The Top Five Movies of 2024

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Big Picture – "The Top Five Movies of 2024"

Episode Release Date: December 6, 2024

In this episode of The Big Picture, hosted by Sean Fennessey from The Ringer, along with co-hosts Chris Ryan and Adam Neyman, the team embarks on an in-depth exploration of the best movies of 2024. Despite the absence of guest co-host Amanda Dobbins, she contributes a voice note sharing her favorite films, adding another layer to the lively discussion. The episode seamlessly weaves through award analyses, film critiques, and the hosts' personal top-five lists, offering listeners a comprehensive look at the cinematic landscape of the year.

---

1. Year in Awards

The episode kicks off with a comprehensive review of the New York Film Critics Circle (NYFCC) and National Board of Review (NBR) awards, providing early indicators of the award season's trajectory.

New York Film Critics Circle Highlights:

• Best Film: The Brutalist
• Best Director: Ramel Ross for Nickel Boys
• Best Screenplay: Sean Baker for A Nora
• Best Actor: Adrien Brody for The Brutalist
• Best Actress: Marian Jean Baptiste for Hard Truths
• Supporting Actors: Carol Kane for Between the Temples and Kieran Culkin for Real Pain

National Board of Review Top 10 Films: Sean Fennessey notes that NBR's list is notably "safe and solid," comprising widely recognized films such as Honora, Baby Girl, A Complete Unknown, Conclave, Furiosa, Gladiator 2, Juror Number 2, Queer, Real Pain, and Sing Sing. Chris Ryan echoes this sentiment, describing it as “a safe and good list” that excludes major contenders like Dune Part 2 and The Brutalist, reflecting a populist approach to film selection.

Sean Fennessey [03:52]: "A list that does not feature Dune Part 2 or The Brutalist, which is pretty notable."

---

2. Discussion of Notable Films

The hosts delve into several standout films, analyzing their impact, performances, and potential award prospects.

a. The Brutalist

• Overview: A compelling narrative about an individual rising in the architectural world of post-war Pennsylvania.
• Awards Insight: Chris Ryan compares its ambition to The Godfather, while Rob Harvilla praises its formal structure.

Chris Ryan [53:33]: "I was mesmerized by it. It felt like someone reaching for greatness in a way that you don't see directors do that often anymore."

b. Wicked

• Overview: Discussed in the context of potential Best Picture Oscar contention, particularly with its Part Two.
• Performance: John M. Chu’s direction and the film’s ambitious scope are highlighted, though some skepticism remains about its international reception.

Rob Harvilla [09:06]: "Who's the future David Lynch, whose movies are all gonna be coded remakes of Wicked?"

c. Nickel Boys

• Overview: An adaptation by Ramel Ross based on Colson Whitehead’s novel, lauded for its unique cinematic translation and original point of view.
• Reception: Praised for its extraordinary adaptation approach and emotional depth.

Rob Harvilla [47:43]: "It's a completely cinematic translation of a literary medium. It has a use of point of view that I think is genuinely original."

d. Kneecap

• Overview: An Irish film available on Netflix, featuring Michael Fassbender, centered on young activists promoting the Irish language.
• Reception: Chris Ryan describes it as “an absolute blast”, praising its energetic portrayal and musical elements.

Chris Ryan [14:37]: "Just an absolute blast from start to finish. The music's incredible, the performances across the board are great."

e. The Order

• Overview: A 1983-set thriller about an FBI agent tracking politically motivated bank robbers in the Pacific Northwest.
• Performances: Jude Law and Nicholas Hoult receive accolades for their gripping portrayals.

Chris Ryan [24:03]: "It's a really, really, really solid movie. Watched it like two or three times."

f. Evil Does Not Exist

• Overview: A Japanese film exploring the impact of industrialized tourism on a small fishing village.
• Reception: Sean Fennessey finds the film “deeply personal and complex,” appreciating its atmospheric depth despite its confusing ending.

Sean Fennessey [51:10]: "I adore this movie and I adore her too, for somewhat similar reasons."

---

3. Year in Movies Analysis

The hosts reflect on the overall film landscape of 2024, touching upon:

• Impact of Strikes: Causing irregular release schedules, leading to weeks devoid of major releases.
• Streaming Influence: Acknowledgment that streaming platforms like Letterboxd are democratizing access to a broader range of films, though leading to debates on recency bias and list-making.

Chris Ryan [30:39]: "I have like a 15 to 20 movie long list that I was like, this is really good."

• Critical Reception vs. Popularity: Rob Harvilla emphasizes the importance of critics highlighting underseen films to balance the populist trends.

Rob Harvilla [35:40]: "If critics aren't calling attention to films that aren't as widely seen, they're not doing their job."

---

4. Top Five Movies of 2024

Each host presents their personal top-five list, highlighting diversity in taste and perspective.

Christopher Ryan's Top Five:

1. Civil War – Alex Garland's politically charged thriller.
2. Nickel Boys – Ramel Ross’s poignant adaptation.
3. Anora – Sean Baker’s emotionally resonant drama.
4. The Brutalist – An architectural saga with grand ambitions.
5. Strange Darling – A non-linear cat-and-mouse thriller featuring Willa Fitzgerald.

Chris Ryan [45:12]: "Number five, Strange Darling, is a cat and mouse serial killer movie told in non-linear fashion. Features my favorite performance of the year by Willa Fitzgerald."

Sean Fennessey's Top Five:

1. The Brutalist – Praised for its scope and performances.
2. Evil Does Not Exist – Admired for its atmospheric depth and unconventional ending.
3. Challengers – Luca Guadagnino’s intense love triangle within the sports milieu.
4. Dune Part Two – Denis Villeneuve’s continuation of the epic saga.
5. Nora – Sean Baker’s intricate storytelling and character development.

Sean Fennessey [53:47]: "My number five is Evil Does Not Exist. It has one of the most unusual and confounding endings to a movie that I've seen in recent times."

Rob Harvilla's Top Five:

1. Nickel Boys – Celebrated for its unique adaptation and emotional impact.
2. The Beast – Bertrand Bonello’s genre-adjacent exploration with standout performances.
3. The Order – A tightly constructed thriller with stellar acting.
4. Rebel Ridge – A martial arts-themed critique of civil asset forfeiture.
5. Red Rooms – Pascal Plant’s French-Canadian courtroom drama with intense character studies.

Rob Harvilla [47:43]: "Number five is Nickel Boys, directed by Ramel Ross. It’s a completely cinematic translation of a literary medium."

---

5. Honorable Mentions

The hosts briefly acknowledge additional noteworthy films that didn’t make their top-five lists but are still significant.

• Chris Ryan: Rebel Ridge, Juror Number Two
• Sean Fennessey: Challengers, Soundtrack to a Coup d'Etat
• Rob Harvilla: The Beast, Red Rooms

---

6. Amanda Dobbins' Favorite Films

Though absent from the main discussion, Amanda Dobbins contributes a voice note outlining her top favorites for the year.

Amanda Dobbins' Top Favorites:

1. Twisters – Highlighted as her favorite blockbuster of the year.
2. The Beekeeper & Lonely Planet – Classified under her "junk category" for their transcendent entertainment value.
3. The Challenge – Described as the most "Amanda" movie of the year, emphasizing character-driven narratives and compelling soundtracks.
4. Honora – Ranked as her number one favorite, praised for its intellectual and provocative storytelling.
5. Additional Mentions: Soundtrack to a Coup d'Etat, Furiosa, A Different Man

Amanda Dobbins: "My number one has to be Honora. It’s a completely engrossing, intellectual, and provocative movie that stays with you."

---

7. Conclusion

As the conversation wraps up, Sean Fennessey teases upcoming discussions on award nominations and further film analyses, inviting listeners to stay tuned for more in-depth coverage of the cinematic achievements and controversies of 2024.

Sean Fennessey [99:07]: "Next week, the Golden Globe nominations come out. Monday morning, I will be here with Joanna Robinson covering the first truly big domino of award season. We'll see you then."

---

This episode of The Big Picture offers a rich tapestry of film critiques, personal insights, and passionate discussions, making it an indispensable listen for cinephiles eager to navigate the cinematic milestones of 2024.

Transcript

[Rob Harvilla]

Look, it's not that confusing. I'm Rob Harvilla, host of the podcast 60 songs that explain the 90s. Except we did 120 songs and now we're back with the 2000s. I refuse to say aughts. 2000 to 2009. The Strokes, Rihanna, J. Lo, Kanye. Sure. And now the show is called 60 Songs that Explain the 90s. Colon, the 2000s. Wow, that's too long a title for me to say anything else right now, Just trust me. That's 60 songs that explain the 90s. Cole in the 2000s. Preference, preferably on Spotify.

[Sean Fennasy]

This episode of the Big Picture is presented by Walmart. Thoughtfulness matters during the holiday season. Walmart has a huge selection of great gifts at great prices. So you can find the perfect thing for everyone on your list. Like a Samsung soundbar for action movie fans, the Lego Sorting Hat for those who queue up a Harry Potter marathon every year, or the Fujifilm Instax camera for the aspiring cinematographers. Give the gifts that show you get them at Walmart. There's no better feeling than a personal win. And the State Farm personal price plan can help you do just that. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer, availability, amount of discounts, and savings and eligibility vary by state. I'm Sean Fennasy and this is the Big Picture, a conversation show about the best movies of 2024. Chris Ryan and Adam Neyman are here. Amanda Dobbins, of course, is not here. She's usually here with the three of us to share her best films, but she has contributed a voice note and she will be giving us her favorite films of the year at the end of this episode. So please stick around after we've had a chance to talk through everything here and you can hear Amanda's wonderful voice and her extremely strong opinions about the year in movies. Before we get into the year in movies, we have to talk about the year in awards for the movies of the year. They've started. We had the Gothams last week. This week, the New York Film Critics Circle as well as the National Board of Review gave us some an early glimpse into what's going on in the minds of the cinema lovers.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

How are you feeling, Chris, about some of these results?

[Chris Ryan]

First of all, I just wanna say, you know how Russello, when he does life advice, when he gives out picks, it's the alliance, you know, that's their crew. Could we be the Atlantic Division? Knicks, Raptor, Sixers. Right?

[Sean Fennasy]

That's true. That's true.

[Chris Ryan]

That's what the Adam, Sean and Chris Pie can be.

[Sean Fennasy]

Who are we missing? Who else is. Are the Orlando Magic in that division? Who else is in the Celtics?

[Chris Ryan]

The Brooklyn Nets. So we'd need a Brooklyn 8. And if we can find a Boston Celtics fan, that would be great.

[Sean Fennasy]

Of course, the Celtics. How could I forget?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, yeah, sorry, what was your question?

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, we can be the Atlantic Division. The New York film critic circle is also in the Atlantic Division. They gave out some prizes, Adam. They gave the best film of the year to the Brutalist. We'll come back to that film at some point in this discussion, I'm sure. Ramel Ross, the director of Nickel Boys, won. Best director Screenplay went to Sean Baker for A Nora. Best actor went to Adrien Brody for the Brutalist. Best actress went to Marian Jean Baptiste for Hard Truths. And then in supporting actor categories, Carol Kane for Between the Temples, a movie I liked quite a bit. And Kieran Culkin won for Real Pain. Probably the least surprising of all these awards. Adam, what do you make of the New York Film Critics Circle choices?

[Rob Harvilla]

They would seem to be, you know, they're usually bellwethers. You know, Harbinger's pretty good predictors. I think that any year where you could look at, you know, an actress from a Mike Lee movie getting nominated or, you know, an actress like Carol came from between the Temples, shout out to the film's co writer, Chris Wells, one of the. Of the. One of the great good guys. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's a good thing. I think that the New York film critics as a predictor of the Oscars has gotten a little, you know, you know, sometimes a little bit overstated. I think that their choices tend to be, you know, a little higher end, a little more chin strokey, and then, you know, certainly more high end than something like the Golden Globes. But this is not. There's nothing there that's terribly unexpected. There's the. There's the whispers of category fraud around here in Culkin. It's a good performance, but it's like he's essentially a co lead, you know, co lead within the film. The question of the Brutalist winning awards will be interesting to talk about since it has awardy aspirations kind of cooked into its storyline. But no, nothing like out of left field.

[Chris Ryan]

Can I ask you a question?

[Sean Fennasy]

Please.

[Chris Ryan]

Starting to get these Gotham awards already happened. Too, as well. Is there any rising and falling going on that you are surprised by in terms of a film's futures?

[Sean Fennasy]

Well, you've set up, I think, the National Board of Review conversation by asking that question, because that was the other big body that handed out their awards. The National Board of Review is kind of a strange collection. Agglomeration of figures, sort of film enthusiasts is how they're defined. You've got some critics, some scholars, some people who are just really into movies. I'm not quite sure how you get selected to be a member of the National Board of Reviews. There's not a ton of crossover in terms of.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, you don't know.

[Sean Fennasy]

I honestly do not know.

[Chris Ryan]

Don't tell them.

[Sean Fennasy]

Do you guys vote? You guys? So you guys are responsible for the best film selection of Wicked as picture of the year? Their top films of the year, they always provide a top 10 are Honora, baby Girl, A Complete Unknown, Conclave, Furiosa, Gladiator 2, Juror Number 2, Queer, a real Pain, and Sing Sing.

[Chris Ryan]

You know, that's a good solid. Like, I get up every day, eat breakfast, you know, read the Wall Street Journal. And These are the 10 best movies of the year list?

[Sean Fennasy]

Yes. I don't know what you mean by that. Like, it's. Normie.

[Chris Ryan]

It's like. It's like a double to left. Like, there's no chances taken, really. Baby Girl, I haven't seen that. But, like, for the most part, like, Furiosa's pretty high, I guess.

[Sean Fennasy]

On your list.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, on their list, yeah. But it's. I think it's. It's like a safe and good list.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, it's. This is a list that does not feature Dune Part 2 or the brutalist, which is pretty notable. I don't think Emilia Perez was eligible for this list because it's an international production. But I would say the inclusion of juror number two is fun. Obviously. Adam, you and I really liked that movie. We had a chance to talk about it on the show. The inclusion of Gladiator 2 is straight up weird. And the Wicked Wind sucks. Like, in my opinion, I think that's super corny to make a part one of musical fanfic the best film of the year.

[Chris Ryan]

How far out on the Ice Floe do you want Fantasy to go with this Wicked can't win Best Picture thing. Adam, do you. Do you think it's healthy?

[Rob Harvilla]

I mean, how much power do we think Sean has in this situation? More. More power than some, but probably still close to zero, right? Like. Like, it's just, you know, not even.

[Chris Ryan]

On the National Board of Review.

[Rob Harvilla]

My, my, my, my, my prediction is that they will give it to part two in a Return of the King type scenario. That it would be premature to reward the magnificent artistry of the first Wicked movie, which is eight hours long. So give it to. Give it to. To Part two, which as a someone who knows the musical is going to feature zero good songs. Whatever good songs are in that show are all in the first half. I have no idea what they are.

[Chris Ryan]

I totally didn't even think of that. Is that true?

[Sean Fennasy]

That's what they say. They say. They say Part two is significantly the.

[Chris Ryan]

Side of that soundtrack. Oh, no.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, they're going to be like, we have to. Defying Gravity. Part two will be written for Wicked two.

[Sean Fennasy]

The speculation is that they're going to add songs and moments in theory to the second half of that story. As I said, I'm not an expert on the Wicked story. The Wicked movie is fine. I think making a list that features, I don't know, Honora and choosing Wicked is pretty lame to me.

[Rob Harvilla]

Okay, Sean, on that point, who did they give Best Director?

[Sean Fennasy]

Best Director went to John M. Chu for Wicked. Yeah, there you go.

[Rob Harvilla]

You know, definitely a storm. A storm is brewing.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah. NBR is not terribly predictive historically of Best Picture winners, but Wicked is clearly rising. It's been rising steadily since I would say, roughly two weeks before it was released when people started to get a chance to see it. And especially fans of the musical, I think, feel really, really excited about this movie's big box office hit, at least here in the United States, not international. That is notable that the wizard of Oz and this related story does not have as much purchase internationally because the Academy is so international these days. Like, how is a movie like this gonna do it? The baftas? I'm not totally sure. Maybe not as well.

[Rob Harvilla]

Who's the future David lynch, whose movies are all gonna be coded remakes of Wicked? There's that thesis that every David lynch movie is a kind of submerged remake of the wizard of Oz. I'm like, who's the sicko, David? Who's the sicko David Lynch? In 25 years you'd be like, actually, I just am trying to recapture the feeling of filming Wicked on my phone while singing along to it. And that's how I made wildlife.

[Chris Ryan]

Probably somebody who's shooting a Get ready with me TikTok right now.

[Sean Fennasy]

Like I was gonna say Lights Camera Jackson. Maybe he'll be making wicked inspired films 25 years from now.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's a really good question. Is his top 10 list out? Because it is always good.

[Sean Fennasy]

I haven't seen it.

[Amanda Dobbins]

Is that to see you at the movies guy?

[Sean Fennasy]

No, that's Lights Camera Jackson is the OG underage child movie recommender.

[Rob Harvilla]

Oh, I'm a huge fan.

[Sean Fennasy]

His legacy is extraordinary, honestly.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, no, it is.

[Sean Fennasy]

And he's also one of those guys who credit to him does not blink. He's like, what bit? I'm not doing what bit. There are no bits. I'm a man who enjoys films and frankly, I admire it. I admire the approach.

[Chris Ryan]

You see yourself in it.

[Sean Fennasy]

I do. We are brothers, me and Lights Camera Jackson.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

So this is kind of a funky list. And there were some good prizes. Mike Lee won for Hard Truths for original screenplay. Clint Bentley and Greg Kwidar for Sing Sing One for adapted Nicole Kidman won actress for baby girl choice that I like. Daniel Craig made one for best actor for Queer, which we'll talk about momentarily. Kieran Culkin also won here. And then by far the weirdest choice at non wicked division is Elle Fanning winning for a complete unknown.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Not because Elle Fanning is a bad actress or because she's bad in a complete unknown, but there is another female performer in the film, Monica Barbaro, who plays Joan Baez who's like just significantly more a standout. Would you agree? You just saw the movie?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. I think they both gaze at Bob Dylan a lot.

[Sean Fennasy]

Me too.

[Chris Ryan]

But I would definitely think that the Joan Baez part is meatier. But I thought they were both quite good at what they had to do there, which is essentially be like, God damn, that's Bob Dylan.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, Bob Dylan. I would like to have sex with that guy. Which, you know, who among us. I can't say I don't relate. Any other thoughts on the NBR picks, Adam?

[Rob Harvilla]

No, I'd just like to repeat that Wicked one Best Director. This is just. I just want to repeat it, you know, so that no one is unclear that it was the best directed film that came out this year. That's all I have to ask. It's actually not. It's not adding anything. It's just repeating a fact a couple.

[Sean Fennasy]

Times when you're just underlining when is.

[Chris Ryan]

The last time a film won best director or best picture that you also are on record is describing large swaths of it as unwatchable.

[Sean Fennasy]

I honestly don't know. I mean, it's got to go back to. It's probably crash, right? I mean, crash. Like Green Book is an example of A movie where I think it is now over criticized because of its win, like Green Book is a perfectly fine Farrelly brother movie that certainly has some, I would say, issues culturally, maybe not the most sensitive portrayal of race relations. Maybe a bit of a fantasy. But is it a horrendous movie? No. There are parts of Wicked that I did find hard to watch, but not all of them. Some of them are fine. Some good performances. I enjoyed Ariana Grande as the leader of the Ariana Grande fan club. This must be hard for you to have a mixed feelings on Wicked, Adam.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's very hard for me. It's kept me up for a few days now, but, you know, I'm dealing with it. Are you guys frozen?

[Sean Fennasy]

I believe you're freezing a bit here and there. Yeah.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah. This is because of the incredible geographic distance between America and Canada.

[Chris Ryan]

It's also the divide between people who love Wicked and don't love Wicked.

[Sean Fennasy]

You know, it is.

[Rob Harvilla]

When do we love. When do. When do we do the tariffs podcast? When do we do the American Canada tariffs?

[Chris Ryan]

When we take you over as the 52nd state, man.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, I know. I hope. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that means we might be closer together after. After we're invaded. I think you were asking me how I feel about Wicked again, Best directed film of the year, apparently.

[Sean Fennasy]

Thanks for weighing in, Chris. I did want to speak with you about an Irish film that was released earlier this year, but not very many people got a chance to see it. It's now available on Netflix. I first saw it out of Sundance. Adam, I'm not sure if you've had a chance to see this one.

[Rob Harvilla]

I haven't and I couldn't scramble in time. I am sorry.

[Sean Fennasy]

The movie is called Kneecap. Probably the movie I have gotten the most requests to discuss on the show. I think. I think I talked about it for 90 seconds on a pod 11 months ago. It's written and directed by Rich Pepiat. It's the story of two young lads, two young men and a teacher who together form a rap trio that becomes a kind of activist group in favor of returning Ireland to its native Irish language. And it's also a family drama, a crime drama, a number of other things, a romance, a musical, incredibly energetic, alive movie that people are now discovering. You know, a series of Irish actors in the film. Liam Mohanet, most notably probably Michael Fassbender, is in this film.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

What'd you think of Kneecap?

[Chris Ryan]

I loved it, man. Just an absolute blast from start to finish. I hate to sound like Gene Shallot but it was honestly one of the most fun experiences of watching a movie this year. The music's incredible, the performances across the board are great. I'll also just shout out Adam Best, who plays the Republicans against drug dealers guy in the movie. He's shown up now in Black Doves this and say Nothing and is excellent in everything but just like basically like a satellite beaming in from like some world that you. Obviously, most of us don't get a chance to experience the music. We don't get a chance to experience the language, certainly we don't get a chance to experience, but feels entirely familiar because of the beats of the story and the kind of almost sports movie nature of it. So I just. I just thought it was awesome.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, I really liked it too. It reminded me a lot of a period of time in movies, in a lot of British films that I was thinking about because you and Yossi did an episode about Blur on bands plane and you talked a lot about Trainspotting and I was thinking about movies like Backbeat that felt. I think sometimes when there's like a focus on a. Like a musical act that is not famous, it's a little bit easier to get sold on the quality of the music, you know, as opposed to like I'm humming along to like. I know you were crying, singing, blowing in the wind last night when you saw a complete unknown, which is totally admirable. But in this case, like, it felt like I was discovering something for the first time, like a brand of music and frankly, like what. What incredible representation for Belfast white boys to spin a yarn. I thought it was really fun and people should definitely check it out if they are interested. Adam, will you be watching Kneecap?

[Rob Harvilla]

I'm going to. I'm going to see it soon. It sounds good. I've heard nothing but good things about it, including and especially from you. So I'm there. I gotta get through, you know, Nosferatu and other award season essentials first.

[Sean Fennasy]

When you say get through, what do you mean by that?

[Chris Ryan]

Well, I mean he has the criterion edition of Wicked Part one that he's doing, so it's just.

[Sean Fennasy]

Have you written that essay yet?

[Rob Harvilla]

No, no one's letting me write about Wicked. Yeah, it was funny. I was watching the movie. We got a screener to watch it at home legally. And my wonderful wife taught me was like, no comments during the movie. And then an hour in she's like, this is very long. Okay, that's it. The dam is broken. I've not said anything. You said something. So now it's open. Open.

[Chris Ryan]

Are you a big. At home when the movie's on, do you. Do you have like a running commentary going or are you respectful of the process?

[Rob Harvilla]

Depends on who's asking, I think, you know, people who've known me a long time say only sometimes semi respectful. Sometimes movies you know are actually good. So you don't talk during them, Right? I'm pretty good. When I watch movies with my kids, I tell them to stop asking questions and say. And say, we're going to find out. We're going to find out what happens. Soon the Minions are going to break into the whatever next. I'm trying to keep them from asking too many questions.

[Sean Fennasy]

That's what they should do, is add Minions to Wicked Part 2. That would improve it. I think that would be.

[Chris Ryan]

Then it would break globally.

[Sean Fennasy]

It's very, very true. You, Chris, you don't really talk during movies, but you will furiously masturbate from time to time.

[Chris Ryan]

No, but I do turn to you and I emotionally, intellectually masturbate where. When something cool is happening. I saw a complete unknown last night, Adam. And when Boyd Holbrook appears as Johnny Cash, I looked to my left and Sean wasn't there. But I wanted to shake him and say, it happens like we did it. Like we did it, Joe.

[Rob Harvilla]

The first.

[Sean Fennasy]

The first message I sent after I saw a complete unknown was directly to Chris and I said, big winner of a complete unknown colon, Boyd Holbrook. He has risen again.

[Rob Harvilla]

If people made the joke that, why didn't they just port Johnny? Joaquin Phoenix in from the James Mangold cinematic universe is that they did, but.

[Chris Ryan]

He quit the day they started shooting. Like.

[Sean Fennasy]

As a force Ghost Johnny Cash. That would have been an interesting choice.

[Rob Harvilla]

As a force ghost Johnny Cash. Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Adam, you've seen Queer.

[Rob Harvilla]

I have.

[Sean Fennasy]

You haven't seen. Yes. So we can. We can trade thoughts briefly, I'm trying to hit a couple of titles that I don't know when I'm going to get a chance to talk about them again because this month is so packed. But Queer is released and limited over the holidays. And as I just mentioned, Daniel Craig just won the NBR prize for best actor. I think there's speculation that he's strongly being considered for best actor in the Academy race. This is Luca Guadal, second movie of the year. It's his second movie with Justin Kuritzka script. It's adapted from the William Burroughs novel, kind of a. Not a. Not considered like a major Burroughs novel, right?

[Chris Ryan]

Not to my knowledge, no.

[Sean Fennasy]

And no.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's kind of. It's kind of considered leftover from other material. It's, like, parallel to other stuff he was writing around the time.

[Chris Ryan]

And it's a Stella, right? Like, it's pretty. Pretty. It's short.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, yeah, it's very short. And set in Mexico city in the 1950s. It follows a man named Lee who has fled New Orleans after a drug bust and is kind of like bumming around Mexico City and having affairs with men throughout the city. And he stumbles upon one man in particular named Allerton, a former Navy serviceman who has been discharged, who he falls into this sort of deep and passionate lust, love, kind of romantic obsession with. And it follows their story closely. Drew Starkey plays Allerton. And I was a bit stumped by this movie, Adam. I'm curious what your reaction to it was.

[Rob Harvilla]

I was stumped by it, too. I wasn't stumped by challengers. I mean, whatever you say about challengers, strengths, weaknesses, it's a movie that I think knows what it wants to be. And this is a film by a director who I think is taking this material very seriously. He's not bowing to it. I definitely think he's trying to complicate it a little bit. I think he's trying to complicate some of his own moviemaking, too. Because a lot of the discourse around Call me by your name was that it was kind of prudish about depicting queer sexuality, gay sex scenes. This movie is not squeamish about that. It's not recessive about that. Those scenes are quite good. The question of him as a sensual kind of filmmaker, I think has been answered by the standards of now. He's pretty pervy, you know, but there's still something kind of gassified about this movie as a Burroughs adaptation. It's a little too clean and a little too crisp. Burroughs, a really nasty writer. And that nastiness kind of doesn't come through, I think. And I think Craig's performance is sort of extraordinary. But I don't like him more than, like, Peter Weller in Naked Lunch. I mean that, you know, he doesn't have the same depth of kind of mystery. He's a little bit. It's kind of a goofy performance. He's very good. I'm not. Not saying he's not. He's a good actor. Daniel Craig.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah. I mean, it is. It's extremely mannered and a little bit silly in the characterization, which is sort of a path that he's been on, obviously, in the Knives out films. He's Doing something. It's extremely different tonally, but the performance style is actually not that different. There's something kind of like Tex Avery cartoon character about him throughout the movie when he's looking at Drew Starkey, you know, the movie also is shot, I believe, in China Cheetah. And so it has this kind of, like, artificial feeling. In Mexico.

[Chris Ryan]

I read about this. Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Which is an interesting choice, but maybe not an effective choice. And then it becomes a kind of a road movie where they go on this quest looking for things. And, you know, there are various addictions play out in complicated ways. There's a wild third act featuring a very funny performance by Leslie Manville that features him, like, really diving into some explorations of consciousness and what, you know, certain kinds of drugs can do to your body and to your idea of romance and connectivity to people. Like, I find it to be a very sincere movie, but not a successful one.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you, like. What do you think of his prolific nature? Like, this is obviously second film in this year.

[Sean Fennasy]

I mean, awesome. It's great.

[Chris Ryan]

He's got a bunch dialed up. He does tv. He's like. He's really. I'm curious whether or not you look at that and you're like, this is how it should be done, or if you think some of his stuff is a little undercooked.

[Sean Fennasy]

I think it's always deeply considered. He was on WCF this week, and he's just such a great talker about theme and ideas and what he's trying to accomplish in his films. And he takes chances. You know, he's got a movie coming out with Julia Roberts and Andrew Garfield. And I owe Debris, like, I think in the middle of next year. So he is on a hot streak right now. I think it's okay if some movies don't work. This was just one to me, that ultimately didn't work.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, I thought you were talking about the set shooting. What I always thought was interesting about a bigger splash is how much it kind of became a movie about insularity within this larger reality. It's not just that it's a beach house vacation movie, but it's a beach house vacation movie surrounded by a real population. And I thought that this was an aspect of Burroughs writing that he seemed to be trying to contend with a little bit. That Burroughs really not interested in, like, the reality of life in Mexico, just more in Mexico City. Just the interest in, like, his experience of being there and drinking and, you know, fucking and all of that stuff. I thought that this movie was a little bit accusatory of that, or at least making it a bit of a point. Showing that distinction, showing that insularity and the idea of a larger, you know, even it's a small one, kind of a society around it. But also by the end, when it's going into the trip stuff and the ayahuasca stuff, I just. I just missed friendship, you know, that was the better, the better ayahuasca type scene of two movies that played it at TIFF this year. I find that when Guadaguino gets really stylized and really kind of surrealistic, like when it's around the edges, it's fine when he kind of commits to it. I don't know. Like Adam McKay is better at it. You know, I thought it was maybe.

[Sean Fennasy]

The last time we hear that sentence uttered this year.

[Rob Harvilla]

No, I thought that the drug trippy stuff stuff and it was like, frankly, kind of weak.

[Sean Fennasy]

That's interesting. I think I enjoyed it just as a change of pace from being on this kind of deathless journey of obsession. Anyway, we can kind of leave it at that. Chris, let us know when you see Queer.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm definitely going to see it. Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Let's talk about the Order, which is one film that all three of us have seen.

[Chris Ryan]

Definitely saw this.

[Sean Fennasy]

Not as much ayahuasca in the Order, although it is probably how Chris feels inside when he gets to see grown men do what they do in this Justin Kurzel movie. Australian filmmaker who's had an interesting career. Maybe we can talk about it a little bit. This movie is set in 1983. It's about an FBI agent who is essentially tracking a series of bank robberies and trying to figure out who is committing them. And it turns out that it is a slightly more politically motivated, militarized, militarized group rather than your typical Heat style bandits and all. Takes place in the Pacific Northwest. And this was like a really classical, tightly gripping, men grinding their teeth, doing hard bitten things kind of serial drama that I think is very deeply solid. You know what I mean? Nothing spectacular, but incredibly watchable. And I thought two terrific performances from Jude Law and Nicholas Hoult as the rival figures in the film.

[Chris Ryan]

So worth mentioning that Adam Arkapaugh shot this. He shot a bunch of early Kerry Fukunaga stuff. And it looks extraordinary. And it's worth the price of admission alone is just to see these two guys shoot Idaho and eastern Washington and the Pacific Northwest. I love this movie despite the fact that within four minutes I could tell the entire plot to you. You know what I mean? Like this is what's going to happen. This is like this guy's introducing his family and talking about what a loving father he is. It's probably not going to go great for him, but man, like just as like a bare knuckle B movie that looks way better than it has any business looking. And Kurtzel's really good at set pieces and is really good at landscapes. I thought Jude Law was really good. Your mileage. I've been kind of like noting with interest the British invasion and how American actors don't get parts after they turn 30 anymore.

[Sean Fennasy]

What do you mean? Marc Marin is in this film.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay, but like Holt and Jude being like a hard bitten New York FBI agent and a Aryan Nation offshoot bank robber. It's pretty interesting. But it's like I thought, I thought it was, I thought it was just like really, really, really solid.

[Sean Fennasy]

What'd you think, Adam?

[Rob Harvilla]

I thought it was very good. I think this guy, this guy's a good director, you know. And it's interesting the similarities to the last one to Nitram, which Caleb Landry Jones won an acting prize at Cannes for and got very little traction when it came out. But the two performances in that movie, which is about a spree shooter, you know, it's a kind of a recreation of a really, really horrific sort of gunman attack in. In. Is it Australia or New Zealand? It's on. It's in Australia.

[Sean Fennasy]

I think it's Australia. Yeah.

[Rob Harvilla]

Which ended up getting gun laws changed. But you know, that movie, Caleb Landry Jones and Judy Davis is the. The character's mother were amazing. And this movie reminded me of it, or one half of it did because it's about radicalization. You know, Nicholas Holt's character is a really interesting character for a particular moment. You know, I mean, for one thing, it's the second performance he gives this year about a guy who thinks he's doing right by his family. You know, it's obviously a very different kind of character than the character in Juror Number two. But that whole idea of, you know, the tension between looking after his household and what he's willing to sort of do to preserve that. But I don't know, the idea of like a populist, Aryan, you know, system smashing kind of ideologue, getting people to follow him and complaining about the media and essentially, you know, advocating for the overthrow of the government, it's not untimely. And the historical narrative about the Turner Diaries and about, you know, the incredible impact that that had on various acts of domestic terrorism that's the part of the stuff that's really interesting to me. Jude Law being Gene Hackman with his jowls and all the, you know, like cop on the edge stuff. That's fine. It's very solid. Everything Chris said about how it shot is great. He's a really good location shooter. Kurtzel, he's great with mount mountains and lakes and roads. But I thought the Nicholas Holt half of it was very good. And the climax, which we won't spoil. Although you can spoil it by like going on Wikipedia, I guess. But you know, it's fictionalized but, you know, the climax is fantastic. That's a really good set piece at the end, I thought.

[Sean Fennasy]

It's a very effective semi slow reveal of Holt's character's power throughout the movie too. It's really funny. The archetype you're describing is also one that is somewhat similar to his character in Nosferatu as well. Trying to do right by his family. And it doesn't go as well for him in that respect. And then he's going to play Lex Luthor next year in Superman. So we're in a fascinating Nicole period right now. I've always been a fan of his. I don't think I. You know, he's really getting. He got cucked out a couple times on screen this year, but like by.

[Chris Ryan]

Toni Collette, you mean?

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, I mean, in theory. It depends on how you read that movie Superman. We'll see. We'll see if Lex Luthor can triumph. What do you think?

[Chris Ryan]

I think I like him when he's doing the favorite or the great rather, or Mad Max.

[Sean Fennasy]

Mad Max, Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

More than straight, narrow. Like my jaw is like iron set. This was sort of the perfect split the middle performance for me. So enjoyed him in that sometimes, like when he's just playing straightforward leading man parts, I'm a little less enamored with him.

[Sean Fennasy]

Okay, those are three films that are out in the world right now that people can check out. Let's talk about the year in movies.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, we gave Nicholas Holt something to think about there.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, that's right. Straighten up, Adam. Was this a good movie year?

[Rob Harvilla]

This is what everybody says. And it doesn't mean that it's not. I mean, it's all the politics of release dates and what are you going to sort of count and where are you publishing your lists? You know, I get to publish the top 10 list in the ringer next week. And trying to be fair about what people have seen or haven't seen. But it always. You're talking about the National Board Review. I like how Chris described it as like a list for like a normal person who sees movies. Right. And then there are different levels of exposure or accessibility. I've written about this a few times, which is the whole way recency bias works for top 10 lists and awards. It's just very annoying. It's amazing people haven't cottoned onto this yet that just because something opens in December does not mean it's good any more than things opening in January, February kind of means that it's bad. But, you know, the fact that I had like a long list of 18, 19 movies that could have gone on a top 10, I think is pretty good. You know, and a couple things I came out that came out this year I think are extraordinary. So not a. Not a bad year at all.

[Chris Ryan]

Thought it was a pretty good year. And to piggyback off what Adam's saying, I do think that movies could learn a little bit from the way television has been honestly shattered, where there isn't this kind of like gold rush at the end of a year that I think mixes everybody's signals about what's good and what's bad. I think a healthier movie industry would promote all types of different moviegoing experiences throughout the year. That being said, I've just had an extraordinary last like six weeks going to the theater and seeing stuff at home that winds up on streaming. And I actually really wound up like Adam. Like, I think I have like a 15 to 20 movie long list that I was like, this is really good. It's weird because, like, I feel like we go through months when I appear on the show, like bemoaning things or talking about like. I think it was a really dry summer. And I think that maybe has an outsized impact on the way I saw the year. And maybe it wasn't the dump you worry that we crave every year. But man, if I didn't have like a pretty cool list and up until like last night was still like moving things in and out of my top five just to. Just to try and figure out what was what.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, I was doing the same thing. I think for me it was not a great year by any means. And I think part of that is maybe the sense that there were not as many genuinely breathtaking forever movies for me personally. And that's an odd. That's just my own personal metric. Your mileage may vary, I think. Also, I think one of the reasons why there is this real pile up this year in particular is because just a lot of movies could not be finished because of the strikes. And so this was an odd release year. And it was odd, honestly, doing the show this year because there would be two and three week stretches with no significant release, wide release. And I'm not sure that that has ever really happened since movies became so massively commercialized in the 1930s. So having, you know, November 8, for example, being like a dead release weekend, or having something like a movie like Sing Sing only reaching a very small number of people, or a movie like juror number two only reaching a small number of people over time, I think it created a sense of dissonance that has already been growing over the years with the amount of streaming only movies that we get and the clear. I do feel like that has really shaken out. I do feel like there is now clarity on streaming. Movies are lesser than theatrically released films. The studios have the data they need to realize that. And that for the most part, the quote unquote, real movies are going theatrical.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

And then there is the hot frosties of the world. And they're like, this is great for people at home who want to hang out and watch movies like this. And hopefully we're not seeing any more movies. You know, I guess with obviously, with the notable exception of the way that Netflix still does business. So in that way. No, go ahead, Adam.

[Rob Harvilla]

Can I make a point based on the title of this podcast, though, and it is particular to viewership and listenership here? Because I was thinking the other day, I mean, I freelance for a lot of places and I have tremendous editorial freedom here, considering that there's, you know, site with really wide reach. Never told what to put on my 10 best list. I'm allowed to write about foreign language cinema, experimental cinema, older film. Very grateful for this. You know, the title of the podcast, Big Picture. It's a big playing field of movies. So at the end of the year when lists come out and people, not necessarily listeners or readers of the Ringer, but social media introduces you to all kinds of people. People say, I haven't heard of that. Well, because things aren't all equally widely distributed, but they exist. Or I haven't heard of that. Well, but aren't you curious to now watch it? But I can see where the, where the polarization comes from, because people feel that if it's movies that they haven't heard of, they must not be worth seeing or not be worth promoting or people are making them up. Which is why whenever people describe what they think art house or foreign language films are, they're very far from the mark. You know, people are like, oh, a seven hour Belgian documentary from the point of view of a pigeon. I'm like, I'd love to see that. That, that's not a thing. What it probably is is a boring coming of age movie set on an island somewhere. You know, I mean it, it's all perceptual. So I think at the end of the year, if critics aren't calling attention to films that aren't as widely seen, they're not doing their job. Otherwise, what's the point of their job? So something like the National Board of Review has a very populist mandate. So of course it looks like a list of 10 kind of normie movies. Those are all pretty wide release movies. Don't they also do lists of foreign and independent, like they silo these things apart. That's their mandate. To me, a good critic is someone who doesn't silo those things apart, but sort of tries to bring them together. You don't expect exclude populist movies if they're good, but you also don't privilege them if like Gladiator 2, they suck. And you also don't look too askance or too suspiciously at like good movies made in other countries or in other styles. Most people who are skeptical of that would never consider themselves to be like discriminatory or xenophobic. But it's like, if you haven't heard of something, watch it. If they can't see it, that's the problem. Right? So the podcast being called the Big Picture is a. Is a. Is a good thing for me.

[Chris Ryan]

Let me ask you a question that I don't mean to narrow cast your personal experience influencing how you feel about a year, but I'm genuinely, genuinely interested in your answer. You've done a lot of, whether it's hall of Fame's, you know, it's like top fives or whatever. Like we wind up looking backwards a lot. We live in a city that's got a ascendant, an ascendant repertory theater scene. Those repertory theaters seem to be hotbeds of young people going to the movies and discovering film history. The best moviegoing experiences I've had this year were going to see Thief at Vidiots and going to see Sorcerer at the Vista, both of which were completely packed out with people having their minds blown by that experience. I also was at a fully full Florence of Arabia screening at the Arrow, like and Apocalypse Now. Do you think that the introduction of Letterbox as like a really viable social media platform and Film sharing platform and this obvious like groundswell of interest, at least in major metropolises of young people going 10, 20, 30, 50 years into film history, but reacting with the passion that you would kind of expect because they're not being given this thing necessarily routinely on a week to week basis by Hollywood. Now, does it change how you feel about going to AMC and seeing a movie that was just like kind of meh?

[Sean Fennasy]

It's a good point, but the question doesn't really resonate because the mission of the show is still ultimately like the contemporary cinema. Sure, right. So it's like, what movies are out now and then how do they relate to that history and how can we kind of contextually discuss them? Do I wish that rather than going to see Despicable Me 4, I could just go to a 70 millimeter festival?

[Chris Ryan]

Of course, I think I'm more asking the same way that streaming music kind of made all music history flat because it was given equal kind of shelf space. Whether or not this sort of emergence of a very active social culture and interest in older films has maybe kind of taken new movies down a peg or two in terms of like the pecking order.

[Rob Harvilla]

I. I think as someone who teaches undergrads, right. I teach undergrad regularly at U of T. Toronto is a film going metropolis. We have a big film festival, you know, and big film community, big cinema tech in the light box. I think Chris asking is exactly right, actually. And that some of my, not all of them, it's students are all different people. But I think people are very sometimes hesitant to go see new stuff when there's the ability to catch up to older things. And if you go to repertory screenings in Toronto, where I spend a fair amount of time when I'm not like parenting or writing mean reviews, it's a lot of young people and they're much, much more interested in seeing things that are rare or seeing things that have been historically contextualized or things that have some kind of conceptual connection to now or thematic connection to now than just turning up for whatever is new. Like when I taught the film criticism seminar at U of T earlier this year, my students seemed much more interested in trying to write about and analyze and unpack old movies. Then the assignment were like, go see a new release. They're like, really now? That also meant I got two separate papers on the Beekeeper with Jason Statham which were very good reviews of that.

[Sean Fennasy]

You're about to get your third.

[Chris Ryan]

When I do my top five list.

[Rob Harvilla]

Of that movie, one of the most.

[Sean Fennasy]

Politically complicated movies of the year.

[Rob Harvilla]

It is great double bill with the, with the order, you know, be great. Great double bill with, with a lot of things. But I do think that, that, that, that Chris is kind of on to something. And I also know from knowing Sean, that you know your film history and know your like larger currents of film history and connections. Those are often brought to bear on this podcast, even though it is about new stuff.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, I, I think that you were right. I think I'm a little bit. I used to caution against this when I was a music criticism. I really didn't like what has happened to me, which is when someone was, was an active critic for a long time, was engaging with music that could be defined as youth culture and got, they got too old and they fell out of step with the modes of current creativity. And then a lot of their writing and criticism and experience with culture just seemed very angry about a kind of loss of their own youth. Yeah, and I'm very suspicious of that. And I try, it's one of the reasons why I try to give a lot of time to very mainstream successful things like Marvel movies like Hot Frosty. Like, I think it's worthwhile to understand why those things resonate with certain groups of people. And by the same token, I think there's always going to be very few genuinely great, awe inspiring movies. But it's important when they happen to put a big red circle around them and say, like, you know, like A Nora is not on my top five list, for example. But I think A Nora is a great movie and I think it's really exciting to be able to say, Shawn Baker's been doing this for almost 20 years. There's a lot to discover about what he does and what he means to the American cinema. And if you pay attention on a regular basis, the experience of Aunora will actually be that much deeper. You just have to keep paying attention. So if you backslide into I only watch Sorcerer now and like I watch Sorcerer is. My personality is a thing that has happened to like thousands of men in Los Angeles in the last 10 years. Literally thousands. And look, I fucking love Sorcerer. I'm in many ways one of those guys. But you can't be just that guy and be like, I love movies. You actually have to make the effort to see the kinds of films that Adam is describing and to also, at least for my purposes, you know, see the Wild Robot and take it seriously, you know, and make an effort to understand it and figure out where it fits in the constellation of movie making and Movie creativity. So I don't know what I'm trying to do is not fall out of step with movies the way I did with music. And when I started to feel it, I stepped away from music.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, no, I think I was really more asking whether or not this is a bubble conversation or not. I was just curious whether or not the time is a flat circle experience has come for cinema. And I think that there are elements of Letterbox that are amazing and the way that people can organize lists and share and like, for people to be like, oh, okay, like now I can go back through and like, I just can just. I just have a list of 200 spaghetti Westerns I can watch. And like, that's just awesome. That was like hard work 30 years ago it was. And now it's like I have 14 lists that I can cross check and make sure, like, well, just to circle.

[Sean Fennasy]

Back to that band splain conversation that you had with Yossi Adam. They were pointing out that once upon a time, if you really wanted to hear a British band that didn't have a US release strategy, you had to pay $12 for a two song, you know, ca single or CD single and have it imported to you. And how that, that, that rarity, that feeling of rarity created a sense of anticipation and excitement around things that is much harder now because of what you're describing. But, and look, nobody advocates harder for Letterbox than I do. I think it's an amazing platform. But one of the things that I think it does now that is super cool is when you open the app, the Substance has been among the top three logged movies on that app for like two months. The Substance being a successful film period, is an incredible long shot.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

You know, not a non American filmmaker, a star who has never has not led a major production in like 20 years, a movie starring almost entirely women, about women's experience in the world. And it's body horror. And that app, because of the fervor that it sometimes drives around a certain kind of a movie can help grow and sustain the success of certain kinds of films. And that is ultimately, you know, Universal was behind that movie and then punted it. But it's like that Mubi distributed that movie. So I still think it has an incredible power in that respect too. Not just for the here is my spaghetti westerns list.

[Chris Ryan]

Future you faces some big expectations, work.

[Sean Fennasy]

Out more, go to bed earlier, and.

[Chris Ryan]

Most importantly, make smart money decisions. Thankfully, today you has bank of America one place with tools and guidance to help balance tasks from budgeting to saving.

[Sean Fennasy]

So you can just be you with big plans.

[Chris Ryan]

Do more with a bank that asks.

[Sean Fennasy]

What would you like the power to do?

[Chris Ryan]

Explore our tips and [e-mail] FutureU.

[Sean Fennasy]

This is the sound of your ride home with dad after he caught you vaping. Awkward, isn't it? Most vapes contain seriously addictive levels of nicotine and disappointment. Know the real cost of vapes brought to you by the fda?

[Chris Ryan]

You can get the most important meal of the day any time of day. I'm Talking about the $5 big deal breakfast meal from Jack in the box, available all day and all night. A breakfast Jack with a freshly cracked egg, a hash brown and French toast sticks for five bucks. Sounds good for breakfast, lunch and dinner at Jack. Every bite's a big deal. Order Jack's five dollar big deal breakfast meal now.

[Sean Fennasy]

We could pontificate all day about what this year in movies means. Maybe it's better to just talk about the movies and talk about our lists. So we'll share five films, we've got some honorable mentions and then like I said, Amanda will share hers at the very end of the episode. Chris, why don't we start with you?

[Chris Ryan]

Okay. Number five, strange darling, J.T. muller's cat and mouse serial killer movie told in non linear fashion. Featured. I think my favorite performance of the year is Willa Fitzgerald as well. In case people haven't seen Strange Darling.

[Sean Fennasy]

As a young woman.

[Chris Ryan]

As a young woman and also features Kyle Gallner and Barbara Hershey and Ed Begley. This was a film that kind of hit me out of nowhere, has stuck with me, has some bones of the 90s indie cinema that I kind of was grown up, grew up with. So it's obviously like I'm already like speaking the language. But I thought that it looked incredible. It felt incredible. It was challenging in really interesting ways. I think that a bunch of the films that I have here felt very contemporary and felt very of the moment in a variety of different ways. And it's just a little bit difficult to talk about Strange Darling without spoiling it for people. So I will just implore them to see it if they haven't already. And it was one of the most thrilling experiences of the movies that I had this year.

[Sean Fennasy]

One thing I wanted to point out about this is that at the New Beverly tonight, Strange Darling is playing on a double feature with a film called Mademoiselle, which I was not familiar with. Adam, if you were familiar with it, please let me know.

[Rob Harvilla]

But it's, I haven't seen it But I've heard of it. Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

So it's Tony Richardson's follow up to the Loved One and Tom Jones, made in 66 in France, starring Jean Moreau. And here's the Log line. Jean Moreau delivers a sultry and powerful portrayal of a frustrated schoolteacher whose suppressed sexual desire leads her to commit devilish acts of destruction in this erotic tale of eccentric human behavior. This is the movie that the director J.T. mulliner and Giovanni Ribisi have said has most directly influenced the film Strange Darling. I watched it and I thought it was very interesting and very un. Tony Richardson and kind of a fascinating, pure arthouse movie. Anyhow, I like Strange Darling. Adam, what's your number five?

[Rob Harvilla]

Well, keeping in mind that when the list gets published Tuesday, I reserve the right to move it around, but I'm trying to give, I think, the most honest top 10 in terms of where it's at. So I'm going to say that my number five is Nickel Boys, a movie that may or may not pop up for. For you guys on your list.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, this is the only one that I didn't see that I wish I had seen by.

[Rob Harvilla]

By the aforementioned Ramel Ross. You know, there's a lot I want to say about it, but I'm going to write about it. And also I don't want to step on any future episodes about it. But just it's a really unique approach to literary adaptation. It is a completely cinematic translation of a literary medium. It has a use of point of view that I think is genuinely original and a couple of moments that stand out when that point of view between, let's say, two characters converges. It's just extraordinary. You know, this is a director who's just thinking through how do I do this material in a way that honors it but also changes it. I happen to see Ramel Ross in conversation in Toronto where we talked about, you know, being a point guard as well as being a filmmaker. He's a really nice guy and he. His approach to this, to adapting the Colson Whitehead novel is, I think it's ingenious, you know, and I think it's a movie that you don't want to risk saying too much about, not just because of narrative spoilers, but because the experience of watching it is very surprising. Usually prestige seasoned literary adaptations, even good ones, are not formally surprising. In fact, the whole point is they want to be formally accessible. So just for the way he plays with language without completely obscuring the history and the cultural relevance of the material, I think he did an amazing job. And I think that the best directing prize that he won from the New York Film Critics Circle is one of the most heartening prizes I've seen in a long time.

[Sean Fennasy]

I love this movie. It will come up later in our conversation and I think you'll find a lot to admire about it. You've been talking about it longer than anybody I know, actually. Had you read the novel? Is that why?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Okay. I would say it is faithful but wildly different.

[Chris Ryan]

That's cool. I can't wait to see it.

[Sean Fennasy]

My number five is a movie called Evil Does Not Exist. This is Hamaguchi's follow up to Drive My Car, a movie that has stuck with me pretty profoundly. I was thinking about this movie, Adam, when you were talking about how sometimes we get a little stuck on the December releases as the good movies. I have some December releases on my lineup. You know, Nickel Boys is a December release. But Evil Does Not Exist premiered some time ago, earlier this year. And it's been haunting me. And I was reminded of it because it feels not in conversation, but connected to another movie that I really liked this year that I was a little bit on an island with, which is Robert Zemeckis here. And I'm thinking about those two movies together because they're very much about place, pride of place, and what you can have and what other people think they deserve from a place. And Evil Does Not Exist is about a small fishing village in Japan that a kind of industrialized glamping company comes to and intends to build a campsite which will then have a meaningful ecological impact on the community that lives in this Japanese village. All non professional actors in this film. Hamaguchi, incredibly patient filmmaker, someone who's unafraid of mystery and interpretation. This movie has one of the most unusual and kind of confounding endings to a movie that I've seen in recent times. As with all of his movies, it has incredible music by Aiko Ishibashi. And I have only watched this movie once. And a lot of times when I make these lists, I feel it is imperative to see the movie a second time, to make sure that the feeling I had the first time is right or not right.

[Chris Ryan]

It's like watertight. Yeah, yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

And this is the rare case where I'm sort of like, I had a very special experience watching this movie and the way that it made me feel. And I almost don't want to sully that. But I also want to continue to understand what he was going for because it is quite complex. So I don't know when I'm going to see it again, but I'll probably buy it. And when I buy it and have a physical copy, that's when I'll do it. But I adore this movie and I adore here too, for somewhat similar reasons.

[Rob Harvilla]

They're both in my top 10, though not in my top five. And just a Second with Sean saying Evil Does Not Exist is exactly the sort of movie that people who might look for more mainstream titles on this list would be well advised to check out. Not least of all because it has major horror movie vibes. While not being a horror movie, the score, the sense of atmosphere is quite frightening. And if anyone is fans of Kiyoshi Kurosawa, who is one of the world's great directors and who actually made three great movies this year, none of which are eligible for my list for different reasons, but three great movies by Kyoshi Kurosawa. Hamaguchi was his student. You know, he was. He was Hamaguchi's film instructor. And there's Kurosawa ness in this movie for sure. Great movie.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay, Chris, number four, do you want to. When we have overlap, do you want to just address them separately?

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Number four for me is the Brutalist, which I got to see with you last week and lived up to all my expectations. Amazing cinematic experience. Like when people talk about four quadrants, this one hit the quadrants that, like, are actually what you care about with movies, which is like sound, image, performance and writing. And I was mesmerized by it. It felt like an event. It felt like someone reaching for greatness in a way that you don't see directors do that often anymore. And really the story itself is actually a little bit of a surprise to me. You could say that it's a guy trying to cram Godfather 1 and 2 into one movie. And that sometimes has loosened loose ends or uncomfortable moments, but was completely blown away by the story of this guy who comes to America as a refugee and rises, but not too far in the world of architecture in Pennsylvania and the post war era.

[Sean Fennasy]

I'm very fond of the Brutalist. It'll come up again. Adam is a little bit less fond of this movie. I think we're gonna. Hopefully we'll have a spirited conversation about the Brutalist sometime soon on the podcast.

[Rob Harvilla]

But let's talk about it in time. I'm writing about it for the site. Let's leave it for now.

[Sean Fennasy]

Okay, Adam, number four.

[Rob Harvilla]

Number four is a movie called the Beast by Bertrand Bonello. This is another movie that is Very worth seeking out if the title is not immediately recognizable to you. This, for me is. I mean, everything Chris said about the ambition and craft of the Brutalist is true, by the way. I mean, that's a movie that is going for a lot. This is a movie that's going for a lot in a different way. Brutalist is chasing Coppola. I think Benello is kind of chasing Lynch. He's chasing a lot of really kind of conceptual, melancholy, sci fi. It's a movie that has three timelines. Past, present, future, three performances each by Lea Seydoux and George MacKay. They may or may not be the same characters in each timeline. They may be reincarnations, they may be astral projections. I think Benello is the real deal. Every movie of his is interesting. It's often genre adjacent and horror adjacent. Not everything he does works. I'm tired of movies where everything works. I like movies where things kind of don't work. So the stuff that works is extraordinary. I like that parts of this movie feel like Titanic. I like that parts of this movie feel like Minority Reports. I like that parts of this movie feel like Mulholland Drive. I like everything about it. And I think that it's the movie I saw at TIFF last year that I've wanted to rewatch at least other than one other movie on my list. The movie that I felt inclined to rewatch the most. And yet I haven't because I don't want to spoil that first experience a little bit. Like what Sean was saying about evil does not exist. I loved my first experience of the Beast and I even wrote about it for Film comment. And they were like, do you want a screen or do you want to look at it again? And I'm like, no, let's. I just. I remember seeing it at TIFF and some guy walked out. There were a lot of walkouts at this movie, which is often a very good sign, you know. And there's this scene where like Lea Seydoux is like floating naked in a. A tub of black goo and a robot. It's like you need to go to a nightclub and it's going to be the year 1982. And a guy walked out. I'm like, what are you doing? Where are you going? What possible better thing do you have to do right now than see where this is going? So shout out to Bertrand Bonello. He's a real one. He's a really good director, I think.

[Sean Fennasy]

Where are you at on David Lynch? I don't know if we've Ever had that conversation.

[Chris Ryan]

Massive Twin Peaks fan. Massive Mulholland Drive fan. And then kind of up and down with other stuff.

[Sean Fennasy]

Okay.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

I would be curious to know what you think of this movie. I'm of the camp that what works is remarkable and what doesn't work holds me back from loving it the same way that Adam does. But I get exactly what he's saying. We're sort of forgiving of our favorites a lot of times too, you know, and the messiness sometimes is an adventure that a tightly constructed movie maybe doesn't give you.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

So I get it. I fully relate to what you're saying. My number four is a tightly constructed adventure. It's called Dune Part two.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Sean Fennasy]

Which I don't know that I would have thought for sure would have ended up on my list when I first saw it, because I was like, we're gonna. It's gonna be a great movie year. It's March and Dune Part two hit. And as I look back, I'm always fond of trying to find one event style film to place into my list because it is one of my favorite types of movie experiences to have is to be amongst a big crowd of common moviegoers and to love a movie.

[Chris Ryan]

Together because Deadpool and Wolverine's number one for you. So, like, let's not spoil things.

[Sean Fennasy]

Please keep them, you know, with some bated breath there. But Dune Part 2, I think, is as close as we got to that this year. It is the second, but perhaps not conclusive installment in the Denis Villeneuve adaptation of the Herbert novel. I thought this was like movie synchronicity at its finest. Like a person with a very strong point of view on a piece of literature who knows how to make. Wow. Moments with arguably the most stacked young movie star cast in recent memory. I actually could not think of a comp where we're kind of getting into Dazed and Confused territory here where they. You know, Linklater had foresight about people who are going to be famous, but this movie brings together what feels like a next generation in a lot of ways, to tell a very old kind of story with a very messianic kind of structure. But the moment very early on in the film where you see the sort of rival Harkonnen soldiers gliding through the sky to get to the top of a mountain, I was like, I have not seen that, and I don't know what this is. And I feel like I'm in safe hands with a genuinely creative artisan and visionary is a strong phrase. And I'm not Sure. If I necessarily believe that Villeneuve is a visionary. But I think he's an amazing movie maker, and this is an amazing feeling movie. So number four.

[Chris Ryan]

Also just really awesome to see a blockbuster that ends on a tough note.

[Sean Fennasy]

Complicated.

[Chris Ryan]

We don't get tons of those anymore, so it's nice. There's no Michael Caine being like, you did it, Paul Atreides. It ends, and you're just like, fuck, man. Like, that was a real choice he made.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah. Yeah. I really like it. Okay, Number three. Cr.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay. Anora. Sean Baker's film we've referenced a couple of times in this podcast. I haven't really gotten a chance to talk about it here. I just really cared about what happened to this person. I really, really did. It's basically three movies in one. It's a Cinderella story in the beginning. There's a middle section that's. That's basically after hours. And then there's this sort of complicated relationship dramedy that happens at the end, but throughout it, I was just like, I don't feel like I've ever seen. It's not that I've never seen a character like this, but I just was like, I really, really care what happens to this woman. And that's all due credit to Mikey Madison for that. I think it's a really, really, really special performance. This from the opening music cue in the beginning as you glide through the strip club on a pan. Like, you're just like, I'm in. This guy knows exactly how he wants this movie to sound, exactly how this movie should look, should feel. To go from that nightclub to her small apartment where she forgets to bring home the milk. You're just so enmeshed in the highs and lows of this character's life. And then that just rollercoaster continues throughout the film. I thought I left it with a gut punch, thinking a lot about what the end of the film meant. I love that people are arguing about that. That's kind of a theme of some of the films that I picked as films, I think are going to be very divisive and people are going to have a lot of different opinions about. But I was just mesmerized by this whole thing.

[Sean Fennasy]

Is Enora on your list, Adam?

[Rob Harvilla]

No. No, it's not. There's a lot of things about it that are very good. I think Sean Baker's a really good filmmaker. There's also things about this film that don't land for me. I will say to Chris's point, because I always love everything Chris has To say and where everyone comes from. No, I mean it like it is a movie to talk about because probably at TIFF last year, some of those interesting chats I had with other critics and with friends working backwards, you know, was about the upshot of that last scene or about the depiction of sex work or about the culture clash within or the idea of extreme wealth. I will say that Sean Baker tends to make very similar plots. It's just interesting to see as he's gotten more successful, it's leveled up in terms of the kind of wealth and privilege that's kind of put on the screen. It's not a bad thing. The movie, it reminds me of. I don't like it as much, but saying that it reminds me of it as a compliment. It reminds me of uncut gems, both in the sense that it is like a mad cap realistic screwball thriller movie, and also that it is by far the biggest movie that the person associated with it is made. So with the Safdie is the question, like, where do they go from here? Is still open. I don't know where else Shawn Baker goes because he just won the Palme d'or and is making a lot of money and Oscar nominations for this movie. It's not a criticism. It's just like, what do we do? Because he's a real indie hero filmmaker.

[Sean Fennasy]

For me, I think, yeah, when we did our episode about it, it's not on my list, but I said, I think that's a culmination of all of his themes and maybe that elevation of wealth that you're talking about as a part of that. And I think that is absolutely a neat pairing with uncut gems because these are both movies about people who have incredible desire that is unexamined. And I think that our own. We're meant to think about ourselves in that respect and why we want these things.

[Chris Ryan]

They're both movies also that use time in a really wise way. You know, like time seems to last forever in the first act of a Nora. It seems to go by in a blink of an eye in the second, and then in the third, it's kind of this ellipsis of like, where are we going next?

[Sean Fennasy]

Dragged out. Yeah, yeah. Very purposefully. The fall is always a little bit more painful. Okay. Adam number three.

[Rob Harvilla]

My number three is very similar to Anora in that it is a gig economy screwball comedy. The female protagonist sort of in the ruins of European communism, which is do not expect too much from the end of the world, which I would also hugely recommend to anyone. Who's listening to this or watches and saying, I don't know what that is. Go find out what it is. It is fucking hilarious movie. It is about a woman driving through Bucharest. She basically is working for a company that makes work safety psas. From the point of view of like, don't get hurt. You know, it's like. It's like looking for people who will sort of give testimonials about how it's not really their fault. There is a cameo from Nina Haas as the, I think the great granddaughter of Goethe. There's a cameo by Uwe Bol as himself. There's probably the worst language of any movie ever since Goodfellas. The slur per moment ratio or the expletive per moment ratio is often the charts and it's hilarious. It's a movie about social collapse and late capitalism and just the absolute hostility that vibrates from this character who half the time is pretending to be Andrew Tate using a face filter. The. The female protagonist has this kind of alter ego she posts to Instagram with, where she just has Andrew Tate's face and just vents her spleen about the world. And then it culminates. I'm going to write about this too. When we do shots of the year, it has the greatest long take I've seen in years. A 40 minute long take which is not about camera movement. It is just about pure duration. It's a shot that you could have taken in 1895. And it is also a better Bob Dylan movie than a complete unknown. The End of Do Not Expect to Enter the End of the World is a parody of the Subterranean Homesick Blues video. Except the idea is you add the words in post because it's green screen cards. It's the best comedy of the year and a movie that, even though it's long, it feels like it's about two seconds long to me.

[Sean Fennasy]

I like this movie. It's a good pick. Okay, my number three is Challengers. Challengers and Dune. Coming out so close together again was a sensation of like, we are. We are truly back. We are in incredible hands. And Guadagnino, I think resisting the impulse to make something so commercial for so long, I found fascinating because you could always sense right underneath the surface as a very kinetic filmmaker and somebody who, if he picked up the pace, had a chance to do something extremely cool. This is a very simple, seeming soap operatic story, a love triangle on the surface, a sports movie on the surface that I think is also about incredible, unquenchable passion for victory that exists Inside some people. And in this case, it is in the character portrayed by Zendaya. And she is using everyone around her to supplement her desire and her ambition.

[Chris Ryan]

Because her body will cooperate.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yes. And her willingness to use other people and to sublimate, you know, certain feelings in order to get where she wants to go. And it's also just like a hilarious and relentlessly propulsive story about what happens to everyone who gets in her way. Also just features one of my five favorite performances of the year, which is Josh O'Connor as this sort of weaselly bastard who won't ever get out of her way and continues to place himself right in front of her. I really, really loved this movie. I think that this is. It has more of a divisive movie than I think I imagined when I first saw it, and I first saw it in 2023. And when I saw it, I was like, God damn the score alone. The Atticus Ross and Trent Reznor score, and the inspired decision to basically put a four on the floor dance beat behind tennis. Yeah. In 70% of the movie. Just a relentless use of music as well is just so inspired to me. And I've seen this movie three times now. I really, really love it. It's a good meeting point, I think, for me and Amanda and our interest on the show. So as I look down the list, there's a lot of stuff I did like. There were some movies that maybe could have been swapped into here, but I'm not sure if I ever had quite so much fun at the movies as I had at Challengers. So that's my number three. Okay. Number two, Chris.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm gonna go with Rebel Ridge, Jeremy Saulnier's film about a martial arts instructor who comes to a small Southern town to bail his cousin out of jail and everything that goes wrong from there. It's about the corrosive forces of local law enforcement, forced to. Not forced to, but engaging in this thing called civil asset forfeiture. Taking people's property, their money, their time, their freedom for essentially financial benefit. But it also is just like a movie that could have come out in 1983 and starred Chuck Norris. It is made, though, with such care and such excellence in scenes that you are just like, this is just a transition scene to get him from one part of a riverbed to a bridge. You're like, how the hell did he do that? Why did he take so much time to do it that way? But it pays off. It's just watching someone who really still cares about making really good Genre films, and that's excellent. It's kind of a triumph that this film is as good as it is, given how the reshoots and the delays, they went under. And then on top of all of that, aside from really cool performances from Don Johnson, who's reliably awesome anyway, and Emory Cohen and Anna Sophia Robb, Aaron Pierre just becomes a movie star in this movie. And so if you didn't know that already from watching Underground Railroad, you will know it from watching Rebel Ridge. It was just one of the most satisfying films I've seen all year. Watched it like two or three times.

[Sean Fennasy]

Great movie. On my honorable mentions, for sure.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's terrific movie. Aaron Pierre is fantastic, and it's really good. Adam number two, we probably can. We probably don't have to talk about it. We did a whole pod on it. Juror number two, look at you.

[Chris Ryan]

Hey.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, you know, people. People may have heard us.

[Chris Ryan]

You saw that forerunner yet, brother?

[Rob Harvilla]

You saw the forerunner, Benny? No, I mean, I really love talking about it with Sean. That was a fun chat. I do think there is a little urgency around this movie and critics rallying around it. There's a sort of like, white knighting of Clint Eastwood who can take care of himself, but still. And it is a movie. Remember we talked about that idea of distracted viewing. You know what the common thing people have been texting about this movie with me is? They're like, I didn't look at my phone. It is a great. You can't look at your phone movie because it is told in such a precise, measured, classical, pressurized way. And again, what an amazing ending. That last scene, which I wrote about. So I won't go on about it here. That's an extraordinary ending in every way. The way it's written, the way it's shot, the way it's acted.

[Sean Fennasy]

We haven't talked about it.

[Chris Ryan]

We haven't.

[Sean Fennasy]

What'd you think?

[Chris Ryan]

It was quite good. Yeah, it was quite good.

[Sean Fennasy]

Some flaws.

[Chris Ryan]

I wish I could do the Pepsi Coke taste test of not knowing who directed that film and know how I would have felt about it.

[Sean Fennasy]

Really?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Cause I think I went into it with a lot of, like, God, Clint, late style. Like, you guys need to understand the mastery at work here. And so I went in with, like, kind of like, looking for that when I was watching it. I think it's fair to say that it's also a very procedural kind of, like, for as much like mysticism as might be attached to it. It's kind of a bare bones, like, Showtime movie of the week kind of movie in some ways.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah. I think the kinds of movies that I thought about when I was watching it, and I think we talked about this a little bit Adam when we did the episode. But, you know, that period where he makes Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil and True Crime and Blood Work, and he's working through genre adaptation, that is a very comfy period of movies for me personally. You know, that sort of like, 96 through 2003 era where he's like, semi mailing it in. But him semi mailing it in is so much better than everybody. And for me, Juror number two distinguishes itself because it is like a big moral gray cloak over his questioning of institutions for the last 15, 20 years in his films. And I love that about it. And I echo Adam's sentiments about the ending, which I just think is like, I was. I don't know, floored is the wrong word because it's sort of inconclusive in some ways, but just, like, knocked out. Just like, took my breath away. So. Great pick, Adam. I like it. My number two is a movie that Adam also has on his list, which is Nickel Boys, which I think both formally, intellectually, and emotionally and spiritually is just, like, wildly deep and new and exciting and is the kind of movie. This is why, to go back to your question earlier about, like, the Sorcerer Boys, you know, like, this is why I'm doing the show, is to discover a movie like this at a film festival and to tell people to watch it.

[Chris Ryan]

And the Beekeeper too.

[Sean Fennasy]

And the Bee. Well, I do. I do like promoting movies like the Beekeeper as well. Those two films have a lot to say to each other politically. Nickel Boys and the Beekeepers. You know, Nickel Boys is because of its decision to remove perspective and amplify perspective at the same time, I think really confronts the viewer about what they're willing to tolerate in a narrative style film. In addition to that, it has something in common with my number one movie in terms of the use of archival footage that I find to be fascinating and in the wrong hands, could go very badly. But in both cases, I think is an amazing choice. And I think the film gets into this is so pretentious. But like legitimately abstract poetry, in the final 20 minutes of the film where you are, like, levitating, you are being lifted off of your feet or off of your ass while you're watching the movie because it's so deep now. I saw it with a bunch of friends at Telluride who I see a lot of Movies with. And half of them were just like, what the fuck was that? And I think a lot of people will watch Nickel Boys and have the same feeling. And frankly, if you watch it in your house, like on Amazon, it's probably going to seem even more strange. But it just knocked me out and I'm very excited about Ramel Ross as a filmmaker. So that's my number two. Okay, Chris, number one. I love what you're doing here.

[Chris Ryan]

My number one is Civil War. So Alex Garland's movie from earlier in this year featuring Kirsten Dunstan, Cailee Spaeny and Wagner Mora as journalists who are covering the fall of a, I suppose fascistic or at least third term president. I say suppose because a lot of people took a lot of issues with the lack of clarity and lack of world building that went into this very straightforward Heart of Darkness style. Up the river, but just down the Pennsylvania Turnpike type movie. I found that the imagery from this movie stuck with me. Yes. The ideas from this movie stuck with me. Even though I know it's been criticized for having no ideas whatsoever. Amanda. But I keep thinking about it and it's a fucking heavyweight title contender of a piece of filmmaking. And I'm not actually always like, Alex Garland can do no wrong. I definitely have issues with some of his films. I think they get really sloppy in places. I think sometimes he gets enamored with the things that I'm not particularly interested in. This movie was not that I was absolutely gripping my armrests for the entirety of this film. It was sonically and visually overwhelming. And I don't know, it's an interesting conversation to have to ask people whether or not their feelings about this movie have changed since the election. I probably can't squeeze it in here, but I did think about it in different ways.

[Sean Fennasy]

You're saving it for jmo?

[Chris Ryan]

I'm saving it for jmo. I'm saving it for my letterbox livestream. But yeah, that's my number one. Did you hate this movie?

[Rob Harvilla]

No, I wrote about it. I didn't hate it. I didn't like it very much. The last thing that you said about I wonder if people's feelings about the movie have changed. It's partially what I resisted about it, which is, among other things, it felt opportunistic.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Rob Harvilla]

But I suppose it is a very thin line because I always, again, respect what Chris says. It's a thin line between opportunism and like prescience. Right. He's not making a movie about the wrong thing. So my issue is Kind of with the filmmaking itself, but that's, that's, that's, that's subjective and I'm not really a Garland fan. There's some good scenes in it and the one scene performance by what's his. By. By Jesse Plemons, obviously very memorable and not just because it's been memed a lot. You know, that's a, that's a memorable little performance. He's very good.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah. I mean, I really love this movie and I had a very similar experience that you did, and I rewatched it right before the election and I think I liked it a little bit less but felt like it was, it was better. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like I am actually in the church of Garland and I love his movies and I love the way that he thinks and I like his novels quite a bit. And I'm so excited that he is doing another 28 movie with zombie movie with Danny Boyle and some other movie Warfare.

[Rob Harvilla]

Right.

[Sean Fennasy]

He's making this movie Warfare with Ray Mendoza, who is the consultant on some of the military action in Civil War. And it's a friend of mine who works in the business was like, this is going to be the best movie of the year next year. I'm fully in the, in the cult and I think it's prescience and my sense that it will be very warmly understood long term. Yeah. Part of. As part kind of like undid me a little bit. But, you know, I really like it. It's kind of like. Right. It's literally, I think a number six for me right now. So it's a good pick. Okay, Adam, you've gotten a number one slot.

[Rob Harvilla]

I wanted to be a surprise when I published the list, but I've also got to be consistent. Right. I can't not mention it then have it be number one. I went with Pascal Plants film Red Rooms, thought about this as well, which is a French. French Canadian film. And what I'm going to say about it as a mea culpa is I didn't think it worked the first time. And letterboxd, which we've talked about for this entire podcast. You can find it there. Someone shared it the other day were like, oh, there's some really good thoughts on Red Room by Adam. I'm like, no, I disagree with myself. And I wrote about the film, wrote about the film for a MUBI later and said, I think it's really good and I think it's better than really good. I think it's an amazing film and I'm really loath for spoilers. I think spoilers are essential to, like, written, serious criticism. But when you're trying to introduce people to a movie, you don't want to say too much. Interesting companion piece to juror number two in that it is a courtroom drama that is not really a courtroom drama at all. It has extraordinary courtroom sequence for about 10 minutes, and then it's not about that. It's about a woman who I'm hesitant how much to say, a vested interest in the trial of a ser. Of an accused serial killer. And the ways that she pursues this interest, which is kind of like investigative journalism and kind of like obsessive fandom and maybe something else constantly surprised me. I have not seen a movie. We see movies for a living to greater, lesser degrees. All of us. Right. We try not to be cynical. I think Sean does a great job of not being cynical. I don't. I do a less good job of not being cynical. I had no idea what this character was capable of. That's rare. I don't just mean that a movie is unpredictable. Movies can be twisted. That's easy to do. But I'm like, who is this person? What the hell is she thinking and doing? And why is she doing this? And the performance by this French Canadian actress, Juliette Garrippe. I think it's an all timer. I mean, I don't know if the movie's an all timer. I like it a lot, obviously, because I'm putting it at number one. She's unbelievable. And it's a movie that I think for fans of the pod, who like a very obscure director none of us have ever talked about named David Fincher, might want to watch because it has the Fincher juice.

[Chris Ryan]

That was my info for. It was like, this is really good Fincher methadone.

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Really a movie in its own right, obviously.

[Rob Harvilla]

Really good Fincher methadone. And this performance, a lot of it is in close up. The close ups are often nightmare fuel. A few critics have described this movie as being as scary as something that is not a horror movie can be in terms of. And it all comes back to this idea of what this character is capable of and why she is doing these things. And I love the idea of a movie about a character who knows exactly what she's doing and maybe not why or has no idea what she's doing, you know, but is super competent in a kind of Stieg Larsson, Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. Way great movie number one.

[Sean Fennasy]

We've talked about how quite a bit over the last Couple of years. Many great filmmakers are resistant to making contemporary set stories because of the way that they resolve some of the natural plotting that comes from telling a story in the past because of cell phones and technology and what have you. This is an incredibly contemporary movie. Red Rooms. And there's a sequence in a bedroom near the end of the movie that is the most like, stunning portrait of a modern mentality that I've ever seen. I won't say anything more about it, but I know I relate deeply to the way that you're describing the. Like, what? She's. What. What is she. She's now she's doing what? Like. And to reiterate, like sick fucks, you know, this is like a trio of guys who are into some gnarly shit.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's. And to reiterate, for anyone who's now curious about seeing the movie, this is not incoherence. It's sort of a movie about a completely self divided moment. Because everything that Sean said about the way I usually. When movies are like, we're about the way we live now, it usually means they're bad, you know, but this is a movie about screens and prisms and about self curation and like how people present themselves in private versus public and absolutely about just like interacting with and interfacing with AI. And it does it all within a genre framework because Fincher, when he's really good, colors inside the lines of genre. He just colors vividly. You know, Pascal Plant is not a household name like that. But the way that this movie is directed, I hope it does good things for him in a good way. I hope it means he gets to make more movies that are as uncompromised as this, as opposed to, you know, leveling up to making some horror remake in the States or something. But, you know, really good film.

[Sean Fennasy]

That's a good segue to my number one, which is the brutalist. And I will. I will, boys. I will echo Chris's feelings about the film. I've seen it twice. And now that I know more about the movie, I think that that has probably infiltrated even more of my appreciation. And what you're saying about Pascal Plante and the way that he made Red Rooms, Adam, I think resonates to this conversation too, because this is someone who I hope gets to make more movies and gets more and more freedom. There's something fascinating about the perilous being made for such a small sum because it is such a big movie and it is such an extraordinary accomplishment and a sweeping movie and it's not just its length, but its scope that is so thrilling. The performances, I think, in this movie are amazing. And I don't. While I do understand the concern that it is a very transparent and to some desperate grasp for greatness, I would rather have that than settling for mediocrity, settling for something small, settling for something that is cheap or cynical. And this is like, to me, I see no cynicism in this movie. I see no cynicism in the ambition to make something big and great. And it's evident to me, like, what some of the inspirations are. And I think that Godfather is there and I think the American productions, the moral fables of George Stevens are there. And I think Visconti movies are there. And Bergman and I think, yeah, 1900 is there.

[Rob Harvilla]

Like I sequences from Paul Thomas Anderson.

[Sean Fennasy]

Movies with the Master is vividly on the surface of this movie.

[Rob Harvilla]

Vividly on the surface of this movie.

[Sean Fennasy]

No question about it. You know what? All of those movies I just mentioned are phenomenal. They are among the best pieces of art that have been made in the last hundred years. And trying to conjure that feeling that those movies give us is why I'm doing this is exactly why I'm doing this. So, you know, we'll talk about a lot more about the movie. And most people have not had the chance to see it yet. And I am excited. I'm looking forward to the debate. I am looking forward to the division, to quote your list, because I just was so knocked out. And seeing it again with you is fun too, because not only did we get a chance to talk about it, but I got a chance to kind of wrap my arms around my expectations versus the actualization. Yeah, of course. And we made a lot of jokes about this movie before it came out. And I had been desperate for a big, important seeming film all year. And then you come to see the movie and it's just like, just deathly serious story about alienation and assimilation and capitalism and pain and physical deterioration and how you and, you know, patrons versus artists and so many big ideas. Some are gonna say too many ideas, that's fine. But I love this movie and I hope a lot of people go to see it. And I hope Brady Courbet gets to make a lot more movies. Honorable mentions.

[Chris Ryan]

I'll just rattle some off. Right. We don't have to spend a ton of time on them. But the one movie that I was like this was still last night trying to figure out whether it was going on is I saw the TV glow.

[Sean Fennasy]

I just rewatched it last night.

[Chris Ryan]

Thought it's just an extraordinary film. A couple others, Snack Shack, a real pain. And then a complete unknown conclave and in a violent nature.

[Sean Fennasy]

Okay, Adam, you want to cite some?

[Rob Harvilla]

Yeah, I want to give a shout out. Someone whose movie I probably can't write about because she's a friend. But Brett Stories documentary Union, which is about the unionization of an Amazon factory. This is courageous political filmmaking, you know that because people are hesitant to distribute it. It's a really good film. It made the New York Times top 10 list and got a big feature written about it in the New Yorker. Big contrast with Nomadland in that they did not want to film inside Amazon. You know, it's a really interesting companion piece to Nomadland. Brett Story kept her cameras outside and used cell phone footage that was snuck into the union meetings. So that's great. To me, it's kind of co authored film. I mean, the movie that I can't put on the list because it's not a feature is Chime by Kiyoshi Kurosawa, who is I mentioned before, best horror movie of the year. And it's 45 minutes long. And I don't want to steal Sean's thunder, but I want to tee it up for him. I'm going to throw Sean a lob here and I'm going to say much to the consternation of my actual editor here at Ringer and with a couple of my friends looking at me like I'm a psycho, I put here on my top 10 list. In the end, I kicked off two or three other movies that I'm more certain are actually good for something like Here, which I wrote about for a different publication. Was very happy with that piece. That movie's bananas. That movie is bananas. And thinking about it and deconstructing it is necessary.

[Sean Fennasy]

I think that's Here is my the Beast in that I know that there are things about it that do not work and I do not care because what does work about it is so powerful to me. And the thing. I'll just pitch this to you guys. I'm putting you on the spot by asking you this. I've asked a few friends this before. Can you name me what's the last movie made by a movie star like Tom Hanks that is about the erosion of the middle class and the impossibility of the American dream.

[Rob Harvilla]

Deadpool and Wolverine. Ryan Radford.

[Sean Fennasy]

I mean, that's the thing is that that is what movie stars do in 2024. Movie stars don't make movies like here and Tom Hanks and Robert Zemeckis and is he absolutely boomer fied and obsessed with the past and obsessed with the own impossibility of his, of the life that came before him in his parents world? Yes, all that stuff is true. All the criticisms are true. I am willing to let them go. But the actual act of getting Sony Pictures to adapt this graphic novel about the arc of time and what is lost in that time and how it affects individuals is fucking deep, man. That's really deep. And it's easy to make fun of the movie because they de age Tom Hanks or whatever, but I think if you really make an effort to approach it sincerely, it's a meaningful movie. So thank you for putting it on your list, Adam. I appreciate it.

[Rob Harvilla]

It's the great double bill this year with Megalopolis. Because with Megalopolis there's no tension. He just financed it himself. So the movie is whatever it is on Coppola's own terms for Zemeckis to make that movie when a studio is footing the bill and for it still to be on his terms like that, that's what makes it an interesting double bill with the brutalist. Right. Like they're, they're, they're, they're very much both movies. But how much control can you exert while you're being patronized? I don't mean made fun of patronizing, literally being subsidized to make this thing. And I'm sure people who work for the studio wouldn't want to hear this. It's great that here is going to lose so much money because that's what cult reclamation is made of. I wrote a book about Showgirls, man. This is how it happens. You need to have the nuclear blast site of negative consensus for people to go look at something else. So when they see a movie that is about like American self interest and colonization and the arc of the universe bending towards McDonald's with the. And I'm not going to spoil it, but anyone who watches that movie, please think about where the last shot ends up, not just where it finally goes when the camera moves. Like whose position we're looking at the frame now from at the end with the stupid Benjamin Button hummingbird winking at everybody like that. That movie is kind of evil and kind of great. And in 15 or 20 years people are going to say how did everybody miss thinking this was interesting at least.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yes, here will be heard from again. And I think it's also an amazing pairing with Forrest Gump Robert Zemeckis slight, less embittered version of a piece about the arc of time passing in America. Okay, honorable mentions for me. You guys mentioned a bunch of movies that would be on Civil War. Nora I wanted to give a shout out to a movie that I'll spend maybe a little bit more time on in a couple of weeks that I just saw called Soundtrack to a Coup d'which, is an unbelievable documentary that unlike one I've ever seen before. Chris, are you familiar with this movie at all? Not it is essentially told entirely through archival footage, jazz music and text on cards. It's about the relationship between American black music and Lumumba and the Congo in 1960 and the sort of radicalized politics of a new Africa in the middle of the 20th century and the way that the CIA may or may not have used some of the musicians who traveled to Africa during that time to implement Force and Power. Two and a half hour movie so dense as to be overwhelming. You have to be fully engaged because there is a lot of reading involved, but because of the way that it is scored by Max Roach and Ella Fitzgerald and Dizzy Gillespie and on Charles Mingus on and on and on. Coltrane makes an appearance in the film. Miles Davis makes an appearance. It's like going down the big slope on a roller coaster and never stopping. So fascinating movie that I hope more people get a chance to see. I think it's only in theaters now and not available on vod, but that's Soundtrack to a coup d'etat. I had Red Rooms on my list. I had the First Omen on my list, which is of course a horror movie that I liked quite a bit that I've talked about quite a bit on the show already. That Rebel Ridge, you know, I think I should give a shout out to Furiosa, which, you know, we've been tough on this year. But when I look at my list, it still is like 13 or 14. It's not. Have you gone back to I've only seen it. I've seen it twice in theaters twice. I have not watched it at home, but I will do that. And then the last one I wanted to mention is A Different man, which had a surprise win at the Gothams last week for Best Picture. This is Aaron Schimberg's movie starring Sebastian Stan and Adam Pearson. And I did talk to Sebastian Stan at length about the movie on the show, but I never really devoted any time to discussing the movie, which is about a man who's born with a condition that disfigures his face and that he has a remarkable surgery that makes his face look like Sebastian Stan's face. And he seeks out an opportunity to become an actor and play a man who has the condition that play is written by a woman that he has fallen in love with who lives in his apartment building. Very convoluted dark comedy. Very, very black satire of self worth and self image that features Adam Pearson's bright, jovial, exuberant spirit in the center of it.

[Chris Ryan]

Really enjoying Sebastian Stan's somewhat post MCU moment.

[Sean Fennasy]

Just very cool.

[Chris Ryan]

I know he's still in it.

[Sean Fennasy]

Yeah, I was very mixed on the Apprentice, but not at all mixed on him and Jeremy Strong in the Apprentice and people should check out a different man. It's on VOD right now. I think that's it. Should we throw to a man? Any guesses on what's on a man's list?

[Chris Ryan]

Civil War?

[Sean Fennasy]

No. Adam, do you have any guesses?

[Rob Harvilla]

No, I just look forward to hearing it.

[Sean Fennasy]

I know challengers will be there. I do know that Amanda has seen Wicked. Do we think Wicked will be on her list?

[Chris Ryan]

I think Nora will be on her list.

[Sean Fennasy]

Uh huh. Yeah, I think you're right. But maybe not. No Wicked.

[Chris Ryan]

I only saw the Instagram story that was like, okay, like.

[Sean Fennasy]

So, Adam, what do you think? Will Amanda select Wicked for her top five?

[Rob Harvilla]

No, no, Amanda will not select Wicked for her top five, but she will have. Amanda will have something to say about you saying she would select Wicked for her top five.

[Sean Fennasy]

I know. I mean, I'm almost certain she will not. All right, let's go to Amanda now.

[Amanda Dobbins]

Hi, everyone. It's me, movie mom, AKA Amanda Dobbins. That's my legal name. It is Wednesday night. Everyone else in my home is asleep. I'm in my pajamas. And I'm here to tell you briefly about my favorite movies of the year. And I say favorite and not best because I haven't seen everything. As you know, I have been on leave since October. Just kind of. It's just the prestige season, definitely the fancy movie season of the year. And so I haven't seen a lot of what I suspect will be at the top of at least Sean's lists. Respectfully, I haven't seen the Brutalist. Okay, I've seen your memes, but I haven't seen the Brutalist. I haven't seen A Complete Unknown. I haven't seen Nickel Boys. I haven't seen the Piano Lesson. I haven't seen September 5th. I haven't seen Baby Girl, though. I am going next week And I'm very excited. So this can't be authoritative. I, you know, I have great respect for list making and I'm not going to be out here proclaiming the best when I haven't seen everything. But I have seen a lot and I do have some favorites. So I made a very, very quirky top five, and it's really a top seven because there are no rules when it's just me alone talking into my phone. But here they are. Number five is it's two movies. It is the Beekeeper, the Jason Statham David Ayer movie that came out in January 2024, and Lonely Planet, the Netflix film written and directed by Susanna Grant, starring Laura Dern and Liam Hemsworth. If you can't tell by the pairing, this is the junk category, the transcendent garbage. I haven't revisited the Beekeeper since the election and I don't plan to, but I remember enjoying it at the time. And Lowly Planet really got me through a dark three days in early October because it took me three days to watch it. If you have seen it, I'll just say to you, swing route. And if not, check it out. It's on Netflix. You know, what else are you doing? Okay, number four, the Bike Riders, the Jeff Nichols film starring Jodie Comer, Tom Hardy, and yes, Austin Butler. Mike Shannon Boyd Holbrook. Hi, Chris, how are you? We podcasted about this over the summer and I remember, I believe it was Sean, but maybe it was Chris saying, I really like this movie, but I don't think it's going to be on my top five list at the end of the year. Guess what? It's on mine. Okay, number three, the Glen Powell special, Twisters and Hitman. Dune two is not on my list because I figure that I, Chris and Sean, at least have it covered. Adam, I know how you feel about Denis Villeneuve. So Twisters is my blockbuster of the year. Aside from Dune 2, which is very, very good and should be nominated for a lot of Oscars like Get Off My Back. Twisters had the fun summer and actually released in the summer. Like, you know, we used to build things in this country sort of vibe Hitman, which is a the best movie that I saw on Netflix this year, probably delightful Richard Linklater movie co written with Glenn Powell. And it occurs to me now that this would have been a really great adult Halloween costume. I wasn't really around for that. Did people go around as all the hitmen? I hope someone did. I hope that you guys had a great group costume and A great Halloween night. I don't really do adult Halloween, even when I'm dialed into the world, but that would have been funny. And to Glenn Powell, wherever you are, happy holidays, Congratulations. I'm back in January. Please come draft with us. Okay, number two. I might be betraying myself here by putting challengers at number two, but I'm going with my heart. This is like the most Amanda movie of the year and we covered it a lot. Please go back to and listen to those if you haven't. It is everything that I want in a movie. Luca Guadagnino, Zendaya, Josh O'Connor, Mike Feist. A just absolutely bump in soundtrack tennis, which I'm thinking about pursuing as a player in 2025. Stay tuned. You know, fancy hand creams, incredible product placement up and down the line. I loved this movie. I loved also just the vibe of this movie, which was, let's just put a bunch of cool things together and let it rock. Luca, I really feel sees me. So listen, I love this movie. Really cool. I'm really bummed that it's not an Oscar conversation, but I do think that my number one has to be Honora. I'm just. When Sean texted me, asked me to do this, Aonora was my number one.

[Sean Fennasy]

It.

[Amanda Dobbins]

We did a whole podcast about it before I left. But what an amazing movie that makes you feel so many things at the same time. I've been thinking a lot about that last scene and what I felt when I first saw it and then how Sean and I talked about it on the podcast and kind of our different interpretations and then the different interpretations that every person I've talked to about the movie since it came out has had. And it just. Everyone takes something like slightly different from it while also, you know, being completely entertained and amused and, you know, a little repelled by the perform by the. Not repelled by, but the performances, but some of the characters in it. Anyway, it's a completely engrossing, like, movie ass movie and also something just really like intellectual and provocative that stays with you. So I'm, I just, I love it. If, if Anora wins best picture, we're in a great spot. Gotta be honest with you guys. I saw Wicked today and if Wicked wins best picture, you all have some splaining to do. Well, we're gonna, we're gonna do that in January 2025. I love you all and I, I remain confused and I will continue to seek to understand what the hell is going on. But I love doing this podcast and I love listening to all of you guys while I'm gone. So thank you for letting me talk about movies and thank you for all your kind wishes. And I will be back to yell at you very, very soon.

[Sean Fennasy]

Thank you to Amanda. Good to hear her voice. Thank you to Chris. Thank you to Adam. Thank you to Jack Sanders. Thank you to our producer, Bobby Wagner, for his work on this episode. Speaking of the best movies of the year or not. Next week, the Golden Globe nominations come out. Monday morning, I will be here with Joanna Robinson covering the first truly big domino of award season. We'll see you then.