Ohio State vs Minnesota picks and preview

Summary

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The Bill and Doug Show: Ohio State vs Minnesota Picks and Preview

Date: October 2, 2025
Hosts: Doug Lesmerises & Bill Landis
Presented by: Blue Wire

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Doug and Bill dive deep into the Ohio State Buckeyes' upcoming home night game against the Minnesota Golden Gophers. They analyze both teams’ strengths and weaknesses, preview key matchups on both sides of the ball, discuss betting lines, and make their official game picks. Listeners are treated to seasoned insight, banter, and analysis that puts Ohio State’s national championship aspirations in broader context, all while highlighting Minnesota’s emerging talent.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Setting the Scene

• First Home Big Ten Night Game Since 2023
  Ohio State returns to primetime at Ohio Stadium, a setting Bill and Doug agree will energize both players and fans.

  • “This is like, it's exciting. Like, I think it'll be exciting…Minnesota is enough. I think Minnesota is good enough to be excited for.” — Bill (01:52)

• Game Spread & Stakes

  • Ohio State favored by 23.5 points; over/under set at 44.5 (02:18)
  • Both hosts note: Big spread for a game they're projecting as low-possession.

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Minnesota’s Offense vs Ohio State’s Defense

Drake Lindsay: Minnesota's New QB to Watch

• Profile:
  Drake Lindsay, 6'5" pocket passer, first-year starter, strong arm, not a runner (“one scramble the entire season”).

• Performance:

  • Demonstrated poise and arm strength against Rutgers, especially after a slow start.
  • “He has made some impressive throws, especially in that Rutgers game…best game so far this year.” — Doug (04:31)
  • Only two turnover-worthy plays, five big-time throws (02:56).

• Offensive Evolution:

  • Minnesota shifting from run-first to a pass-heavy approach (throwing 54% of the time—unusual for PJ Fleck's Gophers).
  • Wide receiver room improved with transfer additions.
  • “They're putting it on Drake Lindsay and I think more and more each week…he's an exciting young quarterback in the Big Ten for sure.” — Doug (04:31)

• Limitations and Pressure Points:

  • Offensive line has issues, especially on the right side—susceptible to pass rush (09:31).
  • Lindsay not mobile, likely to face relentless pressure from Ohio State’s defense.
  • “I think they're going to be hounded on pretty good in this game, and he's not elusive…He's gonna get hit probably more than he's been hit in any game so far this year.” — Doug (11:00)

Run Game Woes

• Backup RB out for the year; Darius Taylor (top RB) banged up and status questionable (11:12).
• Minnesota likely to be one-dimensional, even if Taylor plays.
• “If he doesn't play, they're one dimensional and even if he does, they might have to be one dimensional.” — Bill (11:10)
• If healthy, Taylor could factor in as receiver out of the slot, setting up interesting matchups versus OSU’s linebackers (12:08).

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Ohio State’s Offense vs Minnesota’s Defense

Minnesota's Defensive Strengths

• Pass Rush:

  • 3.5 sacks per game (tied for 6th nationally), 7.5 tackles for loss per game (15:15).
  • Anthony Smith (rush end): 16 pressures, 7 in Rutgers game.
  • “Anthony Smith is an All-Big Ten candidate…a tough guy to try to block.” — Bill (15:15)

• Defensive Play Calling:

  • Danny Collins (first year DC, longtime PJ Fleck assistant) praised for smart, situationally aggressive playcalling (15:42).

• Blitz Tendencies:

  • Blitze 50% of the time vs Rutgers; Minnesota may be hesitant to blitz Ohio State as heavily due to OSU’s elite playmakers (16:54).
  • “It's a tough proposition when you decide you want to try to blitz Ohio State because…you throw a two-yard pass to Jeremiah Smith and that can happen.” — Doug (16:54)

Secondary & Key Players

• Koi Perich (safety, return specialist):

  • Electric athlete; first team All-Big Ten as a freshman.
  • “When he's right, he's a top 10 defensive player in the Big Ten and a…top 20 defensive player in the country.” — Doug (19:04)
  • Inconsistent; struggle with missed tackles and coverage lapses noted, but coming off his best game vs Rutgers (18:05).

• Other Secondary Notes:

  • Cary Brown (nickel safety): recent interception, smart coverage play (20:01).
  • John Nester (CB, Iowa transfer) – solid play, strong grades.

• Defensive Vulnerabilities:

  • Secondary can be vulnerable, especially in early game scripts.
  • Gave up big passing numbers early to Rutgers before adjusting.
  • “23 minutes there where Ethan Kaliak Manis was absolutely picking them apart. And Julian Saying absolutely has a chance to do the same thing.” — Doug (21:51)

Anticipating Ohio State's Offensive Approach

• Opportunity for QB Julian Sayin to have breakout numbers.
  • “This might be the exact right kind of opponent at home under the lights…for a 29 of 34 for 336 yards and four touchdowns kind of game.” — Bill (22:57)
• Buckeyes likely to air it out more than in prior weeks, tapping into explosive passing attack.
  • “Here's a little red meat for you…we’re going to toss it around the yard here.” — Doug (24:17)
• Both agree: Expect some fireworks from Ohio State’s offense under the lights.

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Special Teams Watch

• Koi Perich (Minnesota):
  • Electric but volatile as return specialist—had a key muffed punt in Cal loss and a 56-yard kickoff return vs Rutgers (26:32-28:02).
  • “He’s more boom than Brandon Ennis, because he’s a very good athlete. But there’s a lot of bust both ways here.” — Doug (28:02)
• Both teams could produce a big (or disastrous) special teams play.
• Doug predicts a special teams turnover in this game.

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Broader Context, Coaching, and Program Trajectory

• PJ Fleck's Place in the Big Ten:

  • Ninth season at Minnesota (61-40); earns respect for program-building despite evident talent gap vs OSU (29:03).
  • Middle-tier Big Ten team, but depth and overall roster ceiling restricts major upsets.

• Character Building for Minnesota:

  • Longer-term optimism about Drake Lindsay and Koi Perich as cornerstones.
  • Not equipped to truly threaten this Ohio State team yet.
  • “Getting their doors blown off by Ohio State in 2025 is a step on that journey [to contention in ‘27].” — Bill (35:26)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Minnesota’s New Identity:
  “They're putting it on Drake Lindsay and I think like more and more each week…he's an exciting young quarterback in the Big Ten for sure.” — Doug (04:31)

• On the Likely Game Flow:
  “This is going to be a baptism by fire for [Drake Lindsay] in Ohio Stadium.” — Bill (13:20)

• On Koi Perich:
  "When he's right, he is a top 10 defensive player in the Big Ten…and like, a top 20 defensive player in the country." — Doug (19:04)

• On OSU's Offensive Opportunity:
  “You want to see the number one team in the country at home under the lights, putting on a primetime show. I think you got a shot at it.” — Bill (23:50)

• On PJ Fleck's Philosophy:
  “I think he's keeping Drake Lindsay and the first team offensive line in there, down 30…to give them reps against Ohio State's backups or whatever, to try to, like, this is Drake Lindsay. Drake Lindsay needs to know what this is because in two years…Minnesota wants to make a playoff run.” — Bill (35:17)

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Picks and Predictions

• Doug’s Pick:
  Ohio State 35, Minnesota 7
  • “I'm not going absurd…I'm going 35-7. I could see it's 35-0 and Drake Lindsay throws a bomb in the fourth quarter to make it 35-7.” (33:40)
• Bill’s Pick:
  Ohio State 35, Minnesota 13
  Thinks it’s a little much to cover 23.5-points spread in a low-possession game; takes Minnesota +23.5.
  • “I just think there might be just like enough…in a low-possession game. That 23.5 is a lot to cover.” (34:41)

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Betting Insights

• The low over/under (44.5) points to limited scoring from Minnesota.
• Stats suggest both teams start slow offensively (“Ohio State in the first quarter…three points against three FBS teams…Minnesota zero points.” — Doug, 30:03)
• Both teams rank top-5 nationally in fewest plays of 20+ yards allowed (32:09).
• Hosts disagree on the spread—one on OSU, the other takes points with Minnesota.

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Time | Topic | |-----------|--------------------------------------------------------| | 01:21 | Show open, setting up OSU-Minnesota, night game hype | | 02:18 | Vegas Odds, initial breakdown starts | | 03:00-06:30| Minnesota’s new pass-first offense, Drake Lindsay | | 09:30 | Minnesota offensive line weaknesses | | 11:06 | RB Darius Taylor’s injury, one-dimensional offense | | 15:15 | Minnesota’s pass rush (Anthony Smith, Danny Collins DC)| | 18:01 | Koi Perich deep-dive | | 21:51 | Early defensive struggles against Rutgers | | 22:57 | Potential breakout game for OSU passing offense | | 26:32 | Special teams (Koi Perich) chaos | | 29:03 | PJ Fleck’s Minnesota tenure and program status | | 33:40 | Official Score Predictions | | 35:26 | Minnesota’s long-term plan, “character building” | | 38:02 | Doug, on possible OSU offensive breakout |

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Conclusion

Doug and Bill provide a comprehensive, nuanced preview of Ohio State vs Minnesota, combining Xs and Os analysis, humor, and a sense of the larger stakes for both programs. They expect a decisive but measured Buckeye win in front of an energized home-night crowd, marking another step for OSU’s title defense and for Minnesota as an up-and-coming—but not yet dangerous—Big Ten challenger. The episode is essential listening for Ohio State fans, betting enthusiasts, and anyone tracking the evolving Big Ten landscape.

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Transcript

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[Bill Landis]

Welcome back to the Bill and Doug Show. Ohio State versus Minnesota pick second Saturday night in Ohio Stadium on NBC. Noah Eagle, Todd Blackledge, Catherine Tappin on the call for NBC. Bill, first home night game for the Buckeyes, especially one that really matters in a while. Exciting for the fans.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I think it's the first home night game against the Big Ten team since 2023. I can't remember who they played in that game, but yeah, it's been a while.

[Bill Landis]

Michigan. Michigan State.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Michigan State. I think it was Michigan State. Yeah.

[Bill Landis]

So that's good. So this is like, it's exciting. I do think. Like, I think it'll be exciting. Like, like I think Minnesota is enough. I think Minnesota is good enough to be excited for. Do you agree with that?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Well, I mean, like excited and what. In what sense? Like that it's not going to be 72 to nothing. Sure.

[Bill Landis]

Yes. Yeah, that's enough. Yes. It's. It's a low bar. It is a low bar. That's basically what I'm saying. This game is a 23 and a half point spread. Let me see who's favored. Ohio State is favored by 23 and a half over Minnesota. The over under is 44 and a half. Not a big game breakdown on the show, but let's do a little bit on both sides of the ball. Let's start with the Ohio State defense against this Minnesota offense. I've been talking about Drake Lindsay kind of ad nauseam. Landis. He's an interesting dude. He's. He's practically the opposite of Daman Williams Jr. The Ohio, the quarterback that Ohio State faced last week. He is a big 6 foot 5 pocket passer. I think he has one scramble the entire season. He is not going to run. Although he got out of the pocket. Made like a really nice throw on the move in the second half against Rutgers last week when they really needed it. But he is a classic drop back passer. First year starter, second year player at Minnesota. They've been grooming him. He sat behind Max Brosmer last year. His nut like his, his stats are pretty good. His pff grade is good. Right. He's. He doesn't like the Dante. Yeah he's made five big time throws this year. Only two turnover worthy plays. Has hit 5 of 16 throws of 20 yards or more. Watching him early I just re watched the entire Rutgers Minnesota game from last week. Again it's just like a good solid, fun, not super high level but good Big Ten game if, if Ohio State fans want to go back and watch it I think. And the thing about it is it's actually like we'll get this to when we get to the Minnesota defense like Rutgers. The Rutgers passing game is actually like a decent representation of what Ohio State's going to do in the passing game. It was a good warm up for the Minnesota defense, not like 35 of what Ohio State can do but I thought that was like an interesting matchup. But on the offensive side of the ball, Minnesota did nothing early and then Drake Lindsay dropped a perfect deep ball onto the hands of another red shirt freshman, Jalen Smith. It like woke up that offense and it was just bill a little bit of reminder of okay like this. This guy can do stuff like that maybe on occasion.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah, he's got a nice arm. That throw was, was really good. I noted the throw you mentioned outside the pocket too. That was nice. They had another touchdown like on a little screenplay. He can make all the throws and Minnesota I think has done a nice job with its receiver room this year. Javon Tracy for my transit for Miami. Ohio is pretty good player so it's a different, different feel I think for a Minnesota team like Minnesota for the longest time at least under PJ Fleck anyway certainly before that was a run first kind of team. Last year started to go more toward the past because I had Max Brosman but didn't really, really. I don't think had the receivers like to maximize that. This feels like a heightened version of it. They're, they're throwing the ball like 54 of the time, which is really high for them. They usually run the ball in the 60s. There's been years if you go back like 2021 and 2022, there's years where Minnesota is running the ball as much or more than anyone who's on a service academy and they're. That's not what their offense is right now. They are, they're putting it on Drake Lindsay and I think like more and more each week. So he's an exciting young quarterback in the Big Ten for sure. Like is he, is he ready to go shot for shot with Julian saying in the shoe? I don't, I don't think he's quite there yet. But he has definitely made some impressive throws, especially in that Rutgers game. The Rutgers game was, was his best game so far this year. Like they played Buffalo and they played an FCS team and then they lost to Cal. Like that became a back and forth game against Rutgers where he started to kind of have to match Ethan Kaliak madness throw for throw. And it felt like he did. It was pretty fun.

[Bill Landis]

43 drop backs, 15 rushing plays for Minnesota in that game against Rutgers, like, like crazy three to one passing because that's what they felt like they had to do to win. Now we'll get into the Minnesota rushing attack in a little bit. Like early in that game I was like, oh, like Lindsay still has a, like a big young guy is just like a chuck and check down. It's like, oh, let's take a shot if it's there. If it's not there, just check it down. But then actually over the course of the game, like then as they sort of opened it up a little bit more, he's making throws in the middle of the field. Like he'll stand in there, make a throw and he feathers the ball very nicely for a big guy. Like he has, I think he has nice touch on the ball and they'll try to hit and he, you know, he can hit a couple of those free money outs. He feather a crosser and Lee and lead a guy like, you can see what's there. I will say this, the thing you said about he's not, I don't think he's, he's not going to like, I'm, I'm not, I'm not gonna, I'm not here to like scare Ohio State. Oh, Drake Lindsay, that's not it Ah, Ohio State, Minnesota don't play each other next season. If Dinkytown Athletics, the nil arm of the Minnesota football program, can keep that guy around, I'll be very curious when Ohio State goes to Minnesota in 2027, what that might look like if Drake was year three as a starting quarterback for the Gophers.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

This was. This was floated in the interview room on Tuesday as we were waiting for Ryan Day. What if, by that point, P.J. fleck and Drake Lindsay are in Arkansas?

[Bill Landis]

Oh, I thought you were going to say, what if by that point, Drake Lindsay is a starting quarterback at Ohio State?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

No, no, no, no. That'll be insane.

[Bill Landis]

Who floated that? Was there an SEC interloper floating P.J. fleck and Drake Lindsay to Arkansas stuff?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I think it would have been Spencer. I think it was Spencer.

[Bill Landis]

No, no, that's not a float. That's not better. That's not a better job. Drake Lindsay went to high school in the backyard of the Arkansas football program. I get it. If. If they. He's Arkansas is his Texas. If this is the Hogs are calling him home. Big Suey, I get it. Fine. But also, when we talked to him at Big Ten media days, I was, like, trying to pound home. Like, they. They didn't want you, Drake. They didn't want you.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. Could you think, by the way, the.

[Bill Landis]

North wanted you, what it would do.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

For the Taylors of Fayetteville, Arkansas, if John Calipari and P.J. fleck were at the same university?

[Bill Landis]

I'm not entertaining this. It didn't work last time. PJ Fleck, it's like, oh, Brett Biloba ruined his career for a decade trying to go to Arkansas and do something. Now he's back where he belongs. PJ Flex, PJ Fleck wants to go to usc. Fine. Don't go to Arkansas. So stop it. Cut this part out. Can we get our producer to cut this part out? This is offensive to me. Drake Lindsay, 10 yards on his A dot, average depth of target, right? Like, he will throw the ball down the field. So I think it's interesting. Like, he wants to throw it down the field. He will feather some throws, but if you get after him, he's not very mobile. And in terms of this passing game, the right side of the Minnesota offensive line is. Has been bad. Their right guard has allowed nine pressures. Their right tackle has allowed 10 pressures. Their right guard is Marcellus Marshall, who's a transfer from ucf. There's, like, kind of a big portal ad for him, not really working out. And right Tackle is where Philip Daniels should be, except he transferred from Minnesota to Ohio State. So they had some real offensive line issues last year when they had a lot of guys back, including Ariante Ursary, who is a great NFL draft prospect and with a lot of talent. They had some trouble, like, finding their way, and that was more in the run game. It really took them some time. Their center's good, but I. I think there's a real hole on the right side of the offensive line. Lindsay's hasn't. Has been like, blitzed about a third of the time. He actually. Actually seems to hit, like, by the stats, handles the blitz pretty well. He's not going to scramble. I think he's just gonna get rid of it. Like he's. He. He will take a check down, right? But he settled in. They did not move. The Rutgers dominated Minnesota early, and then Minnesota, like, sort of figured out we're just going to throw it. And they. You can see Lindsay, as you said, he played his best game. He really settled into a rhythm. I don't think Ohio State's defense is going to let him settle into a rhythm.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I do not. Even that play, like, where he got outside of the pocket. I was just watching that play thinking to myself, like, great job. You're not going to run away from Ohio State's defense the same way he just ran away from Rucker's defense to make that throw. So I don't. I think he might in this game, connect on a big play or two, but I don't think he'll ever feel settled. I think they're going to be hounded on pretty good in this game, and he's not. His numbers against pressure, I don't actually. Don't think are terrible, but.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah, they're not. They're okay.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

But he's not elusive. Right. So he's gonna. I think he's gonna get hit probably more than he's been hit in any game so. So far this year.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah. And they can't run it. Like, their run game has been a real problem.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

It's crazy how bad it is.

[Bill Landis]

Well, their backup running back is out for the year, and then Darius Taylor, they're returning. Starting running back got hurt in Week 2 and hasn't played since. P.J. fleck, I think, played a little coy early this week about that. He said, check the injury report two hours before the game. So actually, like, let's all check the injury report two hours before the game. You know, they're playing their third and fourth guys and like, it's just not great. I have no idea if Darius Taylor's gonna play in the opener. He carried 30 times for 141 yards. That's the kind of back that he is. And P.J. fleckin talking about this. It's the difference between a place like Minnesota and a place like Ohio State. Minnesota certainly can have some individual stars, but then like you, if you lose one of your best dudes and Darius Taylor coming into the year is one of their five best players who has the ball in his hands a ton. You're just, you don't have anybody to replace him. And they're feeling that loss. And I think if he doesn't play there one dimensional and even if he does play, they might have to be one dimensional throwing the ball. I don't know.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah, I think because the last year is like, they had Darius Taylor, they couldn't block for him. So it's like if they get them back and they still block for him, you. He had 30 carries for 140 yards in the opener. They played a Mac team like he had. He had to carry the ball 30 times for 140 yards against, against Buffalo, which has like, it's a good Mac defense, but still Mac team. Yeah, I, I would expect them to be one dimensional. If Darius Taylor plays, like, even if Minnesota is throwing the ball a lot, you know, he is or can function like a receiver out of the slot. They did that quite a bit last year. So that could create some interesting matchups for like, Arvel Reese and Sunny Styles, both of whom I think have been very good in coverage so far this year. But no one's really like, tried to pepper their running back with passes against Ohio State either. So that could be something new to tackle. I, I just, I think there are reasons to be, like, excited about Minnesota's future. I just don't, like, I don't think they're nearly ready to like, put that on display against what Ohio State's throwing out there defensively right now.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah, I think it is just a, it is a slower line of progression. I, I was very intrigued by the Minis, the Washington offense last week because, like, Denzel Boston's a veteran guy, Jonah Coleman's a veteran guy. And when you have a young quarterback who can move like that, I think it accelerates the timeline.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Right.

[Bill Landis]

And then you still saw what Ohio State did with him. As you're saying, Tomond Williams Jr's like, where's Arvell Reese? Where's Arvell Reese? I think it's a slower timeline for Minnesota, but I think that I think like, I think Drake Lindsay is going to be good. This is going to be a baptism by fire, I think, in Ohio Stadium, and I would be prepared for him to make a couple throws and for Ohio State fans at times to be like, well, that's kind of a big guy who can stand in there and make a throw. And then other times, you know, to have Kaden Curry and Arvell Reese inside his jersey and he has nowhere to go. And Ohio State has eight sacks. So.

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[Bill Landis]

Defensively, Minnesota averages three and a half sacks per game. That's tied for sixth in the country. Seven and a half tackles for loss per game. Anthony Smith. They're good. Rush end has 16 pressures. That's tied for seventh in the Big Ten. Kaden Curry, for instance, has 17. He had seven pressures versus Rutgers last week. Minnesota sacked Rutgers six times and in re watching that game, there's a couple times where Anthony Smith or somebody on the defensive line just won a one on one battle and got a sack. There was at least one coverage sack in there where we can talk about the secondary in a moment, but they can cover at times. And then one of the things that accelerated them was they were down 14 nothing early and this wound up being like a great comeback victory for Minnesota at home. And then they started blitzing and they had two sacks on back to back third downs where they blitzed one of them by Koi Perich from their safety from real depth and it felt like it, it jump started them a little bit. So I do think there's a little like Anthony Smith is an all Big Ten candidate. Right. I think he's that level of defensive lineman and he has a chance to, you know, be a tough guy to try to block. And then who's the. Danny Collins, right, is the new defensive coordinator for Minnesota who's been with PJ Fleck forever. Hadn't been a coordinator before. I thought it was like a well called game and you know, Yogi Roth and the guys who recruit calling the game for the Big Ten network, I think kind of agreed with that. Like he, he know PJ Fleck, he knows this team and he, I thought like the way he called it really helped dig out Minnesota out of a hole and I think they'll try to get after Julian saying a little bit.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

He'S not been blitzed a ton. Saying 33 of his drop back so far this year and, and Minnesota was like I think almost 50 of the time against Rutgers. I, maybe, well it's a, it's a tough proposition when you're, when you decide you want to try to blitz Ohio State because as we saw against Washing when Washington blitzed seven and they threw a two yard pass to Jeremiah Smith, like that can happen. So I don't, I don't know that they're going to trust their guys to cover as well as you need to cover on the back end if you're going to send extra pressure. Like I, I actually Minnesota's secondary numbers aren't like terrible but like the, the two teams with decent quarterbacks that they play did throw the ball on them.

[Bill Landis]

So.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

We'Ll see. I, I bet they play it more conservative and try to keep everything in front of them and hope they can blow up in the red zone like everybody else. Ohio State plays.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah. Minnesota love their safeties coming into the year. Parrish, Koi Parich, who I think. Did you vote him or did I vote him second?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I voted him first preseason defensive player of the year. Yeah.

[Bill Landis]

Ahead of Caleb Downs. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it hasn't like really clicked in, but he had his best game last week. He had 11 tackles. He had the sack on the blitz last week. I don't know, it feels like maybe, you know, they're playing him a little bit on offense. I think he has 16 snaps on offense there. He's a very talented player. He was a great high school player. It was a big deal for Ohio State to keep him home. Ohio State tried to get him at the end of that recruiting cycle. He made a splash last year. He didn't start until about a third of the way into the season last year as a true freshman and wound up first team all Big Ten. So he is like a, he is a talent, and it's not a talent that, that comes through the Minnesota program all the time. And then I think maybe like the hype got it to everybody a little bit here, first couple games and we'll talk about him on special teams because he is their return guy. But I, I think, you know, he's, he has a lot of missed tackles by pff. He's given up a lot in coverage by pff, but I think maybe he found himself a little bit last week and it's just a guy you got to keep an eye on.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

You definitely have to keep an eye on him. He's, when he's right, he is like a, he's a top 10 defensive player in the Big Ten and like a, I don't know, top 20 defensive player in the country. He's very good. And I like watching the cow game. He just seemed very out of sorts, and that was probably his worst game of the year. But he definitely looked better against Rutgers, and that was a game where the ball was in the air a lot. So I guess that that's a good sign for him that he's rounding in the form. He's a little bit of a wild card. Like, if Minnesota does, does decide to like, junk it up a little bit defensively, like, he's kind of the guy I think they do it with. So he's probably trying to think he's the best secondary player I think Ohio State will have faced so far this year. I think he's better than probably anybody in Texas is secondary. Davis didn't play, so he's, he's the best defensive back Ohio State has played so far this year.

[Bill Landis]

And then Carrie Brown, one of their other safeties, he's more like their nickel guy, had a nice pick last week where Minnesota, like acted like they were in man. And then they're in zone and Carrie Brown comes off a guy and goes to an area and makes a pick. So they're gonna throw some stuff at Julian saying John Nester one of their corners is like a really good grade. I think has played well this year. So I do think they have a decent Iowa transfer.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Right. Mr.

[Bill Landis]

I think that's right. I think that's right. Decent secondary, at least one edge guy who can get after it seems like they have a good defensive plan, but I don't know. Like, I don't. I. I also think just watching it last week they've played, you know, Rutgers tried to throw it all over him. So here's the other Rutgers, the first three possessions last week moved up and down the field at will. They got their Rutgers kickers kind of screwed up. He like tried a 22 yard field goal on their first drive and like kicked it. The ball hit a defensive tackle like in the neck. It was the lowest kick I've ever seen. And then they scored touchdowns of the next two drives. So the first quarter and a half of that game, it was 14 nothing. Rutgers did whatever it wanted against this Minnesota defense. And mostly what it wanted to do was, was throw. And as you have talked about, Rutgers has three really good receivers. And you think Ethan Kaliak Manis is a Heisman contender. So Rutgers was marching. So like, like that part of it is like, oh, Minnesota had no chance stopping the Rutgers passing attack on the first three drives. And it's like, okay, is Ohio State going to score 80? Like what are we doing here? And then Minnesota found themselves a little bit credit to them. But it is worth Remembering There were 23 minutes there where Ethan Kaliak Manis was absolutely picking them apart. And Julian saying absolutely has a chance to do the same thing.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

He definitely does. Although I, I will say the. I think both early touchdown throws from Cal of tight window throws right like he was. He really. He really pumped them in there, pumped them in there to the guys who were covered.

[Bill Landis]

So cracked the door on a Manus and you're like, let me tell you, nobody could defend. I mean Kaliak Manis I.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

The interception he threw was terrible. So, so he saw. You saw. You saw in that moment the reason why Minnesota was like, we don't think he should be our quarterback anymore. But there were definitely guys open. It felt like. And I. Minnesota does not want to let anybody run the ball. And it felt like Rutgers was able to kind of throw them out of that a little bit. I'm curious. I don't. I don't know that I have a great feel for how Minnesota might try to play Ohio State. Minnesota's like, likes this defensive line has very good linebackers. Actually. I think the secondary is probably the weakness of the defense aside from Koi Perich. But I don't like if Minnesota just like loads the box and is playing four Guys deep like I, I don't know what, how they're going to expect to stop Ohio State's passing attack.

[Bill Landis]

Really interesting. You know the two power conference teams at Ohio State's played it sort of felt like, okay, like have they really let Julian say and go this could be it. This might be the exact right kind of opponent at home under the lights that night for a. For a 29 of 34 for 336 yards and four touchdowns kind of game from Julian Zan.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah, I could see it. Jaron Kave, Sanga Pulatelli and Ethan Kali Manis. The Cal and the Ruckers quarterback threw for a combined 528 yards, five touchdowns, one pick against this defense. And those guys have fun names to say and are decent quarterbacks. Julian S. Is better and those guys don't have Jeremiah Smith. So. Yeah, or Corneli.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah, yeah, this is, this R. This really might be the exact right kind of defense to really work some stuff out in the Ohio State passing game which I think would be like for you might get the game. You want Ohio State fans like you. You want to see. You want to see the number one team in the country at home under the lights, putting on a primetime show. I think you got a shot at it.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I think so. And don't you feel like too sometimes if like because for instance, I think, I don't know that there's anybody that's like upset with how Ohio State played against Washington. But people are kind of like eager to see some explosive offense from Ohio State and wondering a little bit somewhat like why they're running the ball so much. It just gets to be like Ryan Day and Brian Hartline like, okay, here's a little, here's a little red meat for you. We're going to, we're going to, we're going to toss it around the yard here. And then it's just a matter of how many possessions does Ohio State have to score X amount of points? That I don't know. But yeah, I think they'll throw it pretty well here.

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[Bill Landis]

Yeah, I do think when we get to our picks, it is still just like 23 and a half is a lot in. In a low possession world, man. Like it is, you know.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

So yeah, total. The total is telling you something, right? Would you say the total was 40.

[Bill Landis]

44 and a half?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. So like they think Minnesota might not score, which is like, yeah, Ohio State's giving up five points per game.

[Bill Landis]

But yeah, we're around. What? Yeah, I mean we're like, it's. Yeah, we're like at 34, 10 or something like is roughly what we're talking about. Special team. So it is. So. So Minnesota's 3 and 1. They have a loss at Cal. And then it was like, oh, Cal might be good. It was like, no, Cal got shut up by San Diego State the next. Like, Cal's not good that game. The yardage was equal in the Minnesota. Cal game. Minnesota lost the turnover battle. 2 Nothing because Drake Lindsay threw a pick on the first drive of the second half. And then Coy Parish let a punt, let a punt hit him in the foot. It was like the weirdest. If you think Brandon Ennis is driving you crazy as a return guy. Holy moly. It's like, oh, who's Coy Parish? It's like Coy Parish is the most important recruit in Minnesota history and possibly one of the 20 best players in college football. How's he done this year? He let a punt hit him in the foot and we lost because of was 1414. And he just was like kind of standing at the eight yard line and the punt rolled and hit him in the foot. And then Cal was like, cool, thanks. We're gonna win now. It's crazy. Also last week he returned to kickoff 56 yards. And so like this is. This could be a game of special teams adventures because you said there's Another thing that parents had like another weird special teams thing. But he is definitely. He's more. He's more boom than Brandon Ennis because he's a very good athlete. But there's a lot of bust both ways here. And frankly, I'll pick a special teams turnover somewhere in this game one way or the other from one of these teams.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. One of the kickoffs in the Rutgers game, Parrish like let it bounce and then bent over to pick it up and kicked it when he bent over to pick it up. Yeah. There. There very well could be special teams adventures. It would. It would. I. We'll see if Ohio State ends up punting. It only punted once in the game against Washington. Yeah. But we know that it'll have to kick off at least once.

[Bill Landis]

That's true.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

So we'll see. We'll see. We'll see what happens. But there could be some shenanigans.

[Bill Landis]

Okay. Is there anything. So P.J. fleck. Right. A lot of love shared both ways. Ryan Day said very nice things about PJ Fleck in his news conference. PJ Fleck said very nice things about Ryan Day in his news conference. P.J. fleck has been at Minnesota a long time now. This is Ryan Day's seventh year at Ohio State. Is PJ Flex ninth year at Minnesota? 61 and 40. Has. Has been like a very good coach for that program. And so they are. We put them in the middle tier of the Big Ten this year. In talking about like three teams at the top and eight in the middle, I definitely thought Minnesota belonged in that middle. I just think especially with Darius Taylor out and Koi Parich maybe kind of like rounding into form and Drake Lindsay is going to take a little time. They're probably at the bottom of that middle just because there's less room for error. They played really well last week against Rutgers and like pulled that game out. Now also Rutgers, Minnesota won by three and Rutgers got to like the 15 yard line to kick a game tying field goal and then just like snapped it when the quarterback wasn't ready and backed up 15 yards for no reason and then missed a long field goal in the last play of the game or it gone to overtime. Rutgers looked like a better team for pretty healthy chunks of that game, but Minnesota found a way to win. So I do think they're scrappy. I do think they have like, Anthony Smith is a good player. Koi Parritch is a good player. Darius Taylor, if he's healthy, is a good player. Drake Lindsay has a bright future. But like talent, standpoint, across the board, it's just like, it's a gap, large gap.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. Like Philip Daniels would be like the third best player on Minnesota's roster and he's, yeah, he's playing very well for Ohio State, but where do we have him? 17th in our draft of top 22 Buckeyes. Right. So I think everyone knows the reality of the situation here. It's, I, I, I do think it's a hard like, kind of like game script to try to nail down because there's like the X factor of this being an long anticipated like Big Ten night game for Ohio State. Also, like against, to your point earlier, I think like against an opponent that's, that's just good enough to have Ohio State's attention, like, to come out and like play well. Like, I don't, I don't think if they were playing like whatever, bottom of the barrel, like Northwestern, ucla, like maybe you could go out sluggish just because you're not like too fired up for the opponent. I think Minnesota is like good enough to get you like fairly locked in. And then you combine that with the, which should be a pretty awesome environment. You could see one of those games where like Ohio State scores the first four times it has the ball and it's over in the second quarter. Yeah, but Ohio State in the first quarter against the three FBS teams it's played this year has three points. Didn't score against Texas, didn't score against Washington, kick the field goal against Ohio. Minnesota in the first quarter against the three FBS opponents it has played has scored zero points.

[Bill Landis]

Well, now you're just doing, now you're just doing a betting show, so I don't know.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah.

[Bill Landis]

First quarter under. Is that what you're saying?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Like the, the numbers would tell you that. But like I, I have seen enough of pre game fireworks. 10 minutes later, it's 35. Nothing to scare me off of that. But both teams play slow and both teams kind of ease into it offensively. So I'm not really, I'm not entirely sure what to expect in terms of the script.

[Bill Landis]

Both teams are very willing to take shots if they're there. Right. So that's, that's, but neither defense has.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Given up big plays. 20, 20 plus yards plays allowed. Ohio State has given up eight. That's number four in the country. Minnesota's giving up nine. That's number five in the country.

[Bill Landis]

The first quarter total over, under is nine and a half. The over is minus 140. The under is plus 112. So if touchdown on a field goal wins it for you in the first quarter. And maybe the stats. What the sat. The stats you're citing are driving you towards the under, but it's the Buckeyes in prime time might be driving you towards the over. Right. So that. That could be an interesting over bet. I do. I think Ohio State fans, I think everybody's going to win here. I think PJ Fleck's gonna come in after the game and be like, man, that is a great team. That's PJ Flex said this week this might be Ryan Day's best team.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Right.

[Bill Landis]

The way they played the first four games. So P.J. fleck, who. Who was once upon a time like, you know, coach under Jim Trestle had like a little. Has a little bit of tiny Ohio State blood in him, I think is going to come out of this game thinking it's a great experience for his guys. They're going to grow. We have guys like Coy Parrots and Drake Lindsay who will be better because of this experience. They just want to fight a little bit. They're coming out of a game where they fought hard, right, and found the way three and one. They've got to be pretty happy with that. But I, But I think, I think you're right. It is the exact. Like enough to get Ohio State's attention to bring out the best of Ohio State. So what's your pick?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I still think it ends up being low possession. So, like, I'm not going. I'm not going. Absurd. I'm going 35 7. Ohio State, the last game they played, 20, 23, it was 37 nothing. And then Minnesota kicked a field goal. Like, kicked like a 56 yard field goal with like six minutes left to score and not get shut out. I could see like it's 35 nothing. And Drake Lindsay throws a bomb in the fourth quarter to make it 35 7.

[Bill Landis]

You're not expecting like any actual Minnesota offense? You think Ohio State smothers this?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Basically, I just like, if Texas and Washington couldn't do it, I don't. I don't think so.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah. Yeah. Drake Lindsay might be better than Arch, though, to be fair. I have 35, 13. So we have the same score for Ohio State, but again, that's cover. Not cover. So you're saying take the Buckeyes minus 23 and a half? I'm thinking. I'm saying take Minnesota plus 23 and a half.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Two and over the spread against PJ Fleck, for what it's worth.

[Bill Landis]

Interesting. I just think there might be just like enough, just a tiny little bit of enough life in the Minnesota offense in a low possession game. That 23 and a half is a lot to cover and also like backdoor cover territory. Right. Sort of. If they have one decent thing, you know, they hit like two throws and they get a pass interference call and all of a sudden they score a touchdown in the second quarter and now they're down 35,7 with four minutes left and they do something against the backup. So I, I don't.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

P.J. fleck, I think, would do that.

[Bill Landis]

Right.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Like he would, he would relish the opportunity to make it, make the optics.

[Bill Landis]

Better and just give his guys more reps. I mean, like, I think I, I think he's keeping Drake Lindsay in the first team offensive line in there. Down 30.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah.

[Bill Landis]

To give them reps against Ohio State's backups or whatever to try to like, this is Drake Lindsay. Drake Lindsay needs to know what this is because in two years, if Coy Parrot stays and Drake Lindsay stays, and if they're somehow both seniors, like Minnesota wants to make a playoff run in 2027. So getting their doors blown off by Ohio State in 2025 is a step on that journey. Right?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. So character building. Yeah.

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[Bill Landis]

But we're just like kind of all in on like the low possession idea of things. And that Ohio State is willing to accept that. And then therefore we just might like 40 and 50 point games against Power 4 opponents just like might be off the board for the Buckeyes until further notice.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah, I think, I think that's probably right. We'll see like there, I think there will be the odd game where Ryan Day and Brian Hartline just decide like, you know what, we're gonna play tempo this week. So, and maybe, maybe this is that week. Although like they have, they've talked a lot about this stretch, right. And they like they're home here and then they're on the road for the next two. Like Illinois is potentially trick, tricky road trip like getting, get your win, get out, get ready to go play Illinois. I think could very much kind of be the, the kind of mode of operation here for Ohio State.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah. I don't know. But also it could be like, let's stretch our wings. Like that's, let's like see how high we can fly to get ready for the end of this stretch, right. That at some point we need to let it go. Like before Penn State. Like, let's really see, let's really see what we can do. Let's test it a little bit. And this is the last home game before Penn State.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. And you, you also, like, I think you look for tendency, breaking spots too, right. And Ohio, the Ohio game was definitely that. And I don't think you envision yourself like doing it on the road so much. So this could be one of those opportunities where like they run four plays we've never seen before and all four go for touchdowns.

[Bill Landis]

Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Yes. So we're just like, we're so similar, but we're on opposite sides of both. You're on the under, I'm on the over. I, I'm taking the points with Minnesota. You're giving the points with Ohio State, even though we're right in the same range. I, I, you know, if you want to bet on your Ohio State team because you're an Ohio State fan and the three dollar bet makes it more fun, certainly go do that. I'm not, I'm not pounding the table for, for anything here. Right. I think we're, we're in the same range, but I think it could be a risky game to get a real handle on from a betting standpoint.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah, I think I might have bet the under like earlier in the week because the number moved, but.

[Bill Landis]

Okay. All right. We'll have our Friday show where we dig into national picks and we also have, I got A note from a substack subscriber. You can find us on substack billandduggosu.substack.com about Roback. And one of the things they were saying is, like, I had done a read where I was talking about, man, you can get different shirts for all the teams you like. And he's like, nobody has different teams. They like that. That is not an effective sales pitch. Right? Like, just tell them, go look for your own team. Like, they have your team, so go buy your team. Like, are there really people?

[Doug Lee Maurice]

This isn't the sec. They don't. We don't cheer for multiple teams.

[Bill Landis]

It's like, what should I do? Should I wear my Minnesota shirt today or should I wear my Maryland shirt today? It's like, that person doesn't exist. Doug, that is not a good pitch. But what this person said that is a good pitch is a row back. Good collars, good collars on the shirt. And B, he said, makes a husky guy look good. Good shirts, good, good tops for husky guys. So I don't know if that's officially approved by Roback as an ad read. Good shirts for husky guys. But this is someone who owns Roback gear. So go to roback.com R-H-O-B-A-K.com Check out your favorite team's collection, Ohio states, for instance, and see what you think, and you'll know that you're getting, like, quality gear that looks. Looks good. Quality collar. Collar. I mean, good collar. Good collars make the world go around.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

That's right.

[Bill Landis]

And then also, like, you know, like, it's. It's gonna make a lot of different body types look good in your football gear. So roback.com code bad20. Bad20 will get you 20 off your first order. That's at R H O-B-A-K.com use the code bad20. We will do our national picks on Friday, Landis, where we have a lot of games to cover. So it's a pretty. Again, like, college football is pretty good. College football is pretty. Do you like it? It's pretty fun. It's good.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

I like it. And I saw you. You retweeted something that said the viewership is up. Right? People are. People are digging the product. So far this year. Yeah, it's been good. Yeah.

[Bill Landis]

I mean, it's like, you can't kill the sport as much as the sport itself tries to kill the sport as much as politics tries to kill this sport with, like, what are they going to pass or not pass or who's having a commercial version of the bill or that version of the bill. It's like, I don't know, man. Just show up on Saturday and watch games for 12 hours and you'll probably have a pretty good time.

[Doug Lee Maurice]

Yeah. All right.

[Bill Landis]

So our Ohio State picks, we do every Thursday, national picks on Friday, post game show on the Buckeyes after Ohio State. Minnesota should be around 11pm Eastern or so on Saturday night. We'll see you guys there. For now, he's Bill Landis. I'm Doug Lee Maurice and that was the Bill and Doug Show.

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