← The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
Inside Ohio State football's first day of spring practice: Offensive line plans, guys who jumped out
00:59:38
Ohio State football opened spring practice on Tuesday, and Bill Landis and Doug Lesmerises were there to watch practice and ask Ryan Day questions about it afterward.
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- [00:01]
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- [01:14]
Bill Landis
Made it back.
- [01:15]
Douglas Mace
Welcome back to the Bill and Doug Show. Douglas and Bill Landis. He said, let me go get a tissue right when I hit the button to run the intro. It's first day of spring practice. Everybody's shaking off the rust around the Ohio State football program. We were out at the Woody on Tuesday morning. We got to watch about an hour of practice, including five full periods, which was nice. We got a little handle on things. We came back and heard from Ryan Day for about half an hour. We are expected to be back there on Thursday to watch another hour of practice and I think potentially hear from the coordinators maybe. I think that might be the plan.
- [01:50]
Bill Landis
Thursday. No, Thursday is Julian Jackson.
- [01:54]
Douglas Mace
They are the coordinators in their own way. Julian saying as the faces of those two sides of the ball. So we're going to talk to those guys, but we on this show, we're gonna do a big Wednesday show on our substack feed. We're not going to get into every single thing that happened because the thing, Bill, is a little crazy is we had not talked to Ryan Day or really anybody around the team, like at the Woody in any kind of news conference capacity since the season ended. So we had a lot to cover on, on Tuesday.
- [02:22]
Bill Landis
We did. Yeah. It felt it wasn't like a disjointed press conference. Maybe it was a little bit. But there was, there wasn't so much ground to cover that, you know, you show up after that long not talking to people, you're not entirely sure what to ask about. So, like, it was fine. We got, we got some decent information. I think but yeah, there was a, there was a few different topics discussed.
- [02:41]
Douglas Mace
Yeah, often we want to like a day like this, you want to talk about ball, you want to talk about like how the players are going to fit into the plan. But also Arthur Smith, Corte Hankton and Rob Disher had been hired to the coaching staff since we've talked to Ryan Day. So like we could have done an hour on those three hires, right?
- [02:58]
Bill Landis
Like, yeah. And they brought in 51 new players and lost like 30.
- [03:06]
Douglas Mace
So, you know, we didn't. And it's hard because, like, you want to move on, but like, I don't know if we're ever going to have. And maybe the answer is they just don't want to talk about players that are gone. So they weren't going to speak to players by name. But he didn't really get asked about like the idea of Fahim Delane and Quincy Porter and Myelin Graham and Aaron Scott and Bryce west and sort of this young underclass of second and third year big time recruits who hadn't really gotten on the field but left like there. There was no question about that, right? Nothing along those lines there.
- [03:45]
Bill Landis
No. There was a question asked about getting more experienced, which in that answer, Ryan Day kind of referenced the exodus generally. But nothing, nothing specific about how that all went down or why or how they feel about it. Yeah.
- [04:01]
Douglas Mace
Whether they were surprised, whether they felt they learned any lessons, whether they want to avoid that in the future, whether they now understand that's going to be part of the future. And you know, like, you're on to Terry Moore and Earl Little and Kyle Parker and Devin McEwen and of course you are. But on the other hand, like this was. We haven't talked to anybody since the Portal. Like it's a sea change sort of a little bit. Not just of the people involved on the roster, but to some degree how Ohio State is doing business that I think it would be really interesting to get Ryan Tate, it. Ryan Day to delve into. But like, he's trying to make sure that like practice went smoothly and figure out. Make sure like all the new coaches know how to run the drills.
- [04:43]
Bill Landis
Yeah, I think, I think they'll. There will be time for that. So they're this week, they're off next week with spring break. They come back the week after. I would imagine we have at least two other Ryan Day press conferences before the spring game, if not three, like one every week before the spring game. So I think the time to, you know, drill down a little more specifically on Some of this stuff will. Will come. But, yeah, that was not. Not really part of the questioning on day one.
- [05:09]
Douglas Mace
Yeah. So let's. Let's talk about what did happen, and that was us watching practice. You watched more the offensive side of the ball. I watched more the defensive side of the ball, and that included the offensive line and perhaps some preconceived notions that we had about the offensive line based on what we saw and the way Ryan Day talked about it already not coming true. Or maybe. Maybe I. I don't know what to think, but we started. We, you and I started to have a conversation outside the Woody Hayes Athletic Center. Then I was like, what are we doing? This is the podcast. I. I also think we. We maybe have a different view on this a little bit. Why don't you tell the good folks what happened with the offensive line as you zeroed in on that and also asked Ryan Day about it?
- [05:57]
Bill Landis
Yeah, I. I would say it's possible that maybe I was viewing things not quite the right way when we were doing some individual drills, but it looked to me like there was some interchangeability with a lot of the guys, including Philip Daniels, like tackle and guard. And I think, as we've discussed on previous shows, he sort of feels like the.
- [06:15]
Douglas Mace
The.
- [06:15]
Bill Landis
The pivot point. Is he a tackle? Is he a guard? You answer that question and then kind of start moving guys around relative to whatever that answer is. So I then asked Ryan Delic about that, thinking he was going to say, yeah, Philip Daniels is. Maybe he would say, like, he's a tackle. We're going to give him a look at guard. And he kind of just said, like, no, he's a tackle. And, And I think the. For me, anyway, the two biggest questions about the offensive line positionally were like, Ken, Philip Daniels and Austin Seraveld find their way to guard or one of those guys, or what exactly does that look like? And. And Ryan Day's answer to my question was like, no, those guys are the tackles. The two guys who were the starting tackles last year are the talk. Are the tackles right now. Austin Cerebella on the left side and Philip Daniels on the right side. Now It's. It's day one, and that can change. Certainly they have. They have 14 more practices left, and then whatever happens in the summer, and we've seen stuff shift pretty dramatically over the course of spring before. So I'm not writing off the idea entirely, but there was definitely an opportunity on the first day of spring for Ryan Day to kind of portray the offensive line as being you know, somewhat wide open positionally and more so. What it sounds like is the guys who were starters last year are coming back and starting in those same spots again, and then right guard is open and there's a few guys there in that competition, and they'll see how it shakes out. So, yeah, the. The preconceived notions of. Of maybe Philip Daniels plays guard. Maybe there's a way for Austin Sarah Bell to play guard. I don't know that they're dead, but they're. They're on a hiatus, at least a little bit for now, which is like, whatever. I'm cool with them. I think the biggest thing is to make sure we are talking about things correctly and, like, we can theorize before spring, but then spring starts, you get real information. So now we don't have to, you know, go into every spring practice wondering if Philip Daniels might play right guard because Ryan Day said he's probably a tackle.
- [08:09]
Douglas Mace
Yeah, that was interesting because he was running through the guys who are playing multiple positions. This guy's guard and tackle. This guy's garden center. And he said, Sarah Bell to tackle. And he didn't mention Philip Daniels. And you followed up about Philip Daniels and he said, Philip Daniels is a tackle. And it was it. Not again. I was sort of looking at the defense. I came over. It's like, what's the first team offensive line? Was it not that sort of the first time you saw what looked like a first team offensive line today on the first day of spring football practice on March 10? It was the same offensive line that started the Miami game.
- [08:42]
Bill Landis
It was the same O line that started the Miami game, which was. Gabe, excuse me, gave Van Sickle at right guard. Yeah, I can give you. I have the. The transcript up here. So he said, just like running through the names, the names he mentioned specifically, he said, Austin will mostly be a tackle, though we've seen him play guard before. Gabe Van Sickle will mostly be a guard. Josh Padilla will play some center and some guard. He's also limited for. For part of spring. He mentioned, I think Carson Hinsman. Carson has been complete multiple positions. He said. And then I think he said, I followed up with. About Phil Daniels. And I said, I just said, like, is Phil tackle and guard, too? And he said, right now it's just tackle, but it's worth a discussion.
- [09:25]
Douglas Mace
So. So I think you always have to be able to think about what could Ryan Day have said today? Because this is just Doug's Journalism 101, which I give 50 times a year in a dying industry. Here's how you do this job that doesn't exist anymore.
- [09:45]
Bill Landis
Dying industry is. It's a hell of a way to go through life.
- [09:49]
Douglas Mace
Telegraph operator. You got to keep the index finger nimble. That's the most important thing you got to do. I think if we had gone in and you were asking those questions and Ryan Day had said, or based on what we saw in practice, like Austin Seravel's inside, and you asked Ryan Day because of course you were going to ask the offensive line question. If Ryan Day had said Austin Seravel, like, was awesome last year. We. We can't thank him enough. He was so important to what we did last year. But that guy's a guard. We're going to work him at guard. We know he can play tackle, but we think he's more comfortable there. We want to give him a good long shot at guard this spring. We want to see how that works around him. And he might wind up back a tackle, but we know he can do that. But we want to get 15 practices of Austin Seravel to guard. Is that something Ryan Day could have said?
- [10:43]
Bill Landis
Yeah, I think definitely. Yeah. Especially with the assumption that comes along with that, is that Ian Moore can. Can play tackle, Is ready to play tackle. So then you, like, play Ian Moore and Philip Daniels at tackle and that Austin Serval play guard. Yeah, I think there's absolutely a version of that answer that could have been said today.
- [11:03]
Douglas Mace
And could he have said the same thing about Philip Daniels? Man, we got him in the portal. He got in here. He had to learn the ropes of what it's like to be a Buckeye really quickly. And he wound up starting the whole year. What an accomplishment by Philip Daniels. We're going to look hard at him at guard. We want to find the spot that's most comfortable for him, how this group fits together. And we need to get a good long look at Phil at guard. Could he have said that?
- [11:25]
Bill Landis
I don't know that he could have said both. I think he could have said one or the other because one of those two guys has to. If one of those guys is playing guard, then the other has to play tackle. Unless you're gonna both. Unless they're gonna both battle for guard, which seems unlikely, so because, like, Luke Montgomery is not moving off a left guard. And I don't think. Yeah, I don't think he can kick outside. So separately, yes, he could have said either of those things, respectively, about Austin, Sarah, vault, or Philip Daniels, but I don't think he could Have. I don't think there's a world where he would have said both of them,
- [11:54]
Douglas Mace
but separately, I'm almost. I would have maybe said there's like a 75 chance. He says one of them.
- [12:00]
Bill Landis
Yes.
- [12:02]
Douglas Mace
But I bet you he says one of them, and he said neither of them. And at the moment, as you said, it seems like the tackles last year at the moment are the tackles this year. And so then it becomes a conversation of more. So that, like, we're choosing to do this. We're choosing because of the strengths or weaknesses or whatever of Austin Serveld and Philip Daniels. We're choosing to experiment. It maybe comes down more to is Ian Moore shoving somebody? And if Ian Moore says, like, I'm a starting tackle and Ohio State says, great, now something's happening. But maybe because if you, if you move Daniels or S. First, then you're kind of putting that. It's like, well, then who's the tackle? We would have. Well, then Ian Moore is lining up with the ones at tackle. And so maybe they want to see if Ian Moore forces a move as opposed to assuming a move. Because on. When. On your first team offensive line depth chart, when you were watching, was More playing both sides of tackle, or is he primarily on one side?
- [13:08]
Bill Landis
He was playing. Sorry, I'm consulting my notes. He was playing right tackle.
- [13:15]
Douglas Mace
Okay.
- [13:17]
Bill Landis
With, like, the group of twos is where he was. And. But Ryan Day also said when he was running through those guys, I didn't mention earlier, he said they are going to get. Let Ian Moore play guard and tackle. So, like, what we thought he might say about Saravel or Daniels, he said about more, which again, is interesting because I think, like, of that group, More might have sort of the most kind of like, traditional tackle body. Right. So I, you know, we. We can talk ourselves in circles about it a little bit in a way that, like, I think it might make it seem like this isn't a good situation. It's a. It's a fine situation. Like, nothing about this is, like, concern. It's just like the. We thought the puzzle looked one way, dumped the pieces out of the box, put it together, it's like, huh, it's a dog, it's not a cat. How about that?
- [14:06]
Douglas Mace
Right?
- [14:08]
Bill Landis
Right. So, like, I think it's fine. It's still a nice puzzle. Right?
- [14:11]
Douglas Mace
So.
- [14:12]
Bill Landis
But I do think it makes. I think it makes Ian Moore sort of like definitively the most interesting offensive lineman in spring camp, which maybe he was before, but I think, like, that is kind of solidified now and that
- [14:27]
Douglas Mace
didn't happen until August, the year it happened. But it might put Ian Moore back in the Duan Jones territory of forcing change, which was just like, well, dejuan Jones has to be a starting tackle, so we better figure out the rest of this stuff. So it's interesting, and I don't think. I think it's mostly just interesting. I don't think it's wrong. It's not wrong. It's not problematic. I think it's mostly interesting because. And we'll kind of COVID this with some of. Ryan Day said this offensive line group is like, that room's as deep as it's been, which you thought a year ago you were impressed with the depth of the offensive line. And considering they're all back, it makes sense that the head coach would be saying things like that.
- [15:14]
Bill Landis
Yeah, because if, if you. If you boil it down to they have four returning starters, they're trying to find a right guard, and they probably think they have three viable options there between Ian Moore, Josh Padilla and Gabe Van Sickle. So, like, that's great. And then, like, Jake Cook, like, really seems like he's still on the rise. He was playing center on Tuesday, which is really interesting. I thought Carter Lowe looked really good, just sort of like, physically seemed like he changed his body a little bit. So you're talking now, what, like eight, eight, nine guys? And not even talking about a couple of the freshmen they brought in, like Sam Greer and Max Riley. Like, I, you're right. I thought it last year that they were pretty deep. It was a little premature, I think, because some of that was predicated upon thinking that, like, Ethan o' Neal was going to be good, and that didn't. Didn't really come to fruition. And maybe that even Philip Daniels might be a little better than he was last year, but he's back with the year of seasoning. I think the other three guys that started are good. And, and they have. They have guys that look like they can play. Like, that was like the biggest thing with my. The, the thing that I wrote last year was that you could often, over the last, whatever, 10 years, look at the offensive line and I think more often than not feel about. Feel good about the starters. But then look at the rest of the room be like, I, I don't know that there are three other guys practicing with that group who I think are definitely going to start for this team one day. And, and I think they're just in a slightly different position right now.
- [16:40]
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- [18:06]
Douglas Mace
So, like, there's something to watch. Just, I mean, we, like, like you made the point right off the bat. It's like we're talking about all this stuff and we have a boatload more information to bring to our, our conversations and our stories and what we try to inform you guys about. And so like, we, we kind of were off a little bit with maybe some of the assumptions we had and how they might fit the pieces together. I, I just want to mention one more thing with the offensive line before we move on. And, and I was standing next to Berm when he mentioned this and it was like, oh, I think, I think you're right here. And he, when they were doing their punt drills and they always do a lot of special team stuff early, the media always ends up watching a lot of special team stuff. Rob Dishers, the new special teams coach
- [18:47]
Bill Landis
who's been brought in active, active special teams coach. He was moving.
- [18:51]
Douglas Mace
You did see him. He was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, out and about. Big disciple of Willie Fritz. It turns out. Like, like came up kind of like Willie Fritz, the current Houston coach who's really successful. It's kind of like, kind of like a lesser known Signetti, a little bit of like a guy who's been a winner kind of at every level. Maybe got his like ultimate chance a little late. So anyway, they had. Ohio State had offensive linemen as like sort of some of the primary punt protectors. And they, they had more like a three man wall the shield. Sometimes they only have a two man shield, right. Looked like more three man shield with an offensive lineman in the middle. We saw Carter Lowe in there. We saw Jake Cook in that role. We saw Gabe Van Sickle in that role. And Burn was like, I can't remember seeing this. And there was like sort of a staffer moving around. Like staffers gave us a little bit of like the, the high eyebrows. Like new, new special teams coach might have some new ideas about how to use guys.
- [19:44]
Bill Landis
Are you allowed, are you allowed to think creatively about special teams?
- [19:49]
Douglas Mace
It's like we don't want, we don't want to get a punt blocked. Let's put 300 pound Carter Low right in front of the punter and say block anybody that tries to come near this guy. It's like, works for me.
- [20:01]
Bill Landis
I was wondering because I wasn't looking at that part of the field, but I was watching the offensive lineman during that special teams period. I was looking at the group like, where is everybody? They're like, they're like six offensive linemen light and I don't know where they are because normally they're not involved with punt teams.
- [20:16]
Douglas Mace
Yeah, they're protecting punts. So how about that? All right, let's, let's do a little bit of like, who else caught our eye? Is there somebody that again, you looked a little more offense. I looked a little more defense. That kind of like you.
- [20:28]
Bill Landis
You made Note of Devin McEwen, transfer receiver from UTSA. I, I wrote this in a, in a thing that I wrote on Monday. I went through 90 players on the roster. First of all, apologies to David Adolf. I didn't know he was still on the team, but he is still on the team. Otherwise it would have been 91, but it was 9. It was 90. 90 thoughts on 90 players. Oh yeah, because I, I did like everybody I thought would be like considered a scholar, like a, like a scholarship guy in the old days. So I didn't include him. But I did it. I did in that about Devin McQ and I wrote like he was. If you watch him at utsa, he looked really fast and it's like track times from high school are ridiculous. He is super fast. But you, it's hard to tell exactly how that speed will play when he's like around other guys who are much higher level athletes as well. Yeah, I thought he, I thought he looked fast today in day one of spring practice. Like they were doing some routes on air stuff. So like nothing, nothing crazy, but part of that involved like running some, some shallow crosses where you can kind of open it up a little bit as you run across the field. And I was like, yeah, he, he runs like an Ohio State guy runs. I, I just think like generally the offense like felt like it had a little more speed kind of across the board, but Devin McEwen was definitely a guy that jumped out to me.
- [21:50]
Douglas Mace
Okay, that's good to know. And I think I again, if you guys want to subscribe, Bill and Doug osu.substack.com we posted as soon as we got in from practice on Tuesday. We posted our thoughts over on the sub stack. We're going to do a bigger show on Wednesday about our thoughts. We'll post our thoughts again on Thursday. We're going to write some things over on the subs based on what we asked Ryan Day, what he talked about on Tuesday, what Julian sand and Kenyatta Jackson say on Thursday. So go visit us and you can get 18 off your annual subscription during Spring Ball, Bill. So like that can people, if people are interested, is it pretty easy to find the 18 off deal? How do they get it?
- [22:31]
Bill Landis
Yeah, it should just be on the normal landing page for subscriptions if for some reason that it's not. Billandougosu.substack.com Spring 18 Also, if you go to either of our Twitter accounts, like I tweeted it and you retweeted it, the link is there. Okay. As well. And it comes out to 81.99 for the first year. Pretty good. Yeah. Discount off of 99.
- [22:55]
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- [22:56]
Douglas Mace
So looking at the corner group, first of all, it's just like and, and maybe we are like you put your preconceived notions on guys, but it's like clearly Jermaine Matthews and Devin Sanchez are viewed as the likely starters at outside corner. And Jermaine Matthews has been around forever and Devin Sanchez was a true freshman last year who certainly had a role played. 300 snaps, started a couple games, ended up playing a lot against Miami when Lorenzo Styles got hurt but was a true freshman. And, and then it was like we showed up today and like Devin Sanchez is like, yeah, I got this. Like he's just like going through Dr. Like you go. It's just on day one. Do you go through drills like a new guy or do you go through drills like a guy who's like, I, I, I've got this. And Devin Sanchez went through drills like a guy who's got this, which is not a surprise, but also is like, he didn't go through drills like that last year because he was a freshman.
- [23:52]
Bill Landis
You can tell when. And Ryan Day said this about Chris Hender Jr. And Jade and Guilford. He said like Chris Henry Jr. Caught a big post. Jade and Guilford caught a nice sort of like middle cross. But neither one of those guys knows what they're doing. It's like you can. And you can tell that. I think you can often tell that about freshmen. Like, they're great, they're great looking athletes, but there's just, there's a, I don't know if it's like timidness is the right word or just. You just don't walk, you don't walk with your head quite as high, I think. Exactly. Freshman trying to figure stuff out. Yeah.
- [24:24]
Douglas Mace
So now we'll go to speak of a guy. So I thought it. You watched the group of corners behind those two presumed starters. And again, like, just as a, as a FYI, you break up in corners and safeties like Earl Little, who's the nickel, who's the slot. He's not with the corners, he's with the safeties. Right. It's just like, how do you. And, and that is.
- [24:44]
Bill Landis
Where was Jay Timmons?
- [24:46]
Douglas Mace
Jay Timmons I think was more probably with the safeties.
- [24:51]
Bill Landis
Okay.
- [24:52]
Douglas Mace
And I saw him line up as like the backup nickel a little bit behind her.
- [24:55]
Bill Landis
A little. So I think, yeah, he's like 5 11. So like he's not, he's. Ohio State likes bigger corners. I think that's where Timmons will end up. Is it, Nicole?
- [25:04]
Douglas Mace
So it's not a gigantic group, but in terms of like, there's just some interesting. Like you look at the athletes, you look at the bodies in this group of backup corners and it's like Dominic Kelly is 6:2 and he is long, man. Like, he is long. This is the transfer from Georgia. He's a second year guy. It's like, okay, like, I can see where that's going. You look who's the guy? Who's the 6? Jordan Woods. Jordan woods, who's a redshirt freshman who's 64 who just looks a little bit still. Like, he's almost like growing into his body still. But he's a 6 foot 4 corner. You don't see that every day. That guy is long. Inky Jones, just as a. Like again, it's one of These guys. He's sort of like the David Adolf maybe of the defense. He's a senior. He's 6 2. He was running with the twos at corner like you line up Inky Jones. He doesn't look like a walk on. It's like, like I, I don't know what's gonna, I mean but again like he just looks like a real dude. But anyway. Cam Calhoun, the Alabama transfer, Utah by way of Alabama, six foot again, looks the part, has two years of eligibility. But the guy to me that I thought stood out of the backup corners in the way he looked, the way he moved is Jordan Thomas, number 15 as a true freshman jersey kid. I just thought. And he again, just quick glances, some stuff looked like he was in there with the twos in a little bit of the full team, 11 on 11 stuff. I just thought like I, it's just one of those again, like you're, you're, if we played the roster game, you, you were showing off for me a little bit. At one point we were doing something because we were trying to figure out who the leaders were of different stretching drills and I was writing down the numbers and you were running through the names and you were showing off. You're trying to make me feel bad and like if we did a trivia night of name the roster numbers, you would beat me 50 to 0. Like I, I, I struggle, I'm old and dumb. So what happens is you're watching and it's a good way to watch. I actually am better at watching practice than you are because my ignorance helps me because I have no preconceived notion. I don't know who that is. I don't know who that is. I just see a number and I see a guy moving and I see a guy going through a drill and I think to myself, I wonder who that is. And then I look and I don't know whether I'm looking at a senior, whether I'm looking at a five star recruit, whether I'm looking at a late add to the class, whether I'm looking at a transfer. I don't know what I'm looking at. But I did that with Jordan Thomas. All these corners, I did it with Jordan Thomas and I was like, oh,
- [27:40]
Bill Landis
he's a true freshman.
- [27:41]
Douglas Mace
He's a borderline top 100 recruit from New Jersey. He's kind of a big deal, that guy, considering it's the first time he's ever been at a college football practice. Looks like he knows what he's doing and it Just made me note like maybe keep Jordan Thomas in the back of your head for this fall.
- [27:57]
Bill Landis
661189 yeah, like I think I said this. We did the draft of. Of questions for the spring. It was one our. Our subscriber only show last week. And I think maybe the last one I picked was sort of wondering if cornerback is a little more open than maybe we would anticipate with Jermaine Matthews coming back as a returning starter and Devin Sanchez back as a presumed starter. And it's not, it's nothing about those two guys like not being good enough. I think it's more of a question of like, might they actually rotate? Because I wonder about guys like Jordan Thomas as a freshman and Dominic Kelly as a sophomore transfer from Georgia. Dominic Kelly, by the way, and a purse. They were doing a pursuit kind of drill where basically like they threw a quick pass or receiver, that receiver turned up field and then a DB would, would track him and like tag him on the hip. And that's the end of the drill. Except for when Dominic Kelly did it. Because Dominic Kelly ran over Jerquad and Guilford and like I was on the other side of the field and I heard it and he put him on the ground and like no one said, hey, don't do that. You got to protect each other. It seemed like people were pretty fired up. Kelly decided he was going to lower the boom on somebody in a pursuit drill where you're supposed to tag on the hip.
- [29:11]
Douglas Mace
Respect. So I thought it was like, it's like it's not, it's not a huge group, especially if Timmons is with the safeties. It's like kind of like an interesting collection of athletes potentially at corner behind Matthews and Sanchez. And again, you can line them up. Devin Sanchez is a long, lean athlete, man. And, and just getting to talk to him a little bit last year, like, just seems like a completely together mature guy. 62198 Dominic Kelly does not look all that different from Devin Sanchez. Right. I mean it's just like one of the. So, so anyway, I, I walked away kind of enthused by the corner group and I think we can I just have a brief conversation about this. Ryan Day mentioned depth with multiple groups and I think it is confirming multiple position groups. A little bit of what we talked about that the transfer portal, it solidified their depth. It was not necessarily about bringing in superstars. And there's a conversation I want to have a little bit more about that. But he mentioned it in the secondary. He mentioned it on the defensive line. He mentioned it on the offensive line. And I think that's the kind of thing that like Ryan Day really feels good about is that even, I mean you can, of course everyone feels good about Sunny Styles and Carnell Tate and Arvell Reese and Caleb Downs when those are your top end guys. But he really likes depth in the room and I think he feels like he has it almost all the way through the roster and I think that's what the portal brought to this team.
- [30:45]
Bill Landis
Yeah, it seemed like the only, the only room maybe where he was a little uncertain about that was running back and part of that's because Bo Jackson and Isaiah west aren't doing anything this spring. But yeah, I was surprised. I think he, I, I did control F for the word deep in my transcript. He said it five times.
- [31:04]
Douglas Mace
Oh, okay.
- [31:06]
Bill Landis
I think twice might have been about receiver. But then, so then there's yeah, three others in there.
- [31:10]
Strawberry Me Advertiser
So.
- [31:11]
Douglas Mace
But he said like this Brian Hartline group where he's recruiting four or five stars every year. He said we're as deep at receiver as we've been in a while.
- [31:20]
Bill Landis
That was super interesting to me because I was thinking to myself because I thought, you know, just watching the receivers, it was, it was like a good looking group. But it's like always a good looking group. Right. Like when's the last time you went out to on High State practice and looked at receivers and didn't see seven guys? You thought we're gonna be first round draft picks. But like these guys are, are a little older. Obviously there's production with Devin McEwen. Kyle Parker's played some and then like Chris Henry Jr. And Jacquaden Guilford and Brock Boyd and Jaden Ricketts are just like all potential. You don't even know what they are yet. So I, I don't know that I'd agree that it's like a super deep room, but I think it's like an exciting, interesting room and maybe a way that it hasn't been in a while.
- [32:00]
Douglas Mace
It feels like. I think he likes the idea that there maybe are fewer question marks. This is hard. This is going to be a God that 4,000 questions for the head coach. They probably have fewer set question marks at the twos than they usually do because some of their twos are like a third year guy from Alabama who was a five star recruit who's played a thousand snaps and he's a quay we're saw is a two for them. Right. Some of their twos, like if you Like Cam Calhoun, who I wouldn't say like, jumped out the most to me among the cornerback guys, Cam Calhoun, like, might be like their sixth best outside corner, maybe fifth or sixth best. Cam Calhoun played almost 400 snaps at Utah in 2024 and was like, really good. And he might be Ohio State's sixth best corner. And like, I think Ryan Day, like loves the way that makes him feel when he tucks himself into bed at night.
- [33:09]
Bill Landis
I think you're right because that, that's sort of the conversation we had earlier in the transfer portal about a lot of these additions that Ohio State made were, were about fortifying things. And we're going to talk about this in a second. But, but it was, a lot of it was about creating the environment for like the guys who were already in the program to, to thrive. Right. So I, yeah, I think like not, not every single position feels this way, but like we put together a depth chart on the sub stack and if you just like look through it and you look who's like listed second instead of listed first. There are guys who have played a lot of football. They haven't played at Ohio State, but they played a lot of football. And I do, I do think there is comfort in that for Ryan Day or probably any head coach.
- [33:53]
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- [34:23]
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- [34:53]
Douglas Mace
I'm watching the defense who's running with the ones it feels. You know, the defensive tackles who were running with the ones are Edric Houston and Will Smith on the first day of practice. And the defensive tackles who are running with the twos are the two transfers, James Smith from Alabama and James and John Walker from ucf. And so in the moment in January when they're losing Jarquez Carter to Miami as a guy who was a big time recruit, you think had a lot of potential is gonna, is gonna be a second year player but barely played last year, but absolutely, if he was here, could have been in contention to be in the two deep at Ohio State. And he's gone. And now John Walker and James Smith are here. Like right now they're not playing Indiana tomorrow. But so like right now, on the first day of spring practice, I think Ryan Day is like, I'll take James Smith and, and John Walker over Jarquez Carter all day because on the first day of spring practice, James Smith knows what practice is and Jarquez Carter is, is a second year guy who barely played as a freshman. Like, I'll take that experience. Experience and depth. Now when you need somebody to make a play in the middle of the third quarter against Indiana in a top five matchup, we'll see. And that's when it matters the most. But I think, is it possible, and I'm going to present a theory of the case tomorrow on the Substack show because I've, I've, I've had a couple evolve during the course of watching an hour of practice. Is one of the other possibilities this year, Bill, that the twos are better and the ones won't be quite as good compared to last year, which is just part of a function of like, no Caleb Downs, no Arvel Reese, no Sonny Styles, no Carnell Tate. What are you gonna do? But the twos are better. And then we get into a discussion about like, okay, coach. All right, coach. What makes you sleep better at night? Better ones or better twos? What makes you sleep better? Bill Landis.
- [36:52]
Bill Landis
It's a funny question when you think about it. Better twos, probably. Yeah. Yeah. I think there's a part. Ryan Day was talking about this. He said, talking about, like adding more veteran guys. And he said, you got to get more veteran guys in a room or else you're just constantly young. And then he said, I felt like we were a little young last year.
- [37:15]
Douglas Mace
Yeah.
- [37:15]
Bill Landis
And I think his enthusiasm for this year's team on day one of spring is that he looks out onto the field and doesn't think that.
- [37:23]
Douglas Mace
Yep. So let's. We'll save, we'll save the, the super. Like, if you want us to talk about legend Bay, we're gonna do it last. Even though the legend, Dave Biddle. The first question of spring football is about legend Bay because it takes a legend to ask about one. And, and I 100 mean that all the Way around because it was like, like, hey, hey, Biddle, how come you're asking about stuff that fans care about? You've had, you were watching this show, you have had a legend Bay conversation with somebody in your family or friend group that they didn't know what you were talking about and you couldn't help yourself and you started talking about legend Bay. So Dave Biddle served you and we're going to talk about it. But I want to talk about this, this experience stuff first. This hit my ear in a way it didn't hit your ear. Let's, let's see if we can talk about this. Ryan Day and talking about Rabinowitz kind of, didn't Rabinowitz kind of ask Day this question kind of in the way that I think most of us had been talking about it, which was you lost some young guys in the portal, but you brought in all this veteran depth. Right. That was the, which is what we all talked about in January. He talked, Ryan Day, in his answer, said there are some things analytically of, you can see how much our snap count went up, you know, with the transfer guys that we added. I don't know. I thought, I don't know who's analytically breaking that down. I thought that could have been a Dougie spreadsheet reference.
- [38:53]
Bill Landis
It could have been, yeah.
- [38:55]
Douglas Mace
Did that catch your ear? It did.
- [38:57]
Bill Landis
I've never, I've never gone through the roll of subscribers to see if there's an R day in there, but maybe there is.
- [39:02]
Walmart Express Delivery Advertiser
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- [39:03]
Douglas Mace
Yeah. I mean, like the word could sell. I mean, if you're, if these sids are doing their job, they're passing along the valuable information that is sometimes provided by the media to the people in the building. So all we said in the off season is what if they brought back all these guys? This is what they're like projected too deep or whatever. This is the number of snaps they would have had. This is the number of the snaps that they have instead with the transfers. And it went up. But Ryan Day did not talk really in his answer about, for instance, Terry Moore is here as a transfer from Duke because Fahim Delane, as a second year player and big time recruit transferred to lsu. It, you know, Cam Calhoun is not here because Aaron Scott transferred to Oregon or Bryce west transferred to Wisconsin. He talked about it in terms of, he said, first of all, and he challenged people to go do the research on this and I'll, and I'll do it next week when you're covering basketball. How many. He said he thinks he May it certainly implied that Ohio State has lost more third year and done players to the NFL, I would say in his coaching tenure than anybody. I don't know if that's true. I think he might be right. I think we see less of that generally speaking. College football, that used to be the way of the world. That's how you built great teams. We've talked about that a million times. You needed to hit when your great recruiting class was in its third year because a lot of those guys are going to go to the league. And then in 2024, Ohio State won a national championship by two, keeping so many guys from going to the league. They had a great recruiting class and they kept them around for year four. And then Ryan Day said, as you just referenced, he said if you lose third year guys, you're just going to be young, young, young, young, young. If you don't bring in transfers, he felt they were young last year and then he was Saying Caleb Downs, three year guy to the NFL. Cade McDonald, three year guy to the NFL. Arval Reese, three year guy to the NFL. Carnell Tate, three year guy to the NFL. And Ryan Day said that he counts Sonny styles as a 3 year guy to the NFL because son but one of them, he reclassified when they recruited him, they were thinking of him as being in this class and then he was here as a true freshman. He was 17 years old. Right. So it's not, but it kind of is. And so he then was more saying, I think he didn't say this specifically, but it's not that Terry Moore, a Duke transfer is here instead of is replacing Fahim Delane. Terry Moore is here to fulfill the fourth year of Caleb Downs that they're not getting. Kyle Parker and Devin McEwen aren't here because Quincy Porter and Myelin Graham left. They are here to fulfill the fourth year of Carnell Tate. They're not getting Christian Allegro is not here because they lost. Do they lose any linebackers in the portal?
- [41:42]
Bill Landis
No, this is on his game but
- [41:45]
Douglas Mace
they're trying to like they want. But Christian Allegro is here because Sonny Stiles is not quay Russia is here because Arvell Reese is not. James Smith and John Walker, defensive tackle are here because Kaden McDonald is not. So it's one of these things and Ryan Day has the ability to do this at times. He can, he can make it like, well, we're so talented. It's impossible to coach us because you guys don't know how hard it is because we're so good. But he Said this mostly about quarterback in the past of like, man, yeah, I don't even get to have a second year of a quarterback. He had one year. Dwayne has.
- [42:18]
Strawberry Me Advertiser
Right.
- [42:19]
Douglas Mace
And so there was a question today about you're getting a year two of Julian Stan. He said, we had it with Justin Fields, we had it with CJ Stroud. We hadn't had it otherwise with guys. He's excited to have Julian Stan for year two, but he was, he's lamenting a little bit the idea of like, well, we lost these guys. All those guys should be here. All those guys left eligibility on the table. Right. So he is thinking of when you're piecing your roster together, it's like, well, why did you bring in more veteran transfers than you ever did before? It felt like to me, Bill, he was answering in a way that foremost in his mind was, well, because we lost so many third year guys to the NFL and we had to replenish that. And maybe they had not lost as many third year guys to the NFL because in 20 after, you know, for the 2024 season, they didn't lose any. And then they didn't lose as many for the 2025 season. This was like a, this is like if he thinks of Sunny as a third year guy, that's five major holes.
- [43:16]
Bill Landis
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [43:19]
Douglas Mace
So then instead of their transfer portal strategy being a reaction to their young guys leaving, it is a more of a planned reaction to their NFL third year guys leaving. And it's the same thing. But I think it's a slight twist on how you think about it. And I just, it did strike my ear a little bit of maybe, maybe that's how Ryan Day was thinking of it. Maybe that's how we should think of it. And then maybe going forward, if we feel like they have a bunch of third year guys who are going to leave for the NFL, that's when you activate oh High Estate's really going to be active in the portal. Not because they're worried that their first and second year guys aren't ready or are untested. So because like whether a guy's a fourth year guy or a third year guy and he goes to the league, you're losing him. But it felt like he, he, he was more aware of that because they were third year guys.
- [44:25]
Bill Landis
That makes sense to me now. Now you got me looking at the 2024 recruiting class to see how many third year guys are going to have leave.
- [44:32]
Douglas Mace
Right. Is it going to be anybody besides Jeremiah.
- [44:43]
Bill Landis
Jaylen McLean? Maybe.
- [44:45]
Douglas Mace
Okay.
- [44:46]
Bill Landis
I think they're the only two candidates. Jeremiah Smith, Edrick Houston, Jalen McLean are the leading candidates. But I would say right now I'd probably only say Jeremiah.
- [44:56]
Douglas Mace
So then if you said, it's like, oh, I was Ohio State so active in the ports, like, well, that's five third year guys to the NFL in Ryan Day's head. And next year they're gonna lose one. They're not gonna be as active in the portal. Like, okay, like that's, that's a piece of information that was sitting there, but wasn't the way I was thinking about it.
- [45:12]
Bill Landis
It's not the way I was thinking about it. I was, yeah, it just, I, I thought of it as whatever, whatever a balance of in and out strictly via the portal. Like the, the NFL guys were sort of not part of my equation when I thought about that. But I, I see the logic. It makes me question a little bit, like, how you get off that cycle. But I guess the thing maybe we don't know is if, is there like a strong pushback now moving forward to playing inexperienced guys, like, no matter how old they are, or is it more about their age? Right. Because I think like when you brought in these transfers, you're going to have a group of players rising up in 2027 who are older but perhaps have not played a ton. But is, is the, is the fact that they're older and independent of the program for four years more important to you than whether or not they have a thousand snaps under their belt?
- [46:07]
Douglas Mace
Right. I thought this was a version of Ryan Day saying, I want fourth year players. So if we can have fourth year players ourselves, that we, we keep Jalen McLean for year four the way we kept Travion Henderson and Ameka Buka for year four. That's my first preference. If, if we can't keep them for year four because other, because either they transferred out after year one or two because they didn't play or because they were so good they went to the NFL, then we have to go get year four players. And we did sort of talk like, Senior Day is going to be weird as heck because Senior Day for this team is going to be like a bunch of guys who like just got here. Right. And not that many homegrown guys. But if that's the strategy, and it's not even, I mean, like. And so some of the year four guys right now are actually year five guys or year six guys or whatever. But at Ohio State, Ryan Day is thinking, they're my seniors. I need seniors. I need seniors. We need seniors to win. Seniors win and we like, like. And that's different even I think than it's in the same category but it's a little different than number of snaps, how many years, whatever. It's like if our guys are going to the league after three years, then we're going to replace them with seniors and if they're staying and they're not going to league then we don't have to do it as much. It's like, okay, same thing, different.
- [47:35]
Bill Landis
Yeah, I think they're, they are simultaneously in a position where like they probably won't have a lot of guys who were three years and done but also not bringing back a lot of homegrown fourth year players because a lot of those guys are transferred already.
- [47:51]
Douglas Mace
Right.
- [47:52]
Bill Landis
So like they signed 22 guys in that 20, 24 class and like half of them aren't here anymore. Right. So they'll probably have to do this again. Yeah.
- [48:05]
Douglas Mace
Okay, let's talk about legend Bay.
- [48:07]
Bill Landis
But maybe that's also why you signed 30 high school kids. Because if half of them leave you still at 50.
- [48:13]
Douglas Mace
Because I think all things being equal, you'd rather have homegrown seniors. You'd rather have guys who have been in your program for four years and know understand the ins and outs and how to succeed as a Buckeye. But if you can't have that, then I'll take somebody who's been in college for three years at least.
- [48:27]
Bill Landis
Yeah.
- [48:29]
Douglas Mace
Who knows what practice, what spring practice is like.
- [48:33]
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- [49:04]
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- [49:33]
Douglas Mace
I can't believe Legend. I can't believe the answer to Legend Bay included Ryan Day saying, I wasn't here with Curtis Samuel, but I know it was Good. Because let me say this to Ryan Day. I was here with Curtis Samuel and he was good. And Legend Bay has a long way to go to be Curtis Samuel. And like, I'm not sure you want him to be Curtis Samuel because part of Curtis Samuel being Curtis Samuel was there was nobody else around to help him. But that did nothing to tamp down Legend Bay expectations. When you start comparing him to the guy who did this
- [50:14]
Bill Landis
arm spread, crossing the goal line for people who are listening, what'd you think of that? Yeah, I thought he. He did. He walked it back a little bit. While also invoking the name of Curtis Samuel after going on the radio and comparing on the Tyree Kill. So. So I don't. I don't. I think he's really excited about him, about Legend. Brian Day is really excited about Legend Bay. I do think, as we've discussed. Right. They don't. They've. He has not really had a guy like this, although he reminded us. And like, I had forgotten shout out to this guy because he was a pretty solid player. They did have Xavier Johnson, who was a receiver and a running back now, and it was actually. Actually like a pretty good athlete, I think played in the NFL for a little bit, but wasn't what Legend Bay was coming out of high school. I don't think is quite as fast as Legend Bay, but I think comparing him to Xavier Johnson is a little instructive for how they might try to use him, because when they had a guy of that skill set, they did play him at running back and receiver.
- [51:18]
Douglas Mace
They did, and they loved it.
- [51:20]
Bill Landis
He was good. I was. I was Xavier Johnson over. Over his career at Ohio State, but it's like, really, the last two years, he had 70 touches for 682 yards, almost 10 yards touch pretty good.
- [51:35]
Douglas Mace
That's crazy. And caught, like, the game winning down and have they. Right. Yeah, like, and. And they really did. Like, they liked being able to, like, have him be in the game as a receiver. But, like, the, the defense thought, oh, Ohio State's going empty here, whatever. Then they put him in the backfield.
- [51:58]
Bill Landis
Yes.
- [51:59]
Douglas Mace
Like, they love doing that kind of thing. So I, it's hard because, like, it does. I, you know, sometimes, like, it does. We're not here to serve players and coaches were here to serve fans. So it's like, okay, what's the point of getting overhyped about stuff? And it's like, all right, coach, compared to Samuel, like, it's over.
- [52:19]
Bill Landis
Let's go.
- [52:19]
Douglas Mace
Curtis Samuel, 2016. 202 snaps in the backfield, 408 snaps in the slot, 97 carries, 98 targets. I. Ryan Day is a little bit worried about the running back depth and it's a little odd. And it's, it is. Sometimes it's like Ryan Day on one hand has to be a master planner and have an understanding of every tiny corner of this program. On the other hand, he stood at practice today and was like, man, we don't have any running backs. And it's like, well, Bo Jackson and Isaiah west are right there. They're just hurt. And he's like, I don't care who's right there. I'm looking right there at the running back group and there's nobody there in that group. And so that's what he brought to the news conference. And he was like, we don't have any running backs, right? He was like. And it's like, but Bo and Isaiah Ryan, turn your head. He's like, I'm not turning my head. I'm looking at this group and this group has four guys in it. And I like Legend Bay the best Legend Bay is Curtis Samuel and that's what he brought in. So I'm very curious how this actually works itself out because, like, how do you. And he. What did he say about slot and backfill? Like, are they going to line up Legend Bay, like, as the single running back? Are they going to have him in the game with another running back and offset? Is he going to line up at slot receiver? Like, what's this going to be?
- [53:45]
Bill Landis
I think he will be the only running back on the field sometimes. Yeah, like he's, he's going through running back drills, right? They were doing the backfield drills with the quarterbacks. And one, they were under center. Two, they were running outside zone tracks. Welcome to Ohio State. Arthur Smith and Legend Bay was with those guys. It wasn't like he was with the receivers and then was going over to do some running back stuff. Like he was, he was a running back the whole time. So he's like kind of done neither. That's, that's, that's the key difference between Legend Bay and Xavier Johnson and Curtis Samuel is like, he played quarterback in high school. So I think Malachi Tony did, by the way, anyway, so I don't. I. I'll be interested to see if later in the spring maybe we see him also doing receiver stuff or like lining up in the slot a little bit. There was none of that, like, he was all running back on, on day one, but I do think he'll do Both. I don't know. He's like not the biggest guy in the world. Like he's. He does not look like a guy who can get. Get whatever 20 carries a game but I think he could be a guy that gets like six touches a game and see what happens.
- [55:00]
Douglas Mace
Yeah. Curtis Samuel Snap counts 2014 as a freshman 1642015 as a sophomore 2972016 is the entire offense. 657 when he had 164 snap counts as a freshman he played 36 of those against Kent State in week three. Ohio State this season plays Kent State in week three. Get the Family together for the legend Bay experience.
- [55:32]
Bill Landis
You're selling tickets in the Kent State game.
- [55:34]
Douglas Mace
I mean I didn't Demario like Demario McCall then he go nuts against bowling. What was the Demario McCall game? Bowling green. I like. This is where hybrid Ohio State wrinkle weapons destroy Mac opponents and then like Ohio State gets in the Big Ten schedule. Like I running back better be 64 and 400 pounds. And it's like okay, goodbye hybrid wrinkle guy. Yeah, see you next year when the Mac team comes back. So this is the thing that I just. And I would depending how the legend Bay conversation continues. I have two primary questions for Ryan Day. Did they target this type of player that they wanted a hybrid slot running back guy that we have talked about. They have had in the past. They haven't had in a very long time though. Did they want to bring this back to the offense? Because Brian Hartline and as we said makes a lot of sense was like give me a bunch of 6, 4, 215 guys, 15 pound guys who look like they can play linebacker. That's who I want at receiver. And so was this done with purpose or did you just sort of come across this guy in recruiting and think to yourself my God, this guy's pretty explosive. Let's see if he wants to be a Buckeye, right? Was it or did you. Did you set out with like we want to find a little slot guy that can play some in the backfield and we are now searching the country for that guy. I don't know the answer to that. Do you know the answer to that? Whether no accidental or. Or a purposeful change in plan.
- [57:13]
Bill Landis
I don't know the answer to that but it's definitely a worthwhile question because I, you know, it's. I kind of think like a high state should have a guy like that and they just haven't for a while
- [57:24]
Douglas Mace
and But I think like you can't have a guy like that if you're just not going to play him. Like, because. To bring him in because like, like the last guy, like Jalen Gill was probably the last guy who's a little bit like this. Then it was like, okay, well, it's just, it's not happening and then you have to leave. So like it's one of those things you can't. If you're going to recruit it, you have to be willing to play it that type of player. So it. So I'm. I'm wondering if there's a shift here and the shift would have happened even like pre heartline because I mean like, right, it wasn't like, oh, Brian Hartline left. Let's get a small receiver now.
- [57:56]
Bill Landis
Jalen Gill was in the receiver room too. Like, I don't. There could be something to the idea of Legend Bay not being in the receiver room and maybe it's not even worth. That's not even worth considering now because Brian Hartline's gone and like, whatever receiver is a little different. But yeah, a guy like that I do think would tend to get lost in the receiver room because of how good it's been lately. But if you're in the running back room, I think you can stick out a little more and just maybe be viewed or thought of a little differently and have a better chance of. Of not getting lost like some other guys have.
- [58:27]
Douglas Mace
And then my second question is, who's in charge of making sure he doesn't fall through the cracks? Who's the legend? Bay coach. And maybe right like Ryan Day should say, could say, or somebody's like, I'm in charge of that because what happens? And like again, I've covered this long enough where it's like every. It's like, what, what groups he with? That's like the, like, oh, we have open practice. I want to see what groups are Curtis Samuels with. Like. And then every time it's like we talk to the running max coach, we talk to the receivers coach. Is Curtis Samuel in your room? It's Curtis Samuel in the other room. Always in your room. 40 of the time is the other room. 60 of the time. Oh, does he walk down the hall? Does he have to like, leave a recorder in the other room so he doesn't miss? Like, how do you do this? And like there are guys. Like, there have been guys. It's like, well, they're in both rooms and if you're in both rooms, sometimes you're in no room because then you're behind all the time, wherever you are, you know, less than your peers because they're in one room the whole time. So what is the plan to make this actually work? And if the plan is Legend Bay's, like, tell Cortez Hankton to forget Legend Bay's name because he's never gonna see him. Carlos Lachlan is chaining the door and not letting him out of the running back room. And if we want after practice to have him run a couple routes, so be it. He's not missing one word of knowledge that Carlos Lachlan is imparting, Then that's a good plan. Like, tell me the plan. Because it's, it's. If you're talking about a guy in a special way, it requires a special plan. And usually when the plan is special, it fails.
- [59:57]
Bill Landis
I think it's all fair. Yeah, I think that'll be. There's. There's a lot more to dive into here and part of it is just like, I think like watching him a little more too. We'll be back out there Thursday. It does sound like we'll have other opportunities later in the spring to watch some stuff too. So that'll be all instructive about this. Like, I don't. It's. It's a very easy conversation to get carried away with quickly. And I think part of that's okay because, like it's fun or whatever, like it's spring ball. Let's. Yeah, we don't take it so seriously.
- [60:28]
Douglas Mace
But.
- [60:28]
Bill Landis
But I do. But to your point, like there have, there have been guys like this before where it's just like it's, it was never progressed to anything more than theory really. And like this, this, you know, we want to see this do that. So. Yeah, there are a lot more questions asked about it.
- [60:45]
Douglas Mace
Was it last spring or two springs ago that Ryan Day hinted that Caleb Downs was going to play some running back?
- [60:51]
Bill Landis
It was. It was Caleb's first spring here. Yeah. So two springs ago.
- [60:54]
Douglas Mace
So like. So Ryan didn't get a little loose in March.
- [60:59]
Bill Landis
Yeah.
- [61:01]
Douglas Mace
Who cares? Tavian Sinclair gonna play a little tight end. Okay. That was made up. That's not real.
- [61:11]
Bill Landis
He didn't say that. Yeah.
- [61:12]
Douglas Mace
Last guy I want to talk about, Leroy Roker broke down the team. Ryan Day gave a three minute speech to the team and then they called up a player and the player they called up was third year safety Leroy Roker.
- [61:26]
Bill Landis
Yes. There are a lot of guys he could have called up. Like, clearly it's going to be. So Ryan Day's like Speech. You could. You can hear a little bit of it. He's like, kind of explaining to the group because there's 51 new guys sort of like how they practice, practice and like the structure of things and, you know, period by period and how to. What happens, what you have to do to lose your black stripe and all that stuff.
- [61:48]
Douglas Mace
Yeah.
- [61:48]
Bill Landis
So when he was done and the guy's got to break the team down, there are multiple returning captains. He could have. He could have had do that. There are multiple guys who've been in the program for a very long time that he could have turned to. To do that. And he chose Leroy Roker
- [62:05]
Douglas Mace
and I
- [62:06]
Bill Landis
think intentionally so interesting.
- [62:09]
Douglas Mace
And then Leroy Roker was kind of running with the ones a little bit because they're just not maybe like all the way back with like, some of the transfer safeties and making sure, like, Terry Moore is coming back from ACL and that kind of thing. And so, yeah, was getting a little run.
- [62:24]
Bill Landis
He definitely was. I. That pursuit drill that I mentioned earlier where Dominic Kelly ran over Jacquia and Guilford, like, Terry Moore was doing that. So I don't. I don't know what the limitations are, if any. His. His surgery was well over a year ago to repair his ACL detour at Duke. His surgery was in January of 2025. So I don't. And he wasn't like wearing a knee brace or anything that I could tell. So I don't. I think he can ease a guy back into it maybe. I don't know how much Terry Moore was able to practice last year at Duke. Maybe that's more of it is than anything. Sort of like concerning getting the knee where it needs to be.
- [62:59]
Douglas Mace
All right, we'll end it there. We'll talk more about some stuff. I got a theory we're going to put out on the Wednesday show as it relates to the 2026 Ohio State Buckeyes. We got a lot of responses from people. The whatcha question of the week is about how often do you go to the movies? We're having a good discussion over on the substack chat about that. We'll break that down. And then Big Ten hoops tournament is this week. We'll keep a little bit of an eye on that. Right, Landis?
- [63:25]
Bill Landis
Yeah, it starts Thursday. Ohio State will play at noon against probably Iowa or Oregon or Maryland. Yeah.
- [63:34]
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- [63:36]
Douglas Mace
So thanks, you guys, for being here again. Bill and Doug. Osu.substack.com if you want to go check us out over there for now, Ball is back. He's Bill Landis on Douglas Mace. And that was the Bill and Doug Show.
- [63:56]
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Douglas Mace
I think we should call a doctor.
- [64:43]
Bill Landis
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