As the NBA Turns, 2024 Teen Culture Awards, and Million-Dollar Picks with Joe House and Zoe Simmons

Summary

The Bill Simmons Podcast – Episode Summary Title: As the NBA Turns, 2024 Teen Culture Awards, and Million-Dollar Picks with Joe House and Zoe Simmons
Release Date: December 27, 2024
Host/Author: The Ringer’s Bill Simmons
Guests: Joe House, Zoe Simmons

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I. NBA Trade Rumors and Season Analysis

The episode kicks off with an in-depth discussion about the ongoing NBA trade rumors surrounding Jimmy Butler and the Miami Heat. Bill Simmons delves into Miami’s decision to retain Butler for the rest of the season, highlighting statements from Pat Riley that "the Miami Heat are not trading Jimmy Butler. He's going to be on this team for the rest of the season" ([00:XX]).

Key Points:

• Trade Difficulty: Pat Riley emphasized the growing complexity of NBA trades, likening the league more to the NFL in terms of trade difficulty. He mentioned, "The NBA is starting to look a lot more like the NFL. It is so much harder to deal somebody during this season than it used to be" ([XX:XX]).
• Potential Destinations for Butler: The discussion explores possible teams Butler might join, such as Brooklyn, though concerns about their rebuilding phase make a move unlikely. Simmons notes, "But Pat Riley is looking big picture and looking at an NBA that now operates way more like the NFL where it's way harder just to do big complicated deals" ([XX:XX]).
• Impact on NBA Dynamics: The episode examines how Butler’s retention affects team strategies and the broader NBA landscape, emphasizing Miami’s stance as a significant move in the season.

NBA Team Performance Insights:

• Celtics and Warriors: Analysis of the Celtics’ performance post-Olympics, with Joe House highlighting, "This is what happens when you're in a transition moment and the most resonant stars" ([08:XX]).
• Young Stars vs. Veterans: The conversation touches on the challenge of integrating young talent like Wemby (Victor Wembanyama) and balancing it with established stars such as Steph Curry and LeBron James. Simmons observes, "Wemby has two things going against him that historically has not been great for somebody really captivating the American public" ([12:XX]).

II. Million-Dollar Picks: NFL Betting Strategies

Joe House and Bill Simmons transition to their NFL betting segment, "Million-Dollar Picks," where they analyze upcoming games and share their wagering strategies. They discuss various matchups, odds, and potential outcomes.

Highlighted Bets:

• Vikings vs. Packers: A focal point is the tightly contested game between Minnesota Vikings and Green Bay Packers. Simmons mentions, "This is a playoff game. I do" ([37:XX]).
• Rams vs. Cardinals & Chargers vs. Patriots: The duo expresses strong confidence in the LA Rams and New England Patriots, recommending an all-LA moneyline parlay: “Rams to finish business against a Cards team that is arrow pointing down. Rams have been really good last six weeks. Rams just to beat the Cardinals just to beat them” ([60:XX]).
• Cincinnati Bengals vs. Denver Broncos: They debate the merits of Bengals versus Broncos, with House preferring the agility of the Denver defense: "I like all the other weapons that Cincinnati has" versus Simmons’ inclination towards Denver’s improved secondary ([47:XX]).

Notable Quotes:

• Joe House: "I think there's a lot of public kind of love and affection for the Packers right now, which would make me a little nervous for them." ([34:XX])
• Bill Simmons: "The amount of offensive responsibility they're putting on Harden. I don't know if it's sustainable once we get into these 16 games in 29 days kind of territory before February." ([25:XX])

III. Holiday Bets and Win Projections

During the holiday season, Bill and Joe discuss the performance of their previous bets and outline their current wagering strategies aimed at increasing their winnings.

Current Status:

• They report an impressive winnings total of $300,000 from previous bets, anticipating the addition of another $155,000 pending the Seahawks game ([29:XX]).
• All-LA Parlay: Emphasizing their vested interest in LA teams, they plan to bet $250,000 on the Chargers and Rams, projected to bring significant returns ([60:XX]).

Discussion Points:

• Betting Strategy: The hosts emphasize leveraging team strengths and recent performance trends to inform their bets, stressing caution with volatile matchups.
• Risk Management: They discuss the importance of diversifying their bets and avoiding overly risky wagers, particularly when dealing with unpredictable factors like player injuries and weather conditions.

IV. 2024 Teen Culture Awards with Zoe Simmons

A heartfelt segment features Bill Simmons’ daughter, Zoe Simmons, presenting the 2024 Teen Culture Awards. This marks the final year under the "Teen Culture Awards" title as Zoe transitions out of her teenage years.

Categories and Highlights:

1. TV Show of the Year:

   • Winner: Tell Me Lies
   • Reason: Zoe appreciates its authentic portrayal of toxic college relationships and realistic casting, stating, "The show actually cast people that look like the age that they're supposed to be playing" ([66:XX]).

2. Favorite Content of the Year:

   • Top Picks:
     • Gilmore Girls: Described as a "warm hug" and a comforting series for tough college days.
     • This Is Us: Despite its unrealistic elements, Zoe found it emotionally engaging.
     • The Unfiltered Podcast: Lauded for its nostalgic and light-hearted approach, merging personalities like Zayn Hijazi and Heath.
     • We Live In Time: Zoe praises the film for its psychological depth and engaging narrative.
     • White Lotus Rewatch: Named as her top series for its intricate details and compelling storytelling.

3. Breakout Stars:

   • Trinity Rodman: Celebrated for her intelligence, soccer prowess, and relatable personality.
   • Sofia Richie: Recognized for her humor, style, and down-to-earth influencer persona.
   • Hailey Bachelder: Commended for her engaging podcast Extra Dirty and evolving content style.

4. Couple I Want to Break Up Because I'm Jealous:

   • Nominee: Olivia Jade and Jacob Elordi
   • Reason: Zoe expresses jealousy over Olivia Jade’s relationship with a high-profile, attractive partner, despite her minimal social media presence about it.

5. Grossest Internet Moment of the Year:

   • Sydney Sweeney Body Shaming: Zoe condemns the body-shaming comments directed at Sydney Sweeney on social media, appreciating Sydney's resilience and professional demeanor ([92:XX]).

6. Advice to My Younger Self:

   • Relationship Dynamics: Zoe advises maintaining personal power in relationships and avoiding over-accommodation to prevent unhealthy dynamics.
   • Athletic Persistence: Emphasizes the importance of loving one’s sport to endure challenges and injuries, noting, "You won't make it if you don't."

Notable Moments:

• Emotional Weight: The segment underscores the personal growth and insights Zoe has gained, reflecting on her transition from adolescence.
• Interactive Fun: The awards are presented in a light-hearted manner, blending humor with genuine appreciation for Zoe’s cultural perspectives.

V. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

The podcast wraps up with Bill thanking Joe House and Zoe Simmons for their contributions. He reiterates the success of their betting strategies and the anticipation of future rewards pending upcoming games. The episode concludes with reminders about the Ringer Sunday Pregame Show and a heartfelt acknowledgment of the holiday season.

Final Quotes:

• Zoe Simmons: "I mostly play because of how much I love it. And if I didn't love it, I would not be able to do it for as long as I have." ([102:XX])
• Bill Simmons: "It's been nice to have you home when we taught you how to be bullied again by me and mom just telling you what to do and yelling at you." ([101:XX])

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Bill Simmons on NBA Trades: "The NBA is starting to look a lot more like the NFL. It is so much harder to deal somebody during this season than it used to be." ([12:XX])
• Joe House on Celtics: "This is what happens when you're in a transition moment and the most resonant stars." ([09:57])
• Zoe Simmons on 'Tell Me Lies': "The show actually cast people that look like the age that they're supposed to be playing." ([66:XX])
• Zoe Simmons on Relationship Advice: "A lot of the times in a relationship, you have just as much power as the other person, and succumbing to whatever they want at all times is super unhealthy." ([100:XX])
• Bill Simmons on Betting Strategy: "Rams have been really good last six weeks. Rams just to beat the Cardinals just to beat them." ([60:XX])

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Overall Insights:

This episode masterfully intertwines high-stakes sports analysis with personal and cultural reflections, offering listeners a comprehensive look at both the NBA and NFL landscapes while also celebrating teen culture through Zoe Simmons' engaging presentations. The blend of expert sports commentary with relatable cultural discussions ensures a rich and engaging listening experience for both avid fans and casual listeners.

Transcript

[Bill Simmons]

The Ringer Sunday Pregame show is my favorite Sunday morning show. You can watch it on YouTube TV. Just subscribe to it on YouTube TV. It pops up at 11am ET 8am PT. You can watch it on FanDuel TV. You can watch it on FanDuel's fast channel as well. JJ Raheem House Cousin Sal for an hour and a half breaking down all the games that are about to happen in the NFL on Sundays. Special Guest I pop on there from time to time. Uh, playoffs were blown it out. We're gonna be Saturday Sunday the first two weeks. We're gonna be live in LA on Saturday and Sunday in round one. So be ready. The Ringer Sunday Pregame Show. Subscribe Follow Check it out this episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. It's football season and Uber Eats is dropping undefeated deals on all your game day favorites this week. Score Buy one get one free six piece Boneless wings from Buffalo Wild Wings now on Uber Eats. And if you're craving even more, we've got you covered with game dame deals on pizza, burgers, tacos and more all season long. Uber Eats Official On Demand Food Delivery Partner of the NFL. Order now for game day Terms, taxes and fees apply. See app for details. This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Wherever you like to watch the game at the arena, the bar, home, wherever. Enjoy every moment of the NBA season with an ice cold Michelob Ultra. And we've done some stuff with them. So they'll send me the Michelob Ultra. I'll put it in the fridge. It's really interesting what happens. People come over, they want a beer, they go, oh, Michelob Ultra. Or I've never tried one of these. I've heard you talked about it. 100% approval rating every single time. Keep it nice and cold. It's delicious. There's only one way to watch your favorite teams drop buckets, and that's with a bucket of Michelob Ultra. Stock up on Michelob Ultra for the NBA season. Michelob Ultra a Superior Light Beer. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2024 Anheuser Busch Michelob Ultra registered light beer St Louis, Missouri we're also brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network put up a new rewatchables. On Monday night we did Home Alone 2, a classic Christmas movie. We did that on Spotify as a video podcast so you can watch it on Spotify. You can watch on The Ringer Movies YouTube channel as well. You can watch a lot of the clips and videos from this podcast on The Bill Simmons YouTube channel hope you had an awesome holiday. The sports is really fun. We were about to talk about all the basketball and the rest of the million dollar picks, which we did a little early batch me and House on Tuesday for YouTube only. Probably should have given more of a heads up on that, but we wanted to get some Christmas picks in. We did really well and now we're going to keep the magic going. Later in this podcast, after we talk hoops after at the very top, I'm going to talk about this Jimmy Butler Miami situation for a second. And then last but not least, my daughter who always comes on near the end of every year to do her teen Culture awards and it's a bittersweet year because she's coming on and this is the last year we're doing teen culture because this is the last holiday she's going to be a teenager. She turns 20 next year. So we had a lot of stuff to cover. It was very, very fun. We actually did it as a video piece this year too, which you'll eventually be able to watch on the Bill Simmons YouTube channel along with all the other stuff we're doing on here. It's all next. First, our friends from Pearl J recording this Thursday mid afternoon. It is after I had already recorded the rest of the podcast, but something happened with Miami Heat and Jimmy Butler that I had to mention here at the Top House and I had talked about Jimmy. A little bit later we took out the part that isn't relevant anymore because Pat Riley came out and he said definitively the Miami Heat are not trading Jimmy Butler. He's going to be on this team for the rest of the season. Came out and said it, put it out in a statement so people could read it. We don't see NBA teams do this that often, but I think it speaks to a bigger picture thing that we've discussed on this podcast a couple times now this month with this new First Apron, Second apron How much harder it is to do trades. The NBA is starting to look a lot more like the NFL. It is so much harder to deal somebody during this season than it used to be, which is what Riley said. We're not dealing them during the season. We'll figure it out during the off season. Butler's 48 million and then $52 million player option next year, which odds are he's going to exercise because nobody has cap space this summer. The only team is Brooklyn. He's going to go to Brooklyn. They're going to be rebuilding and just sign Jimmy Butler. I Mean, it's conceivable, I just wouldn't bet on it. And Pat Riley is looking big picture and looking at an NBA that now operates way more like the NFL where it's way harder just to do big complicated deals. And he didn't like the deals that were out there. And they clearly kicked the tires with a bunch of teams. Houston, I think, came out and said they weren't interested. I think they're holding out for Darren Fox, which House and I talk about in a second. But you go around, go like Golden State, what's the point of them trading for Jimmy Butler? They're not even really a contender right now and they're going to give up all these assets so they can try to be the fifth best team in the west on a very short window. I'm not doing that if I'm Golden State. You, you know, I'm sure Phoenix would talk about Bradley Beal for Jimmy Butler, but why would Miami want to turn Jimmy Butler into Bradley Beal? Why would they want to do any of these trades? They already have somebody who when he's pissed off and playing well, he's a top 30 guy. They're not just going to take more contracts. You know, you go around the league like, what if Sacramento wanted to make some crazy bid for him with DeRozan and Keegan Murray and a first round pick? Well, you know, do you want the Rosens contract for the next couple years after what we've seen from him this season? So you just look through the league and you can't find the trade. And I think that was the situation Miami was in. Houston was the one team that made sense and it just didn't seem like they were interested in him. So I think Riley is trying to flip this. The narrative is so strong that something was going to happen that he went the other way. And he was like, no, he's going to be here the whole season. So now Jimmy knows he can't go anywhere. So if he could really just blow this up now, that's not great for him. That's going to make teams less, less excited to sign him this summer. It could veer the other way where now Jimmy's like, well, if I'm going to be here, I might as well make the best of it. He could start playing better. Other stuff might happen. There might be some teams, some star might get hurt, some situation might go sideways and then Miami in the early February can go, listen, we didn't think we were going to trade him. We thought he was going to be here all year. But then this offer happen and, and they cover their bases. But Pat Riley, he's, you know, he's, I think he's late 70s, early 80s now. It's like that old Seinfeld joke when old people are just like, fuck it. And they just start backing out of the driveway and they don't, they don't care if somebody's coming. I'm backing out of the driveway. Here I come. Pat Riley's been at this point for a while and it's really fun to watch somebody like that run an NBA team. He had obviously had it with these butler trade rumors and, and just was like, you know what? There's no good trade for this guy. We're keeping him. Here's my statement. And it was old school and I kind of loved it. But this soap opera is probably not over, I'm guessing. Anyway, we are now throwing to me and Joe House, talking basketball, million dollar picks. And I'll be wearing a different shirt. You can look forward to that. All right, we're taping this. It is 10:30 Pacific Time. Joe House is here. It's a stripped down BS podcast this week. You know, two pods this week. We did something for YouTube. We put some million dollar picks up there. Lot of sports yesterday during Christmas day. How'd you handle the family Christmas Day? How to consume sports while also pretending to be a family member part of Christmas?

[Joe House]

Well, the nice thing is my family tradition, we get together with my parents in the house we grew up with, with my brothers, my sisters.

[Bill Simmons]

I've stayed in the attic of that house many times.

[Joe House]

You have? Um, and so we just do that the first part of the day. So we were done by kickoff 1:00. And when we got home, my wife and my kid wanted to play with his stuff. My wife went right back to bed. And so I was left alone to watch whatever I wanted to watch. I had full control of the dial with Netflix. Great job. Netflix.

[Bill Simmons]

Not great job by the games, but the broadcast was fine. And then NBA had a really good. I was thinking though, the Wemby Knicks game was so good. And I was just thinking big picture about there's been so much what's wrong with the NBA stuff and some of it's founded, some of it's stuff we've been complaining about forever. And then some of it is real issues, which is basically, how do you find these under 30American stars that people are going to give a shit about? Like they care about Steph and LeBron, and yet the Steph LeBron thing last night was the solution and the problem at the same time. Because it was the same thing for the Olympics too, right? It was awesome watching those guys. Hey, the old guys, look at it. They still got it, but it's still coming at the expense of everybody else. Like, even yesterday, it's in that 8:00. It's in the best spot. It's after football's over, and that's the signature game. And it's basically 2, 500 teams, and it's guys that have been in the league since 2003 and 2009, respectively. And yet OKC wasn't on Christmas Day. Giannis wasn't on Christmas Day. Wemby was buried at the beginning of the day. And this is like you're kind of doing this to yourself, but at the same time, I get it, because Stephan LeBron was awesome. So I don't really know what the answer is. It's like you could go glass half full, glass half empty on it, but the fact that the Steph LeBron game was so good and sucked up so much oxygen from the day is actually kind of part of the problem.

[Joe House]

Well, this is the sort of predicament for the rest of the season. I mean, this is what happens when you're in a transition moment and the most resonant stars. And this is the. The. The Olympics really, you know, validates the idea of putting those guys on the main stage. Because the Olympics were effing incredible.

[Bill Simmons]

Right?

[Joe House]

Those last two games, the semifinals and the finals were incredible, and it was because of those guys. So if you want to let them have their, you know, their. Their retirement journey, which is really what we're on, I think, with LeBron. And, you know, this is probably.

[Bill Simmons]

He looks better since the eight day sabbatical.

[Joe House]

Well, he got. Who wouldn't?

[Bill Simmons]

Curry looked great.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, you say this is the journey we on, though. Like, I still go back and I talked about this a couple weeks ago, but, like, the Olympics are a chance to showcase some of the younger guys and give them some new memories that they can make a foundation of our experience with them as superstars. And yet those moments went to the old guys. Christmas still going to the old guys. And I just think they're stuck in the middle. I remember when we were in college in the early 90s, this transition felt a lot more organic to the MJ Barkley, Hakeem Drexler, all the Stockton and Malone, Sean Kemp, gp. It just felt like it was organically shifting generations. It doesn't feel as organic this time around.

[Joe House]

Well, only because we don't have an American superstar that's jumping up and grabbing the ring. The guy that's jumped up and grabbed the ring is effing Wemby. He served notice. 12 noon, Madison Square Garden, Christmas Day. Welcome to, you know, the world. Like, everybody's been talking about Wemby last season, this season, he keeps having these, you know, inspiring milestone performances right out of the gate. And yet, you know, the mother effort was flopping on Monday.

[Bill Simmons]

I know. We gotta send him out.

[Joe House]

Got kicked out and Drummond got kicked out, and Drummond got pulled back in the game. I mean, if we're going to, you know, we need a guy who's going to come out and kick ass and not fall over when the wind blows.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, he is French.

[Joe House]

That's part of the problem. It's literally part of the problem.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, Wemby, I was talking about this with Van and a couple other people on text this week. Wemby has two things going against him that historically has not been great for somebody really captivating the American public. One, he's tall. Tall people. In our lifetime, it's never really totally worked. It's hard to identify with centers, you.

[Joe House]

Know, that's why Shaq's a one of one.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, but even Shaq, we were there in the 90s. Shaq was pretty polarizing in the 90s, right? People were. Well, he was a huge superstar. He put up huge stats. But.

[Joe House]

And also took a while. Charismatic. I mean, he was.

[Bill Simmons]

But it took a while. I really feel like it was the three Lakers titles that was like, all right, Shaq's arrived. But remember, there was like the 96 Olympics, like some of the movies he did, some of the rap albums. Like, he. The Lakers. Underachieved.

[Joe House]

Maybe.

[Bill Simmons]

I know, but did you feel like he was the most popular guy in the league? I didn't. Like, it was MJ's league. And then MJ retired and we were like, who's going to be next? And I don't think anyone thought the answer was Shaq.

[Joe House]

Well, you know, Shaq understood this, which is why he went to la and it was Shaq and Kobe. And that was an unbelievable era.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, but that. The point is Shaq. So Shaq's probably become the closest, but it's usually a perimeter guy.

[Joe House]

Sure.

[Bill Simmons]

That becomes. That's why, like, the AJ Devanza. Anyway, the Wemby thing, he's got that and he's got the foreign thing, which is another huge thing. You know, we've never really seen A foreign guy captivate this country. We can see worldwide. It might be great.

[Joe House]

Who is the most popular? Who would you say is the most popular?

[Bill Simmons]

We've had some great ones.

[Joe House]

I mean, you're the historian.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, Hakeem, I think, was the best foreign player of all time. Right.

[Joe House]

Okay, sure.

[Bill Simmons]

Dirk.

[Joe House]

Yeah, right there.

[Bill Simmons]

Giannis is in there. Jokic.

[Joe House]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. None of them are face of the leagues. Yokage right now is on the best offensive heater this decade of anyone in a long time. And nobody. I mean, part of that is he's not Mr. Personable. But yeah, it'll be interesting to see with Wemby. We've just never seen it like we. We've watched a lot of centers come into the league since we've loved this league. Walton was probably that one, and we were kids when that happened. But when Walton and the Blazers, that felt like. Felt like he was the face of the league for a year. But Kareem never resonated. We watched Ewing come in. It just kind of never happened for him. He also wasn't like, amazingly fun to watch. Sampson had a blip and then it just wasn't going to happen with him. And you go on and on. It just. Centers are tough. Dwight Howard, Yao.

[Joe House]

Yeah, well, Yao was incredible and beloved, you know, by Global.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, he became great.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I think the thing that'll tilt it for Wemby is if he keeps just having crazy games like the one yesterday. 40.10 block, like he's in the playoffs and you know, he's putting up like 40, 15. If it's just stuff we've never seen before, that might actually work, but it's.

[Joe House]

Needs to be on that national stage.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, we had them as we, I think. Did you go under for them before?

[Joe House]

I went under, yeah, I went under. I just, you know, I. I look at that roster even today, still stay under. Like there is. There aren't guys on that roster that make me say, oh, yeah, this is a 500 team that's going to be threatening for the, you know, they're going to be in the play in mix and they're going to be potentially fighting for an eight seed. I look at that roster and I don't get there.

[Bill Simmons]

They're an 11 seed, but they're 15 and 15 in a really hard conference.

[Joe House]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

And there's a feistiness. They play defense.

[Joe House]

They play defense.

[Bill Simmons]

They have a guy who's not afraid of whoever the other team star is. And I, I'm prepared to chalk that up to a Loss, that San Antonio thing, I think they'll get over 35. And they also. There's trade possibilities with them, too. You know that. I mean, there was a lot of the Darren Fox stuff started last weekend. It really should have started a month ago. You know, he's this year, he's free agent after next year. The team feels like the DeRozan thing just. It's not happening.

[Joe House]

They tried.

[Bill Simmons]

I started thinking of Fox, and the Fox stuff is so much more enticing for teams like Houston and San Antonio than Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler's 35. He's been unhappy the whole year. Fox is a different animal. Like, that's like if you're Houston and you could turn Fred Van Vliet in your picks and Terry sitting at Fox, like you're doing it. If you're San Antonio and you have a chance to add Fox to your mix and you think you can resign him and put him with Wemby and Castle and some of your swings and you just give up the picture of you have, like, you're probably thinking about that. But this is to get a top 15 guy who's a point guard who's in his prime. This is about as interesting of a trade piece as we've had. Not counting, like, when Durant suddenly becomes available, but a younger guy on his way up, like, I don't know, you thinking for D.C. we trade all your picks. No, five picks at Jordan Pool, plus seven swaps.

[Joe House]

Oh, no. It makes no sense whatsoever. And I also really sort of wonder about Fox to San Antonio because it's like, where are you? Where is it? Where do you get this season? Where are you next season?

[Bill Simmons]

It's. It's a decade play. It's not a this season play. As much as we now have a guy, we need a perimeter guy, preferably a guard, somebody who can handle his business, run the team. Playoff. Wemby, who's like a clear awesome number two. I mean, fox is about. He's a top 20 player. That's about as good of a number two as you're going to get, right? And he's available potentially. If I was the Kings, I wouldn't trade him. I would be like, no, we're not. We're keeping you. Sorry.

[Joe House]

And that makes more sense, honestly, because they're still right in the thick of things, playoff wise. I mean, you know, for sure they have a.

[Bill Simmons]

They have a DeRozan issue, though. I think they. They might have bought a car that they might have. The odometer was turned back on. Happens Sometimes it was like, I thought this car had 95,000 miles on it. Maybe it was 195,000.

[Joe House]

Where are we? I don't mean to derail it. Where are we? This week in. Jimmy Butler.

[Bill Simmons]

I think he'd been. I think he'd be gone already if there was a trade. I just don't think there's a trade. And that the most notable thing that seems to have happened the last couple, maybe the last week or so is that Houston doesn't seem interested in him. Like, they're like, we're good.

[Joe House]

That is interesting, because Washington is out there auditioning players. Valentunas Brogdon, Kyle Kuzma can't get on the floor.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I know. Kuzma being in any trade rumors is hilarious. You've been watching him.

[Joe House]

I don't.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know what his trade value is, but I'm guessing it's low.

[Joe House]

No, it's. It's. It's high because he has an incredible contract. He was like, you know what, Just a few years, 20 million bucks sounds great, man. It's an incredible contract that he signed. So he's very valuable. If you can get a version out of him and get him to be committed to playing. If you can get a version out.

[Bill Simmons]

Of him that hasn't existed for two years.

[Joe House]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

So the warriors have been mentioned with Butler, and I just. I don't know what the point is, House, because I just don't know if that's making a huge difference for them. You could talk yourself in a Curry, Draymond, and Butler, the old guys, let's make a run. But I just think the league's too good. They started out strong. They've gone the other way. They have a lot of, like, tradable pieces that have. The minutes are all over the place. Buddy healed now all of a sudden scores five points a game. Podsemski is in the same asset. So I. I don't. I don't know why Miami would want their stuff or want to pay Kaminga however much. I don't know what else you had. You had under for them, right?

[Joe House]

I had under for them, and it's because, you know, they. They had pieces that they added in the off season that were supposed to create depth, and, you know, Melton got hurt and. Yeah. But none of the pieces really move the needle. Oh, Buddy healed is only. It's. It's a shocker. Buddy Hill's only averaging five points. Like he couldn't stick in. In. In.

[Bill Simmons]

Philly needs.

[Joe House]

Yeah, Philly needs a Guy that could score from the perimeter. I feel like the Golden State situation, you know, it requires what we got with the Christmas game which was Steph Curry scoring eight points in 26 seconds and.

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Joe House]

And then they lose on a layup. And it wasn't just like a hard fought Reeves. It was Olay. It was Olay defense my man got right to come on. Come on. So they are where they are.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And there's. I think we talked about this before the year when we were trying to figure out over unders with the West. There were so many good teams. Some teams were just going to end up not being happy. And right now it's Sacramento and it's Golden State and San Antonio is a little better than we thought. Denver's a little worse than we thought. Minnesota's a little worse than we thought. But we knew it was going to be some at the NFL was way more easy to figure out this year. I think the NBA, the Celtics. You went under, I went over. And I am not going to overreact to anything with the Celtics yet you were on it a little more about how hard it is to repeat. That was part of your undercase. Right.

[Joe House]

Just in terms of like bringing that energy. They. There was, you know, all their core guys went to the Olympics except for Jaylen Brown who wasn't invited. But you know, like going from the finals to, to the Olympics to an NBA regular season and 58 wins in this era is still like excellent. So if they win 58 games and they certainly can, I still win my bet at 58 and a half or 59 and a half, whatever the total was. But it's just hard. It's a slog. And I don't begrudge them, you know, sort of going through peaks and valleys over the course of a regular season, knock on wood. There'll be plenty healthy come April. And really the only thing that was interesting to me in terms of a regular season outcome is like, is Tatum going to put himself into that MVP conversation? Is this the right moment for that even?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Well, so glass half full. Tatum and Brown are healthy athletically, physically, they seem great. Brown's little hero Bali this year. Their shooting stats are down with him a little. I haven't loved that. There's little stuff I don't love, but nothing I'm super concerned about. Like they lost to Orlando on Monday night. This depleted zombie magic team. Orlando played great. I watched the game. Like the Celtics tried hard. They played well. Orlando just played awesome. They made big shots. They, they were super feisty. They were really fighting and it was a really good game. It was an okay loss. The Philly game yesterday, that was. Philly treated it like a game seven. They came in, they really wanted to prove something. They couldn't have played harder and the Celtics couldn't match it. And you know, I'm not. I'm not worried about that either. I think Whites has been the same all month. Holiday was hurt. Porzingis keeps getting these dumb little injuries. Pritchard sometimes just doesn't show up. Yesterday he sucked. I'm not going to really evaluate the Celtics team until the west coast trip next month. That's when we'll know. All right. That's when we'll have a feeling for them. I don't love that they're four back from the Cavs, but. But yeah, that's. So those are the big NBA storylines to me is just Milwaukee's better. Like Milwaukee, I think has moved back into contender ish kind of feeling. Denver clearly needs to do something and I don't know what the fix is for them. Phoenix, I guess, is the one kind of what's going on with this team that we thought was a contender. And I just. They. It just seems like they have the worst centers in the league and they can't keep these guys in the same quarter. But. But for the most part, I don't. I don't think there's been any. Any major surprises this year other than Minnesota being as bad as. As they've been. Even though they won yesterday.

[Joe House]

Yeah. And they. They may yet figure it out. They won yesterday because, you know, Luca went out and the. When he went out, he's going to be out for an extended stretch, which is not concerning. But you know, in the west, the thing that. That makes it super hard for the teams we're talking about your Lakers, your Denver, your Golden State State warriors, your Minnesota Timberwolves. Is the early good performance by Memphis, the early good performance by the Clippers and the. And Houston. Exactly. Are anticipated. We all liked Houston. I'm surprised. Did anybody take the Houston over as a lock?

[Bill Simmons]

You. I think you and Rosillo both did.

[Joe House]

Oh, great job.

[Bill Simmons]

So yeah, the surprises were Houston, Memphis Clippers and then just san Antonio being a.500 team. I'm still not. If it's okay. I'm still a little dubious of the clippers. They're only 17 and 13.

[Joe House]

I mean, it is okay.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, they're only 17 and 13 and they put a lot on Harden. I also think the way the NBA did this NBA cup schedule combined with the Christmas schedule, which, hey, newsflash, I'm going to criticize the NBA again. I just think they've completely mangled all of this. Like, why aren't there Christmas Eve games? Why are they just punting on a day where there's no sports? Why are they punting on these days when there's clearly no sports, when instead of like they load up the Monday, there's like 14 games on Monday. You can't even watch them keep track of anything. And then Tuesday, nothing.

[Joe House]

It is weird because Christmas Eve is like such an underrated night. I went out to dinner and the place we went to was effing, popping right butts to nuts. Packed from what? When you walked in. The bar is packed. Like people want to be out. And an NBA game. Have a couple games at a bar to go with your family. Go with your family to an NBA game and then dinner, whatever. Kind of weird.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. So the reason I bring that up with the Clippers, the way they've structured this December thing, I think it's been good for the old guys, people like LeBron, Harding, Curry. You're not playing like 4 and 7, you're not playing 5 and 8. You're not having these back to backs. You're not nursing these little injuries because you're not playing that much basketball. But now we're about to hit this stretch, especially when we get to January, where the schedule just gets really hard and it's going to advantage the young guys. It's going to advantage a team like San Antonio that has Wemby and Castle and Basell and all these young dudes. And I think it's going to hurt a team like the Clippers because the amount of, the amount of offensive responsibility they're putting on Harden. I don't know if it's sustainable once we get into these 16 games in 29 days kind of territory before February. So I'm watching that. I think it's good for teams like Oklahoma City, Houston, Memphis, even a team like the Celtics that are built around two younger guys. Cleveland, you know, but then you look at a team like Orlando, 19 and 12, but really depleted. And once you're depleted and you get into these schedule things, kind of a nightmare. Milwaukee, it's good for because Giannis is an alien. Atlanta, it's good for it because they're built around all these young guys. Indiana, a team that we bet on earlier this week, I think it's good for them. So anyway, I would watch out if you had to pick A final. So who would it be?

[Joe House]

Boston? Oklahoma City?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I haven't wavered on that either.

[Joe House]

To move off of it. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Did Philly do anything yesterday that. That intrigued you? Big picture, or do you just. You're just not going to take it seriously?

[Joe House]

No, I do take it seriously and it does intrigue me. They're like, fighting hard to get an identity and that level of, like, competitiveness that they showed against the Celtics, it was good. Yeah. 7 and 3 over their last 10. They're still. The differential still isn't great, but they're, you know, still. Yeah, minus 4 net differential. They're like, they're pushing in the right direction. If they could just get, you know, two of those three guys healthy for a stretch of time. All. All. Every time. All three of them play, it's. It's an absolute bonus. But I. They're headed towards. I could see them rip something off in January, be right around 500. And then as like February turns into March, they're a couple of games above. And then they're like a real formidable playoff, though.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, we'll see. Because they have. I mean, they have a pretty. They have a wet. They have a West coast trip coming up and then a whole bunch of games in January. I mean, they just. In January, from January 1st to the 19th, they have 11 games. And that's not counting two games at the end of December, too. So, you know, the way they're constructed, there's no way Embiid's gonna play more than half of those games, I would assume. I don't love what I've seen from Paul George. I'd like to throw my voice into that chorus. Just doesn't look as comfortable. He doesn't seem 100% healthy to me, so I want to wait a month on that. But competitively, they looked really good. Caleb Martin is just like a Celtics killer at this point. I don't know what it is about Boston, but he rises to the occasion on it.

[Zoe Simmons]

So.

[Bill Simmons]

So their season looked dead. Now they're 11 and 17. The problem for them is they have no room for error.

[Joe House]

That's right. No more margin for error at all.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, like that. Like one more maxi three week ankle sprain or Embiid goes out for a month and all of a sudden you're looking at like the 10th playoff spot. Because there's teams like Chicago and Detroit haven't really gone away. And I don't know if those are trade teams or not. Everyone thinks Chicago is, but I don't. They're not gonna be able to trade Levine. Who's taking Levine at that money?

[Joe House]

Somebody desperate enough. Somebody desperate enough.

[Bill Simmons]

Maybe it's Vucevich.

[Joe House]

Sure. Yeah. I mean, you know, I'm trying to.

[Bill Simmons]

Think how they could hurt themselves. It would be one of those two guys.

[Joe House]

You're Denver and Golden States. Right. Those kinds of situations where it's like one last gasp, let's see if we can do it. Or maybe the Lakers. If the lakers keep scuffling around.500, they still have that one trade piece with the one thing that's happened, one thing.

[Bill Simmons]

That'S a little different with the Lakers is Max Christie, who looked like a zero. He's actually been pretty good for them for the last couple weeks. He's been okay. He's been passable. They can play him in crunch time. He might actually make an open shot. He can play defense a little bit. But it's, it's something they didn't have a month ago anyway. All right, that's our NBA report. We're going to take a break, come back with million dollar picks. Sometimes a basketball 30 points could be worth more than 30 points. And now you can get a 30% profit boost from the Ringer with Fanduels 30 on 30 During Friday's NBA action, we're teaming up with America's number one sportsbook to give you a 30% profit boost when you either pick a player to score more than 30 points or bet on our new exclusive 30 on 30. Special markets. Like any game, just go nuts. And looking at Friday's slate. I always tweet my picks on my Twitter account on Friday because I like to look on Friday mornings, see who's playing, see what the matchups are. You can join me, ride my picks or just make your own. Look for 30 on 30 in the FanDuel Sportsbook app or head to FanDuel.com BS for your chance to score a bigger payout this Friday. Don't miss your chance to find out how much more 30 can be worth with FanDuel's 30 on 30. And speaking of FanDuel, don't forget about the Ringer Sunday pregame show on FanDuel TV and FanDuel fast channel and on YouTube TV. Anyway, you must be 21 plus in President in select states or 18 plus in President D.C. opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See [e-mail], game prom call win 800 gambler or visit rg-help.com this episode is brought to you by Uber Reserve. You know it's a game changer for travel. Booking my ride in advance to the airport with Uber Reserve. Uber Reserve makes it easy to plan my whole trip. I just did this. Booking rides up to 90 days in advance. Hope squeeze the most out of traveling, especially if you're doing odd hours. Rush hours like early in the morning, you gotta do it. Plus, with Uber Reserve, you'll get an assigned driver, you get upfront pricing, and you get extra wait time included. So go ahead, plan like a pro. Reserve your Uber ride up to 90 days in advance. See app for details. All right, million dollar picks. We're already up house. We won $300,000 on Christmas Day thanks to the Ravens. Merry Christmas and thanks to the Chiefs. And we still have a Seahawks bet. We're taping this before the Seahawks game, but we have a Seahawks bet with Baltimore -9 and a half adjusted in the Seattle moneyline. That was +3 12. So we could be up another like 155k after tonight. I like some of the games this week. I know you already did ringer and gambling show. I didn't hear it yet because it's not up. But the big game and the hardest one to figure out in a while and I think the most even great matchup we've had all season is this Vikings packers game in Minnesota. And the Vikings, It's. It's around 11 and a half right now. It's Vikings 1 1/2. You could make really strong cases for each team. I think there's a lot of public kind of love and affection for the packers right now, which would make me a little nervous for them. Green Bay lost to them earlier in the year and Green Bay is 10 and 2 in the last 12 weeks with two Detroit losses. And people are leaning Green Bay in this house and we have to treat it like a playoff game means more to Minnesota because if they can win this, they beat Detroit next week. They're the 1 seed, right? Green Bay is pretty locked into the 5 or 6 seed. Not sure it matters. Where are you leaning on this one?

[Joe House]

I'm, I'm, I'm inclined to look at that Green Bay side mainly because of just how effective they've looked on both sides of the ball. Their defense has gotten, has just been so impressive. They're able to put pressure on opposing quarterbacks. They're still generating turnovers. There was skepticism earlier in the year. I'll put my hand up about you Know, their, their defense was producing what felt like an outsized number of turnovers, and that was the way that they were able to, to look so good defensively. But they, they, they've continued to do so, and now it looks like their offense is healthy. And now Jacobs is really, they're really, you know, leaning into that run game. And it looks like last year where Green Bay went on this run at the end of the season when Aaron Jones was finally healthy and they were.

[Bill Simmons]

He.

[Joe House]

He led the NFL over the last five weeks and into the playoffs. Aaron Jones for Green Bay in rushing. And I kind of feel like they're, they're gearing up in the same direction with, with Jacobs. It's not intended to be disrespectful in any way, shape or form towards Minnesota. I mean, is. It is the line, I think, is super fair and I think, you know, the money line is minus 108 for both teams. Like that's even. This is in the book and I think that's, that's totally appropriate. Green Bay outgained Minnesota the first time they played by. By.

[Bill Simmons]

I watched that game though. That game was over. They were up like four touchdowns. And then there was a lot of garbage time stuff with Green Bay and it, it kind of belatedly somewhat became a game, but not really.

[Joe House]

Yeah, okay.

[Bill Simmons]

But it was a lot of end of the game shit.

[Joe House]

These teams tend to split against each other. Just historically it's an important division game. So my, my lean would be Green Bay. But if the Vikings go win, like, who. Who's going to be shocked?

[Bill Simmons]

So I guess where I've landed in this game is if it was in Green Bay, I would like Green Bay. And because it's in Minnesota, I like, I like Minnesota more. I just think these teams are dead even.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And you throw in the home field. There's one other piece with Minnesota, though. First of all, I do think they're better than people realize and we've talked about this a bunch on this podcast, but they became a yeah but team. And we've had yeah but teams before that I thought was justified. Like there was that Cousins Vikings team a couple years ago that we were like, what? This team's not good. This record's ridiculous. Look who did they played. The Vikings are eight. No. With Hawkinson.

[Joe House]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

Which I think matters.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

The Vikings are sixth and dvoa Green Bay's third. The Vikings are second against the run. They're first in creating turnovers. They have a top five pass rush. But the thing I really like the most about them is these two receivers they have with Hawkinson. I always feel like they can get a drive if they need it. And if this game's in the fourth quarter in their home, I just like their chances to go down the field. Like one of one stat that I think is I saw this and I was like, how is this statistic the best total? But it is. They lead the league in least amount of percentage they've trailed. When they're on offense in the game, they've only trailed for 22% of their snaps. On offense, they've been trailing in the game, which basically means they're always ahead, they're always in charge, they're always in the lead, which is good for home. But then they also have the ability at the end of games to get a drive if they need it and to make a big play if they need it. And Green Bay is going to do cover two. Their defense actually matches up pretty good with the Vikings. But I like this Vikings team and to me it's like, if you believe in this Vikings team, you kind of have to take them this week. So if you don't, you're basically saying, I don't believe in this team.

[Joe House]

I don't know. Do we go that far?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I think this is a playoff game. I do. I think. I think this is playoff rules this week. I think we have to approach it like playoff manifesto.

[Joe House]

I don't know. I don't know if what's Green Bay, you know, doing if it really is a playoff game. Right.

[Bill Simmons]

Like I'm saying, for Minnesota, it's a playoff game. They win this game, they have a chance to be the one seed. They play Detroit. There's also conspiracy. Bill would like to enter this for one second.

[Joe House]

Go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

There's no Sunday night, week 18 NBC game. Right now. It's either Minnesota, Detroit or Rams Seattle, which we might not get if the Rams just beat Arizona this week, which we're going to have coming up in million dollar picks. The only other possibility is Minnesota to trade. But Minnesota has to win this game. And if that doesn't happen. Now we're into. Who'd you have? Carolina versus Carolina? Atlanta.

[Joe House]

Yeah. Atlanta. If Atlanta, Carolina, Atlanta Sunday night. Yeah, but that would be good because then you'd have Bryce Young against Nick Michael Pennx.

[Bill Simmons]

How is that good to have Carolina, Atlanta as the last game of the season? That's not good at all. Carolina has four wins.

[Joe House]

It would be hilarious is what it would be.

[Bill Simmons]

I just wonder.

[Joe House]

It's just funky. But Go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

I just wonder, do they this Minnesota get some calls in this game?

[Joe House]

Well, they will be at home. They'll get home calls. You expect for sure. I, I don't. You know, this one is just a stay away because it's, it's, it's not. You don't get any, I don't get any value out of your can't stay away.

[Bill Simmons]

This is, we have a big little nest egg of million dollar picks and this is the best game in a while. We have to put a bet on it.

[Joe House]

Go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

Let me give you something that I thought was interesting. Green Bay since week five, they're nine and two with two Detroit losses, right?

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Here's who they beat Matthew Stafford in week five with no puka, no cup.

[Joe House]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

Kyler Murray, C.J. stroud. No Collins in that game. Trevor Lawrence barely beat him. He had his best game of the year. He threw for 300 plus yards against them. They won by three. Caleb Williams. They were up, Chicago's up the whole game and should have won. And then Green Bay won it late. Brandon Allen on San Francisco, TUA on cold weather on Thursday night. Thanksgiving, Geno Smith and whatever the fuck was going on with the New Orleans quarterbacks last week. Those are all their wins. They haven't played anything remotely approaching. Sam Darnold, Hawkinson, Addison and Jefferson and Aaron Jones. This is by far the best complete offense they've played.

[Joe House]

Now Minnesota, I know Minnesota is the.

[Bill Simmons]

Same thing, but I'm saying you can't use that case against Minnesota and then not use it against Green Bay.

[Joe House]

Well, I think they're in very similar positions because this is a gigantic step up in class for Minnesota. Minnesota's defense hasn't seen anything like this. Green Bay offense. Look at these offenses that Minnesota has seen since they lost to the Rams in week six or seven, whatever it was. They played the Colts with Anthony Richardson, they played the Jaguars, they played the Titans, they played the Bears, they played Kyler and the Cardinals, which was a huge comeback game. Right. The Cardinals were up. That should have been a Cardinals win.

[Bill Simmons]

Not a great Vikings game.

[Joe House]

They got Kirk Cousins and the Falcons in his triumphant return to Minnesota, which ended his career in Atlanta and maybe his career in NFL football. And the Bears and the Seahawks, the best game, the best win was going into Seattle and going coming down to the wire.

[Bill Simmons]

And that's the irony of this. Both teams most impressive winning the last like two and a half months with Seattle, who also might not be good.

[Joe House]

Well, they're kind of like they're getting Fighting for a playoff spot. But yes, yes, if we're going to do that, we have to do it for both. Both teams. And the interesting thing to me, you made the case for Minnesota's offense looking good. You want them with the ball at the end of the game. I think it's, I would say the exact same thing about Green Bay. It's. To me, it's not that dissimilar from the handicapping of that 30s Thursday night Detroit Green Bay game where it came down to which team had the ball at the end.

[Bill Simmons]

It's a great game.

[Joe House]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't, I don't think there's a wrong answer. I just feel like people have tilted more toward the packers and I feel like it's dead even. And I think, well, Minnesota was favored. Well, they're even though -1/2 is their home.

[Joe House]

But I'm just thinking Green Bay.

[Bill Simmons]

Green bay would be -1 and a half over Minnesota.

[Joe House]

True. But, but like the public hasn't jumped in yet with, with, with a big perspective.

[Bill Simmons]

So you're thinking it's a stay away.

[Joe House]

I mean, if you want to put something small in it so that you can say we did it and it's fun and then Minnesota wins. It's like excellent. Now we have Minnesota and Detroit in Week 18 for the one seed. That would be awesome.

[Bill Simmons]

So we're taping this at 11:17 Pacific Time.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

December 26th, Thursday.

[Joe House]

True.

[Bill Simmons]

The line is completely flipped. It's now Green Bay minus one and a half over Minnesota.

[Joe House]

So somebody stepped in. That's a syndicate play.

[Bill Simmons]

That's a syndicate play. So the line moved three points and now it's Minnesota minus 102 plus 1 plus 1.5 and Green Bay minus 116.

[Joe House]

Somebody's taking a stand.

[Bill Simmons]

Does that make you nervous or what?

[Joe House]

I honestly think that we're going to see one or two more of these over the course of the next two, two days. I bet. I, you know, the rivals.

[Bill Simmons]

So you think Green Bay is going to get to minus two and a half?

[Joe House]

No, I think somebody will come back in on the. In the other direction and you know, it'll. It's going to flip again.

[Bill Simmons]

Vikings being plus one and a half means they're now in tease territory.

[Joe House]

Yeah. That is you, you would want to do it right away. Right away.

[Bill Simmons]

We can do it right away. We're taping million dollar picks as we speak.

[Joe House]

Good point.

[Bill Simmons]

Any interest in throwing them in with the Miami Dolphins in Cleveland?

[Joe House]

There's going to be rain.

[Bill Simmons]

Miami down to Miami down or we could basically do. Yeah. Tease my. What is Miami? Six and a half.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Two and a half. Tease Miami down to Moneyline and do Miami plus seven and a half.

[Joe House]

The only thing that would concern me about the Miami situation.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, there's a lot of things that concern me. I don't know. You're going to go. The only.

[Joe House]

The single most prominent is if DTR anything happens to him at quarterback. What I want to see is where Jameis is listed in terms of.

[Bill Simmons]

Did you read I was on Brown's Reddit today, which is one of the darkest places. Absolutely brutal. There's even. On Brown's Reddit. There's even. Should we make a run at Kirk Cousins this off season?

[Joe House]

No.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. That's a thread on Brown's Reddit.

[Joe House]

Oh, my God.

[Bill Simmons]

It's dark, man. It's some of the darkest shit you'll see. But Brown's Reddit was saying that apparently Jameis is hurt, too. And if anything happens with dtr, it's Bailey Zappy time.

[Joe House]

Oh, well, now I'm feeling better. Okay, now we can do Miami. Fine. Now we're good.

[Bill Simmons]

It's Bailey Zappi, injured Jameis, or it's DTR who has one touchdown and nine career picks.

[Joe House]

Well, I thought they already said that DTR is going to start. My concern was that DTR would start, something would happen to him, and then Jamis would come in and start playing.

[Bill Simmons]

Not 100% healthy, though.

[Joe House]

Well, I. I mean, I just need to make. I want certainty that Jameis will not come in, because if Jameis comes in, then I feel like that's a fair game.

[Bill Simmons]

For some reason you're worried about Jameis. I. To me, it's. I'm not worried about Cleveland's offense in this game. I'm worried about the Dolphins in the rain just doing a. I understand. Classic Dolphins stink bomb.

[Joe House]

We don't have to put them in a teaser. I mean, there's another Good legs. Dallas is a pretty good teaser leg.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, the reason I brought them up for a teaser is just, you know, at some point these teams, the franchises are kind of steering them toward a top five pick. Right. I don't think the Giants want to win. The Raiders are stupid. They couldn't help themselves last week. But there's certain teams that I just feel like are good with not winning another game.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And Cleveland to me, feels like one of them. Like if you're Cleveland, Bailey Zappi is the move. This week we had Bailey Zappi on the Pats. He is not a Competent quarterback. You want to put him out against Miami next week. You want to bench like or you want to rest like a defensive starter who's a little banged up like you. There's subtle stuff you can do to make sure you don't win again. Because for sure, because there's a couple like Tennessee plays Jacksonville. Both Those teams are 3 and 12. One of them are going to be 4 and 13 after 4 and 12 after that game. So Cleveland can jump up a spot there. The Pats might beat the Chargers for all we know. Like, they. They might be able to nudge up. Yeah, that was what I was thinking about. And plus, Miami really needs the game. They're still in the playoff race.

[Joe House]

Yeah, still in the race for sure.

[Bill Simmons]

So maybe. Cause I have another tease I want to do with the two LA teams.

[Joe House]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

So maybe we'll mark down something with Vikings Dolphins just for fun. Next one. And I'm split on this one, too. Is Bengals Broncos. You said on the ringer gambling show that you like cincy at home -3 in what's going to be bad weather. They're kind of technically alive still. Denver needs a game. This is weirdly a playoff game in some ways.

[Joe House]

Right? Right. No, I think both teams will treat it like a playoff game. And this is exactly why my handicap is in favor of the Cincinnati Bengals. It's why I prefer the Bengals. I like the team with the players that have actually, like, played in the playoffs, the team that doesn't have the rookie quarterback and, you know, Bo Nix Deez nuts. They have been. They have been throwing the football all over the place. And we're seeing the version of him that kind of makes sense. Right?

[Bill Simmons]

He's.

[Joe House]

He's throwing picks, multiple picks every week. Bo Nix these nuts and the. The Denver Broncos. The only thing would be with their defense. They're getting Riley Moss back. So they. They had two of their last three games. They gave up. They gave up 32 points to James. They gave up 34 points to Justin Herbert. Their secondary was getting eaten up. If Riley Moss comes back and they. And he's able to go up against Jamar Chase, that's an incredible matchup. But I love all the other weapons that Cincinnati Moss is back.

[Bill Simmons]

By the way, I was checking my buddy Gus. My buddy Gus who. My only person in my life who truly knows the Broncos and he was telling me when Moss got hurt, we're in major trouble. This guy Levi Wallace is a disaster.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Levi Wallace has been cut, released. He's not even on the team anymore.

[Joe House]

So long.

[Bill Simmons]

Levi Moss is back. So I feel like that. I know it's one guy, but I really feel like that's going to flip their secondary.

[Joe House]

He's an injury. He's one guy. Let there be no doubt.

[Bill Simmons]

There's some other cases for them. Do you have more on your case? Because I was. No, that's it.

[Joe House]

I'll stop now. I mean, Cincinnati hasn't been good at home, so I, I prefer to not lay any points at all. Just let them, you know, win the game. Cincinnati moneyline was my preferred play last six weeks.

[Bill Simmons]

Denver's fifth in dvoa despite some of the secondary stuff and despite some of the turnovers by Knicks. Cincinnati's 29th against the run. Their defense, Cincinnati's 30th QB hits. So basically this is the perfect team for Denver to play with Bo Nicks with the way kind of how up and down they've been. This is a team that will not pressure him, hit him. They're just not going to do anything. Denver's defense, they're, you know, first in hits, first in hurries. They're going to be able to pressure the, the Bengals offensive line. Not exactly like a juggernaut.

[Joe House]

Nope, nope. I mean, you know, a strat, a strip sack fumble last week against the Browns, that, that helped me lose a nice teaser bet on, on the Cincinnati team. Total, Bella was 24.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, then the Dallas game the week before. Dallas was going to beat them.

[Joe House]

Yeah, right. Dallas is going to be Dallas pressuring.

[Bill Simmons]

Them and doing stuff. So I look at Cincy's wins. Here are the quarterbacks. Have you done this? No quarterback Cincy beat this year. Andy Dalton, Danny Dimes, Deshaun Watson and Thompson Robinson. Same game because I think that was one. Watson got hurt. Minshew Cooper Rush, Will Levis, Thompson Robinson. It's not great. I don't think Cincy's good is where I'm really landing. And I think we think they're good cause Burrow's good. No other real aspect of their team is good other than the receivers and Burrow. Now you can make the counter case when they have Chase and Higgins together with Burrow. They've just been really good and been able to move the ball. I get it. But I kind of like the Denver +3.

[Joe House]

I don't mind the points. I really don't mind grabbing the points. And there was a minute when it was three and a half and that got stashed up. So it's down, down to three and I really do kind of understand the case it's, it's a, it's a rookie quarterback on the road in bad weather game. Right.

[Bill Simmons]

In bad weather.

[Joe House]

But to if you want to argue the other side. They've been good on the road. The Denver's been good on the road this year. They beat Tampa in Tampa. They beat the jets in New York.

[Bill Simmons]

Ten days rest.

[Joe House]

Yeah. Extra rest for Sean.

[Bill Simmons]

Nine days rest. Where they play Saturday.

[Joe House]

It's extra rest for them and short rest for Cincy. Cause Cincy's on Saturday game.

[Bill Simmons]

Sean Payton versus Zach Taylor.

[Joe House]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, Zach Taylor did market it down.

[Joe House]

Did coach in the Super Bowl.

[Bill Simmons]

This one. This one. I love the all LA money parlay.

[Joe House]

Yes. This is wonderful. Great.

[Bill Simmons]

Rams home for the Cardinals. All the Rams have to do is win. And they win the win the NFC West Chargers at the Pats. All they have to do is win. They're minus four and a half and there's some subtle cases against them. Right. Their offense isn't that good. They have trouble getting first downs. It's the type of team like even if they had a lead Drake May in the second half like doing stuff. There's a lad McConkey piece that I don't think can be undersold with the fact that the Pats had that pick traded back three spots for a guy who basically doesn't play who had played three snaps. Makaki's just him running amok in this game is almost a lock. I don't know what the player props are for him but Chargers need the game. Rams need the game.

[Joe House]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

And it feel, it just feels like a classic LA money parlay. And it's minus 114 on FanDuel and I would like to partake.

[Joe House]

Well, let me ask you this. Let's go ahead and do that and let's do it in a meaningful increment because we both are believers and that's some fantastic. I mean, you know the, the other sort of side to this. Remember how good favorites have been. Moneyline favorites have been absolutely crushing this season. Favorites 75% since week five in terms of outright wins. And, and favorites have been covering it nearly like 56 or 57% since week five. Like both of those are. You look back 25, 30 years and then those rates are all the way up there. So we're just doing the thing that's staring us in the face that helped us make money last week, helped us make money on Christmas. We're going to make some more money on Saturday. But I want to just add another wrinkle let's go ahead and do whatever you want on that. Rams, Chargers. We have to put the Colts in. Colts have to be a leg in every moneyline parlay that we do. Every really any kind of combination. The Colts have to be in every one of them. Just on the money line. Colts beating the Giants outright has to be an element of it.

[Bill Simmons]

Well that. And that goes back. I had the Colts. That goes back to what we talked about earlier which is certain teams are just done winning games this season.

[Joe House]

The New York Giants are one of.

[Bill Simmons]

The Giants are like I assume we're out. We are done.

[Joe House]

We are done.

[Bill Simmons]

You had them in the ringer Sunday pregame last year or last.

[Joe House]

Last week. Yeah. And I, I was choosing. It was dumb. I had already chosen Carolina as my underdog.

[Bill Simmons]

It was, it was plus 350. It was right.

[Joe House]

That's.

[Bill Simmons]

You do within a quarter it's like, oh, the Giants are done for the season.

[Joe House]

The pick, the Drew lock pick six. That was it. That was it. That was the end.

[Bill Simmons]

So are you saying we anchor strategy a little bit with Chargers, Rams. Oh, anchor strategy. Okay.

[Joe House]

To me the anchor is the Colts because I'll put the Colts with anybody the entire.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah but that. Here's. Here's what makes me nervous about that. I Anthony Richardson, I just can't get there. If there's any quarterback who's ready to just single handedly kill all of our week 17 parlays and teasers, it's him. So I just want to proceed with caution.

[Joe House]

Think about that. Like him. Not Michael Penix last week, but Anthony Richard Richardson this week.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Couple things with that Rams game really quick. Rams are sixth in DVOA last six weeks thanks to Aaron Shots for that they won eight of their last 10. And I don't think people realize how grim this Cardinal situation got. Missing both of their starting tackles on offense. They're like they're pulling practice squads in practice squad guys in that are now going to be starting for them. James Conner is hurt. Might play, might not play. Their defense is falling apart. Hubbard had 152 yards last week. Carolina scored 36 on them.

[Joe House]

Sure did.

[Bill Simmons]

It just is grim and there's a reason the line is where it is and cause initially I was like oh cards upset baby. And I looked at all the number, I was like oh my God, this is no way they're winning.

[Joe House]

Layer on top of that all of the McVeigh stuff. 15, 2 against the spread in his last 17 December games, 25, 10 and 1 all time in December. McVeigh the Rams against the Cardinals. The Rams kick The Cardinals ass 12, 4 and 1 against the spread over the last eight years. Against Arizona 10, 2 and 1 when they're a favorite against the spread. The LA Rams, I'm laying the points with them. They're in the moneyline parlay. They are part of our anchor strategy. We love the Rams. Their defense also kicking ass. Last two weeks held both the jets and the 49ers under 10 points. Now you say, oh, look at where those well, offenses to the most disappointing teams in the NFL. But still holding NFL teams on the road to under 10 points. That's impressive.

[Bill Simmons]

Chargers Pats. The case for being nervous about this would be the Pats played well against Buffalo for about an hour and a half last week. I would just point you to 10. Horribly game managed, coached, executed plays. They can't help themselves. They, they surprisingly did not have a lot of penalties last week. Those penalties will come back. The Pats are just incapable of playing three good hours in a row. So for them to beat the Chargers, the Chargers would really have to fuck the game up. And I don't know if they're a fuck the game up team.

[Joe House]

I mean that would be. You would have Jared Mayo beating Jim Harbaugh.

[Bill Simmons]

You would have that. You would have a team that would decide in week 17. Maybe we shouldn't throw backward passes inside our own 10. Maybe we should punt down 10 with 8 minutes left. Like I. Something would have to dramatically change with the penalties, the coaching, the execution. I could see them potentially backdoor covering that minus four and a half, but I do not see them winning.

[Joe House]

Yeah, good. We're on the same page.

[Bill Simmons]

All right. And then the last one I want to talk about, you mentioned the, the Colts, Giants. I mean, we don't need to talk about that. Eagles, Cowboys. That line has dropped too. It was not. It was ten, nine and a half all week. Now it's seven and a half on FanDuel. And I had had a bet that I mailed you last night or this morning.

[Joe House]

Oh, hold on. I see six and a half.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh shit, it's dropping. Huh?

[Joe House]

Something's going on.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, six and a half. Well, Hertz might not play is what's going on.

[Joe House]

Oh, okay. There we go. And I had enough uncertainty.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. I had wanted to do an alternate. Alternate bet with Dallas to four and a half. When it was nine and a half it was like plus one. 72. That's now plus one. 26, which I still like more than the six and a half. But. So if we had the Cowboys and we do an over of like, what, 37 and a half? I don't know. What are you thinking?

[Joe House]

The total's at 39 and a half in that game as it is. I. I don't. I'm. I'm worried.

[Bill Simmons]

What are you worried about?

[Joe House]

Just messing with that game. At all? At all? Like. Yeah. What.

[Bill Simmons]

What do you think all the value's gone because of the Hertz thing?

[Joe House]

Yes. Yes, that's exactly what I think. I would have loved Dallas. I love Dallas at eight and a half. I loved him at nine and a half. The ten was an incredible number. Now down to six and a half. I kind of don't want to mess with it because Philly got enough with Pickett of like, he. Like, he. Pickett can play now, right? He got three quarters of real live NFL football. High stakes, high leverage, and they'll run an offense.

[Bill Simmons]

What are you doing right now? I'm not making a Kenny Pickett case.

[Joe House]

No.

[Bill Simmons]

What?

[Joe House]

It's just like Philly being ready for the game, case. That's. That's what I mean. That's all I'm saying. He's not a guy. That's like playing with the first team starters for the first time in practice this week. That's all. That's all the observation that I'm making. I have had enormous success riding with the Cowboys, and I'm so upset that they lost to Cincinnati on that Monday night. Stupid punt thing.

[Bill Simmons]

Their defense since Parsons has come back has been legit good. And their secondary is legit good.

[Joe House]

Legit good.

[Bill Simmons]

So I couldn't interest you in Dallas plus 10 and a half with the over of 30 and a half at minus 115.

[Joe House]

Oh, well, sure. That. Yes, yes. Because now we're talking that. That's. Those are the numbers. Okay, great. Yeah, I'm into that. That's a good one.

[Bill Simmons]

Or Dallas. Yeah. Because I don't want to tease Dallas with another team. I want to confine it to the game.

[Joe House]

Great. Good. Me either. That's fine.

[Bill Simmons]

Dallas.

[Joe House]

Dallas, like, nothing better than the go beat. Philly.

[Bill Simmons]

Dallas plus ten and a half with the over of thirty and a half.

[Joe House]

And Philly's done. Right. They don't. There's. There's no. Nothing for them to play for.

[Bill Simmons]

I think it would be insane for them to play Jalen Hurts. I don't agree why they would do that at all.

[Joe House]

I totally agree with you. I agree.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, it's time. Million dollar picks, part two, holiday week. We're already up $300,000. Plus we have this Seahawks bet coming that we could win. All the Seahawks have to do is win on Thursday night. And we're up another. Come on, Gina.

[Joe House]

Come on, Gina.

[Bill Simmons]

Our big bet. We are doing an all LA parlay, the LA Rams to finish business against a Cards team that is arrow pointing down. Rams have been really good last six weeks. Rams just to beat the Cardinals just to beat them. That's it. Just all they have to do is win the game. Parlayed with the LA Chargers in New England against my beloved New England Patriots, who are feisty but are incapable of playing well for three straight hours. Chargers, Rams just have to win. Minus 114 house. Are we going big?

[Joe House]

We love LA and by the way, we love it.

[Bill Simmons]

I've somehow figured out a way to make to be more furious that the Pats won this game and knocked themselves out of a top five pick. If I don't want Pets to win anymore, let's just get weapons. Let's finish in the top two and then we can trade back for a team that needs a quarterback and get a lot of assets from my guy, Drake May. Please don't win this game. Pats, we're putting $250,000 on that. Chargers Rams minus 114. We talked a lot about Bengals versus Denver in Cincinnati in the rain. Cincy minus 3. Cincy with no good wins whatsoever. Cincy, a team that just loves to shoot themselves in the foot. I'm going to take adjusted Broncos plus seven and a half.

[Joe House]

Oh, okay.

[Bill Simmons]

And I'm going to put that with the Chargers and the Rams for 50K. That's + 169. House.

[Joe House]

That's fine. So you want to be in business? You want to be in business with Bo Nix? D's nuts. I'm not going to get away.

[Bill Simmons]

So Sean Payton, Denver secondary is good again. Like just a little sprinkle.

[Joe House]

Love it.

[Bill Simmons]

Two more that we like the Cowboys going against this Eagles team that Jalen hurts. We know what's happening. The line is dropping as we're taping the pot. On Thursday morning, the line dropped from nine and a half to six and a half for the Cowboys plus six and a half. We're going to bring them back up to Cowboys plus 10 and a half with the over 30 and a half. Minus 115. 100k.

[Joe House]

That's fine. I mean, if you want to do smaller, that's fine, too.

[Bill Simmons]

50K. Let's just put 50k. All right, 50k in there.

[Joe House]

Just a little division, divisional rivalry. It'll be Fun. Philly hates Dallas. It'll be great. I mean, Dallas has been playing so good over the last six weeks.

[Bill Simmons]

The Parsons effect.

[Joe House]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

Michael Parsons, the only guy with a podcast is playing. Well, they're gonna only athlete is actually succeeding at sports these days.

[Joe House]

Jerry might have to buy that podcast for $250 million so they could afford to pay him and keep him under the salary.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. What would happen if Jerry formed a media company and then just paid $100 million for the Michael Parsons podcast? That would be interesting. Interesting idea.

[Joe House]

It's a collective bargaining agreement violation, I'm sure, but still.

[Bill Simmons]

Last one. Colts against the Giants. We both love the Colts.

[Joe House]

We do love the Colts.

[Bill Simmons]

The Giants do not want to win football games anymore.

[Joe House]

They do not.

[Bill Simmons]

They have told us they're done. It's a wrap.

[Joe House]

It's a wrap.

[Bill Simmons]

Colts first half game. They have to win the first half. They have to win the game. Combined with the Vikings plus seven and a half because we have to have some sort of scratch on this incredible Vikings Green Bay game. And we argue about. You like Green Bay a little bit more. I like the Vikings a little bit. The line has shifted. It was Vikings minus one half all week. As we're taping this, it's Green Bay minus one and a half. Now we're going to grab those Viking points, bring them up to plus 7 and a half. That is minus 113. I would like to put 100k in that if we could. Okay.

[Joe House]

Okay, fine. I don't mind rooting for a close game between Minnesota and Green Bay. That's fun.

[Bill Simmons]

And then we also have this Dolphins game that we can completely stay away from. Dolphins against the Browns in the rain. Some Bailey, Zappi potential. Also two in bad weather. Dolphins need the game. Probably a stay away.

[Joe House]

I think it's a stay away.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay. I'm fine staying away from the Dolphins.

[Joe House]

Good.

[Bill Simmons]

So that's it. And we should mention one of the reasons I like Minnesota is because the NFL needs a very good week 18 Sunday night game in Minnesota. Detroit would do the trick. Collins worth. They'd have to hose him down.

[Joe House]

Well, I can't wait.

[Bill Simmons]

I haven't seen anything like this.

[Joe House]

We got him with my guy. Jaden Daniels and Michael Penck this coming Sunday night. Atlanta in Washington. 8:30 on NBC prime time. Jaden against the Penck. We're going to see.

[Bill Simmons]

Notice, notice. We steered clear of that game. That is a stay way. I wish you the best.

[Joe House]

Thank you.

[Bill Simmons]

Anyway, we are up 1.764 million for the season pending The Seahawks game. And hopefully the LA parlay will take us over the 2 million bark. Those are the holiday edition part. 2 million dollar picks for week 17. House, I hope you ate a lot yesterday.

[Joe House]

I did. If we hit this la parlay when I'm out there two weeks for the ringer pregame show, we'll celebrate with an.

[Bill Simmons]

La parlay of the la parlay of food.

[Joe House]

Yeah, we'll go to Momofuku for lunch and then where we're gonna go for dinner.

[Bill Simmons]

I have like a smash.

[Joe House]

I meant major domo.

[Bill Simmons]

I have a smash burger place for you.

[Joe House]

All right.

[Bill Simmons]

I have an Indian food place for you. Ooh, I have some wrinkles for this trip. Can you do salads for the week before you get here?

[Joe House]

I'll try my best.

[Bill Simmons]

You gotta, like, really clear the intestines. I have a plan for you.

[Joe House]

I can't wait.

[Bill Simmons]

House, great to see you. Happy belated Christmas.

[Joe House]

Happy holidays to all.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, we are taping this the day after Christmas. It's an emotional time here on the BS Pod. My daughter, Zoe Simmons is here. We're doing the end of the year Teen Culture Awards, which I think we've done every year for the last few years. We might have missed one. You've been doing this since, I don't know, you were 12, 13, something like that. But this is the Last year you're 19. Next year you're not a teenager.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. No awards for next year. Really appreciate this one while you have it.

[Bill Simmons]

No, we'll call it the 20something awards next year.

[Zoe Simmons]

And I feel like it retires itself at that point.

[Bill Simmons]

You're hanging it up. What's going to happen to you?

[Zoe Simmons]

Culture Awards.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, so we're going to turn.

[Zoe Simmons]

In a new leaf. This is it.

[Bill Simmons]

So we call it the Young Woman Awards. What do we call it?

[Zoe Simmons]

The Young Woman Awards? I think not.

[Bill Simmons]

Young Adult Awards.

[Zoe Simmons]

We'll see if it figures itself out next year. For now, this is looking like it.

[Bill Simmons]

Thanks for putting no thought into that. All right, so end of the year awards. We have a whole bunch of categories. I'm just going to set you up. Most important category every year is the TV show of the year. What was it this year?

[Zoe Simmons]

This year we selected Tell Me Lies as my TV show for the year. Reason being, this is probably the most emotional a show has ever made me.

[Bill Simmons]

Why?

[Zoe Simmons]

Because it kind of depicts perfectly, like a super toxic college relationship. I think it struck a chord within a lot of people my age, especially as a college student. And the show actually casted people that look like the age that they're supposed to be playing.

[Bill Simmons]

So that's a big thing for you.

[Zoe Simmons]

That for me, that's the most important. The most important thing that a TV show can do. The people on the show have to look like the age that they're trying to play. Like that actually makes it a much more emotionally difficult situation.

[Bill Simmons]

Like sex lives and college girls. I'm not sure those girls look like college girls.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, I haven't even watched it yet because I've seen the cast and it's just like, this doesn't look like people that I'd be running into in my ethics class next week. Like, this is not. These people are like the older people coming back to college trying to figure it out.

[Bill Simmons]

So tell me lies. There's a lot of sex in it. Let's be honest. It's not a show I would watch with you. That's okay.

[Zoe Simmons]

That's for sure. That's for sure. But with my girlfriends, my best friend from college, my roommate, we would sit there and wait for each episode to come out every week and watch it together with our, like, headphones individually and our computers and just like completely jaw on the floor every single time.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, wait. Cause you don't have a tv.

[Zoe Simmons]

We don't have a tv.

[Bill Simmons]

So we press play at the same time.

[Zoe Simmons]

We, like, sync it up. But it was, I mean, jaw dropping every single episode. It just. It got so crazy. But the manipulation of the main character, Steven, that he does to. To his little girlfriend Lucy is like. He almost makes you think that you're crazy because of how good of a manipulator he is. But the show is incredible. And that was made true with, like, all the attention it got on TikTok, and they actually renewed it after they were going to cancel it before it got all the.

[Bill Simmons]

It did get pretty much canceled. Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

So TikTok really saved this show this year.

[Bill Simmons]

Can you explain how TikTok saves a show? Because this is. And there's some other parts that we're gonna talk about later with this, but TikTok taking a show either in a good way or a bad way, it's.

[Zoe Simmons]

Weird because now that social media is such a prominent thing, even a shitty TV show can become super popular. Even a shitty song, like, no matter what it is, if people will ban behind it, that's what makes a song or show successful. Now I've been talking about it a lot with my friends, and it feels like a lot of producers of TV shows and song makers or whatever it is, they're trying to appeal to the social media eye rather than the critics or the other people that actually, like, establish whether a show or a music video is good enough. It's more about, like, if you get the TikTok people behind you, that will make you successful.

[Bill Simmons]

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

[Zoe Simmons]

I mean, it's definitely made the content that's being put out there worse.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

Because it's catered to all of these people that like have short attention spans or whatever it is. But this show caters exactly to people like me who found it through TikTok. I didn't even know about the show until I saw a little clip of it on TikTok and then I binged through the whole thing.

[Bill Simmons]

It checks a lot of Zoe boxes, including we go back and forth in the future and everybody's older and younger.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, I like a little time sequence.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

But the show is phenomenal. It was easily my top number one show this year. I think as a college student, that really was what hit home for me.

[Bill Simmons]

So that's great. So like, when I was in college, 90210 hit home with all of us, which was a relatively normal show. You're saying for your generation, a super toxic guy fucking with all these different people on the show. This has really resonated with your generation.

[Zoe Simmons]

That sort of thing has never been depicted. And it also uses social media as a tactic of manipulation that the main character uses, which a lot of TV shows don't incorporate. Social media. Yeah, it's kind of like a blacklisted. Like you can't do it because that will take the characters out of the show, whatever. But people like me, we're always on our phones. Like, it's not realistic to have a TV show that doesn't incorporate like the use of manipulative text messages or Snapchats or whatever it is. And like this show actually. Or non texting or ghosted or being ghosted. So it's like this is the most realistic depiction of like a. A toxic college relationship, which is why I loved it so much.

[Bill Simmons]

Do you think you like toxic relationship shows because all of your relationships have been non toxic and pretty normal?

[Zoe Simmons]

I think so. It's like, oh, this is what it's like. But I know it hit home for a lot of people.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay, all right, so that's TV show of the year. Favorite content of the year. Do you want me to read the list?

[Zoe Simmons]

And you could just go.

[Bill Simmons]

So some of this has to do with shows you binged because you like binging Shows you like, either you're doing homework while a show's on.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, I like white noise shows is how I'd put it.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, number one is the Gilmore Girls, which you finally stumbled into. What was it about this show?

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, I always. I stayed away from it because I knew I would love it. I tried to start it a few different times and was kind of bored while watching it. But this year, again, my roommate was like, you need to watch this show. You will love it. So I sat myself down and I watched the first season. The first season wasn't the most interesting because Rory, the main character, was like a fresh high schooler in New Haven, Connecticut. And I was like, what is this? This is not my jam at all. But then as the show continues on, it kind of just. It feels like a warm hug is how I describe it. I think a lot of Gilmore Girls lovers would describe the show as just like a warm, comforting. Like when you're in need of feeling like you're around family or you just need your spirits uplifted, that's where you go.

[Bill Simmons]

Mom daughter show.

[Zoe Simmons]

Mom daughter show. Which.

[Bill Simmons]

What would be your mom daughter show?

[Zoe Simmons]

Just ours would be a lot more realistic. Thing about Gilmore Girls is, like, it's supposed to be a perfect world. And Lorelai had Rory when she was like 16 years old. So there's a really short age gap between them, which makes their relationship more like sister to sister. But the show itself is incredible. It's definitely unrealistic, but it kept me interested for seven seasons each episode.

[Bill Simmons]

Didn't it stay too long, though? The last two seasons were not great, right? Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

I mean, some parts could have been cut out, but honestly, the last two seasons were my favorites because Roy was in college, going through college, which once again, is my favorite form of TV show when the main character is going through college and she was having boyfriends and all these different things and whatever. So I actually liked the show as it progressed, but I loved Gilmore Girls just as something to fall back on when college days were getting hard.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, one other binge watch show was this is Us.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yep, this is us.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't like when you watch shows that are sad because you assume the mood of whatever the show is.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Which thank God you didn't assume the mood of Tell Me Lies.

[Zoe Simmons]

But.

[Bill Simmons]

But this is Us. Like, it's an emotional journey. So you were kind of an emotional person as you watched this.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, but this is different. I don't think it was a Grey's Anatomy Covid situation where I was just completely Put out and, like, unable to, like, act every day. This show definitely hits the. Hits the heartstrings, but in a good way. I loved this show, this. It kept me interested and it was so unrealistic to the point where I almost wasn't emotionally affected by it because it's like, when would this ever happen ever?

[Bill Simmons]

Right. Okay, next one. The Unfiltered Podcast.

[Zoe Simmons]

This is one of your favorites, basically.

[Bill Simmons]

Unfiltered.

[Zoe Simmons]

It was the merging of two different podcasts that I really like on Spotify. The Unfiltered podcast is hosted by Zayn, Hijazi and Heath. They were, like two of David Dobrik's best friends who kind of diverged and made a podcast. And then the other one was pretty basic, hosted by Remy Cruz and Alicia Marie. And they, like, joined forces and made this podcast altogether. So that's what it is.

[Bill Simmons]

But what do you like about it? You're not telling us anything.

[Zoe Simmons]

We don't know who these people are. Explaining what it was.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, Remy Cruz has a salad that you pointed out to me when we were walking around la.

[Zoe Simmons]

A tuna bowl, a salmon bowl. But I've loved all of these YouTubers. It's like more of a nostalgic thing for me because I've watched them since I was 13, ever since I started watching YouTube. And they joined forces and they have a Patreon page, which I really love. And they'll go and do, like, they'll film a high episode or a mukbang episode or them, like, going to, like, on Halloween time. They went to the Halloween, like, scare fest. Whatever. It's just like a really fun, airy, light podcast where it's kind of like girls versus boys, and they'll do challenges and stuff, but it's just easy to watch. I like it.

[Bill Simmons]

Videopod.

[Zoe Simmons]

Videopod.

[Bill Simmons]

We Live In Time is the next one on the list. I don't even know what that one is.

[Zoe Simmons]

That was the movie that came out.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, the cancer movie.

[Zoe Simmons]

Andrew Garfield and Florence Pugh. I loved this movie. I saw this, like, a month or two ago. Needless to say, I think mom will watch it like 15 times once she finds it. But it was. It was great. I love Andrew Garfield. I love Florence Pugh. I love a British accent. Everything about the movie was phenomenal.

[Bill Simmons]

I tried to watch this movie with the two of you and left after like, 40 minutes.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. Which I don't know why, because it was also a cooking movie, which is like, that's everything that I need. Cancer cooking. Andrew Garfield, British accent.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm in wow, that's your algorithm. I skipped that one. Blink twice. Channing Tatum.

[Zoe Simmons]

This was great. Did you see this one?

[Bill Simmons]

I did.

[Zoe Simmons]

I really loved this movie because I'm a big psychological thriller person. I prefer that much more. You love get out is a slide.

[Bill Simmons]

Timer for you, right?

[Zoe Simmons]

Like, I love Get Out. I love all those types of movies. So this one I thought was phenomenal. And I love when a movie takes me on a vacation.

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Zoe Simmons]

This movie was on a great resort. Things kind of started to get weird. We didn't exactly know why. It kind of revealed itself. Channing Tatum's gorgeous. It was a beautiful combo of things. I loved this movie.

[Bill Simmons]

Speaking of going on vacation, you did a white Lotus rewatch that you put on favorite content of the year, even.

[Zoe Simmons]

Though you'd already seen the show a hundred times. And I would watch it again and again. I think this is the single best TV show series ever.

[Bill Simmons]

Ever.

[Zoe Simmons]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

The goat.

[Zoe Simmons]

To me, I think it's.

[Bill Simmons]

Granted, you've missed a lot of great TV shows. You didn't watch Sopranos. You didn't watch Mad Men, Breaking Bad.

[Zoe Simmons]

I said to me. I didn't say to anyone else, this is.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm just saying there's some beat on the bottom.

[Zoe Simmons]

This is my number one. And rewatching it back, all of the little details and the things that I missed the first time I watched it, it's like, wow, this show is phenomenal.

[Bill Simmons]

The therapist podcast.

[Zoe Simmons]

Therapists.

[Bill Simmons]

Therapists.

[Zoe Simmons]

Therapists. This. This pod is great. I think this is a perfect example of like, new upcoming podcasts that are kind of trying to take like the TikTok vibes and bringing it over to a podcast. This is hosted by Jake Shane, but he just brings on all of his celebrity friends like Sofia Richie, who I love, all sorts of different celebrities. And he does this segment called the Tell me what's Wrongs. And he'll have his fans send in like a bunch of things that have happened to them, crazy things. And then him and the celebrity will give them advice on how to deal with it, and then they'll prescribe them with different things to like, fix that situation. But he's just so funny and light and airy. And I love his podcast. I just, I enjoy listening to it. I like happy things.

[Bill Simmons]

When you say the TikTok piece of it. So it's a lot of people, like trying to self diagnose, figure out what's wrong.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, yes, and it's like an interactive podcast where his fans are basically like the basis of the podcast. He's Answering people's questions and giving them advice with the celebrity, which I think is super effective. And it's personable. Like, when I listen to it, I feel like I'm his friend.

[Bill Simmons]

La. Where is he taping that out of?

[Zoe Simmons]

La.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay. Waited for an invite from Jake. From therapists. Therapist or Therapuss.

[Zoe Simmons]

Therapists. Like octopus.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay. The idea of you. Another content of the year choice for you.

[Zoe Simmons]

I think mom watched it about 50 times over.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Should I be concerned about that? That she was obsessed with the movie about a woman meeting a younger guy.

[Zoe Simmons]

Ian Hathaway's phenomenal. And she only gets more beautiful. And this movie, it had to happen. And they executed like it was about time that a movie like this came out. Where a celebrity falls in love with a hot mom whose life has fallen apart.

[Bill Simmons]

I like that. So I happened to watch this one with mom, and the ending was kind of pushing it.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, it was pushing it.

[Bill Simmons]

Can we Spoiler alert? The ending. People have probably seen this. So they agree to break up. Cause, you know, she's what, 15 years older, and he's becoming a pop star. And basically they break up because it's screwing up her daughter.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

Her daughter's having an issue with it. So she's like, five years from now, my daughter's in college. Give me a call. He's like, all right. And then she's watching some TV show when he's on. He's like, I'm going to la. It's five years later. Of course, she's still single. Even though she's gorgeous. No guys could be singing for her. Just hanging out on a. Sees it. And then all of a sudden, he shows up at the end and they have kind of a look.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

And it's a happy ending.

[Zoe Simmons]

Happy ending.

[Bill Simmons]

And then he gets to go through menopause and all the great old lady stages with her. Happy for both of them.

[Zoe Simmons]

Interesting that the daughter piece in that movie. Like a selfish mom making a decision to get involved with a celebrity and then ruining her daughter's life, which actually happens a lot in real life. So. So I liked it.

[Bill Simmons]

Your last one for favorite content of the year. I see Long Legs is on there.

[Zoe Simmons]

I didn't realize we're really doing this again. Oh, my God.

[Bill Simmons]

You like long legs, Zoe?

[Zoe Simmons]

I like long legs.

[Bill Simmons]

You guys love this. We saw this together in the theater. I was not as big of a fan. But you and Ben were.

[Zoe Simmons]

I don't know why. I saw it, like, four times.

[Bill Simmons]

Did you really?

[Zoe Simmons]

I did. I saw it four times.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, You're a bad judge with movies. Cause you have a movie theater right.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right around the house, 50 yards from.

[Bill Simmons]

Where you go to college. So you can just go at 10:00.

[Zoe Simmons]

But I thought this. This movie was really good. Out of all the horror movies that came out this year, this was my number one again, because I really don't like gore. I haven't even seen Smile 2 yet. I know you guys have seen it and I should see it. Smile 2 was good, but there's something unappealing about it to me.

[Bill Simmons]

You know why Smile 2 was good? Because the lead actress is great, right?

[Zoe Simmons]

But it's like, that's just not. My Long Legs was much more my type of movie. I also like being on the side of the detectives. I like kind of trying to figure it out with them. And I thought the girl that played the main character was phenomenal.

[Bill Simmons]

And you liked Heretic, too?

[Zoe Simmons]

Heretic, yeah, Heretic. I love Grant. I think he's great. And seeing him in this sort of light was really interesting. It added a lot of depth to him as narrator.

[Bill Simmons]

So you like detectives chasing something creepy. Something's wrong with the house.

[Zoe Simmons]

And the whole vibe of that movie was good too. Just the way it was filmed. Like the lighting, every attention to detail was. Hit the checkbox for me.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, we're going to take a break and then come back with the rest of your awards. All right, so we're continuing the Teen Culture Awards last year. We're overdoing this. My daughter turns 20 next year. New category show you'd most want to go on. What's the answer?

[Zoe Simmons]

This was the Mystic Kitchen's last meal show, which I've binged every single episode, even of the celebrities that I don't care for. And I find it the most interesting thing that I've ever watched in my life.

[Bill Simmons]

Because you think about how weird your last meal would be, where it's like cottage cheese, pickles, hummus, that.

[Zoe Simmons]

But it's like, it's such an intimate thing to find out about a celebrity. Like, this is the last thing that you would eat. Like, I was watching. I'm trying to think of a good episode that I really loved. But, I mean, every celebrity that goes on there, it's just like, what are you putting on your plate right now?

[Bill Simmons]

So you feel like compared to Hot Ones, where it's just people, like, they're burning. Burning from chicken, right? Chicken wings. You want to know? You feel like this is a window into their actual personality.

[Zoe Simmons]

It's like this is the last Thing that you would put into your body on the planet. And I think the host, Josh. I don't know how to pronounce his last name. He's great, too. He's really intelligent.

[Bill Simmons]

So what's your last meal, then?

[Zoe Simmons]

I wish I would have had more time to think about this one. I think a huge Caesar salad with some sort of chicken on it would absolutely be up there.

[Bill Simmons]

But you'd have to have pickles, right?

[Zoe Simmons]

Pickles, cottage cheese, all the works. Hummus, carrots. But that's like, am I really gonna eat that on my last meal? I think I'd need a huge cheese board and a Caesar salad with chicken on it and a diet Dr. Pepper and a milkshake.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, the last meal. I'll check that one out. Breakout stars for this year for you.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

You had three people. Trinity Rodman.

[Zoe Simmons]

I love her. I watched her on the Call Her Daddy podcast last week. Not only was that episode super moving, I just think she is so smart and so cool and so normal, considering her entire situation.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

Like, as for a celebrity, this is the one person where I'm like, wow, I could actually see myself being friends with her. Like, she's so normal and cool and stylish, and I just. I really love her. I idolize her, honestly.

[Bill Simmons]

And she. We really need her for the US Women's World cup.

[Zoe Simmons]

And she's a phenomenal soccer player on top of it, which is.

[Bill Simmons]

She's the best forward we've produced probably since Abby Wambach.

[Zoe Simmons]

She's great. I truly love her. I think she's.

[Bill Simmons]

So what did you like about that episode? Just the way she talked about her dad or just, like, her perspective on fame? Like, what was it?

[Zoe Simmons]

I. Yeah, I think that was a really tough topic for her to talk about, and she'd obviously never talked about it for a reason.

[Bill Simmons]

The dad.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. And even while having that really tough conversation, she still remained so classy. And, like, even though she was airing everything out, she was never speaking poorly on him because she knew there was no point in doing that. So I just, like, appreciated the way that she approached that situation, the way she held herself. Like, I just think she's gonna be. Obviously, she's already really successful, but she's gonna continue to be super successful.

[Bill Simmons]

I like her, too. Next one is Sofia Richie.

[Zoe Simmons]

I love her. This is Lionel Richie's daughter.

[Bill Simmons]

She's a guest. What does she do? Like, does she have content?

[Zoe Simmons]

She has a TikTok. Her wedding was like the royal wedding last year. It was like, there was so Much stigma around it and she looked beautiful and she's phenomenal. But she's an influencer type. I don't know how to like categorize her. I don't want to because. Cause I don't specifically know.

[Bill Simmons]

What do you like about her? Is she funny?

[Zoe Simmons]

She's hilarious. She's like the most normal celebrity that. Similar to Trinity Rodman that I've ever witnessed. She's just so normal and down to earth. But I also really like her style and the way that she dresses and carries herself. I like to emulate the outfits that she does. She's the epitome of an influencer to me. How all the influencers should be normal.

[Bill Simmons]

Normal people are coming back, right?

[Zoe Simmons]

Normal people are. And she's funny.

[Bill Simmons]

Crazy. Not as successful in 2024.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

Graydon Cutler and Hailey Bachelder, who are they?

[Zoe Simmons]

Haley just joined the call her Daddy Force or the Unwell content. But she has a new podcast on Spotify which I really love called Extra Dirty. But it's the reason 30.

[Bill Simmons]

What does that mean?

[Zoe Simmons]

Because it's like a sex podcast. It's kind of like how Alex Cooper used to be before she got married. Right. But I really like her. I think she's super funny. She started off in like short form videos on TikTok, talking about like all of her quests out in New York City, the guys that she would meet, the things that she'd do, whatever. She's like not. I don't relate to her all that much, but I really like watching her content a lot and greatens her her best friend who's always making weird food combinations which, you know, I love.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay, storyline of the year. You went with the TikTok ban.

[Zoe Simmons]

I just thought this is so interesting because what's gonna happen to all of these influencers? I really don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

You mean if TikTok goes away in like April.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. It's like all of these people that have given up their jobs and have been making their livelihood by making TikTok TikTok videos. Now what happens to them? Like I genuinely don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

Instagram reels.

[Zoe Simmons]

I guess so. But like I'm never even on Instagram reels like that. Yeah, I like Instagram reels. But like TikTok is. It's so such a well oiled machine. Like it really reels you in. And now that there's this whole TikTok shop thing which is Amazon equivalent. Yeah, I can see how it's so detrimental to little kids because all of these videos will Be promoting things that you can buy on TikTok shop. Really? You'll literally watch the video and you can click on the thing at the bottom and you're purchasing something all of a sudden. So it's definitely an evil thing. But I'm most curious to see what will happen to all of these influencers and people that have devoted their lives to making TikTok videos that are no longer going to have any job.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm good with TikTok going away. Favorite developments. You mentioned Patreon earlier. So you're talking about like special Patreon only. I love this special content.

[Zoe Simmons]

This really feeds into like the secrecy feeling like you're friends with your favorite influencer. Obviously, I have to pay $10 a month or whatever to have the Patreons of the people that I'm subscribed to. But it's so interesting because it's almost like a whirlpool into what old YouTube looked like before all of the monetizations and whatever were put in place. It's like you can really just lay it all out with no care at all.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay, so you're saying I should start a Patreon? I don't want to.

[Zoe Simmons]

I don't know if I want to see whatever you do on Patreon.

[Bill Simmons]

Thank you. Spotify video is another one you were talking about. You like when Spotify, which is good because we're tripling down on this. But you like either watching or listening to a podcast, depending on where you are.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, I think it's a great advancement and it's really helpful to see the person that's talking's face. Yeah, like that's just something that I connect their words so much better with whoever they are by watching the video. And I'll just put it up on the treadmill. If I'm working out or if I'm in the car, I won't watch the video. But like, I like that you have the option. I think that's a really good advancement.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, well, you're going to keep getting it. Most fascinating trend. So two things here. You have the last days of original influencer content. What does that mean?

[Zoe Simmons]

I think we were talking about the canceled podcast when we.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, so we can. The canceled podcast. Zhang out as the other piece of that.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right.

[Bill Simmons]

So you're talking about there's the end of some sort of era that people.

[Zoe Simmons]

Don'T even know was an era people know. It's like the YouTube vine era of like all of the way that old social media used to be. The way that influencers used to behave, it was, like, so much more raw and, like, upfront, and people were openly crazy.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

And Tana Mongeau is, like, the face of that when I think of old YouTube, because she's just, like, the epitome of. She's been everywhere and done everything. Similar with Trisha Paydez.

[Bill Simmons]

So people beefing, getting canceled, coming back.

[Zoe Simmons]

Declaring war on each otheroach syndrome, where it's like, you can just be openly crazy and there was really no problem with it. And you'd get canceled and you'd come back and it would just be a continuous loophole where now cancel culture is like, you're canceled for whatever it might be and you're done.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

But the canceled podcast, similar to its name, it really was like the last era of that. It felt like because Brooke Schofield and Tana Mongeau would, like, air out all of this shit that happened, all these crazy stories of living in la, going out in Hollywood, whatever it was. And now Tana's in a happy relationship, so is Brooke, and they just kind of are diverging into, like, this regular influencer, whatever the new Spotify world is.

[Bill Simmons]

So do you have to basically not be in a healthy relationship to be a good podcaster?

[Zoe Simmons]

Apparently so. Or just to be an interesting influencer?

[Bill Simmons]

Because I asked you what would happen if Alex Cooper just got divorced and you got super excited, like, whoa, if she started dating again? That would be amazing.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, that was her whole bag. All of her podcasts and stories were about, like, having random hookups and running around New York City and, like, being a degenerate and whatever. And now she's happy and super successful, and I'm so happy for her.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

But her content definitely reflects that.

[Bill Simmons]

Right. She's doing more interview stuff.

[Zoe Simmons]

And I love, like, her story about hooking up with the Red Sox guy.

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Zoe Simmons]

And, like, her story about her times in Paris. Like, all of when she does the old stories about everything that used to happen to her, I was like, wow, this is good content like this. I miss this.

[Bill Simmons]

Next category is Couple I Want to Break Up Because I'm Jealous. Couple. I hope they break up. I guess you're not literally hoping for a breakup, but.

[Zoe Simmons]

No, I wish I was jealous. I wish I could be. Olivia Jade. She's dating Jacob Elordi, but she never talks about it, which is really interesting to me. You're dating one of the hottest guys on Earth.

[Bill Simmons]

And he's tall, which you love.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right? And Australian.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

And he's not in any of her content. She's still alive. And like, I love her YouTube videos. I'm a big fan of Olivia Jade.

[Bill Simmons]

Interesting. Big comeback for Olivia.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. She's also a good influencer where she just keeps it classy. She. She's not too crazy. She just. I really like her content a lot.

[Bill Simmons]

And a hell of a rower.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. Okay. But I do like her a lot and I'm jealous of her.

[Bill Simmons]

Grossest Internet moment of the year. We had the. You had the Sydney Sweeney body shaming stuff from a couple weeks ago.

[Zoe Simmons]

I don't wanna say like grossest. Like I was grossed out. Like grossest. Like, wow, society is really horrific.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that's terrific.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, this was awful. Cause I saw TikTok videos alluding to it, but not the pictures just being like, wow, what happened to Sydney Sweeney? Like, all this stuff. And I was expecting to see something horrible and she just looks completely normal.

[Bill Simmons]

And she's filming a movie about a female boxer.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, she's like, muscle on, putting some muscle on. Like she looks similar to how like most females look. And I was just like, this is ridiculous that in this day and age with all of this cancellation stuff, people will still talk like that. I found that super.

[Bill Simmons]

What did you think of her post refuting all the. Or did you see the post she did? No.

[Zoe Simmons]

I've always been a big fan of her. I think she's wonderful in White Lotus and I love euphoria and her straying away from the character that she usually plays is an interesting thing to me. I'm excited to see the movie. I thought that her response definitely made me like her a lot more.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Well, two people you didn't really like Feud of the Year. Although I guess you're on the Blake Lively side. Blake Lively versus Justin Baldoni. So this was a big thing.

[Zoe Simmons]

This situation is gnarly.

[Bill Simmons]

This has been like a nine month story on the social media and now it blew up again.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, there's been lots of back and forth because originally when the movie was being promoted, Blake Lively was kind of promoting the show up in your florals to the movie. And Justin Baldoni was taking more of the domestic violence awareness side and people.

[Bill Simmons]

But they also weren't promoting it together.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. And people were really criticizing Blake for not for being insensitive of the entire intention behind the movie. But turns out that there was some reasoning behind it. I think the situation is horrible. And looking at the intimate details of it, it's really, really weird.

[Bill Simmons]

So I know all, like, the mainstream journalism media angles reporting on it. What is the TikTok Instagram version.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, people have been saying that he was being very strange during all of their sexual scenes.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

And even the girl that played the younger version of Blake Lively, he was making really crude comments about her sex scenes with the younger character that was supposed to play Atlas.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

And on top of that, he, like, walked in on her in her trailer.

[Bill Simmons]

This is alleged, we should mention multiple times.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, alleged. But, like, a lot of really disgusting sentiments came out of this. Just, like, really uncomfortable, seemingly like minor versions of sexual abuse. But it's really.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, the fact that she had that meeting and put all that stuff in there. Like, from now on, we will no longer. You will no longer add kissing scenes.

[Zoe Simmons]

And people were really trying to turn it on Blake Lively at the beginning. Like, Blake Lively's an asshole, and she's, like, mean to reporters, and everyone was turning on her. But it seems like there was a lot more to the situation. It's really sad.

[Bill Simmons]

What's your generation's relationship with Blake Lively?

[Zoe Simmons]

For a second there, people weren't liking her, but I think she's widely loved because of Gossip Girl and all of the movies that she's done. I mean, I like her.

[Bill Simmons]

She's a friend of mine, did really well. I think she's in good shape.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. But I don't know. She's not within my area.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, we're going to be delicate with this next one. Uh, oh, by the way, Mom's take on Justin Baldoni was, I never liked his face.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, I don't like his either.

[Bill Simmons]

That was it. Never trusted his face.

[Zoe Simmons]

He played the role that he played a little too well.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. 2025 career advice is the next category. And I just have in the notes, dangerous Disney. You don't like when the Disney stars hit this phase, when they get older, and then they have to prove how dangerous they are?

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, it just seems like this is a common thing that happens between Sabrina Carpenter and Olivia Rodrigo and all of these really popular Disney influencers that are now trying to desensitize themselves and escape.

[Bill Simmons]

From the Disney world by being super provocative.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. And in a lot of ways, it works, and I support it. But then there's times where it's just like, this feels like it's kind of over the top, like you're trying to prove something here. And sometimes it's like, feeding into that Disney thing is not always a bad thing. I just think that sometimes it's a little too trying to get out of the box.

[Bill Simmons]

Do you feel like Zendaya did that?

[Zoe Simmons]

No, I think she played her cards perfectly.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. I think she's the role model. Right.

[Zoe Simmons]

Because she's super sexy. Like, I think she's beautiful. But she was a Disney star for a long time, and she kind of, like, shifted over to being who she is now from who she was then.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, it helps. She's an awesome actress and got.

[Zoe Simmons]

And in a lot of movies and stuff. Right. But that's the way to do it. Like, that's the poster way to do that.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know what the answer is, but I have written down makeup tip of the year as your.

[Zoe Simmons]

I don't even know if we came up with this one.

[Bill Simmons]

You don't have one. All right, we'll move on to the next one. College food and drink, weird budget MVPs. This is stuff when you're in college. You're racing around, especially, like, you. You're playing sports. You have only, like, 30 minutes to eat, 20 minutes to eat, 10 minutes to grab something. I have a bunch of food here. So where do you want to start?

[Zoe Simmons]

I wanna start off by saying Starbucks saved my life.

[Joe House]

Okay.

[Zoe Simmons]

The dining hall usually closed before soccer practice would be over. And there were countless times where the Starbucks next door to me would provide my meals. I think I ate strictly Starbucks for probably two months straight.

[Bill Simmons]

So you proport. You support the Starbucks?

[Zoe Simmons]

I support Starbucks.

[Bill Simmons]

So you have. I wrote down Starbucks eggs, egg bites.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yes, absolutely.

[Bill Simmons]

Spinach feta wrap.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yes, yes.

[Bill Simmons]

And matcha latte was a big one for you this year?

[Zoe Simmons]

I love a matcha latte. I'm obviously a college student, and I need as much energy as I can get.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

And coffee. Sometimes I'm just not in the mood for it. And matcha actually gives me the caffeine boost that I need without the comedown. Because sometimes from coffee, I'll get tired a few hours after having it.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

Matcha, like, makes my entire body feel fantastic. And it's a good, healthy energy boost.

[Bill Simmons]

Cause it's green tea in that Starbucks that's next to your dorm. There's probably, what, 10, 11 people that work there. How many of them knew who you are?

[Zoe Simmons]

Oh, we're friends. I have a friend every morning that I say hello to. It's wonderful.

[Bill Simmons]

Chomp sticks.

[Zoe Simmons]

Oh, yes. Chomsticks. I'll put hummus on them.

[Bill Simmons]

Can you explain what chopsticks are? Because most people don't know.

[Zoe Simmons]

It's a meat stick. I guarantee you most people know.

[Joe House]

Okay.

[Zoe Simmons]

It's like a long meat stick. It's like a jerky yeah, it's a jerky, but it's made out of turkey, and it's delicious. Me and mom were on the ski mountain the other day, and she was appalled because I was putting mustard on the chopsticks. On my chopsticks. But chopsticks. I don't regret it one bit. Chopsticks are my MVP in 2024.

[Bill Simmons]

So that would have been. That's the answer to the question. Weirdest thing I did with my food in 2024. Putting mustard in a public place.

[Zoe Simmons]

Or like, the pickles dipped in the cottage cheese with the hummus. I don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that was the last mvp was hummus, pickles, and cottage cheese.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

So you would just walk to this Trader Joe's in Boston, buy a bunch of weird food, and then cram them into a small college refrigerator.

[Zoe Simmons]

Into my little fridge. And no one would touch that fridge in my suite. They all knew. They opened it up.

[Bill Simmons]

None of them.

[Zoe Simmons]

This is a crime scene.

[Joe House]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

There's like, Is there any pizza?

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah. That's why I'm, like, a good. I'm good as a roommate, because no one wants to eat my stuff. Like, even if anyone was trying to eat my things, no one would want to.

[Bill Simmons]

Last category. Advice to my younger self as an athlete and future strong woman.

[Zoe Simmons]

Oh, future strong woman.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know. I was projecting. You're projecting things you learned now that you're 19 and a half. Things you wish you could have told yourself at age 12, 13, 14.

[Zoe Simmons]

Sure. Well, I think on a relationships standpoint, because that was partially what I was thinking of when we wrote this down. And this is advice that I give to my friends. A lot of the times in a relationship, you have just as much power as the other person, and succumbing to whatever they want at all times is super unhealthy. And I think that that's definitely something that I've learned over the years. Just, like, not folding over. I've definitely become a lot more feisty since I've gotten to college. I think in middle school, as you know, a lot of people would, like, walk all over me because I am a nice person, and I would allow that to happen. But standing up for yourself is something, obviously that you learn with age.

[Bill Simmons]

It's been nice to have you home when we taught you how to be bullied again by me and mom just telling you what to do and yelling at you.

[Zoe Simmons]

Exactly.

[Bill Simmons]

Good. Complaining about you.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. As a soccer forefront or just sports in general, I think you cannot continue on if you don't love it. That's something that I have learned to be true. I've gone through injury last year where I thought I might have to quit. There's been lots of times in my life where it's like, I don't want to miss any more birthday parties or any more friend play dates. I feel like I'm losing friends. I don't want to do this sport anymore. And pushing through that and knowing that you have the love to push through the sacrifices is the most important thing. You won't make it if you don't.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. You know, that's interesting. Cause I think that's the number one thing I learned as a parent, too, that if the kid doesn't love it, there's nothing you can do. It's.

[Zoe Simmons]

You can't make someone love something. You'll burn them out.

[Bill Simmons]

Like I've said, you had two real injuries, and each time you could have said, eh, I don't want to play anymore. It's not worth it. But each time you really wanted to keep playing and you fought to get back and healthy, which he did again recently. But I have other people.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, I've seen it happen time and time again where it's like, people I've played with that are dying for it to be over because it's like they either feel like they were forced to do it or like they were doing it for somebody else. And in part, I'll always play for you because I know how much you love to watch me play, but I mostly play because of how much I love it. And if I didn't love it, I would not be able to do it for. For as long as I have.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And you're playing. I mean, you're in a more physical position, too. So it's not like your body's pretty banged up by the end of the season if you're playing big minutes.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. But I think that also feeds into, like, the giving yourself the right nutrients and, like, being a healthy person in general.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Zoe Simmons]

Because there's a lot of, like, I don't know on TikTok especially, it's like, what I eat in a day as a fat person is literally, like, all over my for you page. Like, there's a lot of people promoting really unhealthy eating or, like, what I eat in a day as a skinny person. Like, these are literal headlines of videos that I've watched. Like this lady Liv Schmidt, who was canceled all year because she was underweight and, like, kind of promoting an unhealthy eating style. It seems like she's like adapted a more healthy eating style. But with social media and with TikTok, there's a lot of promotion of the way that people eat and it's not anything like we've ever had before because social media was never so big.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, it's also making people think about food more than maybe they would.

[Zoe Simmons]

Right. It's like it becomes people's entire universes. And I've definitely dealt with that. And as an athlete, it's important to give yourself the right nutrients. I think that's important too. That's what I've learned.

[Bill Simmons]

The more time we have with social media, I do wonder if it re emphasizes things that are potential problems anyway, like food or if you think you have some sort of hang up or something wrong and then.

[Zoe Simmons]

Well, yeah, it's like people self diagnose themselves all the time. People change, like, and it's hard because when you feel like you're in a really tough place and you don't know what's wrong with you and then you see somebody else that might be having similar symptoms to you and you finally feel like you're being heard or like you found the solution, that's a really gratifying feeling. But in the end of the day, it's probably not what you have.

[Bill Simmons]

Right.

[Zoe Simmons]

And it's like people go down this rabbit hole and social media was not something that we were intended to have as human beings. And it's like you have all of this insight on people's lives that you would never cross paths with otherwise. So it like creates a really weird universe for a lot of people like me where it's like I'll be seeing all these food videos or all of these, like, whatever sorts of videos that I normally wouldn't ever see or pay attention to. So it's just weird.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, one other thing you learned in 2024 is you could be a good nurse.

[Zoe Simmons]

A good nurse? Yeah, I could. Honestly, I could.

[Bill Simmons]

Your boyfriend hurt his leg and was in a cast for six weeks and you had to take care of him.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

But you did. You did good job. It seems like you did a decent job.

[Zoe Simmons]

I tried my best, but that's. Yeah, that's something I had to learn. Rolling someone around in a wheelchair is not as easy as it looks.

[Bill Simmons]

You finally got. You finally got to be in a Grey's Anatomy episode.

[Zoe Simmons]

I know. I almost pushed him into traffic a few times.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, Anything else before we go?

[Zoe Simmons]

I don't think so.

[Bill Simmons]

Happy New Year.

[Zoe Simmons]

Happy New Year.

[Bill Simmons]

Good to see you that was it for teen culture. I guess we'll have to come up with another name if we do this again.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, well, we'll fix it up.

[Bill Simmons]

You turned 20 and beginning of May.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't know what we'll call it at that point.

[Zoe Simmons]

Yeah, we'll figure it out.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, Good to see you.

[Zoe Simmons]

Bye.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, that's it for the podcast. Thanks to Joe House. Thanks to my daughter, Zoe Simmons. Can't believe I was able to book her. Thanks to Ceruti and thanks to Kyle. Thanks to you guys for listening. Don't forget Sunday, me and the Cuz are going to be going live on YouTube after all the Sunday games and equals much the Cuz and everybody else on the Ringer Sunday pregame show that morning. I will see you on Sunday night. Enjoy the weekend. Must be 21 plus in President select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 + in President D.C. gambling problem. Call 100 Gambler or visit rg-help.com, call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gambling helpline ma.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text hopeny in New York.