The Switch 2 and "Vampire Survivors+RPG"

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Besties - Episode on The Switch 2 and "Vampire Survivors+RPG"

Release Date: January 24, 2025

Hosts:

• Griffin McElroy
• Justin McElroy
• Chris Plante
• Russ Frushtick

---

1. Opening Banter: Neopets and Cheat Engines

The episode kicks off with playful banter among the hosts about using cheat engines in Neopets. Griffin McElroy humorously shares his experience with an infinite breeding cheat, leading to laughs and lighthearted teasing.

• Griffin McElroy [00:00]: "I downloaded a Neopets cheat engine. And when that's running, which it is around the clock because I'm always grinding it out."
• Justin McElroy [00:24]: "I turned on that cheat in college. High five."

This segment sets a relaxed and humorous tone for the episode, showcasing the camaraderie among the hosts.

2. Introduction of Hosts and Episode Overview

The hosts introduce themselves and outline the episode's main topics: the Nintendo Switch 2 and the game "Heroes of Hammer Watch 2."

• Justin McElroy [01:26]: "My name is Justin McElroy and I know the best game of the week."
• Griffin McElroy [01:29]: "My name is Griffin McElroy. I know the best video game console of 2025."

They briefly mention upcoming discussions, including an honorable mention segment featuring "Donkey Kong Country Returns HD."

3. Main Topic 1: Nintendo Switch 2 Announcement

The bulk of the episode centers around the recently announced Nintendo Switch 2. The hosts delve into the specifications, design changes, and their personal opinions on the announcement.

a. Specifications and Design Changes

Russ Fresh provides a rundown of the rumored specs, although he admits they are largely speculative.

• Russ Fresh [05:52]: "The Switch 2 is a 6.4-inch screen with a 7700Hz processor."

Griffin questions the accuracy of these specs, leading to a playful disagreement.

• Griffin McElroy [05:23]: "Are these official specs or are these what's been... Totally making numbers up."

The discussion touches on design elements like an optical sensor and the potential inclusion of mouse functionality, which the hosts find both intriguing and unconfirmed.

b. Hosts' Opinions on Switch 2

Justin expresses disappointment with the Switch 2's reveal, feeling it lacks the excitement of previous Nintendo announcements.

• Justin McElroy [08:15]: "For me this just feels a little bit disappointing."

Griffin echoes these sentiments, hoping the Switch 2 will focus on enhancing the user experience rather than merely iterating on the original Switch's design.

• Griffin McElroy [09:30]: "I find it very uninspiring."

c. Nintendo's Strategy and Market Position

The conversation shifts to Nintendo's strategic position in the gaming market, with Christopher Plant highlighting Nintendo's ability to stay ahead of market trends.

• Christopher Thomas Plant [18:29]: "Nintendo makes money off hardware where nobody else can. People design their games down to be on their hardware."

Russ emphasizes the financial success of the Switch, predicting the Switch 2 will become one of the best-selling consoles of all time.

• Russ Fresh [19:57]: "They sold 146 million switches. That was as of September of last year."

d. Critique and Future Expectations

Justin critiques Nintendo's focus on hardware over innovative software, expressing concern that the Switch 2 may not offer groundbreaking features.

• Justin McElroy [17:35]: "If you don't have any fun functionality, it's just another Switch."

Griffin counters by pointing out potential surprises in the Switch 2's functionality, though he remains cautiously optimistic.

• Griffin McElroy [23:53]: "Perhaps there's a Joy Con Street Pass functionality."

4. Main Topic 2: Heroes of Hammer Watch 2

The hosts transition to discussing "Heroes of Hammer Watch 2," exploring its gameplay mechanics, improvements over its predecessor, and overall reception.

a. Gameplay and Features

Griffin provides an in-depth look at the game's class system and progression mechanics.

• Griffin McElroy [33:03]: "Each class has a mastery bonus that applies to every character... Sorcerer increases your mana regeneration."

Russ praises the game's satisfying combat and multiplayer experience.

• Russ Fresh [34:19]: "It's like a Diablo-like ARPG with the juice from Vampire Survivors."

b. Hosts' Personal Experiences

The hosts share their personal experiences, highlighting both strengths and areas needing improvement.

• Justin McElroy [38:29]: "There is an insane issue where after you play a certain number of levels, the load times become exponentially longer."

Griffin expresses enthusiasm for the game's ongoing development and patches, signaling strong community support.

• Griffin McElroy [40:15]: "It's really exceptionally fun and good and I can't stop playing it."

c. Future Prospects

Russ speculates on future updates and the potential for console releases, emphasizing the game's stability and multiplayer design.

• Russ Fresh [43:34]: "It's very stable. It doesn't feel laggy at all."

5. Honorable Mentions: Donkey Kong Country Returns HD

In the honorable mentions segment, the hosts discuss the upcoming re-release of "Donkey Kong Country Returns HD."

a. Game Overview and Critique

Griffin describes the game's design and differences from previous entries, noting a more straightforward platforming experience compared to "Tropical Freeze."

• Griffin McElroy [44:20]: "It's a relatively basic platforming game in the style of Donkey Kong Country."

Russ shares his frustrations with the multiplayer mechanics, particularly the mechanics surrounding player deaths.

• Russ Fresh [46:50]: "If one of your players dies...the barrel's gone as is that life. So like there was a level we were trying to get through... then lose and have to restart the entire level."

b. Comparison to Previous Titles

The hosts compare "Donkey Kong Country Returns HD" to "Tropical Freeze," highlighting differences in design philosophy and player experience.

• Griffin McElroy [45:14]: "Tropical Freeze feels like a much more developed, thoughtful game."

6. Additional Mentions and Announcements

Beyond the main topics, the hosts briefly touch on other games and media, including "Final Fantasy IX," "Shenmue," the movie "Night Bitch," and the "SNL 50 Beyond" documentary series.

a. Justin McElroy Prize for Success in Innovation

Justin announces a humorous and unconventional prize for successfully emulating the Philips CDI digital video cartridge on his Retro Pocket 5.

• Justin McElroy [53:31]: "If you can get the Philips CDI digital video cartridge, emulate it in a way where I can play it on my retro pocket five. I will give the recipient of that award $1,000 in Olive Garden gift certificate."

The announcement is met with playful skepticism and laughter from the hosts.

7. Patreon Shoutout and Closing Remarks

Russ takes a moment to thank Patreon supporters, highlighting exclusive content available to patrons, including special episodes and bracket discussions.

• Russ Fresh [62:27]: "Thank you so much to all y'all for supporting us. I also wanted to mention that the readers, specifically Bastoad, wanted to applaud us..."

a. Teaser for Next Episode

The episode concludes with a preview of the next week's topic: "Citizen Sleeper 2."

• Justin McElroy [63:51]: "Next week we're going to be talking about Citizen Sleeper 2... Find out next time on the Besties."

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Griffin McElroy [44:20]: "It's a relatively basic platforming game in the style of Donkey Kong Country."
• Russ Fresh [34:19]: "It's like a Diablo-like ARPG with the juice from Vampire Survivors."
• Justin McElroy [17:35]: "If you don't have any fun functionality, it's just another Switch."
• Griffin McElroy [40:15]: "It's really exceptionally fun and good and I can't stop playing it."

---

Conclusion

In this episode of The Besties, the hosts provide a comprehensive and engaging discussion on the Nintendo Switch 2, expressing a mix of anticipation and disappointment over its announced features. They delve deep into the mechanics and community reception of "Heroes of Hammer Watch 2," offering insights into its gameplay and future potential. The honorable mentions segment critiques the re-release of "Donkey Kong Country Returns HD," comparing it to previous entries and highlighting its strengths and weaknesses. Throughout the episode, the camaraderie and playful banter among Griffin, Justin, Chris, and Russ create an entertaining and informative listening experience for both regular fans and newcomers alike.

Transcript

[Griffin McElroy]

I downloaded a Neopets cheat engine. And when that's running, which it is around the clock because I'm always grinding it out.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

It tends to slow down some of the other processes.

[Russ Fresh]

What are you turning on in there? What cheats you got going?

[Griffin McElroy]

Infinite breeding. Yeah, a lot of the Neopets, they only let you breed them once.

[Justin McElroy]

I turned on that cheat in college. High five.

[Griffin McElroy]

I don't want to high five that.

[Justin McElroy]

High five. B. I turned on that cheat in college. High five me.

[Griffin McElroy]

I recently turned that cheat off for myself. I removed that cheat from my own personal bio cheat engine, which is a.

[Russ Fresh]

Cheat in and of itself.

[Justin McElroy]

Griffin went to the vasectomy doctor and turned it on. Yes, clipping.

[Russ Fresh]

Yes, clipping. That's a good line.

[Griffin McElroy]

Oh, man, that's good. I and this contractually, this checks off this podcast for talking about my vasectomy on. I think I gotta get it on deathblought this year. And then that's the whole.

[Justin McElroy]

And Radiolab. You said you were gonna do somehow.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cary Gross has a lot of question.

[Justin McElroy]

My name is Justin McElroy and I know the best game of the week.

[Griffin McElroy]

My name is Griffin McElroy. I know the best video game console of 2025.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

My name is Christopher Thomas Plant, and I know the best game of the week.

[Russ Fresh]

My name is Russ Fresh. I know the best game of the week.

[Justin McElroy]

Welcome to the Besties, where we talk about the latest and greatest in home interactive entertainment. It is a video game club, and just by listening, you've become a member. This week, we're going to be talking about the Switch 2. Didn't they just make one of these things? Yeah. Chris Plant, is that right?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

They did it again. Nobody saw it coming this time, but they said switch again.

[Justin McElroy]

And here we are, Switch again. We're going to talk about that, what that means, why it means, and so much more right after this. In the B segment, we're going to be talking about Heroes of Hammer Watch 2. Like it or not, this episode of.

[Russ Fresh]

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[Justin McElroy]

So they did it. They did it. The Switch. The Switch 2. They just made a sequel to one. They finally did it. Like, this is not unlike the Wii U, which is a colossal failure.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

God, I hope that's interesting. Well, no, I was saying, like, on that.

[Justin McElroy]

Okay, I will. Wii Mega popular thing. Wii U, which is basically Wii too, right? I mean, that's what it's supposed to sound like. Wii U, we. Ooh, we two. I would say it's bad. No one likes it.

[Griffin McElroy]

That's so cool. Yeah. I would say the only difference is that the Wii U was a dramatic departure from the Wii in form and function, and the Switch 2 looks like.

[Justin McElroy]

A big switch, but it's that they learned their lesson. Right? Yeah.

[Russ Fresh]

Well, did they, though? Because the Switch is really just a Wii U without wires.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I was gonna say everybody's like, hey, they're just redoing the same thing again. And they kind of did that with the Switch. They should go back and change the Wii U to, like, the Switch Alpha.

[Griffin McElroy]

Oh, that's cool.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

You see? And now there's a natural progression that makes sense.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah. I mean, I will. Who understands the specs the best?

[Russ Fresh]

I know.

[Justin McElroy]

Tell me what you have before we get into, like, the.

[Russ Fresh]

That's Good call. Good call. Okay, here are all the specs. So the Switch 1 came out. It was 3.7-inch screen with a 2400Hz processor. And the Switch 2 is a 6.4-inch screen with a 7700Hz processor.

[Justin McElroy]

That's a large. That's a much bigger screen.

[Griffin McElroy]

Hold on. Are these official specs or are these what's been. Okay, let's make that very clear.

[Russ Fresh]

Totally making numbers up.

[Griffin McElroy]

I was gonna say that's insane man. That's crazy. We don't have a lot. You are a monster.

[Justin McElroy]

I like that. Such was his confidence that we were kind of.

[Griffin McElroy]

It's when he said the switch had a 3 inch screen that I was like. He said right? Isn't that right? We don't know the specs. They have not announced anything going on under the hood.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

We can share what the widely assumed rumor of the technology is.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, go for it.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Which is the Switch, even when it was released followed the Nintendo trend of being pretty not powerful and then pulling off amazing feats with a manage like a middle of the road like smartphone. After a few years the Switch 2 sounds like it will be basically like a Xbox series S. And will it literally be that powerful? No, but with all the like changes in modern technology, specifically things like dlss which is where you can use AI learning to make the resolution much, much better and process it at a lower rate, it will be like equivalent to that. Why that matters. You can put third party games on the Switch 2 in theory in a way you couldn't on the Switch one. And that would be like a big differentiator for it.

[Russ Fresh]

You could run. My headcanon is like PS4 Pro. It's like in that ballpark, it's like the PS4. PS4, sure. And yeah, that's a big improvement I will say. And obviously the other big change apart from the actual raw power of it, it's about 1 inch bigger on the diagonal. I don't have the exact number, but it's about that size based on the CG trailer that they put out. Also it looks like it has a mouse, but that's not officially confirmed.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah so there's an. It seems to be some sort of optical sensor on the side of the thing which now snaps in VTOL style to the side of the screen part of the Switch instead of sort of sliding into magnets. See, Nintendo hasn't confirmed that either I don't think.

[Justin McElroy]

I mean you look at that could only be magnets.

[Griffin McElroy]

That beautiful.

[Russ Fresh]

That is. The problem is after two years of leaks, they've just gotten closer and closer and closer to the truth that the second we saw Joycon's like sliding around on a table, we're like boop. Mouse confirmed.

[Griffin McElroy]

This reveal felt like the most perfunctory, like all right, we gotta. We're bleeding over. We gotta get something out there. It felt extremely light on detail, but I was. My spirits were buoyed by the fact that it will be backwards compatible aside from select Games which I have to imagine is like fuckin Ring Fit Adventure and other sort of like peripheral games.

[Justin McElroy]

That the form factor of the thing is.

[Griffin McElroy]

Right, exactly.

[Justin McElroy]

Let me just kick this off. I would love to know what you guys think because I am having trouble ginning up anything too strong about this because it seems so kind of evident. And for me this just feels a little bit disappointing. I feel like of all the different aspects of the Switch experience, for me at this point the Switch is really just. It's permanently attached like the. The Joy Cons main. I mean I don't even need to separate them at this point. Yeah, it seems it's a little bit disappointing that of all the things that sort of like carry over that that is something that was sort of like prioritized when I. For me that is super not how I use for sure.

[Russ Fresh]

Are you saying you use it exclusively in handheld mode or.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, or even if like. And even if not, even if it's docked like Pro Controller, I'm Pro Controller. I'm certainly not sliding those things off. And like I just don't of the things to like bring over. It's just like so sort of. I don't know. I find it very uninspiring.

[Russ Fresh]

I think there is an argument to be made, and this might be Nintendo's argument, that because of the larger size and because they did improve the like kickstand on the back of it, it's like a better kickstand or something. It does become a little more viable in a split screen couch Co Op scenario.

[Griffin McElroy]

I would love that. I would love that to be true. Because the number of times that Henry's been playing a game on TV and then Gus wants to take over the TV and so we switched to playing Kirby Co Op with the thing on the couch constantly fucking falling over because the kickstand, even on the oled is not very good. The idea of playing that with the Joy Cons, with individual Joy Cons instead of two Pro controllers though is just unthinkable because it doesn't feel great to use a Joy Con sideways as like a regular controller when there is a normal controller. But if that is available, that would save me a lot of headache whenever that situation arises.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

As Edge as it is, two takes different directions. 1. We don't know what the Joy Cons do yet. Like they might be mice for one example, which if that's true, could be cool. And I hope that there are like weird things that the Joy Cons still do. Maybe they are better versions of the Wiimotes and they're actually going to have more physical play back in the system. I don't know. I feel like there's like still a surprise that could come.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

The other direction of this is what I guess, like, what do you think the audience is asking for? Because I feel like half the audience is like, this is a disappointment. I wanted it to be so much weirder. Nintendo, like, they come out never since the GameCube. They make things weird. And then the other half of the audience is like, I want it to just be the Switch, but better and like ultra powerful. And I think they're. I feel like it's kind of. They're caught between those two camps.

[Justin McElroy]

That to me is what's hard is for a company, this is like easily distracted as Nintendo with stuff like this. I feel like if you're not coming out saying that this mouse functionality is like a big part of the idea with the thing. I can't see them. I mean, they even mentioned HD Rumble when they pitched the Switch. Like, I can't imagine it being a big aspect of it. You know what I mean? Like, I think if you're waiting for another shoe to drop, like where it's like a big bit of functionality or a big. I don't think it's gonna come. I think this is it.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Like, I think I. I will say there's still more shoes to drop. I feel pretty.

[Justin McElroy]

I'm not saying that they won't do it. I'm saying that like they won't support it in any way. I'm saying. I'm saying they might come out with.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Something that's interesting if it's.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, they kind of forget that.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, it's like. Right. Like a Rumble again. Like.

[Griffin McElroy]

Okay, well, I want to.

[Russ Fresh]

That to be fair though, all of the first party games on the Switch, we have HD Rumble. It's just none of the third party games do. So they did. Didn't forget about it. But you're right, it wasn't the like, oh, you can feel These balls in 1, 2. Switch rolling around in your Joy Con.

[Justin McElroy]

What I could get excited about.

[Griffin McElroy]

I stand by that. Beats ass. That was cool.

[Justin McElroy]

What I could get excited about is like if they were going to use this to bring in. If they were going to use mouse functionality. Not for like gaming. Because that's no. Like. No, no, we're not going to do that.

[Russ Fresh]

We did it for a first. If you want to play Doom on your thing, that's not a valid. I'm serious.

[Griffin McElroy]

Only if one Joy Con turns into a mouse and the other one turns into a tiny keyboard.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, it's just like, realistically, it's never gonna be a thing, but, like, for creativity apps, like, if they wanted to get back into the Mario paint space.

[Griffin McElroy]

I said that earlier, not entirely joking.

[Justin McElroy]

That would be cool. Like, if you want to get into that kind of. Or Mario Maker. Mario Maker.

[Griffin McElroy]

I mean, fucking Flipnote Studio. Like, they have a history of, like, having wild sort of apps like that.

[Justin McElroy]

Wouldn't you make that part of the trailer? I mean, wouldn't you make that part of the retreat?

[Griffin McElroy]

That's the thing, right?

[Justin McElroy]

That's what's hard for me.

[Russ Fresh]

There's gonna be so much more coming, though.

[Griffin McElroy]

This is the conversation I feel like that we can have.

[Justin McElroy]

Right.

[Griffin McElroy]

Because there's so many unknowns.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

The question is, like, why was this the opening shot? Why was this the first salvo? Right. Why not wait for me? There is no company, and obviously there's not a lot of companies making gaming hardware, but, like, there's no company where the hardware and the software are more intrinsically linked than Nintendo.

[Justin McElroy]

Right.

[Griffin McElroy]

Because I pretty much, at this point only play Nintendo first party games and multiplayer games with my kid on the Switch. Right. Everything else is going through the Steam deck. And so, like, the fact that there wasn't anything other than a new Mario Kart, which is fine, but, like, not at all demonstrative of what the Switch 2 could do. Like, I honestly did not clock that it was a new Mario Kart game the first time I watched it.

[Russ Fresh]

I thought, you gotta look at Donkey Kong. He looks fucking weird in that trailer.

[Griffin McElroy]

Okay. Yeah, I guess I wasn't zaprudering it hard enough to, like, but, like, why not? We all know this shit. We know this stuff because, like, the images from accessory makers, like, this thing was fully out there. Fully, fully, fully, fully out there. Not the specs. Maybe the specs are all rumored, but, like, what the thing is and what it looks like is out there. And then they had a trailer that 90% of it was dedicated to, like, and here's what the Joy Cons look like, and here's what the screen looks like. And it's like, yeah, we kind of know that. So why not have a reveal trailer that's like, yeah, here's all this stuff you already know.

[Justin McElroy]

But also, that's what I'm saying. If you could gin up some. If you had another thing where you're like, sorry, press sneak fucks, you don't have this.

[Griffin McElroy]

And if it's coming out this year they have that right. They know what games are gonna be on it at launch. Now you don't have to completely go ham and show everything. But now we're waiting three months until we find out anything else about it. All you did was come out and say, yep, all that stuff that is out there, that's true.

[Justin McElroy]

Bye.

[Russ Fresh]

Well, what that lets them do is now third parties can say we're making this game for Switch 2, which they couldn't before that trailer happened. Sure, yeah, it does open the gates.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I also just feel like this is, like this is wins all around for Nintendo because now everybody, you're like, everybody gets emotional. Everybody wants it. People talk about it. People. It's three months, three months. Three months comes and then they're like, here's everything. Here are all the games you wanted. Here's mother three, here's mother four and mother five. Here's Pokemon 32. We've got it all for you. And then people are immediately like, okay, I'm relieved. I'm going to play the new Mario Kart and the new MMO and the new Mario and the new Animal Crossing Metroid. And nobody's going to think about this announcement ever again except for like sickos like us.

[Russ Fresh]

It is a little disappointing though. I think the disappointing aspect is because when the Switch 1 was announced and that trailer was like, what the fuck are they doing? Are they playing video games on the rooftop of their fancy condo? That was.

[Griffin McElroy]

And that shit came out of nowhere. Right. There is no comparison. I don't want the Switch 2 to be bonkers. I want it to be a stronger Switch with a really good first party lineup. For me, the thing I'm looking forward to isn't the Switch 2 hardware. It's that the dissolution of this fucking log jam of first party Nintendo titles that we have just have not been getting. Speaking of, we're going to talk about Donkey Kong Country Returns HD later in the honorable mention segment. But like, that to me is like, when that is finally moving, when that is finally flowing, then I'm going to start getting.

[Justin McElroy]

Can I ask though, like, is Nintendo making a good case for them to continue to be in the hardware business? If this is the hardware, like you said, that you don't want the Switch to. To be anything crazy, right?

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Justin McElroy]

Well, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. I can't say that I'm like, I was wanting it to be like, it's a camera that goes in your fingers. But like the. But I mean, at this point, why be a company that makes hardware, right? Like if you, if this is the best you've got, if this is your big idea is like another Switch and it's basically like, it's basically a Steam deck. I mean like I like if Nintendo is not. Things are so much more boring than they were 10, 15 years ago. 10 years ago, whatever. And I don't, I think it's worth like kind of. I do think it's worth like we, we, we like to joke on Nintendo for being such an oddball all the time. But like I don't, I do think it's a little sad that it's just like such a clear sort of like continuing to follow the money. That's been working pretty well.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I think that all completely checks out. I think what Nintendo does at its best is it gets ahead of where the market is going and that is as early as like home consoles with the nes then going into the Super Nintendo, that is the Game Boy, going into the Game Boy advance. They're always like ahead of where the market is. The Wii. There was a moment, it's hard to remember now where it felt like motion controls were the future of gaming. And the funny thing I guess about the Switch is they were so far ahead of schedule, like way more than probably ever before. We're gonna create a handheld console experience. So now the rest of the market is finally catching up to them and they basically get a freebie of we don't have to completely reinvent the thing because we are just dead center in what the market is. The reason that they actually make the hardware then is, is because they can make money off of hardware where nobody else can. People will design their games down to be on their hardware. By say down, I mean the like visual presentation, not the quality of the game. And people will buy their games wherever they are. So I think if it were any other company where they're losing money on hardware, you know, Xbox is I think hitting this problem. Totally agree with you. And I think there's real questions of like should Xbox even make a handheld or should they just make an OS that is somehow better than Steam os? But Switch. I think it's just free money.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, it's free money. They sold 146 million switches. That was as of September of last year. So even more now it's probably going to be the best selling game console of all time. It's going to beat out. I think the PS2 was ahead of it or the DS.

[Griffin McElroy]

Was the DS up there? DS was up there. I used to do the joystick. Japanese hardware, gaming hardware sales report every week.

[Russ Fresh]

And to keep in mind like that. So strictly capitalist reasons. That's the reason to be in the console market. And the other thing is, as plant was alluding to, a lot of people will design for this hardware and Nintendo is getting, what is it, 30% of every third party sale that happens on their marketplace.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Justin McElroy]

So Russ, Russ, I love you, my friend, I love you. But please save this for cnbc. This is an.

[Griffin McElroy]

You're shooting your. Your. Your. Your what?

[Russ Fresh]

You want to bring money logic into this?

[Justin McElroy]

What are we doing? Like, what do we give a shit? Like, I'm serious.

[Russ Fresh]

I'm not. I'm telling you why they're doing. I'm not saying it's why.

[Justin McElroy]

I'm saying that, like, I think it's. I think it's sad. I think it's very sad. And I think that we should say that it's sad to watch the reveal video for new Nintendo console. And the reaction is because that's how I felt and I can't imagine anybody feeling any different. That's a bummer, man.

[Russ Fresh]

I admit it. I thought the first the Switch 1 trailer was like a ground changing moment. And this was definitely not that.

[Justin McElroy]

Wii U, Switch, Virtual Boy, Nintendo 64, GameCube.

[Griffin McElroy]

I mean, now hold on, you can't slide Virtual Boy in there like it.

[Justin McElroy]

Was when you saw the reveal of the Virtual Boy.

[Griffin McElroy]

I mean, I was like, he was.

[Russ Fresh]

On a VHS game.

[Justin McElroy]

The fuck are you guys doing that's so crazy.

[Griffin McElroy]

I bought a Virtual Boy and it was all the money I had in the world and it sucked shit. But it's still.

[Justin McElroy]

But we like rely. I just think it's like if the argument is like, we should be celebrating Nintendo because they get to rest on their laurels this generation.

[Russ Fresh]

It's like, I'm not saying we should celebrate. I'm just saying they're gonna make a really successful fucking handheld. I would also say it leaves them room to do two things.

[Justin McElroy]

One, you would leave this to Microsoft. Let Microsoft do this.

[Griffin McElroy]

All right?

[Justin McElroy]

A true gamer would want the cameras in the fingers.

[Griffin McElroy]

Right?

[Justin McElroy]

Where me and Moto San sees the.

[Russ Fresh]

Future, let me just say, I think apart from the shock value, all their innovation comes in software. Like, you get that initial shock value of what is this console and then once the console's out, the next seven or eight years is just like basically software innovation. Or hey, we're going to let you build a cardboard robot that connects to your Switch for some fucking reason. Like, they will bring innovation in other ways, I agree with you. This handheld, this console does not seem like it is bringing that fire. But they're going to have the new answer to like what Zelda's fucking is this year.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

You know what? You know what I want? Hoops.

[Justin McElroy]

I want. You're proving my point. Don't make hardware. Then if they get to make fun.

[Russ Fresh]

Of, they make money and then the money funds the software.

[Justin McElroy]

Like they make money off of us buying it. Do you understand what I'm saying? Just make video games. Don't. You're not proving the worth of your existence. Why exist?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

We. We're missing it. It is so obvious. They have to keep the Joy Cons because they're gonna finally deliver on the original Switch's promise. You will be able to get fishing Joy Cons. You will be able to get basketball fishing Joy Cons where you're flipping little baskets. You're gonna. It is gonna be the SEGA generation accessories of Joycons.

[Justin McElroy]

Switch 2 will be the one where you can insert it into the. The original Joy Cons will be a.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Keyboard is going to strap onto your Joy Con. It's gonna be fucking awesome. And then we're all gonna look back at this episode and be like, we were. What were we thinking? We should have known that they were gonna put Semen, the Dreamcast game in my joint.

[Griffin McElroy]

That's how it's pronounced. That as on the emphasis here is.

[Justin McElroy]

What I'm telling you guys. Here's what I'm telling you guys. We went from a world where there were multiple Nintendo consoles doing different things in different directions, different form factors, like as many as three platforms at once going. And I just think that it's like a little sad to go from that Nintendo to the Nintendo that follows up like the longest running console it has ever had with just like a number two of that console.

[Griffin McElroy]

It's like the name is bad. The name is disappointing. The name I think more than anything is disappointing.

[Justin McElroy]

I mean the name is accurate. I feel the name I have the least problem with because it very much is like Switch 2.

[Griffin McElroy]

You know, my grown up Christmas wish for the Switch 2 is, is that they have. They get a little bit more fun with the os. I miss me Streetpass. I miss like that stuff. I feel like was. I don't know, it really characterized what Nintendo's priorities were when the 3Ds was kind of like, you know, the big heavy hitter for them. And I feel like the Switch is. It has a very functional os, but it's not as sort of like silly and exciting.

[Russ Fresh]

I want to. I want to be able to open presents. When I buy a game, I want it to be in a little present box. And I think that present box.

[Griffin McElroy]

And here's.

[Justin McElroy]

Here's what I. What I would love if Nintendo is going to go down this route. Right. What I think you're missing by increasing the size is I think you're losing more of like that portability market. I think there's a market of people and I do think that a lot of the, like the retro consoles, part of what they show is that I think people want a device in that form factor. Right. You don't necessarily want your jinkos to carry around your thing. I would love for them to play with like something that's in like a vmu, like the idea of a Joy Con that you could bring with you, you know what I mean? Or could respond to other people's Joy Cons. You know what I mean? Make there a reason for that.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

A Joy Con Street Pass functionality.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, that would be very cool.

[Justin McElroy]

Because I don't want to carry even less. I already don't carry the Switch around, but like, even less am I going to carry a Switch two in my pocket.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

I mean, but there's also the Switch Lite, which also isn't pocketable. I love the Switch Lite. It is my preferred form factor of the Switch. Even though the screen is not anything to write home about, but it is not. It ain't pocket sized. Right. And so there is something lost there.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah. I would agree that of all the things, the limited things they announced, it being bigger was not necessarily a selling point for me because I play it almost exclusively in handheld and I just want to like have it be light and easy to hold. Yeah. I was also a little bummed that the Joy Cons do not look remotely. They've like seemingly made no effort to make them ergonomic, which was one of my big critiques of the first Joy Cons. They're still just like flat backs, which I think is because they want people to use it detached and like sideways. But again, I don't think a lot of people are necessarily doing that. So maybe just make them comfortable to hold in most circumstances.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Justin McElroy]

If they made them comfortable to hold without the doodads, I think. I think people can meet. It is just that combo of like, even after you put the stupid things on, they're still not very good. It's just not worth it.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Have y'all seen the Aya Neo 3? Yeah. Like that. How you can like replace the. Effectively the control face plates, they're like clip in, I guess. I know I'm repeating myself now, but I really wish Nintendo. I really hope they do something like that. I think having Joy Cons that are more for ergonomics, I know that, like saying this out loud, I know that they're going to rely on third party to just handle it, but having their design level handling this issue would be so much better and so much more enjoyable.

[Russ Fresh]

You know, I'm starting to feel like the third parties are really doing kind of an amazing job filling in the blanks on the ergonomic side. Like, you talk. You look at companies. Like, I've been using like a Gamester controller, which is a company that I hadn't heard of until like the last year, and it kind of crushes the original Xbox controller like dbrand. And all these sorts of companies, I think are doing a very good job of filling in the blanks where these.

[Griffin McElroy]

I got a Powera Nano controller for the Switch for Henry to use because it's a little bit smaller. And now it's also what I exclusively use because it feels good to use it.

[Russ Fresh]

I think it just allows for more flexibility rather than being locked into. Whatever the thing is, I just. Just fix the fucking Joy Cons. Guys, like, make sure I don't have to replace them every year because that was.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, they hate that.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, they really do.

[Griffin McElroy]

I am impressed with.

[Justin McElroy]

What's one of their least favorite things about the Joy Cons is how fucking many of them you buy.

[Griffin McElroy]

I appreciate the fact that we have gotten 28 minutes of blood out of this stone. I don't know that there's a lot more talk about this.

[Russ Fresh]

There is one more thing I want to. I want to. Because you guys didn't see him initially because he was in the background. Can we comment on Donkey Kong, the new design for Donkey Kong, specifically in Mario Kart 9? Because that was like the biggest difference that was in the entire trailer. I've dropped an image of the new Donkey Kong into the chat.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Russ Fresh]

What are your first reactions?

[Griffin McElroy]

I mean, we'll start with. His gains are impressive. This is a thick. This is a thick man who has been putting in the hours. And the discipline is this.

[Russ Fresh]

Agh. That he's using.

[Griffin McElroy]

It's. Yeah, it's ape hormone stuff. I don't know what that acronym stands for. It does look like the movie. It looks like the movie DK to me.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Yes. Oh, and like the very classic drawn on the side of the arcade cabinet.

[Russ Fresh]

Oh, yeah. It's kind of throwback in that way.

[Justin McElroy]

Yes.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I think that's what they're going for here.

[Russ Fresh]

That was a meaner Donkey Kong, an angrier Donkey Kong.

[Griffin McElroy]

The Donkey Kong that is on the left here is just andross from Star Fox 64 with different wearing some sort of grim ape mask on. Can we go to the break and talk about a really good game called Heroes of GamerWatch 2? Let's do that.

[Russ Fresh]

Okay, so let's all look back in time to when I introduced Heroes of Hammer Watch to this crew.

[Justin McElroy]

This would be a celebration of you.

[Russ Fresh]

Many years ago, I introduced this game and you guys rolled your eyes. You're like, oh, this is. Look at these little baby guys with their old graphics. Who cares? And it grabbed the podcast by storm. I don't think Plant played it, but everyone else played it a lot and really liked it.

[Griffin McElroy]

It was my most played Switch game of that year.

[Russ Fresh]

That's crazy.

[Justin McElroy]

I didn't play that bunch.

[Russ Fresh]

You didn't play it that much.

[Griffin McElroy]

It was just me and you. Really, Russ, It's a.

[Russ Fresh]

Okay. We got hard into it. I play this. Hammerwatch 2 came out. We didn't really like that too much. And now Heroes of Hammerwatch 2 has come out, and the naming convention is very confusing. But this is the good one, y'all.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah, this is the good one.

[Justin McElroy]

Horizon. Right?

[Griffin McElroy]

Right. This was on my most anticipated Games of 2025 list. I didn't realize that it would be out three days after, like, we released that episode. They totally stealth dropped it.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah. So it's like, if you can imagine, they grafted RPG mechanics onto vampire survivors, so like. Or. And Gauntlet, and you put a little bit of gauntlet in there, and I think you're pretty, pretty close.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Wow. Why have I not played this?

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah, Chris, you should play this fucking game.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah. So basically, you're making your. Taking a. You're say you pick a wizard. There's four different classes. It's the classics. Right.

[Russ Fresh]

There's actually seven, but some of them.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

You unlock other ones as you play.

[Russ Fresh]

Come on, Juice, do your homework.

[Justin McElroy]

Does your wife seem happy? Like, does she seem like a happy.

[Russ Fresh]

No, she doesn't.

[Justin McElroy]

I didn't think. I wouldn't imagine. So there's four classes. There's a warrior and there's a wizard, and there's a, you know, a rogue and there's a paladin. And each one feels pretty different. It's like the difference between slinging spells around and then having, like, more close combat abilities. But it is still that like, feels that auto shooter thing, or you're trying to, like, fire as fast as you can and. And fire off your abilities as fast as you can.

[Griffin McElroy]

More.

[Justin McElroy]

More, I would say more agency than a lot of those, like, auto shooter things give you, but it is that. It feels like.

[Russ Fresh]

It's like a Diablo D make.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah, it feels like an arpg more than a. More than an.

[Justin McElroy]

It's hard because, like, Vampire Survivors is. Is already like a. You know, like, we're taking, like, mechanics there and, like, boiling them down to their. There's some of that. There's some of that in there. There's Gauntlet in there. There's Vampire Survivors in there. There's a persistent sort of. And actually, if you didn't play Halls of Torment, it's kind of similar to that, where you have different characters that have different gear that you unlock. So, like, as you're leveling up each of these individual classes, you guys would have played a lot more than me. So you could probably explain better how leveling up each class is helping your, like, meta.

[Griffin McElroy]

So each class has, like, a mastery bonus that applies to every character. So for the rogue, if you make a rogue, every level that you get with your rogue adds like, a 1.5% gold bonus, which really starts to stack up as you level up that class Sorcerer, if you level them up, that increases your mana regeneration. The basic, like, loop of the kind of, like, roguelike elements of Heroes of Hammerwatch 2 are what make it so strong, because every time you play, you are leveling up your character and earning those bonuses for every other character you might make. You're finding resources to upgrade your town, which unlocks all kinds of different upgrade opportunities for you. You are finding pieces of equipment which is new for Heroes of Hammerwatch too. So you're not just leveling up, you're also putting builds together based on what kind of equipment you're finding, which has all kinds of new systems associated with it. There's an enchanter that you can use to get the right sort of bonuses on it. It is so much stuff, and it makes it feel like every time you are playing, you are getting stronger in 10 different ways, which is very, very, very compelling to me.

[Russ Fresh]

It also has the. The juice that you get when you're playing a Vampire Survivors or Halls of Torment, where you are fighting seemingly like a thousand. I mean, it's not this many, but like a hundred guys at once. And the screen is filled with numbers going up, and you get that satisfaction of, I'm gonna drop this Nuke and, like, clear the entire screen. Like, that feels amazing.

[Justin McElroy]

I will say that in as long as, like, the Vampire Survivors comparisons are coming. I did experience kind of a slow period in. In most of the time early in runs where, like, as it's not really much of a challenge and you're just trying to get it going. I don't know if, like, I know Vampires Survivors fixes that with, like, a hyper mode or like a, you know. You know, that kind of deal. I don't know.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah, there's a. There's a fast travel mode that's a little bit hidden in the game, but you basically get the ability to skip the first five levels worlds if you feel like you're strong enough. It's actually a really smart system. Once you get deep enough into the game, you unlock this area, this tower, this room, and you basically say, like, okay, I'm gonna challenge myself with basically, you can light these different candles, and if you light four candles, a shitload of enemies are gonna come in. And if you survive all those enemies, it'll give you enough gear to basically survive seven levels deep. So it kind of like. It's like a.

[Griffin McElroy]

It throws one incredibly difficult challenge at you in lieu of playing through three or four levels, which is great because then you skip ahead to the harder stuff, where you're getting more experience and more money and better loot, and it lets you skip some of the more repetitive stuff that you've already done. Heroes of Hammerwatch 2 is actually pretty good at doing that. More so than Heroes of Hammerwatch 1. I think it looks great. I think I'm playing as a paladin, and it also has class specialization, so once you get a class to level 10, there's like, three different branches that it goes off in. So the Paladin I'm playing is all about, like, fire magic that goes out in this huge radius, which then sets off this combo system. So now you're moving twice as fast and shooting, like, bolts of light out of you. It's so, like, fast and crazy.

[Justin McElroy]

I'm often hard on games with a retro aesthetic, but I will say they're doing some really cool stuff with, like, transparencies and things like that that have, like, a. It almost makes it feel a little bit Uncanny Valley. Because it's, like, graphically, it's sort. It looks like something you'd remember, but they're. There's effects. There's things going on under the hood that. That feel very modern. I don't know. It's a cool.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah. The lighting is very modern.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And the designs, like the designs of the individual like characters and the spells and stuff are. Are modern. Did you guys like playing all of the classes equally or did you find yourselves gravitating towards some.

[Russ Fresh]

I went wizard. I started with a wizard and that's kind of like glass cannon is usually what I start games with. And that felt really good. And I ended up leveling that up all the way and eventually beating the game with it.

[Griffin McElroy]

What's the bonus?

[Russ Fresh]

What's cool is when you beat the game, you get gear for the other classes. So I was able to start a fresh paladin with like a level 20 sword right from the jump. So what was previously like a very slow restarting of a character from scratch actually went a lot faster because I was like what's the term? Twinking? Is that right? That doesn't sound right. But when you drop something.

[Griffin McElroy]

That's right. I mean that is what it is called. Yeah.

[Justin McElroy]

I have not heard. Heard that term used for quite some time for reasons that I bet you could figure out.

[Russ Fresh]

So yeah, I was able to like basically get past the slow parts of leveling up a guy from scratch. For Chris Plant. I will say this, the reason that I think. I think you would enjoy the core gameplay, but this game definitely requires you to do that thing where when you're level three, there is no possibility you will ever beat the game. Numerically speaking, you will not have the strength to get to the end of the run. It's not spelunky. You don't start from scratch. You need to grind the resources to get enough stuff to level up the skills to get you there. Once you're there, it feels really good and satisfying because you feel like you've earned it, whatever. But that is just a heads up because I know you are not a big fan of doing that stuff.

[Justin McElroy]

I did not have a lot of problems with the game. The only thing that was tripping me up and this could just be your mileage, maybe everything. But some of the abilities, like the wizard has an ability where it's like bringing up a reticle and then you're firing. So it's like bringing up a targeting reticle while you're moving around and there's this targeting reticle and then you have to push a different button to fire off the attack. So it's like you start the ability and then you aim with the reticle while you're moving and then you fire it off.

[Griffin McElroy]

It feels like More of a mouse and keyboard kind of contrivance.

[Justin McElroy]

It's not hard or impossible. It just, especially on the Steam deck, like felt bad. It just like I was getting like a weird claw grip to make it happen.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah. I ended up remapping a lot of controls just to make it feel better.

[Justin McElroy]

And when you're moving, trying to like target something in that view while you're moving, it just feels like too much. I don't know. I like the characters that were. That didn't rely on that as much.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah. I will also say there was a patch yesterday that improved this somewhat, but there is this insane issue where after you play a certain number of levels, the load times become exponentially longer and it doesn't get fixed until you quit the game and restart, which is like they do save it every time you start like a new level of your run. So it's not like catastrophic, but it is pretty annoying and hopefully the kind of things that they can fix.

[Russ Fresh]

It seems like they've been very proactive. There's been. I think the game launched last week and there's been three patches, significant patches since then that have really addressed a lot of the community concerns. I think they are very worried after the reaction of Hammerwatch 2. I think they're like extremely worried of falling in that muck again. But obviously the response for this one has been much more positive.

[Griffin McElroy]

Really great. It's so strange to me how they released this. I know it's not the biggest franchise in the world, but this game kicks ass. It's really exceptionally fun and good and I can't stop playing it. And the people playing the community is super, super into it. I don't understand why they didn't put a little bit.

[Justin McElroy]

Well, I. I will say, guys, I think you got some rose tinted glasses on. I. I'm enjoying it. But like, I think you're seeing a lot of the potential. Potential because of the experience you've had that. My experience technically was really bad. I mean like really bad. Like freezes beyond the caching. Like it would just stop hard stop. Or like it wouldn't be able to move the character. Like there's a lot of stuff going like that and some of the things we're talking about with like equipment and the way that those systems all interact. A lot of it's like not very clean or well explained and maybe you understand it better like from. From previous experience, but I think there's probably more rough edges than you're. Than you're seeing.

[Russ Fresh]

I think that's right. And keep. Keep this in mind. When I got super into Heroes of Hammer Watch, it was at the Switch launch. And this game is only on PC right now. And I'm pretty sure when Heroes 1 launched, it launched on PC first. And then, I don't know, it could have been a year later that it launched on Switch. And so it wouldn't surprise me if, to answer both of your questions, one, they're going to address a lot of those issues as they work through these patches, and two, they'll do more of a marketing push when the game hits console. I could see both of those happening. I am really loving it. I'm very much into it. And if you're a fan of the first one, I think you should definitely check it out. If you're a little wary, you can wait because it'll, you know, they're clearly patching it a lot and more content will be dropped.

[Justin McElroy]

I think it's like one of those that, like, if you play it in a year, it will almost certainly be a better experience. Like it's almost certain to be. I don't.

[Russ Fresh]

I don't think it's in a bad state right now, but I think a lot of that, you're right, has to do with me and the amount of time that I've spent on the original.

[Griffin McElroy]

On the original.

[Russ Fresh]

But I am more. The fact that I'm already seeing performance gains and like not seeing as those dramatic slowdowns that I was three days ago really says that they're pretty tuned to what's going on.

[Griffin McElroy]

The first game also got a few really good DLC releases that I'm hoping they will continue supporting. I don't know. I loved that first game and Hammerwatch 2 I thought was so disappointing and frustrating and I was worried that they would not be able to sort of return to form. But I. I think that those fears have been assuaged for me.

[Russ Fresh]

One last thing. It is really, really fun in multiplayer. We mention it in passing, but it's like kind of perfectly designed for multiplayer. It supports up to four players normally. Apparently people have been using debug codes to get like 16 people in a game, which is.

[Griffin McElroy]

I joined a server with 64 players.

[Russ Fresh]

It was so funny.

[Griffin McElroy]

I had to leave after like 10 seconds because my Steam deck was going to melt in my hands.

[Russ Fresh]

But it's great you can revive people. There's like this tension of like, oh shit, this guy died while going through a bunch of traps. Do I bother to rev him or not? It just feels very much like a great it would be like a great couch co op experience or online for that matter.

[Justin McElroy]

It's.

[Russ Fresh]

It's very stable. It doesn't feel laggy at all.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah. What are we gonna do now, guys? Are we gonna do honorable mentions and talk about Donkey Kong Country Returns hd?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Let's do that.

[Justin McElroy]

Sure.

[Griffin McElroy]

I didn't play the original Donkey Kong Country Returns.

[Russ Fresh]

I played it on 3Ds. This is actually the third time it got, I guess the second time it got re released because it came out on Wii originally and then it got released like a year later on 3Ds. And now this is coming out on Switch, which is a very bizarre sequence of events.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah, but it was the predecessor to Tropical Freeze, which was a Wii U game that came to Switch and now there's an HD version of Donkey Kong Country Returns.

[Russ Fresh]

Yeah.

[Griffin McElroy]

Called Donkey Kong Country Returns hd.

[Russ Fresh]

And this was the basically retro saying, we're going to reboot the Donkey Kong country franchise after doing so well with Metroid Prime. And so they made basically, you know, these games play like Donkey Kong country, But obviously with 3D graphics, but still side scrolling. And I think with this one in particular, they were. It feels very much like they're like, let's get our feet wet. And more or less make like a relatively basic platforming game in the style of Donkey Kong Country. But from a design perspective, we're not going to like swing for the fences necessarily. We're going to like focus on other stuff, I don't know, just to like get it set. And so when you compare this game, it's Tropical Freeze, it's like kind of night and day. Tropical Freeze feels like a much more developed, thoughtful game.

[Griffin McElroy]

Yeah, I played it with Henry pretty much exclusively in two player mode and we were having a pretty good time with it. It does get really hard, really, really fast because it's a Donkey Kong country game. And when I say really hard, I mostly mean, you know, for an eight year old. I'm fucking. I can be any game, like, try me. Put me in front of him. I'll fuck it up. But it started to get very frustrating. There is one mechanic that I think is the worst thing, just the worst thing ever to ever feature in any kind of multiplayer platformer game. And it is that if one of your players dies when you're playing Co Op, that player can respawn into the world as a DK barrel on a balloon that floats down and it goes across the screen back and forth in an insane sine wave that is unpredictable and demonic. And if you don't hit it as the other player to free that monkey, then that barrel's gone as is that life. So like there was a level we were trying to get through for a long time that was like an ocean level where you're jumping across all these little platforms and trying not to fall into the water and instantly die. And if one of us would die, we'd spawn back in and the barrel would just zoop, zoop, zoop, zoop, zoop, back and forth and we'd miss it and would go through all of our lives and then lose and have to restart the entire level. Like, there's some stuff in here that is so frustrating and not in a enjoyable way.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Ruin the faith of your child in you. Yeah, right. Like your child is like you, dad, mom, you're a pro gamer. Surely you can do this. And here you are jumping off a cliff trying to save the life of your child.

[Griffin McElroy]

Of your child. Yes.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

And they're like, wow, you can't even. You can't even do this. You can't even do this for me. If you're gonna fail me here, how are you gonna fail me in the future? I do not. I'm not a fan of this.

[Russ Fresh]

It's also weird because Tropical Freeze did add more, I guess, help to kid gamers. They added the Funky Kong mode which had. He had more health, he had a double jump, he had like fucking hovering. Like he had all sorts of like things that he was making the game easier with. And it doesn't seem like they've added a lot of that stuff here.

[Griffin McElroy]

There's an inventory where you can like bring power ups and stuff like into levels. Most of them don't work when you're playing in co op mode. So like, what are we doing, man? We pivoted off discussing this as like our main game of the week. I think pretty quickly after each of us played it. And we're like, there's not a ton to it.

[Russ Fresh]

Does it does make me wonder. I just worry a little bit because Nintendo will obviously continue doing this. They're going to re release their old games. And in a lot of cases I'm thrilled that that's happening because there are games like Link Between Worlds that I would love to play again in full graphics and on a big screen, something like that. But I do worry that like, if the barrier to like a remake is this rather than like a much more full featured thing, that that makes me a little worried. Like, I think Super Mario World was a great example. What was it Super Mario 3D World. 3D World was paired with Bowser's Whatever the Fuck Story. Whatever that game was.

[Griffin McElroy]

That was great.

[Russ Fresh]

That was fucking amazing. Because you got two great games in one package. Totally worth it. But this for $60 is just like, it's a Wii game. It's for $60.

[Justin McElroy]

I want to just say, also, I want to rescind my earlier trepidation about the Switch 2. If Nintendo can continue to deliver like this on the software end, I think we're in for a very bright future indeed.

[Griffin McElroy]

I think this is more indicative of the log jam. The past, like, I don't know, man, Year of Nintendo first party exclusives has been so lackluster and so disappointing. And it just feels like there's this big, beautiful tomorrow waiting just around the bend.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

The weird one for me is, why not Wind Waker? Like, that thing has been done forever. And like, why are we getting this Wind Waker?

[Russ Fresh]

My guess is that they just are spacing out Zelda titles and they just had a Zelda title come out four or five months ago.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

They need one next year and they.

[Russ Fresh]

Need one next year. So that would be my guess. But I'm sure it'll happen. I mean, I've been saying that for four years, but I'm sure it'll happen.

[Griffin McElroy]

Can we talk about other honorable mentions?

[Russ Fresh]

Yes, Yes.

[Justin McElroy]

I want to briefly mention one. The movie Night Bitch. You can watch it on Hulu. It's adapted from a novel and it's a. I would say, like, it's sort of a heightened reality movie.

[Russ Fresh]

I hope so.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah. I would say it is a movie about a. A woman struggling with balancing, like, motherhood and her career and her aspirations and the pressures that society puts on her and everything. And it is in the premise, there is this idea that she is turning into a dog at night. And that is a metaphorical device. Maybe. I don't know. You gotta watch the movie. Find out.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

There was a wink there. Yeah, the odd wink.

[Griffin McElroy]

You didn't hear it.

[Justin McElroy]

But it's a movie about how women are expected to function in our society and parents in general, and how hard that is and how unrealistic and monstrous in many ways it is. There is a lot of stuff watching this movie that I could feel my wife sort of reverberating with and things in this movie that help me understand what her experience is like and has been like. There is a lot of this movie that I already realized from, like, talking to my wife over the years and living through things with her. But if you are someone who is a young parent no matter where you are on the sort of like gender spectrum. I think that it's like a really powerful movie and a very like. I wish I had seen it as a younger dad because I think I would have been a better parent if I had seen it and understood a little bit better. Sort of like my wife and where her head had been at. But it stars Amy Adams. It's called Night Bitch. It's very funny, it's very well done. It's very entertaining. It's not like preachy or anything, but it is. I found it very moving. So the other thing I briefly wanted to mention is that since we had our like retro discussion, I've been like messing around a lot with the retro retro games and trying to get a bunch of stuff up and running on the retroid 5. And I had this idea of like trying to get a bunch of FMV stuff that I had never checked out. Right. Like digging that out. So here's the problem is the Philips CDI had this thing called the digital.

[Russ Fresh]

Video cartridge which and Justin Confirm this shouldn't be a three hour YouTube essay. Right?

[Justin McElroy]

It'll be really quick.

[Griffin McElroy]

Jenny Nicholson this. If you wanted to.

[Justin McElroy]

It will be really quick. So you know like a memory pack expansion for the Ninja W624. Right. This is a digital video cartridge that you had to install in the Philips CDI because it could play video. But in order for it to like process video off the discs you needed the digital video cartridge which was not inbuilt into the Philips cdi. The digital video cartridge has not been well emulated in any real sense that is. That can be reproduced. So there are a lot of titles on the CD I that I have never and as far as I could tell will never experience because the emulation is not there and there's no passion for it. There's things like, guys, what's Christmas country and Christmas Crisis? I don't know. Right. Do you remember the 60s? I don't know, I don't get a chance to.

[Russ Fresh]

But is that actually a game?

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, Monty Python's Invasion from Planet Skyron and I don't get. It's not fair. Right? There's a seventh guest. You know, guys, there's a Hulk Hogan Thunder in Paradise FMV game that I don't think I'm good. Listen. Okay, listen. That's a bad one. Here's what I'm. Here's the deal. I am taking this opportunity to announce Justin McElroy Prize for success in Innovation and here is the prize. If you can get the Philips CDI digital video cartridge, emulate it in a way where I can play it on my retro pocket five. I will give the recipient of that award $1,000 in Olive Garden gift certificate.

[Griffin McElroy]

Wow, that's a lot of pasta.

[Justin McElroy]

I will not be communicating this. I will not be researching it. If you are the person who says, hey, Hoops, here's how I can get these digital video cartridges going for you. I did the emulation, I made it up. That person's gonna get this incredible prize. Let the race begin. Let man's progress be unfettered. And let's get. Okay. I mean, like.

[Griffin McElroy]

And our lawyer's not here. Our lawyer's not on the call. So I'll go ahead and say, our.

[Justin McElroy]

Lawyer is not on the call.

[Griffin McElroy]

I'll go ahead and say, this might not work for you at home. If you think I have the skills to do this, you might do it and still not win the prize. There is going to be an element.

[Russ Fresh]

I think it's the first person to email you, right?

[Justin McElroy]

That's the first person to email me with their work. Don't just email me a link to something you read that might work. No, I want you to make it. Make it easy for me. I'm using the same. I'm using the same CDI core. It's within the main framework that seems to be the accepted way people are playing CDI games. By the way. This isn't like piracy. No one gives a shit about the film CDI on in any reality. If I called Philip, they wouldn't. I don't even know if I could call Phillips. I don't think.

[Griffin McElroy]

I don't think you could call Phillips at all.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I just want to make sure I have this right because I am writing the rules down into the newsletter. If the Justin McElroy Prize for success and Innovation. If you can get the Philips CDI emulation fully playable on Justin's retro Pocket 5.

[Justin McElroy]

Well, let me say the Philips CDI digital video cartridge emulated. Cause that's what I need.

[Russ Fresh]

Maybe it's easier to pick a title. Maybe you should just tell people if you can play Christmas, because I don't want them to.

[Justin McElroy]

Like, this is a prize in innovation. This isn't selfish. I'm trying to move mankind forward.

[Russ Fresh]

I see. I see.

[Justin McElroy]

Do you understand?

[Russ Fresh]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Sorry. Say this. The digital video card trick. Yeah, that's.

[Justin McElroy]

Hey, Plant, I'll say this. If they have this much trouble with what it's called, they're probably not gonna win the prize.

[Russ Fresh]

Okay, can they get cash value for the cards?

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, they can. They can. As long as they don't mind selling someone their Olive Garden gift certificates, because that's the only way it's gonna work. Maybe somebody will give them pennies on the dollar.

[Griffin McElroy]

Potter down at the bank is buying Olive garden certificates for 50 cents on the dollar. I'll be closing my account now.

[Justin McElroy]

Hold on just one second. I'm trying to open Kabara's Grill.

[Griffin McElroy]

Your money's in her Olive Garden gift certificates.

[Justin McElroy]

All the Darden family of brands is represented.

[Griffin McElroy]

I want to promote a documentary series on Peacock called SNL 50 Beyond Saturday Night. It's a four part docuseries about Saturday Night Live on its 50th anniversary. First episode's about. It's called Five Minutes. And it's all about auditioning for Saturday Night Live. What that is like from all the cast members. The second episode's about what it's like to be a writer going through the week, you know, Monday to Saturday. The third part is about the more cowbell sketch. The whole thing is about the whole. And then the fourth part is about season 11, which was the insane season where Lorne Michaels returned to the show after like a five year hiatus and cast fucking Randy Quaid and Robert Downey Jr. And like all of these people who were only on for a single season, almost getting the show canceled forever. It's so fascinating. The audition and writing episodes have given me so much anxiety as a comedic performer. And so there is a strong emotional response, but I think it's just fantastic and it really, really, really takes you behind the curtain.

[Russ Fresh]

I cannot fathom the amount of anxiety that that show must produce in people. It is truly the worst scenario.

[Justin McElroy]

Not really, though. I just want to echo what Griffin said. That first episode is the only one I've watched so far. But like, you think about what Broadway video, which, like Lorne Michaels Company, like, has access to the. I mean, like, think about all of these auditions are perfectly captured in hd. So there's so much footage you've never seen before of like people. People watching their auditions for the first time. Like, that's great. Like seeing of comedy. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, 100%.

[Griffin McElroy]

Oh, man. Heidi Gardner's audition is so. Her response to it is so moving. You get to see Tracy Morgan's audition, which is the funniest shit. Will Ferrell's audition is iconic. I don't know. I have fallen off snl. It's not a show I watch every week. Anymore. But I feel like I care a lot about that show still and got to see some stuff about it that I didn't know. I also have been messing around with the Retroid Pocket five and I've been playing mostly Final Fantasy IX because we talked about it last week. That game still looks fucking great and is fun to play. And Shenmue because finally Dreamcast emulation is pretty good and Shenmue is a. Yeah.

[Justin McElroy]

Speaking of which, I maybe need to come up with a new prize to make Seaman work. That one's tough to emulate too. I was trying to get that going.

[Russ Fresh]

Do you have a mic on the Retro Pocket five?

[Griffin McElroy]

I don't know.

[Russ Fresh]

How are you gonna talk to Leonard Nimoy if you don't have a mic?

[Griffin McElroy]

Oh, I'm gonna Google that.

[Russ Fresh]

Plant. You have anything?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

People who are in New York, go to the MoMA if you can. Between like now and I think like mid February because there is a movie playing that I think the last time it played was 2010 called the Clock. And it is a 24 hour movie.

[Russ Fresh]

Oh my God.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Where each minute is related to moments in other movies where they're talking about that minute. So like, if it's 2:22pm they it's a clip from taking a Pelham one two three where John Travolta is like, it's 2:22, you better be ready by 2:34. And then at 2:34 we like get the follow up to that scene for 24 hours. It sounds.

[Justin McElroy]

Can I just watch on Netflix or something?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

I wish, man. I really wish. Because the first, I don't know, 10 minutes I was like, oh, this is real painful and slow. The next five minutes I was like, I think I'm asleep. And then the next two and a half hours I'm like, this is the most engaging thing ever.

[Russ Fresh]

I mean, it's like TikTok.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

It is. You can't stop. Like it's.

[Russ Fresh]

It's like constant cliffhangers.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

And they. The artist who made it has like a great sense of humor. So you start to realize that it is kind of building its own story and that there are callbacks and goofs between all of it. And it is not like all art films. Like a lot of it is.

[Russ Fresh]

I mean, it couldn't be silly.

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Yeah, it's great. And I. Yeah, if you can go see it, you should also. If you can't go see it. Hey, I'm just gonna say you should be using your Crunchyroll subscription right now because it's the new Season of anime. And there's a lot of good stuff. Honey Lemon Soda. I watched just good vibes. If you want a little sweet romance, you can get that right now.

[Russ Fresh]

Cool. I played Donkey Kong Country. I'm in, you know, potty training hell. So there has been a lot going on. I'm continuing to play Pokemon Snap. New Pokemon Snap, which is. I think we're like probably 50 hours into that game. There is so much fucking shit in that game, it's insane. I think. I think I massively underestimated it when I first played it. And if you are a Pokemon fan or you want to turn a child into a Pokemon fan, holy. This is the one to do it with. Very, very, very fun. I think we did it. You want to recap?

[Christopher Thomas Plant]

Yeah. We talked about the Nintendo Switch 2 announcement. We dug into Heroes of Hammer Watch 2, Donkey Kong Country Returns HD. We also mentioned Final Fantasy 9, Shenmue, new Pokemon Stap Night Pitch SNL50 Beyond, Saturday Night, the clock at MoMA and Honey Lemon Soda. And we revealed or announced the Justin McElroy Prize for success in innovation. You can find the details at Besties fan.

[Russ Fresh]

I wanted to thank everyone over at the Patreon for supporting us. Patreon.com Thebesties you can get new episodes and all sorts of cool stuff there. We have resties episodes. We have this month's bracket episode. We have a new bracket episode coming out first week of February. Always new stuff there. So thank you so much to all y'all for supporting us. I also wanted to mention that the readers, specifically Bastoad, wanted to applaud us over the fact that Russ from Retro Game Corps last week mentioned that he was a master chief in the navy and none of us made a joke.

[Griffin McElroy]

Oh, guys. Oh, man. We were all on our best behavior.

[Russ Fresh]

I think we really were.

[Justin McElroy]

Yeah, I think we all did really like simultaneous eyebrow raise. Okay.

[Russ Fresh]

I was vibrating.

[Griffin McElroy]

What are we doing next week?

[Justin McElroy]

Next week we're going to be talking about Citizen Sleeper 2. Bit of a cult hit. Getting a follow up here. We beloved the first one. Will we beloved this one? It's hard to say. Only time will tell. Find out next time on the Besties because shouldn't the world's best friends pick the world's best games? Sa.