Podcast Summary: The Bill and Doug Show - “Nick Saban is Wrong and the SEC is a Ponzi Scheme; Penn State Candidates; Ohio State RBs: Rants”

Host: Doug Lesmerises (Blue Wire)
Date: October 14, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode delivers three impassioned rants centered on:

1. Why the current SEC reputation is overblown and constructed on a “Ponzi scheme” logic, with heavy criticism of Nick Saban’s public takes;
2. Ohio State’s running back room and the statistical/eye-test reasons behind any struggles;
3. Media-driven “hot lists” for the open Penn State head coaching job, and why they’re mostly nonsense.

The tone is energetic, irreverent, and deeply invested in breaking down myths about Southern football dominance—especially SEC depth—while championing data and on-field evidence favoring the Big Ten.

Key Discussion Points and Timestamps

1. Rant 1: The SEC “Ponzi Scheme” & Nick Saban’s Narrative

[01:49 – 32:14]

Main Arguments & Insights

• Breaking News Gag:
  Doug opens with a satirical “newsflash” that the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) is now investigating the Southeastern Conference (SEC) as a Ponzi scheme, with Nick Saban and Paul Finebaum dubbed “co-conspirators.”

  • “This investigation is focusing on two co-conspirators, Paul Feinbaum and Nick Saban, who have been deceiving the college football public with discussions about how deep the SEC is.” (Doug, 02:22)
  • Playful mockery - no real criminal allegations, but a jab at how self-perpetuating SEC “depth” arguments are.

• Changing Stance – Big Ten Supremacy:
  Doug says he’s officially moved from “the North is as good as the South” to “the North is better”—i.e., the Big Ten is now superior to the SEC, especially at the top:

  • “The best teams in the Big Ten are better than the best teams in the SEC. There is no conversation about that anymore.” (Doug, 03:16)

• Dissecting Saban's Take on TV:
  Critiques Nick Saban’s recent claim (on the Pat McAfee show) that “the Big Ten isn’t really that deep … it’s not like the SEC where you’ve got eight or nine teams that can beat you.”

  • Calls this “lying or disingenuous,” especially when comparing teams like Indiana, Oregon, and Ohio State to the SEC’s supposed depth.

• How the SEC’s “Depth” is Manufactured:
  Doug walks through how SEC teams’ performances are spun in the media (“the Ponzi scheme”):

  • Middle-tier SEC teams beat each other; losses are explained away with arguments about strength of schedule; when the Big Ten’s middle teams lose, it supposedly exposes their mediocrity.
  • “They are tricking you along the way into thinking that, like, Vanderbilt is good and that Missouri is good.” (Doug, 08:22)

• Ranking Realities vs. Perceived Strength:
  Doug compares AP Poll and SP+ ratings, showing that:

  • The AP poll grossly overrates SEC depth (e.g., nine SEC teams in the top 17).
  • SP+ (especially “this season only” calculations) tells a different story: four of the top five are Big Ten teams.
  • “The idea that the SEC is deeper is fraudulent, driven a little bit by this top 25 AP poll.” (Doug, 09:47)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• “Nick Saban is wrong and people like Paul Finebaum are wrong … I don’t know if they’re ignorant or if they’re trying to trick you.” (Doug, 11:19)
• “Your depth perception is 100% wrong, because you start doing things like this if you’re not careful.”
• Entertaining breakdown of questionable officiating and its impact on SEC results (e.g., Auburn’s “should-have-won” games vs. Georgia/Oklahoma).

2. Head-to-Head League Comparisons: Evidence by Tiers

[15:22 – 32:14]

Big Ten vs. SEC – Team by Team

• Top Tiers:
  Big Ten: Ohio State, Oregon, Indiana
  SEC: Georgia, Alabama, Texas A&M

  • “There’s no doubt that the top three in the Big Ten are better than the top three in the SEC.” (Doug, 24:49)
  • Doug details why recent results—actual games and quality of wins/losses—strongly favor the Big Ten trio.

• Second Tiers:
  Big Ten: USC, Nebraska, Washington
  SEC: Ole Miss, LSU, Tennessee

  • “Washington [Big Ten] is better than Ole Miss … Ole Miss is propped up by beating LSU, who is also a fraud.” (Doug, 25:31)
  • Walks through how SEC teams prop each other up via a chain of overhyped wins.

• Third Tiers:
  Big Ten: Illinois, Michigan, Iowa
  SEC: Oklahoma, Missouri, Vanderbilt

  • “Vanderbilt 5-1, ranked 17th, inexplicable. This is Diego Pavia mania. … If Iowa played Vandy, I’d take Iowa.” (Doug, 28:17)

• Bottom Tiers:
  Doug asserts that mediocre Big Ten teams (e.g., Maryland, UCLA, Minnesota, Northwestern) are no worse than the SEC’s bottom feeders, and some are even better according to SP+.

• Penn State & Texas:
  Doug compares the recent falls of these blue bloods, arguing the Big Ten’s deeper slate exposed Penn State more effectively than the SEC did Texas:

  • “Penn State and Texas might be more similar than we think, except the Big Ten was able to take advantage of Penn State’s flaws.” (Doug, 30:56)

Overall Rant Takeaway

• “The Big Ten’s better at the top. Big Ten is as deep. And it is a lie to you when you think about what Tennessee has really done, what Vanderbilt has really done, what LSU has really done … ask yourself how real it is, because I think it’s a Ponzi scheme.” (Doug, 31:56)

3. Rant 2: Ohio State’s Running Back Room – Problems and Solutions

[33:32 – 36:50]

Run Game Analysis

• Yards After Contact:
  Ohio State’s run game issues—unusual for them—are due mainly to a lack of backs generating yards after contact. Cites PFF data and compares to past backs (Elliott, Dobbins, Hyde, Sermon).

  • “They just don’t have backs who are getting yardage after contact in the way they usually do.” (Doug, 33:32)
  • “In 2025, Bo Jackson, their freshman, is averaging more than five yards after contact per carry… Everyone else is much lower.”

• Bo Jackson is the Exception/Solution:
  True freshman Bo Jackson is viewed as the answer; if healthy, he “fixes” most run-game issues.

• Peoples and Donaldson Just Aren’t It:
  James Peoples and C.J. Donaldson aren’t providing enough after contact—Doug predicts playcalling adjustments/carry distribution to follow.

• Perspective:
  “There’s nothing wrong with this Ohio State run game that Ezekiel Elliott wouldn’t fix, which is a ridiculous thing to say, but…” (Doug, 34:55)

4. Rant 3: Penn State Coaching Search Hot Lists Are Nonsense

[36:50 – End]

Main Arguments & Insights

• The Coaching List Game is Broken:
  Doug points out that media “hot” lists for open jobs are driven by agent plants, obvious connections, and bandwagon logic.

  • “Coaching lists make me crazy whenever there’s an opening … everyone’s connecting the same dots. Matt Rhule played at Penn State, worked for the AD at Temple … so everyone lists him.”

• Retread Names & Industry “Insiders”:
  Urban Meyer, Jon Gruden, and other usual suspects get recycled regardless of fit or reality.

• Past Example – Indiana’s Surprise Hire:
  Points out nobody had Kurt Cignetti on Indiana’s list; “the best hire for Penn State is probably a name nobody is talking about.”

• Search Firms & Underrated Hires:
  Emphasizes that the best athletic directors find less obvious but proven “winners” (e.g., Lance Leipold, Jim Tressel, Cignetti).

Notable Quotes

• “Right now, people think Penn State should hire Kurt Cignetti … you know what, Kurt Cignetti wasn’t on mostly the coaching lists when Indiana fired Tom Allen that every media person in the country put out.” (Doug, 38:29)
• “Shortlists shouldn’t have 11 names on it. … There’s probably a decent chance that the next Penn State head coach might be a guy that is on nobody’s list right now.” (Doug, 41:36)

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Saban/SEC spin:
  “They are tricking you along the way into thinking that, like, Vanderbilt is good and that Missouri is good.” (Doug, 08:22)
• On media coaching shortlists:
  “And one of the names he added was Matt Rhule because he didn’t have him on the first list, which is like… what are you doing? And the second was Urban Meyer. … We’re just gonna Urban Meyer and Jon Gruden our way through every coaching list until they’re both 90.” (Doug, 36:56)

Episode Structure & Flow

• [01:49] Satirical “SEC Ponzi scheme” news; Doug’s change of stance—Big Ten > SEC
• [04:00-30:00] Detailed breakdowns of league strengths (top to bottom), media perception vs. reality, case-by-case team evaluations, and why “SEC depth” is a myth
• [33:32] Ohio State RB analysis (PFF numbers, why it’s a personnel issue)
• [36:50] Penn State coaching search: why media lists are mostly guesswork and groupthink
• [End] Show plugs, thanks to listeners, and sign-off

Conclusion

Doug Lesmerises’ episode is an energetic polemic against “SEC myth-making,” a clarion call to put actual performance and holistic analysis over “laundry-list” narratives, and a case study in smart, evidence-driven college football commentary. His signature blend of humor and data-driven breakdowns, especially regarding Ohio State and the Big Ten, makes this episode a must-listen for anyone tired of SEC propaganda or college football echo chambers.

Listeners will leave questioning the next “SEC depth” claim they hear—and thinking twice before buying into the latest coaching “hot list.”