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- [00:00]
Sean Fennessy
This episode is presented by State Farm. Life's full of decisions, big and small, and sometimes you make movie ones you can really stand behind. For example, I was wise enough to stick around through the mid credits during Ryan Coogler's Sinners. And unlike my co host Amanda, I got to see a very special sequence with a great buddy guy. Among other things. State Farm gets it. Making confident choices can make all the difference. That's why with the State Farm personal price plan, you can choose the right amount of coverage to help create an affordable price for you. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state.
- [00:46]
Sponsor/Ad Voice
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- [02:07]
Sean Fennessy
I'm Sean Fennessy.
- [02:08]
Amanda Davis
I'm Amanda Davis.
- [02:08]
Sean Fennessy
This is 25 for 25, a big picture special conversation show about. Get out. Now sink into the floor. Number 13. Lucky number 13 is Jordan Peele's Get Out. This movie was released on February 24, 2017. It's Peele's directorial debut. It stars Daniel Kaluuya, Allison Williams, Bradley Whitford, Caleb Landry Jones, Steven Rood, Catherine Keener, Lakeith Stanfield, Lil Rel. How Rhee, this movie is our horror pick.
- [02:40]
Amanda Davis
Yes.
- [02:41]
Sean Fennessy
So let's talk about Get Out. Get out is tremendously important movie to this show. This is one of the signature movies that was here at the launch of this show. One of the very first guests on this show was Jordan Peele. And I don't think I quite knew at the time what a culture changing event the movie was.
- [03:02]
Amanda Davis
And you did a little bit because you changed your Oscar pick last minute to get out over the shape of Water.
- [03:10]
Sean Fennessy
Well, that was a whole year after the movie came out.
- [03:12]
Amanda Davis
Sure. But like wishcasting wise, you know, you understood that there was something in the air.
- [03:17]
Sean Fennessy
Yes. I have kind of set the. I've set the course straight on my best picture predictions since then. I've gotten a little bit better at doing this professionally. But back then I was really following my heart. And what Peele did with this movie I found to be frankly stunning. And it's one of the reasons why it's here. But it's not the only reason why it's here. So let's talk about it. Um, this being Peele's first movie, you might think if you had followed his career prior to this, that he would have made something slightly different. He was one half of Key and Peele, which was a sketch comedy duo, they had a series on Comedy Central for some years that was well liked and pretty popular. And turns out he's an insane horror head. And his biggest inspirations are Wes Craven and John Carpenter. And he wanted to make a movie that reflected his experience in the world using the tropes and tools of horror. And he did so with this fascinating, fairly modestly sized. I think the budget of this movie was $4 million, more or less. An independent production that Blumhouse helped to distribute and kind of changed the face of horror. Honestly, the last eight or nine years is very much living in the shadow of what get out accomplished. And it elevated Peel to extraordinary circumstances. So for you, why is this movie on this list?
- [04:34]
Amanda Davis
Because we did need a horror pick, but it is not limited to a horror pick. The influence has gone beyond horror both in the movie world and just pop culturally. This was an absolute phenomenon, certainly in the movies, but also sociologically pop culturally and phenomenon for Jordan Peeler in the sense that this is his first movie and now he's like one of our generation's auteurs, you know, and it really did happen like that. This was less than 10 years ago. And this gives us Daniel Kaluuya. This gives us a better understanding of Alison Williams. That's not fair.
- [05:15]
Sean Fennessy
But it's a great utilization of Alison Williams.
- [05:19]
Amanda Davis
But it's really, really hard to overstate how big a deal this was and how it did come out of not quite nowhere, but pretty much. As you said, Jordan Peele was part of a comedy duo. This was a Sundance premiere that suddenly is making over $200 million worldwide and is being nominated. And Jordan Peele wins the Oscar for screenplay within a year. So the size of it, we don't have movies with this kind of giant impact anymore, give or take your Barbenheimers. But it was, if not box office wise, it was kind of on that level as a sensation.
- [06:02]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, there's a variety of reasons for that. I believe that this is the highest grossing original debut for a filmmaker in movie history, which is just a staggering statistic when you think about it. And the fact that it happened in horror at a time when horror was finding its way as one of the only reliable, non franchise driven ability to powers to get people into movie theaters. And I think this movie kind of set the course for a generation of people who got really excited about a number of filmmakers that were kind of working around the same time or followed in their wake. Some who were associated more with like your A24 brand, some who are more classically kind of Blumhouse studio oriented. But you know, your Robert Eggers is in your Ari Asters and a whole host of other people who are all roughly around the same time. They feel like a class and they live alongside some other filmmakers who aren't working in horror, like Coogler, like Greta Gerwig, like Damien Chazelle, like Barry Jenkins, who are kind of like the people that we are depending upon most to make movies special these days and people who've really come into their own in the last decade. This movie in particular is so great because one, it's just a fun, funny horror movie. If you go in with an inability to process any of the real world stakes and consequences and satire of the film, you probably could still have fun. Yes, if you were a complete dunderhead or you've had one side of your brain dulled, you could still enjoy the thriller aspects of the movie. That's obviously not what makes it special. The mechanics are good, but what makes it special is this is really the sharpest critique of a post racial America that sure, we've had at the movies and, and the reason that I think it has that imprint that you're talking about sociologically is because there's so many ideas and phrases in this movie that have stuck to the ribs of our.
- [07:48]
Amanda Davis
Diet and, and, and did pre instantly. It is the post Obama era movie and I was chagrined and amazed to learn last night that it debuted at Sundance quite literally three days after Trump's first inauguration. So like this stuff was happening all at the same time. And we like, we kind of knew, but we didn't really know. But the idea of the Sunken Place, I would have voted for Obama third times if I could. All of that stuff really did instantly become kind of Rosetta Stones, for lack of a better word, shorthand for us trying to make sense of a world that we had been living in for a long time. But with the election of Trump, the first time kind of was revealed, or not revealed, but put back on center stage and then we had to look at the last eight years and this movie really became central to that. In addition to being just like a dynamite horror movie.
- [08:49]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, I think the satire really moves in two directions in that way too. And I really felt this, watching this this time because we have some distance from the Obama administration. The one way it works is very obvious, which is that, you know, the villains of this movie being upper middle class liberals and not your redneck, you know, your typical like Texas Chainsaw Massacre, living in the outlands kind of crazy person who doesn't understand anybody that doesn't look like them, was very cutting at the time and very clever and one of the funniest and best parts of the movie. And that is a condemnation of what white America thought it had accomplished in electing Barack Obama and then re electing him. And this idea that we had kind of like moved past a very ugly history in America. The movie also operates as this really interesting critique of Obama and the era of Obama politics, which I find kind of fascinating. And I think that, I mean, I wouldn't have got. You wouldn't have gotten that if you hadn't seen the consequences of what the Obama administration wrought where there was this attempt to communicate a kind of unity amongst the world and that the right exploited those pursuits of unity by doubling down on division and making that the primary characteristic of American politics that we are different and our differences are the friction that makes us exciting and real and gets us going every day by looking at social media and what have you. And that's an unintended consequence. But this movie also has like, it has a role in that. It has a part in that that's sort of like we kind of mishandled or we miscommunicated about what it meant not just to have a black president, but to pretend as though we'd gotten past something that we are not getting past anytime soon.
- [10:34]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. I mean, it's not a coincidence that Key and Peele's most famous, at least to me, speech was like the Obama anger translator. Yes, Right. Which was contemporaneous with his presidency. But it's like, this is what he's probably actually thinking and imagining.
- [10:49]
Sean Fennessy
Likewise for the handshake line for Barack Obama as well, where, like, you know, any black member of his cabinet or the press, he breathes, like, super warmly and gives him a pound. And any, like, older white woman, he's like, oh, hello, madam. And the code switching that was evident in the Obama presidency. And, you know, I think you can really, like, overreach on a movie by looking at the political status of the country at that time. But in this movie, it's so obvious.
- [11:12]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. I mean, it's literally in the text. Like, that Bradley Whitford line has become iconic in a bad way, but an effective way. But it is written there. He is taking these things head on and with proper nouns.
- [11:27]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. It's unusual to be able to literalize an idea like this and have it not feel ham fisted. And in this case, it doesn't feel ham fisted. I think it's because he has this really acute understanding of horror genre tropes and that stuff works really well. The movie is not gross. It's not.
- [11:44]
Amanda Davis
No.
- [11:44]
Sean Fennessy
Doesn't feature monsters, which you're not a huge fan of. Obviously the monsters are among us.
- [11:49]
Amanda Davis
I was also. I was thinking about our recent. Though I don't know. Yeah, our recent conversation about the horror canon and, like, whether something like Silence of the Lambs is horror. And we decided on violence as. And like violent scream time as the definition. And this doesn't have that much violence. I mean, once it does, there are some kills, but it's not even really a movie about kills.
- [12:18]
Sean Fennessy
The thing that makes it pure horror to me is that there is a kind of mad scientist fantastical trope that you would find in a Vincent Price movie in the 1950s. The idea of this body swapping that is transpiring, this idea of having a host body, it's almost Cronenbergian in a way. It's not as fully realized in terms of makeup effects and things like that. But there's stuff that is ripped right out of classical horror that is placed in here, but it's not. It doesn't define the movie. And it's probably not even the first or third thing you think of when you think of the movie, which is one of the reasons why I think it crossed over so hard.
- [12:55]
Amanda Davis
Right. I do think there is also an essential horror aspect of it, which is this structure and the way it involves the audience. And also quite literally the title, which is just like you just, you need the character to leave from the minute don't get in the car. And even the little Rel character says like, do not get in the, you know, do not go, don't go in the house. And the whole thing is just like, no, no, no, why aren't you leaving? Why, why, why aren't you leaving? But what's amazing about the movie is that that is a very classical horror structure, but the way that it brings the audience and in the signals that it gives to the audience of like, no, no, you, like, you need to leave. Everything is, is messed up. Here is like an amazing sociological text about the liberal class and racism in America and also about how we watch these movies, you know, and that is like indicting the audience at the same time that you're watching it. It's both very simple and very, very complex and effective.
- [14:02]
Sean Fennessy
There's also something really fascinating about the way that the text speaks to the moviegoing culture around the movie. Like obviously the idea here suggests that deep down these upper middle class liberals, and for the record, I am an upper middle class liberal, same are predatory figures and that they are looking to consume and adopt and co opt black culture, black life, black identity, black bodies. That is the idea that is central to the movie. And then of course this movie becoming a phenomenon powered in part by black audiences loving the movie and talking about the movie and then white audiences, some of whom needed to catch up to the movie and then start referencing things like the Sunken Place on podcasts, for example. I don't mean to be too self indicting, but there is something really interesting about the way that the movie's ideas can become realized in the real world. And I don't think that this ever creeped into any kind of weird, you know, mid-90s rap territory where like the next generation of artists are ripping off the ideas and co opting them and stealing them. But it was a kind of fascinating little reflection in the pool that he filled with this film. So I love that aspect of looking at it and especially when you think about the idea of the Steven Root character who's a blind art dealer, you.
- [15:19]
Amanda Davis
Know, I had forgotten that until my rewatch and I was like, oh, this is quite literal. He Just he wants to be able to have your talent and literally your eyes and see the world and then be his own person. You know, I thought of Sinners for a lot of reasons, obviously, but in terms of black art, black, black ownership, black cultural influence, and how the creative industry and or the world at large metabolizes that, if you will, they're definitely in conversation for sure.
- [15:52]
Sean Fennessy
And I think Coogler is clearly climbing the steps that Peel helped to build here. There's some history of black horror, for sure. There's a really good series on shudder called Horror Noir, which is about the history of black performers and black writers and directors, but it's not a very deep history. And so him emerging in this way as this, like, central figure in Hollywood, while more or less sticking to the horror genre, has been interesting too, and for me has been really exciting. The fact that he followed this movie up with us and then he made Nope, which I just mentioned, I recently saw again and was my favorite movie of 2022. And I'm so curious to see what he does in the future and if he is sticking to this because Nope. Was the sign of somebody who is reaching towards Steven Spielberg for the first time. You know, somebody who really had a bigger vision in mind just in terms of the canvas that he wanted to draw on. This is a really small film. This is a very modest movie that basically takes place in one apartment and one house. And it just goes to show how far you can get even in modest circumstances and modest settings. And a lot of that comes down to a couple of key things. One is he's got an incredible sense of craft and pacing in this movie. The music is wonderful. Michael Abel's score.
- [17:13]
Amanda Davis
Score really underrated. Another thing that jumped out to me on Rewatch.
- [17:16]
Sean Fennessy
Excellent score. The sound design is really strong in this movie. The costuming is modest, but really sharp. The way that Bradley Whitford is styled. The way that Kathryn Keener is styled.
- [17:28]
Amanda Davis
The turtleneck for the auction.
- [17:30]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, the turtleneck. Allison Williams, all white get up in the moment when she's shipping milk. There are some really good choices there. And then the production design, where the Sunken place sequence in the movie where Chris sits in a chair and is effectively hypnotized by Kathryn Keener's character is a pretty big visual achievement for a $4 million movie. I mean, it looks phenomenal and it completely sells you on the idea, which is this really blow bearing metaphor about basically what happens to black identity when it is like, subsumed by white power. And he makes it Feel like a slick sci fi psychological experience.
- [18:11]
Amanda Davis
Right. And, and it, and it builds visually like the template for the rest of the movie and the re and the reveal plot wise in a, like, in a very smart way. It just doesn't, it doesn't look cheap, which is just essential, especially when it's only $4 billion. And I had forgotten how early in the movie. Yeah, it, it comes like when I said when they sat down in the chairs, I was like, no, really like sunk in place already. But that's kind of a risk to ask people to go into this, you know, this high concept other place so early and trust that they'll buy in and stay for the, for the rest of what's to come.
- [18:49]
Sean Fennessy
The other thing too, and I thought of our conversation about, I know what you did last summer is, you know, this is a movie that features a character who's coping with a trauma that he hasn't really reckoned with. The death of his mother is this signature event in his life and he's not at peace with it. And he gets stuck in that chair because Keener's character has located the fact that he has this vulnerability and she's gonna attack it so that she can control him eventually. And it exists. It's a part of Kris character. It's not the primary focus of the character. It's not the thing that we go back to over and over again that they keep circling in red in the movie. It's just something that happened to him. Like all people have had terrible things happen to them and, and it's exploited, but it isn't the motivation.
- [19:29]
Amanda Davis
It does even at one point, he and Allison Williams are like by a lake and it's cutting between the auction itself and an emotional moment between them. And it is used to explain his character's motivation as why he doesn't leave at that exact moment. So it, you know, it like is still character development, but he doesn't give a speech where he's just like, I had a trauma. And so that is why I take photographs. And you know why? Like, like every single laundry list of a thing he, it's as you said, it's just part of who he is rather than the, the defining plot thing of the movie.
- [20:15]
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- [21:30]
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- [21:51]
Sean Fennessy
Peele during interviews and I think during our interview used the phrase social thriller to describe the movie. And he wasn't rejecting horror by doing that, but I think he was and he was citing the Stepford Wives a lot as a big influence, this 1975 version, because that's a movie about a person who enters a world where everything seems a little bit off.
- [22:15]
Amanda Davis
Right.
- [22:15]
Sean Fennessy
And that they're disoriented by that and they feel like they're potentially going to be sure.
- [22:19]
Amanda Davis
And it's also exploring social structures through, you know, scientific metaphor and the politests.
- [22:27]
Sean Fennessy
Of American culture and what we feel but don't say and all these other ideas. So it's clearly a cool influence. And you could say Stepford Wives is kind of a social thriller. It's not really a horror movie. But there's also plenty of horror stuff in here, too, you know, like, it doesn't shy away from that. And so I always found that fascinating. And then the other thing too is I feel like a lot of Hitchcock and M. Night Shyamalan in this movie, too, which is that's where some of the thriller part comes in. I can feel a lot of Psycho with the sort of like, the movie is constantly making you feel unnerved. And though something is clearly very wrong here and Chris is in trouble.
- [23:00]
Amanda Davis
Yeah.
- [23:00]
Sean Fennessy
But it never, it takes a long time to be like, this is what you think it Is this is in fact exactly what you think it is. There's a moment during the party which is one of the best sequences in the movie, where Kris runs upstairs. And when he runs upstairs, all of the white patrons at the auction just stop talking. Stop talking. And they all look up at the same time. And that, to me, is the moment really beyond some of the awkward conversations or some of the things that we see Bradley Whitford doing or the oddity of Caleb Landry Jones hyper aggressive older brother. But that's the moment where you're like, they're all watching him. There is something. He is prey in this deadly game. And all that stuff's just really well handled and I think it's amazingly well told. And it could have gone off the rails at any time.
- [23:47]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, I mean, that's the thing, is that in addition to it being such a phenomenon, it's just also really, really good. And they even land the. Can we talk about the endings?
- [23:55]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, of course.
- [23:56]
Amanda Davis
Because famously, there were a few options, including one where Kris is. Are actually arrested by the police instead of saved by Lil Rel in a TSA police car, which is genuinely, really, really funny. And also, you know, it's a release, which I guess in one way you need, though you ask the important question, which is like, is the other ending. Does it make a better movie? Is it truer?
- [24:28]
Sean Fennessy
Like, I, you know, I think it's an interesting conversation. The movie was. Was tested and they listened to the audience and what the audience wanted. And the audience wanted Chris to survive. They wanted little Rel to save him. They wanted Allison Williams to die. And they got what they wanted. And the movie went on to be a mega sensation. And it won Jordan Peele an Academy Award for Best Original Screenplay.
- [24:51]
Amanda Davis
Right.
- [24:52]
Sean Fennessy
So they did the right thing.
- [24:53]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, yeah.
- [24:54]
Sean Fennessy
Like, in the grand scheme of things. And I remember vividly being in the movie theater seeing for the first time Lil Ro popping out of the car and the audience went apeshit. They were so excited and loved that moment. And it's fun, given the strength of the ideas and where the whole conceit is going. Yeah, no, I. Yeah, the more sort of like dramatic and true ending.
- [25:18]
Amanda Davis
Right.
- [25:18]
Sean Fennessy
Is probably him getting arrested.
- [25:21]
Amanda Davis
Totally. But I think the, you know, focus groups are in general, like the bane of everyone's existence. But it's like, you have to believe that it would not play as well and that it would not, as many people would not be as excited to go see it. And then. Is it the success that it is? It is. Is it as Widely seen and discussed as it is.
- [25:43]
Sean Fennessy
Almost certainly not.
- [25:44]
Amanda Davis
Yeah.
- [25:44]
Sean Fennessy
Because you wouldn't walk out of the movie theater feeling exaltation.
- [25:47]
Amanda Davis
Right.
- [25:48]
Sean Fennessy
You would feel sad and depressed. And you would think then that it actually puts on the audience. If you do that, whose fault is this? Instead of we had fun.
- [25:59]
Amanda Davis
Yeah.
- [26:00]
Sean Fennessy
And whose fault is this Is important. But it doesn't usually make for movie phenomenons.
- [26:05]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. And the movie still sort of asks that or it has some ideas we can.
- [26:09]
Sean Fennessy
Eight years later.
- [26:09]
Amanda Davis
It's pointing right back. But I think if the whole movie is pointing right back, it's. Yeah. Less. People are. People are less excited. You know, it's. What's the feedback sandwich? You know, like you want like a happy thing and a happy thing with the real truth in the middle.
- [26:27]
Sean Fennessy
That's a good way of putting it. You mentioned Kaluya.
- [26:31]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. One of our great actors.
- [26:35]
Sean Fennessy
He is. And he doesn't work that much. And he has since won an Academy Award. And whenever he's in a movie, it kind of feels like an event because he's a bit sparing about what parts he takes. I had forgotten what a special performance this is. And this is not a speechifying Judas and the Black Messiah, hyper charismatic leading man part. It's a very reserved character. It's a character who has to fit in in this environment, who is confused and disoriented and is sort of a detective as he's figuring out the case of what's going on. Sort of the victim as he starts becoming more entrenched in the plot to capture his body. Kaluuya has this great stillness as an actor. Super expressive eyes. And one in the scene with the Sunken Place when he loses it and bursts into tears. He's phenomenal in a big emotional moment. But in the rest of the movie, he's kind of doing a little bit of a Paul Newman. Like, is it. What's going on here, guys? I'm a little smarter than you, and yet I'm kind of stuck. It did remind me a little bit of Cool Hand Luke where he thinks he knows what's going on, but maybe doesn't have any power. And it really hit me watching him this time around, just paying close attention to him rather than trying to solve the movie in any way, which is something that happens the first time or two that you watch this.
- [27:57]
Amanda Davis
I was thinking about how on this rewatch and when you get to the Sunken Place moment right before he falls back and it is that shot just of his face and his eyes. And I had the moment like, oh, there's the shot, you know, oh, there's the shot. Sorry. There it is, there it is. And that is like a single shot that we think of when we think of get out this movie.
- [28:20]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [28:20]
Amanda Davis
And you know, and we have those shots for a lot of different movies, but they're not usually just like a person's face acting and that. It's just him and that's it. And you know, everything is pretty remarkable.
- [28:35]
Sean Fennessy
He's very special in this movie. All the actors are very good. It's surprising what a. It's not a star studded cast, but it's a lot of very accomplished performers that I think carry the movie. The Bradley Whitford and Kathryn Keener parts could have been a lot worse in less talented hands. They both have this very interesting mix of broad TV style, presentational acting. But then obviously Keener has a really kind of serpentine, quiet communication style that is very powerful and they're both really, really special. And then Allison Williams, who, you know, I've had a crush on for a long, long time, of course, and is obviously just an insane person in this.
- [29:16]
Amanda Davis
Rewatch, I was just like, okay, so could my hair do that? And like how. What would I need to do to get my hair to do that? You know, which is intentional. The movie is. She is drawing you in quite.
- [29:26]
Sean Fennessy
She is the trap, she is complete or the bait, I suppose, in the trap. And she is weaponizing what we knew about Marnie from Girls so well in this movie. And it has actually interestingly gone on to be a little bit of a scream queen. You know, she's in the M3gan movies. She was in a NETFLIX streaming movie some years ago that was like fairly violent body horror movie. And she seems actually pretty comfortable in genre and doing this kind of work. But at the time this was very surprising.
- [29:53]
Amanda Davis
Yes.
- [29:53]
Sean Fennessy
And she presents herself obviously quite innocently through roughly the first hour of the movie. And like I said, the hard cutaway to her wearing all white, listening to I had time of my life.
- [30:02]
Amanda Davis
I always think of, you know, I can't give you the keys. Right. And just like the little hand flip. Um, but yes, also the hard cutaway for her to her drinking milk and googling NCAA draft, you know, which is hot.
- [30:17]
Sean Fennessy
So good. Eileen made a really good point though there, which is that you wouldn't want to target a well known person, would you, if you were this family?
- [30:25]
Amanda Davis
I mean, it's true. But it's like again, the investigation is played for comedy, which is much needed. But he has a Point that this person has just disappeared and none of the. No one's doing anything.
- [30:41]
Sean Fennessy
No one cares.
- [30:41]
Amanda Davis
And then like, no, we've spotted him and there's no follow up.
- [30:44]
Sean Fennessy
So, yeah, I mean, one of the big heavy ideas in the movie is the historical precedent of disappeared black people, like not just representing the slave trade, but throughout American history from the 17th century on. This idea of like, there was a black person in the community and they are no longer there and no questions are asked. And that is the other idea. The movie opens with Lakeith Stanfield's character being kidnapped by Caleb Landry Jones. And that is an echo of hundreds of years of American history. So the movie really is kind of having it both ways. It is not afraid to confront you with this really tough, cynical, hard truth about the world that we live in. And also, Allison Williams sipping milk. I did want to cite this quote that I read from Peel from around that decision to have her drinking milk. And it resonated with me. So here it is. There's something kind of horrific about milk. Think about it. Think about what we're doing. Milk is kind of gross.
- [31:39]
Amanda Davis
Okay.
- [31:40]
Sean Fennessy
To that I say thank you, Jordan Peele.
- [31:42]
Amanda Davis
I mean, I think it's always usual on films. See also Baby Girl. You know, it's a rich, liquid lot to work with.
- [31:51]
Sean Fennessy
Anything else in the movie itself that we should cite that is effective or works? I like seeing Eric Alexander as the cop. You know, love her from Living Single. She's great. Betty Gabriel is incredible. Amazing performance in this movie. And I had hoped that she would get more fun stuff to do after this movie. But she's so great as both the maid and woman whose body is taken over by the grandmother of the family. And she gives this crazy dual performance. And I had forgotten about her getting in the car at the end of the movie and then resulting in the car crash and kind of flipping. And then the revelation of the scar above her head. There are so many little details in the movie that were really fun to revisit.
- [32:28]
Amanda Davis
I had forgotten that Bradley Whitford's character is killed by a deer head, which is. You know, the signifiers are right there. You know, it is both like on the nose and just. And perfect because. And then Caleb Landrieu Jones is killed with a.
- [32:45]
Sean Fennessy
A croquet ball.
- [32:46]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, I thought it was am a pool, but, you know, same thing.
- [32:49]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. So they're both really good for two reasons. The deer head is great because one, obviously a slaughtered deer is prey. And so the Kris killing him is the prey killing The Predator, but also a deer head, a croquet ball. These are signifiers of white wealth.
- [33:04]
Amanda Davis
Exactly. There's also a lacrosse stick that's just being juggled throughout the entire first half of this movie.
- [33:10]
Sean Fennessy
All that stuff. These are small character choices that work really, really well. This movie lives on profoundly. The Sunken Place is a phrase that is in our culture that you will hear about all the time. You mentioned the Obama line. Would you vote for Trump a third time if you could? Black is in fashion. All of the quotes from the white attendees of the party are chillingly funny and clearly reflect experiences that Jordan Peele has had in his years moving through the world. We mentioned the money. $255 million internationally made $176 million in the United States, and it actually made $80 million overseas, which is darn good. We always hear black films don't travel, comedies don't travel, and horror films don't travel. This is all three did pretty good business. Four Oscar nominations, one screenplay. Yes, Kaluuya was lost to Gary Oldman for Darkest Hour.
- [34:08]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, that just, you know, I didn't even think it was a good Churchill. I'm record on record on this. Okay, Sir Gary now, but that's.
- [34:16]
Sean Fennessy
Is he Sir Gary?
- [34:17]
Amanda Davis
He's Sir Gary. And it is Sir Christopher Nolan. Okay.
- [34:20]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, Cool director. He lost to Guillermo del Toro.
- [34:23]
Amanda Davis
Sure.
- [34:24]
Sean Fennessy
And Guillermo del Toro's film the Shape of Water won Best Picture that year.
- [34:27]
Amanda Davis
He did.
- [34:28]
Sean Fennessy
Let's look at the 2017 Best Picture lineup.
- [34:30]
Amanda Davis
It was stacked. I can do it off the top of my head. Kirk, Phantom, Thread, Lady Bird, Get Out, Shape of Water, Darkest Hour. Call me by your name. That's seven. What else am I missing? Like Philomena or some shit?
- [34:45]
Sean Fennessy
The Post.
- [34:47]
Amanda Davis
Oh, the Post. I liked the Post. I'm sorry to the Post.
- [34:50]
Sean Fennessy
Three Billboards outside Ebbing, Missouri.
- [34:52]
Amanda Davis
What a time we were having in 2017.
- [34:55]
Sean Fennessy
And did you say Darkest Hour?
- [35:00]
Amanda Davis
I think so.
- [35:01]
Sean Fennessy
Shape of Water, Call Me by youy Name, Darkest Hour. Dunkirk.
- [35:03]
Amanda Davis
I said Dunkirk.
- [35:04]
Sean Fennessy
Get Out, Lady Bird, Phantom thread. The post. Three billboards outside Abbing, Missouri. Nine.
- [35:08]
Amanda Davis
Oh, nine.
- [35:09]
Sean Fennessy
Okay, interesting.
- [35:10]
Amanda Davis
I got seven out of nine. That's pretty good.
- [35:12]
Sean Fennessy
Before they made the change to 10 permanent. I guess they only did that recently.
- [35:15]
Amanda Davis
Okay, 2017 was, like a very powerful year.
- [35:19]
Sean Fennessy
Best Director is fascinating that year because it was Nolan for Dunkirk, Peel for Get Out, Gerwig for Lady Bird, PTA for Phantom Thread, and GDT1.
- [35:27]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, well, I mean, Shape of Water won over all those movies, which I think maybe, like, you could make an Argument. Or I, Amanda, could make an argument that To a director. Those are my favorites of each of those directors. Right. Dunkirk for Sir Christopher. Lady Bird for Gerwig. Let's see. Phantom thread.
- [35:52]
Sean Fennessy
Get out for Peel, too.
- [35:53]
Amanda Davis
Get out for Peel. Phantom Thread for pta. Maybe not Call Me by youy Name, even though I do really like it. But, you know, Luca contains multitudes. To me.
- [36:02]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. Darkest Hour for Joe Wright, of course.
- [36:04]
Amanda Davis
Oh, yeah. No, not anymore. Okay.
- [36:07]
Sean Fennessy
And certainly not the Post for Steven Spielberg.
- [36:09]
Amanda Davis
No. But again, I did like the post. Yeah.
- [36:11]
Sean Fennessy
It's a fun movie. That was a really, really. We didn't know how good we had it. We were just starting to do this.
- [36:19]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. We didn't. We didn't know we did.
- [36:21]
Sean Fennessy
That was fucking cool.
- [36:22]
Amanda Davis
I remember.
- [36:22]
Sean Fennessy
And Phantom Third coming out of nowhere and not playing any festivals.
- [36:26]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. That was so fun.
- [36:28]
Sean Fennessy
And then it came out. It was magical. And then it Getting all the Oscar nominations, which we did not expect.
- [36:33]
Amanda Davis
I know.
- [36:33]
Sean Fennessy
That was a great time.
- [36:34]
Amanda Davis
That was a great morning to wake up.
- [36:35]
Sean Fennessy
It was.
- [36:38]
Amanda Davis
We got to do it. We got to do. Why? This is the Jordan Peele movie on the list.
- [36:44]
Sean Fennessy
I think it's the one that's easiest for us to agree on.
- [36:46]
Amanda Davis
I know. I mean, I know why I think it is, but you feel very strongly about. Nope.
- [36:52]
Sean Fennessy
It's a movie that continues to reveal itself to me, and I think its ambition is much bigger and much harder to unpack. The metaphors, the satire, the phraseology of get out is very approachable and very easy to understand. Nope. Is a much bigger movie about not just spectacle, which is literalized in the screenplay, but the idea around black artists and how members of the black community are integrated or ignored in American culture is so complex in note. And to do that inside of a movie about a giant alien that eats people and horses is like a crazy feat to me. It also just features some of the craziest, most beautiful production design that I've seen in a movie this century. So I am really taken with it. And it's ambition, and it is the thing that I am kind of begging for, which I said at the time. I understand that many people watch it. Like, my wife just watched it again with me on my birthday, and she was like, there are things about this. I completely understand. The things about it I don't understand at all. And I think it is a little bit alienating. And you can see that in the way that it was received.
- [38:04]
Amanda Davis
I love that. Yeah.
- [38:05]
Sean Fennessy
But it also has another great Quaya Kaluuya performance. And keke Palmer throwing 105 miles an hour. So I love it. I understand that it's not for everybody. It is like pretty easily my favorite of his now.
- [38:20]
Amanda Davis
Okay.
- [38:20]
Sean Fennessy
But I think this is also like a 5 star movie. I think both of these movies are great. Us to me, is more flawed. Us was the first actual pod that we did together where I was like, this show is gonna be good. The show with too many good. Because we saw it and then we were like, we gotta do a deep dive on it. That's really interesting. And we didn't really totally understand everything, but we were kind of working it out together. And I just think it's great to have him doing this stuff. I made a long list of potential horror movies that we didn't do here. And I guess we'll be giving away some of the movies that are not gonna be included on the final 12. But we're getting a little like on the list. We're getting to a place where people are like, I think you could pretty closely guess somewhere between 9 and 11 of our movies.
- [39:00]
Amanda Davis
I know there's one though that no one's guessed since.
- [39:01]
Sean Fennessy
I know. I'm really excited about that.
- [39:03]
Amanda Davis
I love it.
- [39:05]
Sean Fennessy
So let the Right One In. Hereditary, the Witch, the Others Pulse, Martyrs Train to Busan Signs. It follows the Babadook, 28 days later, the Strangers, the Wailing, the Host, the Invitation, the Ring, the Conjuring. All of these movies I like. They're all really good.
- [39:21]
Amanda Davis
Even I like some of them.
- [39:22]
Sean Fennessy
Some of them, yes. You know, there's obviously been a huge wave of international horror that's hit stateside. We're not really representing that in any way on this list. But there are also like, movies like the studio horror, like the Conjuring. That's a very good film.
- [39:36]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, I've seen that one. Wait, that's the Vera Farmiga and Patrick Wilson one. Yes. Yeah, I've seen it.
- [39:44]
Sean Fennessy
I think the fifth one and the Babadook. Yes.
- [39:47]
Amanda Davis
Okay, great.
- [39:48]
Sean Fennessy
You've seen that too. That's about the terrors of motherhood.
- [39:50]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. I mean, aren't they all?
- [39:51]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. This one's the best, in my opinion.
- [39:55]
Amanda Davis
It is. I think it's. It. It's the best. But I do think also it's just. It is both a great horror movie and then like one of the great American films of the. Of the first 21st century so far.
- [40:09]
Sean Fennessy
It accomplishes so much in such a small container, which I love. And then Peele new movie next year.
- [40:15]
Amanda Davis
I'm excited.
- [40:18]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, I am too. It's so nice when someone like that is like, what I want to do is make movies. Yeah, he could have done anything. You know, we had a conversation earlier this month about comedy movies and how comedians don't feel they need to make movies anymore to stay in the culture. But this is a guy who grew up loving the people under the stairs, you know, and just like you.
- [40:38]
Amanda Davis
Yeah, that's beautiful.
- [40:39]
Sean Fennessy
Now he wants to make stuff. It is really beautiful. Okay. Recommend it if you like. Now, you already mentioned Sinners.
- [40:43]
Amanda Davis
Yes.
- [40:43]
Sean Fennessy
I think this is a really good. That's a great double feature.
- [40:46]
Amanda Davis
You think there are people out there who have seen Sinners and not get out?
- [40:50]
Sean Fennessy
Probably not. It's the tricky part about doing a recommended, if you like, episode about a movie we've covered on the show. It's a little bit more challenging to be like.
- [40:58]
Amanda Davis
I mean, I like to think that these episodes will find their way to people who, like, don't care about the Fantastic Four or whatever's going on in movies this week. But I would imagine if you have seen Sinners like you probably did at some point, make it to get out.
- [41:13]
Sean Fennessy
Well, if not, you should check it out.
- [41:15]
Amanda Davis
If you're 12, then thank you for listening and do your homework and then see Get Up.
- [41:21]
Sean Fennessy
Well, I think Also if you're 60 and you stopped going to movies and didn't see get out, but you really liked they Live or Cronenberg's the Brood or the People under the Stairs or the Shining, you will, like, Get Out. It is in conversation with those movies. Or even like Shadow of a Doubt, the Hitchcock movie, or there's a lot of movies about sort of like, is what's really happening happening right now? That incredible feeling that a good horror movie can convey to you, that this movie just absolutely nails bang on. So I'm really glad this made it to the list. Too high, too low? You feel good about it?
- [41:52]
Amanda Davis
Maybe a little too low, but, you.
- [41:53]
Sean Fennessy
Know, couldn't you have said that about so many of the movies, though?
- [41:55]
Amanda Davis
Yes, and every other movie. Like, I, you know, I Stand by.
- [41:59]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. Children of Men is the one where I'm like, ah, this may be a little too high.
- [42:02]
Amanda Davis
I don't know. We're getting so much feedback about Michael Clayton at 25. And we explained to you guys why, like we explained, this is how you make a mess.
- [42:09]
Sean Fennessy
We had to kick off strong.
- [42:10]
Amanda Davis
Yes, I know we said that then. We say it now, but.
- [42:13]
Sean Fennessy
So by the time this comes out, I will packages by Expedia.
- [42:17]
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- [42:30]
Sean Fennessy
I've introduced Michael Clayton to a crowd.
- [42:32]
Amanda Davis
I know. I'm really jealous. I'm sorry everyone that I missed it.
- [42:37]
Sean Fennessy
When this episode comes out, you'll be in Italy.
- [42:39]
Amanda Davis
You'll be in Venice. Yeah, I will. At the Venice.
- [42:40]
Sean Fennessy
Exciting for you. That's really wonderful.
- [42:42]
Amanda Davis
I hope it's going well.
- [42:43]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, me too. Well, I think that's it. Any closing thoughts on Peele? Get out.
- [42:48]
Amanda Davis
Yeah. This is a really good movie.
- [42:50]
Sean Fennessy
Great movie. Thank you to everybody listening at home. Thanks to our producer Jack Sanders for his work on this episode. Later this week we'll be back from the fall film festivals. We'll have a full report on every movie we've seen. We'll see you then.