A Round 2 Roller-Coaster Ride, Denver’s QB Plight, and Josh’s Lost Weekend With Cousin Sal

Summary

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The Bill Simmons Podcast

Episode: “A Round 2 Roller-Coaster Ride, Denver’s QB Plight, and Josh’s Lost Weekend With Cousin Sal”

Date: January 19, 2026
Host: Bill Simmons
Guest: Cousin Sal

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Episode Overview

Bill Simmons and Cousin Sal break down an utterly wild NFL Divisional Playoff weekend that saw upsets, quarterback carnage, heartbreak for the Buffalo Bills (and their fans), and improbable paths to the Super Bowl for several flawed teams. The hosts riff on the emotional swings, dissect strategic (and not-so-strategic) decisions, and commiserate over a weekend that's left both viewers and bettors spinning. The conversation weaves together passionate fandom, shrewd observation, a barrage of memorable quotes, and, as ever, some classic sports pain and gallows humor.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Rams vs. Bears: The Caleb Williams Experience

• [02:22–11:42]
  • Caleb Williams’ Chaos: Simmons likens watching Bears rookie QB Caleb Williams to “the experience of watching a really fun NBA player who's all over the map from game to game in a playoff series” ([03:20]).
  • Miraculous Fourth Downs: Sal: “I don't know if he's the best fourth down quarterback we've ever seen in our lives... he’s got, like, nearing a dozen now.” ([02:50])
  • Rams and McVay’s Conservatism: Critique of Rams coach Sean McVay for playing it unusually safe.
  • Analytics vs. Gut: Both feel Bears should have gone for two at the end—Simmons: “Throw out the math. It's just pure...I just feel like they would have gotten it at that point.” ([06:56])
  • Weather as the Great Equalizer: Simmons and Sal discuss how outdoor games and bad weather still matter more than advanced stats often account for—"Is the weather going to be bad because the game's probably going to be close?" ([09:12])

2. Seattle and the Quarterback Carousel

• [12:24–16:27]
  • Seahawks Positioning: Seahawks are now favorites, having beaten multiple playoff teams and with a top-tier DVOA, making this “as good of a chance as you’ve ever had.” ([19:55])
  • Sam Darnold Drama: Darnold’s injury was overblown in media (“Not trusting [Schefter] anymore with info”), and he played fine.
  • Backup QB Playoff Legacies: Long riff on how rare it is for a backup like Stidham to navigate so deep. “The best that's ever worked out was Hostetler and Nick Foles.” – Simmons ([14:15])

3. Patriots vs. Texans: Surviving the Mayhem

• [24:09–36:19]
  • Drake May’s Up-and-Down Performance: “Every game this season he's had a perfect 35, 40 yard throw” but also periods of rough play. ([26:05])
  • Standout Moment: Booty’s one-handed catch in the snow is labeled “the catch of the year” and gets a ranking as potentially top four in Patriots playoff history ([28:38]).
  • Easy Schedule, But: Both joke that Pats’ path to the Super Bowl is so soft it invites an asterisk, but Simmons counters: “We only play who's in front of us.” ([29:08, 30:38])
  • CJ Stroud’s Collapse: Four picks, zero poise, and possibly a long-term hit to his future as Houston’s franchise QB.
  • Pats’ Defense & Run Stopping: Defense sets a record for negative/zero plays and run-stuffs Chargers and Texans in consecutive weeks: “30 carries for 61 yards.” ([33:14])
  • Are the Pats Actually a Super Bowl Team? Sal: “Probably not, but… in that scenario, I think you are.” ([35:55])

4. Bills-Broncos: Josh Allen’s Ongoing Playoff Heartache

• [38:50–56:16]
  • Allen’s Costly Mistakes: “Two picks, two lost fumbles… missed [Knox] for the game-winning touchdown… missed Hardman…” – Simmons ([38:50])
  • Fan Angst and Historic Futility: Allen “is 0 for 6 in this round. I think six overtime games, he had the ball and a chance to win in five of them.” – Sal ([42:24])
  • Blame Game: While Bills fans focus on one controversial overturned catch, Simmons and Sal agree the Bills blew it in many ways.
  • Catch Rule Confusion: “We still don’t know what a catch is.” ([45:45])
  • Historic Comparison: Simmons compares Allen’s playoff struggles to the “star-crossed” careers of Marino and pre-championship Elway and Manning.

5. Denver’s Bad Break (and Good Luck)

• [56:16–63:12]
  • Bo Nix’s Ankle Injury: Heartbreakingly, Nix gets hurt just as Broncos seem poised for a run; Stidham steps in.
  • Broncos’ Defensive Edge: Their success comes as much from luck as skill; upcoming test will be if their defense can slow May and the Pats’ variable offense.

6. Looking Ahead: Conference Championships and Gambling Talk

• [66:11–69:42]
  • QB Matchups: Stidham (with one career win) vs. May vs. aging Stafford vs. Sam Darnold – “What were the odds of that? You think in August you couldn't get it? Is it like a million to one?” ([66:11])
  • Lines and Futures: Pats surprisingly solid favorites over the Broncos (Patriots -5.5), while Seattle is favored in the NFC. Simmons and Sal debate the logic, joke about their betting habits, and set up the week’s gambling narratives.

7. Bills Fan Pain & Emotional Fallout

• [72:41–76:46]
  • Read-aloud listener email: A dad describes his son having an asthma attack after the Bills’ collapse—“I tried explaining that, like the Masters, this is a tradition like no other…” ([72:41])
  • Relatable symmetry to Red Sox “curse” years and the psychological toll of repeated heartbreak.

8. End-of-Show: Parent Corner and Listener Questions

• [80:16–85:06]
  • Sal tells a tale about his wife’s fantasy football punishment league—“I suck at fantasy football” sign or “I give great BJ’s” sign-wearing walk of shame ([82:07]), prompting laughter and mock sympathy.
  • Simmons reflects on lying to his son about post-acceptance senior year grades (“the last stage of Elf on the Shelf”).
• Quick Hits:
  • Listener asks for the NBA equivalent of the Bills—"I don't think you can compare any other sport to what happened to the Bills in the 90s." ([76:09])
  • Schrager’s “re-Apex” theory and “Who’s the 2026 OJ?” (answer: Kelce “if he’d killed Taylor Swift,” with Strahan and Serena Williams in the mix as theoretical pop culture bombshells).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

The Caleb Williams Phenomenon

• “The guy—good or bad—I don't know if he's the best fourth down quarterback we've ever seen in our lives.” – Cousin Sal (02:50)

• “The experience of watching a really fun NBA player who's all over the map… you just don't know what to expect. You don't want to leave the room.” – Bill Simmons (03:20)

Analytics and Playoff Guts

• “Throw out the math. It's just pure...I know the nerds say momentum doesn't happen, but you have that play, you get a touchdown, and I just feel like they would have gotten it [going for two].” – Bill Simmons (06:56)

Bills and Allen’s Playoff Curse

• “Six divisional round games. Zero for six. Can't get past it. I think six overtime games. He had the ball and a chance to win in five of them… He's put up three points in those six games. It's rough.” – Cousin Sal (42:24)

• “I think he's the best player in the league. But I don't know if you can say that anymore if this keeps happening.” – Bill Simmons (41:38)

• “[Buffalo fans]…they want to get concussed so they can forget about all this nonsense every year.” – Cousin Sal (52:33)

Backup QB Carousel

• “Stidham having one career win. I think this would be the new standard if he was able to win two more games.” – Bill Simmons (15:03)

Pats’ ‘Easy’ Path?

• “We can only play who's in front of us.” – Bill Simmons, on critics of New England’s schedule (29:08)

Legendary Fan Pain

• “After the loss to the Broncos, [my son] went full Brad… hysterical crying, purple lips and wheezing. I tried explaining that, like the Masters, this is a tradition like no other.” – Brian, Bills fan email (72:41)

Classic Parent Corner

• “It's a sign that says. It's a fantasy football sign that says, I suck at fantasy football. And it has to go on our lawn for a month. Like, that's not going on our lawn.” – Cousin Sal (82:07)

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• [02:22]: Caleb Williams’ daredevil heroics and Bears-Rams breakdown
• [09:03]: “We argued about that for 12 hours.” – What is a catch?
• [14:57]: The backup QB debate—Hostetler, Foles, and the “Stidham Standard”
• [28:38]: Pats’ best playoff catches, “Booty catch” in the snow
• [38:50]: Bills-Broncos, Josh Allen’s meltdown, play-by-play of heartbreak
• [41:38]: Simmons questions Allen’s status as best QB after latest loss
• [56:16]: Nix gets injured, Denver’s luck/bad break
• [62:21]: Gambling wars—recapping weekend performance, teasers, and regrets
• [66:11]: The Final Four QB oddity—Stidham, May, Stafford, Darnold
• [72:41]: Bills fan’s brutal email and childhood sports pain
• [80:16]: Parent Corner—fantasy football punishments and Elf on the Shelf
• [88:11]: 2026 “OJ scenario”: Who’d be the modern equivalent?

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Summary Tone & Atmosphere

True to form, Simmons and Sal mix sardonic humor with sharp sports insight, bonding through fandom scars old and new. Their bitter laughter and camaraderie create a space where fan pain is both aired and exorcised. The show is filled with pop culture digressions, self-deprecation, and running bits about gambling anguish, schedule luck, and the Sisyphean quest for championship glory.

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This episode is essential listening for any fan who ever felt personally wounded by sports—or anyone who’s ever tried (and failed) to make sense of a weekend when nothing made sense, except maybe rooting for chaos.

Transcript

[Bill Simmons]

This episode of the Bill Simmons podcast is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Without Internet, you wouldn't be able to hear my beautiful voice right now and businesses wouldn't be able to stay connected the way they need. What if I told you that business owners can get free business Internet advantage forever? When you add four or more mobile lines, Spectrum Business keeps you connected seamlessly with Internet, advanced WI, fi, phone, TV and mobile services all in packages tailored to your business budget. No contracts, no added fees. Find out how you can get free Spectrum business Internet [e-mail] freeforlife. That's where you go. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. The Bill Simmons podcast presented by FanDuel Sportsbook. We're also presented by the Ringer podcast Network revenue rewatchables. Coming up on Monday night. Sal, we did just one of the guys.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, that's a great one. Yeah, I love it. I love it.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it's one for us week because we go to Netflix next week and we wanted to bang out a couple. I'm turning off my hide self view. There we go. Yeah, we wanted to bang out a couple before we started.

[Cousin Sal]

Anyway, you should flash everyone at the end. I mean, that was the big scene, right?

[Bill Simmons]

That's what I should have. I should have pulled my shirt off at the tail end. There's still time coming up. Sal and I are going to talk about an unbelievable weekend of football right after this. Cousin Sal is here. Best super bowl draft. Here are the super bowl nominees. Sal, wait a minute. May vs Stafford, May vs Darnold, Stidham vs Stafford or Stidham vs Darnold? What are you the most excited about?

[Cousin Sal]

I like Stidham, Darnold. I mean, I've been rooting for that all year. You know me, I'm not a front runner. That's the one I had targeted all year. Stidham and Darnold. And it looks, really looks like it's going to happen.

[Bill Simmons]

It's unbelievable. Cinema has one career win.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, man. How do you do it?

[Bill Simmons]

How do you do it? Oh, don't even start. Can we talk about Rams Bears first? This is fun.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm hoping we can talk about Rams Bears to a point where you forget about your team. Maybe we can go the whole hour.

[Bill Simmons]

And a half if you want. How dare you. Rams, Bears. Would it have been the Cole commit game or the Caleb Tecmo bowl game for you? Because that was the original Tecmo bowl offense of just running backwards 25 yards and heaving it toward the end zone and then the guy Catches it. But how would you have remembered it actually went da na na na.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Everything's the Caleb Williams game at this point. It really is. I mean the guy, good or bad. Yeah, because he, I don't know if he's the best fourth down quarterback we've ever seen in our lives. How many does he have to have? How many miraculous 4th down plays does he have to have? He's got like nearing a dozen now. But the fact that on that play he was able to weave his way back and create a Hail Mary where he had a third of the end zone to himself one on one is. I just don't know how he does it.

[Bill Simmons]

It's not, he threw it what, 46 yards. It was a 14 yard touchdown pass that actually went 46 yards in the air. Look, he's replicated the best I've ever seen at any quarterback. The experience of watching a really fun NBA player who's all over the map from game to game in a playoff series. You just never know when he's going to get hot, when he's going to bank in a three. Um, he could be six for 22 and then make the last seven shots of the game. I think, I think this season's been a massive win for him. I didn't know what to expect from him. You know, heading into this year it's like didn't think it was going to be a bust but was he going to be one of those disappointing. Was he going to be passed by Daniels, passed by Drake May now I think he's the most exciting game to game quarter. You just don't know what to expect. You don't want to go, you don't want to leave the room. When he's on the field, I don't know what he's going to do. You, you always feel like there's more there. Like he could just run around and run for 20 yards whenever he wants. He can uncork any throw the balls, go all over the place. That Rams interception in overtime we should have known was going to happen because every time you start getting settled in and feeling like okay, I trust Caleb and then he veers the other way. I just. There's nobody like him.

[Cousin Sal]

It's an incredible phenomenon locally and Broadway nationally, but at least in Chicago you have like 60 year old truck drivers like teamsters painting their nails black for this guy. Like what the hell's going on over there? Really? You got Collinsworth of the next gen stats. I don't know what my sperm count is anymore. With this guy, but it's just. It's. It's phenomenal to see. And it's like, yeah, you don't know when you're going to get it, except that it's definitely going to be in the fourth quarter at a crucial time. But then he could turn it over again. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I wrote down in my notes that they can't feel the blood in their body until they're down 7 with, like, less than five minutes left. And as soon as they're down 17, 10, they can get a stop. You just assume, all right, here they go. This is who they are. They left a lot on the table during this game, but so did the Rams. And I thought the Rams really tucked their tail between the legs a couple times, especially late. They just seem very safe, like, uncharacteristically safe. And then when they got that interception, I think McVeigh rightly said, what are we doing? Let's go. Let's turn it up here.

[Cousin Sal]

Should probably give credit to most of the defenses that played this weekend. Right? Because now, now, otherwise, it's just. We're just going to crap on the quarterbacks and the play callers. Like, I don't have a high opinion of myself as a play caller, but I think I could have done better. In three of the four games we saw, for sure, McVeigh and Ben Johnson looked like they threw out the playbook. Like, McVeigh had, like, six passes inside the 30 in the go ahead drive. And then, like, to kill the clock, all I needed was a first down on third and seven, I think, and it's just like, yeah, weak run up the middle. Like, I don't know. I don't know. They're flipping coins back there or what was going on. And Ben Johnson, like, you were all over it today, like, just. Just unsure of himself.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, yeah, he had it. The third and ones and the fourth and ones and just like, the really predictable. Like, Collinsworth kept talking about what a gunslinger he was and this Ben Johnson look out. And then it would just be like the most generic play as possible. I didn't think that Caleb used his legs enough. I felt that same way about Drake May, too, in the game before. But then you think about yesterday where Peyton does the design rollout with Bo Nix and the guy breaks his ankle. So maybe that's why they're afraid to let these guys kind of run around and do their stuff. But I thought the Rams were incredibly fortunate for a couple reasons, but mainly because if the Bears had just gone for two with 18 seconds left. I just feel like they would have gotten it.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

There's no evidence. Throw out the math. It's just pure. I know the nerds say momentum doesn't happen, but you have that play, you get a touchdown, and I at least show like I'm going to pretend I'm going to go for two and make the Rams panic and see. I don't know. I just feel like they would have gotten it at that point. It felt like the bird with the angel was on their shoulder and they were going to get it.

[Cousin Sal]

Birds, angels, everything. I mean, everything's stacking up on the shit. Yeah. Bird shit. I'm with you. I don't go by the nerds in that situation. I go by the opposing team's fans. We always talk about this. Right. So what are Rams. Rams fans? Think there are Rams fans. Right. But what are Rams fans like? There's a collective sigh when we see the extra point team come out to tie it up. Right.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, you. You had $28,000 on the Rams, so what did you want the Bears to do? I bet you went higher. You wanted them to kick the extra point.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, yeah, of course.

[Bill Simmons]

You were like, let me take overtime. Let me have Matthew Stafford against up and down Caleb. I'll take my chances.

[Cousin Sal]

By the way, both teams kicked off, lost. I mean, we could talk about that. I think it was worse in the Bills game. But another stupid thing. Got a tired defense out there. Take advantage, get the ball.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And we just don't have enough of a math sample size to know what we should or shouldn't do in this situation. But it feels weird to me to kick off. Wouldn't you just want the ball and want to lay the smackdown and want to try to score and especially if you had the momentum of scoring at the end of the previous quarter. I just feel like that's what I would want to do.

[Cousin Sal]

You have to count momentum in that scenario because momentum comes with it. It's like these guys are playing in now, what is it, 10 degrees by the time it's 11 o' clock at night, whatever it is at 10. But yeah, and you gotta take advantage of that. You're giving them like three free timeouts if they're playing defense. Second. And really, what's the benefit of. I get the whole, oh, we want to see what we have to do thing. When does that matter? Unless they score and then you score like it's.

[Bill Simmons]

Then.

[Cousin Sal]

Then the top of the second favors them because they're going to get the extra possession and they can win there.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I don't. I just feel like the longer we watch football, the more we get confused by stuff. Yeah, I still don't know what a catch is.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, forget.

[Bill Simmons]

We argued about. We'll talk about the Buffalo game later. We argued about that for 12 hours.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, we have 40 inch texts arguing about that.

[Bill Simmons]

Devonte Adams had a similar play, but. And we were like, no, no, he held it longer. Like, there's no rhyme or reason any of this. The more football we watch, the more confused I think we get by by all of it. But it did feel like that. The big lesson to me during that game was it felt like the teams were really even. And I don't know if we value enough the weather stuff with these matchups. And just in general, I feel like we. It's like a variable we talk about the same way we talk about, like, the Rams don't have a. Have a good run game and the Bears don't have a very good run defense. They have this and it's like, maybe we just throw all of it out. And it's like, is the weather going to be bad because the game's probably going to be close? Or in Houston's case, is the weather going to be bad because they can't block and I don't trust their quarterback and maybe I don't need to know anything else about the matchup. Maybe that's it. But I don't know, do we. Do we discount the indoor, outdoor and all the weather stuff too much?

[Cousin Sal]

Well, a lot of times the weather report is wrong. Like, they'll show something in the, in the morning and you'll see snow. Like, oh, my God, how are fans even going to get in that stadium? And then it's like all cleaned up and everything and it just looks cold. So I, I don't, I don't try to live and die by it. But I know one thing. We could throw out the performance we saw last week. Like, maybe we don't know what a catch is, but we don't know what to think of these. Like, both defenses played really good yet today, right? Rams had nothing of that against Bryce Young. You know, Jordan Love could have probably put up 40 points against the Bears in the first half if he wanted to, but they really, they really hit hard.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, Collins were said at one point, like, the Rams were having trouble with the footing and the receivers were having trouble with the footing. And you think like, and obviously I'm biased. And, you know, anyone who roots for an east coast team is Kind of biased on this one. But playing outdoors and what it does for your stats and your ability to do stuff on offense versus being in a dome indoors, I think it's a real thing. Like I look at the breeze stats and manning stuff in Indianapolis. I just think it's an advantage versus like if you're somebody like Brady who is not sound like a Brady defender even though as you know I am. But he's in the AFC East. He's playing at least 12 games a year outdoors then a lot of the playoff games outdoors and I just think it's harder to put up stats. You saw the Rams like Puka's been the best receiver not only of this year but of the last couple years and he seemed a little more mortal today when you throw him outdoors. Although he did end up making the biggest play of the game. But I think there is something to that though. These warm weather dome teams outdoors, like you really have to count them.

[Cousin Sal]

You can see the stats on the splits for home and away with home is in a dome most of the time time it does make a difference. I'll tell you. I think that we set a record this weekend for passes that were just behind the receiver, you know, like a Dunes a. Was that a dunesday in the first quarter? Like oh, he should have had it but like I felt like we saw like 40 of those all weekend and we could talk.

[Bill Simmons]

Strada made a couple in the game before that too. So we had The Bears down 7. Huge drive. They go all the way down. They can't get it. Rams giving them the ball back. Caleb prayer and then we go to oh that like it was so much happened. But the bottom line is the rams scored what, 10 points in the last three hours of the game.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, it's true.

[Bill Simmons]

And if I'm the Seahawks, I'm probably rooting for the Bears as I watch that game. Right. But I'm a little less afraid of the Rams.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I think so. I mean it's a rubber match, right?

[Bill Simmons]

So yeah. Third time.

[Cousin Sal]

I don't know. I guess McVeigh is going to have it out for them more. But yeah, for sure. For sure. It's a coin toss now going forward, except for your fricking team. It's going to go all the way.

[Bill Simmons]

Well on FanDuel now.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, don't look.

[Bill Simmons]

No, no, no. I'm not going to look at the lines. I'm going to look at the futures. Yeah. Seattle's plus 150 now.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Pat's plus 220. Rams plus 220 Broncos 13 and 1.

[Cousin Sal]

What happened with the Broncos? I missed something. They're in the Final Four.

[Bill Simmons]

They were looking so good.

[Cousin Sal]

Why are they 13:1.

[Bill Simmons]

So the NFL's best case scenario is May versus Stafford. The Rams rematch. McVeigh getting his revenge against the Patriots.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

May in his second year making the Super Bowl. If you're just talking like big picture storylines, that's probably the coolest for sure.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

May versus Darnold. We would just see the Darnold ghosts. The clips of that one Jets Pats game. That would just be two weeks of that. Right.

[Cousin Sal]

Or Malcolm Butler. Right. That's the.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, yeah. That's the Seattle revenge game.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. I mean, I think that's fair.

[Cousin Sal]

Three of the four super bowl rematches, right? Yeah. New England Rams, which was a lousy Super Bowl. Seattle, New England, one of the best.

[Bill Simmons]

Seattle, New England's the best one because Seattle's never won a Super Bowl.

[Cousin Sal]

Can't go wrong.

[Bill Simmons]

And they would be getting their revenge on that. Then when we move into the Stidham territory now, you have to start talking to yourself. I have this written down. The. The backup qb. Yeah. Kind of being heard from either in the conference championship or the Super Bowl. The best that's it's ever worked out was Hostetler and Nick Foles, who talks shit today about the Patriots. I didn't appreciate that. Nick Foles, I love it.

[Cousin Sal]

What does he have to lose? That's terrific.

[Bill Simmons]

Fuck off. Nick Foles. Wow. Nobody wanted to hear from you.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, you know what?

[Bill Simmons]

It's good.

[Cousin Sal]

It's all good.

[Bill Simmons]

But so backup qb. So we had that Brady Bledsoe thing where then Bledsoe came into the AFC title game in 2001 after Brady had taken his job and kind of held the fort. Earl Morrow going way back on the Colts, but they ended up not winning. Tony Eason, sort of the 85 Bears 40th anniversary of the Bears Pats shellacking. But Grogan had been the starter and then Tony Eason. Grogan had his job and then Tony Eason basically took it back for the Super Bowl. But it felt like it was Grogan's job. But it's really not a lot of examples.

[Cousin Sal]

Did you say Hostetler?

[Bill Simmons]

You said Hostetler or no Hostetler? But yeah, Hostetler is the most famous, I think.

[Cousin Sal]

Right? Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Stidham having one career win. I think this would be the new standard if he was able to win two more games.

[Cousin Sal]

This is one career win. He hasn't thrown a pass in like, almost two and a half years. Right.

[Bill Simmons]

Listen, I kind of like him.

[Cousin Sal]

I can't see.

[Bill Simmons]

I can't say I feel awesome about. Like, if there were some other backup QBs, some of the ones we watched on and tried to bet against during this season, really be like, oh, my God, we get to play this guy. This is amazing.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know. Stidham's not horrendous. He's kind. He can kind of sling it a little bit. He's one of the highest paid backups in the league. Right.

[Cousin Sal]

You know, I'm calling bullshit on this. I. You know what? Show me your text. Your.

[Bill Simmons]

Your.

[Cousin Sal]

With your Patriot fan text. And shame on you and all your incorrigible masshole chums on your pats chain. I'm sure you celebrated the second. The second you found out Bo Nicks was out.

[Bill Simmons]

We had. We. We try to. We try to be magnanimous and we try to celebrate everybody else's wins.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I'm sure you try.

[Bill Simmons]

Who's in front of us? Yeah. So do you feel better or worse about the Rams after that game?

[Cousin Sal]

No, I agree with you about Seattle. I think they should feel better about their chances. You know, they're going to. I don't want to ruin the line anyway, but you said they're favorite to win the super bowl, and there's a reason. So I just. In general, I think Seattle's just like, try to beat us here. You saw what we're all about.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, do. Let's talk about that game really quickly, and then we could circle back the. The Sam Darnold injury. Rope a dope. I fell for it.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I had all these Seattle bets. Schefter. I don't know. Not trusting that guy anymore with info really made it seem like Darnold was. It's gonna be a miracle if this guy can throw a pass and then the game starts and he seems fine. The line moved from seven and a half to six and a half, and they just.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, it was seven most. It was seven and a half.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I'm saying seven and a half. Start of the week, settled at seven. My game time was six and a half. Yeah, well, then Darnold was fine.

[Cousin Sal]

I had San Francisco +7, so I don't think I could do much bragging here. But it wasn't because of Sam Darnold's oblique like you could, because you could read every Adam Schefter or Jay Glazer, whatever sports doctor report on the injury, and you could read one number on FanDuel Sportsbook. And if that number didn't go from seven to three and a half, there was no chance of him, like, throwing pregame and being like, you know what? I can't make a. I can't make a go of it. And I looked it up, and oblique isn't even a body part, by the way. I think it's a font. I'm not sure.

[Bill Simmons]

It only matters in baseball. Yeah, somebody can pull their oblique in baseball. They're out for six weeks. They just have the red flag next to them in fantasy baseball forever. Well, this was one of those where I had people. I had a couple of people over to watch the first game, and they were leaving and came back in, and the Seahawks were celebrating and they were up 7. Nothing. I didn't even see the first. It was one of those where it's like, oh, that's going to be one of these games. They have no chance.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm pretty. I felt like I was still seeing, you know. Cause I have knucklehead friends reporting on Bo Nicks. I'm like, this isn't true. Like, I was checking Twitter so much that I missed the first play. The. The. The first and only play that mattered.

[Bill Simmons]

My big T. I mean, I want to talk about the Seahawks in a second, but the. The most damning thing I think all weekend is the Eagles, who didn't even play right, and they lose last week to that Niners team that just seems so depleted and overmatched this week. I mean, they didn't have Kittle, but it was mostly the same team. And if I was an Eagles fan, I would be even madder than I was a week ago. And I was thinking, is this a playoff? Is this a possible playoff manifesto? AD don't take any playoff team that had a miserable season doesn't seem like they liked each other. It seems like they might be excited to be in the Bahamas in a week over round two.

[Cousin Sal]

Wow.

[Bill Simmons]

I just got to remember them with the Eagles because clearly it was a rollover by them. It's fucking embarrassing. They should be the champions. What kind of title defense was that? Yeah, in the playoffs. If I was Eagle span, I'd be furious. Like, really? We lost to that fucking team. Who was the guy? Who's the receiver who had 100 yards? DeMarcus Robinson. You didn't have a catch yesterday. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, how are you doing, Philadelphia?

[Cousin Sal]

Forget Eagles fans. What if you're Eagles management? What if you're Howie Roseman? Like, but, like, you know, they didn't Fire Sirianni, right? He. He survived the week. He must. Sirianni must be like, oh, thank God. All right, I'm good. Big Dom, let's go out and get some chicken parm. We're going to be fine. Then Howie Roseman sees that. I would. I would think twice now about keeping him around based on the next game that the Niners played. What are you looking at?

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Cousin Sal]

What are you doing?

[Bill Simmons]

I'm asking. No, I'm asking how if we have to take a break after this. Oh, I. I listen to everything you said.

[Cousin Sal]

That's all right.

[Bill Simmons]

Those matters. Yeah, no, I heard everything you said.

[Cousin Sal]

Do we have to take a break?

[Bill Simmons]

No, not yet.

[Cousin Sal]

You want to do the intro again?

[Bill Simmons]

Can I have another crack at it, or are we live? Seattle's now 15 3, and they have the top six best DBOA of all time right now. They've beaten the Niners twice. They beat the Steelers, the Jaguars, Houston, Carolina. And the Rams. Lost to the Rams and the Niners both close and really look good. Yeah, I mean, that's like. If you're a Seahawks fan, this is as good of a chance as you've ever had. You made the Super bowl in 05, but who'd you have in that game? Pittsburgh? Seattle? Which one? Yeah, Pittsburgh.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, that one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I had Pittsburgh.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, yeah, Pittsburgh had that crazy Colts game.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, we did the show in Detroit.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, Pittsburgh had that crazy Colts win when they stopped Manning and then Bettis fumbled on the one yard line and Roethlisberger made that crazy tackle. Basically saved the game. And then they end up winning, and they end up winning the whole thing. The Seattle fans still pissed off about the calls in that game. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Defensive holding.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, yeah. And like a couple years later, got their NBA team stolen. So they, you know, they're. They're a little edgy.

[Cousin Sal]

All right. And then what you guys did to them with the Malcolm Butler thing. Yeah, I think, like, I was surprised that both them and Denver didn't come out rusty. Like, you know, the two buy teams, right? It used to be four by teams, whatever. But both teams were right on it. Denver scored, what, 20 in the first half. Josh Allen helped that. But Seattle, what was that? Two plays and the game was over. Like, you had the kick return, and then you had San Francisco on 4th and 1 with that fullback option to McCaffrey, who's checked to McCaffrey, he's like, oh, this is. This is way over, this game. Like, Darnold could throw. I think he threw for 106 yards. He didn't probably have to do that much to win.

[Bill Simmons]

Tough Purdy game, too.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. I wonder if McCaffrey, do they start treating him like the Clippers treat Kawhi or something? Yeah, where you just try to get like 10 games. If you're trying to like actually win a couple playoff rounds with him, do you try to just get 10 games out of him during the season, kind of stagger his minutes?

[Cousin Sal]

You know, it's funny, I was looking at him play and I know the Seahawks were swarming and they had more energy anyway, but I was like, oh, even McCaffrey doesn't look fast. He didn't look like the Blaze that we were used to with cmc. And then I saw this stat. It said Next Gen stats. Their average top speed this year was 12.81 miles per hour. The 49ers, that was sixth slowest in the NFL. And Dee Winters, the linebacker is the only one to reach 20 miles an hour. So they I was like, oh, finally some. Some useful.

[Bill Simmons]

I mean, that actually is pretty useful. Yeah, I like that. I would have liked that. All right, so we're going to take, I think a break and then we'll come back and we'll hit the AFC games because those were. Well, there was one game that it was the most interesting game in the week. So we'll be back in one second. The Bill Simmons podcast is presented by FanDuel. FanDuel's got it all. Same game parlays, quick bets for jumping in live. They have your way. Go check out your way. You can build the bet that fits your play your way. Plus, don't miss out on the NFL playoffs. One of my favorite times of the year. All month long. Download the FanDuel app or head to FanDuel.com BS to get started. Get ready for the playoffs. Let's go. Must be 21 plus President select states 18 plus in D.C. kentucky and Wyoming Gamble. Call win 800 Gambler or visit rg-help.com call 888-789777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut. This episode is brought to you by LinkedIn. If you've ever hired for your small business, I've done this once upon a time. You know how important it is to find the right person. That's why LinkedIn Jobs is stepping things up with their new AI assistant. So you can feel confident you're finding top talent. Post your job for [e-mail] Simmons that's me. Then promote it to use LinkedIn jobs. New AI assistant, making it easier and faster to find top candidates. That's LinkedIn.com Simmons to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. You know, I felt like I was really good last week. I was on it. The Pats game took a lot out of me today, Cousin Sal.

[Cousin Sal]

Really? How so?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, yeah, it was that. That was kind of a heart attack game. You, your home, the weather's bad. The other team's quarterback throws four interceptions in the first half. And all of a sudden it's a one possession game and we feel like we have no momentum at all. And there's about 20 minutes of that game. It got pretty dark. And I don't think I was the only Pats fan who felt that way. It was like, really? This is how the season's going to end? Where we lose to a team whose quarterback had such deer in the headlights that at halftime, the argument was whether they're going to replace them with the backup in a round two playoff game. When was the last time that happened? 1984. The Marcus Spears. I think it was the right point. Are they going to bring in Davis Mills? Because we were texting about it and then Ryan Clark came in. You can't do that. This guy's your quarterback. He got rounded that. All of a sudden they're having first take in the halftime show. And I was like, riveted because I was like, I think they should play Davis Mills. I think Strouds have sunk.

[Cousin Sal]

Cost three games, right?

[Bill Simmons]

I mean, what are you going to do?

[Cousin Sal]

How many interceptions and fumbles? 8? 10? How many are you going to allow before your season's over?

[Bill Simmons]

I'll tell you. My dad and I were texting. Both of us were like, I hope they don't bring in Mills. I hope they keep Stroud in. Please. So anyway, the third quarter starts and then all of a sudden, the Pats can't do anything. And the Texans have momentum. And it looks like we can't block Will Anderson anymore. He's just going by Campbell. It took a lot out of me. I can't lie. We're getting older. These are tough.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I know. Well, this isn't the bragging I was expecting, that's for sure. I really thought you were going to tell me how this is the best Pats team of all time. That throw to definitely not K. Sean Booty was. I mean, that's the one nice thing I'll say about this Patriots team that I think was the catch of the year. And we see millions of them. We see Puka going up with one hand. But to do it in the snow, whatever else was going on with one hand. And you know, it really put a stamp on that game.

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Cousin Sal]

Like you, you were nervous until then, right then that was that.

[Bill Simmons]

I felt they were driving and looked like they're going to get a field goal. And I didn't think the Texans could get 11, so that would have been a lot. But Booty, like he basically ended the game. What's interesting is that was like every Drake May game this year where it's a little choppy for the first 45 minutes of the game or in real time, 45 minutes, it's just not. And then all of a sudden it clicks in and he's off. And in this game he did that. And then the third quarter, all of a sudden he was, you know, seemed off again and then kind of rallied back. But every, every game this season he's had a perfect 35, 40 yard throw like that. This time the guy had to make an amazing catch on it. But they've hit that throw. It feels like every week. Was waiting on it, was waiting on it. And then finally did it and it ended the game. You knew they weren't going to get two touchdowns.

[Cousin Sal]

That's all he should do, is throw long passes. He shouldn't bother with the short stuff. He's great at throwing long passes.

[Bill Simmons]

As soon as he tries to throw.

[Cousin Sal]

Over the middle, he holds onto it too long. He gets sacked, he fumbles. He's subpar quarterback. You want to call him an mvp, that's fine. Just throw long every time.

[Bill Simmons]

Subpar's a little strong.

[Cousin Sal]

Rear back and throw it.

[Bill Simmons]

I think he was holding it a little too long considering Will Anderson was in the backfield in about four seconds every single play. They didn't use his legs that much. I think that fumble kind of freaked them out. I thought they were going to be rolling him out due to design.

[Cousin Sal]

Rolled out.

[Bill Simmons]

The stuff that swung the game was the eye formation. When they kind of went bigger and really started to try to run the ball. Ramondre was out for a while. That wasn't open either. That booty catch. I know. I didn't want to tell you I was doing this. I wanted to be a surprise. Cause I knew how excited he would be. Go ahead. Best Patriots playoff catches ever made a list. I'll just go in descending order to the biggest one. Gronk versus the Chiefs in 2018.

[Cousin Sal]

How many are you doing?

[Bill Simmons]

What is this?

[Cousin Sal]

How many?

[Bill Simmons]

No, just six. Gibbons versus the Panthers. Second Super Bowl Gronk, fourth and 10 against Denver. AFC title game, down the middle. They end up losing that game, but that was an out. He's double covered. 40 yard pass down the center. This is my favorite Gronk play. Edelman, third and 14 against Seattle and he's basically concussed during the play and keeps going and then claimed he wasn't concussed. Amandola against Jacksonville and then Edelman in the, in the Falcons game, the, the dive, the whatever. When it seemed like, wait, did he catch that? When he caught the deflection, which is still the best Patriots catch we've ever had.

[Cousin Sal]

So you're not putting this in the top.

[Bill Simmons]

I think this might be seven. I would put this fourth. Now, if they don't win anything, if they don't end up winning the super bowl, maybe it drops. But yeah, but yeah, it clinched a round two playoff game. It sent them to the AFC title game. All my texts today were basically like, we can go CJ Stroud in the snow, Stidham, Sam Darnold, and we win the Super Bowl. It's like we were just sending it back like nobody could believe, like this was the path. We can only play who's in front of us.

[Cousin Sal]

I know, I know, I know. I really just gets worse and worse. And like you get great news that Josh Allen's knocked out of the playoffs, and then four minutes later you get news that Bo Nix is out of the playoffs. And then no Chargers with no offensive line, Texans with no Nico Broncos. You know, I, I feel like if the Venezuelan opposition leader presented the Patriots with the Lombardi Trophy, do you accept it? Does Kraft lower himself to accept it?

[Bill Simmons]

It's not really. God only knows with Kraft these days. Well, we were missing guys. We didn't have Matt Collins. It's been huge for us. Might get him back next week. I can't believe this. Yeah, I'll just. I know everybody's going to make the joke. Hey, everyone's going to joke about the schedule. It's just how we're going to do this the next couple weeks, especially if they beat Denver, they'd be like, oh, how do I bet on the pat Super Bowl MVP being the schedule? Like we know we're going to hear the jokes. We only play as in front of us. Do you know who the 2019 Chiefs played in Mahomes first Super bowl title? Do you remember who they played?

[Cousin Sal]

You want me to list all the teams I don't remember?

[Bill Simmons]

I'll give you the playoffs.

[Cousin Sal]

Playoff teams, go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

They played the crappy Texans. They played the Titans and Ryan Tannehill and then they played the Niners and Jimmy Garoppolo and they won the super bowl and nobody was like who'd they play? Right?

[Cousin Sal]

And they were down two.

[Bill Simmons]

Who was it? I don't know why we pick and choose the who'd we play thing. Well, this is Patriots fault that Josh Allen fucking choked in the, in the. On Saturday, which he did for him. Yeah, he's supposed to be the best player in the league. He didn't play well enough. Like that's not the Patriots fault. We're waiting for him. He's not there.

[Cousin Sal]

I think the Stroud thing is extra damning because he's supposed to be decent. And he put out one of the. Well, two of the worst playoff games of all time combined. Right. And they still won like you know, five, five, five plus interceptions and five plus fumbles and a single postseason is the first one to do it. Four plus interceptions in a single playoff game. Which puts him in good company. He tore that Kate Stovers ACL throwing a pass to him. It was a non contact. It was not. I hope he didn't tear. I haven't looked up though. I hope not, but I've never seen that before. He just like had to twist himself to get back to a awful pass. So I, I don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

Four picks and then it felt like five more. We almost caught or could have caught and then for that were just completely uncatchable to guys that seemed like they were open. Um, I don't know. He doesn't like getting hit.

[Cousin Sal]

He doesn't like getting hit and he especially doesn't like getting hit in the cold. And that's why that pick six happened, which was really the game changer I felt.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, he almost had a full Delome so I know it's close. For the newer listeners or people of the pod, way back when Jake Delome, I think he had five picks including a pick six or maybe it was five picks in a fumble. Whatever it was, we called it the full Delome. This was just a Delome. It wasn't a full Delome. He needed one more. I was waiting for him to get it and he couldn't do it. But it was. There was like a half decent. How much can you actually blame him? Debate. Because clearly he deserves a bunch of blame. And he was terrible. But didn't have Nico Collins. The running game wasn't there. The Pats just took that down. Schultz got hurt early.

[Cousin Sal]

Right?

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know It's.

[Cousin Sal]

He lost on the Lombardi Trophy. All this goes on your trophy.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, well, but I'm just. Because they're already talking after the game like, would you give this guy an extension? Yeah, right. You know, he had last two seasons, including the playoffs, 26 picks, 42 touchdowns. There was a legitimate. Should they start his backup in the second half of a do or die playoff game combo? I would be nervous to give him the extension. I thought he took a step back this year.

[Cousin Sal]

I would too. I think we for sure thought he was the best quarterback in that division. Right. And now we reluctantly have to give it.

[Bill Simmons]

Who is it?

[Cousin Sal]

Trevor Lawrence. Wait, where are we, Trevor?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I, I think it is Trevor Lawrence.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I think that's where we are.

[Bill Simmons]

Sitting there for Cam Ward.

[Cousin Sal]

Cam Ward could get it too.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

And you know, to your point, like it helps if you could in these cold weather miserable games if you could run the ball right. Yeah, I would think. And Woody marks was what, 14 for 17 with a fumble. You're just not going to get it.

[Bill Simmons]

That way in the first half. Not only do we have the four takeaways in the pick six, they forced 22 plays of zero or negative yards, which set the record for this century for a first half in a playoff game. Yeah, they had the run defense in the Chargers game in this game. Combined 30 carries for 61 yards. Like, and this is what I was saying last week before the Chargers game, like the, the stats when Milton Williams plays versus when he doesn't. It's like night and day. They have all their D linemen back and they're really good at stopping the run. The Texans, I thought, had a pretty good game plan. Like they kept picking on Carlton Davis, who's the. That's the cornerback all the Pats fans are scared of. Right. He's always in the middle of. Feels like a PI or a possible PI. Every time. He had two picks, he had a couple of PIs. He went after him and he got hurt at the end. Yeah, but they went after him. But I think when Schultz went out, I think that really screwed with them. Cause they weren't going to be able to run the ball. They didn't have like that 8 yard guy over the middle. And let's be honest, like they just were never good enough offensively this year, I think to match whatever the defense was. And then I'll say this about the defense, which was admittedly awesome in a couple stretches, but the Pats had three like full touchdown drives in them. Yeah, it wasn't like, you watched, and you're like, oh, they had these intercept. They had three drives to score, including to, like, end the game. And the Texans didn't stop them. So, like, when people are talking about them compared to the 2000 Ravens, like, settle the fuck down.

[Cousin Sal]

All right? But three touchdown drives for 193 yards. Nine other drives for two total yards. I think you had seven first downs after three quarters. Like, if you just isolate that. C.J. stroud should be ashamed of himself for not beating that.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, I didn't love the play calling. I thought may really took a while to get going. And there's. It's. It's a real thing. These young, young quarterbacks in the playoffs. Cause we saw it with Caleb, too. They're just all over the map. They're not consistent enough yet. But he ended up. He had, you know, three touchdowns. Thought he had some really good throws. I think next week will be easier. I, I. Are you, like, wildly impressed by the Denver defense? Cause I'm not.

[Cousin Sal]

I don't think it's going to be as good as what we saw today.

[Bill Simmons]

No.

[Cousin Sal]

But maybe they'll play with a chip on their shoulder, so.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, give me the unbiased. Just watching the Pats, do they seem like a Super bowl team to you? Cause to me, I feel like it's a year early.

[Cousin Sal]

What do you mean? Will they advance to the Super Bowl?

[Bill Simmons]

As you watch them, is it like, holy shit, this is a team that belongs in the Super Bowl? Because to me, it feels like we had this in Parcells last season, the 96 team, which just felt like a year from now was going to be the awesome team. And then all of a sudden, they made the super bowl, and it's like, all right, I guess we're ready. And that's kind of how I feel about this team.

[Cousin Sal]

I mean, probably not, but what. You know, when Denver's the number one seed and Jacksonville's fighting for the number two seed by the, you know, by the last year, by the last week, and Buffalo. Shaky. You might as well be. Yeah, sure, in that scenario, I think you are. And you're. You're right there. I'm not. I really have to say something nice about this team.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I tried to trap you, and you wouldn't do it.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm not doing it.

[Bill Simmons]

Knew a few people were at the game, and they said the electricity was 100% back.

[Cousin Sal]

Really?

[Bill Simmons]

It was 2000s level. Like, just everybody loved. Was old school, Feisty D doing the whole thing. So the Pats go To Denver where they're 0 and 4 in the playoffs. In my lifetime. All games that were memorable for some reason. The Rulon Jones safety on Tony Eason. Up down three with the ball and somehow fucking Tony Eason gets sacked for a safety. Never forgive that dude. The Plumber Champ Bailey game. Plumber's like one good playoff game. I guess he had one against Dallas too. And then the Champ Bailey when Ben Watson ran, basically, I don't know, they didn't have the next gen stats for that. He was probably like 32 miles an hour.

[Cousin Sal]

He's off the charts, Bill. We can't even measure that.

[Bill Simmons]

And ball goes out at the one. I thought it went out of the end zone. That's the one. Apparently for Brady, that's the super bowl. That and 07 are the two that bother him the most. I didn't get. Yeah, because I think they, they might have been the best team in 05, 2014. That was the year Hernandez stuff went down right before the season. And then T.J. wobby.

[Cousin Sal]

That didn't bother Brady. That, that stuff didn't bother Brady.

[Bill Simmons]

They tried to play on and then TJ Ward took out Gronk. So we went into Denver without both of those guys. Lost that one. And then the last one was the noodle armpade manning season. The 20 day 18 loss.

[Cousin Sal]

2 point conversion.

[Bill Simmons]

2 point conversion. Didn't get it. I think Brady was concussed like for that entire game. So anyway, my point is they've never won there. I have a vague memory of elway beating us 20 times. I don't think the stats back that up. But this has been mostly a house of horrors for the Pats. And now Jared Stidham awaits.

[Cousin Sal]

But the good news is there's not one player associated with any of those years anymore on either team. So you're good.

[Bill Simmons]

So you don't believe in the laundry baggage?

[Cousin Sal]

I don't know. I might if phone Nix was quarterback. I, I, I mean we're going to get into that game, but. I just can't believe it, man. I just can't believe it.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm ready to get into that game right now. Let's do it. Where do we start? You want to start on the Denver side or the Buffalo side?

[Cousin Sal]

Let's do the intro. Talk about what Just wanted.

[Bill Simmons]

Should I do the intro again?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Just one of the guys coming on the rewatch. What a day.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, I think we gotta, we gotta reluctant Josh Allen for this.

[Bill Simmons]

Two picks, two lost fumbles, including a fumble before the end of the first half that cost them three points. That was something like Shadur Sanders or pick a rookie quarterback. It was a rookie quarterback play. It was inexplicable. Missed knocks for the game winning touchdown. Down three, 20 seconds left. Missed Hardman and OT. When they're driving, they would have been in field goal range. He just threw him a grounder. Bad throw. And then the Bills fans fixated on those three calls. The bottom line is Allen missed a ton of throws. Their defense was up four with four minutes left and had a chance to close the game out and they didn't do it. And then they had to hold an OT and they couldn't and they gave up the two PIs, which by the way, were both PIs. I'm sorry.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I'm proud of you. I'm good. Well, I know you're going to have the anti bill slant anyway, but yeah, it was Josh Allen's fault. You could, you know, at this point of year, like I feel like I'm. It really gets taxing like defending referees and Tony Romo. It ends up being like 22 hours of my day. So. But the referees are going to make calls. They're not going to make calls. Say what you will about those pass interferences. The game could have ended 30, 30. There was a hold in the end zone. If you want to be like that. It could have been 32, 30, Denver on the safety. That would have been that.

[Bill Simmons]

It was. It was 100% a hold in the end zone that they let go and they missed calls both ways the whole game, of course.

[Cousin Sal]

And guess what? They're not trying to keep Josh Allen out of the Super Bowl. This is.

[Bill Simmons]

That's there.

[Cousin Sal]

That'd be a great story for them. That's what they want. So this one is. And I feel like the others maybe weren't all on Josh Allen. I feel like this is 70, 80% on him. The others, you know, it's a kicker that misses the Chiefs.

[Bill Simmons]

I want to go through those.

[Cousin Sal]

We can. But it's just like this is. This is just. It's rough for him. It's rough to see him cry and both locker rooms are crying because of the result.

[Bill Simmons]

But, you know, it was a brutal loss. Allen was 0 for 9 on passes, 20 yards downfield, including the two picks. He just wasn't good enough. And he should be able to win that game because I thought his defense was good enough, kept him around and it really felt like the way Cook was running the ball, if he had a normal Josh Allen game, I Think they win. So you go through like he's eight and seven in the playoffs now and he said four horrific playoff losses. Which was the first One was the 2019, that Houston overtime loss. They blew a 19 point lead in that. They lost to KC by 14. I mean they had a couple normal playoff losses but they had that OT loss that was not his fault. The 13 seconds game in 22. They had the loss last year by three when they basically went four downs and out when they had a chance to close the game. Then they had the one this year he's had in his last three playoff losses. For three of his last four he's had the ball with a chance to close the game and he didn't do it and he hasn't done it yet and they haven't made a Super bowl yet. And I think he's the best player in the league. But I don't know if you can say that anymore if this keeps happening. I think this is the first. I've been on that corner since August. This is the first time where I'm like, I don't know if you can say it anymore.

[Cousin Sal]

That was bad. Yeah. How about this? He's QB2 and there's no QB1, but he's not QB1. So just don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

So it's like the, it's like the WWE title is vacant because there's somebody got injured.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm fine with that for this year.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm fine with that. I don't think there's anyone at the top of the mountain right now.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Yeah. And your guy.

[Bill Simmons]

I think it's vacant. My guy could do it. My guy's not ready for that either. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

I mean this is six divisional round games. Zero for six. Can't get past it. I think six overtime games. He had the ball and a chance to win in five of them.

[Bill Simmons]

He has.

[Cousin Sal]

He's put up three points in those six games. It's. It's rough and it's really, it's really rough. And you know, we talked about all the weather that went on this week and the bad stuff. Like. Well, a good running game could disguise bad quarterback play. You never thought you'd have to disguise Josh Allen's quarterback play. But the Bills had the most rushing yards this weekend out of anyone. They had 183 yards. That was such a bonus for Cook to be on fire. What do you have? Like 1:17. The terrible fumble. I mean it was reminiscent of the Jacksonville last week who was up seven three. They didn't fumble. But they missed on the fourth and one this week. Buffalo's up seven three and about to go 14 three. And Cook fumbles. But the difference is you have Josh Allen. You should be able to overcome that.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And if you're going to make excuses for him and we haven't talked about the call yet, but we will. But if you're going to make excuses like depleted receiving core. Right. He had Cooks involved in multiple huge plays who wasn't on a football team seven weeks ago. He had Hardman, who I don't even think was on the team a month ago. He's out there in important spots. Shakir is like basically they're using him like he's Troy Brown in 2001. But there's been other great quarterbacks who've been in situations with like inferior receiving. Like Brady won his first Super Bowl. He had Jermaine Wiggins and David Patton and I think David Givens, I can't even remember who received. Troy Brown was the best one. But then you go on through like 06 when they almost beat the Colts in the AFC title game. The Pats, that was the Rashe, Caldwell, Jabar Gaffney, Benjamin Watson, like this happens sometimes when you're paying your quarterback 55 million and you have some bad luck. You, you know, you might end up with this.

[Cousin Sal]

You can't have everything he has. His tight ends are very good.

[Bill Simmons]

His tight ends are very good. His offensive line is good.

[Cousin Sal]

His offensive line is good. He had 18 touchdown passes to non receivers, so that's pretty. He's been able to figure out how to make it work between throwing a running backs and tight ends for sure. But Brandon Cooks, boy, my God, what a frustrating player. I mean this guy was on what, like a half a dozen teams before age 25. Something ridiculous.

[Bill Simmons]

And yes, including the Pats, you're right.

[Cousin Sal]

And he's supposed to be a speedster. And Allen barely overthrew him like three times and then he takes a little off of it and he actually catches it, but not long enough because I actually didn't think that was Alan's fault because he has to on the throw. This guy he's overthrowing because it can't catch his speed. But you thought, you thought no catch. I thought, I thought they should have looked at it, for God's sakes for longer than what they did.

[Bill Simmons]

I was shocked that people. It was a good argument because people felt strongly about it both ways. I didn't think it was a catch. I didn't remotely think that was A catch because he's catching and he hits it and people freeze frame. And if you freeze frame it, great. But that's not how football goes. It's like a continuation.

[Cousin Sal]

But why is it. Why can't it freeze frame? We freeze frame. Pass interference, as they call. If there's a slightest tug of pressure, I get it.

[Bill Simmons]

But you have to catch it, and you've hit the ground, and you have to survive the catch at least a little bit. He lost the ball immediately. And if the Bronco wasn't there, it just would have been incomplete. But he lost it right to the Bronco. I don't know, man. I thought, like, immediately I was like, oh, shit, that's an interception.

[Cousin Sal]

Really?

[Bill Simmons]

But as we talk about over and over again, the definition of a catch seems to change week to week. And people can bring in plays from the past and be like, here's the play. When they called that a catch for the receiver, no doubt. I never thought he had the ball.

[Cousin Sal]

We could instantly find five.

[Bill Simmons]

I thought he lost the ball in 1 1/100 of a second.

[Cousin Sal]

What's the answer? Was it have to be 6, 100? Who decides? You? Me? Like, who decides how long?

[Bill Simmons]

Well, let's agree it can't be incomplete because it never hit the ground.

[Cousin Sal]

It never hit the ground.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

So, yes. Yeah. One of the two had to catch it, right? He. He took two steps, hit the ground, immediately lost it. And in any other scenario, they would have said he didn't. He didn't continue the catch. It's not a catch.

[Cousin Sal]

But McMillan wasn't a catch.

[Bill Simmons]

It went to the Broncos.

[Cousin Sal]

So at what point can they be like, all right, hey, it's not long enough, guys. Let's let five of us come in here and swarm that ball out. Is it two seconds? Is it a half a second? He doesn't need to make a football move at that.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, well, maybe a half a second would have been nice. I agree with that. They should have looked at it longer. It was kind of a big play to not be like, hey, we're going to look at this for a minute here.

[Cousin Sal]

They spend 10 minutes looking at spots, fourth down spots, like, third down at one. Like, they could look at this. McDermott's like, I'm going to call timeout. Maybe I'll call all my timeouts here, because I really think you guys should look at it for 40 seconds, and we still don't know what that eye in the sky and go to New York and Booth review. Like, we're still unclear about that. But there should have been some explanation about it. That's all I'm saying.

[Bill Simmons]

I agree. I don't think it was a catch. I thought it was a weird call that you're. We saw this even in the Rams game today where it was before the field goal to win the game. They just took two shots at the end zone for no reason. Like, why aren't you guys getting closer? Why are you so comfortable with. Right. A 48 yard kick at. What was it, like, 10 at night?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

In Chicago. Freezing cold. Special teams happy with this?

[Cousin Sal]

The special teams have been great, so I think they got well.

[Bill Simmons]

So I was doing a. You know, I was nervous about the game and I was doing a bunch of research about Allen and I was thinking this might be the best version we've ever had of the qb, the great QB that can't get over the hump. Cause when we were in high school and college, it was Marino. No way. Right? And they were like the. Yeah, but QBs where we would be like, ah, they're so great. But. And especially Marino. Cause Marino really peaked 84, 85 and 86 when he led the league in yards and TDA's. Every year they made the super bowl. And it just seemed like he was going to rip through the league. And he never really matched it. But he lost the super bowl to Montana, he lost the AFC title at home, and to the 85 Pats. Lost to Jim Kelly twice. They blew a 216 lead to San Diego, 95. Then he became pretty immobile.

[Cousin Sal]

Right?

[Bill Simmons]

And it just kind of. That was it. I still think he's one of the 10 best QBs since the merger. He's one of the best QBs I've ever seen. He didn't win.

[Cousin Sal]

Me too.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't think he's.

[Cousin Sal]

Show my kids highlights of him and I'm like, come on, doesn't that. Isn't that great? Doesn't that look different than a lot of what we see? Then they're like, yeah, that's good. I mean, I don't know. He wouldn't be top five type. I'm like, oh, God damn it. Of course he would. I promise you he would.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, if you factor in like, people are diving at his knees and hitting him after he throws it and, you know, all the things that you had against you. So he was star crossed. But I don't think even close to Josh, like year after year with these horrible losses, not to mention the Buffalo Bills history and all the stuff, all the baggage that comes with being A Bills fan, all the terrible things that have happened and now you have this guy who's the best player in the league and every year something happens. Elway was the other one. And Elway was from 83 to 96, 7 and 7 in the playoffs. Got blown out in the Super bowl three times. Had that huge choke against the 96 Jaguars. Did you have them in a parlay? Yes, I did the Brunel game. I forgot. I looked up that game. They're up 12 nothing at home. And then the Jags scored 23 straight points and they ended up knocking them out. But then he flipped it and they won in 97, 98. They went back to back Super Bowls and it was moot after that. And then the other one was Peyton Manning, who the first eight years of his career was 3 and 6 in the playoffs. Lost to the 99, Dolphins, lost to the Pats twice in a row. Lost to the 05 Steelers as big favorites. And that's probably the doppelganger for this. Allen and Manning. And Manning won in 06.

[Cousin Sal]

Minor league version of that. I'd put my guy in there. Romo, you could say what you want about him, but he had some really good years. They had 13 win years and 12 win. You know.

[Bill Simmons]

So the other one is Phil Rivers. I think you have Rivers, I would say.

[Cousin Sal]

How long was Breeze before he. Before he went?

[Bill Simmons]

He got his early because they were 09 against the Colts. Yeah, that was 09. He'd only been on the Saints for a couple years, so he doesn't count. Then I was going back to the 80s and there's like Dan Fouts, people like that who had little mini runs. This is crazy because he's clearly the best quarterback in the league. But now there's this playoff thing hanging over it and we see this, this happened in basketball more than football. Like this was like the old Karl Malone thing and people like that where they couldn't get over the hump base.

[Cousin Sal]

Couple things make this worse. Social media, right? Because within four minutes of the loss, you see Josh Allen come January and there'll be a picture of Aaron Judge in a bill's uniform. You know, so that's awful. The second thing, he just, he just falls to pieces during these press conferences. Like, man, this. I don't know that it meant that much to Dan Marino that he was losing.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm sure it hurt, but Damarino just yelled at people.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, exactly.

[Bill Simmons]

Would have excoriated an intern.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, get out of my face. And I want. I'm not Talking to anyone until September kind of thing. And Josh Allen is just. Even on the sideline, just broken up and just. It's miserable.

[Bill Simmons]

There's something with the baggage. Like, I was talking about it with a couple Red Sox fan friends about. And I wrote about this a hundred times when I was writing for espn about the mentality of a fan base, when you just feel like you're getting kicked in the nuts at the end every season.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And we hit, you know, from our generation, from that. The Pedro era through the Aaron Boone game, where it was just like, I don't know if I should follow sports anymore. Like you, it gets the darkest of dark. You're just like, why do I do this? Like, I like, should I do this? Do I want to give this team to my kids? And I think the Bills, the combination of everything that's happened to them, really, since The, I don't know, 80s, late 80s, into whatever, combined with the fact that they have this guy and they had this season where by far, he would have been the best quarterback left. Right. And now, on top of it, you get to watch the Broncos advance and Bo Nix is out, and you have Jared Stidham. Like, they're probably like, can that Bo next injury have happened like, 20 minutes earlier? Like, Jared Stidham? It's really brutal.

[Cousin Sal]

It's brutal for the fans.

[Bill Simmons]

Bad as it gets.

[Cousin Sal]

I went to college in upstate New York. Everyone was a Bills fan. Some of them were bearable, some of them not. But the core fans are just. They're great fans up there. And I think now I know why they dive through tables. Because they want to get concussed so they can forget about all this nonsense every year.

[Bill Simmons]

It's really bad. Yeah. So they were fixated on the call. McDermott played it big, but I just thought they blew that game in a bunch of different ways. And honestly, he's got to hit Knox, like.

[Cousin Sal]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

You just have to. You're one of. I had my best QBs since the merger. Brady, Montana, Mahomes, Manning, Elway, Rogers, Marino, Favre, Young, Allen. I think those are the best 10 QBs since 1970. And then you can throw Stafford, Breeze, Rivers, Kurt Warner, Bradshaw, Stau back. I just think Young and Allen were better than all those guys. Favre has to be above them, like when you throw them in stats in a Super Bowl. But it's weird. Allen is the only one that. I guess Marino would be the other one that doesn't have that. Reno only played in one super bowl and lost.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. I mean, it's phenomenal. That he's over six in this round.

[Bill Simmons]

And lost to Mahomes over and over again is the other problem. That's like his biggest rival from his generation and lost him every time. This was bad because Knicks I think is the worst quarterback he's lost to.

[Cousin Sal]

I think so. I mean I know you were down on Knicks. I don't know that. I think he probably played better than every quarterback this weekend. Like who played better than him this weekend?

[Bill Simmons]

We know that he threw the key PI throw. He had a broken ankle it seems like when he threw that last pass.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, but how about this? You know, you don't have to worry about a call. Tick ticky tack call if you. If you have some safety help there. If it's a one on two when you're Eli Manning and it and you under throw it. The refs are less likely to call the pass interference if it's an uncatchable ball like that. Yeah, I don't know. Don't leave it up. Where was the help on any of that stuff? He was like kind of smart. Nick's throwing it like that.

[Bill Simmons]

We've talked about it forever that this. Who was the. Was it Rivers that was doing it for a couple of years there or Flacco? Somebody was doing this in the way 2000 and tens where this Roethlisberger tried to do it. This offense where he's like ah, maybe we'll get one. There's three outcomes. Two of them are good for us. Let's just keep doing this. But they. The one of them was clearly designed to get a PI. That last one he threw was like almost like a Hail Mary moonball to drop down and try to get the D back to collide into him. White was pissed off. I thought it was no question that was a PI. I thought so too.

[Cousin Sal]

I thought second one for sure. First one was eh.

[Bill Simmons]

But I don't know. I get it. If I'm a Bills fan, I'm making excuses for my guy. I'm fixating on that call. I understand all the stuff they're doing but they. They blew the game. Like there's no other way to say it. They blew the game. They should have won and they should have won and should win. 34 30. He should have hit Knox. The game should have been over.

[Cousin Sal]

Is it like this in basketball would you say? Where the officiating is scrutinized 500% more in the playoffs than it is the regular season?

[Bill Simmons]

I guess because NBA is pretty bad too. But it feels like, the calls are bigger in football, right? You have these calls that literally swing games. In basketball, you have the foul baiting and some stupid stuff, but it's hard to swing a game with a call in basketball.

[Cousin Sal]

And I've always said it's tough to officiate. Like, otherwise, it's just a practical joke on all us fans, right? Like, no, no, we're going to make the officiating in every sport bad. It's like, no, these guys are fast. It's hard to see, it's hard to make calls. But in the case of the cooks catch, where you could review it, that's where I think they need to get it right or they need to explain or they need to do something different than, you know, on the spot call, which you can't review.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, the Broncos win, it's one of the great. I mean, they've won Super Bowls, so you can't say it's one of the great non super bowl playoff wins. Probably you defeat Josh Allen, this great home win that seems multiple times, it seems like you're going to blow it. And then 15 minutes later, we're all get. We're all getting the text from each other. Whoa. Oh, my God. Nicks. It's like, did he get hit by a car? What happened? It's like, no, he broke his ankle. How did he break his ankle? I watched the whole game. Would he break the ankle after the game?

[Cousin Sal]

Well, then it was like. It was a little bit weird because most of the reports were that he got it kneeling down, which wasn't the case.

[Bill Simmons]

Right?

[Cousin Sal]

It was like, kneel down.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it was that little design rollout thing. So they. They had an incredible amount of luck this year and then get a bad break at the worst possible time. Yeah, I still think this did them thing. They're home. They have a really good defense. You saw this. Pat's offense could be a little. The blocking could be, I would say, sketchy. Will Campbell hench texted us. They have that he was watching the video when Vrabel stands in the tunnel and he hugs each guy after when the guys, the Patriots come in and each guy does the handshake and the hug. And he said Will Campbell looked like he had just gotten back from like a tour of duty and some military site and just like just deer in the headlights. I mean, he got. He has not done well as the left tackle. And now you have this Denver team that's going to load up on him. They're going to, you know, they're going to try to prevent the Pats from running the ball.

[Cousin Sal]

I'll tell you why I'm not buying this, this what was me thing with the Denver thing. Because if you are to lose to Denver, you're definitely listing your top seven Patriots playoff losses next year and you're putting this in the top three. We're not going to have to worry about it because it's not going to happen, but I'm just telling you that's what would happen.

[Bill Simmons]

This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Having insurance isn't the same as having State Farm. It's like expecting the leadership of a team captain on the football field, but getting a sea captain. Sure, they're both captains, but who's going to run your offense? You wouldn't settle for just anything for your team, so don't settle for just any insurance. When it comes to getting the help you need, State Farm is the real deal. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. This episode is brought to you by TaxAct. Like an expert coach, TaxAct offers step by step guidance and guaranteed accuracy when filing taxes. Get tips along the way. Add expert assist to talk to tax experts and let our experts do your taxes for you. With Expert full service, TaxAct helps you find the deductions and credits you deserve so you can get them over with. Visit taxact.com to learn more. Conditions apply. See taxact.com for details. This episode is brought to you by Firehouse Subs who just dropped a game changing sandwich? The French dip. Literally one of my favorite sandwiches. Subs Roast beef, caramelized onions, melty cheese, little freshly toasted garlic butter roll and the warm savory au jus. I've been eating these forever since I was living on the east coast in la. I think to me this versus the cheesesteak, the French dip. No contest. Way better. And I think it's really because of the au jus. I don't know anybody who doesn't like au jus. An elite game day sub. Fun to order by the way if you want it delivered because they usually put the au jus in the special little container you can pour it on. Knock yourself out. The French tip here for a limited time. I wish it was longer. Only at Firehouse subs limited time at participating Firehouse subs restaurants while supplies last. This would be pretty tough with the way it's lined up now to play Darnold on a neutral field as the prize who I still feel like and I think our defense is good. I felt like people were sleeping on it. I think they can at least get pressure on him, make him try to work. I think Gonzalez could take out JSN and we'd match up pretty nicely with them. And I'm excited to watch the Malcolm Butler quit for two weeks. But the Pats have to get there first. And they have never, ever won a playoff game in Denver.

[Cousin Sal]

You could hire Pete Carroll as a consultant. Right. They've done that. Like right now going into that.

[Bill Simmons]

Like, he's like the Denver conciliary.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Well, no, not Denver. For the Seattle game. Yeah. Like, hey, here's.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, for the Seahawks.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, yeah. Because he was there since last two.

[Cousin Sal]

Years and he was the guy. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I thought you were going to say the Denver game because Vegas played them twice.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, that's true too.

[Bill Simmons]

I think Pete was only there in spirit.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Did you see Vegas, the Raiders record and not the record, but the scores against these playoff teams? Like, you know, you guys lost four that are left.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Unbelievable. Like they either won or lost by three. Football's weird.

[Bill Simmons]

That was when I really was concerned about Stroud when I started him that week in Fantasy in the playoffs and he played Vegas and he was terrible. And I was like, it's like, what's up with this dude? And that was the guy that showed up today. Well, we've guessed the lines and we have two. Is this where you get sad? Well, before we do guess the lines, how'd you do in the gambling?

[Cousin Sal]

I did okay. Cause I had teasers all over the place. I have a ton. Way, way too much. Like I'm going to have to pull my kid from college if the Hoosiers lose tomorrow because I had a bunch.

[Bill Simmons]

Of tied to some of these games.

[Cousin Sal]

Plus seven and a half, Seattle money line tied to Indiana. So fingers crossed I get over the finish line there. Across the finish line. But how'd you do? You did well, right?

[Bill Simmons]

I did well. I would have done awesome if I hadn't panicked and done some Niners protection stuff. Oh, I got really scared.

[Cousin Sal]

Sue Schefter. You should sue him.

[Bill Simmons]

I got really scared. I did some, but I had my favorite one. I did like a four team seven point tees. That's like two to one. Odds are close. And I took both sides of the Bills Denver game because I was like, that game's going to be close. I'm just betting on that one. And I had that with the Seahawks and then the Bears plus ten and.

[Cousin Sal]

A half today when they were down 2310. You were scared. I was nervous too with having the bills plus points, 23, 10. Then you look up, it's like, how are they winning this game? 24, 23.

[Bill Simmons]

What did Denver do? Yeah, that's the. That was the weird thing was it was a little like the Stroud game where Allen was bad enough that it's that all of a sudden the Bills were in a power position in the game. And it's like, I don't understand how this happened.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, it was weird. They didn't use Sutton enough. Thought some of the Sean Payton play calling I thought was a little, Little. Little iffy. I don't. I don't really remember that much about Stidham. I don't think he can move like Knicks could, obviously, but I think he throws a good deep ball.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

So I don't know if they. They're going to try to just do heavy run and then play action with Stidham. And if they do that, that's perfect for the Pats because they eat up the run.

[Cousin Sal]

I can't. Well, why don't you check out his preseason games? I'm sure there's tape of it because he started every. Every preseason. First two preseason games every year.

[Bill Simmons]

It's a great spot for Drake. We'll see. You know, I don't think he was probably happy with those first two playoff games and especially the ball protection stuff. They got lucky. There was one fumble that really would have hurt them, and they. The Pats were able to get it back, but I think they. They need to start rolling them out away from pressure. I just can't. I can't believe with the way this team blocks, that they're in the Final Four.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

When it just doesn't seem like he has more than 3 seconds ever.

[Cousin Sal]

You know, when do you think Donald gets hurt? Like, is it like washing his car? Just like.

[Bill Simmons]

See, we went through this with the Celtics two years ago with all the teams the Celtics played that year, and it was like, asterisk, asterisk. And then they beat Dallas especially.

[Cousin Sal]

This is incredible, though. This is just every week, Right. Even when the good teams don't show up.

[Bill Simmons]

But if you had this situation with your guy Tony Romo in the late 2000s, you would have loved it.

[Cousin Sal]

Of course I would have loved it. You have to love it.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

But you're going to be.

[Bill Simmons]

We knew this was going to be a weird year. We were saying this in October. We were like, get ready for fucking weird playoffs. Like, none of these teams are that good. Who are the good teams?

[Cousin Sal]

I'm just saying, don't Accept the trophy. That would be like a bold thing to do. It'd be like, you know, like the fans of Massachusetts fans would be like. People will be like, all right, I'm. I'm okay with them now.

[Bill Simmons]

Just, you know, I Bet maybe at.

[Cousin Sal]

5 to 1 for MVP, for Super Bowl MVP. I did it on the pre. Pregame show today. I was like, enough is enough. Throwing in the towel. I'm playing.

[Bill Simmons]

How much was it?

[Cousin Sal]

I'm Duke and Rocky, four. Five to one odds.

[Bill Simmons]

That was just.

[Cousin Sal]

It's gotta be updated. It's gotta be less than that now.

[Bill Simmons]

So do they have the Super Bowl MVP odds or.

[Cousin Sal]

No, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. Up right now.

[Bill Simmons]

Do they have all of them up? Oh, yeah, they do. Yeah. Darnold's plus 250. May is plus 280. Stafford plus 330. JSN 14:1, Puka 17:1 and Walker 21. I think there's a real JSN case. Really?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Because at the Seahawks one and we've seen receivers. We just had it happen with Cooper Cup a couple years ago. We've seen receivers win MVP when they. The quarterback stats aren't that good and the receivers like 10 for 122 with a touchdown or whatever. Sometimes they'll win it.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm predicting you put a hundy on Christian Gonzalez at 225 to 1. No doubt about it.

[Bill Simmons]

He was good today.

[Cousin Sal]

Got that.

[Bill Simmons]

He was. He was excellent today. It really helped him that Nico Collins wasn't playing, obviously. But I don't have to tell you, we have Stidham versus an aging Matthew, Stafford versus Drake May versus Sam Darnold. And that's our final four of QBs. What were the odds of that? You think in August you couldn't get it? Is it like a million to one?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, you couldn't get it. The Stidham part of the game.

[Bill Simmons]

And if I told you Stidham was starting in the AFC title game at home, you would have thought Bo Nix got hurt in like week four and Stidham did like a Nick Foles.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, yeah, I guess so. Yeah. I guess that would be the only.

[Bill Simmons]

Way to do it.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, man. Freaking Patriots.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, guess the lines.

[Cousin Sal]

So bummed. Go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

So I don't even know. Do we know what's the first game? What's the second game? I'm assuming Pat Stember is first game.

[Cousin Sal]

You think you're in the night game. You should. They should send your game to Europe. They should play that in Ireland somewhere at three in the morning. Of course. You're the first game. You should have been the first game Saturday if not for Houston and the Reds.

[Bill Simmons]

Saturday?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I went Pat's. So Pat's in Denver. I went Patriots minus one and a half.

[Cousin Sal]

Wait a minute.

[Bill Simmons]

Really?

[Cousin Sal]

That's what you did? Yeah, I said Patriots minus five and it's Pats minus five and a half. Are you crazy? I was wondering why you were so worried. You got this, buddy.

[Bill Simmons]

So if Knicks was the qb, what would the line have been?

[Cousin Sal]

I think it would have been a tic tac with you maybe favored by one and a half.

[Bill Simmons]

Really?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Did anyone see our offensive line today?

[Cousin Sal]

Well, I don't know. You've been power ranked higher all year than than Denver, right? Haven't you?

[Bill Simmons]

How do you think it's 1/2?

[Cousin Sal]

This guy hasn't thrown a ball in years.

[Bill Simmons]

You're saying Bo Nix is worth six points to the line like he's Patrick Mahomes. That's ridiculous.

[Cousin Sal]

If the England was favored by one and a half, this would be four to the line.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't think we would have been favored by 1 1/2 in Denver against Bo Nicks.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, who's, who's betting Stidham?

[Bill Simmons]

People have to decide are we good or are we not good? Because everyone's like oh, it's schedule, schedule, schedule, schedule. But then we should be favored in the AFC title game. Like which is it?

[Cousin Sal]

Well, I think you have to decide because you obviously don't think enough of your team that you. I mean you have a four point gift here. You should bet a lot on Denver.

[Bill Simmons]

We can't block.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh man.

[Bill Simmons]

Will Henderson almost had seven sacks in that game.

[Cousin Sal]

You are well, just fans.

[Bill Simmons]

Third tight end next to our left tackle. So we could have our quarterback have two seconds of time.

[Cousin Sal]

100%. You're betting the we've never want to.

[Bill Simmons]

Get playoff game in Denver.

[Cousin Sal]

I'm not betting this in the Ringer 107. There's no question you're betting the.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I'm going to do that. I mean obviously I'm going to do that. What am I going to take the Broncos? I'm going to go against my team.

[Cousin Sal]

That's what everyone's saying. Oh, what are we going to take the Broncos like this is teasers. They got to move this. They may move this to eight, who knows?

[Bill Simmons]

I'm positive you are going to tease the Broncos to like 11 and a half.

[Cousin Sal]

No way. No way. I can't bet bad quarterbacks. I'LL bet you're a bad quarterback. That's it.

[Bill Simmons]

I got to look at the manifesto and see what's going on. There are a couple quarterback rules in the manifesto.

[Cousin Sal]

Just go to the letter S. Understood them.

[Bill Simmons]

Bad offensive lines usually don't travel. And from what we saw the Pat's offensive line, it was pretty sketchy. I mean, May in two playoff games, I think got where it stripped from behind as he was throwing five times. Five or four. Four or five. That's not a good sign for us. Denver's got a good defense or at least I'm looking now.

[Cousin Sal]

I look at these before, I guess. But some people are sending so Denver's the first home underdog in a conference championship game since path Colts 2015. No. Denver New England 2015.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, noodle arm. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

2018. Was that two and a half? Three. And this is the biggest home underdog any one seed has been in a conference title game since 19.

[Bill Simmons]

All the sharps are going to take the Broncos.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, there you go. All right. So I win the week and go within one if I get this or if we tie.

[Bill Simmons]

Manning was good in that AFC title game. Even though he was noodle arm that whole year. He actually was pretty good in that game and he hurt us. Rams Seahawks in Seattle. I have the Seahawks favored by three and a half.

[Cousin Sal]

Wait a minute. Who gets this? I said one and a half. It is two and a half. So we tie and so you won the week. I win the week. And it is now 10 to nine. No, it is now.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm still up by one. You can tie for the year.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, what a great treat that would be if we tie. Take what? Netflix really did the right thing.

[Bill Simmons]

I like when we tie it because then you're in a better mood if we tie.

[Cousin Sal]

If we tie, let's go to penalty kicks and Zoe. We're. We're the two goalies and Zoe kicks against us.

[Bill Simmons]

That'd be great.

[Cousin Sal]

Let's do it.

[Bill Simmons]

She'd probably love that. Zoe could probably hurt either of us.

[Cousin Sal]

I know.

[Bill Simmons]

It's all right.

[Cousin Sal]

I deserve it.

[Bill Simmons]

Seattle two and a half, huh?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I. I would have thought.

[Bill Simmons]

I feel like that should be higher. I think I haven't been that impressed by the. By the Rams.

[Cousin Sal]

You think going into this week it was lower?

[Bill Simmons]

Kind of thought they should have lost today. So midfield in overtime like that felt like that game was done.

[Cousin Sal]

What would you have made this line Friday night or whatever?

[Bill Simmons]

Probably two and a half.

[Cousin Sal]

Two and a half?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Instead of three and a half?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. I Have a couple emails from Bill's fans. This is from Brian. I'm a lifelong Bills fan. I have two sons. Our 10 year old has completely bought in. He's watched every game the past four seasons. I've done everything I can to warn him about how the season will end. After the loss to the Broncos. He went full Brad. I guess that's now a verb for our crazy friend Brad. He went full Brad was inconsolable and launched into a fawn asthma attack. 30 minutes of hysterical crying, purple lips and wheezing. I tried explaining that, like the Masters, this is a tradition like no other. And the Bills, NFL finding a way to absolutely gut punch us, the most resilient fan base in the NFL. I felt nothing. They've crushed my insides. Do I have an obligation as a father to completely disavow the Bills? That's from Brian. It's pretty bleak.

[Cousin Sal]

That's for child protective services to figure out it.

[Bill Simmons]

Maybe you ought to get that on the record.

[Cousin Sal]

You're knocking at your door. You're lucky Bill didn't say your last name. That sucks. That sucks though. We could laugh and everything, but that absolutely sucks.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Unfortunately, your kid inherited the team and he can't switch. He stuck with the team. Did you? That's 9 and 10 are the worst times to have a loss like this. Those are the.9 was the twice I've cried from sports and those were the two times when I was nine.

[Cousin Sal]

You know what? You didn't have to worry about that.

[Bill Simmons]

Yours was in 2006 when you were in your mid-30s.

[Cousin Sal]

And also. But like going to school for you, you all sympathize. You're all together. You're all in it together. I was a Cowbo fan in New York. You know, the Mets is a different story. All my friends were Met fans or Yankee fans and they hated the Mets. But yeah, that's. That's an extra hurdle you have to. You have to get over.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, we had the Yankee playoff game and then we had the too many men on the ice against the Canadians. I think within six months of each other. I think my parents got divorced in the middle of that.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, no.

[Bill Simmons]

Because of that. Because I might have had a 30 minute asthma attack. Wait a minute.

[Cousin Sal]

Your parents got divorced because there were too many men on the ice? That's a real fight.

[Bill Simmons]

I was just taking losses left and right. Shale from Columbia, Maryland asks. The NFL famously changed the rules on how defensive backs could cover receivers to get Peyton Manning a ring. This is true, by the way. Which Rule are they going to change to get Josh Allen over the hump? Could it be that QBs don't count against the cap anymore? They did change the rules for Manning. I mean, that was 100% happened.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

If you don't know what rule they would change.

[Cousin Sal]

If your wife has been nominated for an acting award, you start 10 million.

[Bill Simmons]

More on the seller cap.

[Cousin Sal]

Start every possession at the 45.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know what it is. There were a couple kickoff spots during these playoffs that I like. You down in the end zone, you throw one 15 yard pass and you're over midfield. I can't get used to it. I can't wrap my head around some of the spottings where you're like, wait, we're on the other team's 45 already. What's happening?

[Cousin Sal]

This is why I want to get rid of kicking fantasy.

[Bill Simmons]

Colton S. You've talked a lot about how it could be Josh Allen's year. You forgot to mention how good his life is going. He's married to Hailee Steinfeld. They have a baby on the way.

[Cousin Sal]

There you go.

[Bill Simmons]

He's not hungry enough. One of the main reasons Tom Brady was so good, especially in the last few years of his career, is because his personal life was teetering on the edge of collapse. Do you think Allen misses those throws against the Broncos if his personal life was collapsing? I think not.

[Cousin Sal]

Wow. Do you think that matters?

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know. It's a theory from Colton. Did make me think like Brady met Gisele in the mid 2000s and we didn't win a Super bowl for like eight years.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And then he started ripping them off near the end and now she's married to her jiu jitsu instructor.

[Cousin Sal]

Brady was hungry, but I think it's because he was dedicated to carrot and ginger soup.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, he was hungry. He was like literally just hungry because he was eating almonds.

[Cousin Sal]

Gotta be hungry to be hungry.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, he was actually hungry. And then Allen asks, he said, I'm a hardcore NBA fan, a casual NFL fan. Is there a modern NBA equivalent to the Buffalo Bills and Josh Allen, a proud but tragic small market team that's never made it over the hump. I don't, I don't think any. You can compare any other sport to what happened to the bills in the 90s, right?

[Cousin Sal]

No way. No.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't think that you could say like the Pacers last year, but then seven other horrible things would have had to happen to them.

[Cousin Sal]

So they hit six divisional round games in a row without winning a Super Bowl. This Bills team is at six in a row without getting to the. Getting to. Getting to the Super Bowl. But yeah, that was, that was absolutely brutal. Those four.

[Bill Simmons]

And they hit the lottery with the. I mean you go back at that draft and how it worked out when we were. That was such a weird draft where we were trying to decide who the good quarterbacks were going to be out of it and there were all those choices and then they ended up getting the one you would wanted.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I was thinking that, that, that Caleb, if Caleb had made the next round and we would have had Caleb, Drake and Jaden Daniels all in the conference title game in the first two years of that draft. And they went 1, 2, 3. I don't know if that even has happened in the NBA where we went 1, 2, 3 like that. I don't think it has. We've had top five where there were three guys but not like 1, 2, 3. All of the guys were awesome. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

I think it takes less time for a football team to change their fortune than a lottery pick basketball player probably.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that's true. You want to do some parent corner?

[Cousin Sal]

Let's do it. I mean I feel, I mean that's. Those were. That was a parent story. That was really. That's going to be tough to top. Poor guy.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that was sad. I mean he did create the word full Brad.

[Cousin Sal]

He doesn't know what he's talking about.

[Bill Simmons]

I gotta remind me to send you. I have, I have video of Brad trying to get himself and somebody else a Mountain Dew soda at Shakies from two weeks ago.

[Cousin Sal]

Himself and someone else. Oh, someone at the table. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

It didn't take a short amount of time. I'll just. Spoiler alert.

[Cousin Sal]

It's the simple tasks.

[Bill Simmons]

It's really. I take it was an eight second task that took two minutes.

[Cousin Sal]

This is not a parent quarter thing. But we took him to yogurt land a few weeks ago. I took him with the boys and he had never been to one and he was screaming at the people behind the counter because he didn't realize you have to do it yourself. Right. Like you have to put the yogurt in and then you add the toppings. And he didn't think that was right and he was wondering what they were doing behind the counter that they couldn't do this. Oh, I gotta do this. Oh, I gotta do this myself. Oh really? What do I get? What do I get? Like eight bucks an hour. What do you get? I'll take half what you get. What? Like ah, Jesus, just eat your chocolate swirl. Let's get outta here.

[Bill Simmons]

We might have to have him on the super bowl props podcast when we do that two weeks from now. Let's go. Can we have him on. Is it possible for him to be on a zoom?

[Cousin Sal]

I think so, yeah. I mean, it's going to take a lot to install a camera in his apartment.

[Bill Simmons]

I got to talk to Netflix. I don't know if he's allowed on Netflix.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, you're right. It's too controversial for Netflix.

[Bill Simmons]

This episode is brought to you by Velveeta. Game day is all about the tailgate spread. Listen, if you're going to have friends over, you absolutely 100% have to have a lot of things for them to eat. Everyone gets hungry. They could say they're not going to eat. But guess what? If you lay out the right kind of spread and you have some good cheesy creamy melty dip with some good crackers, some chips, they're probably gonna eat it. So why not do creamy shells and cheese melty Velveeta box and cheesy jarred quesos? I don't know. Why wouldn't you? They're taking down one taste bud at a time. Do yourself a favor. Stock up on Velveeta before kickoff. This episode is brought to you by LinkedIn. If you've ever hired for your small business, you know how important it is to find the right person. That's why LinkedIn Jobs is stepping things up with their new AI assistant. So you can feel confident you're finding top talent that you can't find anywhere else. The best part is that those great candidates are already on LinkedIn. In fact, employees hired through LinkedIn are 30% more likely to stick around for at least a year compared to those hired through the leading competitor hire right the first time. Post your job for [e-mail] Simmons. Then promote it to use LinkedIn Jobs new AI assistant, making it easier and faster to find top candidates. That's LinkedIn.com Simmons to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. What do you have for Parent Corner?

[Cousin Sal]

All right, well, my parent corner involves my wife who, because she sees me as a child, so it counts. Although I feel like I'm very mature in this situation. So she's in a baseball mom's fantasy league, right? So all the moms of Harrison's 12 year olds right there, and she does the draft in September and she. I give her a nice grid. I was like, hey, go running back, wide receiver, running back, wide receiver. Maybe wide receiver, running back. I don't care. But for those first four, do that. Just keep doing that and do it through six rounds. So she, for some reason, waits until the fifth round, take running backs, despite the fact that I gave her a nice grid, telling her what to do, and she ends up with, like, James, Conner and Dobbins, all this crap for running backs, and they're gone early, so she can never catch up. She has some bad luck. She goes 2 and 12. And she blames me. And because I can't dig her out of the hole, she's like, you watch football. You watch every single play. You can't help me here. I'm against mothers. I'm like, sweetheart, it's all luck. Fantasy's all luck. So as it turns out, there's a punishment for last place. She was in 2 and 12. Yeah, there's punishment for last place. So she says the other day to me, she's like, hey, so and so is gonna come by. She's dropping off the sign for the lawn. I was like, what sign for the lawn? It's a sign that says. It's a fantasy football sign that says, I suck at fantasy football. And it has to go on our lawn for a month. Like, that's not going on our lawn. She's like, yes, it has to. There's nothing I can. And the kids are like, no way. No, we're not doing that. Because then that looks like someone in this house, you know, right? Then it'll look like I suck at fantasy football, right? It'll look like, you know, my kids are like, they'd rather fail all their classes than have someone think that they suck at fantasy football at this. So she's like, well, the alternative was, get this. I'd have to walk up and down the pier with a sign that says, I give great BJ's. And I was like, ah, Jesus Christ. What kind of league is this? Even my league?

[Bill Simmons]

What is this, like, the Ice Storm league? What's going on in this league? I would have great BJ's.

[Cousin Sal]

I would have tried harder if I knew this was what's at stake, you know, so. And. But then I'm thinking, like, all right, she carries that sign that makes me look better at least. But I get why she doesn't want to do it, but. So, like, we're fighting about this, so we have to put the sign in our yard.

[Bill Simmons]

And I was like, she lost. You got to do it.

[Cousin Sal]

You got to put your face on it. I was like, we have to. People have to know. She's like, no, no, no. I don't want people knowing my family. Like, why you walk the dog? People see you out every day. It doesn't matter. It's like, no, no, I'm not. So now we're. It's like, what do you think we should do here? Like, the kids, we're all fighting about this.

[Bill Simmons]

So it should say the sign should be I'm Melissa and I suck at fantasy football. Something like that. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

But it's already here. It just says I should make a new sign. I should just change it or put.

[Bill Simmons]

Her face on it. Right? Put a picture of her face on it.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah. Do you have a picture of her from the other night?

[Bill Simmons]

I don't have pictures of her.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I like this. I think it should go on your front line, and I think it could apply to the whole family.

[Cousin Sal]

I know.

[Bill Simmons]

How many leagues did you win this year?

[Cousin Sal]

I love that. I like telling him, like, oh, sweetheart, it's all lock. And then I'm like, no. I'm like, we're not putting that on the thing. If it's all luck, I shouldn't have a problem with it, right?

[Bill Simmons]

But my Parent Corner is so. My son is in college, or he's in high school, but got into college. And it's one of those things where you still have the second semester and you still gotta put in the work, but he's already in. And it struck me that this is all the times when we have kids when they're younger and you have to lie to them about the repercussions of things, right? And it peaks with Elf on the Shelf, which, when we started doing Parent Corner, we talked a lot about Elf in the Shelf and how ridiculous it is that these elves, we move them around every day, and if the kid doesn't obey that elf gets mad. They might not get Christmas presents. And they're stupid enough to believe this. I feel like this is the last. This is the last stage of Elf on the Shelf. It's like if you. If your grades go down, they could. You might. They might rescind your application and you're not in there. But meanwhile, you could probably Google that. And I don't know if that's true, but threatening your kid with something that deep down they probably know, isn't that true? So now I'm just guilt tripping, like, you gotta finish strong. You became such a good student. You gotta finish this now. You got one semester left. Do this for pride. The point is, lying to our kids doesn't work anymore. I think they just have completely figured us out by age 18. Right. Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, it certainly doesn't work now that you're telling the story and someone tells you.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I was. Yeah, yeah, he already read me. So it's. It's.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, it's a good point.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm. We're going back to past with our kids and they know exactly what offense we're in and where the receivers are going. And it's just. I don't think we can slip anything by them. But I wonder what age that is when that ends.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, that's like 15.

[Bill Simmons]

15, 16.

[Cousin Sal]

I think that's it. The only thing you could do is like, you. You could have a story attached to it. Like, look, for the most part, this doesn't matter, but my friend Joe House, he was in. No, him. He was in Notre Dame. He got in and whatever. He was in. He was. And then he was going to Harvard.

[Bill Simmons]

He was in Harvard Law and they. They signed his grades and pulled it.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, he got rowdy at a bar and something happened. And then he actually said two weeks. Yeah, I try that. See if it works.

[Bill Simmons]

I should have said that. Well, one thing is, I know he's probably not watching. Not watching this anymore. That's it for Pear corner. Anything else we got to hit before we go?

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, I want to hit a couple things here. First of all, most of our beginning of the year in August, we did our futures bets, right?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

Want the good news or the bad news?

[Bill Simmons]

Well, we did over unders, which was disappointing. And then we had a futures draft above our futures.

[Cousin Sal]

Yes. I'll tell you what the good news is. We hit 12 bets, six each. The bad news is we gave out 53.

[Bill Simmons]

But some of those were high end.

[Cousin Sal]

Okay. Yeah. So your best.

[Bill Simmons]

Was it one of mine? Like, I had like a Denver to make the Super Bowl. Like, I have some ones that have, like, pretty big odds.

[Cousin Sal]

You did better than I did. And we still have three left. You have Rabel for coach of the year, which is going to win. That's about seven to one. I have Salah for assistant coach of the year, and I have like Penny Sewell for protector of the year, which I haven't seen an update since August on that. But anyway, your best was Seattle +500 to win the division. Good job by you. New Orleans, Cleveland for last place plus 1, 58. And Denver or Green Bay, number one seed plus 5, 50. Those are your best?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Well, the thing is we throw a bunch of these out and we try to hit 10. Because they have the big odds. Right. But I think my issue was I tied Casey to all these.

[Cousin Sal]

KC Killed us.

[Bill Simmons]

KC Just murdered us.

[Cousin Sal]

What happened? Dumbass team, nowhere close to playoffs. The other thing is, I listened to your Friday show, and Schrager mentioned the Bill Simmons re Apex, which is great. I mean, he just. He loves to kiss your ass. My God. My God, I love Schrager, but could you give it a rest? You got the Friday spot locked up. You're going to be fine. I love you, Schrager. But anyway, the example he used, and I'll admit it's a great scenario. Was it an email or just a scenario he came up with? If. How does it go? If there's an OJ type Bronco chase in 2026, who's the most compelling current or former athlete to be?

[Bill Simmons]

Who would be the 2026 equivalent to O.J. simpson? If that happened now? And you had to have the surprise factor, the likability of the celebrity and.

[Cousin Sal]

The fame that everybody's in now. Everybody.

[Bill Simmons]

Everybody's like, oh, my God, I can't believe this.

[Cousin Sal]

Yeah, Peyton Mang's not in the top 20. Why is he?

[Bill Simmons]

Who do you have?

[Cousin Sal]

First of all, if it's the same scenario, it's Travis Kelce. Because that means he would have killed his wife. Taylor Swift, of course. That's gotta be the answer. You can't think of that. Yeah, Josh Allen.

[Bill Simmons]

That's true. He would have killed a. Yeah, Anybody who's married to a celebrity, it's a bigger. It's a bigger deal. That's a pretty good point.

[Cousin Sal]

Even Josh Allen.

[Bill Simmons]

But that's not equal. Then that's a higher thing. OJ Wasn't married to a celebrity, so it has to be.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, it's got to be. I mean, I think, like, Shohei Ohtani would be big. You'd be like, oh, that guy was gambling. He's running from his butt. He had to kill somebody. Like that. That's pretty good. LeBron, Caitlin Clark, Steph Curry. We kind of know his wife. Right.

[Bill Simmons]

But it has to be a retired athlete, though.

[Cousin Sal]

It had to be retired.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Because O.J. was retired. You're trying to fit the box of, like, former athlete, moved into a second phase of his career. Everybody liked him, did commercials, dabbled in TV stuff or movie stuff.

[Cousin Sal]

All right, all right.

[Bill Simmons]

So Travis Kelsey's the other ones. Somebody. There was a couple emails, actually, people pushing Michael Strahan saying that that's actually the closest because, like, O.J. went into TV after, tried to cross over Was on the Regis and Kelly show and is on the ABC show. So means something to, like, the female audience. Kind of like OJ Was in the Hertz commercials. So Strahan was interesting, but I don't think Strahan's as liked as O.J. was.

[Cousin Sal]

Well, Brady then for sure would be up there. How about this one? Cause we know the wife. Triple H. Triple H would be good.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know. I think a wrestler. Everybody's kind of like they're 20% not surprised.

[Cousin Sal]

They know the McMahons. Al Michaels would be ironic. That would be fun, since he called the.

[Bill Simmons]

Michaels on the run from Toscanos after he just put down a veil chop.

[Cousin Sal]

That'd be good.

[Bill Simmons]

Riding through Brentwood the same streets.

[Cousin Sal]

He's crazy. This is what happens when you don't eat vegetables. You lose your mind.

[Bill Simmons]

That's a good one. The more I thought about it, I think Serena might have been the answer.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh, yeah, That's a good one, too.

[Bill Simmons]

Because it switches over. Everybody loves Serena. Nobody ever in a million years would have thought anything would happen with her. And I think the shock value. I think my wife would care the most. Versus, like, Michael Strahan. People like that.

[Cousin Sal]

That's a good call.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. But Manning is kind of fits the OJ Profile of almost, in some ways, feels as big as he did when he played. From all the stuff he's up to.

[Cousin Sal]

Right. I knew we're missing one. I wrote down Bowen Yang, but I don't know if that's his name.

[Bill Simmons]

He must have.

[Cousin Sal]

I'll force a bow and Yang joke in every Netflix podcast.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay. I watched. By the way, I watched the Kill Tony show on Netflix. Yeah, Yeah.

[Cousin Sal]

I haven't got that.

[Bill Simmons]

And that guy, Cam Patterson came just absolutely crushed. You loved it on there. Yeah, I like the Kill Tony show. It's kind of like Gong show crossed with Don Barris. Ding Dong show crossed with like a Jeff Ross roast. I don't know. It's all over the place. I like that show.

[Cousin Sal]

All right.

[Bill Simmons]

Anything to plug the show. All week.

[Cousin Sal]

All week. I'm on with Tate, the Bundo House High Fitz. Great group of fellas. We do it over again Sunday morning on the pregame show. And you know what? I'm going to give 10 people $50. I gotta change my mojo. If you had a bad beat, hit me up at the Cousin Sal on Twitter. Show me. Show me a copy of your ticket stub. Whatever. I'll give 50 to 10. First 10. I see. Had to be a bad beat in the Buffalo game. Or this other stupid one we just watched.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, we almost had the Rams with the overtime cover. Felt like it was in play. And those throws. Yeah, it's almost like he had them. All right, so two rewatchables coming this week. Double rewatchables. We have just one of the guys on Monday and then I'll tell people what the Wednesday movie is on the Monday pod. So we have that. We're going to be on Netflix all week on this pod. Rewatchable starts next week on Netflix as well. And cuz I will see you in a week or big debate about whether my dad's going to come out for this Pat Stember game.

[Cousin Sal]

Oh really?

[Bill Simmons]

What's the debate?

[Cousin Sal]

He's got to do it.

[Bill Simmons]

Talking about making the fight. Yeah, we've watched a lot of these. You never know after we had that last Pat's Chiefs1 in 2018, which I think we watched together. Now that we're back, I think he might come out for this one. So I don't know if that's going to help my luck or not. I could have him as I'm doing the pot. I could just have him sitting in the seat behind me, just probably in a coma from the game after that.

[Cousin Sal]

You should say to him, dad, remember senior year you told me I have to give it my best the second half. You were full of shit, right?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, you lied, didn't you?

[Cousin Sal]

Dad, look at us now.

[Bill Simmons]

Thanks to Gahao and Eduardo as well. Coast as always. Good job by you. Good job by you, buddy. We'll see you next week live on Netflix. But check out the BS Pub Tuesday and Thursday as well. See you in a couple days. Must be 21 plus on President select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 Plus. I'm President D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. GAM Prom. Call 100 Gambler, visit rg-help.com, call 888-79777 or visit ccpg.orgchinconnecticut or mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 877-8-HOPE NY or text Hopeny in New York. This episode is brought to you by 20th Century Studios. Send help. From the twisted mind of Sam Raimi, director of the Evil Dead and Drag Me to hell, starring Rachel McAdams and Dylan O'. Brien. I like both of them comes a new film that begs the question, what would you do if you were stuck on an island with your terrible Boss in paradise. HR can't hear you scream. Only in theaters in 3D January 30th get tickets now.