Is the Big Ten in playoff trouble? Playoff race for Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana, Michigan & Nebraska

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Is the Big Ten in playoff trouble? Playoff race for Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana, Michigan & Nebraska"

The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
Hosts: Doug Lesmerises & Bill Landis
Date: October 8, 2025
Platform: Blue Wire

---

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the College Football Playoff (CFP) landscape, with a sharp focus on the Big Ten’s playoff prospects: Is the ongoing national narrative and playoff math putting the Big Ten at risk of limited representation? Doug and Bill examine whether the Big Ten is truly facing a "one-bid" threat and forecast how teams like Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana, Michigan, and Nebraska fit in the crowded playoff field, while weighing ongoing perceptions of the SEC and debates over Southern college football bias.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Big Ten's Playoff Peril: Reality or Overreaction? (01:01 - 05:38)

• Initial Worries: Bill expresses concern about the possibility of the Big Ten only getting a single team into the expanded playoff, citing ESPN's playoff predictions and public narratives that seem slanted in favor of the SEC.

  • "I'm just getting a little nervous about what might happen should this Oregon, Indiana game go a certain way and Penn State like truly never gets back up off the mat..." (06:44, Bill)

• SEC vs. Big Ten Perceptions: Doug notes that ESPN’s playoff predictor and weekly coverage (e.g., Heather Dinich’s articles) reflect not just SEC favoritism but also the current strength of SEC’s "middle" compared to the Big Ten.

  • "I do think there is something temporary before all these SEC teams start playing each other and beating each other, that right now they look glossier than similar Big Ten teams..." (04:34, Doug)

• Context Matters: Both hosts agree that much of the lopsided projections are due to scheduling quirks and not necessarily reflective of how things will look in November.

---

2. Schedule Scenarios and the Perils of Parity (10:10 - 18:46)

• Variance in Outcomes: The hosts stress that upsets in the Big Ten's middle tier (like UCLA over Penn State) could devastate the conference’s playoff hopes. However, Bill isn’t overly alarmed by the prospect, calling the Penn State loss to UCLA "a bit of a dead cat bounce." (10:29, Bill)

• Big Ten Tiers and Mathematical Scenarios: Doug divides the Big Ten into playoff contenders (the 3 undefeated teams: Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana), one-loss hopefuls (including Michigan, Illinois, USC, Washington, Nebraska, Maryland), and longshots (like Penn State).

• Assumptions for Modeling: Doug walks through an exercise assuming top-10 teams beat the bottom-eight, tallying a series of outcomes that project how many Big Ten teams could plausibly reach 10+ wins (16:12+).

---

3. What Makes a Big Ten Team Playoff-Lock? (16:12 - 22:44)

• Undefeated/One-Loss Locks:

  • If Ohio State and Oregon go undefeated, and Indiana is 11-1 (with their only loss to Oregon), all are in as playoff teams.

  • For 10-2 teams (Illinois, Nebraska, Michigan), their chances depend highly on quality losses (ideally to playoff-caliber teams) and the competitiveness of their defeats.

    • "I don't know that you can lose by 50 and get a playoff spot if you're not 11-1." (17:50, Bill, on Illinois)

• Importance of Signature Wins: Not just record, but "who did you beat?" matters. E.g, 9-3 Washington with a win over Oregon could trump a bland 10-2 from another Big Ten team.

• Crowded Middle—Good or Bad? Having two dominant teams (OSU and Oregon) could paradoxically hurt the Big Ten’s depth of playoff representation, because teams rack up "good losses" but lack quality wins over each other.

  • "Is having two dominant teams actually bad for the league? Because that's eighteen guaranteed losses for everybody else." (22:01, Doug)

---

4. Systemic Flaws and the Role of Automatic Qualifiers (22:44 - 27:01)

• Depth vs. Top-End Dominance: Most leagues would prefer more teams in, but having two national title favorites can be both a blessing and curse.

  • "If you could guarantee an all-Big Ten national championship game, I think that would be preferable to five." (24:17, Bill)

• Debate on Playoff Structure: The current CFP system, with no automatic qualifiers in the expanded playoff, magnifies these Big Ten worries. Doug questions whether that invites unfairness or rewards the wrong aspects of team performance and league depth.

  • _"Does a discussion like this make automatic bids better for people?" (25:35, Doug)

---

5. Indiana: Real Contender or Schedule Mirage? (27:01 - 29:21)

• Roadblocks for Indiana: Their schedule sets up for a strong record if they only lose to Oregon and Penn State. But 10-2 may not be persuasive depending on margin and quality of losses.
  • "If you have two losses that look like Indiana's loss to Ohio State last year, then, then no, I don't think it is persuasive." (29:05, Bill)

---

6. Perception Problems and SEC Bias (33:06 - 36:37)

• 10-2 Big Ten vs. 9-3 SEC: The hosts are skeptical that a 10-2 Big Ten team would be a lock, yet anticipate several 9-3 SEC teams making the field based on reputation and narrative, not just quality.

  • "I just think that there still, I think, are baked-in assumptions about the SEC that might show themselves in scenarios like this." (34:55, Doug)

• Dreaming of a Big Ten-SEC Challenge: Both hosts argue for more non-conference data points to settle these debates on the field rather than in committee rooms or on TV.

  • "You know, a way to eliminate some of those assumptions would just be to have a Big Ten-SEC challenge." (35:00, Bill)

---

7. Playoff Picks and Bracket Projections (37:39 - 51:41)

Doug's Playoff Bracket Highlights (37:47 - 39:17):

• 1. Ohio State
• 2. Miami
• 3. Oregon
• 4. Texas A&M (SEC champ)
• 5. Ole Miss
• 6. Oklahoma
• 7. Texas Tech
• 8. Indiana
• 9. Georgia Tech
• 10. Notre Dame
• 11. Illinois
• 12. South Florida

Notable Observations: Doug is bold with only three SEC teams, slides in an 11-1 Indiana, and finds a playoff path for a two-loss Notre Dame if their losses are "good."
"If Notre Dame is 10-2 and it's two losses are to the ACC champ and the SEC champ, both close, I don't know how good the rest of their schedule has to be." (40:46, Doug)

Bill's Playoff Bracket Highlights (44:11 - 48:27):

• 1. Ohio State
• 2. Miami
• 3. Oregon
• 4. Texas Tech (Big 12 champ)
• 5. Texas A&M (SEC champ)
• 6. Alabama (SEC runner-up)
• 7. Oklahoma
• 8. Indiana
• 9. Ole Miss
• 10. Georgia
• 11. Michigan
• 12. South Florida

Notable Observations: Bill projects five SEC, four Big Ten, and no SEC team earning a bye—a nod to the conference’s lack of true dominance this season.
"Texas Tech 4. No buy for the SEC. I love it." (44:44, Doug in response to Bill)

• On Michigan: Both agree a late win over Ohio State makes them a playoff definite, but even a competitive loss could earn a 10-2 Michigan a spot.

  • "I do think they could go into the playoff committee room off of, like, a decently compelling Ohio State loss." (47:18, Doug)

• On SEC “Midness”: Doug remains committed to the possibility that the SEC cannibalizes itself into mid-tier status, despite skepticism from national pundits.

---

8. Final Thoughts—Where the Playoff is Headed (51:05 - End)

• On the Big Picture: Both are eager for the playoff to “work itself out” but remain wary of the “default to the SEC” if narratives don’t shift.

  • "I am rooting for [SEC chaos]." (51:36, Bill)

• On Expansion and Reforms: The episode closes echoing a desire for either more objectivity (automatic bids) or more data (non-conference showdowns) to clarify playoff contenders and help dispel old biases.

---

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• "I'm scared. I'm scared shirtless." — Doug (03:05)
• "That's what would really screw up the Big Ten." (upsets from the bottom half) — Doug (09:47)
• "Is having two dominant teams actually bad for the league? Because that's 18 guaranteed losses for everybody else." — Doug (22:01)
• "It seems like a flawed playoff system, if that were the case." — Bill, on two Big Ten powers but only two playoff bids (22:44)
• "Does a discussion like this make automatic bids better for people?" — Doug (25:35)
• "I don't know that you can lose by 50 and get a playoff spot if you're not 11-1." — Bill, on Illinois (17:50)
• "You know a way to eliminate some of those assumptions would just be to have a Big Ten-SEC challenge." — Bill (35:00)
• "If Notre Dame is 10-2 and it's two losses are to the ACC champ and the SEC champ, both close, I don't know how good the rest of their schedule has to be, if they win all the rest and they look good while they're doing it, which I think they are in the process of doing." — Doug (40:46)

---

Noteworthy Segments & Timestamps

• Big Ten & SEC Playoff Projections: 03:03 – 07:10
• Perils of the Middle (Parity and Upsets): 10:10 – 13:49
• Mathematical Scenario Breakdown: 15:12 – 18:46
• Deep Discussion on Playoff System Flaws: 22:44 – 27:01
• Indiana’s Path & Schedule: 27:01 – 29:21
• Big Ten vs. SEC Perception Bias: 33:06 – 36:37
• Playoff Bracket Reveal: 37:39 – 48:27
• Michigan's Playoff Outlook via Ohio State Game: 46:22 – 47:55
• Conclusion & Where This All Leads: 51:05 – End

---

Tone & Style Notes

The episode is fast-moving, debate-filled, and deeply analytical, with the hosts using humor, candid admissions of bias, and well-informed skepticism of both national punditry and prevailing playoff narratives — all while keeping the focus on serving Ohio State fans and fighting southern college football bias.

Transcript

[A]

Some things in life are just made for each other. Peanut butter and jelly, macaroni and cheese. Modelo and college football College football season is Modelo season and the season has officially kicked off. The Modelo recruiter is back in action.

[B]

Looking to reward full time fans who.

[A]

Give their all for their team and their school week in and week out. If you're listening to this, you've been recruited. So lace em up and get out there and don't forget to make time for a well deserved ice cold reward because college football wouldn't be the same without you. So grab yourself a Modelo and enjoy the official beer sponsor of the College Football Playoff. Modelo Foreign.

[C]

Welcome back to the Run Into Traffic edition of the Bill and Doug Show. We're talking playoff brackets and Landis. I'm not even sure I want to do it. What was your idea for this show? Like, is the Big Ten gonna get a single team into the playoff? Just one, one team, one bid league, two bid league.

[B]

Not quite that bad. Two, two bid league. Yeah, I, I think like one to ten scale. I'm not, I'm not like at a, a nine that it's going to be like that, but just looking at some stuff getting, getting a little worried about what exactly the balance is going to be between the Big Ten and the sec.

[C]

So I'm gonna. Let's, let's take the audience out to the ledge and then I actually went through some stuff and I think I can bring us back.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

From the ledge slightly. Let's walk and listen. This is not. Heatherton Dinwich takes a lot of heat at ESPN because A she works for ESPN and B, she is like the face of their playoff coverage at ESPN and so do you. And I think at times that ESPN can have a lean towards the SEC because ESPN has an agreement with the sec. Do we think that at times? I think we do.

[B]

Yeah. I, that's part of what, what has fueled this fear for me because I was looking at ESPN's playoff predictor which I shouldn't have done. Don't look at it.

[C]

Okay. Yeah, well, so, and I, but I don't like, like Heather Dina is not doing things because they have an association with the sec. So I looked at her thing she does like a bubble like a playoff. She does version of this every week. Right. So and so hers right now. So I think she is just like in many ways reflecting some degree of consensus, some degree of this is where teams are now. This is what their records are now. If the playoffs started today, this is who would be in and her playoff right now, of course, there's one from.

[B]

The group of five.

[C]

So the 11 other spots, she has six SEC, three Big Ten, and one each from the ACC and the Big 12.

[B]

Yeah. That doesn't scare you?

[C]

No, I'm scared. I'm scared shirtless. But I put. Doug got so scared, he took off his shirt and everyone turned off their YouTube channel. But what did the playoff predictor say? I didn't look at that.

[B]

So it's. The playoff predictor is not like, here's the field. It's just like percentages to make the playoff.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And there were 16 teams that had 30 chance or better. And of those 16, nine are in the SEC and only four in the Big Ten. The top two were in the Big Ten. Ohio State in Oregon are the only two with 80%, almost 90%, Ohio State's 89, Oregon's 87%, and then Indiana's fifth, and then he goes all the way down to 13th until you get another big. Another Big Ten team.

[C]

So I do think what. What I. The way the consensus is shaping up right now with a. With Penn State falling off the map is that that middle of the SEC is momentarily. And we'll have to see if it's long term, but momentarily getting more playoff consideration, playoff talk, playoff respect. Then the middle of the Big Ten where, like, Maryland is 4 and 1 and Washington only has one loss. And there's not a predictor. There's not a mathematical formula. There's not a human being. Right. Like, we understand. Like, no one's like, hey, I don't know, Texas A and M, Maryland, I think they have equal playoff chances. That's not what we're asking for. It's not what we expect.

[B]

Hey, man, Maryland's like, top five in stop rate, right?

[C]

Tell you what, Maryland, like, had Washington on the ropes and let him off. Like, if we want to talk about 5,0 Maryland, we could talk about 5,0 Maryland, but they're 4 and 1 Maryland because they gave it up to the Huskies. So, like you, you know, now they also. I think they're like, literally last in the nation in rushing yards or something. Anyway, we're like, we're not trying to be unrealistic. We don't want to be naive. But I do think there is something temporary before all these SEC teams start playing each other and beating each other, that right now they look glossier than similar Big Ten teams. And I'm not so sure they don't deserve to look glossier or even if they don't deserve it. I get it. I'm not going to get it as much in November, but, but I kind of understand where things are now, and I'm not assuming that is a reflection of where the playoff will be two months from now.

[B]

Yeah, I think, I think that's probably the right way to view it. And the way that the schedule has broken out, it's just like there, there have been more like big SEC games, I think, than there have been big Big Ten games so far. Right. Like the, it's the Big Tens probably had, I'm talking like actual conference games, like three, and the SEC's probably had more like five or six, at least in the way that they get talked about. And like the AP poll impacts that too. So I, I don't think it's off base either. I'm, I'm just wondering about like how much longer it might linger. And as we discussed many times before, will these games in the SEC actually start eliminating teams or just bolster the argument that the league is so good that it deserves seven or six or seven teams? Because I, because like, seven actually feels like a reality and I, I don't want to live in that reality. I'm not, I'm not saying like, you look at the Big Ten and say the Big Ten absolutely has six playoff worthy teams. How could, how could this possibly be the case that the SEC is getting projected to have six or seven? But I don't like the imbalance and I'm just getting a little nervous about like what might happen should this like Oregon, Indiana game go a certain way and, and Penn State like truly never gets back up off the mat and you know, USC and Michigan aren't quite playoff worthy. And then you're, you're staring at the two Big Ten team in the playoff, I think in an action like a very realistic way.

[C]

Okay, okay. So I, I, I have some scenarios because I think we have to like try to game out. For instance, when we did our playoff picks last week, I had Indiana at a certain spot and I had Oregon at a certain spot and I had Penn State at a certain spot. And you're like, well that must, does that mean this or does that mean that? And I was like, actually, I don't know, I don't know what any of it means because I actually didn't like go through and figure things out. So now I've done that. I tried to game out the Big Ten season. So we'll get to that in a second. But first we just want to Remind people not a bad time to go check out roback.com we know several of you have. Many of you have already and we're certainly grateful for that. We think it's a good place for you to go, like refresh your Ohio State wardrobe. We're getting to that time of year, like early October, almost mid October. Hoodies, quarter zips, sweatshirts. Like you can still get some of the short sleeve stuff. But roback.com r h o-b a c k.com go check it out for your Ohio State gear. Kind of like next level gear. We're going to give you a code bad 20B a D20. Put that in. It gets you 20 off your first order. So Bill, isn't it? It's like it's time. You don't want to get too late. Not that there's ever a bad time, but if it's like, it's like the, you know, it's week 10 and you're like, oh man, I didn't order my stuff yet. You kind of want to order it now for the [e-mail] it's been funny.

[B]

To me because, you know, like, you get these partnerships and they send you some language, language that you can use or choose not to use. And for this one, it like, it starts with fall is here. And like for the entire time it's been like, I know, but it's finally getting down to the 60s this week and hopefully moving forward. So yeah, perfect. Perfect. Time to restock your hoodie collection.

[C]

Yeah, Tank top season is here. Just in time for college football. It's not what really we should be doing. So there are ways, I think, Bill, the thing that would make the Big Ten most nervous at this point is the assumption and I think the correct assumption based on how they've played so far. And then like you try to project Ohio State and Oregon going forward and like, you know, again, I'm not sure anybody called Penn State using losing the ucla, but we don't see that happening. So then beyond those two, it's the collection of like, if everybody beats everybody and there's a couple random losses and I divided the Big Ten into two categories, but the main issue is the next UCLA over Penn State type of game that all of a sudden Michigan's losing to Purdue or I don't even if they play each other, Illinois is losing to Northwestern or like those are the ones, that's what would really screw up the Big Ten. And again, that's what screwed up the SEC last year. Ole Miss Losing to Kentucky. Right. That you beat each other up. But it's the UCLA over Penn State loss is devastating. A few more of those is when the Big Ten could really be in playoff trouble.

[B]

Yeah, you don't, I mean it's, it's on one hand like a sign of strength I guess for the league that the bottom is able to rise up and beat the middle sometimes. But you don't really want that to happen when you're in the business of getting as many teams as possible into the playoff. I don't know that I'm like terribly fearful of that.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

I like, I think the UCLA thing, starting point.

[C]

That's, that's good to hear you say that.

[B]

Yeah. I think the UCLA thing was a, a bit of a, of a dead cat bounce thing in.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

Against, against a vulnerable team. I don't know. Although I say that did you see that the Illinois, Illinois beat Purdue, but it was one of those upside down success rate games, like a fairly decent margin for, for Purdue being better than Illinois. So maybe I shouldn't say that as confidently as I did, but that is, that is not part of my math here when, when being a little worried about what might happen with Big Ten.

[C]

Okay. So if that's not the primary fear, then I think let me talk us all off that ledge with some of like, okay, if stuff just happens, how you, how you sort of expect it to go. I divided the Big Ten into like the teams that are still have a playoff chance and the ones that don't. So this is primarily. It's the three undefeated teams. Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana. It is the six one loss teams. Michigan, Illinois, usc, Washington, Nebraska and Maryland. And then Penn State at three and two because frankly with Ohio State and Indiana still on the schedule, if Penn State wins out there in no doubt.

[B]

About it, 10 and two, Penn State is in. Yes.

[C]

Yeah, like 10 and two. Penn State's like the six seed. So you know, I wrote about, about Ohio State and Penn State on, on Substack on Tuesday. We're going to continue to talk about this. This is an important story for Penn State and the Big Ten in northern college football. I'm my, I'm not going to come on here and be like, oh wait, don't, don't bury Penn State yet. But on the other hand, they still have good players. You know, like, you know, given what has happened, are they going to come into Columbus and win? I would certainly doubt it. But they still have good players. 10 definitely in nine and three we can get into in a second, so I still included them. Right. So if you do the three undefeated teams, the six one loss teams in Penn State, that's the top 10. Then if you do the other eight that are like they're kind of, they're. They're already out of the playoff race, no offense. The two lost teams of Minnesota, Rutgers, Michigan State and Northwestern, like, I just don't think it's gonna. In Iowa and Iowa. I just don't think it's gonna happen. Surprise us. One and two. Great. And then Wisconsin and Purdue with three losses and UCLA with four. So those eight are, are out. Right. So I looked at all the games between the top 10 and then for these purposes, assume that everybody in the top 10 is going to beat everybody in the bottom eight when they play each other. Now, like Minnesota is in the bottom eight. Minnesota still has to play Nebraska. Minnesota, like Minnesota can jump up and get somebody, right? Like that. Minnesota is barely in the bottom, I don't know, like Purdue. If you said they have a better success rate against Illinois, could Purdue jump up and get somebody? Could Michigan State, Nathan Childs jump up and get somebody? We understand, like we're not being dismissive of that fact, but this is an exercise. So then I went through those 17 games. Bill, do you want me to read those 17 games or can we just kind of figure it out? We understand what they are.

[B]

Yeah, I think we understand what they are. Yeah.

[A]

You just realized that you needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use Indeed. When it comes to hiring, Indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job post seen on other job sites. Indeed sponsored Jobs help you stand out and hire fast. With sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people that you want faster and it makes a huge difference. According to Indeed data, Sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Plus with Indeed sponsored jobs, there's no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. How fast is Indeed? Well, in the minute I've been Talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed according to Indeed data worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more [e-mail] just go to indeed.comBWN right now and support our show by saying that you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.comBWN terms and conditions apply. Hiring indeed is all you need.

[C]

So, like Michigan, USC this weekend is a huge one for this, right? Yeah, like Maryland, Nebraska is one of the 17 this weekend. Kind of like a big deal. So I then went through those 17 games and basically just picked who I think the favorite's going to be in that game to win. So some of them are toss ups. Some of them, like this week, USC is the favorite over Michigan because USC's at home. Like, I don't know if I necessarily believe that. I don't know if I'm gonna pick USC to beat Michigan, but for now, I gave that game to usc, so I did that. And then these are the records that I came up with. Okay, you get Ohio State and Oregon at 12, 0. You get Indiana at 11 and 1. Because now, even though they're going to Happy Valley, I'm now under the impression that I think Indiana is going to beat Penn State. Maybe Penn State will be favored in that game. But for operating purposes, can we call that a Hoosier's victory until we're told otherwise?

[B]

Yeah, I think that's fair.

[C]

Okay, so now we're talking about 11, one Indiana with its only loss to Oregon this weekend, and we're certainly going to end up talking a lot about India, Indiana, Oregon on our national college pick show on Friday. But if we have 11, one Indiana, 11 and one Indiana is 1000% a playoff team.

[B]

Yes, yes.

[C]

Okay, then we have at 10 and 2 with the way I did it, Illinois and Nebraska. So that this is, for instance, me giving Illinois a win at Washington, which again, I guess maybe Washington will be favored in that game, but I just think, like, Illinois could win that. Illinois, Maryland. I gave Illinois that win. This is Illinois losing to Ohio State this weekend and then running the table and going 10 and 2, and then Nebraska at 10 and 2, which this is Nebraska losing to Penn State, which I actually think they have a chance to win that game, but that would just be their second loss. All their other games are very winnable. And so then you're looking at 10 and 2 Nebraska, that's lost to Michigan and Penn State. And then this is Michigan at 9 and 3, USC and Washington and Penn State at 8 and 4 in Maryland at 7 and 5. I'm not predicting that, but I'm just trying to do the exercise. Bill, if everybody else handles their business against Northwestern and UCLA and all the teams like that, this is what we would be looking at. And in this scenario, Ohio State and Oregon at 12. Oh, and Indiana at 11 and 1 are definitely in. And I think Illinois, Nebraska at 10 and 2 would have a shot. Does this scenario make you feel any better or still make you feel like you did before?

[B]

I guess slightly better. I would disagree on Illinois. I don't think, because Illinois has a incredibly loud. Yeah, I don't know that you can lose by 50 and get a playoff spot if you're not 11. 1.

[C]

So, like, the. The thing is, right, like, so in this scenario, it's 10 and 2 Illinois with losses to playoff teams with losses to, like, the number one seed and the number seven seed.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But what's their best win? Is their best win at Washington? Does Duke come on and have a good season? And the Duke win on the road looks really good. But you are correct. It is quite a thing to overcome.

[B]

Yeah. Unless, like, they lose to Ohio State and it's close. Right. That would certainly help.

[C]

But, like, do you believe, like. And we're not doing this right this second, but I believe that is pretty important to the Big Ten this weekend. If Illinois can be competitive with Ohio State. How Illinois loses to Ohio State, I think affects the Big Ten's playoff chances.

[B]

I agree. Yeah. It doesn't affect Ohio State. It's playoff chances or Oregon's, but it affects everything beyond that. Yeah. Yeah.

[C]

And then what do you think about 10 and 2 Nebraska?

[B]

Yeah, 10 and 2 Nebraska. I kind of had my eye on coming into the season.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

And I think. I can't remember preseason. Did one of us have Nebraska in. I know people were putting Nebraska in their playoff field preseason because. Yeah. The schedule could just kind of get you there. Yeah. And I don't know that anything's happened for Nebraska so far this year that would make you deviate from that possibility too much. So I think 10 and 2 is possible. And if it were 10 and 2, because the Michigan loss was not like, it wasn't like they got blown out against Michigan, so.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Yeah. That actually attended to. Nebraska feels more solid to me than a 10 and 2 Illinois would. Just because the Indiana lost for Illinois was. Was so lopsided.

[C]

And then the other part of this is, you know, this is I have Michigan at 9 and 3 with a loss to USC that actually I don't think is gonna happen. So then if. Now we're talking about. If we're talking about 10 and two Michigan, and it's two losses are to two playoff teams in Oklahoma and Ohio State. And again, Michigan might beat Ohio State, but for this exercise, Ohio State is going to be favored in that game. I'm giving that game to Ohio State. What would you think of 10 and 2 Michigan if Oklahoma is a playoff team?

[B]

Yeah, I think they would have a pretty strong case. I, I, I think like the, this Michigan USC game is maybe the most important Big Ten game to date. Like just because like what it can mean for that, for that winner. I think whoever comes out of that game has a shot to get to the playoff. Like a pretty, pretty strong chance to get to the playoff.

[C]

So the bottom line of this is if we wind up with two undefeated teams in an 11 and one team and there's three Big Ten teams in and then there we think there will be an option or two at 10 and two, is that a pretty good outcome for the Big Ten?

[B]

Yes, if there are multiple 10 and two teams. Yeah. Because you're talking about potentially what to like 5, 5 or so double digit win teams. I feel, I feel very good about that. I'm just worried about the two double digit win teams.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

And like a 10 and two Indiana that I'm not sure would get in and then a bunch of nine win teams.

[C]

And the other thing that is difficult about this that I, that I think the SEC does not have to worry about this year is Ohio State and Oregon are both so good. It is more difficult to imagine them losing to anybody else. But if any of the prospective 10 and 2 or 9 and three Big Ten teams had a win over Oregon or Ohio State, that's rocket fuel. If Washington's 9 and 3 with the win over Oregon in the last game of the year or Washington's 10 and two with the win over Oregon the last game of the year like they're in. Yeah, 9 and 3 Washington with that win I think would have a real chance. And 10 and 2 Washington with a win over Oregon I think is in no doubt about it.

[B]

I would agree.

[C]

But this is where you get to the point where is being is having two dominant teams actually bad for the league? Because that's 18 guaranteed losses for everybody else. If Ohio State and Oregon steamroll, it is quite a thing that you would say hey guess what? The SEC does not have teams like Ohio State or Oregon and the result is 7 sec, 3 big 10. How are 2 big 10. We have the two the two best teams in the country or two of the three best teams in the country are from the big 10 so nobody else in the big 10 gets in. And everybody from this mid conference we're taking half the league.

[B]

Bill, that's what I, yeah. Seems like a flawed playoff system. If that were the case. But. But I don't know. What do you think, like if you, if you injected Tony Petiti with truth truth serum and said what's better for the league? Having five teams of playoff bids or having two of the three strongest national championship contenders like. Well, and you had to choose one, what do you think you would want? Because I think you would probably want the. What? Yeah. Do you think you don't want.

[C]

I think he'd want the five. I think he'd take five. Yeah, I think you'd want the depth.

[B]

Yeah, I mean I know like Ohio State fans don't care. I say fans like what do you mean we're going to win the national championship? I don't if we can be the only big. But. Yeah, yeah, I, I think you're probably right. I think he, I think he probably would take the five.

[C]

Unless. Unless you could guarantee that Ohio State and Oregon were on opposite brackets and the story of the playoff becomes hey, congrats to the mid SEC on getting teams in. They just were cannon fodder for these two Big Ten monst that are destined to meet for the national title in a 140 versus 14 0. Well no, because somebody's gonna have a loss because one, they would have played each other in Big Ten championship game.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So it's, it's 150 against 141 for the national title between two Big Ten teams. If you got that like that's what you're talking about. So would you think that is preferable to five?

[B]

Yeah, if you could guarantee it. If you can guarantee an all Big Ten national championship game, I think that would be preferable to five.

[C]

Yeah, but if you get us, if you get a spot where it's like the Big Ten champs, the 1 seed and the Big Ten championship game loser is the 4 seed and all that means is they're going to play each other in a semi final for the right to play Miami or some mid SEC team in the national championship game. I'm not sure that's as appetizing, but that's hard. And this is back to this conversation again. You know the SEC used to be top heavy. The Big Ten had depth and that was what everybody wanted and now it's flip flopped and the SEC does not have teams like Ohio State and Oregon. But the result is nobody knows who's good. So I guess we'll just put six or seven in. That is. And does this make. And so it's like, oh well, no wonder the Big ten is pushing for four guaranteed spots because we're talking about what if they wind up with two. But, but beyond, beyond personal agendas, beyond doing what's best for you, does a discussion like this make automatic bids better for people? Because if, if you wind up rewarding a team that doesn't have as much strength as the at the top and the result is they get in more in the middle, is that, is there a little bit of that that's wrong. And even if it was reversed, we'd be okay. Like, Bama and Georgia are great and the SEC has the two best teams, but the Big Ten has a bunch of other teams. Should the Big Ten get in six and the SEC get in two? This to me starts to get to the nut. If you could get away from. You're just doing what serves you. It gets to the nut of like, why the automatic bids might make sense. Because.

[B]

Yeah, you're.

[C]

You're just putting forth the best you've got rather than trying to stumble into rewarding mediocrity with six bids.

[B]

It helps me understand the argument better. Like, it doesn't, it doesn't fully put me on the side of it, I don't think. Because I still think people are trying to make determinations with too small of a data set. Like, we have, we have one year of this and then we're. And we're hypothetically talking about year two. Who knows what the 30 year it might be. It might bring. And. And I, I'd be lying if I said, like, this doesn't feel like the direction it's headed. Right. Look where we end up kind of rewarding a league for being mediocre. Probably not the right word, but like, for its parody when I'm not really sure that's the point. So I get why that would drive anyone to want the. The aqs. I'm still not a huge fan of the idea, but it is starting to make a little bit more sense to me why. Why that would be the case.

[C]

Yeah, this Indiana Oregon game is obviously fascinating, but like, as much as we said, okay, Indiana, who did they play last year other than Ohio State? Well, this year they're going to play Oregon and Penn State both on the road. And I was like, oh, wait, is Penn State not Who we thought 5 0, Indiana. Remaining schedule at Oregon, home. Michigan State, home. UCLA at Maryland, at Penn State, home. Wisconsin at Purdue. I mean, that is, that is four games versus that bottom part of the conference. And then like, honestly is like Maryland really at that level? Like, this is. That is. That is like five eminently Winnable games, man. Five eminently winnable games. And then it depends how wounded Penn State is. But it's like somehow.

[B]

After Penn State plays Ohio State, like, who knows what kind of, what kind of beaten up right mode Penn State will be in. Yeah.

[C]

I mean, honestly, either way, for Indiana, if Penn State somehow just saved its program by winning at Ohio State, Kurt Signetti would, like, relish that. Like, oh, now they're flying high. Let's go in and cut their legs out. Or if they're wounded and that was lost number three and. And like, they're kind of dead, then Kurt Signetti's is going to want to go in and finish him off. Like, either way, you almost don't trust.

[B]

Penn State either way. Right. Because they, they just handled a close loss terribly and it's like they're going to handle beating Ohio State. Well, there's no way. There's no way that would happen.

[C]

And like, that scenario, like, James Franklin's kind of also done that in his career, kind of let a loss turn into another loss. Like, they don't necessarily rebound from things right away. But here we are with this scenario, Bill, where somehow, like, Penn State's not quite what you think. And now all of a sudden we're back in a scenario where could Indiana, like, if Indiana, though, doesn't beat Penn State, Penn State's still decent. It's still in Happy Valley. That's a tough place to play. So they lose to Oregon, they lose to Penn State, but they're really good otherwise. They might be, like, definitively the third best team in the Big Ten. They just happen to have to play Penn State on the road and like. But 10 and 2 is not persuasive, I think. Right.

[B]

I think it could be. It just depends on what the two losses look like. Right. It can't, it can't look like it looked. If you have two losses that look like Indiana's lost Ohio State last year, then, then no, I don't think it is persuasive.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

But if they're competitive, even if, even in a loss, I do think that would, that would matter. Yeah.

[C]

Okay. It is quite a thing. It's just like, you really, in the end, you're better off, like, beating Georgia and losing to Kentucky than you are beating Kentucky and losing to Georgia. Like, I think, like, the, you know, even though that was the resume that didn't get Ole Miss in last year, but, like, that was at 9 and 3. So, like, I don't, I don't know. I, I do think Again, it's, it's an interesting discussion because I do think just the, the profiles of the SEC in the Big Ten are just different enough right now then makes these discussions matter. And it's not just a discussion about now it's about. It's a discussion about what college football wants to be, what college football wants to reward. How the people on the committee or the powers that be that determine the playoff system want to think about the sport. And I do think that overall discussion, you know, what we're having today is a reflection of the reality of the structure they set up of the system they set up. So then we're talking about it within that system. But if we get to the point do you root sometimes for things to be so broken that you have to change it?

[B]

I understand the sentiment. Yeah. Yeah.

[C]

Because I actually like. I don't think the 12 team playoff is broken. I thought the fort in the by the end the 4 was the 14 playoff is broken but I don't think this is broken. No but if, if you are a person who wants expansion, if you are a person who wants AQ, you know, automatic qualifiers, a College Football Playoff that is one Big 12, one ACC, two Big 10 and seven SEC. That's a shattered system.

[B]

A bunch of 99 SEC teams. Yeah, I would, I would say so. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think that's the point of setting this up because I don't not to say that some of those seven like clearly some of those if it's a bunch, if it is like literally seven nine Wayne SEC teams, some of those teams would be deserving but I don't think all of them would be all someone will just be in there like on but on the benefit others like not the similar from Indiana I guess last year but I think like some point along the way you would need to like show yourself as being like the quality of a playoff team. And I think we all know what that looks like and, and I don't. I don't know that I believe that all seven of those teams would do that en route to a 9 and 3.

[A]

You just realized that you needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use indeed when it comes to hiring indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job post seen on other job sites. Indeed sponsored jobs help you stand out and hire fast. With sponsored jobs your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people that you want faster and it makes a huge difference according to Indeed Data. Sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Plus with Indeed sponsored jobs, there's no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. How fast is indeed? Well, in the minute I've been talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed according to Indeed Data worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more [e-mail] just go to indeed.comBWN right now and support our show by saying that you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Podcast indeed.comBWN terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

[C]

So we're just sitting here like the idea of that 10 and 2 Illinois team, Indiana 10 and 2, Nebraska at 10 and 2 Michigan at 10 and 2. There's none of those teams that we're like, oh, they're in for sure. Is that what, is that true? Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, Nebraska at 10 and 2. None of those. If they, if they go as we expect, the 10 and 2, that would be the most likely, which is like lose to the best teams you play, beat everybody else. We don't think any of those teams are guaranteed in. Right?

[B]

No. No.

[C]

Okay. Whereas we would expect probably in this mishmash, some 9 and 3 sec teams in there. And that's where. Because, because the perception would be. And I just said it. But the idea of those 10 and two Big 10 teams, it's like, well, they lost to the only good teams they played and then they just beat everybody else. But that's the. Then they're, then we're assuming that Washington's not good or that Minnesota is not good or that these other teams that they're. That the middle of the Big Ten that we've said is the deepest it's ever been. You're operating under the assumption that the middle of the Big Ten is not very good, but the middle of the SEC is, when actually it might be that the, the top of the Big Ten is better than the SEC and the middles are just as good. Or maybe the middle of the SEC is a little better, but not that different. But really what's separating you is that maybe a couple of your teams beat Alabama or Texas. You know, Florida beat Texas. So then if Florida's in a playoff race, if Florida's 9 and 3 Florida is going to 9 and 3 Florida, they're not going to be 9 and 39 and 3 Florida, though, would have a better chance at the playoff probably than 10 and 2 Nebraska because Florida beat Texas. But when Nebraska played Michigan, like Michigan might be better than Texas. You know what I mean? Like, I don't like, that's the kind of thing that there still, I think, are baked in assumptions about the SEC that might show themselves in scenarios like this.

[B]

You know, a way to eliminate some of those assumptions would just be to have a big 10 sec challenge.

[C]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

How good would that be?

[B]

Great.

[C]

Do you think it'll ever happen?

[B]

Yes, I do.

[C]

Tv.

[B]

Tv. Yeah. Too much. Too much money to be made. Yeah, it.

[C]

It will. The 12 team playoff. I think we were saying it. We were saying it before it happened. I think we were saying, people do not realize how good this is going to be from a. From an excitement standpoint, from an interest standpoint, from a viewership standpoint, from a financial standpoint. Do you believe the 12 team playoff lived up to the expectations?

[B]

Yeah, I thought it was awesome. Yeah.

[C]

Okay. I think the N. SEC Big Ten challenge, although very different, could have a similar effect on the beginning of the college football season that we would view. We would never view September college football the same way again.

[B]

No, it would be. It'd be pretty gigantic. Yeah. Like, just think of what. What it was to get that Ohio State Texas game, but now, like multiply it by whatever, eight or ten, however many, however many of those games we get, it would be incredible for the sport. And, and also, I think, like I said, like, helping race. Teams can evolve over time. I'm not trying to be dismissive of that. What you are in September is not necessarily what you are in November, but at least we'd have like some extra data to consider when trying to figure out is the middle of the Big Ten better than the middle of the SEC or like, how much better is the SEC than the Big Ten in the middle? That kind of stuff. So it would be helpful and also entertaining.

[C]

Yeah, no, I agree. And I think, I think your choices are. In trying to figure this out. And we've been talking about this since the beginning of the season. If you just get a big mishmash at nine and three and you have 11, nine and three teams and four get in and it's almost impossible to choose between them, but you just have to choose 4 and you can't take all 11 because the numbers say you can't. To me, like, it's not that the committee would get it wrong, is that there's potentially no right answer. So Then I think the, the best way to handle that either is to take away the subjectivity and make it objective with aqs, or to add data points to add incredibly valuable data points. And something like this would do that. If you don't want to get to aq, then let's let them fight it out in the non conference a little bit more to help inform it. So. And it's not necessarily like, oh, you know, the Big Ten won the, the Big Ten SEC challenge 10 to 6. So the Big Ten gets one more playoff bid. Like, it's not that, but it is data points. So okay, you want to do playoff picks?

[B]

Let's do it.

[C]

So I hate my bracket slightly less than I hated it before.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

But I also might hate one of my things. Anyway. Okay, we did not have a large conversation about this, but let me, I'll, I'll go first and I'll, I'll tell you the thing that's happening here. Number one, Ohio State. Unchanged. Number two, Miami. Unchanged. Number three, Oregon. Unchanged. Number four, Texas A&M, the SEC champ. Unchanged. Number five, Ole Miss. Moved up a little bit, I think, from last week. Yeah, yeah, I did move them up a little bit. Number six, Oklahoma. Number seven, Texas Tech. Number eight, Indiana. Which is where I sort of settled on Indiana. I had him five last week, but kind of nonsensically so. Eight Indiana, nine Georgia Tech. 10, Notre Dame. 11, Illinois. 12, South Florida. So this is Texas out for me. I have Oklahoma in instead. This is Penn State out. I have Illinois in instead. And this is Missouri out. I have. I have Notre Dame in instead. So this is me. Again, maybe a little wishful thinking with just 3 sec. But like, I don't know, maybe, maybe people can realize that it is a collection of mid. And this is like a 10 and 2 Illinois team that competes pretty substantially with Ohio State this week, getting in as the fourth Big Ten team. So before you unveil yours, what do you hate most about mine?

[B]

I don't know that I hate a ton of it. I, I can't get there on Notre Dame just yet.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

I think like to this point Notre Dame has done what it needs to do, but I just don't know that that schedule is going to help them much. Like, like, they, they're big Michigan fans this week. They're gonna, they're gonna need that, I think. Or, sorry, big usc.

[C]

They're big USC fans. Yeah, they're rooting. I mean, it comes naturally for Notre Dame to root against Michigan because Notre Dame plays USC and they Want USC to be viewed as, as highly as possible. The one thing that could work in their favor is like the reverse schedule thing of again, like you and I, if Miami and Texas A and M are two of the four best teams in the country and Notre Dame played them both down to the wire and then just handles business as we remember that more and more teams are going to lose. That's the thing that like the schedule plays in their favor is that it turns out Miami and Texas A and M are both just awesome. And Miami on the road, that was a tough loss and they probably should have beaten Texas A M. I mean like, if you want to go through, I don't know, again, it's like not a thing that you're supposed to really talk about, but Texas A M's game winning touchdown pass, there should have been a hold called on the play. Like, no doubt about it, it should have been a hold called. So that doesn't mean you'll turn, you don't turn that into a Notre Dame win. But if you're looking at the SEC champs, if, if Notre Dame is 10 and two and it's two losses are to the ACC champ and the SEC championship, both close, I don't know how good the rest of their schedule has to be. If they win all the rest and they look good while they're doing it, which I think they are in the process of doing.

[B]

That's a fair point, I think. And I, I will say we had the conversation like, or is Notre Dame dead in the playoff conversation after the A M loss and I think probably being a little too much prisoner of the moment, I believe we, I, I said yes. And I think you might have said like probably yeah, I, I don't think it's, it's like that written in stone. Right. Like with, with, with time. I, I would back off of that a little bit, but I, I think they maybe almost need Miami and Texas A M to be their conference champions for that to be the case.

[C]

They're like crazy for that. Yeah, yeah, I think you're right.

[B]

I don't know. But that also, especially Miami's case, that seems likely to happen. And I still have A M as my SEC champ as well. So it's, it's on the, on the table. It's not impossible because I think one.

[C]

Of the things if we thought they were dead in the moment is like we didn't think Texas A M was going to win the sec. But if, if, if that night Notre Dame had lost to Georgia on the last play of the game and it's like, oh, they've lost to Miami and Georgia. I think we might have been like, well, I don't know, like a lot of teams are going to lose to Miami and Georgia. I think they can get in, right? So like that's what it is now. So if you just think of that like the best team in the sec. So I'm, I'm very curious how that unfolds, but I do think either Miami or Texas A and M sort of falling apart here would be devastating. Notre Dame, potentially, yes, potentially devastating. So they really need that. Okay. So I, I feel a little better about where things are and the idea of like an 11 and one Indiana being like whatever, like a nice seven or eight or nine seed, like comfortably in, but not still not like the five seat or whatever. I think is very possible. Then it's just a reminder again of like we're gonna get into discussions about two lost teams. And like when you have Penn state losing to UCLA, you already mentioned that Illinois losing by 50 to Indiana, like somebody, it's 10 and two teams are going to get in. And not having horrible losses, having two excellent losses really could be a decently compelling case for Notre Dame.

[A]

You just realized that you needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use Indeed. When it comes to hiring, Indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job posts seen on other job sites. Indeed sponsored Jobs help you stand out and hire fast. With Sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people that you want faster and it makes a huge difference. According to Indeed data, Sponsored Jobs posted directly on Indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Plus with Indeed sponsored Jobs, there's no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. How fast is Indeed? Well, in the minute I've been Talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed according to Indeed Data worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more visibility@ Indeed.com B BWN. Just go to Indeed.com BWN right now and support our show by saying that you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.comBWN terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

[C]

Who's your bracket again?

[B]

It's still, it's still a little hard for me to like kind of separate the SEC team. So Some of this maybe a bit non. Nonsensical based off some of the schedules, but number one still for me is Ohio State. I did put Miami back at 2 last week. I had Ohio State, Oregon 1, 2. Every thinking, like, like, if Miami's actually undefeated, I don't, I don't think they'd be behind the, the Big Ten runner up. And I kind of think. I think Miami is going to end up being undefeated.

[C]

So.

[B]

Ohio State 1, Miami 2, Oregon 3. Here's my change up. Texas Tech 4. No buy. No buy for the SEC.

[C]

I love it.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Oh, so mid. And then they just run the table. They fill in the rest of the bracket, but no buys.

[B]

Yeah, because I think. I think the Big Ten runner up could be ahead of an unbeaten Big 12 champ. Because I think that's because Miami is going to have the Notre Dame win outside of. And, and the Florida win, whatever you think of that, and South Florida, too.

[C]

And that Big Ten title game between Ohio State and Oregon. If it's a banger we said, and they look like the two best teams, it's like, okay, they're both better than the Big 12 champ. That's not hard to fathom.

[B]

Yeah. Okay, so Texas Tech 4 is a Big 12 champ. 5 is a M as my SEC champ. Alabama 6 is the SEC runner up. Oklahoma 7. I took Oklahoma out. I put them back in because it sounds like Matier is going to try to play this week in Red river, so.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

I didn't know if he was going to miss a month or a week, and I guess the answer was a week. So I have Oklahoma back in at number seven. I have Indiana eight. That's like an 11 and one Indiana at number eight. Nine Ole Miss.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

10 Georgia, man.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

11 Michigan.

[C]

Okay. Okay.

[B]

And then 12 South Florida.

[C]

Is this, by the way, just as a heads up for the games for us to pick on Friday when we do usually six national picks? I do have South Florida, North Texas on Friday night as a game for us to pick.

[B]

Are you.

[C]

Are you cool with that?

[B]

I am cool with that. Yeah. It's a big one. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. Huge game for the American that Michigan that you have in. That's a 10 and 2 Michigan with losses to Oklahoma and Ohio State.

[B]

Yes. Yeah, I think it'll get a. Get a nice win this week against usc. Like, I think. I think the opportunity that Michigan has with a young quarterback like Bryce Underwood is like, even if it loses to Ohio State, to like, just consistently, like, week after week after week, like, start to look better and like, he more and more like, looks like a star. And maybe it's not enough to beat the Buckeyes, but it's enough to make you think, like, that team belongs in the playoff at 10 and 2.

[C]

And like, again, step one, nobody is assuming that Ohio State is going to beat Michigan because that would be a crazy thing to assume. So if in, in a lot of the scenarios that we're outlining here, if it actually is a scenario where Michigan has what is either 10 and 1 or 9 and 2 going into the Ohio State game, and Ohio State continues to look like it's looked so far, and Michigan wins, Michigan's in. They just beat the best team in the country.

[B]

Yeah, I think that's right.

[C]

But also the opportunity, like, if Michigan is in that scenario, let's say they're a 9 and 2 Michigan team at that point, and I'd say they're 10 and 1. They don't lose again until then. Man, I wonder, though, could they get it at 9 and 3 if you play with what looks like and has been all year the best team in the country, like that world where it's like, listen, man, I don't, I don't think anybody would have beaten Ohio State today. So Michigan lost to him, but so would have everybody else. 134 other teams would have lost to him, too. So Michigan lost to him. I get it. But they look pretty good. Run game looked pretty good. Defense still getting after the passer a little bit. Bryce Underwood makes plays. Like, I like Michigan. Like, I do think they could go into the playoff committee room off of like a decently compelling Ohio State loss. And then this is where the strength of the best teams in the Big Ten should work in the Big Ten's favor. That like, yeah, Michigan lost to him, but guess what? Ohio State's awesome. Guess what? Oregon's awesome. Like, that's just the way it is. So I would be curious how much that could work in Michigan's favor. So you. You did not live your fear. How many, how many essences do you have?

[B]

Five sec. Excuse me? Five sec. Four Big Ten.

[C]

Okay. What that we might be in, like, so I still have like 4 big 10 and 3 sec. I'm like, I'm the only person in the country with three SEC teams in because I'm putting. I still have Georgia Tech in and that kind of thing. So From a Big Ten standpoint, if. Would you would. Should the Big Ten take that today? If they could get guaranteed 5 sec, 4 Big Ten.

[B]

Yeah, I would think I would Take. Yeah. Yeah. I would cash out. Yeah.

[C]

I don't think Tony Petiti could be like, no, I'm holding out for 4. Big 10, 3 SDC. So if you'll notice, I still don't have Bama in because I'm. We're gonna pick Bama Missouri this week too. I picked Bama to lose a Vanderbilt last week. They didn't. I'm not. I'm just not getting on yet. I'm not getting on yet and so sure. I also don't have Missouri in right now, but like this. So. So we don't have Texas in. We don't have Georgia in. And I don't have Bama in.

[B]

Like I have Georgia.

[C]

You do have Georgian. So you think, what do you think about. So you have Georgia and Bama but no Texas. I don't have any of the three.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Do you feel good about Georgia in or do you just. Do you feel like they'll probably get five and Georgia might be the fifth one?

[B]

Yeah, kind of. Because like I'm not like I have currently have Ole Miss ahead of Georgia. So like I guess that means I'm picking Ole Miss in the moment to win that game. They play in a couple weekends. But I don't know like, and then it's for Georgia. It's like Florida, Mississippi State perhaps a down and on its way out. Texas, Charlotte and Georgia Tech. Like it's not an overly impressive 10 and 2, but I don't think like a 10 and 2 Georgia would get left out.

[C]

So I guess what I'm doing there is basically to me then there's a possibility that like Georgia, Georgia Tech in the last week of the regular season becomes a playing game.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And I have Georgia Tech in and so like oh my Georgia Tech in all the way along the way has been Georgia Tech with a win over Georgia in. So like that's, that's a scenario where even like Georgia Tech could then go to the big. The ACC title game and lose to Miami, but they're still riding high. Like, like that's like a bid steal probably where the, like that's like the ACC 2 steals the. The SEC 5 spot with that head to head win. So. Okay, okay, we. We have to, we just have to talk this out as we prepare for it again. Like I'm still going to be probably a little too crazy about this stuff, but I remain committed to the idea that the SEC still might wind up beating each other a lot and proving how mid it is and that maybe people will see the light and not just shrug their shoulders and put in 3, 9 and 3 SEC teams because they don't know what else to do.

[B]

So a long way in helping serve serve that agenda is if Texas wins Red river this weekend.

[C]

Yeah. So we need like, but, but I'm, and I'm anti, like, I'm anticipating some of that. Like, I'm not anticipating chaos with Ohio State and Oregon and maybe not with Indiana that if, like, Indiana just loses to Oregon and that's it and they beat everybody else. But, but I still think it's reasonable, even if you're not anticipating SEC chaos, but to be curious about it, not surprised by it.

[B]

I will not be surprised by it. And I am rooting for it.

[C]

Yes. That's all we can do. That's all we can do. All right, try roback.com check out our substack show on Wednesday. We'll be doing a Q A with our Substack subscribers, so if you want to be a premium member over at Substack, you can sign up billandougosu.substack.com but then we have still obviously a lot of of stuff coming here on the podcast feeds on the YouTube channel that will include our Ohio State, Illinois picks on Thursday. It will include national picks on Friday, and it probably will it will include, I think, at least one other thing this week, maybe more. We have a couple irons in the fire that we need to sort out, but we'll keep pumping the content here and we appreciate you guys being part of it. So for now, that's our playoff bracket show that we drop every Tuesday. He's Bill Landis. I'm Doug Lee Maurice, and that was the Bill and Doug Show.