Podcast Summary: The Big Picture

Episode: Best Picture Power Rankings and The Rock’s Oscar Bid in ‘The Smashing Machine,’ with Benny Safdie!

Date: October 3, 2025
Host(s): Sean Fennessey, Amanda Dobbins
Guests: Van Lathan, Benny Safdie

Overview

This episode of The Big Picture dives deep into two main subjects:

1. A review and discussion of Benny Safdie's new film The Smashing Machine, starring Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson, and
2. An updated power ranking of likely Oscar Best Picture contenders for the upcoming season.

The show features a lively roundtable with Van Lathan on the film, followed by an interview with filmmaker Benny Safdie, exploring the creative process and ambitions behind The Smashing Machine.

Key Discussion Points

1. The Smashing Machine: Review & Analysis

Premise and Approach

• Written and directed by Benny Safdie, inspired by a documentary about MMA legend Mark Kerr.
• Stars Dwayne Johnson, Emily Blunt, and several real-life fighters.
• Subverts expectations of a typical sports biopic by focusing on vulnerability and slice-of-life drama over triumphant arcs.

“On the surface... it looks like a standard athlete biopic... And that is not what the movie is ultimately, in my opinion.”
— Sean Fennessey (02:29)

• The film closely recreates the documentary but isn’t just a shot-for-shot remake—it's seen as a “spiritual sequel” to Safdie's TV show The Curse.
• The fighting scenes are intentionally shot from outside the ring, emphasizing alienation and observation.

Highlights & Memorable Scenes

• The “gun moment” and “cactus scene” are cited as standout dramatic moments.

• The amusement park (Gravitron) scene is discussed at length as metaphorical for the main characters' internal worlds, contrasting their responses to risk and safety.

  “He is a walking, vulnerable, open wound. Everything affects him. He seems to be trying his best to be decent.”
  — Van Lathan (05:52)

• Subtle, observational filmmaking and use of pacing take cues from The Curse.

Performances

• Dwayne Johnson’s Transformation

  • Universally praised for his vulnerability and for “melting the Rock” persona.

    “He melts the rock and becomes Mark Kerr. And I did not know if that was possible for him at this time in his career.”
    — Van Lathan (17:48)

  • Praised for dropping his larger-than-life image, playing an emotionally complex, broken character.

• Emily Blunt

  • Her presence both helps get the film made and, for Amanda and Sean, slightly undermines the intended verité aesthetic because she does not fully disappear into her character.

    “She looks like herself... she is playing against her type, styled and cast ... as the shrewish wife. And that is fucking depressing for someone who is so talented.”
    — Amanda Dobbins (30:18)

Critiques and Takeaways

• The film's lack of conventional structure and resolution may alienate viewers expecting a traditional sports movie.
• Emotional realism and vulnerability are the core; “feelings can be plot too.”
• The main reason to see the film is Johnson's performance, with effective supporting turns from real fighters.

Notable Quotes

• On The Rock:
  “He doesn't smile his way through it. He doesn't quip his way through it. He doesn't flex his way through it. He melts the rock and becomes Mark Kerr.”
  — Van Lathan (18:16)
• On the film’s style:
  “The whole movie is about alienation... Mark Kerr trying to be like other people, but is kind of incapable of being like other people.”
  — Sean Fennessey (13:08)

2. Best Picture Power Rankings

Context

• Sean and Amanda update their predictions based on recent festival screenings (Venice, Telluride, Toronto, New York).
• The power ranking is a snapshot, not final Oscar picks.

Current Rankings (as of episode):

1. One Battle After Another
2. Hamnet
3. Sinners
4. Sentimental Value
5. J. Kelly
6. It Was Just An Accident
7. Begonia
8. House of Dynamite
9. Frankenstein
10. Wicked for Good

Discussion Points

• One Battle After Another solidifies as the frontrunner.

  “I do think we can kind of pretty comfortably start with One Battle After Another at number one... Whether we're taking the Oppenheimer path rewards season or the Saving Private Ryan/Shakespeare in Love path, it would be at 1 or 2.”
  — Sean Fennessey (39:25)

• Amanda points out the resistance older Academy voters may have to genre pictures like Sinners, despite its critical and commercial success.
• Frankenstein's standing boosted by festival acclaim and Netflix campaign support.
• Wicked for Good and Marty Supreme are wildcards—yet unseen but expected to have a big awards presence.

Meta-Industry Talk

• Discussion of who can “open” a movie: Leo vs. Chalamet as the biggest current stars (47:03-49:50).
• Netflix’s unique position with multiple major contenders.

3. Interview with Benny Safdie

Early Inspiration & Process

• Benny’s fascination with boxing and combat sports movies; Dwayne Johnson approached him after seeing the original documentary.
• Safdie was drawn to Mark Kerr’s duality: monstrous physicality and deep vulnerability.

  “Here you have this guy who is so big and so strong and yet so vulnerable and so willing to talk about his feelings and his emotions...”
  — Benny Safdie (56:37)

• Safdie wrote Johnson a heartfelt letter and even sent a prop sweater to help him get into character.

Directorial Choices

• Fights shot almost always from outside the ring to preserve realism and distance (63:00-66:00).
• Emotional authenticity prioritized over strict historical fact (documentary comparison).
• Emphasis on “ecstatic truth” (Herzog): scenes may invent details to capture emotional reality.

On Working with Dwayne Johnson

• Safdie praises Johnson’s willingness to go emotionally deep and drop the persona.
• Notes Johnson was “ready to burst”; the film became an emotional valve.

  “He would say to me, like, what am I looking at when I cut the cactus? Why am I stepping back and looking at it? And I said to him, you're looking to see if you can live with the scar that now exists on the bottom of this... And instantly, he got it.”
  — Benny Safdie (85:08)

On Scale, Pressure, and Creative Freedom

• Despite the film’s scale, Safdie felt he had intimate creative control — “just us in a room figuring it out.” (75:21-76:00)
• Created a pressure-free environment for actors to explore.

Music & The Curse Connection

• Describes the jazz-influenced, collaborative approach to scoring, influenced by his work on The Curse.
• Sees The Smashing Machine and The Curse as spiritual siblings in style and tone (70:10).

Other Topics

• Safdie’s ongoing acting work, and the interplay between acting and directing for his creative development.
• Plans for his next directorial project (“Lizard Music”).

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• On Johnson's performance:
  “He melts the rock and becomes Mark Kerr. And I did not know if that was possible for him at this time in his career...”
  — Van Lathan (17:48)

• On the film’s subversion:
  “The whole movie is about alienation... Mark Kerr trying to be like other people, but is kind of incapable of being like other people.”
  — Sean Fennessey (13:08)

• On emotional realism as plot:
  “Maybe feelings can be plot too, you know, like, that can kind of push you through...”
  — Benny Safdie (84:18)

• On the Oscar race:
  “I do think we can pretty comfortably start with One Battle After Another at number one...”
  — Sean Fennessey (39:25)

• On crafting realism:
  “Everything has to feel that way. And so for the fights, we were religiously accurate to how they played out. And I wanted to show them in a way that felt like if a fighter watched that, they would go, that's it. And it fucking hurts. Like, that's exactly what it's like.”
  — Benny Safdie (78:10)

• Amanda on Emily Blunt's role:
  “She looks like herself, but she is playing against her type, you know... and she's also just cast again as, like, the shrewish wife, the nagging wife. And I just... that is fucking depressing for someone who is so talented...”
  — Amanda Dobbins (30:18)

Important Timestamps

| Segment/Event | Timestamp | |----------------------------------------------------------|---------------| | The Smashing Machine - initial impressions | 01:49–14:27 | | Dwayne Johnson’s performance and discussion | 14:42–29:16 | | Emily Blunt’s role and casting commentary | 29:16–33:27 | | Specific scenes (Gravitron, Cactus, Gun) discussion | 06:11–10:56 | | Relationship to The Curse | 12:11–13:35; 69:05–74:28 | | Interview with Benny Safdie begins | 53:47 | | Safdie on realistically depicting fights | 62:55–68:35 | | Discussion of fact vs. emotional truth | 77:42–84:18 | | Safdie on Dwayne Johnson’s vulnerability | 84:18–90:41 | | Oscar Power Rankings breakdown | 36:18–53:32 | | Final section – Safdie on Next Steps, Recommendations | 90:41–98:26 |

Conclusion

This episode offers a rich, layered review of The Smashing Machine, delving into its artful subversion of the sports biopic genre and highlighting Dwayne Johnson’s transformative performance. The hosts provide a detailed yet fun snapshot of the current Oscar race, and Safdie’s interview sheds light on the personal, creative, and directorial choices behind the film. The tone alternates between reverent cinephilia and playful industry banter, capturing the distinctive voice of The Big Picture.