← The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
How important is football to Ohio State? Predicting 2026 Buckeyes stars: Around the Shoe
00:43:59
How important is football to Ohio State as a university on a scale of 1-100? What is the best thing about Ohio State football right now? Which player is not currently a star for the Buckeyes but will be in 2026?
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A
The who's down in who Newville were making their list but some didn't know Walmart has the best brands for their gifts.
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B
What about toys? Do they have brands kids have been wanting all year? Yep.
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C
Barbie, Tonys and Lego. Gifts that will make them all cheer.
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B
Do you mean they have all the brands I adore?
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C
They have Nintendo, Nespresso, Apple and more.
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A
What about so the who answered questions from friends till they were blue? Each one listened and shouted from Walmart. Who knew sharp gifts from top brands for everyone on your list in the Walmart app. When cool creamy ranch meets tangy bold Buffalo, the whole is greater than the sum of its sauce.
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Say howdy partner to new Buffalo Ranch.
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Sauce only at McDonald's for a limited.
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Time at participating McDonald's.
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B
Welcome back to around the Shoe on the Bill and Doug Show. Every week Doug Lamoris and Bill Landis are joined by two members of this role robust Ohio State football beat to do five quick hit topics on the Buckeyes this week to the Lantern, the Ohio State student newspaper, one of the finest student newspapers in all the land. We are joined by Jack dewick and Liv Rinaldi. Jack, what's your title over there at the Lantern? How long you've been around the football team and and how'd you wind up at the Lantern?
- [01:22]
D
Yeah, so I'm the managing sports editor at the Lantern and I started with the Lantern last semester. Started off covering the men's basketball team and then both of the sports editors were seniors. Last year I got asked to apply for the position. I got it and I'm from Columbus, so I was around the team this summer while living at home. And then I've been with the team since the start of summer camp, so it's been a good experience.
- [01:53]
B
Nice, Nice. All right, Liv, how did you wind up at the Lantern and what is your title over there?
- [01:59]
E
So I started freshman year with I was a freelancer, so I worked a little bit with lacrosse and hockey. Those are two of my favorite sports to cover. And then from there I kind of had a little bit more experience kind of going into that class as a beat reporter for the men's hockey team. I got a lot of good experience there. They had a pretty good season last year, so I got to cover them. And then from there, kind of same story as Jack got us to apply for the sports sports editor position, which I ended up getting. And I'm from New York, so I was not here over the summer, but I ended up coming back in August and got started going to the, you know, like Tuesday and Wednesday. Yeah. Interviews and things like that. So a little bit less time than Jack, but yeah, since the beginning of the semester, basically.
- [02:46]
B
All right, very cool. Just jumped right in. You guys jumped right in. Covering the defending national champions, potentially the first back to back national championships in Ohio State history. If it happens, you'll be telling your grandkids about it. But we don't want to get ahead of ourselves. Let's talk though, Bill, while we have these student journalists, I do want to do some questions sort of about how Ohio State football fits into the fabric of Ohio State, which certainly Jack and Liv would have a better handle on than we do. We'll, we'll still opine on it. Jack, we will start with you. First question. On a scale of one to a hundred, how important is the football team to Ohio State as a university? And like, I, I don't even, I don't know what I mean by that. So you decide what that question means. I'm putting you. Making you do all the work.
- [03:31]
D
Yeah. I laughed when I saw this question because, I mean, instantly I thought like 100. It's got to be 100. I feel like the football season for people, especially students at the university, kind of dictates what people do on a like weekly basis. For example, if it's a bye week, it'll be a ghost town around campus. Everyone's going home, everyone's going to visit people. Even if it's an away game, I mean, people are gone. And if you're wearing like whenever I go out of state and I'm wearing an Ohio State shirt, they're the first thing people will say to me is something about the football team. They don't care about the, about what I'm doing at Ohio State if I'm in the business school or whatever. So I think football, I mean, it's, it sounds, you know, it sounds corny, but I think it really is just super, super important to Ohio State.
- [04:30]
B
Okay. Okay. So we're starting with 100. We're starting high. Live. Live. Are you at 100 also live or where are you?
- [04:37]
E
I'm going to have to say like 110. Especially around Michigan week. Yeah, I think like Jack said, I think Ohio State is kind of synonymous with Ohio State football. I mean, everywhere you go, like over the summer I was, I was abroad, I wasn't even in the United States. And people would see me wearing Ohio State shirt. It was like immediately, oh, and then IO, you know what I mean? How about them Buckeyes and It's like, yeah, how about those Buckeyes? I think it, like Jack said, I mean, it really does dictate people's moods around here, and we're a very proud population of people. Yeah. I think it really is just our identity. Like, if you're not spending your Saturdays in the shoe, it's like, where are you? So, yeah, it really is. When people think of Ohio State, I think that's the first thing they think of is the football team. And it's, you know, not. It's not a bad thing to think of when you think of Ohio State.
- [05:24]
B
Yeah. But Landis, before we get to us, like, live, if, let's say, the football team had a rough couple, two or three years, do you think it would affect campus life?
- [05:38]
E
I think in a way, yes. I mean, I see. Even see it now, and, you know, we lost against Oregon last year. You know, like, the one point difference, it was like, you got back to campus. I think it was like our fall break. You got back to campus and, like, no one's happy. Like, no one's in a good mood. But, yeah, I think if we're having, like, a rough couple of years, I think the biggest thing is that maybe this is the definition of insanity. But, like, time after, especially when it comes to the Michigan games, like, we're always getting out there, like crack of dawn, and we're always going to be, like, rooting for the Buckeyes. So I don't think, you know, even if they're kind of disappointing us a little bit, like, there's. There's never. You're never going to really tell that. You know, we're always rooting for them. But, yeah, I mean, it's like, I think especially now there's no we in sports journalism, but especially when we were not working with the lantern. Yeah. You say, like, when they lose, like, we lost, you know, everyone feels kind of like part of the team in a way.
- [06:35]
B
Jack, do you. Is there any part of that. Is there any negative to that, that. That a university, a big, robust state university with. With great academics and such a large student population, is this defined by a football team? Is there any downside to that? Or is it like, man, like, we can love ball and still be a university in other ways, too?
- [06:57]
D
Yeah, I mean, I. When I think of the downsides, I think it kind of rubs off on some of the other sports at the university. For me. I mean, I think, like, the greatness and all the attention of the football team kind of takes away from sports, like, even like men's basket. I mean, you go to the shot and I'll talk to my buddies. And I'm like, yeah, I'm going to the basketball game today. They're like, oh, the season started, like, nobody cares about the basketball team here at Ohio State. It might be because they don't have the level of success that the football team has, but I think that the football team being so good just takes so much attention away from other athletics here at Ohio State.
- [07:39]
B
Okay. Wow. Okay. I'm, I'm intrigued by these answers. Landis, what was your number?
- [07:44]
F
Yeah, it's a, it's a hundred. Whatever. The number can't be too high. What, whatever lifts at 110. I'll go, I'll go there. And like, that's just like an assumption, right, from somebody who's not an Ohio State student. And I don't spend every day on campus, but clearly that's the case. I did. I mean, I went to a similar school to Ohio State. There's a giant school with a big time football program that everything revolves around it. The thing that was always interesting to me when I was at Penn State, like, the people who couldn't care less about football, like, it still dictated their social life. Like, like campus life is so intertwined with the football team and during the fall that even if you, like, you know nothing about the sport, don't care if they win or lose, don't even go to the games, like, it still kind of controls your life and, and what you're able to do on weekends. And I'm sure it's the same way at Ohio State, so. And then, like, you can take it beyond that too, right? Like, we all know that universities are more than their athletic departments, but I would imagine a good deal of conversations and connections that impact the university abroad and, and, and fundraising happen via the football program, right? So, like what they call it, the front porch, right, of, of the university. And that is very much true at places like Ohio State. So, yeah, it's a hundred or a thousand or a million, whatever the highest possible number on your scale is.
- [09:00]
B
So now I feel like an idiot because I was going to say 82. I was like, well, it's important, but there's a medical school and there's a business school and there's like a lot of other important things happening at Ohio State. So I was like, maybe, maybe 64. And I was like, no, no, not 64. Probably 82. And now I'm just, I'm just feel like out of touch with all of this. The one thing I will say is I've off having just gone through it with. With two of my children and, like, applying to college and stuff. I sort of was. I. I think I said out loud, like, you can't. You can't pick your college based on the football team. Right. Especially if you're not playing football. But also, can't you. Can't you go to, like, a good university that also has this giant, unifying, successful thing that drives the campus society and bonds people and makes people happy, like. Jack, did the football team affect you at all when you were making your college choice?
- [10:02]
D
Well, I actually transferred from Indiana University, so. No, it didn't. Yeah. Yeah. That's a whole. Yeah, that's. We don't have to get a.
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B
Hunt you down and punch you in the neck, man. You abandoned the Hoosiers right when it was sick time. Wow. Yep.
- [10:22]
D
Right. The year before he came, I was out of there, so bad timing. I was there when they were. I think they won three games, so.
- [10:31]
B
Wow. So would you have stayed in Indiana if it was the Kurt Signetti era?
- [10:34]
D
No, that the football team did. Not really. Okay, okay.
- [10:41]
B
Live. Did football matter to you at all when you were applying to colleges and choosing Ohio State?
- [10:46]
E
I will say, like, 5050. I was. I did want a Big Ten school. I did want a big school with, you know, to be able to go to the football games. I didn't really envision myself two years from then, like, going to the football games for a totally different reason and not actually being in the stands and being in the press box. But, I mean, looking back, I think it was the right choice for a lot of different reasons, but especially because, like, I knew I wanted to do journalism. I knew I wanted to work in sports, and, like, this is really the place to be. I mean, my freshman year didn't really have the best season, but, I mean, like, hey, who would have thought, especially after last year, we'd be where we are right now? So I think, all in all, it was the best decision for the future that I pursuing at the moment. So.
- [11:27]
B
Yeah. Okay. All right. Landis, if. If Sig comes looking for Jack, we're not going to give him up. We won't.
- [11:33]
F
No, no, no.
- [11:34]
D
Protect our guy here.
- [11:36]
B
Okay, man, if this. Jack, your story, if Ohio State and Indiana meet in the Big Ten championship game, your. Your personals. What are we talking about? You're going to win, like, a student Pulitzer for that thing.
- [11:48]
D
I'm fired up. Yeah. That's been. I've Been looking forward to that ever since Indiana B, Oregon. I'm like, oh, my God. Like, it might happen.
- [11:57]
F
Wow.
- [11:57]
B
Okay, we will look forward to that story. Question number two. This is still kind of a little bit about like the program at large Live. We'll start with you. What would you say is the best thing about Ohio State football right now? And again, I don't even know what this question means. Interpret it however you like.
- [12:19]
E
I think when I first hear that question, I'm looking like sort of at like the team identity right now. And I think we have a really good mix between like, veteran status, but also like a lot of new talent, which is really exciting for the team. Like, you look at last year, like, how many starters they lost. It was like, that was a huge, like, team identity. And it was like they say all the time whenever we're at media, like, you know, that was their time. That was last year's team. Like, they won the national championship. Like, now we want to win the national championship. Like, they look at it as like a whole new team, which is really exciting because it's like a new dynasty sort of. But you look at players like, like Isaiah west and you know, even like Colonel Tate now, like kind of on the come up and it's like, that's really exciting to know. You have them for a few more years. But also the intertwining and the mixing of. Of like the younger and the older players and kind of getting to sit back, watch older players do their thing and then kind of take over. I think it's in a. They're in a really good spot right now for kind of like that transition of power almost, for lack of a better word. So.
- [13:18]
B
Yeah, no, Bill, you and I have talked about that a lot this season. That, like that, that striking that balance, especially when you're trying to defend a title, that it's not just running everybody back like what you're talking about live, like the, the mix of that. That's it. That's a stew. Sometimes when you're trying to get the right ingredients there, it's not always an easy thing to do. But they seem to have really found a way to do that this year.
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A
The who's down in who Newville were making their list, but some didn't know. Walmart has the best brands for their gifts.
- [13:47]
B
What about toys do they have kids have been wanting all year? Yep.
- [13:51]
C
Barbie, Tonys and Lego gifts that will make them all cheer.
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B
Do you mean they have all the brands I adore.
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C
They have Nintendo, Nespresso, Apple and more.
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A
What a bad so the who answered questions from friends till they were blue? Each one listened and shouted From Walmart. Who knew? Shop gifts from top brands for everyone on your list in the Walmart app.
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B
Are you ready to get spicy? These Doritos Golden Sriracha aren't that spicy. Sriracha sounds pretty spicy to me. A little spicy, but also tangy and sweet. Maybe it's time to turn up the heat or turn it down. It's time for something that's not too spicy.
- [14:33]
G
Try Doritos Golden Sriracha.
- [14:36]
C
Spicy but not too spicy.
- [14:43]
B
Landis, what do you think is the best thing about Ohio State football?
- [14:46]
F
Yeah, I think it sort of dovetails off of that. I would just say like it's stability, which we've talked about a lot. It is the most recession proof program in college football history with with not much in the way of of bad seasons and I don't really have any reason to think that they're not always sort of going to be in the hunt moving forward. They seem to have a very good grasp on this like ever changing landscape in college football with the, the revenue share stuff and the way the roster building has changed and navigating the expanded playoff and, and the sort of downstream effect of, of of how to handle the regular season. They just seem to to have a pretty good grip on a grasp of of all of that. So it, it has sort of withstood a bunch of different changes in, in the sport sort of throughout the history of college football. And as we get into this new one, I don't see any reason why that would change. So you know, I guess like knock on wood, like crazy things happen. But, but I think Ohio State stability is kind of the best thing and most impressive thing about it right now.
- [15:47]
B
Yeah, I do. Minus mine is similar to that. I, I use the word control that and I think that applies kind of in multiple ways because I do think for a lot of fan bases in this era of college football right now, with conference realignment, with the transfer portal, with coaches getting fired and leaving for new jobs that feel like things are out of control a lot. And I do think even a couple years ago when Ohio State was maybe not exactly sure how to handle nil, even for the success on the field, it didn't feel like they had a full grasp on things. And I think right now when you talk about how they're handling nil, I even think to lose two coordinators in the off season and for Ryan Day to make these hires and it Feels like Matt Patricia and Brian Hartline have slid in seamlessly. Like that feels like in control, like, oh, like if an assistant coach leaves down the line. It doesn't feel like that's going to be a disaster for Ohio State because, like, they kind of got this. And I think that they got this kind of thing as it applies to on the field on Saturdays, but also the entire off season. I can think that be a very difficult thing, Landis, to feel in this era. I feel like a lot of times it just feels a lot of fan bases can feel like they're. They're floating into chaos. And I, I don't think Ohio State football as a program or as a team on Saturdays, with the way they play, the slow nature, the control on both sides of the ball, they're the opposite of chaotic right now in what is, I think, definitively a chaotic sport.
- [17:22]
F
It is very chaotic. Obviously you put any, any program that is like searching for a new coach right now into the category of they don't know what's going to happen. But I even think like, like Alabama, I think, is in that position sort of wondering what they are without Nick Saban. I think Georgia, for as good as it has been, is sort of in that position because it looked like it was set to dominate the sport and then sort of quickly lost that footing. So Ohio State's station, I think, is elevated within the sport. It certainly, it certainly hasn't. Hasn't fallen, which I think is probably the, the bigger thing, because I do think there are other programs, almost every other program in the country that has to sort of rethink what it is in this new world. And Ohio State, meanwhile, just kind of keeps chugging along in a way that, I don't know, almost. Almost feels like it shouldn't be possible. And maybe, maybe, maybe the time will. They'll have to navigate. Something will come. But over these last couple of years, it seems like they, like, like you said, they have a pretty good handle on it.
- [18:20]
B
Yeah. All right, Jack, what you got?
- [18:22]
D
Yeah, mine's kind of similar. I was, I was gonna say consistency. You guys kind of already hit on most of the points, I was gonna say. But I mean, in this era of college football, to know that you're going to go out there and I mean, at this point, I feel like everybody knows what's going to happen in Ohio State game, every game this year. Like in that Purdue game, you knew they were going to come out, you knew they were going to throw the ball and that, you know, it's not always good because the run game, you're kind of expecting to kind of slog through some. You know, they're. The run game is decent, but it's not where I think Ryan Day and them wanted to be at. But I think consistency overall, like, when Julian. We live. And I always talk in the press box, when Julian said throws a deep ball, you just know it's going to be caught every time without doubt. And I just think that level of consistent consistency from the offense and the defense is just very fun for Ohio State fans.
- [19:24]
B
Isn't that lunacy live to just be like, oh, there's a ball going 50 yards down the field. That's definitely going to be complete. That's a weird way to live, isn't it?
- [19:31]
E
I could. I could honestly, like, see Julian saying, throw the ball. Be like, I'm gonna go to the bathroom. And I just know. But I know that he caught. Like, I know Jeremiah Smith caught it or Carnell Tay caught it. It really. Jack Said, it really is, like, ludicrous. Like. And you can see so much more from the press box. And you can see when you're in the stands, like, he throws the ball and we're like, yup, like you. It's five seconds, you can look from Jeremiah Smith back to Julian saying, like, five times and the ball still in the air. He's caught it and he's got three men covering him. It's like, it is. It's really crazy. And it's just like, it's expected at this point, I think, to go off with Jack Said, like, yeah, I mean, you look at what happened on the college football landscape this year, like, who would have predicted what happened with Penn State? Like, no one would have predicted that. But one thing remains true, and that's that Ohio State remains a top. And it's like, yeah, you just. It's expected at this point, and I think they know that and they come out and they, they. They do what they need to do every game. So they've been consistent for sure.
- [20:23]
B
Next time we're in the press box, Bill, I'm watching for that. If Julian Saying throws a deep ball, I want live to stand up and leave. Like, I'll let you know. I don't even need to see this. I'm out. I know what's going to happen. Question number three. Bill, we will start with you. This is the Arvell Reese question. This is the R.V. reese question. I think it's the Kaden McDonald question. I think you. It's the Carnell Take question in a lot of ways, and it is. Who is a current Buckeye who's not a star right now? They might be playing, they might be starting, but you wouldn't say they're a star. Who will be a star next year?
- [21:00]
F
I'm gonna shock everyone and pick a receiver. I think it's. I think it's Quincy porter, who has three catches this year for 45 yards. And had he not been injured this past week against Purdue, I think maybe that could have been. Breakout is perhaps too strong of word, but I. But I think an afternoon where people really started. Start to take notice of a guy like Quincy. He's got great size. He's. He's about 6, 3, 6, 4. It's interesting when you watch Ohio State at practice, like we get to do in the summer mostly, and just sort of see the receivers, Jeremiah Smith stands out among the group, but the next guy, like, physically who kind of stands out is Quincy Porter, just kind of based off his size. There are other guys like, you know, Demario wins a big. A big kid, too, but Quincy's got that. The explosiveness. He had that catch against Wisconsin where he caught the ball shallow and then turned it up field into a 22 yard reception. I think, assuming Carnell Tate is moving off to the NFL after this year, that Quincy will be the guy that kind of steps up in that. Into that role and plays like sort of alongside Jeremiah as the other outside receiver for the Buckeyes. And he's got the pedigree that you expect of a guy who would step into that role and kind of flourish immediately. So I know Ohio State fans are really excited about him now and are waiting for him to be a star. But I think, like, to the rest of the college football world, he could be a guy who becomes, you know, fairly well known, I think, pretty quickly next year.
- [22:23]
B
Okay. Okay. That's a good way to take a receiver, Bill.
- [22:26]
F
Yeah.
- [22:28]
B
Take the layup. I'm going to say Jalen McLean, who is a starting safety right now, but I can sort of already hear the broadcasters next year saying things like, man, we thought Caleb Downs was the best safety in college football. Last year. We thought he was maybe the best defender in college football. And Jalen McLean is filling his role and doing almost the same things. And that if we have seen what. What Downs has established with that safety position where you can come down in the box, where you can be aggressive, where you can make tackles in the backfield, where you can cover and hit and run in space and be rock Solid, but also be dynamic. And I think what you've seen of Jalen Mcclain so far this year is that he plays smart, he also plays physical, he takes good angles, he's not out of position. And I think that, you know, we, we saw downs flourish and Jim Knowles defense last year. Matt Patricia now using him in a similar way. And if that's just a template for, hey, if you have a smart, dynamic guy who can be a playmaker, we're going to find a way to use a safety like that in our defense. And I think Jalen McLean, and we've talked about it some this year, just might be learning at the foot of Caleb Downs and be ready to kind of slide into that role next year and maybe be a guy that we're talking about for all Big Ten or all American. See, I took a safety that's not a layup. So now there's plenty of room for Jack and live here. Jack, who's your guy next year is going to be a star.
- [23:48]
D
Yeah, I'm going to take Riley Pettigon. When you see him around the facility and even when he's on the field, like he's just one of those guys that you can tell, like he's going to be a stud. Like you can just look at him and be like, yeah, that guy, I mean he's got the makeup of an all American and an NFL guy. I think him and Payton Pierce are going to pick off, pick up right where Sonny Styles and Arvell left off. Peyton Pierce, I guess has played a little more than Riley this year, but I mean, five star recruit has all the makeup of an NFL guy. I don't really see any reason why he won't be a star in his time at Ohio State.
- [24:30]
B
Yeah, yeah. No, it's interesting to see him, see him early against Purdue because it's like it was a little bit of like a sign of things to come, I think. All right, Liv, you're going last. That's a tough spot. If you want to say a name that's already been said, that's allowed. But maybe you find somebody else too.
- [24:45]
E
No, I'm going to take a running back on this. Maybe kind of, I don't think controversial. I mean, he's been playing still a freshman though, but Isaiah West, I mean like my eyes, when he's playing, like my eyes immediately go to him. Like he's a big guy, he's strong, he's consistent, he's fast, he plays with, he plays like with the, the type of like I Guess like, aura that, like, it kind of like, belies his experience. Like, you wouldn't look at him. Yeah, laugh at me, Jack. That's fine. But he. He plays and it's like, you wouldn't think that he's a freshman. Like, I just. I can see him, like, really, like, running, like. Like running the running game and. And being like that guy in the running. Running back room. Yeah. Every time he's playing, like, my eyes immediately go to him. I know he's one touchdown on the season, but I think he's going to be really important to this Ohio State team.
- [25:33]
B
He was popping pads against Purdue. Like, he runs physical. Like he. He looks good live. He sounds good, too, with the way that he runs.
- [25:42]
E
Yeah, laugh all you want, Jack, but.
- [25:43]
B
Yeah, no, I think, like, Bill. Jack, why are you laughing, man? Isaiah west is a great.
- [25:48]
E
I said aura. I said aura.
- [25:50]
B
Is that an aura? Is that your thing? Okay. Ours are good, Jack. It's a weird world that it was like, hey, what are they gonna do in the run game? They're gonna go to this freshman, Bo Jackson. Then it's like, no, wait, they're gonna go to this other freshman, Isaiah West. It's. It's a little amazing to have two different freshman running backs, Jack, sort of picking up the run game this year.
- [26:11]
D
Yeah. And I. I think they're a great one, two punch. I think Bo Jackson's a guy who. I mean, he. When he hits the hole. I mean, we saw it in the first. First play from scrimmage last week. It got called back, but, I mean, he. He hits the hole hard and he. I think he's going to be a great player out of. Out of Ohio State. I think he'll be right up there with the Carlos Hides, the Travion Hendersons, the J.K. dobbins, once it's all said and done. And I think him and Isaiah west are a pretty electric duo in the backfield.
- [26:44]
F
Yeah, they complement each other really well, I think. And I think. Doug, you kind of. Was it you who said that maybe, like, Bo Jackson is the travion and Isaiah west is the quin. Sean, I think that could be the dynamic there.
- [26:55]
B
Yeah. Yeah. No, I think. I think Ryan Day might think that too. That. I think, like, we could. And we've seen that if that's what they really want to do. The idea that, you know, because they. Last year, it was sort of. It was a transfer guy and a guy who's been here, and then they brought in CJ Donaldson to try to do that. This year. And if, if they can do that with two running backs in the same class and develop them both together at the same time and have them rise up through the ranks complementing each other, that'd be, that'd be really good for the running back room.
- [27:22]
G
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- [27:46]
B
In.
- [27:47]
A
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- [28:18]
B
All right, we want to talk a little bit like journalism here. And so this is to let Jack and Liv talk about their experiences but also for Bill and I for you to embarrass ourselves and like what ding dongs we were when we were in college. So question number four is how do you hope being a college journalist will help you in your career? Or Bill, for you and I, it's for how did it help us in our career? And so I will say I'm, I'm curious to hear Jack and Liv talk about this that like is. Is writing and having clips and like things like, you know, that still a big thing maybe for, for what you hope to do in your future. But I will say I'm an idiot. My college newspaper, I've told this story many times. I think Bill might know this story. I went in spring of my freshman year at my college newspaper and they said, I was like, hey, I want to be a sports writer. What do I do? And they said, well we already have this very go getter college sportswriter who's also in your class and she came in in the fall and she's been doing all kinds of stuff and she is our softball beat writer. And so since you're only showing up now because you're stupid and lazy, we maybe you could go to a game and help keep stats for the softball team as like the first thing that you would do. And I was like, I'm not keeping stats. What is this? No, just like give me a beat or I'm out. And they were just like, please leave. So I just left and that was kind of the end of my sports journalism newspaper career. And the person who was the beat writer that I didn't want to go keep stats for was Rachel Nichols, who is now had for a time there, took over all of sports media. And, like, I was like, whatever, sitting in my room playing video games. And then I did go on an internship, and I wrote a story about people eating a weed that grew on the side of the road that would make them high. It was called a jimson weed. Don't eat jimson weed. I got on the front page for that. And then they made me write a story about home mortgages on my internship, and I literally did not know what a mortgage was, and I did not know how it worked. I didn't know what it was for. And I wrote a story that appeared in the business section, and none of it was correct. So, anyway, don't be like me, Jack. I hope you have some better stories about how what you're doing, you hope, might help you down. Down the line. And do you want to be a journalist, or do you want to be something else?
- [30:45]
D
Yeah, so I'm a senior right now, so it's kind of crunch time. Kind of have to start, you know, really thinking about that, which sucks, because college is the best. But I, you know, I have been applying to a lot of writing jobs, but what I've kind of learned from this position is the inner workings of just college sports, like, in the athletic departments. And that's really interesting. I'm really interested in that. Like, kind of the sports information director roles or even one day becoming like an athletic director or something interests me. So, you know, that's kind of the. I still don't have it really figured out yet, to be honest. But just something in sports is. I know that's my calling. So, you know, that's. That's what I'm looking to do.
- [31:38]
B
Yeah. And listen, Jack, you. You don't have to have it all figured out now.
- [31:41]
D
You got.
- [31:41]
B
You got at least, like, six months, and then you better have it figured out, man. Liv, how is this experience, do you think, helped you? And do you want to be a sports journalist? You want to do something else?
- [31:53]
E
Yeah. Well, I'm. I think I said former junior, so I'm not in the same boat as Jack, thank God. But I do definitely I want to continue down this road and be a journalist. Definitely want to work in sports. Yeah. I think what it's taught me is just, like, when you're thrown into it, it doesn't really feel Real at first. Like, I mean, especially, like, this year, first game that we're covering in our new roles. It's like Texas. And it's like, okay, like, now it's time to, like, get going. And it's like, it teaches you time management, for sure. It teaches you how to work under deadlines, under pressure, even being in the press box. Like, we see the same. Same beat reporters every week, and it's like, you get to know these guys. You get to talk to them about their experiences and, you know, their stories, and it's like, all right. Like, I think I can. I think I can do this. Like, I think I can pave my own way. And it's like, I don't know, like, where I'll be in a few years if I don't think I'll be in football. Like, you know, wherever I'll be, I'll hopefully be back home in New York, not in Ohio. But, yeah, I mean, it's just. It's taught me a lot about my writing, for sure. I think, like, the first thing we're told is, like, you think you're the best writer until someone else reads your writing, and then it's like, all of a sudden, you think you're the worst writer in the world. But, yeah, I mean, I'm just really grateful to have the story support that we have, but also to just. I feel like Jack and I are very much like a. A duo. Tandem. Like, we work very well together and very supportive of each other. So, yeah, I'm just really thankful to be where we're at right now and to get to cover this team, because I. It's very tiresome sometimes, but no other college journalist has the opportunities that we do. So. Very thankful.
- [33:25]
B
Yeah, it really is. And, Bill, I think you and I learned that, like, we always. You can't control how good the team is that you cover, but when they happen to be good, it. It does honestly open up opportunities to just write things in a different way that if you're just covering a team that's three and six, it's kind of a different world. Landis, you got any experiences here?
- [33:45]
F
Yeah, I. I mean, being a student journalist helped me a ton, I think, to. To, like, where I am now. It's interesting because I. I. You know, I. I'm a journalism. I was a journalism major, and I took journalism classes. But everything I fall back on is stuff that I experience, like working for the school paper. And it's no offense to my professors. It's just, like, the real world Experience is the things that kind of. Kind of stick with you. So I got. I got some pretty good lessons. Like, early on, I remember the fir. The first story I was assigned to cover for the Daily Collegiate at Penn State was to go listen to a speech that Brett Musburger was doing because he was calling the game that week. And it was like, go to this thing, listen to the speech, and then, like, ask Brent Musburger a couple questions afterwards and, like, write a story about. About this thing happening. But I was, like, so nervous, and it was my first thing that I, like, I didn't. I didn't ask Brent Musburger a question. I kind of just, like, wrote off the speech, and I turned the story into my editor. And he basically said, this sucks. And he said, like, did you talk. Did you. Did you ask him anything? And I said, well, no. Like, for all these reasons was all B.S. so that was, like, a good lesson of, like, they're gonna send you places. You better, like, give them a reason to send you there, right? Like, you need, like, if you're gonna. Don't, don't. Merely your. Your presence is not enough. You. You need to be there to ask questions. And it wasn't like, I wasn't there to put Brett Musburger on the spot. I was just there to, like, write a good story about him being there, but I didn't ask him anything because I was, like, too scared to do so as a. Whatever college sophomore. And then the other thing I did, I was covering women's volleyball, which at the time at Penn State was probably the second biggest beat. Now. Now I'm assuming it's wrestling, but back then, it was women's volleyball. They were very good, and we got to go to practice, and, like, I observed a girl who's on the team. She was very good, but she was having a bad season, and she sort of got, like, got taken out of the lineup a little bit, wasn't playing very much, and she was sort of just, like, standing on the side, like, hitting the ball against the wall before practice started. And I decided it would be a good idea to, like, use that scene as a lead and then say, like, so and so has been standing on the side a lot lately. It was, like, super mean. And I, like. I never talked to her about, like, what she was going through or even, like, the coach about why her role had changed. It was just like, she's not playing well. I'm going to take this access. I got to see her, like, kind of, like, standing off the Side not looking all that happy at the moment. And use that as my lead because I think I'm the best sports writer in America and I have the opportunity to do so. And like, all I did was look like a total a hole and then like had to, I didn't have to apologize, but like, I got a lot of blowback for it. Not like publicly, but just like from the team and from the coach and stuff. And it was like a lesson in basically just like not being a jerk and you're covering people and like try to be cognizant of that when you're writing things. Not that everyone is sort of like above criticism or whatever, but I think two things. One, keep in mind that they are people you're talking about. And two, like, if you are going to be critical of somebody, like maybe be critical to their face first before you decide to go spout off about it and try to use that as a shield between you and them or whatever. So that was a good lesson too, man.
- [36:38]
B
I, Jack and Live are getting some great lessons about how terrible we were in college, Bill. Like you and I, I was pretty.
- [36:44]
F
Bad at the start. I was pretty bad.
- [36:46]
B
I was awful. Please just learn from our mistakes. We'll wrap up with this. And you guys have already told some stories. I mean, I do. Like, what's, like, what's another experience that you've had, a story that you've written, something that you've done? Like, what's, what's your best story or most interesting story about being a college sports journalist so far? Jack, we'll start with you.
- [37:07]
D
Yeah. And just going back on the last question for a second, I think, you know, I was thinking about it while Bill was talking. Like, nothing can prepare you from going and sitting on the couch and watching Jeremiah Smith for a year to being in front of him and having to ask him a question. Like, I think the experience of like having to go up there and be like, all right, here you go, like, talk to Ryan Day is, I mean that's a, that's a life long experience. No matter what you do, it gives you confidence to talk to whoever. But as far as stories go, over the summer I was lucky enough to connect with Devin Smith and he was a guy when I, when I was in fifth grade living in Columbus, like, everybody loved Devin Smith. They loved the Nike elite arm sleeve and like people would wear them to school and stuff to play football at recess. So I got, I got him on the phone and he was amazing. We talked for like an hour and A half, almost. He gave me his whole journey, and, I mean, I was just listening most of the time because he's such a great storyteller, and he's just the nicest person ever. And I got to do a cool feature article on him. He's training kids down in Texas now. I forget the. I think it's Plano, but I might be wrong on that. But he. It was amazing just hearing his story and just, you know, he was a guy that I looked up to while I was a little kid, so being able to connect with him was awesome.
- [38:37]
B
Yeah, no, I think that. That. That happens, I think, to a lot of people that. Like, someone that you knew as a fan and now you're interviewing them, like, in a journalistic manner, and it's like, you got to, like, check yourself a little bit, because it is, like, quite a thing. I can remember doing that, too. Yeah, that's really cool. Liv, what's the thing that stood out to you?
- [38:54]
E
Yeah, I think I'm gonna go off the beaten path a little bit here and just say, like, I think just, like, the culture of being a sports journalist, like, the experiences that you have, like, just from outside, like, covering, like, just. Just this past weekend, like, we. You know, we were like, all right, are we gonna go the day before the Purdue game and stay over and then. And then cover the game? Are we gonna go the morning of? And we're like, I guess we're going the morning of. And so it's like, 5:00am and, like, Jack's, like, outside my house, like, all right, like, let's go to. Let's go to Indiana. And it's just, like, the experiences that you have together, I think it just makes it really worthwhile. Like, it's the stuff that happens, I think, when you're, like, talking to the beat reporters that are doing this, like, professionally for a job, and you get to know them and, like, you know, it's like. Like you said, like, they're. Everyone's, like, people in this business, and everyone is, you know, just doing the best they can. So I think it's just like, the. The life that you. You live, like, outside of. Outside of just covering the games and writing the stories beyond the score. It's like, Jack had the opportunity to go to Washington, and it's like. Like, you know, I was pretty jealous. Like, that's so cool. And, like, I got to go to Wisconsin, and it's just, like, seeing the places you get to see and, like, the stadiums. Like, no one else that I know is Going to the stadiums that I'm going to and just taking it all in. I feel like, you know, even before, after the game, like just standing on the field before anyone's even there and just kind of like breathing it all in, you just can't believe how many people are about to fill into the stadium and, like, the history that's going to take place there. So it's just. I just getting to be along for the ride and kind of witness it all is, I think, probably like the. Like Jack said, it's just an experience that you can't really replace and it's something you'll remember for forever. So I don't know, just the. The stuff that kind of. That you. You don't really see beyond just watching the game on Fox or espn, whatever it is.
- [40:36]
B
Yeah, this. It's quite. I don't think that gets lost on you, Bill. You know that you have this position where you are sort of on behalf of the thousands of other people who wish. Millions of people who wish they could be there and can't, you're there reporting for them, and it's like you're getting to have this experience. I can remember covering Ohio State in the Elite Eight in Boston, and they won to go to the Final Four. And it was like, whatever, 11 o' clock at night, and most of us are going back to our hotel. And the lantern people were like, well, I guess we're driving back to Columbus. And I was like, what are you doing? And they're like, oh, we're driving overnight to go back to Columbus. And I was like, please get a hotel. Here is my credit card number. What are you doing? You cannot drive through the night. And it's the life of a sports.
- [41:22]
E
Yeah. Life of a college journalist.
- [41:25]
B
I was like. I was begging them and it's like, I guess you're young. You guys are young, you can handle it. But my God. Yeah, you guys. You guys are crazy. You guys are crazy.
- [41:35]
G
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- [41:59]
A
In Walmart Zuluville. Everyone ready their cart. The early Black Friday deals are about to start online and in the app. Such great deals to explore everything you love from tech, toys and more. The days to save and the ones to remember are the 14th to the 16th of November. The who's are all ready, but are you Walmart? Black Friday deals await. Who knew?
- [42:31]
B
Bill, what's your, what's your go to story from your college journalism life? You already told a couple good ones.
- [42:36]
F
Yeah. So still, when I was covering Penn State women's volleyball, they, I think their winning streak ended up being like 109 matches in a row. It's one of the longest winning streaks in the history of the ncaa. But when I was covering them, they were approaching breaking. Not breaking but, but passing the UCLA men's basketball 88 game winning streak. So I don't know why I thought this would even be possible. And I was like, I'm going to talk to Bill Walton about this. And Bill Walton had a website at the time it was just bill walton.com and his email address was bill.walton walton, bill walton.com. and I said I sent him an email and I swear he called me back two minutes after I sent the email. He called me during a volleyball match and like I had to answer the phone and say like, well, sorry, Bill Walton, I can't talk at the moment, but like, can we schedule a time to talk later in the week? And he was like, sure. And then I talked to, I think I might have talked to him for three hours for a story that like in the paper, I don't know, might have been 700 words. And like, I couldn't, I could hardly use anything we talked about. But covering that team gave me the opportunity to talk to, to the legend Bill Walton for a couple of hours, which is pretty cool.
- [43:41]
B
That's crazy. I will say I have, I think I still have it on my phone. I have a voicemail from John Havlic from many years ago and I think he was maybe selling some of his memorabilia or something and was like, hey, do you want a story on this? And it's like I called John Havlich and John Havich called me back and he has since passed on. And it's like I saved my John Havlicek voicemail because it's like, what? It's like, hey, the 11th greatest basketball player of all time just called your voicemail. It's like, what are we doing? How is this real life? Like, why are these things happening? So this is my best college sports journalism story. I did a lot of radio when I was in college and I was doing student radio for a college softball game and there was a pop up and the catcher jumped up to try to catch the pop up. And so I said on the radio, the catcher Jumps out of her crotch. Excuse me, I mean her crotch. And instead of crouch. And that's why I'm not a radio guy. But I am on this podcast embarrassing myself yet once again. Don't go into the radio. See, this is not live. So if I say something ridiculous, we can edit it out, right?
- [45:01]
E
Don't worry. I had an experience like that recently with the headline that I wrote, so.
- [45:06]
B
Oh, tell it. This will make me feel better. Tell the headline.
- [45:09]
E
I think it might be worse actually than yours. And it's. It's not. It's the fact that it's written. So it's. It's out there forever. And so it was. And speaking of the. The deep throws that say, and had. And we said it before, like, his, you know, when he throws those deep balls and like, you know, my headline was like, Julian sains deep balls. Like, keep coming down for Ohio State. Didn't think much of it. It's like, whatever time after the game. And like, post. It gets post on the Instagram. And it's like, I mean, we like one of the. Like, everyone loves like Mikey's Late Night Slice. Like, they're like a pizza place around here. Like, they're commenting. Like, everyone's commenting. Like, what? Like, pause. What are you talking about? Like, take this down. And I'm like, Then you have like my mom commenting, like, great job. Like, great article. And it's like, no, just delete it. Like, delete it all. It's bad. But yeah, and it's not even like. And then I started doing stand ups, so it's not even like, no one knows who I am because, like, you scroll to the next post and it's like me on the field, like, speaking. It's like name to the face. Like, now everyone knows who I am.
- [46:10]
B
So I do feel a little better, actually.
- [46:16]
F
That's good.
- [46:17]
B
It happens to all of us. It happens to all of us. Been there a million times. We could do another 20 minutes. On the list of ridiculous things that I have done in my career, Bill, I'm sure you could do it too. All learning experiences. Jack and Liv, thank you so much for joining us here today. Jack, if people want to keep up with you, if they want to read you, if they want to know what's going on, how can they find you?
- [46:35]
D
Yeah, the lantern.com if you just search on my name in there. I mean, I'm doing mostly football stuff. I'll be doing basketball stuff in the winter. So, yeah, that's where you can go.
- [46:48]
F
All right.
- [46:49]
B
Jack Dwick. Thanks for being here live. How can the folks find you?
- [46:52]
E
Yeah, same thing. Lantern.com search up my name and you can always look at any, any of the work that we're doing putting out some really good stuff on all the sports. So, yeah, we're really proud of what we're doing. So thank you for having us.
- [47:03]
D
Yeah, thank you guys so much.
- [47:05]
B
Very cool. That will wrap up this edition of around the Shoe. We do it every Monday here on the Bill and Doug Show. Like, subscribe, tell a friend about the Bill and Doug Show. And we want to thank Jack. We want to thank Liv for taking time out of their busy college lives to join us for now, for Bill Landis, I'm Doug Lemarise. And that was around the Shoe on the Bill and Doug Show.
- [47:32]
C
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A
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