Host (3:20)

Why am I able to hold my breath longer in water?

Theo Lucier (3:22)

Humans have something called mammalian diving reflex, Right?

Host (3:26)

That's where you, like, swallow, right?

Theo Lucier (3:28)

Yeah. It's a survival adaptation for, you know, to not drown, basically. But there's receptors right here and around the mouth that when they get wet, particularly if the water is a little cooler, it instantly induces bradycardia. So your heart rate just slows way down. And then your spleen will start to kick in more hemoglobin, which is, you know, like Velcro for oxygen and that. So when we do like this, called static training, when we're training to hold our breath in water, we just do it in a pool or whatever. You lay face down in the water and breathe through a snorkel, no mask. And that's. That's part of the warmup, is doing that. Even when we go free dive here out in the ocean, we swim out to the buoy, you know, quarter mile, whatever it is. And then the first five minutes, take our masks off, lay face down in the water, and let that slow our heart rate down and start to kick in that hemoglobin.

Host (4:28)

Wow. So you're taking the mask off because you pointed underneath your eyes as an important part where the water, if the water hits underneath your eyes and around your mouth, that's what initiates this process that allows you to get longer breath holds.

Theo Lucier (4:41)

That's correct, yeah. And you see these tourists usually off cruise ships, where they have these, like, huge full faces. Snorkeling mass now.

Host (4:49)

Yeah.

Theo Lucier (4:50)

And the water doesn't touch any of that. So their heart rate gets elevated, and a lot of them are already a little agitated. They're just not used to having that stuff on their face and breathing through a tube. And a lot of people drown in those things.

Host (5:04)

Wow, that makes sense. We did. We Did a diving course years ago, I think it was 2012, in Sharm el Shek, Egypt. And it started in a pool and my brother had one of those big masks and he freaked out. He didn't think he was going to be able to dive because he had like a mini panic attack in the pool and he was ready to throw in the towel. He finally got himself to calm down a little bit, was able to enjoy the experience. But I wonder now how much the equipment had to do with that.

Theo Lucier (5:31)

A lot. Because if your heart rate slows down, you slow down, your mind slows down, you're calm. Yeah. Free diving. I would be super excited for you to get into it because you get. I never have anybody to talk to about this that actually like gets. I will.

Host (5:49)

I will 100% get into it.

Theo Lucier (5:51)

Yeah.

Host (5:52)

I feel like I agree with you. You said a second ago, it's the ultimate biohack. I couldn't agree more.

Theo Lucier (5:57)

So many. Yeah. Benefits, like. So when I used to live in Santa Monica, I would go to Bulletproof Labs, had a membership there, just to mess around with all their toys. And they had this. I can't remember what it was called, but it was like this pod.

Host (6:09)

It looked like a. Yeah, the CVAC pod. Cyclical variations of adaptive conditioning.

Theo Lucier (6:14)

Yeah. And I remember sitting in there and it would increase the pressure. I'm like, this isn't very much pressure. Like, I can do like orders of magnitude greater pressure. Just free diving, definitely. So you get the. You get the pressure. You're breathing in negative ions from the ocean's surface. You know, all that negative charge from the salt water. You're getting sun usually, and then you're working out while hypoxic, which has a ton of benefits because it's kind of like sprinting underwater for sure. Depending.

Host (6:44)

It's that intense.

Theo Lucier (6:46)

Yeah. There's different styles, but when you're doing constant weight, which is very kick down with the fins, I mean, it's sprinting, it's hard. So you're like have to be completely relaxed, but you're using the largest muscle groups in your body and it burns a lot of oxygen really fast. There's another discipline called free immersion where you just pull yourself down the line with your arms. That barely uses any energy at all. It's super fun. That's probably how you learn.

Host (7:14)

Nice. I'm. I'm pumped about it. My. My friend who I would be going with, Nick Boskovich, we've. He's been on the podcast. He owns High Vibe, Superfood Juicery in Chicago. I think it's one of the best, if not the best juice place in the world.

Theo Lucier (7:28)

Yeah.

Host (7:28)

He went once with two professional free divers and said he almost died. They like climbed down a cliff. He said he had these shitty tiny little fins and they had the big free diving fins.

Theo Lucier (7:41)

Yeah.

Host (7:42)

And he was like getting left behind. He had sharks swimming, circling him. But he was, he thought he was going to get chummed up for shark bait and like, but he said it's such a good workout and like the, the hypoxic training, you know, I'll do hypoxic training but I'll do like a breath hold and then bang out push ups on land. It's totally different than having the pressure that you're also, you know, people are doing. So many people are doing hyperbaric oxygen now. You don't know like what 2 atmospheres of pressure you got to build up to that. Do you have any basis of comparison for what type of, how many atmospheres of pressure you're getting when you're free diving?

Theo Lucier (8:14)

Well, every 10 meters is one ATM.

Host (8:17)

Okay.

Theo Lucier (8:18)

So when you go down 10 meters, 33ft, you're already at 2 atmospheres of pressure. Cause you have the air atmosphere and then you've got your 33ft of water, which is an additional atmosphere. So your lungs decrease by half already in that short amount of time. And then you go to 20 meters and then that's another. So you're already at 3 atmospheres, 30 meters, you're at 4 atmospheres and so on. So I mean my deepest dive I've done here in San Diego is 53 meters. So that's already at like 6 atmospheres of pressure. So your, your lungs are, they're like that, they're about the size of your fists and so they collapse down so small that you get a plasma fill so they don't get crushed and it all happens.

Host (9:08)

What's a plasma fill?

Theo Lucier (9:11)

Well, your lungs are air spaces, right. So past a certain point of collapsing in size, they will, you can get a pressure injury, a barotrauma and bleed. So your body knows this. Humans have been free diving for apparently a long time because it's built into our DNA where they hit a certain point and blood plasma will flow in the clear fluid and it'll make them incompressible.

Announcer (9:41)

Wow.

Theo Lucier (9:42)

And then you come, you come up and then it's gone. It's not in your lungs anymore.

Host (9:48)

We're doing this in a kind of fun way where we're going to get to Your intro and. But I want to, like, I want to stay on this free diving thread now that. Now that we're off and running. What made you fall in love with freediving?

Theo Lucier (10:01)

That's a great question. I think it's. Have you ever heard of the concept of a samskara?

Host (10:08)

Did you say Samsara?

Theo Lucier (10:09)

Like samskara? Yeah. Like a previous life imprint.

Host (10:13)

Yes, yes.

Theo Lucier (10:14)

Yeah.

Host (10:14)

It has to do with reincarnation too, right?

Theo Lucier (10:17)

I think so, yeah. I mean, not to get weird and spiritual, but I was born in rural Minnesota in the southern part of the state too. So it's like all cornfields. And from the youngest of ages, I've always wanted to be underwater. And like, we. I grew up without a tv. And we would go into town and I would go to the library and I would find the Jacques Cousteau books, and I would bring those home and I'd look at all the pictures and I'd go in the bathtub and I would like, try to hold my eyes open underwater, like as a whole thing, my whole life. And then I even did part of my university in Australia so I could dive in Australia. And I did that back way back then. I mean, I'm 47 now. There wasn't any training back then. You just kind of went and did it. And. And then I came to San Diego. I built a commercial real estate company. Kind of gave up all my fun things for a long time. And then at the end of that, I was like, man, I wonder if anybody teaches freediving now. And I went and took some courses and it just took to it immediately. Like, it was just easy for me right away. And there's something like. I have an advanced scuba diving certification, several of them too. But I just don't like all that hanging off of you. You know, you're.

Host (11:43)

I know. I feel that you can.

Theo Lucier (11:45)

Got all this crap. It's. It's really noisy. There's hoses everywhere. The community of scuba divers outside of the tech community is like, they're super unfit and unhealthy, and it's. Their culture is one of underwater is Disneyland. So the. The underwater environment is there for you to spectate and consume and look at stuff. And it sounds kind of snobby, but there's like a famous freediving quote. I think it was Umberto Pelizarri that said it. He's one of the greatest of all time. He said, you know, we free dive not to look around, but to look inside. So I like the personal challenge of freediving because it's like a mirror that reflects back anything pathological going on in your mental, physical, spiritual bodies. Like if your mind's running, you're not going to be relaxed, you're not going to dive. Well, if you've got some weird latent infection you weren't aware of, well then you can't equalize because your sinuses are being weird. You know, you have anxiety. Well, it's going to show up. When it's pitch black at 40 meters and you can't see anything and it's cold, no one's there to help you. You know, I just love that aspect of it. And it feels from a health biohacking perspective, it feels amazing. When you're done, can you paint a.

Host (13:14)

Picture of what, what that's like or maybe like an experience that stands out and what, you know, what you, what you felt in your physiology, your heart, your mind.

Theo Lucier (13:25)

Yeah. In the early days. So I don't feel as much anymore because I'm just, my body's so conditioned to it. But especially in the breath work. What's that?

Host (13:35)

I have that with breath work.

Theo Lucier (13:37)

Yeah. You don't feel it as much. Right.

Host (13:39)

It's a bummer, dude. I used to get so high and I was like, this is the greatest thing ever.

Theo Lucier (13:45)

Yeah. Yeah.

Host (13:46)

And now it's like I gotta work so hard to get a tiny fraction of what used to be mind blowing with breath.

Theo Lucier (13:52)

I know. Yeah. I did a holotropic breathing course years ago and it was like life changing. I'm like, this is, this is crazy. And now I do it and I'm like, oh, that's nice.

Host (14:02)

Yeah, for sure.

Theo Lucier (14:03)

Totally. But when it was new, like you can feel all the air in your lungs gets pushed into your bloodstream and you feel high. And when you're underwater, that pressure feels like this big comforting hug. And it's like, it's so silent and peaceful down there and you're just drifting. And so you have this like combination of like inner peace combined with feeling mildly high. And then when you get out, you're just so, so relaxed. Especially if you get a blood shift. We're talking about like a plasma fill that there's a nervous system regulation that I think comes from freediving that you can't really get anywhere else. It's, it's like weighted blanket therapy combined with like hyperbaric oxygen chamber.

Host (14:58)

Yeah, it sounds, it sounds phenomenal. Especially for anyone dealing with stress anxiety, which is a growing percentage of the populace.

Theo Lucier (15:10)

Yeah. I mean, and it's more accessible than you think. There's a few pool disciplines that are based on breath hold. There's. Well, there's pool free diving, which is its whole own thing, and there's communities around that they just basically go in laps underneath. For me, I'm not into it. It's just pure pain. But some people, they love it. There's underwater.

Host (15:32)

Is that kind of like the tread running on a treadmill equivalent of free diving?

Theo Lucier (15:36)

Yes. Yeah. You're just grinding for distance. I have a buddy that's super into it. He's got a stage static breath hold of over eight minutes. Almost nine now. What? Yeah, yeah, he trains it, but I mean he's able to. Mine is only five minutes only. Yeah, I don't. That's not, that's not very long. I mean it's, it's. I'm more interested in going deep than, than how I am. How long I am down there. But this particular individual like to giving an example of how extreme that training is. Like he puts down towels when he does his static training at home because he shits and pisses himself because his body is so close to death.

Host (16:21)

I'm cool with five minutes.

Theo Lucier (16:24)

Well, think about those. Nervous system thinks he's dying.

Host (16:28)

Yeah.

Theo Lucier (16:28)

And his bladder just starts to void and his bowels will void. And I'm like, man, that is. And he's like, oh yeah, it's really normal in the community. Immunity, bro.

Host (16:38)

Have you watched David Blaine recently?

Theo Lucier (16:42)

He used oxygen for that.

Host (16:45)

He did. So he was. He did like the 18 minutes.

Theo Lucier (16:48)

Yeah. What those guys do is they go on pure oxygen and they hyperventilate it for like 40 minutes and then they go and. And then they're stacking that with extreme breath holding techniques. There's a. He. He had a lot of free dive training for statics.

Host (17:07)

So was. So he was basically doing like Wim Hof style breathing with pure oxygen for 40 minutes and then he goes right into the hold. And do you know anything that. Any techniques that he was using to maximize the hold beyond that or. I'm just curious now.

Theo Lucier (17:25)

It's all the standard, you know, static training. So he probably trained up to, to four, five, six, maybe, who knows, maybe even seven minutes or beyond static hold on his own, which. That's mainly nervous system regulation. All free dive breathing is based on pranayama breathing. So they just borrowed that. That's from the 1960s era of freediving. And it works. And so then they just do like slow deep tidal breathing. And then he probably. He probably did some hyperventilating and then got in there and did it. There's a group of guys that do what they call technical freediving, where they're visiting wrecks, you know, below 100, 150ft on scooters, and they'll hyperventilate pure oxygen and then go and do that. And they're down there for like, you know, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, buzzing around these, these wrecks down there.

Host (18:26)

This is crazy and really cool.

Theo Lucier (18:29)

Yeah, it's a whole world, man. It's freediving. It's exciting because the Internet free diving wasn't really doing much between 1950 and the year 2000. It had, and stuff had changed, but it was glacial progress. And then people started sharing stuff online and it just sped everything up.

Host (18:53)

I feel like that's happened across so many industries and sports and everything. Like, it's this now collective, this neuronal network that we're all a part of that is elevating at least when you look at like the 0.1% of our capability, it's grown exponentially. The reason I asked about David Blaine was are you concerned with some of these really long holds about when he's talking? It's a little weird. He's kind of slow, there's long pauses. And I've wondered if he's damaged his brain in some capacity with these, like holding your breath for 18 minutes, whether you did. Whether you were hyperventilating pure oxygen before or not. I mean, what's your take on the effects? If there are any of these 10, 15, 20 minute breath holds, shitting yourself to, to, to get there and training, you know, what's your take on that?

Theo Lucier (19:53)

I think it's a really good question. I'll tell you what, when I started, when I dove back into freediving for the first year or so, I actually had weird sentence structures and long pauses and I was struggling to remember some vocab words after my dives. And I'm like, that's not great. Like what? Something's going on here. And then it just completely evaporated and then I felt sharper. So I think it's a nervous system adaptation as well.

Host (20:26)

Okay.

Theo Lucier (20:27)

But I mean, that much oxygen, dude, that's a lot of radicals taken. Yeah, for sure. You know, and I mean, there's so many examples of guys that, that have blacked out. They've had a deep water blackout and it's taken them like seven minutes to recover them. And then they just, they come back and they're like, there's no cognitive damage. None, Nothing. Yeah, it's the average body. They say has about seven minutes of oxygen in the bloodstream.

Host (21:00)

Okay. All right, well that's good to know.

Theo Lucier (21:02)

Yeah, that's like kind of a. I don't know how they came up with that number. That's what they taught me in my course. And you know, most people kind of have that going on. I. There's a theory that early human brain development exploded because they were eating a lot of shellfish because of the. The dhea.

Host (21:24)

Yeah.

Theo Lucier (21:24)

And.

Host (21:25)

Or the docosahexanoic acid like you get in oysters and that sort of thing. Especially raw.

Theo Lucier (21:31)

Exactly. So you know, once you clean up what's easily available in the shallows, then you got to dive for it. And so that's the theory about why we have a mammalian diving reflex is because the food was more abundant and better for our brains. That close to the coast there was some super ancient early Homo sapiens or early hominid site in South Africa. They found that, you know, had a big mid inner pile of these shells. And that's kind of the take.

Announcer (22:06)

If you are looking to make 20, 25 your year. Get that six pack, get in the best shape of your life, elevate your cognitive performance, really live a conscious, beautiful life that is everything you've ever dreamed of. Then come down to Tulum, Mexico in the Yucatan peninsula with me for a decade and a day immersive biohacking experience. We'd be doing things like hitting the beach, sunrise together, breath work, eating fresh local seasonal meals, fueling ourselves with exactly what your body needs. I'd take you through a a personalized workout. We'd be workshopping and biohacking strategy throughout the entire day. So you'd bring down your labs. I'd help you get the gold standard labs in every category that is relevant for you and your goals and perhaps your health challenges, if you're experiencing any. You'd get those all done before coming down and then we'd go through them together and translate that into actionable health intelligence to completely transform your life. We'd be doing scooter and bike ride adventures all around Tulum. I'd get you access to advanced biohacking agents for maximizing your transformation in a safe fashion. Of course, we'd be doing sauna and cold contrast therapy together. A custom nutrient IV that I'd build out for you and we do together. And then if you want to do a two day intensive immersive biohacking decade in a day experience, then we'd also go on a free diving adventure together. So I've got A couple spots left before I head out to do an event with one of our guys the first week in April, and then I'll open up a couple more spots for when I get back to Tulum after that. If you're interested in this and you want to learn more about it and see if it's a mutual fit, go to biohacker coaching.com B I O H A C K E R C O A C h I n g.com fill out the short form. Grab a time for us to talk or text legend to 847-943-7221. And I'll help manually get a time on the books for us to talk. Now back to the show.

Host (24:11)

Have you ever recommended someone dealing with a health challenge or anything for them to get into free diving and have them take you up on it? And if so, what was their experience? Because I feel like we're opening a can of worms here as a type of therapy that could be integrated into a holistic program with tremendous benefits.

Theo Lucier (24:35)

Yeah, well, so I'm gonna answer it in two stages. So one, no. So because most people think it's just too far out for them. It's, like, dry. It's like dry fasting. They're like, well, how can you dive without breathing? That makes no sense.

Host (24:52)

I know. Everybody freaks out when I recommend it. Even just like a 12, 18, and a 24, they're like, you know, they're putting it off.

Theo Lucier (25:01)

I know. Yeah. And so for diving that doesn't. They're like, how can you not breathe? That doesn't make any sense. And a lot of people can't deal with the equipment. So just having a mask on their face and a snorkel in their mouth, like, for your average person, they're really not into that and the wetsuit, and they feel confined. So the pool disciplines are kind of interesting because it's not. There's also. There's underwater Torpedo League. I don't know if you've run into that.

Host (25:36)

No idea what that is.

Theo Lucier (25:37)

Super cool. They. Yeah, they have this little. It's called a toy pedo. Literally, it's this neutrally buoyant torpedo. And they throw it and they try to pass it into the. The goal. And, like, if you throw it underwater, it'll coast, and it'll just stop and hover, and they play that all underwater. And then there's underwater hockey, which I used to play, which has been around since the 1950s. It's really big in Commonwealth countries like Australia, New Zealand, England, and underwater hockey. Is like sprinting underwater for an hour. It's super hard, but builds your lungs like nothing else. And those leagues are all over the place. So those are two ways to kind of access hypoxic training, for sure.

Host (26:23)

What was the first one about that? Was it underwater torpedo throwing?

Theo Lucier (26:27)

Underwater torpedo league, yeah.

Host (26:29)

Underwater torpedo league, yeah.

Theo Lucier (26:32)

Big. There's. There's, like, a huge one. Huge association in San Diego, man.

Host (26:37)

All right, so you're doing this in a pool, or does anyone do it in the open ocean?

Theo Lucier (26:41)

Yeah, yeah. They're pool disciplines. And then there's the whole pool free diving, which is. They do static breath hold. They do dynamic, which is back and forth. And then they do it with no fins, where you're just doing this underwater, which is just, like, pure pain. How much can you endure stuff like that?

Host (27:00)

That's all a little bit less exciting. What appeals to me is, of course, the health benefits that we've touched on with the hypoxic training. I'd even love to be able to do it in a way where if a wetsuit isn't required, I'm more connected to the environment. You know, I think of, like, the book Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.

Theo Lucier (27:22)

Great book.

Host (27:23)

And it just opened my mind to, like, the. How much I appreciate feeling connected to the environment rather than when you're in a car and you're watching it through the windshield and the windows, almost like. Like a movie. You know what I mean? Sitting inside a box, watching a movie. And so this idea of free diving and not having. I've got my PADI certification. I've gone scuba diving in Thailand and some places, and I'm all right, you know, it's like, nothing special, but the idea of really being a part of the environment and having less stuff hanging on you. Feeling the water on my skin, if it's safe to do it without a wetsuit, all that really appeals to me and feels primal.

Theo Lucier (28:05)

That's the original skin diving, you know, I mean, in Greece, they've been doing this special form of diving for thousands of years.

Host (28:13)

Maybe that's why I'm so. I mean, I'm half Greek, half Italian.

Theo Lucier (28:17)

Yeah, the Greeks and Italians are the best divers in the world. Both countries. Yeah. They trade. They go back and forth, free diving. Their manufacturers fight each other. It's like. But they make the best dive equipment. And in Greek, the. They. In Greece, they have this flattened rock. I. I can't remember how to pronounce the name, but it starts with an S. And they. They use it as a Diving plane. So you got a guy in like a loincloth. You know, they've been sponge diving since, well, I mean, the Greek days. And these guys would dive off the boat and they go head first and they, they follow the rock and they use it to steer. And they would go down, you know, hundred, 150, 200ft, cut these sponges off, put them in a bag, and then they would pull themselves back up the rope. Wow. That's been a tradition in Greece since forever. And the Greeks were what, a haul for a loofah? Yeah, yeah. In Roman times too. Yeah, I think they used that as a, like in the public toilets. That. A stick with the sponge on it and they'd use that as their toilet paper with water.

Host (29:27)

Yeah, I'd do it if I was the first one.

Theo Lucier (29:30)

Exactly.

Host (29:32)

This is, this. Yeah, this is dope. I'm enjoying, I'm enjoying it already. What if, if I was gonna get outfitted with some gear, Is it one of those things where just like, just do a couple lessons, use what they have? Or if I know, like I, I feel my DNA, I go to Mykonos. I feel, when I'm in the Greek islands, I feel like I'm at home, like at a soul and DNA level. I'm like, this is where I'm supposed to be, you know, And I feel like I'm going to have that same.

Theo Lucier (30:03)

Connection with freediving at a minimum. I think it's worth it to invest in a mask that fits your face and works with your beard, because I dive with dudes that have huge beards and it's fine. But there are specific masks for free diving. They're low volume masks and all the major brands make them, but you just have to find one that works with your face. And the way you do that is you put it on with no straps and you do a sniff through your nose. And if it stays on, then it works with your face. If it falls off, it doesn't. That's like kind of the way you do that because you're doing that with it dry, dry. Go into the shop, you don't use the straps, you put it on, you do a sniff and then does it stay on or fall off? That's how you, that's how you tell. Totally worth it. And then a really good wetsuit is totally worth it. And you're going to want to go custom for sure. And custom doesn't cost any different than a production one. They're the same price.

Host (31:09)

It's like the suit of the sea.

Theo Lucier (31:11)

Yeah, I mean, I order mine straight from Italy, so the price isn't so bad. Greece makes some amazing wetsuits. I think the best foot pockets for fins are from Greece. They're called pathos. And then all the fins are carbon fiber now. And it is a hundred percent worth it to have carbon fiber fins. It's not even worth it to get the cheap ones first.

Host (31:37)

What, what brand should I be looking at for carbon fiber fins?

Theo Lucier (31:40)

You know, there's a lot of different ones out there nowadays, thankfully, but Alchemy is a good brand. And then C4 from Italy, another great brand. And you want to get fins that are so soft that you don't feel them when you kick. So their fins are long. They're like a meter long.

Host (32:00)

Yeah, they're like three feet, right?

Theo Lucier (32:03)

Yeah, they're super long. But the idea is if you feel them, they're too stiff. Yeah. So you move your leg as one kind of stiff unit. And then the carbon fiber is like a whip crack. That's what moves you forward.

Host (32:22)

Beautiful. Anything before we kind of close out on free dive in, anything else that you want to add to, you know, people who are listening and kind of feel this or maybe on the fence about trying free diving, A cool experience. Anything that, that you would want to share as an ambassador of freediving to the world?

Theo Lucier (32:44)

Yeah, everybody, everybody thinks it's about breath hold and it's not. One of the deepest female freedivers of all time barely had a three minute breath hold.

Host (32:58)

So it'd be even less than that on land.

Theo Lucier (33:01)

Yeah, it was Mary, maybe barely four minutes, I can't remember. But it wasn't big.

Host (33:06)

Yeah.

Theo Lucier (33:07)

So it's not, it's not about the breath hold. It's about how relaxed can you be under pressure? Literally. Yeah, like so that's. So it's a mindset thing. And the freediving courses have gotten so good that you can pick up a skillset in a weekend that at a minimum, most people will be able to hold their breath for three minutes.

Announcer (33:33)

Wow.

Theo Lucier (33:34)

Three, three to four minutes easily. It's, it's all technique. Um, my breath hold isn't that great. And I mean, my first year getting back into it, I hit 40 meters, which I think is like 135ft or something like that. And I continue to get deeper. The limiting factor in freediving is not physical, it's mental and it's technique. So equalization, which is compensating for the pressure on your sinuses. There's. Yeah, that's like the whole world Unto itself. That's what I'm working on right now. It's my limiting factor.

Host (34:18)

I think that will probably be mine too. I've always had a little bit of a challenge even when scuba diving. I've had periods where I got to stop and really focus on equalizing. And I'm like squeezing my note, pinching my nostrils like a little kid and trying to get it. And who knows how much of that might have had to do with Lyme disease and mold and some different things that affected my, my breathing for a while. But what you're saying is that the breath holds can be taught and often the rate limiting factor is relaxation. How deeply can you relax and being able to equalize as you're going down. And I would imagine the efficiency of your movement, like no wasted energy with limbs going directions that doesn't facilitate, facilitate the direction you're trying to go.

Theo Lucier (35:09)

You can always tell an experienced freediver when you're out at the float by watching who's moving around the most on the surface. So if you've got people and they're kind of bicycling their hands and their feet and they're constantly moving in the water, they're not really used to that. If you see someone where they're just kind of limp when they're on the surface and not moving at all, that's, that's somebody that's experienced. Yeah. So it's, I love it. For the nervous system, regulation, benefits. I don't think we've ever lived in a time where information has hit us faster. There's all these weird, unique stresses coming at us from environmental insults, from like geoengineering coming down on us or blue light and noise. And I mean it's, I'm not one of those doom and gloomy bloom guys. There's enough of them in the natural health world and I feel like they do serve a purpose. I want to focus on solutions, not problems. But it's hard on the nervous system, man. When you go dive, all that stuff is gone. Because when you go underneath the surface of water, you're by yourself and you have a safety that meets you on the way up. But they usually don't meet you until you're about 10 meters from the surface, 33ft. So if you're down 100, 150ft, 200ft, whatever, you're just down there by yourself. There's no one. And that's about as alone as you can get on this world, you know, and it's a, it's A nice feeling. I mean, I love when we have good visibility here in San Diego. I love diving down, you know, not too deep, like I don't know, 20, 25 meters. So, you know, below 100 or above 100ft and just, I roll over on my back and I look up and you can just feel the column of water press down on you and it's just, it's like a hug. It feels so good. And we haven't even talked about spearfishing, but I imagine you would probably be into that.

Host (37:14)

I would love to talk about spear spearfishing as well.

Theo Lucier (37:18)

Yeah.

Host (37:18)

I have one question about free diving and then let's talk about spearfishing.

Theo Lucier (37:22)

Yeah.

Host (37:22)

And then at some point I want to grab your bio recharge and some of the different things for detoxification. Yeah, I'll give your intro for the people that are, that are waiting for that and then. And we've got a ton of great stuff to, to continue talking about. But this is, I mean, I think there's so much relevance here and so many people that are looking for fun things to do like you had experienced yourself, they've gotten so immersed in work and resource acquisition that they forgot how to play. And there's a period there when, and I've been there and still occasionally find myself there where you're like, how do I even play? What do I do? And you almost have to schedule it like you're working and go try new things to get yourself back into just the experience of being a human, you know. So this could give people with, through spear fishing and free diving, some things to try, some communities to get plugged into. And if they're feeling like they've been a little bit overly, overly endorsing resource acquisition and working for a while when you're down there. Well, so you've done a lot of meditation and breath work and different types of presence practices over the years. As you free dive more, do you still do those things or has Freedive have you found free diving takes the place of meditation and breath work where.

Theo Lucier (38:51)

They almost get pushed out, completely replaced it. It's a great question because I, a few years ago I decided to do a professionally facilitated, huge dose mushroom journey over a life transition time. Basically a relationship ended and I was transitioning out of my previous business, which I built my entire identity on.

Host (39:24)

If you don't mind me asking, and feel free if you don't want to answer, that's fine. Do you remember how much you did.

Theo Lucier (39:30)

Over 6 grams? Yeah. And it was, it was A group experience. It's actually a legal church that does it. Husband, wife, beautiful, beautiful facilitators, beautiful music, the whole thing. But a part of it was you did these appointments with the, with the husband. You kind of talked about what was going on, what was coming up from you. And he asked me, he said, are you, are you meditating? I said, yeah, I do a moving meditation. He's like, what's that? And I said, free diving. And he said, really? He's like, you consider that meditating? Not just sitting still and just kind of seeing what comes up. And I'm like, look, when you free dive, anything pathological going on in your mind or your life or whatever, it's immediately reflected back to you. It has this way of being, being a perfect mirror that very few other things are in life. And it's a moving meditation. I remember I was doing a static class in Hawaii and there's this woman that was in the class. She was a professional meditation instructor. Like a real one. Not somebody had done like a Instagram course over a weekend, but she'd been doing it.

Host (40:40)

Listen to a lot of Headspace and Joe Dispenza. And then it's like, I can do this.

Theo Lucier (40:44)

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly. Like she'd been doing it 40 years and she got to five minute plus breath hold and she came out and she's like, I have learned more from this weekend course than I have in the last decade meditating. Because it just brought up all this stuff for her. Because you're just face down in the water and you're just in it. You have to be fully full present. And all these autonomic nervous system things come up, your mind starts playing things, weird emotions come up and you just have to sit with them and just be. And that's a type of. And I prefer the moving meditation. It's, it's.

Host (41:26)

I do too.

Theo Lucier (41:27)

Yeah.

Host (41:28)

I feel, I feel like I'm kind of. If this, if this has done that for you, I feel like I'm ready to be done sitting cross legged and, and, you know, doing the 20 or 30 minutes on my own, because this is much more, much more appealing. Like, I want to get in it, I want to do it now.

Theo Lucier (41:44)

You know what it reminds me of? And this is going to sound really weird, but I had a couple freediving instructors verify this. I used to fight a lot, so I had a partial scholarship in university for Olympic style taekwondo. So there's judo and taekwondo in the Olympics. So there's a track to go to the Olympics through University in Taekwondo. So I did that at a national level and never made it to the Olympics. Got as far as the U.S. olympic Training center for team trials and stuff like that, but had injuries and mainly a mindset thing. I just didn't have a mature enough mindset at the time. But it reminds me of fighting because to be good at fighting, you have to be in the fight. Fight, but relaxed.

Host (42:29)

I was thinking that earlier when you were talking about being relaxed while freediving, I'm like, yes, that's what you see in the best fighters.

Theo Lucier (42:35)

It's a weird balance and tension you have to hold. And I remember I sucked at fighting until I finally like learned to relax. And then all of a sudden I was like relaxed and loose and my energy came up and, and then I got better at it. And the. I remember my first freediving course in my adult life. The instructor said, oh, did you used to fight? I said, yeah. And he said, ah, okay. He's like, you're one of those guys. And I'm like, why? And he's like, well, you're super relaxed right away. He's like, most people, they, they're like tense and they kind of have to learn it. And it's like a, it's an interesting tension. But like, fighting is kind of a meditation like that because all the pathological stuff will come up, you know, I mean, it's. You want to do these intense meditations, be in a serious relationship, start a business, free dive or fight, you'll find out what's coming up for you.

Host (43:31)

Yeah, 100%. And even, you know what I've noticed too is even no matter how much I've meditated and worked on presence practices and stress management, relaxation, and even done some light sparring work and mitt work and that sort of thing, when I get fired up where I think a fight could happen in real life, I still get all the adrenaline rush and everything and I'm not at all chill, you know, it's like, it's like the training has those. There's such few and far between experiences the training hasn't integrated, you know what I mean? And I feel my heart rate go to like 150 and you know what I mean? I'm like, this is not how I want to feel if this escalates into a fight, you know?

Theo Lucier (44:16)

Yeah, yeah. Society's changed too. I mean, I'm, I remember in the 90s it was like fights, it seemed like they were more common. And now out in the general public, I mean, I think everyone has so Much estrogen and the culture changed. It's just you don't, you don't see it doesn't have that same bravado that it used to too.

Host (44:41)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And who knows, you know, the xenoestrogens and the EMFs and all these different things that have, I mean we saw it was a, it was a, I think 20 or 30% decrease in testosterone in the year 2000 alone. A lot of people have hypothesized from.

Theo Lucier (44:58)

The rollout of WI Fi but did not know that.

Host (45:01)

Yeah, you look at the, it's between 20 and 30% decrease in testosterone in one one year, the year 2000, when, when wi Fi rolled out, you know, and you think about like you can entrain the nervous system in so many different ways and all this stuff that's bioelectrical is bi directional with, with our hormonal systems and our biochemical systems, you know, and you see it, it's, it's just in our lifetime we're at a point where we've experienced no cell phones. Cell phones and, and seen multiple generations and the shift that is, that's taken place in humanity. And it's an interesting observation for sure.

Theo Lucier (45:39)

I grew up as the Internet grew up, so it lagged behind me. And I grew up with no screens, including a TV screen. And I feel myself, I count myself being very lucky. Yes, me too in that regard. So yeah, before we get into other.

Host (45:57)

Stuff, talk a little bit about. You know, I've got, I've got a bag of bio recharge here which I love.

Theo Lucier (46:05)

Thank you.

Host (46:07)

And the bio boost. And I've been using these together. I think the camera's having a little bit of a hard time focusing in there. I've been using these together since the dry fast. And I'll tell you what, I mentioned it to you, but I felt like all my cells were more were re sensitized after that dry fast. And my first dose of biorecharge I felt a detox reaction. I was like, yeah, I remember I got really tired and I'm like from. I've never ever felt that from humic fulvic. And I've done plenty of humic fulvic over the years.

Theo Lucier (46:42)

Right.

Host (46:43)

So can you give us a little bit of a background on first graphene oxide. We're talking about a metal here that can have a lot of effects in the body. It's perhaps part of the trans. Trans. You know what I'm humanist agenda and to merge us with technology by getting metals into the body. We've seen this for 100 plus years. It probably, it probably predates dental amalgams. But I wouldn't be surprised if dental amalgams were one of the, one of the starting things. And then, you know, that kind of goes into jabs and things that we're putting in babies unnecessarily that all, you know, coincidentally seem to have metals in there, but. And now it's kind of made its way to this graphene oxide that some people believe is even synonymous with that black goo that we're seeing in a lot of commercials and celebrity endorsements with Celine Dion. I won't go into too many conspiracies here, but we'll keep it, we'll keep it to just a few.

Theo Lucier (47:36)

I'm here for it.

Host (47:38)

What's, what's. And I also don't take a doom and gloom thing. I mean, I think this is, this is literally, I mean, that's the last time I'm going to use the word literally. I believe that it's facilitating the expansion of our consciousness and helping people to realize that there's a big opportunity here for humanity in building the new earth. And when you see both the light and the dark, it can be very empowering to allow you to get off the bench and kind of pick a side and, and choose the work and the impact that you want to have on the collective consciousness.

Theo Lucier (48:20)

Yeah. So would you like to know my gateway into this business and creating those products? I can do it short because I know a lot of times you ask somebody about themselves on a podcast and it goes for like 40 minutes.

Host (48:35)

Do it in a way that is most enjoyable and entertaining to you. It doesn't need to be short. And if you can cover what your take is on graphene oxide and how your products fit into that when the time is right, that would be great.

Theo Lucier (48:49)

Well, let's start with graphene oxide because in the last couple years I've had a large influx of new customers specifically for that reason. So I don't know who it was. Somebody started publishing content online about humic and fulvic removal removing graphene oxide from the human body. And graphene oxide is very sharp edged nanotech metal that is put into vaccines, it's put into bottled water, it's in dental anesthetics, it's in a lot of food products, it's not disclosed as an ingredient either. And it's suspected to be self assembling in the body. It can lead to a lot of clotting. It's supposedly a preservative is why it's put into these products like Nestle bottled waters. Now, like Pellegrino have it.

Host (49:44)

San Pellegrino has it.

Theo Lucier (49:46)

Yes, it does. And you can see it with a magnet.

Host (49:50)

You gotta be shitting me.

Theo Lucier (49:51)

It has it in the glass bottle. There's like, you can find videos online where they're moving it around with a magnet.

Host (49:58)

You almost can't even consume stuff from supermarkets anymore.

Theo Lucier (50:03)

It's gotten crazy, man. I mean, it's so. And then with the atmospheric stratosphere injection programs, the geoengineering they have, there's, there's graphene oxide in there as well. So it's, it's continually raining down on you and you breathe it in. So it accumulates in the body and can have a lot of downstream effects. And so, you know, Humic Fulvic is a binder of many toxins, including mercury, lead, zinc, arsenic, cadmium, and now graphene oxide. And it's also really good at removing glyphosate, which is Roundup, which is the most prevalent herbicide in the world. And Roundup glyphosate causes the leaky gut. So a lot of people gut inflammation, leaky gut, because the tight junctions in their gut get pulled apart and then, you know, goes in and binds to glyphosate and then the tight junctions go back together. So how did I get into this?

Host (51:09)

How long does something like that take in, in your estimation and experience?

Theo Lucier (51:13)

I'm sure it varies per person, but.

Host (51:16)

Like when we do heavy metal cube.

Theo Lucier (51:18)

How long for the gut, the tight junctions in the gut? 10 minutes.

Host (51:23)

I'm saying if someone has high levels of glyphosate, you know what I mean? And metals, how long are they doing biorecharge and bio boost? How long do you feel like it takes to get that effectively out of the body or at least reduced to levels where they're no longer symptomatic in dealing with leaky gut?

Theo Lucier (51:40)

Great question. So let's talk about where metals go when they're in the body. So, so what hemoglobic is really good at doing is aggressively mopping up metals that are in the bloodstream. So these are things that you've inhaled, you've ingested recently, and they're just in active circulation. So it'll grab those and then it's removed through your body, through urine or feces, basically. And that happens right away, over time. It's a chelator of the metals where they're ultimately stored, which is in your fat tissue. So a Major cause of weight loss resistance for people that can't lose that final, you know, 10 or 15 pounds is because their fat is so toxic, the body's holding onto it. These heavy metals are so dangerous, the body removes them from active circulation in the blood, shunts them into the fat to seal them off from, from doing further damage to the organ systems. And so you have to claw the metal out of there. And so I consider Humic Fulvic like a good daily driver detox agent, just like vitamin C or malic acid, those are really good daily drivers to do that. So with stuff that's in the active bloodstream, you're looking at like 10 to 20 minutes for it to circulate and grab stuff for a long term impact. You're gonna have to take it for six months to have to really, you know, daily to really move the needle. And I feel like six months is.

Host (53:19)

Like the minimum for just about everybody.

Theo Lucier (53:22)

And really if you're concerned about metals, you're gonna have to do something like a niacin and sauna detox or a dry fast or use some heavier duty chelation agents too. But the thing about Humic and Fulvic is that it is gentle. It's an organic form of the minerals and they work with your body. A lot of the other drug based ones like EDTA or imiramide are super aggressive and you really got to know what you're doing before you start taking those. Like I wouldn't put my mom on my, you know, my 80 year old mom on either one of those.

Host (54:02)

But you would, you would not use etda?

Theo Lucier (54:05)

Not, no, I tried one time, didn't go well. I, I, I take EDTA personally.

Host (54:12)

Me too.

Theo Lucier (54:13)

Yeah, I take it all the time. But my 80 year old mom who's got like 30 dental amalgams, it just. Oh right, yeah, it didn't, it didn't work out well. But she takes Humic and Fulvic daily and for her it mops up what's in her active bloodstream and it also donates energy to her cells. So that's the, the story there. But as far as how I got into it, so spent my, my twenties and most my thirties building this company. Got so super burnt out, like crazily burnout and had a lot of downstream health issues from that. I mean endocrine system. Yeah, chronic, it's basically, yeah, like the world's worst case of chronic fatigue, inflamed brain, just all of the things I did there, brother. Yeah, it was, it was really bad. I Was like depressed. I didn't even know it at the time, time. But you know, an inflamed brain leads to depression. And like, I just tried to blame myself. I was like, oh, my willpower is not strong enough. But meanwhile my body's falling apart. And I actually did go the expensive biohacker route to start with. So I, I took like, I think it was like $56,000 the first year and just got into like the really exotic biohacking toys and therapies and I traveled to go do stuff and was, you know, doing upgrade labs and all that. And it all worked. But it's. You can burn through money really quickly and ultimately there's no magic bullet. You know, deep health is achieved through consistency over time. And I truly believe that energy is the currency of life. That's. So if you're tired all the time, your life sucks. Basically you need energy to do stuff and you need energy to be in a good mood. A lot of people don't realize that, but if you're in a low mood, kind of a crummy mood, it's because your cells aren't producing enough energy. So I went through this additive process, like a lot of people do when they get into health and biohacking is they just add stuff. So it started with nootropics, like a lot of guys, and then, and then we got into the, the macronutrients and the diet and the hardcore workouts and then the micro supplements and, you know, I think at one point I was taking like 38 supplements per day, like, like a ridiculous amount. And I felt, you know, a lot better, but something was still off. I still kind of felt weary, you know, like I wasn't, didn't have that, that positive expectation for the future and kind of the go get them energy back that I used to have. And then I did my first detox and I felt awful for like eight days. And then on the ninth day, day I woke up and I felt like a new man. I had more energy than I knew what to do with. And I was like, oh my God. So this, this is the key. So you can ask, is this dry.

Host (57:32)

Fasting or another type of detox?

Theo Lucier (57:34)

This particular detox was a sauna and niacin detox. Have you done one of those?

Host (57:41)

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Theo Lucier (57:43)

So that was a big one for me. We should talk about that one a little later because, you know, for a five dollar bottle of niacin and if you got access to a heat source, you can change your life. No no question. I mean, my first one, I didn't even have a heat source. I put on a sauna suit and I would work out super hard and jump rope. That was my sauna, like.

Host (58:07)

So this was shout out to L. Ron Hubbard, I think. Yeah. Was one of the. Probably the biggest proponent of this early on. I think he wrote that in the 70s or the 80s or something.

Theo Lucier (58:19)

50S.

Host (58:20)

The 50s, yeah.

Theo Lucier (58:21)

So L. Ron knew. Not Linus Pauling, but one of the other California orthomolecular medicine guys. It might have been Cathcart, Dr. Cathcart, I can't remember. He knew one of them. And then he borrowed the high dose niacin idea from. From one of them. And so did the AA guy, because Bill Wilson was. He found out that high doses of niacin stop alcoholism. So he started treating all the people in AA with it. And all these people stopped drinking and dropped out of aa. So Bill Wilson's own board fired him over it.

Host (59:02)

Do you know what dosages he was using for that high?

Theo Lucier (59:04)

You're talking like six. Six to ten grams? Fifteen grams a day. Yeah. Because the average of anyone doing more than six, the alcoholic's body wouldn't even flush.

Host (59:15)

Interesting. So you can, you can safely. This is with full flush, immediate release niacin, correct?

Theo Lucier (59:21)

Yes.

Host (59:21)

And so they were building up to. To so 10,000 milligrams, which is 10 grams or even 15 grams.

Theo Lucier (59:31)

Yeah.

Host (59:31)

And. And not. What about liver issues? Do you know?

Theo Lucier (59:35)

They didn't have any. I mean, if you can take a schizophrenic, they can take down an entire bottle and not flush. And they'll be completely calm.

Host (59:43)

Wow. Yeah, fascinating. I'd never heard of anyone doing more than six. We've had some of our guys do six, especially when there's serious stuff. But it's interesting to know that you can go higher safely.

Theo Lucier (59:54)

Yeah. I have a customer who does six a day. Doesn't flush at all. I mean, she has for years. She was using it as a varicose vein treatment. So it takes about a year, but it'll remove them.

Host (60:06)

Interesting. Wasn't one of the members in our group dealing with varicose veins?

Theo Lucier (60:10)

Yeah.

Host (60:11)

Did you tell her about niacin?

Theo Lucier (60:12)

I did.

Host (60:13)

Okay, nice.

Theo Lucier (60:14)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Nice. Nice lady. But anyways, did my detox and it moved the needle on my energy more than anything else had. And I was like, oh my God. If you're cells are poisoned, they can't really use these nutrients I'm throwing at them because they're barely running as it is. And so then I got into daily detox drivers and I started using Humic and Fulvic. And that immediate had immediate uptick in how I felt, like my energy levels were a lot higher. And so then I quickly came to the conclusion that, you know, if you want a deep resource of energy production in your cells that have to both be detoxed and they need, you know, excess electrons. Right. To run on, they need fuel. And so humic Fulvic is this unique molecule that is an organic form of 70 plus trace minerals that is nature's most strong electrolyte. And it has this amazing ability to clean out the inside of the cell and charge it back up. And that. That's kind of the whole secret right there. And it does all these other things, like grabs glyphosate and metals and all that. But, like these unique cellular poisons that we're dealing with for the most part are glyphosate and heavy metals. It does other stuff. It's supposedly removes microplastics too. I'm looking for more verification on that. But it works in order of charge. Right. So microplastics have this really strong positive charge. And then Humic Fulvic has a very strong negative charge, so it grabs that stuff and yanks it out.

Host (62:02)

Interesting. And so, I mean, I was introduced to Humic and Fulvic through Shilajit.

Theo Lucier (62:09)

Yep.

Host (62:11)

And I mean, what's your take on the benefits of. Of Humic Fulvic in the way that it's delivered with biorecharge and Bio Boost versus taking Shilajit?

Theo Lucier (62:22)

Fantastic question. Cause I scoured the earth sourcing that stuff, and it took two years. So you know how shilajit usually has kind of a bitter taste, like a weird taste.

Host (62:35)

It tastes like burnt rubber.

Theo Lucier (62:36)

Right. So that taste is actually from fungal products that are in it. So, like, let's talk about what Shilajit actually is. And there's some fantastic shilajits out there, but most of them are from China and India, and they're excretions out of cracks in rocks in the mountains. And so they're. They're wet and they're. They're kind of just there out in the atmosphere, and then they're scraped off and packaged. And so they grow a lot of mold during that process. And it's a whole food product, so that is kept into the product when you ultimately buy it. And that's what that bitter taste is from. And then a lot of this stuff, this is why I created my own humid fulvic products is a lot of stuff out of China and India is contaminated with lead and lead and arsenic in particular, some mercury as well. And it's pretty bad problem in the industry. So that alone I was like, oof, you know, I couldn't find very clean examples of it. When I would get the certificate of analysis like the lab surveys, and I said, okay, all right, all right, I don't know if I want to go that direction. And I started looking at other humic fulvic sources and again, most of it comes out of China and India because it's like labor intensive to produce. And then I found a supplier in the US who had this beautiful pristine mine for it that's underneath a sandstone cap. So it doesn't get any groundwater penetration. So it's kept clean from atmospheric contaminants and runoff and stuff like that. It's. And he uses a water only process to refine it. So over 90% of humic fulvics are processed or fractionated using acids. They use industrial acids. And some of that residue is always left over in the final product where the way that this is processed is they use specific gravity in water and they spin it and then it separates out that way. And so the Humic that I have is a full spectrum product. It's all the different minerals in one and all Humic contains fulvic. So that has fulvic in it too, about 11%. The Fulvic product I added later based on customer requests, we'll talk about that is a golden liquid. It's not very dark like the humic. And that one is spun in a centrifuge in water, no acid. And then it's used to extract that. So if you look at the difference in them, the humic is a heavier, darker molecule that is excels at detox and it also donates electrons to cells. And then the Fulvic is a lighter, more energetic golden molecule. And it does some detox, but mainly it's like a battery charger for your cells. And as far as I know, both of these are the highest concentration in a single product sold in North America. So the, the biore charge is actually a huge dose. And I formulated it that way on purpose to just help people clean up and just let's get, let's get cleaned out. And then the fulvic, it has like a puckery kind of weird like taste when you put it under your tongue. That's from all the ions. So that's like literally how many ions are on it gives you that, that taste.

Host (66:26)

So the, the humic looks almost like an activated charcoal, but it doesn't stain everything. You know, you mix it with water and you get, you get kind of like a black water product. And it's not a tremendous amount in quantity of powder. You know, the packets are relatively small, but you're saying the constituents that you're getting in there exceed some of the other. You know, you see other products that are Humic Fulvic and they come in big bottles of liquid like restore.

Theo Lucier (66:59)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that or I think it's called Ion Biome. Now that's a great product. And there's some other good ones out there like Beam and you know, those are, those are good products. Those are formulated for a different audience. So I used to, I was a bit a customer of both of those. And the Ion Restore Ion Biome product is, it's diluted a lot and there's a reason for that. Most of his audience are mothers of autistic children. And so you need to have a lower dilution or somebody can go through a detox. You're reaction, I mean, look how clean you are. And you had a detox reaction.

Host (67:42)

Yeah, it's strong.

Theo Lucier (67:43)

I mean you can tell it's working. Yeah, you've done, and you've done dozens of detoxes. So for a sensitive person, you probably would just want to get the bio boost and do a few drops of that. But in fact that's why half a.

Host (68:01)

Packet, you know what I mean?

Theo Lucier (68:02)

Yeah, yeah. Do half or a quarter of a, of a stick pack. Yeah, and that's, there's a reason I did the stick packs too, is because all these encapsulated products that use, you know, vegetable cellulose, it's hard for the gut to break down. And I truly believe that the principle of nervous system cueing is really important. So I think it's important for your mouth, the mucous membranes in your mouth and your tongue to taste what is going to, to be in your stomach so it can signal the intestines like, hey, we've got all this good stuff coming your way, get ready. Whereas if you take that 300 milligrams of that in a capsule, especially with this level of energy density, it just blooms open in your stomach and your nervous system's like, oh God, like how do I process all this information? And so that was one of the reasons I did it that way too.

Announcer (68:59)

What's up guys? As you may know, I signed a six month lease in Tulum recently. As you can probably hear from some of the wildlife and birds making, making their songs outside, and we're doing something really cool. I've spent the past two decades diving deep into the biohacking space and learning how to condense time, how to help people create physical transformations, getting in incredible shape, six pack, building muscle, feeling amazing, tapping into the full potential of their mind and doing it in the straightest path and the least time possible, while of course, maintaining safety and all of that. Well, this has led to something called a decade in a day experience. It's an immersive biohacking experience that you do with, with me in person and in this case in Tulum, Mexico, in the Yucatan Peninsula, which is a magical area. And what I've done is I've crafted an entire day for us to condense decades of biohacking wisdom personalized just for you. To help you take your life, your body, your cognitive performance all to the next level. We would workshop, go through your labs, help translate those labs into actionable health intelligence to change your life, all while having one of the most incredible adventures and beautiful days of your life. I'm opening up just a few spots for this, and we're going to have some before I leave in the first week in April, and then I'll have a couple more when I get back, but they're very, very limited. Obviously, this is me blocking out an entire day for us, and there's a good amount of preparation beforehand. If that sounds like something you're interested in, you can either book a time for us to talk and see if it's a fit by going to biohacker coaching.com that's B I O H A C K E R coaching.com and just fill out the short form and book a time on my calendar. Or you can text Legend L E G e n d to 847-943-7221 and I'll help book you a strategy session for us to jump on that way. And now back to the episode.

Host (71:17)

What is the optimal way to use BioCharge with Bio Boost? And I'll be honest, I've been using it where I'll take it before bedtime just because if I am going to experience some, some fatigue, I'm like, I might as well do it when I'm going to bed rather than doing it before I jump on a podcast with you and possibly be nodding off a little bit during the episode. But I've been combining the two and I don't know if I should or shouldn't, but I've been doing a full packet of the biorecharge and then two or three full droppers of the Bio boost and then sipping the glass of water and taking it down. Is that preventing some of the optimal results? How should we be taking this stuff?

Theo Lucier (72:02)

The reason I created both was because, you know, biorecharge, most successful product I've created. I have had customers who've been taking it for five years. They love it. But the majority of my audience are people that are struggling with a toxic burden. And a lot of people were, were taking it and getting really tired and they still wanted to keep pushing through and keep taking it, but it was taking days, sometimes weeks. And they said, I'm just tired, but I'm going to keep taking it. Is there anything else I can do? And I went back to the drawing board and I was like, I'm going to do the highest concentration fulvic product I can find. So it'll go under their tongue and it'll go into their bloodstream and it'll just donate electrons to their cells. So the humic is gonna go in there, it's gonna grab the toxins, pull those out. They might get tired from that, but then we can boost their energy with the straight fulvic and that'll donate the electrons that their cells need to feel and be more energetic. So it was kind of a two step. And so what I think most my customers do, what I personally do, is I'll take a stick pack of that stuff, I'll dump it in my big water bottle that I have all day, and then I just drink that all day because it makes the water more hydrating on its own. It grabs toxins, it's an electrolyte, all the things. And then usually mid afternoon, when I need a little bit of a pickup, I'll take two or three dropper fulls of the bio boost under the tongue and then I'm like, oh, okay. And then I'll. That's like, I do that before my workout or something.

Host (73:46)

And do you, do you hold and swish around for a certain amount of time?

Theo Lucier (73:52)

I just hold it for 20 seconds because that's gonna transport a big chunk of that through your mucous membrane and then it just goes straight into your bloodstream. But in particular I want to go to the brain. And so it'll do that if you hold it for a little bit. But it's also the one I travel with. I mean, the stick packs you can travel with and they're fine. You can tear them open Dump them in. But like that little dropper bottle, it's just so easy. If you're like free diving and you're in the car or something, you just throw some in your water and drink that and it's like seconds, you know, Beautiful.

Host (74:27)

And so for people that want to check this out, they can go to getbiorecharge.com and I think we have or will have set up a biohacks B I O H A C K S discount code where they can get the Bio recharge and the Bio Boost that you offer at checkout or as you're going through the checkout process and anything else. Like what? For someone that wants to do it properly, you're going to need more than just one bag to really do that. Right. So what's, what's a typical good deep tox protocol? Is it you getting six, six bags so that you could do six months?

Theo Lucier (75:09)

Yeah. What do you suggest? It's interesting because I used to just sell. This is like so midwest of me. It was just, you just buy, you know, one bag and that was it. And then over the years people, they're like, I want a discount if I buy more. So I added a. So right off the bat there's three options. You can buy one bag, three bag or six bags and the discount goes up the more you get. And then after you make a purchase decision, I threw in a couple extra deals in there that you can jump on. So you get an immediate discount on Bio Boost if you buy Bio Recharge that's offered during your checkout process. And then there's a deeper discount offered as well on the Bio restaurant recharged. So that way I have a lot of people that stock up. Like I've got a guy that does shamanic work down in the, down in the Amazon and he buys a year's worth at a time. And then once a year I hear from him when he's back in the states and he re ups. But yeah, they use it down there.

Host (76:16)

So a six month protocol, how many bags of biorecharge and how many bottles of Bio Bio Boost would be required at the dosage? You're talking a packet a day.

Theo Lucier (76:27)

Yeah, you'd want to do. If you want to do it right and just fully embrace this heal your gut, heal your blood, which we haven't even talked about. But you do one stick pack a day and you do at least one to two dropper fulls of the Bio Boost per day. So you would want six of each. So, so you do six bags and six bottles and that would do it.

Host (76:53)

That's the move, I think it's like doing heavy metal chelation for a month. You're going to start moving things, but it's not sufficient in this modern world with the onslaught of toxic agents that we've been exposed to.

Theo Lucier (77:06)

Yeah. And a lot of people ask me about timing on it. And interesting thing about Humic and Fulvic is the they. It's this wondrous little molecule that does all these things, like the Swiss army knife of health. But one of the really cool things it does is that it potentiates stuff you take it with. So if you take supplements in the morning, you take some Humic and Fulvic and it's like millions of tiny little trucks. And it helps import the nutrients from the supplements you took to the inside of your cells. So if you mix it with your magnesium penetrates the cell membrane easier and then your cells getting more magnesium, effectively. Coffee, you know, like Dave Asprey puts it in his coffee now increases nutrient transport of the coffee, reduces some of the acidity, kind of rounds out the mouth feel people feel the effects of coffee more. So morning is a good time to take it. Night's also a good time to take it for the gut repair stuff. And then Dave Asprey's using Biorecharge as well. No, not mine, but he puts a Humic in his coffee now. The danger coffee. Oh, all right. Yeah, yeah.

Host (78:21)

So you gotta get him on the good stuff.

Theo Lucier (78:24)

Yeah, yeah. I don't know what his sourcing is, but yeah, mine's 100% USA. Even the packaging. So that was deliberate decision, decision I made. So it's sourced in Idaho and the initial processing is done there, and then the rest is in Ohio. And my packaging is all USA too. So there's zero China, zero India. That was hard, guys.

Host (78:53)

Getbiorecharge.com G E T B I O R E C H A r g e.com discount code biohacks. And can you talk a little bit about what's going on with the blood? You'd mentioned that, but we haven't discussed what's the impact here, cleaning the blood?

Theo Lucier (79:11)

You know, it's funny, these kind of things that are like a panacea because they work at such a base level in the body, can be hard to articulate the benefits sometimes because they do so much right. And I was doing a ton of research on how do I articulate the real benefit of something like Humic and Fulvic to people and it's simple. If you heal the blood, you heal the person. So when you talk to somebody and you say, well, what's the largest wellness system in the body? Most people, they're going to say, oh, it's the skin, you know, because they think it's a trick question. That's your largest organ. The largest wellness system in your body is your blood. You poke somebody anywhere on their body with a needle, there'll be blood come out. Blood carries nutrients and oxygen and electrons to every cell and every organ in your body. It's super important. Now, in 1900, there is only one recorded heart attack case in all English published medical literature. And now it kills over half the population. In 1963, there is a book written that describes something called zeta potential. And it describes colloids. And so most people heard of colloidal silver. That means the individual discrete particles in the silver, they don't sink or float. They just kind of float around and repel each other and they flow. Well, most people don't know this, but your blood is not a liquid, it's a colloid, or at least it's supposed to be. But most people have what is called sludge blood, where their blood has essentially a traffic jam inside of it. And their heart has to work harder because their blood is thick and sludgy and it is not pumping very well. And then their heart gets stressed, they have heart attacks, heart disease, they get blood clots. And this problem has increased almost exponentially in the last 125 years. So why is that? Well, it's two reasons. One, the food. So all of our food used to have a lot of humic and fulvic in it, but NPK fertilizer binds to it and strips it out of the soil. Those started being used after World War II. So it's the first problem. So it's not in our food supply anymore. That's why we have to mine it and supplement with it. And then two, all these environmental insults, toxins, especially emf, it adds positive charge to the blood. And then the blood cells, instead of being colloidal suspension, they coin. It's called a rouleau effect. And so they stack like coins and then they stack up and it becomes sludgy. And then it doesn't fit down the capillaries very well. And then people's oxygen tissue becomes starved of oxygen. The organs don't work as well. They have brain fog. The, they have less energy. For me, it always comes back to energy. How can I have more energy? How can I help people have more energy. So if you look at the blood as your single largest wellness system and then you realize most people have low zeta potential, I. E. Their blood is no longer in colloidal suspension. It's thick, it's sludgy. There's a traffic jam. What reverses that in minutes is taking humic and fulvic. So, so the cells stop coining. They, instead of sticking to each other with a positive charge, they have a negative charge. They start repelling each other like magnets. When we were kids, and you play with magnets on the table, it starts doing that. And then the oxygen content of your blood goes way up. And then your cells, your organs start receiving more oxygen and you have more energy. So that is like when I just. If somebody just off the street is like, what does this do for me? I don't talk about, like, cell detox and heavy metals and all that. I just say, heal your blood, you heal yourself. It's, it's. And most people are walking around with sludge of blood. Like, EMF adds positive charge to the blood directly because it's conductive and it causes that effect in real time. And most of us are soaked in EMF 24. 7. And that's, that's not including sugar. Other toxins that add positive charge, of course, like metals and pesticides and herbicides. So that's kind of the, that's kind of like the crux of it is you start taking this stuff on a regular basis for six months. It's not just about the detox. It's. Your blood's going to be younger and healthier. If you have tired, sludgy blood, you're going to be tired and your thought is going to be sludgy.

Host (84:06)

Yeah, it makes complete sense. I mean, you're talking about. And you can see this with live blood analysis where I, I'd done that years ago and mistakenly scheduled my live blood analysis where I had an event the night before and I'd had a couple cocktails and you want to talk about seeing, you know, seeing the coins stacked. It was, you know, if you imagine like your red blood cells almost kind of like this raft shape, when they're all stacked on one on one another, you lose a lot of the surface area to carry oxygen.

Theo Lucier (84:38)

That's. That's it. Yep.

Host (84:40)

And so you're saying in real time, you can dose the biorecharge and the, and the bio boost and see if you were doing like a before and after live blood analysis, you would see from a single Dose that improving.

Theo Lucier (84:55)

Not only that, but there's cases of people that have taken it and put it on a slide. And the cells stay alive on the slide way longer than normal. Like the people have looked at slides the next day and the red blood cells are still alive on a sample where they had the humic and fulvic first.

Host (85:18)

This is a valid intervention for Long Covid. You know, it's not just the serrapeptase and nattokinase and some of these other agents, like people experiencing long Covid or any similar flu like symptoms that seem to be cyclical.

Theo Lucier (85:35)

Yeah. I mean, there's a guy wrote a book on this. Nobody knows about zeta potential, nobody talks about it, but there's a guy named Thomas Riddick. He was in, he was an md and he was having all these heart attacks and none of his colleagues could help him. And so he had an interest in natural health, which is weird for an md, but he found out about zeta.

Host (85:58)

There's more and more of them.

Theo Lucier (85:59)

Yeah, he found out about zeta potential and he reversed all the problems in his blood. He basically just had. He had low zeta potential in his blood. He had that coining effect that you've been talking about. He fixed it and then he continued to practice medicine until he was 87.

Host (86:17)

This is a DIY. I mean, we're talking about long Covid and flu like symptoms, which is right now. Someone, someone commented on one of my posts earlier and they're like, it was Dr. Jordan Kaplan in, in Florida. And he's like, everybody I know right now is like dealing with flu like symptoms, a quote unquote virus, you know, whatever. Long Covid. These things that are kind of.

Theo Lucier (86:43)

There was something going around. 30% of the people that went to the conference I did in Las Vegas last week were violently ill. Yeah, yeah, there's.

Host (86:54)

There's something going on for sure. And I wouldn't even look, I like my, I like my conspiracies. I wouldn't be surprised if you know, the, the electrical infrastructure with the towers, our devices, WI fi, smart meters, everything. Like we know if, if. I'm not saying this is happening for sure, but you look at. You can watch the NEXRAD satellites. They're cloaking the United states from like 9pm to 9am Most nights in a rotational pattern and hitting people with these frequencies while they sleep. You can induce illness and flu like symptoms, things that people typically attribute to a virus with frequencies. And what I'm hearing you say, and I'm not saying you agree with that or anything, it's impossible to prove really, outside of, you know, the evidence Hong.

Theo Lucier (87:47)

Kong flew in 1967 was when they first deployed satellites that were broadcasting telecommunications.

Host (87:54)

Absolutely. Spanish flu was when radio rolled out.

Theo Lucier (87:56)

Yep.

Host (87:57)

You know, it's. The evidence is there, the patterns are there. And I think people are wising up and catching up to that. But what we're. What we're sharing and discussing here with BioCharge and Bio Boost is a strategy that is as important and valid, in my opinion, for long Covid and a tool to help people adapt to some of these modern challenges. It's as valid as serrapeptase, nattokinase and any of these other things that have been recommended.

Theo Lucier (88:26)

Yeah, it's really good for that. And people have forgotten about the blood as a wellness system in the body. And, you know, we're talking about assessment tools like dark field microscopes are wonderful for taking a look at your blood and seeing the health of it. And you can see if you have that coining that rouleau effect, which I.

Host (88:52)

Wanted to get into that. I have someone that said that they would give me. They've got two dark field microscopes and she's. She's out of. She learned in Germany and she's like, you can have one of mine if you want to learn and I can kind of teach you and give you the rundown. I'd love to be able to do that for our members.

Theo Lucier (89:09)

I know I would be first in line for that if you started doing that, because it would be cool to do some experiments, but that would be the first tool I would select if somebody was really into. This is just no hemic fulvic. Just do your normal routine and then get a sample done that way with some photos and see the state of it. And then, you know, take your. Your humic Fulvic, wait 30 minutes, couple hours, whatever, and then. Then redo it. And you'll see it goes from a clumpy fluid to a colloid the way it's supposed to be. I mean, all this stuff used to be in our food. Our soil used to be rich with humic and fulvic because fungus in the soil breaks down the inorganic form of minerals into the organic ionic form. So the stuff that we're mining is just old freshwater plants that have been fossilized. It's just we don't have it in our topsoil anymore because we've farmed at an industrial scale since World War II using the NPK fertilizer, which removes it from the soil. So first Thing I would do is the darkfield microscope. I'm super into using phase angle as a metric. Do you want me to kind of just briefly sum up what that is for people?

Host (90:35)

Yeah, please. I wrote down phase angle, but my understanding is that the technology is pretty expensive. Yeah, it is.

Theo Lucier (90:43)

Yeah, it's. It is and it isn't. So you can go into a high end gym or a spa and they'll often have an in body machine.

Host (90:54)

Is that phase angle?

Theo Lucier (90:56)

Some embody machines will measure a phase angle. There's controversy over it because they are measuring through the thick skin on the heels of your feet and also your hands. The skin is thicker and the company that is used as a laboratory standard doesn't agree with that. And they use sticky pads that go on thinner skin on your body. I don't think it makes a huge difference, but there's some controversy over that. But it is accessible that way. But there are phase angle measurement devices. They're called bia, bioimpedance analysis device or bioelectrical impedance analysis is a technical term. And all they do is run a small pulse DC electrical current through your body from top to bottom. You don't even feel it. And your electrical, your cell membranes conduct electricity. And a healthy cell will conduct electricity faster and an unhealthy cell will conduct it slower. And they can capture that, they can measure how much time that takes. That's called phase angle. So phase angle is like a cell health score. What the phase angle tells you is how young or old your cell is basically. And it tells you how much electrical charge it carries and how hydrated it is and how intact the cell membrane is. So if you have somebody who's like 400 pounds filled with seed oils, inflamed like their cell membranes aren't very, they lack integrity. They look jagged and kind of broken.

Host (92:38)

Wow, that's very valuable information.

Theo Lucier (92:40)

Super valuable. And so people who are sick or have a disease, their phase angle is lower. And people who are younger will have a higher phase angle than somebody who is older. It's just a known thing. I mean there was a study done on this of I think it had like over 30,000 people over a decade. They captured this data. So we still use that data set today when you compare your phase angle. And it's this data set is from the 80s and 90s, so it's actually before all the EMF stuff. So if you score high on this one, you're, you're doing pretty good. But I did phase angle before, during and after my Dry fast and that, I mean that moved the needle like crazy. Really on that.

Host (93:28)

What types of improvements like in generalities that you recall?

Theo Lucier (93:34)

Well, in terms of the sheer number, my phase angle was like on the high end of average when I started and at the end it was off the chart. So it went from like 7.6 something to like 9 and then it, and then it settled down a little bit into the eights where it is still now because I keep checking it. But that is. So these cellular therapies like dry fasting or sauna and niacin detox or humic and fulvic, these will increase your phase angle because they de age and support the cell. So that's. And I like that metric because it's super easy. You can get a phase angle measurement in seconds.

Host (94:25)

And you. So you have a device, you have one of these bioelectrical impedance.

Theo Lucier (94:30)

Yeah, I have an RGL, RJL Quantum 4. And we'll do get togethers here where we'll hook people up and measure them because it also gives you your muscle percentage, your fat percentage, it tells you your. Well, a really cool thing that it does is it tells you how much water is carried inside your cells versus outside. So if you're healthy, you want most of your water to be carried on the inside of your cells. But unhealthy people, they'll have more water in their extracellular matrix than inside their cells. So their cells are kind of like dehydrated and shriveled up and all. So you. Have you ever drank water and just goes right through you just pee it out right away. It doesn't.

Host (95:24)

I think it's, it's, it's happening, of course. And I feel like that's what's happening to most people these days.

Theo Lucier (95:29)

Yeah, so like low quality water will do that. So water that has like a positive charge, it's not structured, it doesn't have minerals in it, doesn't have a negative charge. That type of water will pass right through you. So that, that means it's, it's increasing your extracellular water content. So one of these machines will tell you that. And it's interesting because like that's a. Something I work hard at. Like all the water I drink is mineralized and structured. And I had a high score for that being carried inside my cells where I measured my mom and you know, old people dry out and so most of her water was outside her cells. I said, mom, we gotta shift this. Like you gotta get back on the. Taking the humic and Fulvic. And so she did it for a month and then I remeasured her and sure enough it shifted the ratio of water back into her SO cells. And that was a cool thing to actually see in real time.

Host (96:24)

That was with the biorecharge and the bio boost.

Theo Lucier (96:27)

Yeah.

Host (96:28)

So that alone gets this water into the intracellular matrix.

Theo Lucier (96:31)

Correct. Because it's an organic form of these trace minerals. That's a super strong electrolyte, which basically just means it adds charge to the water that the cell likes. So it goes right through the cell membrane. Whereas like you're at the airport and you get the same sonny in a plastic bottle that's been cooking next to a WI FI router for three months.

Host (96:52)

You know yourself just getting that, getting that plastic baked into the water so bad.

Theo Lucier (96:58)

The microplastics.

Host (97:00)

Yeah. Okay. The, the is, is this is the cellular's electrical potential measured in voltage. The charge millivolts.

Theo Lucier (97:12)

Yep. We are electrical beings. There is, there is no chemical reaction in the body that happens without the movement of electrical charge first. And this, this was where medicine was pre flexner report around 1904. But you could go to school and get a medical degree in the United States for electro medicine. Electro health. And they focused on electrical system of the body first and then they would get into more of the chemical drive stuff. So when I was sorting through all the bullshit in alternative health and biohacking, I was like, I just, I'm a practical guy. I just want to solve the problem that's in front of me. And you can solve a lot of problems quickly, cheaply and effectively by addressing the electrical health of your body before you jump into the bigger stuff like chemicals and diet and all that.

Host (98:12)

Yeah, I completely agree. And so, and when it comes to diagnostics, especially on the bioelectrical side, the RJL Quantum 4 that you use for bioelectrical impedance, that's one of your key tools for measuring phase angle. Is there anything else that you mentioned, the dark field microscopy?

Theo Lucier (98:37)

Yep.

Host (98:39)

Is there anything else in there that's like for the people that understand and appreciate the, the bioelectrical system and want to have a better understanding of where somebody is at? Are there any other diagnostics that you really value or do those two hit the. Hit, hit the main.

Theo Lucier (98:54)

I mean those, those are huge. Like that's, that's kind of really all you need if you're looking at your, the wellness of your blood. But there are a ton of other diagnostic instruments out there. It depends how esoteric you want to get, I mean, because there's the subtle energy measurement devices where you can get into that. And that certainly is valid. I mean the Russians and the Germans use them clinically, we don't. That's considered, you know, kooky over here to use those kind of devices.

Host (99:29)

But what would be an example of a subtle energy device?

Theo Lucier (99:32)

Oh man, there's, there's so many interesting ones out there. So there's, there's like GDV cameras. That's, that's one. But I would say the most popular one that you will. That doctors use over in Europe is like an EAV device. So it's like electro acupuncture, according to volunteer. And so that can measure like the energy content of organs of different areas of the body, of cells, all kinds of things.

Host (100:01)

Like that's, that's where they're taking the pen and pressing different points along your body and getting measurements. Yeah, Chiropractor that did that decades ago.

Theo Lucier (100:09)

Yep. So there's that, that's like one. There's something called a Mead device, similar principle to that. There's, I mean, there's subtle energy devices where if you look at Dr. Jerry Tennant, the healing is voltage guy, I mean his practice uses a. Basically you call it a frequency specific microcurrent device he calls a Tennant biomodulator, but they're a DC microcurrent device made by a company called Avasia. But part of Jerry Tennant's diagnostic is a. Uses a pendulum. A pendulum is a subtle energy measuring instrument. And so he'll do the assessment with a pendulum and he does a treatment with a frequency specific microcurrent device that also has a biofeedback loop in it. So it measures. I have one of them. And it measures.

Host (101:01)

Talking about the tenant biomodulator.

Theo Lucier (101:03)

Yeah, yeah. So it measures electrical resistance on the skin. So, so if it gets over an organ system or an area that has a positive charge, it's inflamed, it sticks, it feels like a magnet. Like you slide it around sliding easy, and then it just sticks to one area. So that's another diagnostic that people can do and it does work.

Host (101:25)

Have you found that helpful?

Announcer (101:26)

I mean, I looked at the Tennant.

Host (101:27)

Biomodulators years ago, but never pulled the trigger on one.

Theo Lucier (101:31)

So here, I'll give you a hack first of all, so you can buy them. So, so Jerry White labels those, although his frequencies are proprietary. So I don't know what frequency sets he's using in his. But you can buy them Direct from a vasia, the manufacturer or there's a website called the Santa shop dot com. So it's S A N A. They white label their version. I have one of those. They're sold a lot more inexpensively over there and they're sold for pain management. So I got one when I had a lower back injury and. And that answers your question. So I've found that it's remarkable for like back injuries and stuff. I haven't found that it's like so incredible for all the other stuff it does. It's like. And it's kind of hard to use. Like I've done the little wings where you do like the bowling ball reset that Jerry talks about, like the spinoid bone that your cell, your skull sits on. I mean it's like cool, but it wasn't like mind blowing. I think when we hear a lot about these therapies or devices that, where people are like, oh my God, it was life changing. It's like those people are pretty jacked up so they feel everything more. Because when I was really jacked up, like everything I touched was like, oh my God, this is life changing.

Host (102:58)

Yeah.

Theo Lucier (102:58)

And now I don't, I don't feel stuff as much. I would say for pain resolution. Incredible. But other than that, I don't use it that much. And I have like, I've got all kinds of crazy device. I got rife machines and PMF and you know, all these wild things. But I don't use the, the frequency specific microcurrent device that much.

Host (103:22)

We could touch on dry fasting here. You know, let's, let's say we've got 10 minutes or so to kind of round this one out. Guys. If you're enjoying this episode and appreciate Theo coming on a great thing that, a great way to show appreciation and also take care of yourself and do something good for you is go to getbiorecharge.com and pick up six bags of Biorecharge six bottles of Bio Boost and give yourself a proper, not only detoxification but reoxygenation of your cells and correcting some of that coin stacking effect in the blood. And it's a great way to protect yourself from some of these flu like symptoms that people are cyclically experiencing these days. Where do you think, where do you feel called right now in this country? Conversation to spend the next 10 minutes for our audience. Oh, the thing, guys. Share this episode. We're pretty much heavily shadow banned everywhere and they've, they've gotten to the podcast as well. So the way that. That we've been kind of working through that is you guys sharing these episodes and sending them to people that. That are the same kind of weird and interested in this stuff. Other. Other healers, other biohackers, other people that. That enjoy this type of information. So please share this episode. And that's another way to let Theo and I know you appreciate us being willing to have conversations that some of the. That aren't liked by those that drive many of these health agendas.

Theo Lucier (104:54)

It happened to me too. Still rebuilding from it.

Host (104:58)

Totally. Totally. It's. I mean, it's a game of whack a molecule. You know, it's like every platform that we built, we've got 65, 70,000 people on Facebook. Our videos get no views anymore, can't run ads. You know, all Gmail, all of our emails go straight to Gmail. Spam, no matter what. Instagram's becoming the same way. They'll give me views if I share someone else's video on a content that isn't really impactful, but if it's something that really empowers people to take control of their health, it's almost no views.

Theo Lucier (105:35)

Yeah, I heard it's changing, but I don't know how true that is. People were talking about at the conference I was at. But as far as what direction we want to take this in the last 10 minutes, I mean, I want to help people. I know we've covered a lot of ground in this episode and. And it hasn't been super actionable. We'll focus on that on round two.

Host (105:59)

Actionable, though, the niacin protocols, you know what I mean? Like building up your tolerance and stacking that with hyperthermia. Either sauna or something else, you know what I mean? Some people need to start as low as 25 milligrams of niacin, especially if they're dealing with parasites and histamine intolerance. But you can build up to very high levels and take that 20 or 30 minutes before hyperthermia. That's incredibly actionable. And people can get more details on that either in past episodes of this podcast or getting the L. Ron Hubbard book, Clear Body, Clear Mind. That's super actionable. The biorecharge and Bio boost for building the blood and detoxification. We told them exactly how to dose it. One packet per day of the BioCharge, two to three degree dropper full of the Bio Boost. Do that for six months, get yourself six of each. That's super actionable. We talked about diagnostic tools, including the, the bioelectrical impedance. Yeah, the, the, the dark field microscopy. I mean I think this is an actual. Right, right.

Theo Lucier (107:05)

You know what, I'm so used to like people have me on and I'm doing these like super specific step by step protocols and I didn't realize we covered all that ground.

Host (107:15)

You know what free diving and spear fishing is as one of the ultimate biohacks. That's also fun for people that have been focused on resource acquisition and just working too much and forgot how to play. You can play and have the ultimate biohack. That's as good as any device that you could spend a hundred thousand dollars on, you know, just by making that a part of your life. This is very actionable.

Theo Lucier (107:39)

Yeah, that's the. You're right. Because I spent 12 grand on something in the early days because I was so desperate and I look back at it, I'm like, it worked. But man, I could have done that for like 100 bucks if I had known what I was doing.

Host (107:54)

Done a couple of dry fasts over a year or two.

Theo Lucier (107:58)

Yeah, yeah, exactly. I just, you know, what I want to share is focus on detox first and feel that. Remove the poisons from the cell so it starts working better and then it can assimilate the nutrients that you're giving it. So instead of an additive model of biohacking where you're just throwing lots of stuff at your cells, at your body, focus on removing what can you remove first. And I don't mean in a metaphysical sense, that can be helpful too. But I mean like literally if you children are born with gallbladder issues now they have gallstones, they're born that way because their mother is so toxic that they're filtering it out in utero. That's, that's how, that's how bad it is. So focus on detox because that's going to move the needle the most on your energy and the energy. Energy is the currency of life. If you have more energy, you can do anything. And you don't even have to do anything. You can just be in a better mood. I mean it's literally that simple. So focus on detox first and then get into the more additive stuff. And look at the human body not as this weird biochemistry machine, but as an electrical thing. We're electrical beings in all senses of it. And there's a whole world of health out there waiting for you. Is super interesting to explore in the electro health world. I mean it's not just these cool frequency Specific units like the tenant biomodulator. But there's pulse electromagnetic fields and there's rife machines and there's, you know, there's all kind like low level lasers therapy. I mean that's, that's a photoelectric effect again, that's electrons. I mean it's, it's, there's a whole world out there for you to explore. It's really neat.

Host (110:02)

So if we were going to do a Cliff Notes, you know, knowing we're going to do a part two and, and, and dive deeper on some stuff we've got, I mean you and I were introduced through dry fasting with friends, which, which you guys do, which is a great way for people that want to get a meaningful stem cell Release, do a 5 day dry fast and have a expert guidance and a community of people going through it with them. I highly recommend that, which they could do it@dryfastingwithfriends.com and you guys have, you know, we'll, we'll let them know when you have upcoming ones and that sort of thing. We've got, so we've got dry fasting, we've got the niacin saunas, we've got the, the humic fulvic with biorecharge and, and bio boost. You've got the liver gallbladder flush. What's the Cliff Notes like when you say focus on detox first give people the marching orders that they could get to work on. Now to start that process that you sort of in the order that you consider highest priority.

Theo Lucier (111:03)

There's, yeah, there's, there's levels to the game. So most people are walking around with like undiagnosed scurvy. It's, it's just a fact, like most people are extremely vitamin C C deficient. In 1963, a guy named Dr. Cathcart invented something called the vitamin C flush. And your own body will tell you exactly how much vitamin C it needs and wants through something called a bowel tolerance number. So there is a specific method of dosing vitamin C where you take 3,000 milligrams every 15 minutes until you have to run to the bathroom and you have a watery discharge. That's the protocol. It's super simple. I sell a product around it. You don't need the product. You can just go get yourself some clean non GMO ascorbic acid powder and you take 2 to 3000 milligrams every 15 minutes. It has to be exactly down to the second when you take it, you know, shoot it back in six ounces of water, whatever. And you just keep doing that and doing it and doing it and doing it. And then pretty soon it'll hit. You have to run to the bathroom. That's your bowel tolerance number. Then you do a taper down. In the days afterwards, you've just completely saturated all the plasma in your body, your entire body, with vitamin C. And then you'll find your body goes and fixes all this stuff, stuff that might have been a nagging issue. Vitamin C is an incredibly healing substance. You know why? Because it's full of electrons. It's a. It's a huge electron donor. Again, it addresses the electrical health of the body. So that's a detox. Anyone can do that. Take most people, like, an hour, hour and a half, two hours. That's where I would start.