Episode Overview

Podcast: The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State Football Talk
Hosts: Doug Lesmerises & Bill Landis (Blue Wire)
Episode Date: November 20, 2025
Main Theme:
A deep-dive into Ohio State’s offensive line recruiting strategy, focusing on the in-state vs. national approach, NIL-era financial calculus, and specific breakdowns of the 2026 OL class. The episode closes with a lighthearted ‘Whatcha Watching, Eating, and Thinking’ segment, providing personal and pop-culture talk.

1. The Big Picture: Offensive Line Recruiting Strategy

• Purpose:
  Analyze Ohio State’s philosophy in building a championship-caliber offensive line: can it be done using mostly or primarily in-state recruits?
• Context:
  • The Buckeyes are defending national champions and renowned for their recruiting prowess.
  • The hosts are running a themed “Offensive Line Week” on their Substack, examining history and current trends.
  • Changes in NIL (“name, image, likeness”) and scholarship limits are altering the recruiting landscape.

2. Key Discussion Points & Insights

A. Ohio State’s In-State Recruiting Approach

• Historical Perspective:

  • Traditionally, OSU has built offensive lines from Ohio talent (dating to Tressel, Cooper, and even Woody Hayes years).
  • Recent years saw more national/transfers, but the current staff is intentionally pivoting back in-state.

• Core Question:
  “Can Ohio State build the offensive line it needs to succeed at a national championship level primarily through in-state players?” (02:07)

• Recruiting Realities:

  • NIL has driven up the price for elite national O-line prospects, making it less feasible to “outbid” aggressive schools like Texas Tech, Miami, or Oregon.
  • Ohio State's administrative and fan attitudes support a balanced, sustainable approach rather than overspending for a “five-star” from far away.

• Doug’s Framing:
  “If Texas Tech decides they want a guy at all costs, it’s going to be difficult to pay more than Texas Tech right now.” (17:03)

• Bill’s Take:
  Ohio State is pragmatic:
  “Nobody has infinite money... Ohio State is probably a little more…pragmatic with how it spends, just trying to really take value into account.” (18:40)

B. Priority Positions: Where In-State Works and Where It Doesn’t

• Pass game positions:

  • Quarterback/Receiver/Edge Rusher:

    • Highly prioritized; in-state Ohio rarely supplies what OSU needs.
    • Explained by weather (fewer reps outdoors), different development, and national patterns.
    • “Not the norm in Ohio…and it’s not really the norm in this part of the country.” (10:50)

  • Cornerback:

    • Somewhat more reliable to find in-state, but still inconsistent.
    • “Probably more than receiver and quarterback, but still not regularly.” (13:07)

• Offensive Line:

  • Most realistic spot for homegrown recruiting success.
  • “The only one of those positions where Ohio State probably feels like we can get almost all we need in-state is offensive tackle, offensive line, and that’s why we’re talking about it.” (16:15)
  • Bill agrees: linebacker, maybe tight end, are the only others with a similar in-state pool. (16:44)

C. NIL and Roster Construction Calculus

• Scholarship Expansion:

  • Now effectively have more than 85 spots; up to 100-105 scholarships.
  • “The move from 85 to 105 [scholarships] makes this strategy significantly more possible, because you can throw numbers at the issue.” (43:58)

• Investment Logic:

  • Teams are balancing one super-elite, expensive out-of-state recruit vs. four regional, more affordable prospects.
  • “If you spread that out, and [those] are good players…if you go two for four, well, that’s a better return on your investment than maybe you got by giving it all to one guy. If that guy doesn’t hit, it’s a huge blow…” (35:06)
  • Applies especially at a developmental position like the offensive line.

• Recruiting Misses:

  • Buckeyes targeted Felix Ojo, Jackson Cantwell, Emmanuel Ayanacho—lost all to “NIL-rich” schools.
  • “Not new to see Ohio State miss on…five-star tackles.” (07:08)

D. Anatomy of the 2026 Recruiting Class

Main Commits:
Local standouts + one from Arizona. Analyses based on 247 Composite Ratings.

• Sam Greer (OH, Archbishop Hoban) — #51 overall, #6 OT

  • Offered as a freshman; “Justin Fry fell in love.”
  • Committed before major national prospects made their decisions.
  • “Maybe, if they didn’t know they had somebody they liked as much as Greer, maybe that would have affected their ultimate pursuits of Cantwell and Ojo…but they knew what they had in-state.” (22:16)
  • Elite combination of size, athleticism, and multi-sport talent.
    • “6’7, 315...super athletic, could play Division I basketball.” (24:05)
    • “I don’t think he’d have to play early next year, but I think he could if they needed him to.”

• Maxwell Riley (OH, Avon Lake) — #171 overall, #7 OT

  • First OL offered in this class; chose OSU over Clemson.
  • Versatile: “Can play all five positions.” (26:20)
  • OSU fighting off Clemson echoes Jackson Carman’s old recruiting battle.

• Tucker Smith (AZ) — #571 overall, #45 IOL

  • Only out-of-state guy; connected to OL coach Tyler Bowen.
  • Not the highest-ranked offer sheet but “nasty” edge beloved by OL coaches.
    • “Tyler Bowen just watched and... this is my guy.” (45:13)

• Landry Breed (OH, Mentor) — #851 overall, #77 OT

  • Flipped from NC State; another Bowen connection.
  • More developmental, but held real Power 4 offers.

• Mason Wilhelm (OH, St. Edward; son of Matt Wilhelm) — #994 overall, #80 IOL

  • Flipped from UNC after productive senior season; got his offer as a “challenge met” reward.
  • Hosts praise OSU’s philosophy: choosing developmental, late-bloomers who fit the program rather than desperate late flips.
    • “If it’s a developmental project, but you put something out, do this, the person does it, you reward them, they immediately respond… seems like a good part of the strategy.” (50:20)

On Class Composition & Strategy

• Volume Approach:

  • Five-man class: Preferable to “three sure things,” especially with increased scholarship slack.
  • Bill: “If you’re going to take five, you have to probably have at least two... developmental kind of swings.” (32:41)
  • Doug: Use open scholarships for more dice rolls, maximize returns.

• Plan vs. Panic:

  • Previous years, fallback flips felt desperate; now, late additions are “planful” developments, not last-minute scrambles.
  • Doug: “Was it your plan or not? ... I am more accepting of where Ohio State is now with this kind of recruiting than I ever have been before...” (53:51)

E. The “Developmental” Philosophy

• Identifying High-Upside In-State Projects:

  • More affordable, more motivated, more likely to be invested.
  • Shifting focus to evaluating senior film and rewarding tangible progress (Wilhelm, Breed, Jake Cook examples).

• Trusting Coaches’ “My Guy” Instincts:

  • Tyler Bowen’s advocacy for Tucker Smith is seen as a positive, allowing for OL position coach autonomy.

F. Notable Quotes & Moments

On the NIL World

“When the five-star tackle comes to Ohio State, it’s usually because he’s from Ohio.”—Bill (09:21)

OSU OL Philosophy

“This is the position to do it based on the available talent pool in the state and how great players are created at the offensive line position.”—Doug (39:36)

The Value of Development

“If you’re a three-star prospect on your way to being a four- or five-star prospect, then you probably shouldn’t be at Ohio State. So taking the time to watch the senior film... is probably the right stance for Ohio State to take even if it causes the class to come together a little late.”—Bill (50:20)

On Late Additions

“I am more accepting of where Ohio State is now with this kind of player and recruiting than I ever have been before... I buy this because I think it’s different.” —Doug (54:25)

G. Brief Notes on 2027 and Other Prospects

• OSU already has three OL commits in the 2027 class, building continuity.
• Brief mentions: flips (ex. Kevin Brown, Darius Gray), mutual partings (Aaron Thomas), and Tyler Bowen’s Virginia connections.

3. ‘Whatcha Watching, Eating & Thinking’ Highlights

Whatcha Watching

• Bill: Tried Philly mob docuseries on Netflix—found it boring. Only interesting if you like law enforcement POV over mobster stories. Switched to a promising (partly French-language) Montreal Expos doc.
  Quote: “I don't want to watch a documentary about the Mafia from the perspective of the police... I want to watch it from the perspective of the guys who were doing it.” (63:58)

Whatcha Eating

• Bill: Randomly made stuffing for a dinner—wonders why Thanksgiving sides aren't normalized year-round.
  Quote: “I want stuffing with dinner. What do we think about having Thanksgiving sides not on Thanksgiving?” (70:34)

• Extended riff with Doug on the hidden joys of year-round stuffing, croutons, and Biscoff cookies as gateways to unwitting Britishness.

Whatcha Thinking

• Bill: Amazed by civil engineering/Columbus I-70/71 project.
  Quote: “...to see them reroute the entire highway on the fly...in an area that is far too small for what this city has become. It’s a heck of a thing.” (78:33)

• Doug: Prefers a buffer between celebrities and audiences; dislikes when actors reveal too much everyday real life in podcasts, ruining on-screen “mystique.”
  Quote: “Now every time I watch him on screen, I think about, he’s the guy who poops and then showers, and I don’t want to know that.” (84:46)

4. Timestamps for Key Segments

| Topic | Timestamp | |-----------------------------------------------------|:----------:| | Main theme intro & strategy scope | 00:32–03:06| | NIL/offensive tackle recruiting difficulties | 07:08–09:21| | Positional priorities & geographic recruiting | 10:25–16:44| | Scholarship/roster construction in NIL era | 35:06–36:23| | Detailed 2026 OL class breakdown | 22:16–47:40| | Late additions & developmental approach | 47:40–53:51| | Broader program/planful pivot insight | 53:51–55:37| | ‘Whatcha Watching, Eating & Thinking’ | 62:53–86:20|

5. Overall Takeaways

• Ohio State OL recruiting is evolving, responding to NIL realities by focusing heavily on in-state talent, emphasizing development, and being strategic rather than reactionary.
• The 2026 class is a microcosm of that strategy—two clear future starters and three developmental picks, most from Ohio.
• The hosts strongly advocate the current approach as sustainable and well-matched to the state’s talent pool, even if it’s less shiny than chasing every five-star nationally.

Memorable quote:

“We sort of see the vision for why Ohio State wants to operate this way and we think it can work… But time will tell. But that’s what will happen. We have to see what these investments turn out to be.” —Bill (40:05)

For Listeners:

Even if you skipped the episode, this summary gives you a thorough roadmap of OSU’s offensive line recruiting philosophy, the current class, and some lighthearted podcast signature content, complete with timestamps and direct quotes.

Bill and Doug’s Substack: billanddoug.osu.substack.com
Next Up: Michigan week, signing day, and more in-depth recruiting analysis.