Episode Summary: The Bill and Doug Show – Joshua Perry on Ohio State’s Repeat Quest and How 2025 Differs from 2015

Podcast: The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk (Blue Wire)
Episode: Former Buckeye Joshua Perry of NBC Sports on how Ohio State trying to repeat is different from 2015
Date: November 13, 2025
Guest: Joshua Perry (NBC Sports analyst, former Ohio State linebacker, National Champion)

Overview

In this episode, Doug Lesmerises and Bill Landis are joined by special guest Joshua Perry to dig deep into the unique dynamics of Ohio State’s bid to repeat as national champions—a quest that contrasts sharply with Perry’s own experience trying to run it back with the loaded 2015 squad. The conversation explores how roster turnover and fresh starters have infused new energy into this Buckeyes team, the challenges of sustaining elite performance, the ever-evolving stakes of conference championships in the expanded playoff era, and broader issues shaping college football.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. How 2025’s Quest to Repeat Differs from 2015

[03:38]

• Doug tosses out the theory: having so many new starters, rather than returning a mostly intact, superstar roster, actually benefits Ohio State in its title defense.
• Joshua Perry:
  • Embraces the idea—having “guys on the way up in new roles” creates hunger and motivation that a veteran-laden defending champ may lack.
  • Contrasts the offseasons:
    • 2015: “It was, 'Who’s going to NBA All Star? Who's going to the ESPYs?' ... We kind of felt like we hung the moon.”
    • Admits the 2015 team might have gotten complacent: “Maybe there were some issues that we overlooked because we said we're veteran and we're just more talented than everybody.”
    • 2025 team: “So many of these guys have things to prove. They don’t have a legacy from a year ago that they can hang their hat on ... That’s part of the motivation.”
• Memorable Quote:
  • “They desire to, as a completely different team, feel the glory that those guys were able to achieve last year. And we were a part of it, but we weren't really in the mix.” – Joshua Perry [04:01]

2. What Could Hold Ohio State Back This Year?

[07:25]

• Perry sees a “higher level” the team hasn’t reached yet.
• Notes deliberate slow pace of play—suggests Ohio State is holding back tactical wrinkles for bigger games: “If there is a game where they decide we're gonna go tempo ... they're probably hitting Jeremiah [Smith] over the top three or four times...”
• On Defense:
  • “When you have a coordinator that is so multiple ... sometimes a guy is not where he’s supposed to be ... but this defense doesn’t really give up anything.” [08:05]
  • Credits Arvell Reese, Sonny Styles, Caleb Downs as “erasers” who “cover up mistakes.”
• Concerns:
  • Offensive line and run game, particularly at right guard against stunting/multiple fronts.
  • “Their [the running backs’] finish takes a two-yard run into maybe like a three and a half yard run ... you're still in a manageable down and distance.”
• Overall: Issues with Ohio State are “things that we want to nitpick ... when you’re looking at Ohio State, the biggest thing you’re doing is nitpicking.” [09:55]

3. The Ohio State Standard

[10:20]

• Doug: “The best standard for Ohio State is Ohio State.”
• Joshua: Cites Ryan Day’s attitude—incremental improvement, higher standards ("It's not 80 anymore, you got to grade out 83 or better.” [11:21]).
• The bar for success is now “winning a title or back to the drawing board ... It's a hard way to live, but these guys are leaning into it completely because they chose greatness when they chose Ohio State.”

4. Conference Championships, Playoff Expansion, and the Indiana Surprise

[12:45]

• Anticipating a Big Ten title game between undefeated Ohio State and Indiana.
• Joshua: Questions about meaning under playoff expansion:
  • “There are people talking about resting starters—which I can't even wrap my mind around for a conference championship game.” [13:55]
  • Stakes are lower than in the past (“…the stakes certainly aren’t as high as they are historically in the Big Ten…”), but still matters for trophy, history.
• National discourse still adjusting to Indiana’s rise: “Our minds haven't completely wrapped around this idea that Indiana is every bit as good as any of the other contenders.” [15:00]

5. Playoff Expansion and Its Impact

[19:25, 22:50, 26:19]

• Doug and Joshua debate the loss of urgency in the regular season with a 12-team playoff.
• Joshua notes: “Nobody ever was like, I want seasons ruined. But I think we appreciated urgency...It doesn’t feel as urgent sometimes.” [19:51]
• On further expansion: “If you can't have success in the regular season, I certainly don't want to watch you in the postseason.” [26:19]
• Cautions against college football replicating the NFL’s structure (“…teams that have a record below .500 that make it to the playoffs ... that just feels wrong to me in general.”), wants to maintain what makes the sport unique.

6. College Football Governance & Economics

[28:07]

• Joshua laments lack of centralized power: “The sport would be much better if you can centralize power and not have conferences that are advocating for their own selfish wants and needs.”
• On collective bargaining: “The idea of collective bargaining in collegiate athletics scares the hell out of me ... The Purdue linebacker is not bargaining on my behalf. We're not the same.” [30:17]
• College football lurched from “too rigid” to “completely wide open”—lack of central leadership unprepared for NIL, the transfer portal, realignment.

7. Heisman Hype, Big Moments, and Fan Overreaction

[31:10]

• Doug pokes fun at the rush to award the Heisman to Indiana’s Fernando Mendoza: “People got a little over their skis, did they not?”
• Joshua:
  • “Heisman moment, to me, is an overrated way to look at that award ... we're going to distill it down to a minute and forty seconds that happened in one game. That's an insane thing to do to begin with.” [31:10]
  • Cites Mendoza’s shaky play (9 of 19, second half, including an interception) as not true Heisman stuff.
• Fans and media prone to “prisoner of the moment” reactions—“Sometimes the way the media reacts is nuts.” – Doug [32:13]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Joshua Perry on the repeat dynamic:
  “We had everybody back... I think we got to a point where we believed we hung the moon and you can’t get there so early in the year. Maybe there were some issues that we overlooked ... I don’t see that in this current [2025] team, because so many of these guys have things to prove.” [04:01–05:28]

• On Ohio State’s ultra-high standard:
  "The standard has been elevated ... winning a title or back to the drawing board. It's a narrow scope of success, and it's a hard way to live, but these guys are leaning into it..." [11:21]

• On conference title games in the playoff era:
  “People are doing that—they talk about resting starters, which is something that I can’t even wrap my mind around for a conference championship game ... But the stakes certainly aren’t as high.” [13:55–14:20]

• On playoff size:
  “6 always felt like the number for me. I feel like the cut line every year is somewhere in that four to maybe six, seven, eight range … you can talk me into maybe six teams ... but you can’t feel bad if you don’t get in.” [22:50–24:10]

• On college football’s struggle with change:
  "One of the flaws of the sport is the structure was so rigid for so long that when it had to change, the sport was not prepared ... It wasn't ready to address any of that. And so now we're in a scenario that's very chaotic." [28:27]

• On Heisman narratives:
  “Heisman moment to me is an overrated way to look at that award ... for that moment to be considered in a game where the quarterback threw an interception that led to points ... That, to me, does not feel like a Heisman moment.” [31:10–32:07]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:38 – Perry’s perspective on why fresh starters can fuel a repeat run
• 07:25 – What could hold the 2025 Buckeyes back? Scheme, mistakes, O-line
• 10:20 – “Ohio State is the standard”—how standards affect team mindset
• 12:45 – Potential Big Ten Championship: Ohio State vs Indiana, stakes in a 12-team playoff
• 19:25 – How expanded playoff affects urgency and “do or die” stakes
• 22:50 – Joshua’s ideal playoff format—and the rationale
• 26:19 – Perry’s warning: Don’t let expansion “sterilize” the sport’s uniqueness
• 28:07 – Governance woes: Centralized power, conferences, and collective bargaining
• 31:10 – Heisman Hype and how individual moments are overrated
• 32:13 – Media “prisoner of the moment” reactions

Conclusion

This engaging episode used Joshua Perry’s firsthand experience as both a champion player and analyst to illuminate how Ohio State’s 2025 team—young, hungry, and largely unproven—contrasts with the 2015 defending champs. The panel covered tough questions: does playoff expansion sap regular-season intensity? Is college football’s lack of central leadership hurting it? And can the sport preserve its identity amid all this change? It ended on a light note, taking aim at the over-the-top media hype cycles around the Heisman Trophy and calling for perspective.

For Buckeye fans, college football traditionalists, and anyone watching the sport’s rapid evolution—this episode offered both insight and spirited fun.