Lakers-Warriors Takeaways, Wilt Chamberlain, 'White Lotus,' and Half-Baked Ideas With Rob Mahoney and Kevin Wildes

Summary

The Bill Simmons Podcast Summary: "Lakers-Warriors Takeaways, Wilt Chamberlain, 'White Lotus,' and Half-Baked Ideas With Rob Mahoney and Kevin Wildes"

Release Date: April 4, 2025

In this engaging episode of The Bill Simmons Podcast, host Bill Simmons delves deep into the recent Lakers-Warriors matchup, explores historical NBA legends like Wilt Chamberlain, discusses the eagerly anticipated season finale of HBO's White Lotus, and ventures into the comedic realm with the "Half-Baked Ideas" segment featuring guest Kevin Wildes and Rob Mahoney. Here's a detailed breakdown of the key discussions and insights from the episode.

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1. Lakers vs. Warriors Game Analysis

Hosts: Bill Simmons & Rob Mahoney
Timestamp: [03:46] - [22:44]

Bill Simmons and Rob Mahoney kick off their analysis by dissecting the intense Lakers-Warriors game, emphasizing its significance in the playoff landscape. They highlight the evolution of both teams from former "harmless" squads to serious contenders, noting the strategic adjustments post-trades.

• Disjointed Rhythm vs. High-Level Shot Making:

  • Rob Mahoney observes, "The rhythm of the game felt really disjointed. And yet the shot making was at such a high level."

• Rebounding and Defensive Concerns:

  • Bill Simmons expresses concerns about the Lakers' ability to rebound and defend consistently, questioning, "Can I still be a 40 minutes a game guy in the playoffs?"

• Steph Curry's Performance:

  • Curry's impressive stats are discussed, with Bill noting, "Steph finished with 37, 10 for 21 is starting to play his way towards second team All-NBA."

• Mark Williams and Defensive Adjustments:

  • The addition of Mark Williams is analyzed, suggesting it changes the Warriors' defensive strategy against Curry: "Now they're like, oh, shit, all right, I guess it gotta play Looney for a couple minutes here."

• Playoff Implications:

  • Rob Mahoney underscores the Warriors' need to prove they can sustain offensive momentum to navigate the playoffs successfully: "They need to string it together offensively to not just beat anyone in a series, but to beat four, any ones in a row."

2. Defensive Player of the Year Debate

Participants: Bill Simmons & Rob Mahoney
Timestamp: [30:00] - [34:01]

The conversation shifts to the NBA's Defensive Player of the Year (DPOY) race, focusing on Draymond Green, Evan Mobley, and Lou Dort.

• Evan Mobley's Case:

  • Rob Mahoney states, "I'm more of an Evan Mobley voter at this point. Just the utility of what he brings to that defense."

• Draymond Green's Performance:

  • Despite his stellar defensive plays, Rob comments, "I don't think he's put together the total body of work for it."

• Lou Dort's Impact:

  • Bill Simmons brings up Lou Dort as a standout defender, noting his unique contributions and defensive prowess throughout the season.

3. Wilt Chamberlain and NBA Legacy

Participants: Bill Simmons & Rob Mahoney
Timestamp: [48:17] - [53:34]

Bill and Rob delve into the enduring legacy of Wilt Chamberlain, comparing his polarizing presence to modern NBA stars. They explore how Chamberlain's career would be perceived in today's media-driven environment.

• Bill's Reflection:

  • Bill Simmons remarks, "Wilt is the most polarizing NBA star of all time. He's still polarizing."

• Social Media and Legacy:

  • They discuss how modern platforms like YouTube and Twitter are reviving interest in Chamberlain's iconic moments, potentially sparking a "Wilt renaissance."

4. White Lotus Season Finale Discussion

Participants: Bill Simmons & Rob Mahoney
Timestamp: [35:29] - [43:18]

Transitioning from basketball, Bill and Rob shift their focus to the highly anticipated season finale of White Lotus. They speculate on potential plot twists and the emotional payoff for fans.

• Anticipation and Speculation:

  • Rob Mahoney shares, "All the little quotes that are coming out from the cast hinting at the ominous results of the finale had me a little spooked."

• Character Arcs and Predictions:

  • The duo discusses key characters and possible outcomes, blending humor with genuine curiosity about the show's direction.

• Live Reaction Plans:

  • Bill announces their plans to provide a live reaction podcast alongside Joanna Robinson and Mallory Rubin, offering listeners a front-row seat to the finale's unfolding drama.

5. Half-Baked Ideas Segment

Participants: Bill Simmons & Kevin Wildes
Timestamp: [74:24] - [89:47]

In the signature "Half-Baked Ideas" segment, Bill and Kevin Wildes brainstorm humorous and unconventional ideas, ranging from innovative baby naming services to absurd sports-related concepts.

• Baby Name Consultant:

  • Bill Simmons proposes a niche baby naming consultant specializing in sports-themed names to help parents avoid overly popular choices. "For example, go with Gail Goodrich. Gail for a Gail Sayers."

• Transfer Portal for Families:

  • Kevin Wildes introduces the concept of a "Transfer Portal for Families," allowing children to switch extracurricular activities or even parental roles if they feel another option might offer better opportunities. "I'm going to hop in the portal. I'm like, wow, really?"

• NBA Fantasy Adjustments:

  • Bill suggests revamping NBA fantasy leagues to include "injury picks," awarding points for selected injuries, adding a twist to the traditional format. "I'm going to have NBA injury fantasy league."

• Jarring Innovations:

  • Ideas like integrating live bands into NBA games to enhance the atmosphere and creating mobile caroling services are discussed, blending sports enthusiasm with creative entertainment concepts.

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6. Closing Remarks and Upcoming Content

Participants: Bill Simmons, Rob Mahoney & Kevin Wildes
Timestamp: [89:47] - End

Bill wraps up the episode by thanking guests Rob Mahoney and Kevin Wildes, and reminds listeners of upcoming content, including live reactions to White Lotus and rewatchable content related to The Saint. He encourages fans to engage with the podcast on various platforms like Spotify and YouTube.

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Notable Quotes:

• Rob Mahoney [04:11]: "This game was sick. Really enjoyed it. Everybody involved has still got it to the extent that they needed to prove that they still got it."

• Bill Simmons [06:18]: "I can't really argue with it too much. For me, it's more like if you are LeBron, if you are Steph and I see you sliding towards a team that feels not representative of who you are for your career, maybe I give it like another look."

• Rob Mahoney [17:13]: "Defense comes and goes. And I think the rim protection thing is really instructive here."

• Bill Simmons [37:19]: "I probably would have put him in the corner more just for spacing. Just run plays for him."

• Kevin Wildes [75:12]: "Moral of the story. I needed someone to call, and I had nobody."

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This episode masterfully balances in-depth sports analysis with pop culture commentary and lighthearted humor, providing listeners with a comprehensive and entertaining experience. Whether you're a die-hard basketball fan, a White Lotus aficionado, or just in for some laughter with the "Half-Baked Ideas," Bill Simmons delivers a podcast that is both informative and delightfully engaging.

Transcript

[Bill Simmons]

You're listening to the Bill Simmons podcast presented by FanDuel. FanDuel has made it easier than ever to see how your bets are doing without even opening the app. Now you can get the latest updates. Follow along in real time directly from your phone's lock screen. Yeah, or Apple Watch. No login required, just head to your My Bets page to turn it on if you don't already have it. Download the FanDuel Sportsbook app today to get in on the action. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available and listen to the end of this episode for additional details. You must be 21 plus in President select states gambling problem. Call 100 Gamble or visit rg-help.com Coming up warriors, Lakers, White Lotus Half Baked Ideas Action packed. Next this episode is brought to you by Whole Foods Market. As the weather gets warmer, it's time for lighter meals, right? You know that Whole Foods Market has just what you're looking for. Great everyday prices. The yellow low price signs help you save money every day without compromising the quality you expect at Whole Foods Market. Like low priced, responsibly farmed Atlantic salmon or no antibiotics ever. Ground beef or boneless skinless chicken breast. Plus much more throughout the store. Wherever you see Yellow at Whole Foods Market, you know you're saving money. Save on the best of spring with great everyday prices at Whole Foods Market. We're also brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network. Hey, I got a new rewatchables coming this week because Kyle Brandt and I, we decided to do the Saint because Val Kilmer passed away and we want to talk about Val Kilmer and we want to talk about a very bizarre movie that we both love. So we're just putting it up this week. So Monday's podcast will be this weekend. The Saint. Be ready for it. You can watch it as a video on Spotify or you can watch it on The Ringer Movies YouTube channel. And then Sunday night White Lotus season finale right after it ends, we're going live on Ringer Dash TV, the YouTube channel that we have and we are recording our reaction podcast with me and Mallory Rubin and Joanna Robinson. So you can watch us live on YouTube on Ringer Dash TV or just wait and watch it as a video podcast on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. I will also be doing a Sunday podcast with Brisilo that day as well. We'll see. I'm like LeBron. Can I still play at that kind of pace. Can I still be a 40 minutes a game guy in the playoffs? We're going to find out on Sunday. Stay tuned. Coming up on this podcast, Rob Mahoney and I, we wanted to talk about Lakers warriors tonight because it was an important game and had a lot of playoff implications. And also just to see those two teams, who they are right now after the trades and what they looked like against each other. So we Talked about that + White Lotus season finale. And then my old friend Kevin Wilds came on and we talked about is April the greatest take month? Talked about Wilt Chamberlain, talked about a bunch of stuff. And then we did a slew of half baked ideas. So that's the podcast first, our friends from pro champ. All right, recording this a little before 10:00 Pacific Time. Rob Mahoney is here from the Prestige TV podcast. Oh wait, you do basketball too? I forgot.

[Rob Mahoney]

Occasionally. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

So we watched the basketball just now. Warriors, Lakers. A game that they used to kind of shove down our throats. And we used to like it cause Steph and LeBron were playing. But they were two ultimately harmless teams and now they're actual contenders. And it was a fascinating enough matchup with a lot at stake and we decided to wait until afterwards to do a little pot about it. So what'd you learn? What was your number one thing you learned?

[Rob Mahoney]

This game was sick. Really enjoyed it. Everybody involved has still got it to the extent that they needed to prove that they still got it. And I mean the game of Brandon Pajemski's life, one of the games of Austin Reaves life, this game was weird, but I think representative of both teams in that it was half absolute slog. Like the middle part of this game I thought was really slow. The rhythm of the game felt really disjointed. And yet the shot making was at such a high level. And overall like the veteran execution was at such a high level by both teams in spots, by obviously by the warriors in greater numbers.

[Bill Simmons]

I wanted to figure out one thing to overreact to.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Which is what we do on these Thursday night pods after. I'm a little groggy. I don't know if the Lakers can rebound and defend at the level you need to be to actually win four straight playoff rounds for nine straight weeks. And that was in the back of my head this whole time that these guys were so talented, the three guys together, that maybe it wouldn't matter. And then you watch a game like this when they're getting, you know, how many The warriors had 14 offensive rebounds.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, they. They were. I wouldn't say hunting different matchups, but they certainly got a lot of threes that they liked. They ended up going 19 for 42 from 3. And defensively they basically was small ball against small ball, which the warriors are like, delighted to do that. So if I'm the Lakers, I'm not too upset because Luca didn't play well. Right. On the other hand, I didn't get anything from my bench and I really have an issue at center. I don't have. I have Hayes and that's about it. And I'm playing Rui and I have this oversized. I have some size, but goes back to that Mark Williams trade, which is still, you know, could be a sliding doors. What if for the. For the season for them. But if he came into the game today with what we saw from him after the trade deadline, that's at least changing what the warriors have to do a little bit. Now they're like, oh, shit, all right, I guess it's gotta play looney for a couple minutes here. I think small ball gets small ball. I just like the warriors chances more.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think so too. They're just. I mean, they're better practiced at it, Jimmy Butler included. Like, he was playing this way in Miami for a long time too, in stretches, especially as like a small ball four. But when you think about the Mark Williams element or the Jackson Hayes shadow element, however you want to define it, they're guarding Steph so aggressively that he's having to cut and he's having to drive against that kind of top locking. And so if you have a rim protector there, all those Steph drives don't look so cute anymore. Now, although that's a really complicated premise to have to navigate for Curry, especially when he has a pelvic contusion or whatever it was he's coming back from. Not words I like in conjunction with one another, but he played really well and he was able to play really well because ultimately the Lakers are. They are small ball. They also have a certain kind of beef in size in terms of a lot of small forward and power forward shaped guys. But I just have constant questions as to whether that size is real or not. Is it tangible in a way that's going to impact games? Because they are not by rule like an offensive rebounding juggernaut. They are not a team that really pushes people around. Like they can create advantages offensively with that size.

[Kevin Wilds]

But.

[Rob Mahoney]

But if they're not leveraging on a defense, how are they Going to survive against some of these higher leverage matchups.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, they're not tall, but they're big. They're big. But then in games like this where it's just, you see the other team that has, that can move the ball around, that can get to the rim, that has a bunch of different options, that has bench scoring, that can exploit their bench against the Lakers bench, then you start to get a little nervous. I mean Curry finished with 37, 10 for 21 is starting to play his way towards second team. All NBA. I feel like might already be. Especially because it does seem like Brunson's coming back in time.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And do you believe in legacy stuff at all with this? Like do you feel like almost like in boxing where you gotta actually beat the champ to take the title? Like if it's. He's on the bubble. Second team or third team, same for LeBron. It's like eh, gonna edge you towards second team for the pedigree. I don't, maybe that's not the right way to think about it, but for both of those guys that's what I'm probably gonna end up doing. Cause of the pedigree.

[Rob Mahoney]

It's very generous of you and if you're gonna be generous towards somebody, make it the all time legends who are in our midst. So I can't really argue with it too much. For me it's more like if you are LeBron, if you are Steph and I see you sliding towards a team that feels not representative of who you are for your career, maybe I give it like another look. It's like okay, that doesn't feel quite right. Let's make sure I'm picking Jaren Jackson Jr over LeBron James and I feel okay about that. No disrespect to Jaren Jackson Jr. Is amazing, but he's not LeBron. So they do deserve that if nothing else. A little courtesy.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, The warriors are 20 and 4 since that Butler trade in the game that he's actually played. He was quiet today for the most part, but also wasn't quiet. Felt like he was present in the game.

[Rob Mahoney]

Oh yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

And then there was a couple spots where he took over and he would get to the. He just, he has a sense for when they need him. I really like the way this team plays together. The Kaminga piece was the question for me. Trying to shoehorn him in and you could have like I even looked at his props today heading into the game and like his over under for points was 13 and a half and I was Thinking like that feels way too high to me. But I also wouldn't be surprised if that's way too low. It was one of those. And then, you know, he was out there for big stretches and crunch time. They're playing him and Draymond, Pudzemski, Curry and Butler, and that was their five. And it was interesting. Cause I don't know. I don't know if we've seen those five guys together in a big situation like that. Before they had size, Kamingo was doing the thing where he's kind of floating around the baseline and doing these weird little back cuts. They could switch a little bit on defense with all that. But it also helps that Pizzemski had, as you said, one of the best games of his career. But the Kamiga thing, what'd you see? What'd you notice?

[Rob Mahoney]

I think this was the best that he and Butler in particular, have played together, and they haven't had a. It's like nine or ten games maybe, that they've been able to actually be out there at the same time. And, yeah, it's one of those things where Butler is such, like, an intuitive player in terms of the flow of the game. You put him out there with Draymond and Steph, like, he gets how to move. He gets how to connect and make the right passes and find the flow. I would not say Jonathan Kuminga is a terribly intuitive player. It took him, like, three years to figure out how to play with Steph Curry. The idea that he's just gonna jump in. And now Jimmy Butler, another kind of, like, iffy spacer, a funky player to have to find your way with. Like, Jimmy Butler makes spacers and bigs better. Does he make players like him better? Traditionally, it's a little bit more of a mixed bag. And so the data with them two on the floor coming into this game was mostly terrible. Like, those minutes just had not worked. This felt like some real signs of life for a combination that, if the warriors are going to make any kind of run, actually does need to work. I think what was funny about what you said about the Lakers of, like, if that they may not have enough to string together consecutive series with their defense. I feel the exact opposite way about the warriors, where it's like, they need to prove they can string it together offensively to not just beat anyone in a series, but to beat four, any ones in a row. Like, that's. That's a lot to ask.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it's true. Well, the Kaminga, the. The on, off Numbers with him were pretty. Were pretty rough, even though it was a limited sample size. They were really good with Santos, kind of strangely good with Post, too. And Post was out there today doing the whole, I'm not afraid of anybody. I'm not afraid of you. LeBron talking shit. LeBron was like, what's going on with this guy? But Kaminga against the Lakers has always been interesting because athletically, size wise, physicality wise, he can kind of battle and bounce with those dudes. And I always feel like Kerr likes throwing him out there against the Lakers because, you know, Kamenko, the best thing about him is he's like, oh, LeBron James and I are equals. You guys didn't realize we're in the same plane in the NBA pyramid.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, sometimes that works out. Like, there have been points of the season where Brandon Pajemski thought he was the player Austin Reaves is right now. And that's now paying off. Like, he's now figuring out his way into the lineup, and it's really working. This new starting group for Golden State.

[Bill Simmons]

So I think I'm a little higher on the warriors than you. It sounds like from a ceiling standpoint, I actually really like where they are. What are your hesitations?

[Rob Mahoney]

I think it's just stringing it all together, and I think the toll it takes on anybody to play small. Right. Like, you see this with the Lakers, too. Like, I'm still trying to figure out, are the Lakers the elite defense that they were for, like, the first month after the Luka trade or the garbage defense we've seen over the last month or so. Yeah, Golden State isn't that polar, but there are going to be matchups that are tough for them. There's going to be matchups that just require a ton of Draymond Green in particular, a ton of Jimmy Butler in particular. And then you're playing multiple small guards in a lot of these looks. And so all of a sudden, the toll of that for three series in a row, I think might just be a little bit too much. And so it's the kind of thing where I would. I think they can beat. They can upset anyone in the first round. I think they have that in them.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Rob Mahoney]

But chaining those series together against really formidable Western Conference opponents where everyone's kind of in the same relative class, I think that might just be a lot.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, they interviewed JJ before the fourth quarter with Ali laforce, and he was friendly and curt. I mean, unfriendly and Curt. Unfriendly, yeah. Yeah. He just was like you could tell he was just really pissed off about how the game was going. And I was trying to figure out what pissed him off. Whether it was like, I can't believe Pudzemski really, he's gonna make all those shots, or I don't like something we're doing defensively. Maybe it was a bunch of stuff. The thing that was pretty weird about this game and again, trying not to overreact.

[Rob Mahoney]

But I thought we were trying to overreact.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I'm trying not to now.

[Rob Mahoney]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

Because it's Luka Doncic and he's one of the best players in the world.

[Rob Mahoney]

That's fair.

[Bill Simmons]

It was a pretty uninspiring performance by him tonight. I'm not really sure what was going on with him. He seemed out of it. He wasn't even really bitching at the refs as much as he usually does. He didn't seem upset at anyone on the warriors. And just in general it was a strange performance for him. He was the third best guy on his own team and arguably the fourth best guy because Rui was really good tonight too. And that's the one I thought the warriors were going to have so much trouble matching up with him, but they seemed like they matched up really well with him. He was still doing some good kick out passes. Of course he was throwing his size around, but it just was not your typical luka game. And LeBron who started out slow I think sensed it pretty early and he really came on and was just able to flip this switch and ended up with over 30. But I. So I don't know what to make of the Luka thing. I think the Luka Laker experience has been pretty weird. There's been like flashes of just all time crazy brilliance. He'll be amazing and not that great in the same game and up and down and it seems like he's in better shape than he was defensively. It's still not good. He was really rough tonight and I'm going to say work in progress, but we've had this is two plus months now for sure.

[Rob Mahoney]

I just like work in progress. Luka though is still pretty damn good. Yeah, he's still creating opportunities that basically no other players on the floor can create. I thought he did a good job of at least of not stopping short on drives and especially in transition where he can tend to slow things down and want to reset the offense. And he was going all the way to the rim whether to set himself up, whether to set up threes, whether to set up lobs you know, really like continuing to push himself a little bit. And anytime that he and LeBron and Reeves get involved in the same like triangulated action, it's fucking terrifying. Like you can see the bones of something that is really, really scary. It's just, to your point, not there every single play with Luka, the burst isn't there every single play. The touch kind of comes and goes depending on the game, especially if he's hitting the step back threes. That's always been a huge variable for him, but he's still good enough. And ultimately it's not a real concern for the Lakers relative to the fact that they have this completely turned over team. That is not going to make sense until they have a chance to go into an off season and build a Luka style roster around him.

[Bill Simmons]

One of the things, I agree with you, one of the things I noticed with them, and I'm wondering if the warriors unlocked it a little bit because jj, this team is such a weird team to coach that I think he was doing some math formula stuff with them almost where it's like, Luka's gonna take over the first eight minutes of the game. I'm gonna play Luka by himself and LeBron and reaves together and basically I'm turning the game into like 10, nine, 10 different segments. And the segments are gonna go like this. And then in the fourth quarter we'll do this. And it felt like the warriors were kind of ready for all the segments. It's like, oh, we know what you're gonna do. The first eight minutes you're gonna get Luka going. Well, we're not gonna let him going. And just on and on it kind of went. And the one variable they couldn't really Prepare for is LeBron just all of a sudden was just playing great.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Just turning up. But I do, I do feel like it's just a little bit gimmicky still with the, with the Lakers as talented as they are, because to not have rim protection.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

To play those three guys at the same time, and LeBron has been so much better on defense, but I don't know how sustainable that is when we're playing every other day in the playoffs. But Luka and Reaves out there at the same time, it's just, it's really tough when you're playing a slash and kick team like the one today. Plus Butler, there was a couple times he was like, oh, you're putting this guy on me. And he would just go right to the basket. So it's a weird team. I. I'm still afraid of them. If you talk. I've talked to a couple former famous players who are. All the famous players who used to play are really high in this Lakers team, I think, except Barkley. Just because they see like the talent and the potential. But I wonder, could that end up being this team's legacy? Are we seeing things that maybe aren't quite there, but we're projecting what we think is there, or is this just a team that can't really rebound or defend anybody?

[Rob Mahoney]

I think the defense, it does come and go. And I think the rim protection thing is really instructive here. Cause they don't have. By not having a traditional defensive anchor, the only way they play elite defense is flying around playing with incredible effort and focus all the time. And so it's not a huge surprise that they can't do that every single game. It's not a huge surprise they can't chain it together for five games at a time. Sometimes it's just going to be a little bit more of a peaks and valleys kind of experience for them. On that end, I think ultimately you're banking on the playmaking. And this is where I can kind of see the logic in the segmenting the game that you're talking about. It's like if you have two of the most creative people in the sport, the idea of, oh, I'm going to put these very orderly boxes in place and I'm going to trust these geniuses to navigate it. That's a pretty good premise as far as I'm concerned.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I watched the Indiana Laker game with my dad last week. And the one thing I don't think this Lakers team's going to be. And the Pacers wouldn't do it all the time. We were going nuts because we're just rooting against the Lakers. We're just like, spread them out, go to the basket, spread them out, go to the basket, spread them out, go to the basket. And then sometimes Indiana would just settle for these 26 footers. Like, dude, just go to the basket. You're going to get to the basket. And I think more and more teams are starting to realize this. Just go to the basket. There's going to be nobody waiting for you. We're going to get there. On the Lakers side, I just think LeBron's playing unbelievable.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's so good.

[Bill Simmons]

I just, I don't really understand it from an all around standpoint. It's probably. This is the most. He's looked like 2013 range. LeBron, like, he was 10 for 15 tonight. It's not like he's taking a shitload of shots and has the ball all the time. He's like picking his spots. The defense, he's trying to rebound. He didn't really rebound tonight as much as he usually has, but the all around stuff's been really great. I also don't know if that's sustainable when we get to mid April. Going every other day, big picture.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Neither of these teams wants that playing game.

[Rob Mahoney]

No, definitely not.

[Bill Simmons]

That's just extra miles on the car. That's like, oh, we're going to go all the way across country to la, but on the way we're going to go this way and stop at the Grand Canyon. Like, they don't want to stop at the Grand Canyon. It's just like we want this trip to be straight as possible. Lakers are 4, right. Golden State is 5. Normally that sounds great, but the T Wolves are 71 behind the warriors and the Lost Column. And then the Lakers are two over them and the Grizzlies, who won an amazing game tonight against Miami. It was like, it was one of. I watched it. It was one of those, I don't know who's winning this game. And then Ja once again comes through at the end.

[Rob Mahoney]

Crazy shot.

[Bill Simmons]

Right when it seemed like Memphis was just gonna free fall into the eighth seed. And it was like, oh, shit, okc, Memphis. We have our NBA TV series. I don't need to watch one second of this. We're going for a sweep. But Memphis wins. And now this is a mess. And I don't, I don't know how much you want to do on Western Conference playoff roulette, but the only thing I can think is I would just much rather be in that 2, 3 area so I don't have to see OKC for a little while. And I wonder as we get into the final week, who starts getting a little chicanerous? Just made up that word to try to nudge their way. I'm not like I have my eye on Denver.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, they certainly don't seem to care about the standings too much.

[Bill Simmons]

Like they're after they lost that Minnesota game. I think, I think they're like, whatever. May the chips fall where they may. Yep. I don't. If I'm the Lakers, I don't want to see OKC until round three because that's the one team I don't think the Lakers can beat. And do you think I'm crazy? I just don't like that matchup for them in any way, shape or form.

[Rob Mahoney]

If you are any basketball team, you don't want to see OKC till round three or the NBA Finals, like those are the only options that you would prefer. So. But like as far as the chicanery goes, that's a, that's a real fine line you're trying to walk to basically get to 6 and lock in at 6 is the ideal spot if you're going to be in the 4, 5, 6 range. Because 4 and 5. Yeah. You're going to be potentially roadkill for the Thunder, who look just increasingly incredible, to be honest with you. And I want no part of that team.

[Bill Simmons]

6412 + 13.4 I mean, I think they beat everybody.

[Rob Mahoney]

They're so good.

[Bill Simmons]

And Jokic is having the best year of his career and with six games left, I don't think I'm going to vote for him for mvp.

[Rob Mahoney]

Oh, you're sealed up.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm not sealed up, but I'm like 98% there.

[Rob Mahoney]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

I just feel like we're going to be in the high 60s with those OKC team and it's not. You can't do the thing where, wow, you know, you could put anybody in that top spot. That team's still really good because every game I've watched and all the games I've seen OKC in person, nobody can guard Shay Gilgeous Alexander. No, nobody in the league. I haven't. I saw that in the. Gets the Clippers game I went to last week, he had a bad shooting game, but he. All the shots were good. They just didn't go in.

[Rob Mahoney]

And that's a team with I would say three all defense caliber players on its roster.

[Bill Simmons]

And they made him work for everything. He still got all the shots he wanted. Wanted. And he's like shaking his head. Cause he's like, I can't believe this isn't going in tonight. With that said, I don't think Minnesota would be afraid of them at all. I'm not defending it, but I just don't think that team has fear of any matchup. And I think they would waltz into that series and be like, yeah, sure, let's beat them. And that's the team they could see. And I think the Clippers know they can play with them because they've had really good games against them. Yeah, whether they could beat them, I don't know. But they're not going to be afraid of them. So I would. If I'm okc, those are the two I wouldn't be like super pumped about. Well, the Clippers are just.

[Rob Mahoney]

The Clippers are no fun to play against for anybody. And frankly, when Kawhi Leonard plays, they just do not lose. Except I think they lost randomly to the Pelicans one time. We don't have to talk about that. Other than that. Really just have turned into an offensive buzzsaw in a way that should be terrifying because they were already such a great defense. The Wolves, I am really becoming a believer.

[Bill Simmons]

Whoa. Make the case.

[Rob Mahoney]

This was a team that I was really down on come December or so. I just thought the energy with the team was so off. I thought the defense was so underwhelming. I didn't really see the vision in the Randle thing at all. And then all of a sudden, everything's starting to click. Like everyone who was hurt is suddenly back and playing well. The new additions, Both Randle and DiVincenzo in particular, are both really hitting at this point. Randle's playing, I think, some of the best basketball of his career. Frankly. I don't know how to feel about the kind of person who is telling you and many people on a podcast they should believe in Julius Randle, playoff performer. That's a. That's a big ask of anybody. But I find myself as we're kind of charting the Western Conference landscape, and I'm looking at teams like Golden State and the Lakers, teams that could win a round, but maybe not two or three. I'm seeing teams like Houston that I think can win with the right matchup, but otherwise might be out on their luck if they. If they pull the wrong one. Teams like Denver that frankly, not only do they not care about seeding, they don't seem to be terribly interested in playing defense in a lot of games. And I expect the playoffs would be different. But even still, the personnel is what it is. And I just find my way back to the Wolves. And I'm thinking they have the high end talent, they have the depth, they have the defense, they have the bodies, they have versatility to actually roll with the punches of a playoff series. And frankly, we've seen all this stuff in action in a slightly different form with Kat versus Randle and no DiVincenzo. I just. I really like what they're putting together and I think they're playing great basketball right now.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And all the advanced stats back it up and they could shoot. And I'm with you. I'm never gonna love Randle, but there's a physicality with you.

[Rob Mahoney]

If we're all being Honest.

[Bill Simmons]

But there's a physicality with him lately that I think there's a little bit more of an identity to the team as a whole. When you watch them where they've got size identity. And Ant, that Ant is just. There's no player on any other team that he doesn't think he's better than for better and worse. And that's just the way it goes. I. I thought Denver, Minnesota, I thought that other night I had already put my pot up with Zach on Tuesday before those two games. And to watch Curry and Yokage do that back to back. I know you guys talked about it in your pod, but just that five hours of two of the great offensive players in the history of the league really, really having a night. And it just was all in a row. And it got to the point with the Nuggets and it seemed like so many different times they had that game or they were going to lose that game, and then it really seemed like they had it. And then Russ, who is just wandering around with a fucking pitchfork, ready to just stab somebody with it, just sitting these crunch times, you're just terrified. He's the Texas Chainsaw Massacre guy if you're rooting for Denver, but he's not even doing that.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's stabbing himself. He's like falling on his own rake over and over. It's a disaster.

[Bill Simmons]

He was already horrible in the crunch time overtime section where there was eight times where you're like, just, just take him out. You're better off just not having him out there. He just didn't have it. And then he has that stretch in the last 10 seconds. And it was one of those games where you're like, when we get to game 82 and Sunday and we're trying to figure out all the playoff matchups, I feel like we're going to go back to that game and be like, remember that stupid game when Russ screwed up the Denver game? And now, now Denver's in the. In the four spot playing the Lakers and the four, five. And then the loser or the winner plays okc and they could have been three and played Houston in round two and just felt like one of those. And conversely, Minnesota, who, if they can get to the. Even if they're in the seven, eight, and they can get that seven. But I just want to play Houston. That's where I've landed with all these things. I want to play Houston, I want to play Memphis. Those are the two teams that I just think are a level below all these other ones.

[Rob Mahoney]

I Think the exception to that would be if Denver slides and ends up somehow in the play in which is not incomprehensible. These teams are really bunched up.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it's like they'd have to drop two more.

[Rob Mahoney]

It looks like they'd have to drop a couple spots. I think the Rockets could give the Nuggets a real run. I think that's a tough matchup for them. And I say this knowing the like the Rockets just blew a game against Denver with no Nikola Jokic. I'm acknowledging it, it happened. I don't think it's representative of the matchup. I think if you give these perimeter demons a chance to make Jamal Murray's life a living hell for seven games, I think they will do it. I think they have enough size to really gum things up. I think they're so physical. And that's really the question with Houston is what teams would really be bothered by high end athleticism and high end physicality. And I think Denver might be one of those teams despite the fact that their lineups are quite big themselves.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And the other thing that really helps Houston is their half court in the last six, seven, eight minutes is pretty brutal.

[Rob Mahoney]

It can't be.

[Bill Simmons]

But against Denver's defense then you have some. Doesn't have to be that brutal.

[Rob Mahoney]

Not going to play the words turnovers working in your favor. You know you got three opportunities on the board.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, those guys, they're going to have their team hopefully in this last week. Russ, I just can't imagine he sees crunch time again. You can't do it. It's too risky. Probably play the warriors on Friday night. Yeah, they end the season with the Rockets which could be an all time. Wait, what are these two teams up to? Or just guys. One team's just scratching multiple starters right before, right before we go.

[Rob Mahoney]

Are we still doing the. The last day of the season? Like all the games are basically happening at the same time to prevent this sort of chicanery. Is that still. Is that still going on? I haven't checked the challenge.

[Bill Simmons]

Did that work? But didn't they do like the. They did the non games and then the important games, didn't they stagger them in some way?

[Rob Mahoney]

I mean all you're really doing is forcing an assistant coach to sit on the back row with an iPad. You know, like they're still gonna be watching.

[Bill Simmons]

Well so then the other piece is you this Dallas, Sacramento, Phoenix, factory of sadness and Portland somehow still alive even though they've. They're just like can we just get Cooper, flag.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, no.

[Bill Simmons]

We won again. Dallas at 38, 39, Sacramento 36 and 40, and Phoenix at 35 and 41. I mean, I've gotten to the point where I'm rooting against Phoenix because I don't want to see them in the play in, but I don't want to see Sacramento in the playing either. And I don't. I don't want to watch Dallas at all. Yeah, I mean, Dallas might host a playing game where the crowd is chanting, fire Nico about the general manager as the playoff. As the playing game's going. So I just kind of want to get to the final eight and see where it goes. The Clippers thing. The Clippers thing is the most interesting. Where they land. Cause if that's. That's just a. Just a horrible 18 draw for a team that goes 69 and 13. Oh, my God. Here's your reward. The Clippers, they're healthy.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, they're healthy for now.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, they're healthy for. Yeah, I guess today. Wait, before you go. Draymond Green, defensive player of the year. I'm sure that helped today. He had a nice, big, awesome stop. Nationally televised game was all over the place. I thought that was the most against the Lakers. He's always a little weird because I think especially when it was against LeBron and AD and you always felt like he was kind of a tempered Draymond because those were his friends and he wasn't doing like usual Draymond shit tonight. He was not tempered. I thought he was very alpha y and looked like the Draymond that we've become accustomed to. Defensive player of the year.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I think he's going to win. Is he the defensive player of the year for you?

[Rob Mahoney]

I don't think so. I mean, look, he's Draymond Green. He deserves consideration. Probably deserves a place on the ballot. At the end of the day, I'm more of an Evan Mobley voter at this point. Just the utility of what he brings to that defense, how many people he's, like, constantly bailing out on every defensive possession.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Rob Mahoney]

The flexibility between the 4, 5 is not dissimilar from Draymond. Like, I just think he is an absolute monster on that end. And Draymond, if Draymond had been playing defensively the way he's played the last, I would say 15 to 20 games all season with having a very different conversation. I don't think the first part of the season, especially the first half, he was quite at this. This, like, peak elite level. This is still really high level defensive play. I'm not disparaging Draymond Green. He's incredible, particularly on that end of the court. I just don't think he's put together the total body of work for it.

[Bill Simmons]

I think it's a great point because the other one I was looking at was Lou Dort. I talked about that with Zach. Just separating everything. He's the best defensive player I've seen this year, but they're so afraid to give the perimeter guys. They are that award. But I just. He's done the most interesting stuff on defense for me.

[Rob Mahoney]

Do you take any responsibility for the perimeter gun shyness after the Marcus Smart debacle? Do you think that's what. What radicalized all of us?

[Bill Simmons]

It might have. I. But that was a little bit like this year. This year. I mean, the problem with this year is Wemby should win defensive Player of the Year every year. And he got knocked out. And it's, you know. You know, it's just almost like a political convention where the candidate everybody thought was gonna win is out, and now it's. All of a sudden there's 10 people arguing on stage. I just. I don't feel like any of these are, like, the greatest possible candidates. It's the same thing with Rookie of the Year, where it's like, ah, all right, we gotta vote for somebody.

[Rob Mahoney]

There's like 50 people deserving of all defense consideration. And I don't feel great about any of them necessarily, as, like, the definitive defensive player of the year. You're right. Like, it's. Without Wemby, there is a vacuum. It's unavoidable.

[Bill Simmons]

It's the most fun award subplot. Since it looks like MVP is a rep. Coach of the year is just like, just do a shot and do a whip it and then just pick one of six guys. I don't. Is there a wrong coach of the year choice? Like, I'm leaning toward Dagnaut right now, and he's definitely not going to win, but it's like, if they win 70 games, I'm probably going to vote for him. Atkinson's good, Bickerstaff's good. I. You just pick five guys. It's easy.

[Rob Mahoney]

I feel like the Thunder, like Shay, I agree, is the favorite to win mvp, probably will win mvp. Otherwise, they suffer from that problem where their team is so good and there's credit going in so many different directions that Mark Dagnault probably isn't going to get the credit he deserves. Lou Dort probably isn't going to get the credit he deserves. They have so many good players who are probably going to be under the threshold for games played. And so they won't get consideration for various teams and things. But holy shit. Like, there's so many places to assign credit for what OKC has done. And I think if you want to talk about the reason why they won as many games as they did, it's the professionalism and the intensity they play with every single fucking game. And that either comes from Mark Dagnault or it comes from Shai or both. And if you want to credit either of those guys for that, I think it's more than deserved.

[Bill Simmons]

I'll throw in this too. Caruso, 50 games. Hartenstein 54. Chet 28. Jalen Williams, 65. It's not like this team's been a healthy juggernaut all year. Like, they, they hit the first two months of the year, they, they didn't have a center for like one of those months. None of it mattered.

[Rob Mahoney]

It was Jalen Williams. He was their center for a fucking month.

[Bill Simmons]

None of it mattered. So there you go. Well, for the listeners, you could skip forward from right here if you're not watching White Lotus. Cause I have to talk White Lotus with Rob for one minute. So if you don't care about that, just skip forward ahead to Kevin W. Because we're going to keep going. But if you do care about White Lotus, stick around because I'm going to ask you about White Lotus 90 minute season finale.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yep.

[Bill Simmons]

They won't send us screeners. Joanna Robinson, Mallory Rubin and I are going to be downtown LA watching it live, going live right after on YouTube. Have no idea what's going to happen. Is this going to be crazier than we expected or is it going to be like, weirdly disappointing and more like thoughtful, existential Buddhist? Like we're gonna have like almost like a philosophical religious experience, or is there just gonna be bodies everywhere?

[Rob Mahoney]

It is gonna be a religious experience also. First of all, thank you for inviting me on. Now, the third White Lotus splinter pot. We've had every permutation of hosts possible.

[Bill Simmons]

This is the only. This is the only one left.

[Rob Mahoney]

This is the only one left for the finale. I will say, I don't know if this is great PR and marketing by them, but all the little quotes that are coming out from the cast hinting at the ominous results of the finale had me a little spooked. And again, maybe I'm just being played. I think, I think the body count or the philosophical fallout is going to be Pretty significant. I don't quite know which one yet.

[Bill Simmons]

Went back and watched the first step, the first scene. Gunshot, pause, gunshot, pause, gunshot, gunshots.

[Rob Mahoney]

But did you see any monkeys holding a gun?

[Bill Simmons]

Didn't see any monkeys. Well, I mean, I don't know. They're going Tarantino where three different groups of people are all shooting at each other. Who knows. But in the trailer which came out for the last episode, they really play up the poisonous fruit in the first 20 seconds, which we had talked about in our pod and you talked about on the deep dive pod about the fruit, the blender. They just kept coming back to it, how annoying the blender is. But now they put that in the trailer and now I don't know, is that a red herring or what's that?

[Rob Mahoney]

I know especially because I think we still have one Tim Ratliff vision yet of him wiping out his entire family at one time. And maybe that is where the blender or the fruit come in is like the visualization of this terrible thing but not actually happening. I don't know. I mean, he's not in a good place. He's just been walking around for days, stoned out of his mind, ready, ready to do something to somebody.

[Bill Simmons]

I gotta say, his usage rate's probably been a little too high. Yeah, I probably would have put him in the corner more just for spacing. Just run plays for him.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think he can run some plays, but like when Shay's out, you know, like make him Aaron Wiggins and then we're all going to be fine.

[Bill Simmons]

Was this the right number of episodes for you or was this six episodes stretched to seven so far?

[Rob Mahoney]

I think it was a little too many. It's not really a pacing problem so much as when people are off screen or kind of set to the side, they just idle in place for an indefinite period of time. And so that eventually I think starts to wear out its welcome.

[Bill Simmons]

I think it should have been seven episodes. Just in general. I thought first season was too short. The middle season was the right length. This feels a whiff long. And you probably could have gotten away with 65 minute episodes and had six of them instead of seven.

[Rob Mahoney]

But just a classic Goldilocks scenario.

[Bill Simmons]

With all of that said, I love this show. I've been defending it to people who have it's year three. People start to get used to the format. They start bitching and complaining about certain things. I'm just like, this show's great. I love this show. I love being on vacation in some weird place. I love the characters I love the mystery. It's always keeping you on your toes, and I'm glad it exists.

[Rob Mahoney]

Extremely glad it exists. I think, too. I think this finale's gonna win some people over. I think the calamity has been bottled up for this 90 minutes, and maybe that's just the wrong read, but I kind of feel it in the air.

[Bill Simmons]

Who is your favorite character this season?

[Rob Mahoney]

I love. I mean, I love Carrie Coon, so I am Laurie Pilled, and everything chaotic happening around her right now is just a joy to watch. I can't be mad about any of it.

[Bill Simmons]

Lori is also my. She's my second. Nah, she's my top three. I'm not going to pick a favorite, but my top three are. Chelsea.

[Rob Mahoney]

Wait, you literally just asked me to pick a favorite. You have to pick a favorite.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, it's my podcast. No, no. All right, I'll pick my favorite. Chelsea's my favorite.

[Rob Mahoney]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

Lori second. Saxon third.

[Rob Mahoney]

Saxon's coming up the power rankings.

[Bill Simmons]

Watching Joanna do a 180 on Saxon was. Was my highlight of 2025 so far.

[Rob Mahoney]

One of the great joys. Saxon's just bringing people together as his enlightenment processes within his tiny little brain. He's just bringing people together in really a celebration of everything that he's all about.

[Bill Simmons]

So do you think, Lockie. Do you think he actually took the drugs?

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh.

[Bill Simmons]

Rather than set them out before the threesome, do you think he was actually drugged up? Or is this some sort of weird power play with him?

[Rob Mahoney]

I thought I had escaped the wake of talking about brothers jerking each other off. Yeah. But we get dragged back into these things. I think he did take the drugs. I think it's maybe, like, paying a little too close attention to think that he spat them out, but I don't know. White Lotus is a show that cares about the details. Maybe it's not impossible.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, I asked because my daughter, who not only watches the show, but is intently following the TikTok conversation around it and always tells me this is a big thing on TikTok right now with some dumb aspect of the show. She claimed there's a TikTok where it doesn't seem like he took the drugs.

[Rob Mahoney]

It definitively proves that Locky did not take the drugs.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, but because TikTok would never lie to us and there's no devices to, you know, twist any footage around in anything.

[Rob Mahoney]

Of course not.

[Bill Simmons]

So I can't wait. White Lotus. So we're doing the live one, and then you're doing the deep dive a couple days later with Joanna. And then we go right to the playoffs.

[Rob Mahoney]

I know. Rolling right into it.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. All right. Rob Mahoney, great to see you.

[Rob Mahoney]

Thanks, Bill.

[Bill Simmons]

Thanks. The Bill Simmons podcast brought to you by fanduel. As you know, it's the final stretch of the NBA season. Playoff picture changing every second. Every three pointer or fourth quarter comeback means that much more. With live betting on FanDuel, you can make the playoff picture a little prettier, a little more fun. Whether you're looking to ride with a hot shooter, you think a team is due for a run in the second half, get in on the action until the final buzzer with America's number one sportsbook. We have Denver Golden State coming on Friday. What a fun game to bet on. I have no idea if Denver even where do they want to be in the rankings? So they want to be 4, 5, 6 that they want to stay at 3. We know Golden State wants to keep moving up. Kind of like Golden State in that matchup, by the way. However you want to play, now is the perfect time to join FanDuel. Customers that are new, get started with $200 in bonus bets. If your first $5 bet wins, visit FanDuel.com BS to join today. Make every moment more with FanDuel official sports betting partner of the NBA. You must be 21/president in select states or 18 + and President D.C. first online real money wager only. $5 first deposit required. Bonus issued as non withdrawable bonus batch which expires seven days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See [e-mail], get in prom call 1-800- Gamble or visit rg-help.com this episode is brought to you by Loom. By Atlassian. Some things, they're just unnecessary. You see this in the NBA all the time. Why do you keep talking to that ref? He's going to tee you up. Stop doing it. Stop doing it. And then they keep doing it. And guess what? They get a technical. It's just as unnecessary as tedious business meetings. Good thing you can use Loom instead. Use Loom to simultaneously record both your screen and yourself to share a quick update. Provide feedback, train a colleague, everything in between, whatever. Plus add Loom AI to your meetings. For instant written notes and recordings, try Loom [e-mail], that is l o o m. Com. All right, we're taping this part of the podcast. It is late afternoon east coast time. Kevin Wilds just got off the set of First Things First. It's like talking to Clark Kent right After he got out of the phone booth.

[Kevin Wilds]

Wow. Thank you.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. You still have your little handsome sports TV outfit. Just finished slinging takes. Slinging takes like they were hash.

[Kevin Wilds]

I'm feeling great.

[Bill Simmons]

Feeling great. Great time of year. Is April the best take month? Is this the most going on NFL draft? Nobody really knows what they're talking about, but we all feel like we have to have takes on that. NBA playoffs are coming up. There's already NBA trade stuff happening. First month of baseball season.

[Kevin Wilds]

Got some baseball takes.

[Bill Simmons]

There's some events, some March Madness is still in there. Masters is coming up. I think it's the best month for talking out of your ass when you don't really know what's going on.

[Kevin Wilds]

Are you sure it's either. If. If April is your first draft pick for takes? I would say week one, week one NFL season. That Monday or that Tuesday once the Monday night.

[Bill Simmons]

Overreaction Monday.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, the first overreaction Monday.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Just magnificent. Yeah, this is a good one.

[Bill Simmons]

Overreaction Monday. It's just percolating that whole day of the first. First games back. Everyone's just ready to go nuts. Great teams off. Yeah, it's great.

[Kevin Wilds]

The Eagles could lose by one point. Like, I don't know, they probably peaked last year in the Super Bowl. Weren't ready. It's just great.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm proudest of myself for the NFL draft because I. I'll watch maybe one or two college football games a week, if that, and have no idea what I'm talking about. But then I read all the mock drafts and I watch YouTube clips and then decide I'm an expert. Who do you want? What?

[Kevin Wilds]

Who do you want the Patriots to take? Cause I've convinced myself I'm happy with four guys.

[Bill Simmons]

Four guys. So I'm. I'm at Hunter. Yeah. Travis Hunter, Abdul Carter, trade down.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, really? Yeah. I'm happy with Will Campbell and I'm happy with. I don't really want T. Mac, but I kind of. If we go offensive line, I'm okay with that.

[Bill Simmons]

I mean, tmac now, this is one of the draft takes that's emerged. Is. Are we sure he's the best receiver in the draft? Matthew golden, buzz. No, McShay is pro. Matthew golden on. On the newsletter, in the podcast he's doing. He has golden as the best receiver. It's really fun when you have quarterbacks because it seems like Cammore is definitely going to Tennessee, but when you have this quarterback situation with the two teams that desperately need a quarterback, Cleveland and the Giants, but then nobody really Seems to think Shador Sanders is a, is a top eight pick and just how desperate. It's the age old philosophy. Something's changed. Sports changes. Basketball, we're shooting more threes than ever. But baseball, we get a torpedo bat. You know, every, everything evolves in every sport. And then in football, should we take this quarterback this high even though we're not positive he's a good prospect is like the eternal question forever.

[Kevin Wilds]

I'm almost positive Shador is good. I think Shador, if, if, if both teams pass on Shador and he has the Shador slide, I think that would be insane. If he ends up on the Steelers, I think it'd be great for the Steelers, but the Giants cannot pass on them. That would be bonkers.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, the one thing that happens is if, if the first couple teams pass and the guy falls out of the range sometimes, then, then the guy almost has a little bit of a stink on him and then the fall starts and it's like, oh, and then, I mean Rogers is the most famous example of this. But this has happened in other years where it's like, oh, all of a sudden the guy's going to go to 17.

[Kevin Wilds]

I don't have it in front of me. But then after the Giants there's a run of teams that don't need corner quarterback. Starting with us. We don't need a quarterback. Then there's a run of teams and I guess you get to now with Geno's deal. The Raiders are out. Then it's the Saints.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, you could say the jets. But then they just paid all this money to fields.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, yeah, the jets would be interesting.

[Bill Simmons]

I can't imagine he'd go by the Saints because the Saints are so handicapped by the cap that I don't understand how they would not pass up a chance to get somebody. But you'd have to really think he's going to be not good. Yeah, you know, all right.

[Kevin Wilds]

I don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

You read like pocket presence, tough as nails.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Read stuff fast. He's been in the spotlight for a few years. There's all this intangible stuff with him. And then other people are like he's just not a good enough quarterback. So yeah, the draft's fun. We get to argue about arm length basketball. We're talking about a playoff picture that just changes every day. It's ridiculous. Where you're like coming up is, is could what happens if Denver plays the Lakers? It's like they just might never play the Lakers.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah. Coming up are the Rockets. The second Best team in the west, which they are. Or are they just a first round fodder?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Ready to go home? Hey, should the. Are the Grizzlies dangerous playoff team or should they blow the team up? We don't know.

[Bill Simmons]

Never know. I was thinking, with LeBron, if anyone's generated more takes than him, and it has to be Wilt Chamberlain has to be the answer. But I don't think the take infrastructure was in place at that point.

[Kevin Wilds]

Great. The take infrastructure. So good.

[Bill Simmons]

The take infrastructure was not there. We just had newspapers and we had local networks and some magazines like Sport and Sports Illustrated, and then just people arguing in bars. But I still feel like he's the most polarizing NBA star of all time. He's still polarizing.

[Kevin Wilds]

Now, wilt you think wilt or you think I think Wilt.

[Bill Simmons]

I think it's 100% wilt.

[Kevin Wilds]

Do you count the take, the take infrastructure? If two guys are arguing in a bar, do you. It's a little bit. If a tree falls in the woods.

[Bill Simmons]

And no one is around, does anyone hear the take?

[Kevin Wilds]

Does the take still count? Or does it have to be recorded on someone's podcast that, you know, a lightly listened to podcast that two buddies are doing from a local bar, that counts for the two guys in the 60s, take doesn't count.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, what's crazy about the 60s? And this is how I ended up deciding to write a Chamberlain Russell chapter. When I did my book, when I was doing all the research, so many people weighed in on Wilt, and it was players. It was stuff that never happens now, like long paragraphs from, like, Bill Bradley saying, here's why Wilt's a loser. Just laying out, like in the book that he wrote, and you're just like, holy shit. People could just never decide who this guy was, whether he wanted. Even Russell was pretty critical of him.

[Kevin Wilds]

I'm ready for the Wilt renaissance.

[Bill Simmons]

It's already happening.

[Kevin Wilds]

You think so? He has a lightly managed YouTube presence. Every once in a while, the algorithm will serve me up. Like, here's Wilt blocking one from the top of the backboard. Like, what? Here's Wilt jumping over a guy. Here's Wilt hitting a four hook shot corner threes for fun. Like, oh, I'm ready for the take of, you know, it was the best player actually of all time. It was Wilt.

[Bill Simmons]

That's. That's going to come back because we're in the so and so was a problem era of social media where it's just, this is how I was Thinking about Wilt last week. Cause one of those accounts fed me game six bucks, Lakers. 1972. Bucks are defending champs. They have Kareem. Kareem's like, just killing everybody. Wilt in the seven in the last game.

[Kevin Wilds]

Is it the blocks?

[Bill Simmons]

He. He's blocking Kareem Skyhook.

[Kevin Wilds]

This was fed to me. Yeah, this was fed to me. It was riveted twice on one position or something.

[Bill Simmons]

It was riveting. Yeah. I watched it. I was like, oh, my. And then it was like, Wilt had 22 points, 24 rebounds, and 10 blocks. I was like, he did? Yes.

[Kevin Wilds]

Why are we being fed the same stuff?

[Bill Simmons]

I know. It was the for you. It's a for you tab. They know we like basketball. So this set me on some deep dive rabbit hole. I went to Basketball Reference. When I did my book, they didn't have the box scores past, like, 1986. So I went to Basketball Reference and I was like, I gotta find out more about this series. It was Oscar Robertson and Kareem on one side and west and Wilt Chamberlain on the other. So it's four of the best 12 players ever in a series. That seems like a big deal. The Lakers won 33 games that year. Milwaukee had won the title the year before. Kareem's killing everybody. So I went and looked at the stats, and it made. It made me even more confused. Wilt shooting, like, three times a game, four times a game. Like, for real. You can go in the box scores. Even in this last game when he was awesome, he was like 7 for 10. It was like, why did Wilt stop shooting? He scored 100 points in a game.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's odd.

[Bill Simmons]

Why did he just turn into a rebound block shot guy? And then Kareem was like, 35 and 20 the entire series.

[Kevin Wilds]

What year was that?

[Bill Simmons]

1972.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay, so the 70. The. Yeah, the 71, 72. Lakers. We just did a thing about the Thunder, how good they are, winning percentage.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And it was the warriors team, obviously. Then it was two Bulls teams, Thunder in the middle, then that. Then that Lakers squad with, like. It was like, Jerry. It was Jerry west was on it. And then I guess Elgin had a cup of coffee. I was looking at the thing got her. Was there.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And who else was there? The guy that no one talks about. The Gail Goodrich. Gail Goodrich that I didn't. I don't. I'm a blank slate when it comes to Gail Goodrich. But Gail Goodrich Average, like, 26 points in the playoffs.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I read every Sports Illustrated story about it. And it was 2, 2 after four games. And then the Lakers won the last two. And one of the keys to the series was Jim McMillan, who struggled with weight during the first part of his career. His teammates called him Punch ball. But then he lit it up in the series and I was like, imagine this now this would be like two days of Jim McMillan. Jim McMillan. I wish we had it in him.

[Kevin Wilds]

Kim got rid of the donuts and he's came to play.

[Bill Simmons]

But the. The league back then, like, they just, you know, it was a pretty. It was doing okay. But you have this series that really, if it happened now, it'd be this incredible series where you have like some of the greatest players of all time battling like real stakes Back to back, versus a 33 game winning streak. I didn't know anything about it. So, yeah, Wilt, I have no idea why he stopped shooting. I would watch like a 15 episode Wilt Chamberlain thing if it was done.

[Kevin Wilds]

Correctly, start working on it. Because then he did start working on it.

[Bill Simmons]

Then he did. He just quit and started playing volleyball. He had that whole stretch. Very interesting.

[Kevin Wilds]

Was he playing professional volleyball?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, played professional volleyball.

[Kevin Wilds]

Could you imagine lining up, seeing Wilt Chamberlain come in for the first day? The first day where it's like, you know, there's no social media. You don't even know who's going to show up. And all of a sudden it's like, is that Wilt Chamberlain?

[Bill Simmons]

Right, that is him, right?

[Kevin Wilds]

That's Wilt Chamberlain, right?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. There was another thing that got fed to me with it was Wilt Chamberlain when he was 16, playing with pros. And he's the same Wilt Chamberlain body, but he's super skinny and just like completely dominating everybody. I think Wilt's underrated as a Twitter because sometimes young Shaq will have a moment on social media too, where he's just like going full court and dunking over guys and they're like, oh, Jesus, you know what?

[Kevin Wilds]

The sh. The. The young Shaq moment that gets a lot of play on social media. All star warmups. Is Jordan guarding him? I think it's just a war. It's just they're like joking around and he has like some sort of crossover. He looks like Stan Van Gundy, like a crossover spin layup on Jordan. Like, yep, that will work. Like, yes, young Shaq.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, because I'll go to Twitter and now it defaults to the for your page. But the for your page is getting better. And it's just serving me basketball now. Constantly so, like, the other day I went on and it was Kobe against Rip Hamilton in a 1996 McDonald's All America practice. And it was like, watch Kobe light up Rip Hamilton. I'm like, absolutely. How many. How many minutes is this? Can I watch this? This looks great. This is great content.

[Kevin Wilds]

Shout out to the algorithm. The algorithm's starting to work.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that's right. Instagram, it gets. They definitely. Instagram is a little gameier with the stuff they push. It's a little seedier. It's like two in the morning, kind of wandering around New York City kind of seedy. But Twitter, Twitter, they'll push you, mostly the sports and then something horrible that you don't have any interest in, like some sort of hardcore political or whatever. But I like the basketball stuff. So what. What sports. What sports storyline right now are you the most fascinated of? What is it. Is it NBA related?

[Kevin Wilds]

Well, I'm a little bit. I'm. I'm a little bit obsessed with Will Campbell's arm length, but I'm gonna put that aside that that weight probably crested for me.

[Bill Simmons]

How about that? There were two different measurements. One was 32 and a half, and then the other was 33. And he's like, I'm actually a 33. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And his wingspan got the. The longer his arms got, the shorter his wingspan got.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I didn't get that.

[Kevin Wilds]

It's just absurd. I talked to Jeff Schwartz about it. He's like, it's nothing. He'll just be able to go like that and be fine. I guess it's. I guess it's the. It's not. I want to be positive. I guess the number one story it's not super, like, out of the box, is can the Luca lebron experiment, if you want to call it that, gel fast enough to get a championship. I still think there's a number one story.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. And there's no answer. So you could just talk about it in circles forever and nobody knows until.

[Kevin Wilds]

We see the playoffs. The fact that they were the number one defense for a good stretch, how did that happen? Was that just a string of luck and hustle or. And is that going to come down? And then I guess the other thing they were trying to figure out is the thing about the Thunder that I just mentioned, and if they are truly, like, on paper, a historic team, if they don't win, did they underachieve? No one seems to be saying, like, yeah, they don't win the finals. They underachieved.

[Bill Simmons]

They're like the 2016 warriors, right? Yeah, yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

But they ran into. They. They lost because they ran into a legendary performer. So are they gonna.

[Bill Simmons]

That's not what.

[Rob Mahoney]

That's not what.

[Bill Simmons]

They lost. Go ahead.

[Kevin Wilds]

Why did you.

[Bill Simmons]

They lost because they suspended Draymond for game five.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, that's. You know, I mean, that's fair.

[Bill Simmons]

It's a tough suspension. It's funny because Adam Silver has been in the. In the circles recently. Cause there's this growing conspiracy thing that. I don't know how this would be true, but it's been a fun one to monitor that the league pushed for the LUCA trade to the Lakers. I mean, it's a great one, though. It's. It's turning into this generation's version of the frozen envelope with the Ewing lottery.

[Kevin Wilds]

I just can't.

[Bill Simmons]

It's because it's. There's no other explanation for the trade. So now the conspiracy people have nudged that way to that one, and I can't wait to get aggregated incorrectly for it.

[Kevin Wilds]

Did the conspiracy community already move off of. They were trying to purposely sour the fan base to move the team to Las Vegas? I thought that was the first conspiracy theory.

[Bill Simmons]

That was the first one. Listen, did I hop on that tricycle and take it around for a little spin in my living room? I did. I did. I tested it out. It's pretty ludicrous. I like the league. Brokering a trade is pretty funny, especially because they killed the Chris Paul trade to the Lakers 15 years ago.

[Kevin Wilds]

So it's no conspiracies. Me.

[Bill Simmons]

But that's the thing. When there's no explanation for something, that's when conspiracies start. When it's just like, this is the dumbest trade ever. There has to be a reason this happened. No, none of the reasons fit. That's when you have conspiracies.

[Kevin Wilds]

Just bad call. Just bad decision. Here's the thing. I. I was going to do a thing on. It took me a long time because everybody had their. Everybody had their own LUCA take.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And. And I didn't. I know, like, what's my angle on this? It's such a bad decision. And I came up with it.

[Rob Mahoney]

It's a little story.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay.

[Kevin Wilds]

One day I was working on. We would do, like, commercial maintenance and, like, painting and stuff. We take care of, like, parking lots and stuff. And my boss got a job. Power washing. We were power washing, ironically, a car wash. The outside of a car wash. And the first day I went, I had sneakers on and socks. And again, soaked. It's a real. It's not even Power washer. We're like stripping the cinder block with this high powered pressure washer. And I had socks on and wet shoes and it was the worst. I'm like stomping around. It's just I had like trench foot. Next day I said, I can't do this again. I'm going to wear sandals because we're going to do a two day project. Next day, I wear sandals. Pressure washing. Pressure washing. The only thing worse than having trench foot is having all these little paint chips in between my toes. And I'm stepping in, they're sharp and it's bothering me and annoying me so much. I have this pressure washer and I look down at my foot. I said, oh, this would feel so good if I take this pressure washer.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, no.

[Kevin Wilds]

And get. And I just looked at it and I just did it and I. It was. And there's no conspiracy to it. There was no. Like, maybe Wilds wanted to get off of work and maybe he was upset with the job and maybe he wanted to go back and work on a different project. No, you know what? It was just an absolutely horrible decision on my part to blast my own foot in some skin off.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, you knocked some skin off.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, of course. Of course. It's blasting my own foot. That is the Luca trade. There's. It's just a really bad decision that I think immediately you recognize. Whoa, Bad call on my.

[Bill Simmons]

SO skins hanging off Nico Harrison's body right as the trade's being called in.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, wow. I didn't realize that. I did realize, now that I think about it, if I could go back, I would. I would not do that again. That was.

[Bill Simmons]

See, I think the only move. The only move for him is just to resign. Because at some point you only have one life, we think. And if your life just for the next two years is you've committed this reviled transaction and the whole point of being a GM or whatever for a team, other than running the team, picking the players, but you also want to go to the games and be like, yeah, that's my team. And now that's been. I just don't understand what the win is for him at this point.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, he's pot committed.

[Bill Simmons]

He's in.

[Kevin Wilds]

This has to be all in. You can't resign. And then all of a sudden you get Cooper flag and someone else is like, man, we did it.

[Bill Simmons]

So wait until after the draft. Make sure you didn't get. I think you have to be like.

[Kevin Wilds]

You have to come out with some messaging like, look, defense wins Championships.

[Bill Simmons]

I'll never waver from that.

[Kevin Wilds]

I'm resolute. That's right. Tell me Amaral, like defense. When this next time this franchise wins the championship, it will be because of defense. And I'll put you with Anthony Davis.

[Bill Simmons]

This is good. So the best case scenario for him is the Lakers suck in the playoffs. They underachieve in some way or it doesn't work out. And there's more questions about Luka. Even though there shouldn't be questions. But a little like after the finals last year, like huh. He wasn't that good in the finals and the Celtics really attacked him on defense.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah. Like oh, war a little bit maybe.

[Bill Simmons]

Maybe this could be a James Harden of this generation kind of guy. He'd have that and then you would have. Whoever wins the title. It's like, man, like OKC wins the title. Holy shit. Their defense. Wow.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's right.

[Bill Simmons]

That's defense wins championships. Then Nico's like, see what I mean? I'm trying to tell you guys, we're.

[Kevin Wilds]

Just, you know, a little bit unlucky with Kyrie. One draft pick. He can't. He can't move. He has to. He has to be give it a shot.

[Bill Simmons]

You know what's funny? I have probably a hot take off the trade. If they had gotten Reeves in it with how good Reaves is.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

And it was Reeves and Anthony Davis and two firsts. Like we're in the ballpark of like I can now I can start to see it. You can at least talk me into it after two drinks.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's the other part of it that's bad. It was just also trading.

[Bill Simmons]

I can't believe we're talking about this. It's so funny.

[Kevin Wilds]

Its face is bad. But then you still didn't get enough.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, that it's the not getting enough is the Is to me. If we're doing a seesaw, it's 70% you didn't get enough. And then 30%. I can't believe you traded Luka Doncic. But until the 70% of you just didn't get enough.

[Kevin Wilds]

Mikhail Bridges got. Was it five first round picks?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Two of them are kind of blah. But yeah, it's still. Davis is. Davis is like a top 12 guy but he's little injury prone. But yeah, it's. I don't know what you do because you've hurt the sport in a city in a way that we've kind of time out never seen just to bookmark.

[Kevin Wilds]

Just not to book. Just a bookend conspiracy. Bill didn't Hurt the sport.

[Bill Simmons]

Did not hurt. Well, that's what I mean. Hurt the sport in one city, but it helped in the other cities.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, Surely really helped the sport. The idea. I'm not gonna really help the sport, but did hurt the team. Also not ruling out Anthony Davis. Pelicans. Anthony Davis. Can he come back? And Anthony Davis, like, when we were having real conversations, like, his PR numbers are Wilt Chamberlain esque. It's like, remember that? It was. I don't know how long ago that was, but he was having those killer seasons and then kind of flame out in the playoffs. But, man, I don't know. I kind of believe in Anthony Davis.

[Bill Simmons]

I have an announcement for you. I have an announcement. They traded Mookie Betts. I think February 2020. It was, like, a couple weeks before.

[Kevin Wilds]

COVID I saw this tweet. Go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I'm going to do the tweet, but then I'm going to dive into a little more.

[Kevin Wilds]

Love it.

[Bill Simmons]

The Red Sox were never the same for me after that trade. They'd won four titles. Baseball was changing. My basketball, football fascinations were growing every year. All these different reasons for it. It just was not life and death for me like it used to be, but it was really about the trade.

[Kevin Wilds]

And not having that was the. Was that the beginning of. Was that the beginning of the end or the. Or the final, like, straw that broke the camel's back?

[Bill Simmons]

I think it was like, five straws that broke the camel's back. Because I love Mookie Betts. Like, the whole point of sports is to. You want Tom Brady for 20 years, you want Jason Tatum for 20 years. Like, you get one of these guys. It's like Dallas with Luca. You get one of these guys. This is like 1/4 or 1/5 of your life, potentially, that you're disguised on your team. Was, like, everything I wanted from a good player.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

So they trade him. I'm never the same, and it really made me. But now with this, with the Red Sox, with Christian Campbell and with Roman Anthony Gumming and hopefully Mayor, but especially how much fun it's been to watch Christian Campbell these first few games. And it's very similar to Mookie's rookie season, where he just, like, he's swinging from the heels on everything, but his bat's hitting everything, and you just. You don't want to miss his at bats, the way he carries himself. He had this thing the other day Cora talked about where he said he doesn't call his teammates teammates. Did you hear this?

[Kevin Wilds]

No.

[Bill Simmons]

He doesn't say teammate. He says friend.

[Kevin Wilds]

Love it.

[Bill Simmons]

He's like, these are my friends. My friend, Rafael Devers, he doesn't use the word teammate. I was like, this guy's out of Central Castings 22. He's the most exciting rookie they've had since Mookie Betts. But then Roman Anthony, who's coming at some point this year, who's the best prospect in baseball. And you know what? I'm like, I was on the Castaway island with Tom Hanks.

[Kevin Wilds]

You're back.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I was, you know, I was doing some spear fishing.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Sleeping in a cave, talking to a volleyball. But I think I'm back.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay. Welcome back. Yeah, I. You gotta start following the woo. Socks. That's where I'm getting my, like my.

[Bill Simmons]

The Roman Anthony. Roman.

[Kevin Wilds]

Anthony Roman. I'm like, oh, another home run. I'm just seeing highlights. I never see the guys strike out or ground out. Everything looks great.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, it's the only sport where when somebody's just an awesome prospect, it makes the most sense. In baseball, when you just see somebody and you're like, that guy's fucking awesome. I guess that can happen in basketball too, but not in the same way because they're a little younger and they're competing against like grown ass men. In baseball, sometimes you have these dudes come in, you're like, wow. You see some of the Roman Anthony highlights and you're like, wow.

[Kevin Wilds]

Are you worried about Devers?

[Bill Simmons]

On the flip side, my dad is A big conversation with my dad.

[Kevin Wilds]

He had a hit yesterday.

[Bill Simmons]

He was like, he came in fat in camp. It's his fault. He was like offset about it.

[Kevin Wilds]

I like it. I like all the stories. It's like, it's one part injury. It's one part certain amount of bats. It's one part. He opened up his batting stance and then I forgot. Was it Papel Bond said it? No, too many carbs. Like, oh, too many carbs would actually be the best thing.

[Bill Simmons]

I think baseball has become the new David Stern NBA, where every first month of the season they have some sort of controversy now. Like this year, it's torpedo bats. I was all in. I read every torpedo bat thing. I've been watching the Yankees clips of them. I was like, wow, this is why. Why is this legal? How are they doing this? Why don't other team. Like, it's really fascinating.

[Kevin Wilds]

Loved it. I'm surprised. I didn't even know that. We didn't. I didn't know that was a thing considering, like, if you have a Kid in Little League and there's new bats coming out every three months. Yeah, bats are like it's iPhone updates. Like, new bat. This bat's no good anymore. This bat is hotter. Oh, you need this bat. This bat's out of hits. We have to get a different bat. There's three different bat. Like the bat technology and youth. Baseball is out of control. So it's about time it caught up with Major league baseball. You kind of graduated out of baseball.

[Bill Simmons]

Bat parenting, you say, Let me tell you something.

[Kevin Wilds]

Hundreds of dollars.

[Bill Simmons]

I look back at some of the kids sports that I had to sit through, and baseball's way up there as the worst.

[Kevin Wilds]

Really?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Like, was he any good?

[Bill Simmons]

No, no. It wasn't about whether he. He was actually good. And I think the COVID thing kind of ended the baseball career, but stinks. It was just. It's. It's the, the seating, like the worst possible seating situations. The long drives everywhere the games. Nobody has control over the pitches, over the mound. The ball's going everywhere. Kids are crying. Like, if you go 10, that sweet spot with the boys between 8 and 11, anyone's a candidate start crying during the game. Oh, yeah. Everyone's like, it's just a roller coaster ride. But the sports I missed, thank God, Gymnastics. That sounds horrific. Swimming sounds awful from the parent standpoint. And then track and field. Those are the big three of the ones you don't want your kid to do.

[Kevin Wilds]

Do baseball. I'm, I'm. I'm a baseball guy. I like being a baseball.

[Bill Simmons]

Good to be outside, at least. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Well, the other thing is, I think you're a little spoiled in Southern California.

[Bill Simmons]

With just like, we can't appreciate it.

[Kevin Wilds]

I also just like sitting outside for two hours. I won't do it in my backyard, but I'm happy to just sit outside in the sunshine, like, oh, this is delightful. Also nowhere to hide in baseball, which is nice. Play a lot of sports, like soccer. Hey, how'd the soccer game go? Oh, it's this person did this and this person, like, no, dude, you're at bat, you have to hit the ball.

[Bill Simmons]

You know what was part of the baseball thing for me? I thought the parents were especially annoying. It's a tough parent crowd, but the guy who has to go right behind own plate and videotape all his kids pitches and he's blocking everybody. And then the two parents would get a little chirpy with kids on the other team. You're like, dude, these kids are 10. Shut up. Yeah, it's a pretty bad scene for that confession.

[Kevin Wilds]

Although I like all.

[Bill Simmons]

You're one of those parents.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, I'm a center field parent.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, that's really smart.

[Kevin Wilds]

By myself.

[Bill Simmons]

That's great. That's really smart.

[Kevin Wilds]

I just like watching the game. I like watching the game. I like watching my kids games. And like, if I could have a, like a man cave, it would be like an isolation chamber. It would be like something that, that would be against the, you know, Geneva Conventions. It would be just me in a room all by myself with, with. I would like to have Twitter to follow along, but I don't need anyone. I just like to be all by myself consuming the game. I don't like to hear.

[Bill Simmons]

It's funny you mentioned this because when Ben was playing third base, I would sit in left field and I really enjoyed it because nobody was out there. I was still close enough to see what was going on with him. He'd occasionally get the foul ball hit toward me. I don't. And there were no parents.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, I don't. Oh, this. And if you're talking too much about the game, I just want to watch. And if you're not talking about the game, I'm annoyed. So it's a kind of a.

[Bill Simmons]

When the parents who don't understand baseball. Isn't that a strikeout? No, it's. It's three. It's two strikes.

[Kevin Wilds]

I think most people, I mean that's a really basic.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, no, it's. It's only two outs. We're not out of the inning yet. Haven't had three outs yet. Let's. We'll take a break and we'll do half baked ideas. This episode is brought to by Intuit. TurboTax Taxes was waiting and wondering and worrying. It's almost like how in the old days of fantasy football we used to have to tally the scores on a Monday and then the commissioner would just mail them out to everybody and you'd wait three days to see if you won. Those were the old ways of doing it. Now Taxes is matching with a TurboTax Live full service expert who gives your taxes their undivided attention. They can file your taxes as soon as today. And while they do, you get real time updates on their progress. Meaning you can get back to what's important. The game. Now this is taxes. Intuit, TurboTax. Get an expert now on TurboTax.com this episode is brought to you by Audi. The all new fully electric Audi Q6E. Tron is a huge leap forward featuring effortless power, serious acceleration, the most advanced Tech of any Audi ever experience technology that puts you center stage with a panoramic digital stage plus an optional screen for front seat passengers. Perfect for watching the latest sports documentary. The Q6E. Tron is not just a new EV. It's a new way to experience driving. Learn [e-mail]. always pay careful attention to the road and do not drive while distracted. All right, so you've been doing half baked ideas with me pretty much ever since I've had a podcast. For whatever reason, none of them have been sold for millions of dollars.

[Kevin Wilds]

They're happening though. Every once in a while one of them happens.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, one of them got turned into a movie. The Purge. We didn't get any credit.

[Kevin Wilds]

We did.

[Bill Simmons]

Our leap year movie became the purpose Purge. I'll always.

[Kevin Wilds]

The. The. The watch. Watch TV like a. In a surround sound. Like you're in first base. Like you're in like the front. A front row seat. It's like a baked idea that just happened.

[Bill Simmons]

That happened.

[Kevin Wilds]

Didn't get any credit for that one.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, start ripping them off. I have, I have three bonus ones too, but I'll. I'll interspers mine later because this is your show and your gimmick.

[Kevin Wilds]

Wow. Thank you. I have two odor based ones. Great. First one coming off of what happened to me last night. Supposed to take the dog out for a walk. Midnight.

[Bill Simmons]

Ish.

[Kevin Wilds]

Ah, it's kind of cold. I'll just let the dog out. I just let him out. He goes out, I hear a bark. That is reserved for cartoon dogs like yowzers. So what's going on here? Come back downstairs, open the door. The dog's making like. He's like making noises. He's like drooling kind of like as soon as he gets close to me, he's has already been sprayed by a skunk. I realize he's sprayed by a skunk. Now he's in the house and he's slobbering.

[Bill Simmons]

It's almost like getting a concussion.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh my. It's. Now he's moving around and he's bringing this stink everywhere.

[Bill Simmons]

So you brought him in the house? That's the worst thing you can do?

[Kevin Wilds]

He was making noise. I didn't realize he had gotten sprayed until he was in the house. And now he's like freaking out. And I'm like, and I gotta take care of you. I'm not just gonna, you know, excommunicate him to the garage. I'm like, all right, we gotta get in the tub. I bring him upstairs now.

[Bill Simmons]

You stink A skunk.

[Kevin Wilds]

I stink of skunk. I bring upstairs. My wife wakes up, what smells? He got. He got. He got sprayed by a skunk. Now I've got the. The ragu in there. I'm pouring it on him, and he's like. Kind of likes it.

[Bill Simmons]

He's like, ragu. Tomato sauce.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, that's a thing.

[Bill Simmons]

That's what you do with dog. Get scuffed.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, it's some sort of something about the.

[Bill Simmons]

So did you Google this?

[Kevin Wilds]

No, I kind of knew that.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, I didn't know.

[Kevin Wilds]

I think it's like peeing on a jelly. Like a jellyfish thing. I think it's just convention, like, common knowledge.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay.

[Kevin Wilds]

I don't think you're supposed to use marinara sauce. I think you're supposed to use, like, tomato. I don't know. In any event, now I'm covering the dog up with tomato with marinara sauce. My wife's like, it smells like skunk and garlic in here. I'm like, I know. I'm making pasta in the tub. Covering him up. He stinks. The place is a disaster. Moral of the story. I needed someone to call, and I had nobody.

[Bill Simmons]

Like the wolf from Pulp Fiction for skunks.

[Kevin Wilds]

Nailed it. Oh, wolf of skunks. That's exactly what I want. Some sort of wolf, skunk thing. Call. A guy comes in, because now I'm going home, and everybody else who went to work today is going home and is going to say, oh, I'm so happy I'm home. You know, home is where the heart is in my entire house. Smells like something that God created to get animals away. And I'm just living in it. Also, I smell a little bit right now.

[Bill Simmons]

It's like. It's. It's. It's like days, isn't it? Like seven, eight, nine days. It's like burning popcorn multiplied by a hundred.

[Kevin Wilds]

So what? And he moved all around, and it was on his mouth. So as he was drooling. Like the skunk smells in the rugs. I don't know what I'm supposed to do. Call.

[Bill Simmons]

Call the wolf. Here's so what else. I feel like that can't be the only job for the. For the animal wolf. It's got to be. There's gotta be a couple other things. Like bit by a rattlesnake. He knows what to do with that.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, yeah. He can do all.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, he's got like five specialties.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes. That's. Sure. But I really in charge. I would just like to call him, take care of the skunk. Smell. But also, if you also, you know, quite incidentally got bit by a rattlesnake, that would also work. So then that goes into. So that's just a kind of. That's a one that happened last night. Here's the real one that I actually thought of.

[Bill Simmons]

Tough one for the dog, man. This getting sprayed close by a skunk. Honestly, a concussion.

[Kevin Wilds]

He actually started to like it. He liked the attention. Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

He's gonna court skunk style.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay. This one is called homeowners association. This is just a coincidence from the skunk thing.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay. This is going to upend the real estate market. All right. Real estate is usually based on visuals. Right. Curb appeal of the home. What type of view do you have? View of the water, View of the, you know, nice forest, perhaps. And if it's. So it's one part visuals, probably the top dog. Sometimes real estate's based on sounds. Oh, it's, it's a quiet neighborhood. Or if you're too close to the highway, it's loud and that will hurt the value.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it's.

[Kevin Wilds]

It's never based on smells. So I came home the other day, someone was having. Cooking up several cheeseburgers and I was like, wow. I was just walking home like this. Develop a property and maybe you got to figure out the wind patterns or, you know, you have a little pop up barbecue places. Yeah. And then you have to make money because the money is within the smell.

[Bill Simmons]

So it's like a grilling, a cheeseburger smell just a lot of the time.

[Kevin Wilds]

A bakery. We have a bakery in, in Portchester. There's a bakery. It smells wonderful. Ride my bike around, like, wow, should I go get some fresh bread?

[Bill Simmons]

Was there another level of this where it's almost like you have a surround sound system in your house, but instead it's a surround smell system. And you're like, today I'm going to pass out the smell of burgers being grilled and they just go through your house.

[Kevin Wilds]

I love it. Yeah. I mean, that's just.

[Bill Simmons]

Can't AI come up with that. AI can do everything.

[Kevin Wilds]

AI is overrated.

[Bill Simmons]

Like pizza. Pizza burning on a wood grill smell.

[Kevin Wilds]

Here's another one. This is not artificial. I'm doing the real thing, you know, not just like a fake. I'm not a Yankee candle out here. An old man with a pipe. He comes to your house because I don't want the nicotine. I don't want, you know, the chance of diseases and I don't want the secondhand smoke. But while you're at work, an old man with a pipe will come and sit down in a chair just for two hours.

[Bill Simmons]

And then leaves.

[Kevin Wilds]

And then leaves. But you go in there like, wow, smells like folk music here. Smells great.

[Bill Simmons]

You made me think of LA live. Walk into where we both used to do TV and do TV shows and Grantland was there, that there was that restaurant and would spew out the hot air from the air conditioning that smelled like food, like burgers and dogs. But it was like this hot, humid, disgusting version of the smell. And when you walk through it, you got hit by it every time. And you would always forget it was there. You know what I'm talking about? Was it bad smell? It was like a sauce from Katsuya Hot Heat. Like kind of food that was already made. Gross smell.

[Kevin Wilds]

I don't remember.

[Bill Simmons]

And I, I got hit by it last week going in my car in the garage. Did not like it. Okay, well, all of your odors sound much better.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah. If it has to be positive odor. So that's what it's called. One part Winston Wolfe of skunks, One part Home Odors Association.

[Bill Simmons]

Really great, great start.

[Kevin Wilds]

You want to go into another one?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Combine. I'll start here. One of the legendary pro day story. Kobe's pro day, where Jerry west brings in Michael Cooper.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And Michael Cooper was 40 years old. Kobe cooked him up. Jerry west realizes that Kobe is a superstar. He knew it. But that was a. That is a legendary pro day story. I'm seeing Cam Ward. Nobody's there. He's just throwing to no one. There's no opposition. Ashton Genty, we had his pro day. He took his shirt off, looked great. But he's running against literal garbage cans and jumping over little cones. So here's the idea. Remember Iron Mike Sharp? Yeah. That he would just come in and get beaten up and you're like, ah, that's entertaining. Iron Mike Sharp esque.

[Bill Simmons]

You're talking about wrestling jobbers.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes. For your four year pro day, come in wrestling.

[Bill Simmons]

So football jobbers.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes. But stars like, like Michael Cooper esque. Like Aaron Donald. Look.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, yeah. He's not working out lately.

[Kevin Wilds]

Any interest in suiting up and trying to get past Will Campbell? Like, worst case scenario for Will Campbell. You hold your own against Aaron Donald. And I know you're thinking the pushback is going to be pushbacks and be like, ah, Aaron Donald's been out of the league. Like, oh, so what? You tackled Barry Sanders. He's 45. I get it. But the. I forget which. Jake Paul. Jake Paul Tyson. There is a glitch in sports fans minds and it's happening right now with Aaron Rodgers. That sports fans. And maybe this is because of Tom Brady's longevity and LeBron's longevity. That the glitch is we cannot process aging of our heroes. Aging of superstars we just can't quite get.

[Bill Simmons]

I talked about this two weeks ago. Brady screwed it up in football and now we just assume Aaron Rodgers shouldn't be watching.

[Kevin Wilds]

Of course he's going to be good because Tom Brady was good. We're not like, no, he was one of the one.

[Bill Simmons]

It's really only Brady and LeBron.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's right.

[Bill Simmons]

They're the only two that made it into their 40s and stayed good.

[Kevin Wilds]

But if you are, you know, if you are a little bit younger than me, that was. They were the main figures of your entire sports universe. So of course the great players can go. Same with Mike Tyson. When I saw Mike, I'm like, oh, I don't know. Mike Tyson's got a chance. Even now it's like, no, Mike Tyson was pulling punches. Mike Tyson is.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Of course you can't absorb a punch. So that's why. Wow, look at Travis Hunter tracking down.

[Bill Simmons]

Look at him lighting up. Darrell Revis be great.

[Kevin Wilds]

Wow. Tackling Barry Sanders. Well, get Calvin Johnson out there. Can you lock up Calvin Johnson? Yeah, I think it would be great. So I have also a good way.

[Bill Simmons]

For the old guys to stick around.

[Kevin Wilds]

Make some money and next thing you know, like maybe you guys get another shot at it. Right?

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Like Terrell Owens trying to cook Will Johnson.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes, that would be tremendous. You shut down. Shut down to. That would work.

[Bill Simmons]

Do you want. Do you want my worst one? A decent one or one that I'm actually afraid to give out because I feel like it's an actual idea?

[Kevin Wilds]

I like the one that you're afraid to give out. Your worst ones are usually pretty bad.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay, remember masterclass, when all the be like Malcolm Gladwell teaches you how to write a book.

[Kevin Wilds]

Is that still a thing?

[Bill Simmons]

Dave Chang. I don't know if it's still a thing or not. And you would watch these tutorials, but it was like they would just get all these awesome people.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

What is the biggest question couples ask one another every week? The number one thing. Couples who are married, who are somewhere between my age group and your age group. Even though we're pretty close to each.

[Kevin Wilds]

Other, the number one question.

[Bill Simmons]

Number one question we ask week after week.

[Kevin Wilds]

I mean, this sounds so lame, but what is our schedule this week?

[Bill Simmons]

That's A good one. Yeah, that's probably. I had that. Number two. Number one. Should we watch this? It's like, hey, Netflix. Go check Netflix. What's on there? Temptation Island. Should we watch this? Watch one episode. What's this new show? Adolescence. Oh, Celtic City on Max. Eh, Sports documentary at a team. I don't know. Is this a good one?

[Kevin Wilds]

Sure.

[Bill Simmons]

Should we watch this?

[Rob Mahoney]

This is.

[Bill Simmons]

There's so much content. You never know what to watch, what not to watch, what's good, what's not good.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

And then you end up like, you're on Google. You're looking out like, oh, did Vulture write a recap of this? Oh, wait, the Ringer wrote a piece that said they said this was good. Oh, I heard on the. Like, there's this extra step. Well, not with master Critic.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay, go ahead.

[Bill Simmons]

We're doing all AI for movies. TV reality. So reality. It's like, should I watch Temptation Island? Dave Jacoby hasn't watched it either. He's a czar of reality. But we do have his A.I. dave Jacoby, who's taken all of his takes on reality ever. And then take Temptation Island. The synopsis, what they've heard of the show, synthesize, and then you click AI, Dave Jacoby. And AI Dave Jacoby says, I think Temptation Island's gonna be pretty good. I was a big fan of the 1 in 03 and just talks to you like Dave Jacoby. But it's AI. Same thing for AI. Roger Ebert. Roger Ebert's back. He's reviewing movies again. We're calling. And by the way, his estate gets a share of Masterclass, but we're calling. 40 years of Roger Ebert reviews, and AI can figure out, would he have liked the movie that's about to come out me. There's new heist movie. AI Bill Simmons. I'm dead. AI Bill Simmons. You know, it's like, maybe I can be alive.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, you don't need to be dead for this.

[Bill Simmons]

It's like, wait, it could just be.

[Kevin Wilds]

A time saving thing. You don't need to wait.

[Bill Simmons]

So it's Chris Evans and Denzel Washington are in Argentina and they have to commit a heist. And then I come in and I just say, yeah, you should watch this. That's all I got. Master critic.

[Kevin Wilds]

All right, so this was.

[Bill Simmons]

It's all AI.

[Kevin Wilds]

This is a. I hate to say, because you've done this before in our history of half baked ideas, you don't totally grasp the concept.

[Bill Simmons]

You think this is too fully baked.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's just called a business idea. That you should have saved for, like, some important meeting.

[Bill Simmons]

That's why I was hesitant to give it out.

[Kevin Wilds]

That was. That's what you call a real good idea.

[Bill Simmons]

AI Dave Jacoby.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, that's a real idea.

[Bill Simmons]

What about dive bars with Kyle? Like, it's. It's AI Kyle, Nephew Kyle, where it's just the AI can look at the dive bar and the sign and find out how many bars on tap and would Kyle go in there and spend four hours there.

[Kevin Wilds]

See, that's better.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Kyle, I feel like master critic has. Has options for everybody. But the AI can go and look at the background and figure out exactly what people like. And then they.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, it's basically your reverse engineering, like, supposedly what Netflix was doing, like, picking.

[Bill Simmons]

All of these characteristics.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, yeah. And then you're just reversing it. The thing I do like that I think you stumbled upon with Roger Ebert, like, sometimes Cisco and Ebert. I will try to figure out if I want to watch something. Let's read this review. And it's this interesting review that the writer is writing all of these things. Like, all right, here's what I like. Old school.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Thumbs up or thumbs down.

[Bill Simmons]

Right?

[Kevin Wilds]

It's worth seeing or it's not. That's it. I don't. I don't need any vagueness. Thumbs up. Watch it. Thumbs down. Oh, it's rotten tomatoes 8. You ever get, like, a 77% rotten tomatoes by the fans, but the other one is 62%. Like, huh, am I supposed to. What? Thumbs up or thumbs down? That's all I want.

[Bill Simmons]

I agree.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's good. That's a really good idea, though.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, thanks. Maybe I shouldn't give it away.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, that was.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, at least I got it on the record. Now somebody has to. Now I have trademark.

[Kevin Wilds]

Did I? If I did this one already, Kyle, edit it out. But I don't think I have. Did some caroling over the holidays.

[Bill Simmons]

I don't remember this one.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay, good. I did some caroling.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, we haven't talked to you since the holidays, so we definitely haven't heard this.

[Kevin Wilds]

This is fresh.

[Bill Simmons]

It'd be funny if you did do this and neither of us remembered it, though.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, I do think I have one of those, but I'll try. This one's fresh. So. Did some caroling. Exactly what you think. Some strong eggnog. We got some song books. Walking around in the freezing cold singing. Loved it. Loved it to the point where I stopped. I said, you know what, Lib? We should carol. Like, this should be our thing, too. Maybe we go to their house to carol one week, we go another week. And I was upset that I was going to have to wait 365 days to go caroling. There's no law against non Christmas caroling.

[Bill Simmons]

Year round caroling. Caesar's Chavez Day. Let's get out there, do some carols.

[Kevin Wilds]

Any day, Any day. Any day you want. Like, it's what people talk about. I don't golf, but like, I'm like, I don't know, it's a golf. Like, look, you're out here with your buddies, it's a nice walk, you're having some drinks, you're spending some time together and you know, it's a great time. Just mo. You want to call it mobile karaoke? Sure. Let's all get together. What are we doing tonight? Oh, we're gonna have a few drinks. And by the way, if you're singing, you're allowed to drink in public. That's just a little carve out of the law, I don't think.

[Bill Simmons]

Bring caroling back.

[Kevin Wilds]

But I don't even know if. Is caroling holiday specific or am I just a door to door?

[Bill Simmons]

I always felt it. Did I? I feel like there needs to be a specific reason for caroling. Like in the holidays, it's because everybody's in cheerful mood and they're in the giving spirit. But what, what does that mean for.

[Kevin Wilds]

But if I showed up on your doorstep on July 4th to sing the Star Spangled Banner, you wouldn't turn me away. I got a cocktail.

[Bill Simmons]

That's why this is happening. I'd probably be like, why is that guy at our door?

[Kevin Wilds]

I have lots of friends. I give you a Budweiser, let's go. And we're just going down. We're just singing patriotic songs.

[Bill Simmons]

It feels like this could be co opted by bad people who'd be like, let's do the thing where we pretend we're caroling and then we rob some houses.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, gee whiz.

[Kevin Wilds]

I mean, yeah. So could. I don't know. If you look at through that lens, the cynical guy. My goodness. All right, this one is more basic. All right, I'll do the other one that I think. I don't think I've. Have I done the anti scout?

[Bill Simmons]

No, I don't think so.

[Kevin Wilds]

This is a little bit like baseball because, you know, youth sports right now.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Spending a lot of money, lot of camps, traveling around, multiple sports, people gunning for scholarships. A lot of pressure on the kids, a lot of pressure on the parents to keep up.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, then you get to high school. Ooh, ooh, there's a scout here. Oh. Oh, my goodness. A scout from college or a scout from the big leagues.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Guess what I got Anti scout.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

The parents get excited what a scout does, looking around for all the measurables, looking around to see if your kid's got what it takes to make it at the next level. The anti scout comes to, you know, basically the parents have to hire the anti scout. Anti scout goes, watches the games, does the same exact thing, then has a meeting with the parents, says, I want to tell you about little Johnny. Congratulations. He doesn't have what it takes, you know? Yes. Let's go.

[Bill Simmons]

We've saved 48,000 hours in expenses.

[Kevin Wilds]

Good news.

[Bill Simmons]

Travel camp. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Great news. And he's got like an arsenal. Like, you know, when there's ever like, like always, like, Denzel Washington is always, like, out on, you know, Denzel Washington's trying to put his life back on the, you know, the straight and narrow. But then he has to meet up with his old CIA partners. Like, I can't believe I have to do this. And they have the one scene where he has all the guns and he's got to choose. That's what the anti Scout has, like a table. He's like, come on over here. And he opens it up and it's just like a chessboard. There's like a clarinet there. There's just like several books, like engineering and the coding and stuff like that. The anti sky, like, you can. There's a. There's a recycling bin for all your baseball stuff, your cleats and stuff.

[Bill Simmons]

Like, oh, you're just out. You're out that day.

[Kevin Wilds]

You could be out that day. That's probably too aggressive. That might. There might be a little more emotional.

[Bill Simmons]

So anti scout comes in. He meets with Johnny's parents.

[Kevin Wilds]

He's like, that's it.

[Bill Simmons]

And they're like, what do you think? And he's like, honestly, I watched him run to first base when he hit that line drive single. Heavy legs. And I don't think it ever changes.

[Kevin Wilds]

He's slow, but he's not upset.

[Bill Simmons]

It's like, yeah, it's like, it's the way it is. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, you're happy about it. It's like getting. It's like getting an offer. Like, you're saving thousands. Like, if you get a scholarship, you're saving thousands of dollars and everyone's thrilled. If you get a positive review, which.

[Bill Simmons]

You'Re still saving, you're still saving the money.

[Kevin Wilds]

Thousands of dollars. You're like, I've got great news for you. Yeah, this guy should pick up. You know, I think he's great with drum.

[Rob Mahoney]

Maybe that's it.

[Kevin Wilds]

Maybe we just head somewhere else. Like I think he's going to be a great wind surfer. Like really like yes, the anti scout and parents like text chains are always calling the anti scout to come in. He better play his best.

[Bill Simmons]

I love the anti sky also. It'd be a fun sports movie.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's a good take too. Write that one up.

[Bill Simmons]

This episode is brought to you by Loom by Atlassian Feeling stuck is the worst. We were all feeling it during COVID right? Just staring at the same walls every day and the same people unable to really go anywhere. Just being in a funk. Well, if you're feeling stuck at work right now, too many meetings and hunting down teammates to get approvals, there is an easy fix. Get Unstuck with Video Messaging from Loom by Atlassian With Loom, you can record your screen, your camera and your voice to share video messages easily. Using video helps you and your team save time and stay connected even when you're working across time zones. So now you can delete that novel length email you're writing instead. Record your screen, share your message faster with Loom. It also has editing and AI features to help you record forward once and get back to the work that counts. Unstuck your process, projects and teams with video communication from Loom. Try Loom [e-mail] that is L O O M dot com this episode is brought to you by LinkedIn. During the season, every baseball team plays 162 games. It's a true test of endurance. It's not enough to have a hot month or two, you need sustained dominance throughout. While the same is true for your small business, it's not enough to have a great Q2 or even a great year. You want year over year growth that starts with better hires that'll be there for the long haul. To find Those hires, use LinkedIn. LinkedIn has strong hiring data and insights that you won't find anywhere else to help pair you with the best candidates, from unique skills and interests to the connections you have in common. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of small businesses say that LinkedIn helps them find high quality talent. LinkedIn also lets you go beyond people who are actively applying. In a given week, 171 million LinkedIn members aren't actively seeking jobs, but they are open to new opportunities. That's a big pool to miss out on if you're not hiring with LinkedIn. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.com Simmons. That's LinkedIn.com Simmons to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. I got. All right, I got another one for you. This is probably my worst one, but I feel strongly about it.

[Kevin Wilds]

This means it'll be the best.

[Bill Simmons]

Baby names.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

When you're having a baby. We just had a couple of our friends have babies, and there's like this whole thing where you don't really want to ask what they're thinking about a name.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

Because they usually like some name. And then if you weigh in and you're like, oh, you know, and you have some sort of take, it actually could get a little awkward. So now we've hit this world where people kind of hoard the name and they're like, ah, we don't know. But they always know. You always know. Around month eight, you got your three finalists. But what I'm always amazed by, and I just thought this because my dad just got a puppy, because he's a psycho. He's 77. He just got a golden retriever puppy, who, by the way, is a maniac. But he was going to name the dog Sophie because they always have these ie names.

[Kevin Wilds]

Good dogs. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I was like, I don't know. They're getting this dog out of. They got the litter, they got the first pick of the girls. I'm like, this dog's going to be a little bit alpha. Like, it's got, like, Sophie sounds that. And more importantly, there's a ton of Sophie's right now. It's like. There is. It was like, yeah, don't do Sophie. So. And we talked to her in the name and the dog Ruby. So we call her Rubes. And you get all these nicknames out of it. But it got me thinking. He didn't realize that Sophie was such a popular name right now. And what happens over and over again when people have the names? They don't do all the work to find out, like, oh, don't name your kid Olivia. There's like a million Olivias right now. You're just gonna be like, your kid's gonna be Olivia W or Olivia S.

[Kevin Wilds]

Because you're out of the mix if you're. If you don't. Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

So when we named our daughter Zoe, we were all excited about it. Cause we didn't know any Zoeys, but we didn't realize is there had been a slow stealth Zoe Renaissance right before. So Zoe gets into whatever she's in pre K. There's another Zoe. Like one of her best friends right now is also named Zoe. And there was like all of a sudden Zoe's, Olivia's, Emma's, Ava. They're, you know. So I looked up the top five names right now for girls are still Olivia, Amelia, Emma, Charlotte and Sophia. And then there's Mia, Isabella, Ava, Evelyn, Luna. Like you have two relatively young kids. So you've seen a lot of these names in action.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes, yes.

[Bill Simmons]

The boys are Noah, Liam, Oliver, James, and Elijah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, no. Trending Charlie. We got a lot of Charlie's.

[Bill Simmons]

Charlie's a big one.

[Kevin Wilds]

We got a lot of Charlies.

[Bill Simmons]

Liam's a big one. Henry is in there.

[Kevin Wilds]

Henry.

[Bill Simmons]

And nobody zags the other way. So this is my half baked idea baby name consultant. So you go in and does this exist?

[Kevin Wilds]

I think it straight up exists.

[Bill Simmons]

Shut up.

[Kevin Wilds]

I think it's straight up exists.

[Bill Simmons]

Like it's like a service.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, I think there's people that do that. Maybe I read about this, that it was. Oh.

[Bill Simmons]

So Rudy says 100% exists idea. That's I guess fully baked.

[Kevin Wilds]

Both of you, you have, you have hit two fully baked ideas. You're one.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, I had a whole other thing where you could go into the baby name consultant and be like, we're thinking of something in like a 1977.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, I think.

[Bill Simmons]

And then they go back and they look and the biggest name in 1977 was Jennifer, followed by Melissa, Amy, Jessica, Heather and Angela. By the way, names that no longer exist. Those kids are not. Oh, Saruti says it's infiltrated as IG algorithm. Saruti's about to have a kid.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, nice.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Saruti.

[Kevin Wilds]

What's the name? What's what? Name is Saruti.

[Bill Simmons]

Just come on the zoom. So this hundred percent exists.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yep, Yep. There's. I'll get like, there's three or four different women that come up and they basically like, you email them like, hey, I like Sophia, but I don't want Sophia. And they'll give you like a list of names that are like kind of similar vibes, come from the same origin, start with the same letter, you know, it's very bougie. I don't do that. I just read lists all day and we don't have.

[Bill Simmons]

Has this ever happened in half baked ideas where there's been a half baked idea like I. Is. Is this a sign that we're getting old? What's.

[Kevin Wilds]

Here's the thing. No, I think that you just need you carve out your niche Bill of like sports names. Oh, that's the only, that's the only sports. A sports specific name. Because I think, I don't know if the baby consultants are huge sports fans. So you could be like, hey, what about Gail? Gail Goodrich. Gail for a Gail Sayers. No one's Elgin.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, go all like 70s. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Like you could be like, like that I think works. It's like how Jalen Rose. Jalen's name took off.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, but now that you should be Jalen. Sweetie, don't name your kid Jalen if you're having a boy.

[Kevin Wilds]

Of the new business. It's like Jalen Rose. Like, trust me, like I'm the godfather of all of this.

[Bill Simmons]

See, the reason I thought this was a half baked idea because the move is just don't do anything that everybody else is doing in the last 10 years. Go back. Like there's no Jennies anymore. Jenny was the most popular name when we were growing up. And there's like nobody wants to name their kid Jenny because all the adults all know people named Jenny and they want to zag. But really the move is to zag the other way and go with Jenny.

[Kevin Wilds]

I know, but everyone is zagging. That's the problem. Everyone's doing the opposite.

[Rob Mahoney]

It feels like it's a big like grandma name phase right now. Like names that were popular in like the 20s, 30s coming from.

[Bill Simmons]

I was going to mention this if.

[Rob Mahoney]

You go back to like Rachel, you know, just like a name from the 90s.

[Bill Simmons]

Kathleen. Yeah. I looked the trending names right now.

[Kevin Wilds]

Wilds, Rachel in the Bible. I don't know. But like Rachel was a pot.

[Rob Mahoney]

You know, friends, that whole popularity thing that nobody.

[Kevin Wilds]

I don't know any.

[Rob Mahoney]

Do you know any babies named Rachel anymore?

[Bill Simmons]

Well, trending names right now. Arthur, Birdie, Celeste, Daphne and Dorothy. So like the 1920s and 30s names are coming back. Yeah. We'll probably have a Marge and a Madge, all that stuff.

[Kevin Wilds]

I like those.

[Bill Simmons]

So Rudy, the thing, you just, you just have to avoid having the name that your kid just has to have the last name initial next to their name for eight years.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah, that sounds like severance.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, I was. Zoe was in one class where there were three Zoe's and we were like, we thought like there were. Maybe we were just naive. Anyway. Saruti. All right, that one's fully baked. Thanks, Saruti.

[Kevin Wilds]

Good job.

[Bill Simmons]

What's your next one? Wiles?

[Kevin Wilds]

I've got moms. No, that one's no good.

[Bill Simmons]

I can't believe they're baby Name consultants, that this is a job. I'm just stunned by this.

[Kevin Wilds]

This is a quick one. I just give you a quick take on it. We went to Duke, Alabama. We sat, we sat on the baseline. It was in, it was in New Jersey. Prudential Center, I think.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

And I hadn't been to a. I don't know when last time I went to a. I went to the UConn game at the Garden, but this was the first time I sat baseline and we were sitting near the Alabama band, trombones, the whole nine. And it made me realize, and maybe I. I think I'm pop. I think I'm right, but I. I hold out a chance that I'm just not. I'm misremembering it because the band was so. We were next to the band that there was no music playing during the, during the game. Like there is in an NBA game. There was no.

[Bill Simmons]

Like, oh yeah, yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

It was just in timeouts, the band going crazy. So I'm just putting it out there. Bands at NBA games, bring them back.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah. Like you're Charlotte, you're playing out the string. Put a band in there and it's.

[Kevin Wilds]

Happier and it's great. It's just livelier. Like college games are like. Bands are underrated at this point. I think bands are underrated at weddings. I think they're underrated at sporting events. They're like, no, no, it's the dj, they can do it. I know the DJ should be better, but just do the Pepsi Challenge. Have you know, a DJ on a street corner playing a popular song and have a full on band. The band is tremendous.

[Bill Simmons]

So an actual wedding band. Yeah, yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Full on kick ass brass band. Playing in timeouts, getting you fired up. Cymbals like, it's just great. It feels like you're. There's something to it where. Yeah, they're not hit songs perhaps. Perhaps they're just big cymbal crashes. But there's something about the liveness of it that like they're performing the game is happening. There's something special that college sports captures with a band that gets lost in the NBA with a reliance on DJs and playing sound during the games, which I am not a fan of.

[Bill Simmons]

Nobody likes it. And they do it because if you don't do it, it gets too quiet in the arena and then people can yell stuff and then people get upset. The band thing, I would say one of the reasons is it's taking up space somewhere.

[Kevin Wilds]

Oh, boo hoo.

[Bill Simmons]

Well, that's. I'm just Saying these guys are all greedy. That's why we have 82 games instead of 70, because these guys are grabbing every dollar they can.

[Kevin Wilds]

But that does make sense. A lot of seats. Yes.

[Bill Simmons]

Ballmer could have done it. Ballmer could have been like, I'm building the best arena ever. And by the way, we're going to have a band and not like a college band. It's gonna be like a big ensemble Doobie Brothers kind of band that during timeouts, it's like when a late night TV show goes to commercial and all of a sudden the band kicks in. That's what we're doing, folks.

[Kevin Wilds]

I think Steve Ballmer should do that.

[Bill Simmons]

Maybe he's listening. It's a great idea.

[Kevin Wilds]

100%. He should do that. I think it's good for everybody. Everyone loves a band. No one dislikes a band.

[Bill Simmons]

Great one. What's your next one?

[Kevin Wilds]

This. This one's too stupid. I'm. I'm reluctant. Oh, this is a quick. Another quick one. Then I have an insane one. What do you think about the jumping three pointer? This is a little bit of like the torpedo bat.

[Bill Simmons]

If you think the one, the one legged three pointer, like what Tatum does.

[Kevin Wilds]

Jumping from the three point line to the foul line. Like when this happens. There's a few things happening in sports that are so obvious.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, so you jump but you don't shoot till you're like near the foul line?

[Kevin Wilds]

Yes. So I'll give you just the background. The tush push. Hey, I'm a quarterback sneak. No, how about we get everybody and just push the guy forward? Obvious. Unstoppable. Seems like a flaw. I don't know why it didn't work before. Number two. Hey, torpedo bats. Hey, how about with a barrel? The sweet spot. We make that a little bit bigger and make a smaller part where no one ever hits the ball. Wow, that works. No brainer. Old school. Hey, how about we shoot more threes? Yeah, that sounds good. They're better than twos. Yep. Great. The running three pointer is such an obvious idea. I don't know why it's not happening.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm trying to think of the situations. So you need. It would need to be like a.

[Kevin Wilds]

Three on two every situation, every fast break, Giannis comes down and there's no standing. You take off at the three point line, bare minimum, you're getting to the free throw line for a little mid range jumper.

[Bill Simmons]

So you think this is the new Euro step.

[Kevin Wilds]

It's so obvious. And it's popped up on Instagram and Reddit and people have put like Dwyane Wade did it to win a game and he landed near the free throw line. There's no, it's, it's some teams.

[Bill Simmons]

I remember that game. That was awesome when that happened. He won the game. Yes.

[Kevin Wilds]

Some team is going to do it. Everyone's going to be like, is this allowed? Are you sure? It's like, yeah, it's where you take off. It's always been that way. But no one's doing it for God knows why.

[Bill Simmons]

I like it.

[Kevin Wilds]

There's no reason not. Is there any reason not? There's videos on the Internet. It's a college. Three guys doing basically long range finger rolls for three points.

[Bill Simmons]

Tatum's been messing around with this one legged thing. That's the Wendy thing. It's like a. Yeah, I kind of enjoy it. What's your last one?

[Kevin Wilds]

This is my buddies I would told. I told them I would do it. I think it's insane, but.

[Bill Simmons]

Oh, you're performing other people's half baked ideas.

[Kevin Wilds]

I didn't know would Bill Byrd do.

[Bill Simmons]

This in his Hulu special. It's like, hey, guys, while you're still here. He has a whole bit. I'm going to do.

[Kevin Wilds]

Well, you know, sometimes I don't really take requests. I'm not a dj, but this one is.

[Bill Simmons]

Okay, let's see.

[Kevin Wilds]

Perfectly half baked. And I thought you would like it. I will read you the text that he wrote me. I have a joke premise that's looking for an audience and I'm not sure my friends who like sports nor my friends who like comedy will get it.

[Bill Simmons]

Good start.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's what I said.

[Bill Simmons]

I'm intrigued already.

[Kevin Wilds]

This is what he writes.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Transfer portal for families. So I mean, it's a lot of. It can go a lot of ways. I'm gonna try to keep it above board, but this is just like if my son has been doing well in sports, handsome kids, you know, he comes up to me one night like, dad, can I talk to you for a minute? I'm like, yeah, what's up? I'm gonna hop in the portal. I'm like, wow, really? Like I've invested so much in you, like my time and you know, I thought we had something. He's like, no, you know, you've been great. You've been. Been great. But I'm just, you know, I think I can. I'm gonna move up to a kind of a better dad.

[Bill Simmons]

Like, want to get to the west.

[Kevin Wilds]

Coast, you know, just a nicer dad. You know, I got more opportunities out there.

[Bill Simmons]

Bigger room would be nice.

[Kevin Wilds]

Just like transfer portal for, like, people having marital problems. Like, oh, wow. Yeah.

[Bill Simmons]

I would say for the spouses, that's probably.

[Kevin Wilds]

You're getting divorced. No, no, I'm not getting divorced. My wife just hopped apart the.

[Bill Simmons]

I see. I like the idea of the transfer portal in general because it works for NBA coaches. It works for sports media people.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah. Hopping in the portal.

[Bill Simmons]

Just out. Oh, somebody's in the portal again.

[Kevin Wilds]

I am in the. Hey, we're looking in the portal. See what's going on. Lose your job. Like, I lose my job.

[Bill Simmons]

Could you put dogs in the portal? Like. Like, where do you draw the line? Houses. Houses go in the portal. Like, everything go in the portal.

[Kevin Wilds]

The portal is just like a nebulous concept portal. Everything's in the portal.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, here's my last one.

[Kevin Wilds]

Okay.

[Bill Simmons]

You know, NBA fantasy has just been destroyed.

[Kevin Wilds]

I got it.

[Bill Simmons]

It's the worst. It's been the worst for 15 years.

[Kevin Wilds]

I played and I was like, this is the worst, and it sucks.

[Bill Simmons]

It is like the opposite of fantasy football. And I think it's really hurt basketball because fantasy basketball was fun in the 90s.

[Kevin Wilds]

That's a good take.

[Bill Simmons]

And then as the years went along, you know, whereas football, you care all the way through partly through the prism in your fantasy guys. And then you think about the end of the season, guys getting shut down, teams tanking. Well, how do you make that more fun? That's impossible. Well, that's why I have NBA injury fantasy league. Okay, so there's all star break happens. We have our draft, and you can draft players that are going to get prematurely shut down, but you can also draft injuries. And you could draft either as the rounds go long, so maybe end up with six players and six injuries. And then if the player you drafted gets the injury you drafted, you get triple points.

[Kevin Wilds]

These are fake injuries, like.

[Bill Simmons]

No, these are the injuries they use. I'll read you some of the injuries that they use to shut down players.

[Kevin Wilds]

Some of the fake injuries, they're not real injuries.

[Bill Simmons]

Tyrese Maxson, finger tendon.

[Kevin Wilds]

I saw that.

[Bill Simmons]

Zion Williamson, lower back contusion. C.J. mcCollum, bone contusion in his foot. Paul George, some issues with his left abductor muscle. This is my favorite. Lori Markkanen, who's missed some time with patellofemora nonchondriosis with associated subchondral edema.

[Kevin Wilds]

I didn't know that.

[Bill Simmons]

Could be a first round pick.

[Kevin Wilds]

Yeah. Non chondriosis.

[Bill Simmons]

Darren Fox, extender tendon surgery. So you just. You have like 25 things, 25 kind of fake injuries that you couldn't really, the league couldn't really crack down on. Right. Like, oh, lower back stiffness, I guess take, I'll take your word for it.

[Kevin Wilds]

Neck issues.

[Bill Simmons]

You draft all those, then you draft all the players in the tanking team. And then you try to mix and match and try to, oh, I have Paul George and I had a left abductor muscle, 30 points. And then you go half baked idea. But you can't drop bad injuries. You can't be like real ones.

[Kevin Wilds]

No, it's all like the fake ones, pretend ones.

[Bill Simmons]

Like corneal. Corneal irritation. Oh, that's a great pick. I thought, I thought I was going to get corneal irritation in the fourth round.

[Kevin Wilds]

Your, your half baked ideas in this round have been all over the map. It's real. Like you, I think you evened out from 2, 2 100% ideas in one 10% idea.

[Bill Simmons]

Yeah, it might even be a 5%.

[Kevin Wilds]

Idea, but you evened out to a half baked idea, so you got it. Thank you.

[Bill Simmons]

I know. What's your, what's your closer? Do you have a closer?

[Kevin Wilds]

No, I think that was it. Family portal, offensive offensive lineman Santa. No one cares about that.

[Bill Simmons]

Great.

[Kevin Wilds]

Selling phone numbers. That's boring. That's a real Wilds.

[Bill Simmons]

I had a great time. You can hear Wilds and watch him on first things first on FS1. Yeah.

[Kevin Wilds]

Thank you.

[Bill Simmons]

Are you traveling for the playoffs? You doing anything?

[Kevin Wilds]

No. Oh, maybe Indy 500. We got an Indy 500 on Fox, so we go out to Indianapolis. I'm excited about that. I don't know if that's happening, but I'm into the Indianapolis 500 all of a sudden.

[Bill Simmons]

All right, say hi to the fam sat, hi to the crew. Great to see. See you as always. All right, that's it for the podcast. Thanks to Mahoney, thanks to Kevin Wilds, thanks to Kyle and Saruti and Gahal for producing. As always, don't forget you can watch this podcast as a video podcast on Spotify and you can watch videos on the Bill Simmons YouTube channel. You can watch me and Joanna and Mallory do the season finale, White Lotus Instant Reaction, our prestige TV podcast. We're doing it live on YouTube on the Ringer Dash TV YouTube channel. And then also this weekend putting up the Saint, the rewatchables that Kyle Brandt and I did after Val Kilmer passed away. We are just putting that up early because it felt like we could jump ahead three days. So get ready for that as well. And then Monday night Celtic City Catch up on the first five episodes of Celtic City on Max. Episode five was my favorite episode so we'll see if you dig it. Enjoy the weekend and I will see you two times on Sunday. I don't have must be 21 plus in president select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 + in President D.C. gambling problem call 100 Gambler or visit rg-help.com, call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gambling helpline ma.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text hopeny in New York. This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra Michelob Ultra A superior light beer and the ultimate trophy. Win or lose, you're bound to enjoy the ride with a good beer in hand. Michelob ultra crisp, refreshing, only 95 calories. A superior light beer. No matter the game, sport or season, Superior is worth playing for. So sign up for ultra [e-mail] courtside and you can enjoy some of these games with a nice beer in your hand. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2025 Anheuser Busch Michelob Ultra registered light beer St. Louis, MO must be 21 + to order alcohol Alcohol available only in select market markets. This episode is brought to you by LinkedIn. During the season, every baseball team plays 162 games. It's a true test of endurance. It's not enough to have a hot month or two. You need sustained dominance throughout. Well, the same is true for your small business. It's not enough to have a great Q2, even a great year. You want year over year growth that starts with better hires that'll be there for the long haul. To find Those hires, use LinkedIn. LinkedIn has strong hiring data and insights that you won't find anywhere else to help pair you with the best candidates, from unique skills and interests to the connections you have in common. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of small businesses say that LinkedIn helps them find high quality talent. LinkedIn also lets you go beyond people who are actively applying in a given week. 171 million LinkedIn members aren't actively seeking jobs, but they are open to new opportunities. That's a big pool to miss out on. If you're not hiring with LinkedIn. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn. Post your job for free at LinkedIn. Com, Simmons. That's LinkedIn. Com. Simmons. To post your job for free, terms and conditions apply.