Loading summary
Transcript136 lines
- [00:00]
A
Does God want you to be rich? That's the topic of today's show. This is the Better Life podcast with Brandon Turner and my co host, Mr. Cam Cathcart. Figured I'd make you say it. What's up, Cam? How you doing?
- [00:12]
B
I'm great, man. How are you?
- [00:14]
A
Good, man. I'm about to go ice skating with the kids here in a few minutes. We just got finished recording with our guest today, Pedro, and this is one of our longest and I would say deepest conversations we've had in the last few years of doing this show.
- [00:26]
B
Very definitely in terms around religion and what does it mean to be an entrepreneur and making money and how do you live with that or live in that? My favorite thing that he said today, you asked him a question about how do you balance it? And he said it's not about balance, it's about how do you reconcile it. And I think the way that he answered that was such a solid answer.
- [00:46]
A
I agree, I agree. Yeah. And his idea of like the intersection between faith and money and how there is no intersection. You guys listen for that conversation and such as great stories. If you were not raised in the Christian faith in the Christian church, some of the words we know, we probably talk a little Christianese because all of the three of us were or Christian people but hopefully get a lot of value anyway. We talk about like giving and donating money and then is it okay to have nice things even though there's people dying of starvation and we tackle a lot of and wrestle with a lot of really tough issues. And Pedro's awesome dude. So quick bio on Pedro. So Pedro Adeo is an eight figure entrepreneur, founder of the 100x Academy and Kingdom Seekers. He's a leading voice, like maybe one of the biggest, one of the biggest voices in like faith based business. He's helped tens of thousands of entrepreneurs build purpose driven companies. Widely known as an expert on challenge marketing with if you're in the Internet marketing, you know what that is and if not, don't worry about it. And finally he has a thing every year called the 31 Day Wisdom Challenge. It's a free 31 day challenge. It's awesome. I've been a part of it the last few years and this year I'm actually like speaking at it which is pretty cool. You can go to his website which is what 31daywisdom.com I believe it is or there's a link in the show notes below. Check it out. Every day of January 2026, you'll be able to Learn from really cool, awesome, smart people and myself. One of the days. So would love to see you there again. 31 day wisdom. And the link is in my bio. And that's all I got. Oh, you know what I didn't say to you, Cam? I wanted to know. I have a really important question for you. What did the plumber say to the singer?
- [02:13]
B
I thought you did have an important question.
- [02:15]
A
This is really important, man.
- [02:16]
C
It's.
- [02:17]
B
It's.
- [02:17]
A
What did the plumber say to the singer?
- [02:20]
B
I don't know. I don't know.
- [02:22]
A
Nice pipes.
- [02:25]
C
That's pretty good, right?
- [02:26]
B
That's good. That's.
- [02:27]
A
Well, without further ado, let's get to our interview with Pedro Adeo.
- [02:37]
C
All right. You talk about ego, but you know what it actually is? Okay, so it could definitely be ego and pride, because we probably don't need a church on every street corner. Like, why don't we just go like. But I got a word of the Lord. I want to preach every week. Well, you know, and this is the problem with, like, ministry and church culture is there's only one pulpit. There's only one microphone, and everybody talk about real estate. It's a real estate show in Christendom that 3ft by 3ft behind the pulpit is coveted real estate.
- [03:10]
B
Oh, my gosh.
- [03:12]
C
And I. I have a term, and I feel. I feel the Holy Ghost. I have a term for this, and I call it ministry idolatry. And because we grew up in church or raised in church or came into church culture, and we see these anointed, hopefully powerful, hopefully preachers, teachers, evangelists, missionaries. And like, these people have a profound impact in our life. We kind of like have. They're like spiritual fathers and mothers. It's monkey see, monkey. Do you want to become like those that you admire? And then all of a sudden you this. It's. We make this connection that if I was anointed, if I'm going to be used by God, I've got to be behind that pulpit. I got to have that microphone. And now we're all coveting the same place on Sunday morning from 9 to 10. Well, what do you do when there's one microphone and 50 people in the seats? Now you've got. You've got spectator Christianity. There's the one man of God. We're all cheering for him. And what about us? We're supposed to be doing the thing. So. So, dude, like, my whole story how I actually got free from being double minded, because on one hand, I'm like, I want to go have It, I want to go crush it in business. I want to go. I'm going to go build a massive business and change the world through my business. Two weeks later, I'm at a church conference with Heidi Baker, who's a missionary hero, and she's talking about stopping for the one sitting in the mud with African babies and orphans. And I'm like, I'm gonna sell it all and move to Africa with Heidi. And it's like, dude, two weeks ago you wanted to be a billionaire. Now you want to go sell it all and live in the mud. This is literally double mindedness. James says, unstable in all your ways. This is. Most believers, they're like, they're just conflicted. Like, because. And so I was like, I was, I'm like, you know, I'm done with this. This is stupid. Like, I'm done coveting another person's assignment. I'm done coveting that microphone. I'm done coveting a pulpit God, you have called me to sign me to go represent you in the marketplace. So I'm done with this. I repent. I'm sorry, I don't want nothing to do with that. And please use me now in business, dude. Within 18 months, I have my first seven figure kingdom enterprise.
- [05:26]
B
Dude, that's so good. Like, when I was a pastor, there was such a huge part of being a pastor that I felt validated from the stage. Like, you preach a great sermon, people tell you how great it is. That's where I got validation from. And that's why I said before we started is like, there's a lot of pastors out there that it's ego masquerading as righteousness because it's the perfect place to hide behind that. Of like, no, I'm doing this for God. You know, I'm doing it for myself. I've got journals from when I was an intern at, at Red Rocks saying, God, give me a platform, give me a stage, give me responsibility. And at the time, I even personally, I thought that was holy. I thought that, like, I, like, this is what God's calling me to. And as I got older, I realized, no, I just want people to know who I am. And that was one of the reasons that I felt like, hey, big breakthrough, honest.
- [06:16]
C
Big breakthrough for you.
- [06:17]
B
Exactly. You have to be brutally honest with yourself of like, I'm doing this for me. Like, the thing about as a pastor, you, a lot of times you can hide behind that and act like you're doing it for other people. But when I really got like, was Brutally honest with myself. I realized I. I'm doing this for me. And, like, I still love the Lord and I love people, and I want as many people to get saved. Like, none of that's not true. But subconsciously it was like, man, this is cool. Like, I get to speak in front of thousands of people. And, like, and afterwards, if I speak a really good sermon, they're coming up and telling me how great I am and how anointed I am and how God's just using me. And it did something for me. And it's the same way when I left. I mean, Brandon, you and I talked about this a couple weeks ago on the podcast. That's one of the reasons I've stopped posting on Instagram, because I'm doing it for me. Every time I post on Instagram and I get the likes and I get the comments, it validates something inside of me that's like, people want to hear from me. I'm good. I'm great. Like, I'm smart. And so I'm trying to strip, and it is hard. Like, it's. It takes. I'm not there yet, but I'm trying to strip all of that away. This is going to be way too deep for this podcast. But I was telling Brandon right before we got on, I was talking to a buddy, and I drink beer, and I only drink a night or two a week, and it's. It's.
- [07:32]
C
Well, hold on, Brennan, let them tell us how much.
- [07:33]
A
Yeah, it's not that much.
- [07:35]
B
It's not that much. But. But for some reason, I've had this conviction of I need to stop. And it's not because it's a problem, but it's because I do it because it kind of somewhat like, lets my guard down, and I can be more fun and happier and more charismatic, and I'm doing it for other people so they can be like, oh, Cam's the fun guy. Brandon's seen me at events where it's like, cam's a fun guy. Cam's the guy that's going to stay out all night and hang out with everybody and be the. But I'm. I'm not doing that for other. I'm doing that for my own validation. And so I'm trying to work through all of that. And that. That's a lot. That's deep. But I think it's important for everybody to listen to. Even as an entrepreneur, as a business person, is a pastor, like, getting down to the root cause of why you do the things that you do. And Then having to sit in that and having to do that deep work of. Is it. Because honestly, if you stripped it all away, if you stripped it all away, I think you would get to the point, because I feel unworthy, because I feel unloved, and having validation around this, of standing on stage in front of thousands of people, of having an Instagram presence where people are going to comment how great you are, how smart you are, how your advice changed their lives, or going to an event and being the life of the party, it's all because there's deep seated unhealthiness. And it's not just me. Everybody has that. But getting to that point, I always.
- [09:03]
A
Say every millionaire, I don't always say this, but I've said every millionaire was just like a fat or ugly middle schooler. And so, like, we're all just like, I feel like this, like, striving to, like, show up that kid in fifth grade who picked on us because we were overweight or, you know something? It's not always true, but like, there's this, like, validation I need is I was not good enough at some point in my life. And therefore now, because I'm on a podcast, because I'm a pastor, because I'm a millionaire, or because I'm a real estate investor, now I'm worthy. If only I can go back and show those kids in fifth grade or whatever the time period of your past was.
- [09:33]
B
I feel that for me, it's the opposite, where it was like, I was always very charismatic and great.
- [09:40]
A
You were making fun of the fat kids, man. I know you were, but I was.
- [09:44]
B
Always the guy, like. Because I feel like any, anybody that grows up in the church, that's charismatic, that's a leader, that's good with people. Like, you get identified from a young age if you should be a pastor. And so it's seven years old. I was great with adults. I was charismatic. I was great.
- [09:58]
C
Hold on a second. Like, this is laughable. You're charismatic. You're a good speaker, you're good with people. You should be a pastor. Let's not talk about. Do you know the word? Well, it must not talk about sanctification. Let's not talk about, does your life bear fruit? Like, who cares about that? You can probably fill the seats. You should be the. You should be the spiritual head of this entire church.
- [10:20]
B
It's so true.
- [10:20]
C
And that's, I mean, that's why, that's why the Western American. That's why the Western American church is basically commercialization, lacks power and is not transformed culture.
- [10:31]
B
You see so many pastors fall because of that. Because it was like, and my dad is a pastor, my grandpa's a pastor, my great grandpa's a pastor. And so it was just natural that I was going to be a pastor. And from 7 or 8 years old, I was getting pulled aside at youth events and church events. Be like, I see so much in you. You're going to change the world for Christ. You're going to do this. And so like, it was just this natural progression and to. To be into ministry. But I also, it put this weight on me of like, oh, I'm supposed to be great. And then if I don't live up to that, even internally, my self critic is like, you're not good enough. Like, Cameron, everybody's counting on you. Cameron, you've got in.
- [11:10]
A
So have you seen the child preacher on OPRAH from the 80s? You know, I'm talking about if I say that there's a viral clip, it's on YouTube, but the child preacher, see if this comes through. See if you can hear this if I play this too.
- [11:20]
C
If you don't want. Shouldn't be able to intimidate you if you want to do it. Something.
- [11:28]
B
Shall be ashamed of me in this adulterous and sinful generation.
- [11:36]
A
He goes on and on. It's like this long clip. But he just happens to be a good speaker at 8 years old. So he's like the child preacher. I'm like, yeah, just because you're good at speaking doesn't mean you should be leading people.
- [11:49]
C
Yeah, well, let me just. Okay, so let's. So I am known to also point out hypocrisy. I'm known to also point out just glaring problems and issues in church culture. And I think some of that squarely has to fall on pastors and leaders. So I'm also like, on. However, I think the point that Brandy was making is let's not think that pastors have the monopoly on thinking they're doing things for God and for others. Because how many entrepreneurs do we know, ourselves included? We're overworking. We're over leveraged. We're running on red. We're chasing down every deal. And it's like, oh, I'm doing this for you, babe. I'm doing this for the kids. No, you're not. You're a freaking liar. You are not. Because your wife and kids are like, hey, dad, can we see you more? Hey, dad, can you not be so stressed? Hey, dad, can you not be on your phone all the damn Time. And so, like, let's just be honest. No, we are ambitious people. We're chasing deals. We're trying to build big stuff, and we're not stop lying. And we're doing this for our wife and our kids, because we're not. Now, some of you, maybe 2% of you, you are. You're genuinely doing it for your family, the rest of us. That's why I don't say that. And I. I don't say that anymore. And then. And. And actually, I. I never said it for a long time either. Like, I was pretty clear that, like, we can. We don't need to live in Newport beach on the water. You don't need 2,000 doors to retire in America. So can we just stop the nonsense about we're doing this for these people? No, just be like, you know what? I'm ambitious. I'm driven. I've got goals, I've desires. I just feel like I'm supposed to pursue this, and maybe it is. Brandon's right. Some of us got bullied as kids. Some of us, you know, like, were told they were stupid by a teacher. For me, I was. My parents are immigrants. They're Portuguese. I was. My dad's old school, okay? Like, old school. My dad loved me. He. They put me in private Catholic school. They gave me a great education. My dad took me to soccer, tennis, put me in music lessons. My dad took me everywhere. My dad gave me tons of time. What my dad didn't give me is what he couldn't give me, is what I needed the most was words of affirmation. I'm a. Like, I'm a words of affirmation guy. Just tell me I'm amazing. You know how many times my dad told me I was amazing in my formative years? 0.00. Okay? It was like there was no affirmation verbally, but. Classic story. I bring home a near perfect report card, okay? Like, all A's. I'm now a senior in high school. A 17 years old. I've been accepted to UC Davis. I've got scholarships. Like, I'm winning awards. I'm, like, the number one seed on my tennis team. Like. Like, dude, like, I'm achieving at a high level. I bring home all A's, one A minus a 3.98 GPA. I'm like, this is my moment. This is the time. My dad's gonna give me the flowers. I'm gonna get the trophy. I'm gonna get the. Attaboy, son. I'm proud of you and what does my dad say why did you get an A minus M? And I stood there, I was speechless bro. I I already had rehearsed the scene in my mind I'm like I already saw the confetti falling out of the sky. The moment where we hug it out I and that's not what happened. So that vision gets crushed. I'm speechless. I run in my room, I think I just cried for hours. My mom had, my mom had to come comfort me and like so on some level let's just be very very honest, I am an ambitious person. I do believe God gave me wired me for speed, for achievement. I do believe some of this is hardwired but let me have to be honest, some of this also got in there from an early age from I'm going to stick it to my dad, I'm going to prove my dad he that I'm going to go crush it so big in business. I'm going to go make so much money so fast that my dad has to tell me it's part of me and Brandon. That's how I wrecked my life. I was flipping houses, I was buying homes at trusty auction making a killing flipping homes in my backyard, doing great. Started building a nice buy and hold portfolio and I got, I met a guy who knew a guy in Dallas who was buying non performing notes from gmac. Stop buying the hard asset, you're an idiot. Why are you paying 70 cents on the dollar? Let's go buy the debt for 11 cents. So now I'm in Dallas meeting people I don't even know, looking at buying paper. I don't know anything about buying debt. I have, I've never bought a property outside of California. I'm a real estate appraiser, a real estate broker, a hard asset guy. I have a team of I own my local market, I am an expert in my local market. I am printing money in my local market and I get deceived and seduced by fast big profits with people. I don't know why because I'm like I could probably hit 10 million in three years. Not 10. All because I wanted, didn't not knowing this, wanted to just get the attaboy from my dad. So one of my key phrases is heart wounds create blind spots and the enemy will hijack your ambition. What God meant for good, the enemy will try to hijack that. And if he can't slow you down and stop you, he'll accelerate you. And so my ambition which I think is a godly ambition because I was so wounded As a child, wanting to be affirmed by my dad, and the only person my dad respected I saw was wealthy people. And so in my mind, someone was like, I know how I'm going to get my attaboy. I'm going to go get rich. And I was getting rich, but it was too slow. So I risked my entire life savings. I risked my own capital. I had some friends and family money as well, risked all their capital, lost it all, went broke, ended up having to file bankruptcy, falsely accused by my friends, lost my friends, lost my home, lost properties, lost buildings, three cars, repossessed. Now I'm depressed and suicidal. When I was on a great path, but it wasn't fast enough. And the one thing my dad said, when I quit my job to be an entrepreneur and pursue real estate full time, my dad said, listen, I don't think you're making a good decision. I think you should play it safe, keep a job, just max out your 401k. That's what I've done. But if you quit your job to be an entrepreneur, that's fine. Just promise me that you won't fail. Promise me you won't go bankrupt and bring shame on our family. And sure as heck, within about five years of that conversation, exactly what happened?
- [18:47]
A
What did you go through? Like, I know you said you were depressed and suicidal, I guess. How did you, What'd you go through to get out of that? Like, what brought you out of that? Was it just more success in the future or did you fix it before you got more success?
- [19:01]
C
When I say I was suicidal, what I want to clarify that. So I never attempted to take my own life because I was too scared to be honest. I was just chicken. I just like, I'm like, I don't know. I don't know what happens. Like, I didn't know if I got to still go to heaven, if I ended up in hell, if I had to do a do over. I just wasn't sure about what happens. And I was just afraid to do this. I'm just, I was just scared. But I was earnestly asking God, I was praying earnest, real prayers, sincere prayers. God, please don't let me wake up. Because we had like, I had a $6 million whole life policy, right? And so I'm like, my wife can pay off the bills, pay off the debt, pay back the capital and be up 3, 4 some odd million. My wife is pretty and now she's got a stockpile of cash. Like, she'll find somebody else to raise my kids, right? I, I really thought my. I was done. This is like, I'm like 35 years old. I. Here's the problem, Brendan. I never failed before that. This is my first time failing. So I recommend people, I'm like, dude, like fail early, fail on $1,000, make a bad thousand dollar investment, not a $2 million investment. Like try to fall off the curb before you fall out of a three story building. Before that was my product, part of my problem, you know, So I was just smart and a hard worker and I was charismatic and I was a hustler and I was able to. And so I was able to build. I mean, here's another big lesson for everyone. I was, I built because of my hard work and my intelligence and my character. Being charismatic, I was able to build a world bigger on the outside than I could sustain on the inside. And the kingdom is built inside out. So that's why it's all about the heart. And I built my heart. My heart and my mind is the foundation of my life and even our body. That's why some people, their body blows out. But this is what we talked about a lot of times. Pastors falling, why they built a bigger congregation than their soul. They have a bigger following of people than they have depth in God in their own walk with God. So now the. It crushes them. We're real estate people here, right? So if you put a 10 story building on a single family foundation, it ain't going to work. So this happens to a lot of talented, ambitious people. Okay. But how I began to turn around was I realized that God was not going to kill me. I'm not. This is bro. I don't exaggerate. I hate people that exaggerate and make stuff up. So I prayed for 18 months, please don't wake me up. And every time I woke up, I was like, like, dude, come on. Once I realized God was not going to kill me and I was not going to kill myself, I got. My wife hasn't left. I'm like, why are you still here? Like, like what, what are you. Like, I'm done. I'm a loser. Like, I like, why so. But she's like, no. I mean, she just felt led to stay. Thank God. I'm like, d. I. I guess I got to just start over. So at 35, I'm just like, okay. So a couple things happened. One is I have a. I have. It became a principle I teach. I call it the field of favor. I had to feel the favor. God was prospering me in my backyard. In my local city, my local county, flipping houses with hard assets. I had favor there. And I was also had a lot of favor in the insurance industry, financial planning. And I left all that to go chase a fantasy. And that's a proverb. That's actually a proverb. And I have, you know, now I, now I'm known for doing the wisdom challenge coming up. But so I literally part of my destruction started because I left my field of favor where I'm an expert, to go chase a fantasy in another man's field. So I went, I stopped all that, shut it all down, went back to my field of favor, went back to the insurance industry. How to start from the bottom. When I left the industry, I was quarter the table producer, qualifying for trips, being flown first class to events like Pedro is a superstar agent. Look at Pedro. And now I had, now I'm starting back over, buying mortgage protection leads, final expense leads, knocking on people's mobile home park doors to sell them $10,000 burial policies. And I'm like, I felt like the prodigal son in a, in, in, in a hog pen full of slop. I'm like, this is my life, like, and, but guess what? You have to start at the bottom. When sometimes, like almost always in the kingdom. I'm not talking about the world, talking about, like in the kingdom of God's processes, you always start at the bottom. You always start low. You got to start, you got to pass the test, bro. And so there I am at the bottom. I'm buying leads, I'm doing this. I'm like, gosh, Lord. And I'm making a few sales, paying bills again, like, gotta get going. Quickly realized, this is not for me. These people are liars. This is, we're selling crappy. These are terrible policies. I mean, like, what am I doing? So then I'm like, I'm not doing this no more. And then I found another company to go work with, learned a dinner seminar system, got into the retirement business. And then, and that was a big key now that was a big key. Kind of got back to earning income again. Multiple six figures, paying bills again, paying down debt. Now we're back in a house, now things are going really well. And then God speaks to me on the drive home from my office. This is 2015. I hear God clear as day speak to me. He said, son, write a second book. Call it retired and free. If you write it, I'll bless it. So now I just made $600,000 the year before, doing a direct mail dinner seminar retirement system. And now God speaks to me, and I've been saved since I was 28 years old. I got saved at a funeral. So this is now when I'm 51. So I've probably been saved 2015. So I've been saved 17 years. And for the first time I can remember, God speaks to me about a business matter. He gives me business advice, marketing instruction, write a book, call it this Retired and free. If you guys know anything about the baby boomers and the retirement industry. Nobody gets more ads. No one gets more junk mail. Nobody gets pursued and harassed for their money more than baby boomers and retirees. So I'm like, I heard this, but I'm like, this must be my imagination because there's no way in a million years retiredandfree.com is available. There's no way. This book has already not been written. This is too good of a name, too good of a hook. This is just too good in a very heavy marketed niche. So I'm, I'm like, okay, let's just see what's. So I go over to my laptop, open up GoDaddy.com, i type in retiredandfree.com enter available for $9.
- [26:05]
B
Wow.
- [26:05]
C
And I'm like, this could be God. So I write the book, I get all these downloads. I start praying for my clients, I start praying for baby boomers. I'm like, lord, you're speaking to me about my business. Like, what should I put in this book? How can I serve these people? How can I love them like you love them? I don't want to take advantage of them like everybody else. I want to serve them. I want to love them. How can you're obviously calling me to this. How can I do, how can I represent you in this industry? And it's just like, downloads, downloads, downloads down. I write the book. But more than writing the book, now I reimagine my entire business. Now I'm like, well, wait a minute. Like, I need to examine everything I say, everything I do. Because I learned this industry from a man who was not a Christian, who doesn't have a godly standard. And most Christians don't have a kingdom standard. Most Christians do business just like the world. So I'm like, if God's in my business, God's giving me advice. My entire business has to honor God and be at a kingdom standard, not just the world standards, bro. I changed almost everything I did. I changed the product I was selling because I was taught to sell one product. It was a good product, but not the best product for my clients. Once I did, once I dug or none, once I dug in and looked at, hey, what's the best part for my client? I realized something pretty terrible. And this should be no shock to you, Brandon, because you're a smart guy, but it turns out the best product for my clients paid me 40% less commission. Shocker how putting my clients first is going to cost me money because the company only has so much money and the more I want them to pay me, the less they can give in returns to my client. Now I had a real test. How serious am I about this God first business idea? Because now it's going to cost me 40%. That's not small. That's basically, that's almost half. Like, so I had to in private give myself a 40% pay cut that my clients would have never even known the difference, bro. That was the first huge test I passed. I said no Lord, I'm not even sure I could be profitable. Like, I'm not even sure this is going to work. Like, I'm not sure the math will even pencil. But I'm unwilling to put myself ahead of my clients. So I'm going to sell this and I'm going to trust you to make it all work out, bro. That year I doubled my business. I have, I had my first seven figure year. I became a seven figure kingdom entrepreneur and changing everything about how I have my biggest year ever, giving myself a 40 pay cut. God doubled my revenue and never looked back since. And then two years later he I launched the 100x Academy Teaching Kingdom Entrepreneurship in 2018. There was just from my recollection, from what I can remember, there was no one talking about the Kingdom on Facebook, on Instagram. There were no ads. Kingdom entrepreneurship was not being talked about or discussed. Maybe there was some other groups and some books, but from what I can remember, it's not to gas myself up, just to be honest. Like I was the first one was like who was popularizing and saying guys, there's a different way to do business. It's like don't just be a Christian in business, be a Kingdom entrepreneur. And I was telling my story, I was teaching these principles and then that kind of took off. And then 18 months later, Covid hits and then God launches me out as the challenge guy, as the guy that created the modern day challenge. And now I'm helping Dean Graziosi, Tony Robbins, Damon John, I've helped Joe Polish. All the biggest names in entrepreneurship marketing are coming to me for help. I'm showing them my Challenge model. Now all of a sudden, now they're crushing it. And then they helped me launch my first ever program called Crush it with challenges in 2020. And so I went from someone that I was a financial planner living in obscurity. No one even knew who I was. And within a few months, I was everywhere. Like, it was like God just promoted me to the top of the online marketing space. And that was in 2020 and been a wild ride ever since. But, man, that's a little bit about me, where I've been, how I got here. And it was hard work looking at myself. I hired a godly mentor. Before all the success, when I was still in the junk, when I was broke, when I was losing cars and homes, when we were going to my mother in law's house for groceries, I hired a godly mentor and was paying him a thousand a month. My wife's like, what are we doing? We don't have money for food. How we can't afford a thousand a month. I said, babe, I can't afford to shipwreck our life again. I can't afford to not know what happened. Like, look at our life. I don't know how this happened. And this is the only man I've ever seen who's telling me the truth. He's holding up a mirror. He's showing me hard things about myself. Difficult, painful things I'm having to see. But no one's ever been willing to help me or show me these things. So I know we can't afford it, but I know it's cliche, but I don't think we can afford not to, because I don't ever want to be here again. So I hired this mentor, this a friend, a guy who was in our church. And you want to talk about, like, tough love. You want to talk about, like, iron sharpening iron. This guy just let me have it, bro. Like, he just let me have it. He said some of the most painful things I've ever heard in my life. They were all true, but they were just gut wrenching. And cut, Just cut to the soul. And like. And of course I'd go in there, we'd meet, and he would say something, say, pedro, today I want to talk to you about this. And I'm like, he would make a claim. You're too much like this. No, I'm not. I'd immediately be defensive. No, no, no, it's not that way. I would, I would. You know, here I am, I'm broke. I'm busted. He's a Mega multi millionaire. I hired him to help me. I drive up to his beautiful estate in the hills. He says he sees something in me that's a problem and wants to help me with it. And my first. My automatic response is, no, you're wrong. Let me explain to you why you're wrong. And then he would let me talk for a minute or two, and then he would say, pedro. And then I would keep talking, and then he has to pull out the hammer. And then just. And now I start crying, and I'm crying, and now all of a sudden, conviction comes, and now here's the Holy Spirit. And I'm like, dude, why do I make this guy's life so hard? I'm here for him to help me. And my initial response is defense. So then he has to crank up the heat. Then he pulls out the hammer. And now I want to make him the jerk. Now I want to make him the. Oh, you're so rough on me. Why are you so mean to me? Idiot. You for 20. Like, just. You make the guy have to raise the heat so high for you to kind of even pay attention. So, bro, I went through a very. I went through a very intense time of reflection and mentorship. I also went through a lot of inner healing where I would just. A lot of. Just did some inner healing sessions. I also probably a dozen times in prayer in my own home, in prayer in the word Holy Spirit, would just, like. I would just have encounters with God, and I would just. There's times I would just kind of get knocked out. I know this kind of sounds a little bit maybe super spiritual for this audience. I don't know. There's times I would just start crying, and then I would just, like. Just something was happening to me. I'm just, like, releasing all this pain and all this hurt. And there's times I would just kind of, I don't know, fall asleep, kind of get knocked out, and I would wake up two hours later, and I'm like, oh, I feel better. And I kind of make a joke. I kind of like. I call, like, Holy Spirit anesthesia. Because there are some pains and traumas that some of us have had that are so painful that we can't process the pain consciously. We have to kind of get put under. And it's the goodness and kindness of God that he would allow us to kind of, like. He would kind of help us go into a state where he could kind of remove that from your heart.
- [34:38]
B
So you talked about your dad's affirmation and wanting to Earn that later on in life. And. And you talked a lot about inner healing and childhood trauma. I've got five kids. Most important thing to me is being a great dad, a loving dad. But I also want my kids to be great. And the hard thing is trying to handle like that with also not creating childhood trauma. So a great example is my daughter. She loves gymnastics. She just got second place for her first time. She's been first every other time. She got second place. And I was like, I want to let her know that I'm here for her, and I want her to want to be great. And she was very upset about it, but I also want her to know that I love her no matter what. And, like, I guess just. That's hard. I just never, I guess, go back to my life being pulled aside and telling me how good I was. My father did that. I love my dad more than anything. He's the most amazing dad ever that unknowingly created this need for greatness in my life that. That I've had to work through. And so how have you raised your kids to push them to excellence without creating trauma in their lives? Does that question make sense at all?
- [35:48]
C
Well, it does, but you're. You're assuming I did that.
- [35:50]
B
Oh, yeah, That's. That's. That's true.
- [35:53]
C
Like, the actual better question is, given your experience, how did you choose to raise your kids? Because my kids are now 26, 24, and 22. Okay, so let me tell you the mistake that we often make. I had a very traumatic upbringing, even though I never was raped, molested, or beat. Well, I mean, my dad did spank us, but not a lot. Not very often. I was pretty. I was scared of my dad. My dad was hella big, and I was very small. I didn't grow until I was, like, a junior in high school. So I'm, like 6ft, 200 pounds now. But I was like. I think I was, like, 5, 1 4, 11. 98 pounds as a freshman in high school. So I was small. So my dad. I was, like, scared. So my dad. That. That was very traumatic for me. I shipwrecked my life. So now I'm like, I'm not putting my kids through this. So I course corrected probably too far over here. Now it's like, my kids are gonna know that I love them. I love you guys. You guys are loving you guys. You guys are awesome. You guys are amazing. So I come way over here to this extreme, and I probably did not make grades important enough. I probably did not make Achievement in sports important enough, I probably did not kind of push them to kind of really give more effort in their childhood, Right? And my wife did not help either, because my wife has been raised in this crazy, smothering enabler house. I've got my father wounds. So looking back now, now I'm like, all right, kids, like, it's go time. You guys are like, you're 26 now, Dre. Like, you're 24. Like, you're 22, right? My boys hated school. My daughter went to college. Okay. She graduated. So now I'm like, my thought was always when they need to, they'll turn the switch. Like, they'll kind of get in gear. And I would say that is kind of what's happening. But I'll also be honest, at times I'm a little bit like, dude, my kids should be a little bit more Johnny on the spot that I kind of want them to be a little bit more motivated than they are right now. So looking back on probably over course and guess what? They still have father wounds, bro. I don't care what you do, your kids are going to have wounds. So just take that off the pedestal, bro. Just. You cannot live up to that. No matter how hard you try, no matter how much you pray, no matter how much Bible you read, no matter how hard you want to give your kids the perfect upbringing, it doesn't exist. And there's. Your kids are going to need to process some of this with you, your wife or somebody else possibly later. Now, I don't know anybody that says I had a perfect father, I have a perfect childhood. The only guy that I only know one person, I can't say his name. The only person I know who's. Who's told me that has had some major, major stuff come out publicly and they like. So I don't trust people that tell me that because parenting is one of the hardest things they're going to do. And you're not going to. You're not going to do it right. You're not going to do it perfect. So. And you gotta pick your values. For me, my number one value was my kids will at least know they're loved. And I would rather have kids that are not as ambitious but know they're loved.
- [39:19]
A
That's the judge in my mind of a successful parenting is that your grown up kids want to spend time with you.
- [39:25]
B
It's true, you say you're. You haven't figured it out, but if your kids want to hang out with you and spend time with you, like.
- [39:31]
C
My kids love me, respect me, are inspired by me, and they want to hang out with me. And they're not straight A students, they're not valedictorians. They didn't start three companies that don't have a tech startup. I mean, I'm just being honest. They don't. If I, if I put their resume up, you'd be like, dude, what? Your kids, bro, are like losers. And you know, like, they're not, they're just, you know, they're, they barely show up to work. I mean, I have to, I can't get an honest eight hour a day out of my kids. Like, so like on, it's like they work for four hours and like, oh my God. I, I'm like, dude, you worked four hours today. So I just want to be super transparent. Like, I was married at 22, work, college graduate, married, homeowner, corporate America, 22 years old. My 26 year old doesn't even like have a clue what it is. Eight hour day. Yet.
- [40:19]
B
That's the time we have Brandon. I have a buddy, his name's Eric Hemingway, and he was out in Maui, this is a year ago. And he brought three of his kids with him. And we were at dinner one night and he got up and walked away. And I said something to them and they're like, all in their mid teens to early 20s. I was like, do you guys realize how cool your dad is? And their eyes lit up and they were like, he's the best dad. He's amazing. This, that and the other. Since that moment, Eric has been one of my favorite people in the world. Because a lot of kids would be like, yeah, you don't really do that or you. Yeah, they were like, they couldn't wait to speak highly of their dad when he wasn't around. And to me, that's the biggest sign of respect.
- [41:02]
A
Cool.
- [41:02]
B
That's what I want for my kids is like, when I'm not around, when they're in those private settings, in those private rooms, having drinks with their friends, talking about their dad, I want them to say like, their eyes to light up and be like, my dad was amazing. And Eric, obviously, I'm sure messed up a lot at times. But like, at the end of the day, if they will speak highly of me in private rooms, man, that means I've done something, right?
- [41:25]
C
So again, to get clear about like, like, what does success look like? Like, what do you really want to. And then you're gonna have to kind of maybe make some trade offs along the way, right? Because if you push your kids too hard and you won't even think you're doing it. Like, like your daughter came in second place. She's upset, right? What I would do now is I'd be like, hey, baby, how are you doing? I'm really upset, dad. I came in second place. I'm really mad. I'm like, oh, okay, I'm sorry you're upset. Tell me more about that. Why are you upset? I would just put them through, I would just coach them. Tell me more. Why are you upset? Why are you sad? I would just like, I would, dude, I would take a whole different approach. I would not be trying to tell them what to think or believe. I'd be like, well, tell me why here, tell me why this? And then eventually you're gonna say, gonna start crying. Just like my grown ass adult clients do when I hot seat them, they start crying. And she's gonna say, I just wanna make you proud, daddy. That's the moment you can say, oh sweetheart, like, I love you. And whether you're first place or 100th place, I love you. You make me proud. So like that. But you can't just say, oh baby, we still love you. Oh baby, we're proud. Because like now it's just like, how does she even know you mean it? And how's she not even really aware that that's why she's doing it? So I would just, I'd be asking more questions of my kids, letting them talk, letting them actually start to kind of like, why am I so upset?
- [42:47]
B
Like, I think that's so good because obviously I was like, oh yeah, daddy's proud of you no matter what. But peeling is almost like what you do in adults and with inner healing is peeling back that layer with her of why are you upset? Because every time she, you know, you have four, whatever, four different things and she gets done and the first person she looks to is me. And I guarantee if I would have peeled back those layers, that's what would've came out, is because I wanted you, mom to be proud. And then that means so much more to peel back that layer and then tell her like, hey, we're proud versus at the beginning, right when it happened. Don't worry about it. Mom and I are proud of you. Like, peeling back those layers is important. That's really good.
- [43:28]
C
Yeah. When you saying that in that moment does nothing. In fact now just you should know, I have, I don't have degrees in this. I have an econ degree. Okay. So I don't this is not coming from a place of clinical experience, but I would bet that you saying that actually makes it worse because now she doesn't believe you. She thinks you're saying that to make me feel good because I'm upset. Yeah, now my daddy's just saying that. But it's not true.
- [43:56]
B
That's good.
- [43:57]
C
So you gotta, you gotta let these kids process their feelings and then let them have that epiphany. So then now, boom. Now you can speak the truth and it can be received. But it's. And this is what Christians do, bro. I coach Christians, like in groups. So we'll do hot seats. Okay. And I'm going in on somebody. I'm just like, boom. I'm asking questions or like at an event, I do a, you know, do event now. I kind of do like these Tony Robbins style interventions. I just love doing them. And obviously ours are like, you know, I'm not sure how Tony does it. I'm not sure if it's NLP or what. Ours are like Holy Spirit and just my wisdom. So someone's standing up, I'm going in. All of a sudden they start crying. What always happens, people come over, put tissue in their hand. Oh, it's okay. It's okay. And right. And I, my people don't know not to do that anymore because I'll be like, hey, like, yeah, like we're good. Like you can sit down. Like it's okay. They don't need tissues that bad. You're so concerned that they may put some snot on their dress. You're interrupting Holy Spirit dealing with them of a 30 year trauma. But this dress, God forbid it gets a snot stain. You don't care about them. You're uncomfortable with your own pain and you can't even sit there. And just because you're so triggered your pain so control. You've got to react. And now you're up here messing up what God's doing. This is what Christ. Oh, it's okay, honey. It's going to be okay. No, it might not be okay. That child may die. This you might go, you might lose that house. Your wife may leave. This might not be okay. That's not what we should say. That's a damn lie. But as Christians, we want to comfort. That's not our job. We, you know whose job is the comfort? The Holy Spirit. So, bro, you, you just. Honestly, I don't even know you, but like, oh, I love it. I think I do. You have a great heart, dude. I think you have an Amazing heart. Let me tell you what you're up against. You are up against. You have been indoctrinated generationally into religion, and that is the biggest hurdle in your life is going to be coming out of religion, which is all about how it looks and aligning yourself with God, the kingdom of God, and getting free from that. And I don't know because I didn't grow up in church, thank God, and I'm not a third generation pastor, so I'm a little bit freer. I don't. But, like, the amount of. My best friend's a third generation pastor and he left ministry. I taught him entrepreneurship, the amount of work it took for me to help him detox religion and church culture. Dude, it's a, it's a detox, bro. Like, again, like, and again, you're hanging out, Brandon. You're, you're in the marketplace now, but anytime you are having a struggle or a problem or feeling a little bit off or you're kind of conflicted, you should ask, what did I learn in church culture from my parents? Like, what belief is this? And I guarantee you it's going to probably come from religion because it's just so, it's just so hardwired into you guys.
- [46:53]
B
Well, and I think we talked about this at the very beginning of the podcast where it said a lot of it stems from this unworthiness. And, and it's not daddy wounds, it's God wounds. I was taught from a very young age that you have to do X, Y and Z for God to love you. And we were still taught grace in our church, but it was like, don't drink, don't dance, don't chew, don't run around with girls who do. And it was like, every time I messed up, I was like, oh, like, I'm not good enough. And I remember this one time so specifically where a youth retreat, the youth pastor was talking about habitual sin. He used some verse in the Bible where he's like, hey, you know, everybody sins, but if you were sinning habitually, like, you might not be a Christian. And I remember being so scared because I'm like, I lie all the time. I cuss all the time. Like, being so scared that I wasn't a Christian and having these deep dark wounds that I'm not good enough. And now that's coming up in my later on in my life. And so, like, being able to.
- [47:53]
C
But you call that a God wound?
- [47:54]
B
It's not. It's a religion. It's a, is a western religion.
- [47:58]
C
It's a religious.
- [47:59]
B
It's what I thought it was my version of God, of who God is. It's not the true God, but it was the version that I'd made up in my head of who God is. Is. He's up.
- [48:08]
C
No, that's not what you made up.
- [48:10]
B
That's what you were told in my head is, he's got a weight in a scale.
- [48:13]
C
You didn't make this up. There was. This is what you were told. Okay.
- [48:17]
B
Yeah, so. And then having to rework that, where it's like, hey, the good outweighs the bad. I'm good. Or the. You know, the last three months of my life, man, I've been reading my Bible and tithing, and, like, I'm good right now. If I died, I'd go to heaven.
- [48:30]
C
But.
- [48:30]
B
So, like, trying to work through all of that and then bring kids into the world where I want them to love God, I want them to love people, but I also don't want them to feel that way.
- [48:40]
C
It.
- [48:40]
B
I mean, you said it. We're all gonna mess up. It's the best thing. It's the hardest thing you'll ever do.
- [48:46]
C
But, yeah, one thing that I didn't know. My kids paid a lot more attention to my life than maybe I even realized. So, like, just the best thing to do is, like, just be an example. Like, get your life. Just be an example. Because even if you mess something up or you're. Maybe you're just a little. You know, maybe you're in a bad moon, you can. A little bit too harsh, but, like, they're gonna see the totality of your life, right? So my kids have seen my life and their mom. They've seen us fight, work things out. They've seen us stay committed and stay married 28 years. They kind of now are figuring now they. My son, my oldest son, we're at a conference one day. He comes up to me on a break. He's bawling his eyes out. I'm like, trey, what happened? He's like, dad, I'm so happy you didn't kill yourself. My oldest had no idea. They just didn't know. They were, like, at that age where, like, I was able to kind of. So like, now my kids are like, holy shit, my dad wanted to die. Like, legit. They remember moving from the nice big house to the small, dumpy rental. They remember that, but they weren't or they don't remember. Like, we kind of like, oh, yeah, we're gonna come here now. And our house is not Quite ready yet. So we're gonna live here. We were able to kind of like shield them from that, from the trauma, but now they're kind of putting the thoughts together and they're like, my dad came back from destruction. Look at the people's lives he's impacted. Look at the, look at what he's done. We live in a 13 million dollar house on the water in Newport Beach. We have a property in Portugal. I have other 9 and a half million dollar estate in San Juan Capistrano. We got money over here. We're doing this over here. All of my heroes are friends, contemporaries. My kids saw me do all that they were there. And now they know that before that I wanted to kill myself, dude. What? There's nothing better I can do for my kids than for them to see that their dad could have given up, could have crawled up in a ball and died and chose differently. And look what God's done. And look how God's using our family. There's no better example than that. Even if there's times I was too harsh, there's one time I got my daughter's iPhone, threw in the floor, smashed a million pieces. That's like, okay. But then they have the broader picture of this is my dad and this is what I've seen my example. And so, bro, like, I'm sure you are modeling and living an amazing example for your kids. That's what's going to matter most. You're not going to be judged for maybe having a. Not a great attitude one time here or there. And the fact that you even care this much, bro, about this is you're going to, you're already going to be on the upper end of the curve. You know, kind of like Brandon, like, you know Brandon, bro, I can tell, man. No, but not even that too. But like, he's like, hey, man, this financial wrestle, like, I don't want to be. I don't want to be greedy. I don't want to be like happy in my. Over here in my ivory castle while people like, bro, like people that are greedy, bro, don't think like that. They're not even. It never occurs to them.
- [51:38]
A
So I'd love to dig in a little bit more on the idea. You know, this conversation is kind of around the intersection. That's the way I want to take it is like faith and money or faith in business. There's. There's this belief that like God doesn't care about my business. Like, I'm not saying I've ever said that, but it's kind of a feeling in my soul that, like, business is over here. My faith is over here. God doesn't care about my business. God doesn't want me to be successful, doesn't want me to be rich. Because if he, you know, the two are separate. They're secular and they're spiritual and they should not touch. And that's a feeling, I think a lot. Either. Either a lot of people have or they go the other way and they say, God wants me to be rich. Name it, claim it. Prosperity. How do you view the intersection between faith and money or faith and wealth? Faith and business. Like, what does God care? Like, why does God care if he does so?
- [52:24]
C
There is no intersection. It's completely overlapped. There's no intersection. We live one life unto God. There's no separation. Everything is spiritual, Everything is natural, everything is holy. Everything. We live our lives unto God. So does God care about your business? God cares about your business more than you care about your business. So the fact is both those things, both of those perspectives are lies from the enemy. God doesn't care about my business. I've got my spiritual life and then I've got my real life, my money life. They're separate. That's a lie from the devil. The prosperity gospel is also a lie from the devil. Now if you're going to believe one, you should probably choose the prosperity gospel because that's actually less of a lie. The other one is a hundred percent lie. The other one's like maybe a 20% lie. Right? So like, if you're going to believe a liar, end up in error. I'd rather you believe in error. That has you believe that God is so good he wants you to be wealthy. Because that's actually more true than God doesn't care about my life. What kind of good father doesn't care about his kids? I'm a great dad. I can care less if my kids are broke and homeless, eating out of a garbage can or if they have more than enough. What? We would never say that. That makes no sense. And so of course he cares about your business, but he cares. Here's the. Here's the big mistake I see people make, Brandon. They think God cares more about their money and prospering them than God cares about them. And that's the lie of the prosperity gospel. Don't you think? I was saved and I went broke. You don't think I was praying my ass off to not get those cars repossessed? You don't think I was praying my ass off to not lose homes of foreclosure. Oh, Lord, please not this house. Don't let this house be gone. And I would, like, walk around my block seven times. I'd pray in tongues, and then guess what? It goes to auction.
- [54:20]
A
Gone.
- [54:20]
C
And I'm like, ah. And I'm like, no, God. Like, one by one, all these things. I was convinced he would not let the enemy take from me. Gone by. And it's like, well, God don't care. God's a jerk. No, God cares about me and my soul more than houses. So God's like, oh, God won't let me fail. You're an idiot. You. Don't you even know God? God will, of course, let you fail all of it. The people God's used the most failed big time. I mean, David, this. Wow. David is just supposed to be at work, supposed to be at war. It's like, I'm good. Sends his guys. He's on the roof, sees a hot chick. He's like, I'll have that, please. And just. And then like, oh, this is my best friend's wife. No problem. He's gone. Fighting my battles. Oh, she's pregnant. No problem. Kill my best friend. And then doesn't. And this is David, who God says, oh, David, a man after my own heart. You're like, what? So all these Christians who think God is, like, going to keep you in, like, bubble wrap. Dude, what Bible are you reading? Where are you going? To church. You probably need a new pastor. Like, you listen to the wrong voices, dude. It's the enemy that comes to steal, kill, destroy. God does not want to harm you, but God cares more about you and your soul and. And you becoming a mature son so he can trust you and use you. And sometimes you got to lose a business, lose a house, go bankrupt, go through some hard stuff to end up kind of coming out, having a death of your old flesh, death of your old nature to come in and to become usable by God. Pedro, version 1.0 was talented. He. He had some. He. He was gifted, but he was unusable by God. So God's like, We're gonna kill 1.0. But don't worry. We're gonna. There's gonna be. We're gonna have a new page. There's gonna be a 2.0. Okay, so the. The. The Pedro that you've seen these last kind of 13 years, that's launched global movements, that's had a crazy impact. That's Pedro 2.0. Pedro 1.0. You guys would have not liked that guy, like, I would have probably ended up owing you some money. That guy, like, I'm so glad I. I'm so glad 1.0 didn't have an Instagram account. I'm so glad no one knew 1.0, and I was able to have a death and go through all my problems and drama when no one knew me. So now 2.0, not bad. 2.0 had a good run. But if I'm being transparent, I know God's in a process right now. I think God's like, hey, let's kill 2.0. I'm like, dude, what do you mean? 2.0 is great. People love 2.0. We. $50 million in revenue since COVID 2.0. Dream houses, dream cars, dream life. Oh, I got fancy friends. 2.0. You want to kill this? Come on. He's like, well, he's like, we don't have to. It's your life. But, dude, I think you're gonna love 3.0. Like, I could really use 3.0. I use 2.0, but I can use 3.0 even more. So now I'm. We're in this. We're in this dance. Like, you know, we're in this dance. Some days I let him kill me. Some days I run, you know? So I'm wearing this dance right now, like, Lord, but this is just actually what it looks like. When you truly follow God, when you want to be used by God and you want to stop playing church and nice Christian lifestyle, when you want to actually say, God, use me for your glory, you're going to have to go through a training camp. You're going to have to be trusted. You're going to have to be tested, and you're going to have to be willing to have all the junk in your heart revealed and then deal with it and get over yourselves so we can be used by God. So it. It was not easy, bro. It was not easy, but it was so worth it. And I actually have no regrets. I've had some horrific things done to me. I was falsely accused, lied on, cheated from. And it all. Like, I don't. I can't regret it because look where it brought me. Look what. Look what God's done. Look how much glory he's gotten from that.
- [58:26]
A
There's a quote from Alex Hermosi, who's. Who's not a believer. I don't believe right now, but Hermosi has this great quote that he was gonna butcher it. Yeah, he was. Yeah, there's a great quote he Says, if you are God and you are gonna create the best human possible. Like I wish I could get it word for word, but it's like if you could get create the best human possible, would you give them an easy life or would you put them through trial after trial and near death experiences? Because that's what builds a great person and it's such as great picture of like. Yeah. I think oftentimes people think, oh, I'll become a Christian and my life will be easy again. We don't maybe say it, but there's some intuitive belief that like, oh, everything's gonna be better. Yeah, it will be better in a lot of ways. It doesn't mean it's going to be easy. And in fact the exact opposite is, is.
- [59:09]
C
Is true.
- [59:10]
A
God keeps raising the bar maybe is a phrase. I wrote a song. Like I won't play it or sing it because that's weird. But I wrote a song back when.
- [59:18]
C
I was like 21 years old that would be. No, I love worship music, but that would be kind of weird, bro.
- [59:22]
A
Yeah, I wrote a punk rock song.
- [59:23]
C
I wrote a song about it. Here we go.
- [59:24]
A
Yeah, I know. Back when I was a punk rock face. But the song was called Raise the Bar and the chorus went, I know there's more in store for me but every time I near the end, you raise the bar again. This building plan to destroy my heart will leave me broken and dead but won't you raise the bar again? It's the idea that like he pushes you to that limit because that's what makes you better. And then he raises the bar. He's like, all right, we're gonna do even more. And I'm not talking about like being a more perfect person. I'm not trying to. This is not like a works based. I can not sin anymore, not make mistakes. But it's like I'm going to push you to the extreme where you're like, oh, I can't handle that. And then you handle it and you grow and it's like, all right, you did it now. That's the new line. I'm gonna raise the bar again. Let's make you even better. Like let's put you through more to the point where I, I want to welcome that. Be like, yeah, this is hard. Good. Like Jocko willing style. Good. I'm glad this sucks right now.
- [60:12]
C
Well, James, I mean, so we're talking about Jocko, but James said it first, right? Like, was it blessed are you or welcome? Like, like great joy when you feel. Yeah, this Is James before Jocko made it cool. Yeah. Okay. That's what I love about. And then Alex is like, I wonder, if God wanted to have a perfect person, what would he do? Well, there was a guy named Jesus. Let's look at how God deal with Jesus, right? Like, we don't. We don't have to imagine some of these things. Some of this stuff is just right here written down, right? And this crazy thing about Alex. So we were in a group together for a couple years together. We ended up at the. At a gym, working out one morning in Boise. And then, hey, man, so what are you doing? I'm like, ah, faith based. I teach this. He's like, I used to be a Christian. And I'm like, oh, dude. Like, why are you not Christian no more? You know what he said? He said, because I was all in and everybody around me didn't seem serious about it. He's like. So then it made me like, just question if this is even real. So Alex Hormozi. And maybe this I hope I'm not betraying, maybe a confidential moment we have, but it was a long time ago and he says a lot of things on the Internet. So Alex from Mosey says he walked away from Christianity because of the lukewarmness and apathy of all these other people.
- [61:39]
B
Penn and Teller have a famous YouTube video where they say the same exact thing.
- [61:42]
C
That's an indictment, bro. That's an indictment. Now I think it's a terrible way to walk away. I would have been like, well, hey, bro, lead us then. Like, you're not wrong. Why don't you lead us? Why don't you show us? Like, come on, bro. Like, let's. So I think he drew. I think he made the wrong decision, but he's not wrong about the assessment. If that guy clearly isn't all in obsessive, I'm in or I'm out. He has deep convictions. He's going to live his convictions. And he's like, I don't want to be around other people who don't actually live this because why are we here reading stuff, affirming stuff, saying we believe stuff and not living it? He's not wrong at all. So hopefully God still has a, you know, still will get a hold of his heart and see that he was not wrong. But like, and now we're seeing more and more people who have great levels of influence. I mean, this morning I was watching a. I saw Russell Brand just speak at Amfest. Russell Brand, he's been a Christian for what A year, year and a half, you know that something is happening when actors, comedians who are drug addicts who were lost a year ago are preaching better than 99 of preachers in churches. Like, it's about to happen. Like, this is it. Like, the best preaching in America today is coming out of Russell Brand's mouth right now. Other people that don't have churches don't get paid to be a Christian, who have. He's like, my life's been changed by Jesus Christ like this. They're just like, they've had such a transformation, and so it's so fresh and real. They're still in their first love. That's the people I want to listen to. And the challenge with being saved and being in church culture five years, 10 years, 20 years, is how do we keep that first love? How do we stay on fire and we remember how we first got saved and how we were lost and we were in this desperate place and, like, remembering and staying connected. And even in talks, in revelation, like, there's that letter right in rebuke, you forgot your first love. And this can happen to pastors. It can happen just to lay people. And so you see a guy like Russell Brand who is, like, on fire for God because he remembers it was not even a year ago he was lost.
- [64:00]
A
Well, how do you. What do you suggest for people? How those who are listening, they're like, man, I feel like I have lost that first love. I've lost my not faith, but I've lost the passion and the commitment. How do I get that back?
- [64:10]
C
Great question. I would say one thing. Every time I tell my story about, like, I told you guys here, it's how I. That's part of how I do it. Like, when I can. Like, so I'm here in my house in Newport Beach. I'm looking at the water like it's. We have an incredible life. But every time I tell the story that, like, there was a time where I was begging God to kill me, dude, how do you not just start? Like, I could start crying right now. Like, I was begging God to end my life. I thought I was good for zero. And that's why I tell people all the time, if you're going through a hard time, the Enemy wants to label you and Cha and have, oh, I failed. I went bankrupt. I'm a loser. I'm a failure. No, you're not a failure. You failed. This thing failed. This project may have failed. Doesn't mean you're a failure. But the label wants to hang the Enemy Wants to labels with this identity. And that's why I tell people, like, if you're going through a rough time like this too shall pass Romans 8:28. All things can and really will work together for your good, if you love God and are called according to his purpose. To me, it's just remembering that, like, so it comes back to gratitude, like, being grateful. Like, just like God, thank you. Like, thank you. Like, as hard as I work, Brendan, you work hard. We all work hard, right, Cameron? Like, as hard as I worked, I know that hard work alone did not get me here. Hard work does not guarantee results. So I'm like, God, apart from you, I. I'd be dead. Apart from you, I. God knows where I'd be. So I think that's kind of how I help stay rooted in there. Time in the word. Time in the word for me is like, not everybody likes to read, likes to be in the word. But dude, like, I hear God in the Word, I feel God in the Word. And if you struggle with the word, I would say just keep reading until you experience God. Oh, I have a devotional. Like, okay, bro, that's okay. Maybe. But like, a devotional is like a two minute little snack. I guess that's better than nothing. But like, I would say open up your Bible and don't leave until you experience God. Don't leave until you feel God. Don't leave until, you know, I just met with God.
- [66:21]
A
Where do you suggest somebody who's not into, like, they haven't read their Bible, maybe they're not a Christian. And they're like, what is he talking about? Where do they start? What do you think? Just page one, book of John.
- [66:29]
C
I mean, I mean, I mean, I would pray. I would pray. I would pray. And you're like, well, Pedro, who am I praying to? I don't believe in God. Here's what I would say. God, if you're there, because these people know you respect you, Brandon, right? They're here to learn how to get rich in real estate. So if you respect Brandon, Brandon's not an idiot, okay? He didn't just magically end up here. So you respect him, okay? He brings me on because he thinks I can add value to the show. And I've got, you know, I've got real results too. So what you can say is, okay, God, I'm not even sure if you exist. I feel like I'm talking to the air. But if you are real, just reveal yourself to me. I'm willing to be wrong about this. I'm willing to. If you're real, I'd like to know you. And this is just. I don't understand why more agnostics and atheists at least don't try this. Like, what if you're wrong? And if. And I've been wrong a lot, but, like, this is the worst thing to be wrong about. You don't want to be wrong about that. You can maybe, oh, I shouldn't have bought that apartment building. Oh, I shouldn't have invested in that city. Dude, that's fine. You don't want to be wrong about the most important question of your entire existence is, is there a creator that made me? And if so, is he still around? And if so, is he willing to actually be my friend and talk to me? And the answer is yes, yes, and yes. And so don't take my word for it. Just be like, hey, God, if you're real, please show me. And then just. You can say, I'm gonna go pick up this Bible. And then just tell me where to read. And, you know, like, just tell me where to read. You can even. I don't. You can play Bible roulette. Just spin the. I go flip the pages and just. See, I mean, people like, Pedro. That doesn't. That's. Dude, Pedro. That sounds New Age. That sounds weird. Why would you tell people to do that? Well, my Bible says that when they replaced Judas, there was two good candidates. Do you know how they broke the tie? They rolled dice. They rolled dice to pick the 12th Disciple. So me telling people just to grab a Bible and just keep flipping till the pain shows up, and that doesn't sound too crazy to me.
- [68:46]
A
Okay, now, better than not reading at all.
- [68:48]
C
Go to John, the book of John in the New Testament. John's a great book. The Apostle John was the apostle of love. And it's a great place to start. Then I would go to Matthew. Like, then I go Matthew, Mark, and Luke. But, dude, just more than anything, just open your heart and your mind to the possibility that there is a God and he actually exists. He actually made you. And more than that, he actually wants to be in your life. He wants to be your friend, a father, a friend, a counselor, a mentor to you. And, like, to be able to have this and then go through your entire life not willing to see if it's real is one of the craziest things to do. It's just not smart. It's just not even smart business if Brandon's like, hey, there's a new city. There's this great new City that I just discovered, it's got the best real estate, the best caps, the best tenants, the best bet. And he's like, let's go do a site visit. And you're like, no. Why would you at least go see, bro? Like, at least go see. Maybe you don't invest. Maybe you do. But why would you not go see for yourself? Because if what I'm saying is true, you hit the gold mine of all gold mines. And if it's not true, you're no worse off. You still don't. You don't believe in God now. You don't believe in him, then how are you worse off? So just open your heart, man. Because, dude, without this God, I'd be dead.
- [70:20]
A
Wow, man. I love that talk for sure. So, you know, super. Appreciate that. I would love to. You know, before we get out of here, I want to shift to a couple more quick things. I want to ask a big question. Let me preface it with a story. In the movie Schindler's List, there's a scene at the very end of the movie, for those who don't know, it's the movie about the Jewish concentration camps, and Liam Neeson is the main character, and he's helping all these Jews escape the concentration camp sentence. And by employing them anyway, at the very end, the Jews are liberated, the war is over, and they surround Liam Neeson, and they're like. Hundreds of them are, like, hugging him and crying. Everyone's all excited. It's such a moment of elation and happiness. And Liam Neeson starts freaking out and crying. And he looks at his watch on his hand. He says, says, why am I wearing this? I could have saved one more. This could have bought me one more. And it's this shocking picture of, like, he had this luxury that he could have used to save one more. And he. And he kind of movie almost ends with this kind of breakdown. So as a Christian, I struggle now. This is not an indictment on any of us. Maybe it's on all of us. We're all wealthy people. We all have nice houses. I got the ocean view. I got the Teslas and the Raptor, and I got the whole thing. And then there are people in the world who have nothing. I mean, that they're. Right now. Someone just died of starvation right now. Somebody else died. How do we balance that as Christians, knowing that there are people struggling and then there are people like us that are just on top of the world socioeconomically? How do we balance that? We can't just give away everything Go live on the street ourselves. God doesn't want us to be broke and then die. That way, we can't help anybody. But how do you balance that, Pedro? And then I'd love to know. Cam, your thoughts, too.
- [71:51]
C
Well, I'm gonna nitpick a little bit, so you're not going to balance those things. So balance is not. Balance is not an option for that scenario. The better question is, how do I reconcile these two things? How do I reconcile this? How do I account reconciliations, accounting term. How do I account for. I have way more than I need, and there's a lot of people who don't have at all what they need. How do I account for this? How do I think about this? How. Why am I, okay, having more than enough while others have less than that? Okay, So I think that's really kind of coming into the heart of this. First of all, you should already kind of acknowledge the fact, Brandon, that you are having this wrestling. A lot of people don't. They have more than enough. And never occurred to them, like, so the fact that you already have this wrestling in your heart means you're already leaning the right way. Okay. Most people never occurred to them. Okay, let's be honest, now that you're like. So first of all, part of how this can be, how I think about this is twofold. One is, all of this belongs to God. One of the biggest things I teach in our programs and is that when. If you actually are a child of God, son and daughter of God, if you have said that, if you have confessed Jesus as your savior and your Lord, that means you're now part of the kingdom of God. And in the kingdom of God, Jesus is the king. And in a kingdom, a king owns everything. So if we say that he is Lord, the word Lord means owner. That means Jesus not only owns my life, he also owns all of my stuff, which is not actually my stuff. It's his stuff that I get to manage, use, and take care of until he decides someone else needs it more. And we have evidence of this in the Bible. When Jesus tells his disciples, hey, go into the town. You're going to see a cult tied to a post. Untie that colt and bring it to me. And if anybody stops you, tell them the master, the Lord has need of it. And they're like, what? They're like, you want us to go steal some other guy's horse and colt? And he's like, yeah, it's not stealing. Watch. So he. They go off and, like, sure as heck there's the colt on the pole and look around like, okay, no one's seeing this. Let's. Let's get. Let's untie this and run. They untie the cult. They're getting off. And sure enough, hey, where are you going? And they go, oh, can you imagine? Like, oh, my God, like, they're gonna kill us. And they turn back and they're like, the Lord has need of it. And they go, okay, yeah, okay, good enough. So this is. This is to understand that, like, at that time there was a revelation that this all belongs to the Lord. And if the Lord says, hey, this person, give that person that, let that person use that. So when you understand that this is actually not ours, and if you hold it lightly in your hand and you know that any second God could be like, hey, Brandon, you know this raptor that you love so much? See that guy right there? Just go, give him the keys. And you're like, lord, not this raptor. Like, you mean, like, you're not. Not this one. Because I. You must mean go buy one that's eight years old. That's got a hundred thousand. Like, I just got this one. Like, this is the one. I special ordered this one. Remember how, like, it can't be this one.
- [75:37]
A
Yeah, this is my rule. This was my reward because I did that. Cool deal.
- [75:41]
C
Yeah. He's like, well, no, actually it's this one. And now we have a choice to make. I'm sure we've seen that meme of that little girl where Jesus is kneeling down and he's asking her for the teddy bear. There's a meme. There's this little girl, she must be like 6, 5, and she has this teddy bear, which, of course, I don't have a teddy bear in my office, which is a good thing. That'd be kind of weird if I did. Okay. And Jesus is like, oh, give me your teddy bear. He's like, asking for it. She's like, no, but behind his back, he's holding a teddy bear 10 times bigger, 20 times bigger. Like them circus ones you win at the carnival if you win the impossible game. And you, like, put that softball in that milk carton that is in pot like, that we all know never fits. Anyhow, like, Jesus is holding, like this massive teddy bear behind his back. The girl can't see it, so she's like, why is Jesus taking away my teddy bear? And it's such a simple meme. It's a little girl, It's a teddy bear. This is our entire walk with golf God if you are going to be someone that God can trust with money and wealth, you have to pass that test. And it's not one time, bro. It's going to happen over and over and over. So if you ever feel like God's asking you to give away something, so something. And you're just like. And you really don't want to do it, you can be like, oh, this is the devil. The devil's trying to steal my reward. Probably not. There's a very good chance. This is like God saying, hey, do I still matter more to you than the raptor? Do I still matter more to you than this watch? Than this? And the fact is, this is like Abraham. He told Abraham to go kill his son. And so he's like, off we go. And what did God do? As the knife is coming down, it's like, we're cool. Like, I know you know? So I think part of it, too. Brennan's just like, you just live transparently before God. You're like, lord, you've blessed me so much. All I have is yours. I love my raptor. I love my house. And yet I love you more. If ever these things become an idol in my life, if ever this is a hindrance, please let me know. And I want to help the poor. I want to help the suffering. Guide me and lead me and tell me how I can be a blessing to people that are. How can I help the widows? How can I help the poor? Guide me, lead me, show me, teach me. And then, bro, like, that's it, dude. That's like, that's that. That. That's. That's how it starts to me. It can. Banjo. Can't be that simple. No, I think it is that simple. And then. Well, I didn't hear anything. Okay, well, then. All right, well, then, now you do some research. Get on the Google. Great. Look up some great charities, nonprofits. I have an amazing ministry I support. They support widows and orphans in Mozambique, Africa. It's called irisglobal.org they are literally in a. There's. Now we know that there's this massive murdering of Christians by Islamist extremists in Nigeria. That's been going on in Mozambique, bro, for like, the last six, seven years. They're in Mozambique. They've had pastors beheaded. They've had their churches burnt down. And they're still there. They don't leave. And they were here at my house. The founders hiding on the baker were here this past weekend. Like. Like, she's from Newport beach, man. Like, her parents left her an amazing house here in Laguna Beach. Like they could live here in Orange county in the most amazing place I think in the world to live one of them. But she spends nine months a year in Mozambique, Africa. They've been there almost 40 years, 30 years. When they went there, Mozambique was the worst, most poverty. It was the number one poorest country in the world. And literally like single handedly, by the grace of God, their willingness to be there and they've built their like the economic standard of the entire nation has gone up. She's been shot at, she's had people stone her, like throw rocks at her. And so I support them, right? So I think we should give to places where, you know, I've been to Mozambique, Africa. I saw firsthand. I think a lot of us give money to places and we just assume it's all good. No, I wouldn't assume it's all good. You should expect an ROI on your giving, on your ties, on your offerings, on your giving. Why would you invest in an apartment building for an roi but then just give money to whatever place and be like, well that's on them. No, dude, that's stupid. You are responsible to steward that capital well. And you should be doing as much due diligence on the charities you support, on the churches that you support as much as an apartment deal. And I just know that them I've been there, I've seen the work, I've seen the impact. I have not seen better soil to sow into than those guys. There's other great non profits. You can start one, you can create your own. That's a good way to make sure you know exactly what's going on. And most billionaires and wealthy families do not give to nonprofits anymore. They do their own stuff, which makes sense. Brandon, why would a billionaire give money to a 23 year old kid with skinny jeans who has never done anything in his life, can't manage money, has no clue. But like, oh, because they're just in ministry, that's the dumbest thing in the world. They're like, I'm gonna go build my own airport, I'm gonna go build my own hospitals. We're gonna go feed the poor ourselves. And it's. They're smart because they're like, we're gonna get, we're gonna actually have better ROI.
- [81:15]
A
Yeah, I 100 agree and I think a couple thoughts there. One, agreed wholeheartedly. It's obviously a heart issue. God's gonna ask people to give money. He's gonna ask you if you're a believer to give money. I believe if you are continually saying no to that request, God may not continue to bless you. So first of all, I think one of the reasons, and again, I wanna be careful to pat myself on the back because the Bible's pretty clear about not broadcasting how much you give. But one of the reasons God is continually seems to be blessing me financially every year is because I do give a good chunk of money. Now a lot of people look at, like, look at rich people and they say, wow, those people don't give anything. But again, in the Christian faith, we believe you're not supposed to talk about it. Like you're not supposed to talk about how much you're giving. So I can guarantee you, Pedro, Cam, myself and most of the rich Christians that I know are giving more money away every year than we ever earned before we were rich. Like in a whole year, like we're giving a tremendous amount away. We just don't talk about it. And this is probably all I'll ever say on that topic is that we are giving money away. And God will. If you're a believer, I believe God will, especially if you ask him what breaks your heart. Like God, what breaks your heart that also can break mine. And I remember asking that question and then he like served up Tim Tebow's like anti human trafficking thing on a platter in front of me and said that, that Brandon, I want you to focus on now. There's a lot of needs in the world. But he very clearly told me that. And then later on he introduced me to the charity water team and was like, you know, Scott Harrison, like leading charity water, that that's what I want you to care about this right now. So like, those are two things that to me they matter. And to you it might be something totally different. You know, Pedro, you got your own Cam, you got your own. And so I just, yeah, if you are somebody who is a person of faith or you just want to be able to give more money, ask God what breaks your heart, God and what can break mine. And I promise you, he will reveal that to you.
- [83:01]
C
What's crazy about this? So first of all, 100%, like give to causes that matter to you. Like, it should make you cry. Some people, the homeless breaks their heart. They walk by a homeless person, they just start to weep and they want to help that. Some people can walk right past a homeless person and not feel anything. It doesn't mean they're evil, but their heart breaks for maybe that single mom, right, who's so like your heart is your heart. You're going to care about what. Don't let someone gaslight you or convince you that you have to care about what matters to them. God put things in your heart that matter to you and break your heart. Follow those. That could be a business that you end up launching to solve that problem. That could be a place you're supposed to give. But pay attention to that. Great advice, Brandon. A couple of things I want to say about what you said. I would just want to add a couple things that like, God doesn't bless us because we give money to things. Okay. God blesses us because he loves us and because he built, he created this entire universe to work a certain way. There are spiritual laws and principles that God put in motion from creation. It's like God's automation system. So God always wants to bless his kids. However, there's also a mechanism by which this works and then there's. And so it's sowing and reaping. If you plant corn, you shouldn't go expect an apple, okay? So when you sow and you give, there are commanded principles and blessings that just like going to just kick in. So God's not up there like, oh, Brandon, like God doesn't even have to pay attention to this because he, he created a system where it just works. If you jump out of a 10 story building, God is not the one that sends you to the concrete. That's called gravity. So there are just principles. And as you know, Brandon, even secular gurus teach the tithe. They just teach, oh, just give 10, be generous because they know the principle works. Because there's something that happens when you actually are giving away money. First you're actually training your psychology. You're like, oh, I'm blessed. I have more than enough. Like, so it actually changes how you think, how you see the world. It's kind of hard to have a scarcity mindset when the first bit of money you give in is going out the door to bless somebody else. So like, it changes us how we think, how we see you Definitely kind of, you just unlock some spiritual and financial principles. You feel great because you're like, wow, like my life. I'm so grateful that like something I'm doing could help people less fortunate. I love that you said that like a lot of times Christians don't talk about this stuff because we're told not to. There's two places that the Bible says we can earn. We can store up treasure. You can have treasure on earth or treasure in Heaven. If Brandon comes on this podcast and tells you all the money he gives, the Bible says, great, awesome. You now got your treasure on earth. You feel cool, you're super spiritual. Everyone thinks, oh, wow, Brandon, you're such an amazing guy. And now that treasure in heaven gone because he cashed the check on earth. But when you give in secret, when you do things and don't advertise it, now you're storing up eternal treasure that does not decay. And so that's why as believers, we don't just brag about all the things that we do. Now, sometimes I tell people what I'm doing because sometimes I want to encourage others and hey, here's what I'm doing and here's why I'm doing it. And, but like, that's never the only thing that we're doing. And so you shared some really great things there. Awesome conversation. Cameron, do you want to jump in on this?
- [86:51]
B
Well, and speaking on just the dichotomy of being wealthy and also like what the Bible says about that is, is I guess where we were going from. And I think at the, at the beginning of the day, it's a heart posture. Obviously, if you look throughout the Bible, there is the, the people that God used the most typically were rich people. So like, you can look at that and know right away, like, hey, we're not called to be poor at all. But I do think it is a heart posture of are we going to be open handed with what God has given us? I also think that it false to believe, hey, if I give away X amount, God's going to return X amount. I think what you said is so good, which I haven't heard it put exactly the way that you put it, but like that we have these spiritual principles and laws of you do reap what you sow and planting the seed and working hard and gratitude. And if you do those things, you're going to be successful. One of those things is by giving. And most rich people, even if they don't know it, they're still incredibly generous. It just might not be to a ministry or a local church or tithing is what we would call it. It the end of the day, I think the most important thing is being open handed with everything that God has given you. And if you can do that, if you can say, hey, I'm really happy with where I am right now, but if God called me somewhere else or to do something else, I would do that in a heartbeat. There is no problem being wealthy whatsoever. You said this at the Beginning where you said, my mission is not somebody else's mission. I think a lot of times as Christians and as believers and just as people is we look at the, the mission, especially in like the Christian world. You look at the missionary that is living in poverty over in Africa and you're like, oh, that person's more holy than me. That person's, you know, has a better relationship with God than me. And that's not the case at all. It's just that they were called to a different mission than you were called to.
- [88:51]
C
Maybe.
- [88:52]
A
Maybe.
- [88:52]
C
Yeah, hopefully.
- [88:53]
B
Yeah, hopefully.
- [88:54]
C
Many times they're like, what am I doing here? Like, this is, I just, was following, I was just following my dad's footsteps. Or like, I mean, you were with fourth generation pastor, right? Or third or fourth?
- [89:03]
B
Fourth. Fourth generation pastor.
- [89:05]
A
Yeah.
- [89:05]
C
So, bro, you, you're, you're a cooked. From the very beginning, you didn't have a choice. I mean, they let you think you had a tree. You didn't have a choice, bro. So now, so you know, I'm saying, like, there's assumption, oh, this person's on the mission field because they're super spiritual, they're called or not, or they just didn't know what to do with their life or they couldn't get a job, or they just thought that, like, this is what they're supposed to do. Right. Like, there's so much evidence that like people end up doing things for all kinds of reasons. And a lot of times, like you said earlier before we were recording, a lot of times it's just we want to feel affirming, want to feel validated. One last thought about business and entrepreneurship. And then I know we want, I know we're kind of getting to the end of our time here, but I know we want to hit the wisdom challenge. But, but Jesus steps out of heaven, takes on flesh for a very important reason and a very important time, has a very important mission. The biggest mission of all missions. And now he goes up on a mountain, prays all night because he knows he's going to need some help. He needs a team, he needs a help, goes up, prays all night. Which Bible says it, I believe it, it. And maybe when I was 30, I could stay up all night too. At 51, there's nothing that's happening. I'm going to be able to be up at night. But he says he prays all night, comes down off this mountain, and now he goes and picks his team. 12 people. How many of those 12 people were preachers, pastors, ministers, Scholars, Pharisees, Sadducees. How many of them came from religious trained backgrounds? Zero. Not one. He picked 12 men from the marketplace. Entrepreneurs, business owners, government officials, people who live in the real world who know how to make money and deal with people, proven successful business people who left their business, walked away from money. You think Matthew was poor? He's not. He's a tax collector. He was rich. You think these guys were poor? They were. They owned a boat. They were fishermen. People ate fish all day. You're not poor if you self. If you sell the number one staple of food, you ain't poor. And these people. He went and picked 12 successful people from the business world to bank his entire plan to rescue humanity. But we send our. We send young kids off to Bible college, put them through seminary, memorize verses, exegesis, poke Jesus how to do sermons. Then they come out and we're supposed to just trust them, respect them. These are spiritual mentors, and they've done nothing to prove that they can actually be trusted with true riches because they have not had to prove themselves faithful with money. Can you make money? Can you multiply money? Because that's what God is looking. God wants to test people with money before he'll trust us with his people. God's discipleship program is found in Luke 19, the Minas. He gives all these servants money. He says, go trade it. Go do business. And then the ones that came back and took one and made it 10, one and made it five. He said, well done. Now I'm going to put you in charge of five cities. Like what? Because I was good at flipping houses, God thinks I'm qualified to go lead a city. Yeah, because you understand how to buy, sell, fix, flip how, who to hire, who to fire. You know, you've learned more than you realize. And that's what it takes to, to actually succeed in the real world. So to me, if I had my way, you couldn't be a pastor or a preacher or run a church unless you can prove to me that you know how to make money and multiply money. And you've been faithful with money. Now maybe you can be put in charge of true riches, God's people.
- [93:07]
B
Yeah, I love that. But, but I would also say just to, to press back on that a little bit, like God used the least of these a lot as well. And so for anybody that's listening to this, that's not in a position where they've made a ton of money or like God can still use you. I mean, the very first, the very first person that saw God out of the tomb was Mary Magdalene. A lot of people would say that she was a prostitute. Correct.
- [93:33]
A
I think it's the Catholic Church called her prostitute. But the Bible doesn't actually call it.
- [93:36]
B
The Bible doesn't say tradition verses.
- [93:38]
C
Well, okay, but also, but hold on. But the, but the Bible does say that Jesus was, he was funded by women.
- [93:45]
B
Yeah, I mean that's.
- [93:48]
C
Mary Magdalene was one of those women. Didn't Mary Magdalene break a year's worth of wages in a perfume on Jesus?
- [93:56]
B
That was Mary Martha's sister. Nothing different.
- [94:00]
A
The same one.
- [94:01]
C
Are you sure? I don't think so.
- [94:03]
B
St. Mary?
- [94:04]
A
I don't know. I thought I was St. Mary, but.
- [94:06]
C
Now I think it's the same Mary.
- [94:10]
A
Was it Mary Magdalene?
- [94:12]
C
Who's the lady? Yeah, this is, this is what happens when three.
- [94:18]
B
I'm gonna pass it for a while.
- [94:21]
C
I think I'm right. But who is it? Ding, ding.
- [94:23]
A
It does say the biblical accounts of John 12:3 and Luke 7:38 to cover a woman anointing Jesus, which is often identified as Mary of Bethany, the sister of Lazarus. Though some traditions do link the act to Mary Magdalene. Those are different according to this.
- [94:38]
B
Because I'm a pal. I was a pastor either way, back in the day.
- [94:41]
C
Either way. The point you're making is a good one. You don't need to be rich to be used by God. Amen. Yes, true. You don't need to be rich to be used by God. 100 because you God can meet you anywhere. And that's a fact. So I want to affirm what you're saying. 100 is true.
- [94:57]
B
Yeah. And with that being said, like, I think God will elevate people because of their heart posture, not necessarily because of their business acumen into positions that they ne. Not necessarily should be. I mean, even looking at the, look at David, David was a shepherd out in, in the country and he elevated him to being the ruler of Israel over time. And yes, David had a lot of crap going on in his life and committed a ton of sins. And he still said David was a man after my own heart. But it is a heart posture at the end of the day is what, what I believe. And I guess I'm just saying, like, I, I, I feel like sometimes there's both sides of the coin where it's.
- [95:38]
C
Like, hey, it's heart plus maturity, Cameron. You got it. Maturity. God, God is going to test. God's going to test your heart. And there's also like David, David was a shepherd, was a career yeah, David was trusted with sheep. He never lost one. Dude. He killed a bear and a lion with his bare hands to save a sheep. Like so to say. Like he just, like, that's a career. Like David proved himself in a career of being a shepherd. That was a career, right? David proved himself as a warrior. So like I get, you know, I hear what you're saying, like the people should not hear this and be like, well, I guess I can't be used by God. I'm not a multi millionaire. That is not what anyone is saying here. Right? You can be used by God wherever you are. What I'm saying is God can use us more as we become more trusted by him and more mature in him. And one of the ways God's matures us is through the realm of business, making money, trading. Because when we do a bad deal, when we make a mistake, these things happen and we're like, oh man, I made that mistake. Why did I listen to that guy? Or sometimes we do something wrong. Like, I know no one watching this podcast ever lies or cheats or steals, but you know, like, wow, why did I say that on the. Oh, why did I not mention that there was this leak over there? Oh, you know, come on, guys. I flipped houses too. Sometimes you're like, oh, that's not mold, that's just a crayon. And you're like, here's some bleach. And you know, it's like, okay, right, no harm, no foul. I'm just saying, like all of this, God wants to use the realm of business to put me a mirror for us to see ourselves is all I'm saying.
- [97:16]
B
The best pastors I know for the most part were businessmen before they entered into ministry. There, there's so much to that. And so I'm wholeheartedly agree with that. Wholeheartedly. Um, hey, real quick, I know we're wrapping up, but you've said so much like incredible stuff today. I want to know more about your 31 day wisdom challenge that you have.
- [97:38]
C
31 day wisdom challenge.com is where you go to register. It's a free 31 day experience online virtual where we're going to kick off 2026 the best way possible, prioritizing and pursuing the wisdom of God. I've done this for seven years in a row. Last year we had 92,000 people sign up. This year we'll have, I think over a quarter million people opt in. And there's this big AI craze right now. And here's my thesis WG is Greater than AI. What's wg? The wisdom of God is more important to your life than AI. AI could be a powerful, helpful tool tool. But if you don't know how to use that tool. Some people are using AI to cheat on their homework. Others are creating 100 million dollar companies. What's the difference? Wisdom. Get wisdom. Get wisdom from Proverbs. Proverbs was written by a guy named Solomon. He was a king. He was David's son. Irony. He was David's, you know, he was David's son of the wife of his best friend that he killed. Not the first baby. That baby had to die because that baby was born in sin. Okay, but Solomon was the second baby from that adulterous affair that ended in a murder. And this is proof that God can take anything and use it for good. Solomon, the richest, wisest king ever to have lived, wrote Proverbs. He would have been a multi trillionaire in today's standards. So we're going to start on January 1st. We're going to read a chapter a day, and then I have 31 incredible people that I'm going to interview. They're going to share their testimony of how they came to faith and how they have applied biblical principles and wisdom to succeed and prosper. And this handsome bearded fellow right here is one of my guests. Brandon's going to be sharing about how he's applied the wisdom of God to create the world he's created. And I've got incredible people. We've got John Maxwell's been on this, Joel Osteen, Lisa Nichols, et the Hip Hop Preacher. I've got politicians, government leaders. I've got multi, multi millionaires. I've got Hollywood people. Why I want you to see from both men, women, white, black, Asian, business, government, ministry, the wisdom of God. These principles can work everywhere no matter what industry you're in, no matter what country. Over 100 nations are in this thing last year. This will make the difference in 2026. I don't make predictions, but my sense for next year, it's going to be crazy. I think we're going to have some curveballs. I think we're going to possibly see some economic uncertainty, some, possibly some major economic shifts. Maybe housing gets affected. There's a possibility that the dollar gets impacted. The world is being reset. The rules are changing, they're changing quickly. And if you don't have tapped into wisdom from above, this could not go well. And so my heart is to see people tap into God, get the wisdom of God so you can make sense of what's happening and not be under this but come above it. Wisdom was given to equip us to rule and to reign in life. Where we dictate to life, life does not dictate to us. It's absolutely free. 31day wisdomchallenge.com or use the link, actually grab the link that's in the show notes here. Lastly, it's a free experience, but you're going to be offered a chance to grab this journal, this beautiful journal. It's our 31 day wisdom challenge journal. You're going to the amount of gold that gets dropped, Brandon and guys on this is insane. Like, you're going to fill up at least one notebook of notes. People were like having notes all over the place and then they couldn't find when they wrote that thing down. So we made a journal. It's got all the chapters in here. All the speakers are in here. Make all your notes in here. You might want to get an extra one because you're going to fill up one notebook or give it to a friend. You can upgrade to this called the Wisdom Plus. 31 bucks a dollar a day and you're going to get to go backstage with me and my speech and the speakers every day. You're going to get access to a dreaming and goal setting workshop. And I'm doing a three day kingdom wealth masterclass. If you're like, hey man, this guy's talking about God and money like I've never seen before. I got three, like three days of 90 minutes where I'm going to blow your mind. When you find out what God in the Bible actually say about money. It will completely rewire and change how you think about your life, money, your career. That's all part of this Wisdom plus upgrade. So come for free upgrade if you want to make the most of it. Brandon, thanks for coming on as a guest. Thanks for having me as a guest on your show. I'm happy to come back if you'll ever have me back. I love what you do, bro. You have incredible results. Every. We have so many mutual friends and they all were like, Brandon is an amazing guy, a nicest guy, kind man, like good solid dude. And so I can't wait to kind of just hear your wisdom, bro. I've been doing. I, I talked too much on this one. So I'm gonna get to interview you on the wisdom challenge and I'll get to glean.
- [102:38]
A
I'm excited, man. I'm excited. Yeah, I love that you do that.
- [102:41]
B
I just signed up. You're stacked. You've got Bill Johnson, John Maxwell, Brandon Irwin's amazing.
- [102:49]
A
Irwin Hardy.
- [102:50]
B
Yeah, that's him.
- [102:51]
C
Yeah.
- [102:52]
B
Pace, it's amazing. Cool, man.
- [102:55]
A
I'm excited for it. Well, thank you, Pedro. This has been amazing. I. I've been wanting to have this conversation for a long time on the podcast about wealth, money, all that. So, man, I really appreciate being on here to have it with us, and can't wait for the 31 day wisdom challenge.
- [103:06]
C
Thanks, man. Thank you.