Dancing For Hitler with Jeremy Piven

Summary

The Bonfire with Big Jay Oakerson and Robert Kelly

Episode: Dancing For Hitler with Jeremy Piven
Original Air Date: December 31, 2025
Guest: Jeremy Piven
Key Guests/Interlocutors: Eddie Pepitone, Doug Ellin (appearing as Jeremy Piven), Jay Oakerson, Bobby Kelly

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Episode Overview

This episode features actor and comedian Jeremy Piven in a candid, rollicking conversation with hosts Big Jay Oakerson and Robert Kelly, alongside Eddie Pepitone and Doug Ellin. The discussion dives into Piven’s latest film project, his evolution from dramatic acting to stand-up comedy, the challenges and rewards of both crafts, showbiz's evolving culture, reflections on fame, and the complex intersection of art, personal identity, and public perception. True to The Bonfire’s format, the conversation is both unfiltered and uproarious, filled with industry insights, behind-the-scenes stories, and razor-sharp banter.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Jeremy Piven’s Dramatic Role: “Dancing for Hitler”

(02:10 – 07:30)

• Piven discusses his upcoming film inspired by Arthur Miller’s short story, "The Performance," centered on a Jewish tap dancer invited to perform for Hitler.

• He explains how the project became a metaphor for the compromises artists make for survival and recognition.

• Piven details the years he spent learning tap, reflecting on artistic dedication and “grinding” while funding fell through.

• The conversation branches into the stigma of actors doing reality shows, referencing Patrice O’Neal’s rejection of “Celebrity Fit Club” as a cautionary tale regarding career moves.

  Notable Quote:

  • “It’s the best thing I’ve ever done in my life. It took so long to get the money that I just kept getting better at tap. ...No one’s coming to save you. ...You gotta make your own breaks.” — Jeremy Piven [04:53]

2. Antisemitism, Artistic Courage, and Industry Politics

(05:35 – 08:59)

• Piven describes the pressure and emotional climax of a pivotal scene in the film where his character reveals he is Jewish, capturing the broader themes of antisemitism and identity.

• The group reflects on the absurdity and seriousness of prejudice, the limits of social commentary, and the role art plays in confronting difficult topics.

• Piven touches on Oscar campaign politics, lamenting the need for extensive—and expensive—PR pushes for awards.

  Notable Quote:

  • “There’s this scene between the two of us and I just knew if I can pull this scene off, this will say more about antisemitism and the absurdity of it ...than any tweet, conversation, op-ed, TED talk you could do in your life.” — Jeremy Piven [06:28]

3. Stand-up vs. Acting: Skills, Stigma, and Respect

(09:05 – 20:54)

• The hosts challenge Piven about crossing over from acting to stand-up, confronting the suspicion comics feel toward actors entering their space.

• Anecdotes about crowd reactions, the honesty of different audiences, and the gratification of connecting directly with a live crowd.

• Piven affirms his genuine respect for the craft of stand-up, emphasizing hustle, paying dues, and learning from every set.

• Piven and the hosts note the differences in how actors and comics are held to public standards and discuss the experience of being scrutinized by fans and peers.

• Candid discussion on not taking criticism personally and how sustained effort and resilience matter more than any “natural” entitlement to the stage.

  Notable Quotes:

  • “No one is more honest than a black crowd. No one. You’re either gonna crush or they’re going to destroy you.” — Jeremy Piven [10:00]
  • “Any comic thinks anybody can do stand-up, right? But anybody can…for a minute.” — Bobby Kelly [20:09]

4. Industry Realities: Fame, Schmoozing, and Loneliness

(13:21 – 16:12)

• Reflections on Hollywood’s relentless focus on novelty and fleeting loyalty, contrasted with the comparatively steady rewards and autonomy of stand-up.

• The loneliness and emotional “whiplash” of stand-up touring—the dramatic shift from stage adulation to solitary hotel rooms.

• The hosts and Piven highlight the difference between the pampered world of acting sets versus the gritty independence of club comedy.

  Notable Quote:

  • “The transition from I was just some type of weird God, right? To I’m just a dickhead alone.” — Bobby Kelly [14:05]

5. Crossover Skills: Improv, Acting, and Comedy

(32:02 – 32:58)

• Piven draws parallels between improv and stand-up, noting his improvisational work on sets informed his comfort with crowd work.

• Discussion on the “building blocks” of performance confidence and the transferable skills between dramatic stagecraft and comedy.

• Stories from early theater life (doing Chekhov at 8 years old!), and the blending of dramatic and comedic training from a young age.

  Notable Quote:

  • “Improvising, thinking on your feet… it all kind of informs, you know what I mean? ...You have a building block already.” — Doug Ellin (as Jeremy Piven) [32:05]

6. Behind the Scenes: Career Longevity and Growth

(27:24 – 29:13, 35:00 – 36:57)

• Piven recounts his early break on The Larry Sanders Show, the formative influence of Garry Shandling, and the experience of working alongside giants of comedy and drama.

• Anecdotes about auditioning for Michael Mann’s Heat—persistently waiting hours to get a shot at a scene with De Niro—a testament to endurance and patience in entertainment.

• Observations on how career “breakthroughs” can come late, but each part of the journey builds into personal and professional growth.

  Notable Quote:

  • “If you don’t lose your mind and you stay in it long enough, you’re going to live your dream.” — Jeremy Piven [38:00]

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Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• [04:53] Jeremy Piven: “You gotta make your own breaks and no one’s coming to save you.”
• [06:28] Jeremy Piven: “This will say more about antisemitism and the absurdity of it …than any tweet, conversation, op-ed, TED talk you could do in your life.”
• [10:00] Jeremy Piven: “No one is more honest than a black crowd. No one. You’re either gonna crush or they’re going to destroy you.”
• [14:05] Bobby Kelly: “The transition from I was just some type of weird God, right? To I’m just a dickhead alone.”
• [20:09] Bobby Kelly: “Any comic thinks anybody can do stand-up, right? But anybody can…for a minute.”
• [32:05] Doug Ellin (as Jeremy Piven): “Improvising, thinking on your feet… it all kind of informs, you know what I mean? ...You have a building block already.”
• [38:00] Jeremy Piven: “If you don’t lose your mind and you stay in it long enough, you’re going to live your dream.”

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Memorable Moments & Segments

• [03:43] - Piven contemplates joining “Dancing With the Stars,” describing it as “the white flag” of a performer’s career.
• [07:51] - Bobby Kelly shares the story of being mistaken for Michael Chiklis at Hollywood parties.
• [29:51] - Piven reflects on trying not to laugh as a young actor among comedic legends on Larry Sanders.
• [34:46] - Back and forth banter about acting as kids in theater, improv games, and “butchering Chekhov at 8 years old.”
• [38:24] - Q&A from Black Lou: Favorite Ari Gold monologue from Entourage, describing the pressure and rehearsal process behind it.

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Candid Industry Takeaways

• Stand-up and acting require distinct, hard-earned skills, but some foundational abilities overlap in meaningful ways.
• Resilience and persistence, rather than entitlement or connections, are the real keys to success across performing arts.
• The entertainment business can be both brutally honest and emotionally punishing—learning not to personalize rejection is crucial.
• Fame is ephemeral in Hollywood, but building one’s own audience through comedy provides a sense of agency and security.

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Episode Conclusion

The episode ends with the hosts and Piven riffing about touring, their mutual respect for the different crafts, and the ongoing thrill and struggle of performing. Piven plugs his tour dates and jokes about wanting to be the show’s honorary third mic.

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Quick Reference: Important Segments

| Topic/Event | Timestamp | |-------------------------------------------------|--------------| | Piven describes “Dancing for Hitler” film | 02:10–07:30 | | Oscar campaign grind, antisemitism themes | 05:35–08:59 | | Stand-up vs. Acting—respect and rivalry | 09:05–20:54 | | Industry realities, fame & loneliness | 13:21–16:12 | | Crossover skills: Improv and performance | 32:02–32:58 | | Early career, Larry Sanders memories | 27:24–29:13 | | Auditioning for Heat, De Niro anecdote | 35:00–36:57 | | Q&A: Best Ari Gold monologue | 38:24 | | Closing and plugs | 41:00–41:39 |

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This summary captures the heart, humor, and substance of “Dancing for Hitler with Jeremy Piven.” For those wanting both laughs and industry wisdom, this episode is a showcase of experience earned—and shared—without filter or pretense.

Transcript

[Narrator]

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[Bobby Kelly]

Rest of the show.

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Doug Ellin]

And now, the bonfire with Big J Okerson and Robert Kelly.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, that's right, everybody. The Judgment Night soundtrack. Famous anti Semite Everlast featuring helmet. Well documented.

[Bobby Kelly]

What a. I mean, crazy time that you could do that as a joke and not get.

[Eddie Pepitone]

What was that joke? He said they were just doing like. He said they were going full method. He was going Everlasting. Daniel Day Lewis followed the same actor's code.

[Bobby Kelly]

Was he?

[Eddie Pepitone]

Yes, he was.

[Bobby Kelly]

Dude. I was doing it.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Sorry, Mr. Piven. I was deep in character.

[Bobby Kelly]

Was your.

[Doug Ellin]

Was your character method? It's Methodist with you.

[Bobby Kelly]

Did you ever star David out in your character? How did he know you was your character? I don't believe he was Jewish in the.

[Doug Ellin]

That's the weird thing.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It wasn't sold as a Jewish character. You know, Ray, I don't remember even the last name.

[Doug Ellin]

He's not.

[Bobby Kelly]

He was like just a guy.

[Doug Ellin]

Just a guy. There's no overt message that ever saying that he's. No reference to being Jewish.

[Bobby Kelly]

You weren't doing the emo before you ate something.

[Doug Ellin]

Exactly. Davening like, you know, as a button to every scene.

[Bobby Kelly]

Yeah, dude.

[Doug Ellin]

No, I don't know what. I don't know what in God's name that was. But, you know, it's funny because for the past 15 years, I've been working on this film, and that's a real number. Speaking of Jews, where I'm gonna tell you what the premise is and you're gonna laugh in my face, as if. Cause that's what everyone did. And that's why it took me so long to get the money. But there was a short story in the New Yorker by Arthur Miller called the Performance, and it's about a Jewish tap dancer who lives in Brooklyn. And he not making it, you know, really great at what he does, but can't make a living. And he gets offered more money than he's ever been offered to go to Berlin and then ultimately dance for Hitler. And it's fun. Were talking about, like, well, how much of yourself will you compromise in this game? And that this is the ultimate metaphor for that. And my character's willing to risk it all and. And hide the fact these Jewish. Take the money. You know what I mean? And it's. It's. It's the best thing I've ever done in my life. And I had to. You know, it took so long to get the money that I kept studying tap from a guy, a New York dude who's on Broadway all the time, this amazing tapper. And he had great patience with me. And every year they said, no, I just kept getting better at tap. And I remember last year, my then agent said to me, this. This is a callback to what we were talking about earlier. They said, you're going to hate this. Don't be mad at me. But they're calling from Dancing with the Stars.

[Eddie Pepitone]

No shit.

[Doug Ellin]

And for me, you have to understand, for me, like Chappelle says, that's the white flag. For me to do that is, you know, that would be immediately like, oh, man, that motherfucker gave up.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Crimes are tough. I know. Well, that was a famous.

[Bobby Kelly]

Are you sure he wasn't watching the male dancers in that show? It wasn't Flag.

[Eddie Pepitone]

But do you remember Patrice?

[Bobby Kelly]

But do you remember Patrice, the white nothing.

[Jay Oakerson]

Okay, Patrice.

[Bobby Kelly]

Patrice had a hot bomb in front of everybody.

[Doug Ellin]

Wow.

[Bobby Kelly]

I thought you'd be proud of me that I didn't say anything.

[Doug Ellin]

We can fix that in post.

[Bobby Kelly]

No, this live, Patrice. Oh, this is out there like that Cupid shit.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, it's already out there. Patrice kind of famously turned down. Like, I remember the Steinbergs came to him with, like, Celebrity Fit Club, and he was like, hey, can you not make me, like, a wash up before I'm an anybody? You're already doing the thing where it's like, the come down.

[Bobby Kelly]

In hindsight, it would have been the best thing for him.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It would have been enormous.

[Bobby Kelly]

Yeah, that's been huge.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Huge in his life, probably, but. Yeah, but I understand like the. The turning down or something like that. The performance. I've seen the. There's already a poster for. It's like you. Like in a red suit, sort of. Am I wrong?

[Doug Ellin]

There's. Right there. It's the best reviews I've ever had in my life. And. Yeah, and it's. It's funny how like, you know, once you guys know this is with your stand up lane, if you. If you don't give up, good things will happen. And this is one of those things where like, you know, you can rail against. Oh, man. No one. No one understands me. I'm not Ari. You can do all that shit all you want, but the reality is you gotta make your own breaks and no one's coming to save you. And, you know, everyone laughed in my face about this and I just knew if I can get this made. And by the way, it addresses antisemitism in the. In the best way.

[Jay Oakerson]

Full drama.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It's full dramatic.

[Doug Ellin]

It is, it is. And there. And there are funny parts and it's. The dance sequences are, you know, larger than life and it's a little bit of everything and there's a bit of humor in it, but yeah, it's a dark, twisted drama. And Robert Carlisle from, you know, Been Around Forever is one of the best actors on the. He's in the Full Monty and everything else and train spotting. And so he plays this German character opposite me. And there's this one scene between the two of us and I just knew if I can pull this scene off, this will say more about antisemitism and the absurdity of it or racism or whatever than any tweet, conversation, op ed, TED talk you could do in your life. I was like, just pull the scene off. And we got. I got the chills. We got really lucky. And he's a great fucking actor. And the moment happened where I have to reveal that I'm Jewish and like, this moment is like, I either hit this or none of it works and it's all for nothing. And we hit it. And so now it hasn't come out yet. We did a little one week run for your consideration. And, you know, I got these reviews and everyone, all the big shots who predict these things were like, I was on a short list for the Oscars with Timothee, Chalamet and blah, blah, blah. I mean, it's. The role is. Is unbelievable. And so I thought that if you do the work of your life and it's a miracle and you do this, that's enough. And there and everyone's like, no, bro, you need X. You need millions for an Oscar campaign. And I'm like, no, no, no, we're good, we're good. And as you look from Anora, that won't, you know, the, the Oscar, they came out and said, look, we had $20 million for our campaign. You know what I mean? Yeah. They, this is documented.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It's actually like billboards and stuff like that.

[Doug Ellin]

And you got to get a screener to everyone. You know what I mean?

[Bobby Kelly]

And then you have to go to the parties. Oh, you have to meet all those people. I went to one of those parties when Mickey Rourke was in wrestling.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

Wrestler.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

And I went to one of those. Every thought I was Michael Chiklis, and I swear to God, they were like, mike, turn around. I was just waving at people.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Bobby Kelly is Michael Chiklis, his greatest char.

[Bobby Kelly]

But I, But I remember walking into these parties, it was every star. I walked, right. Dustin Hoffman.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

Walking by me. Laurence Fishburne. Everybody was at this fucking thing.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

And I was like, why are they. They have to be.

[Doug Ellin]

They have to be there and you have to get the word out. And I, I. It's so funny that I played this character that was Hollywood Ari, you know, Gold. And I. All I've ever done in my life is show up, grind, and get out. And I, you know, we were talking about schmoozing earlier. I never did it. You know what I mean? I just. And that's not, I'm not saying it wasn't a premeditated thing. I'm just trying to do the best I can. And I usually had four page monologues, so, you know, I was just, you know, in it. So, yeah, when it came time for the performance, you know, it didn't get nominated. It happens. And the movie hasn't come out yet. But it's one of these things where I can tell you when you see this movie, I mean, people, you know, we're living in times where there is a lot of anti Semitism right now, and everyone's an expert on Gaza, but it's like, do we really know what's going on over there? It's a little nuanced. Is it going to be, you know what I mean?

[Bobby Kelly]

Are you afraid?

[Jay Oakerson]

Sure.

[Bobby Kelly]

Are you afraid that people are going to go see you do this movie?

[Doug Ellin]

Right.

[Bobby Kelly]

And that's going to be a whole fan base that has no idea you do a standup. Right. So those people are like, oh, my God, we got to go see him. And then they're going to come and be like, oh, what the fuck is this? Like, you know what I mean? Is that movie, that, that angle on the movie going to get you a whole other fan base that's going to come see your stand up and be like, this guy's fucking a stool.

[Doug Ellin]

You know, it's funn. You say that because Craig Robinson, who is one of the funniest people on the planet, you know, he's great, he's amazing. And he came to one of my screenings and you know, growing up in the, in the black community, I can tell you there's. And I mean that it sounds like I'm doing a bit. That there is no more honest community they will take, you know, from doing. Even if you dabble in the chitlin circuit. By the way, I didn't come up with that name.

[Eddie Pepitone]

That was started for years upon years.

[Bobby Kelly]

Okay.

[Doug Ellin]

You know, you know how tough that crowd is.

[Bobby Kelly]

The singer of Everlast actually came up with it.

[Doug Ellin]

No one is more honest than a black crowd. No one.

[Eddie Pepitone]

No.

[Doug Ellin]

You're either gonna crush or they're going to destroy you. And Craig watched the performance and he came up to me, man, and he was. The things he said to me and he said, you're gonna not do stand up ever again. Now. I just saw that, you know what I mean? So he thought. Because when you, when you see something that is moving. But the reality is I love stand up and I love doing it. And there's, there's. It's addictive and there's nothing better than thinking some new shit and going different place.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Though I gotta say, it's almost my point. Like, there's something about comedy that doesn't like allow you to like, if I coming from just that, like that I do. I would love. Every time I've auditioned for acting stuff and everything, it's always tends to be like a comedy thing and somebody else's comedy and anything I've ever been intrigued by that I've seen or gotten to read for was like super dramatic. Yet I don't see myself being able to disconnect from like the eye rolly of funny enough to like deliver a scene, you know, you would need to put into it to when it's over, when they yell cut to still have to like walk away. Like, you know, give me a second to kind of get my together. I feel like as soon as they yell cut, I'd be like, was that good? Did I do good? You know, it's like, it's hard like to immerse yourself like that.

[Doug Ellin]

Well, you know, because I know the discipline you guys need and the reps that you need to be as good as you guys are. And you have that in you. And I'm telling you, I won't do it now because it'll take me too long. But, like, we could do a pow hour at some point and I could tell you the different variables that will get you into the state where you're totally present. You know, when you're in the zone on stage, you're either in that moment totally present, or you're not. And you have to be to do that type of crowd work and whatever. But with acting, acting is a momentum sport. You need momentum. You need to get off your fucking self and be totally present in that fucking moment. And then you don't even know what the hell just happened. And then you got lucky and had some fucking magic and blah, blah, blah. But, like, I can tell you the ways to get into that, because you can do it. Because you guys have. Also a comic said to me, when you go back to acting after doing all this stand up, you're gonna be a better actor. And I was like, what? And, man, was he right. Because the reality is you guys were up on stage in the moment getting those reps every night. So when you. And it made me a better actor. And so when you see the performance, it's like so much of that was my standup. Because the reality with act is you're sitting idle and you're waiting for the phone to ring. You know what I mean? And you get cold. I have no rust on me because I'm just on the road to people. You're interacting and also committing to bits and doing, you know, act outs and telling stories. That's performing.

[Eddie Pepitone]

There's a difference in comedy for sure.

[Bobby Kelly]

There's a different thing, though. Like. Like, I, like, a lot of guys hate it or say they hate it. I love being on a set. I love having a trailer. I love being around, you know, the going in and, you know, waiting for your scene to be done and doing your stuff. And it's. It's tedious, but there's something about it that I really enjoy. But it's. It's more pampered, it's less vicious. You know what I mean? Like, you go to a comedy club, you know what I mean? It's like, you know, some guy, hey, you mind if I sell my shirt? Oh, shit. Oh, yeah, go ahead, do it. You know what I mean? How many tickets we're doing Good on this show. But, you know, you know, the football team's in town. They also had a cheerleading competition, and there's five of the comics in town, and there's a balloon fest.

[Doug Ellin]

Well, the thing that's so amazing to me is because I grew up on the stage doing plays, was actually born in New York and went to nyu. So I have all these incredible ties and love New York, but no one would ever talk to you before you get up and do a play. You know, when you're doing Broadway or whatever and everyone, like, gives you. But here at Stand up, they're fucking with you as you're getting on stage. They don't give a fuck. And that's one thing that was like, oh, shit. This is different.

[Bobby Kelly]

Standup is very lonely, too, if you're not a animal.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

Pretty much it's this. Holy. Taking photos and thank you, good night, blah, blah, blah. And then you're in a hotel room.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

And you just like yourself. You're like.

[Eddie Pepitone]

That is the strangest part. The.

[Bobby Kelly]

The transition from I was just some type of weird God, right? To I'm just a dickhead alone.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It's an emotional thing that probably more people should talk to a therapist about. In Stand up is that exact thing, that moment, we're like, what the am I doing? Like, you're like, I was just that there was a line of people, like, waiting to see me and wanted me to sign things and do this because now I'm in socks deciding whether I'm gonna get a Snickers ice cream bar or this little pack of Nestle.

[Bobby Kelly]

Dibs. And go eat it like a little.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Fatso on my belly in my room while I watch YouTube videos.

[Commercial Announcer 2]

Yeah.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It's so not exactly life.

[Doug Ellin]

That's duality of life. Not to get too pretentious. I use big words, by the way.

[Eddie Pepitone]

I love it.

[Doug Ellin]

Don't worry about it.

[Eddie Pepitone]

You're gonna fry Bobby's brain.

[Host/Interviewer]

I know.

[Bobby Kelly]

No, but looking at one right now.

[Doug Ellin]

I feel like I'm a real pretentious. I live that shit all the time. Because, you know, we know from doing ads to get people to come to our shows, like, where the love is for us and the love for me is New York. So knowing people give it to you straight here, and if you suck, they're going to tell you something. And I walk down the street, and the love that I get from people is really. It's. It's amazing, and it makes me feel incredible. And the reality is about Hollywood is it's brutal. It's Fucking brutal. And other countries are a little more loyal to those that, you know, they connect with. You know, but with Hollywood, it's like, okay, who's new? Who's. Who's the. We got the fresh shit. Yeah, bro, I know. Three Emmys in a row. Shut the fuck up.

[Jay Oakerson]

Comedy.

[Doug Ellin]

It's been a minute.

[Bobby Kelly]

I think comedy is too, like, for the, like, the fame thing. They're always looking for that. Hollywood is looking for what. What's the next thing?

[Doug Ellin]

Right?

[Bobby Kelly]

But the good thing about standup is you can build up your own fan base and make a beautiful career and make great money and enjoy your life and. And you're your own boss. Like, when all that me too shit and all the. The, you know, the censored shit. No, you can't say this and that. They were like, you know, are you worried about that? I mean, everybody I knew was like, no, that's actors. Actors have to worry about everything. You have to worry about what you're saying, what you're doing, but comics don't.

[Doug Ellin]

You know what's so interesting when you do. I'm glad that you just said that because.

[Bobby Kelly]

Do I get a pivot for that?

[Doug Ellin]

For sure.

[Eddie Pepitone]

That's a white pivot.

[Bobby Kelly]

Piven actually said. He's glad I said.

[Doug Ellin]

No, no, no. I really am, because you were being very honest there. And I'm glad you said it, because if I said it, it would sound pretentious in the way that actors are intrinsically held to a different standard. And that's just a fact. The reality is, if you're in the NFL, you could have done some crazy ass. They're going to put you back on that field, and if you prove yourself out there, then. Then you're in. You win. It's all good. But actors, you know, and I've lived through this shit, man. You know, they hold us to this standard. And. And it's. It's interesting. And with. With comics, you know, it's. It's a little bit different, but, you know, it's fascinating because I don't know about you guys, but when I see people filming me as. As I'm up there, it's a. It does suck. And you got it. You got to shut it down. Because the reality is, if they lift a bit it out of context, you're.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Yeah, yeah. And there's a microscope on you because you're an actor doing stand up now, so they're gonna, like, look for the reason to, like, take a shot. That is interesting.

[Bobby Kelly]

But now you feel like, I mean, you've been doing it. Look, when you first started doing it, I was like, what? You know what I mean? No, seriously, I'll be honest with you. I was like, of course I was like. Because there's a lot of comment, a lot of actors at certain points were like, you know, go do this. You know what I mean? But you've been doing it long enough now. And you're, you're like, you said you're grinding it out. You're paying your dues. You've been to that small club where you're like, I gotta sell tickets. You know what I mean? You're passing out flyers, you're doing all that grunt work that you have to do to actually become a good stand up, to build that fan base. Because they're not gonna come back if you suck. You're not going back to that club.

[Doug Ellin]

No, but also, I come by it honestly in the way that I do really respect the space you occupy when you're up there, no matter what you're doing. And you gotta bring it and you gotta work your ass off. And listen, I get where you guys are coming from. And one of the great things about getting older is like, I don't take anything personally. That's one of the great things about getting older and the wisdom. I've had conversations and I'm not gonna name who this comic was, but I celebrated him. He was doing some acting. And I know he had no background in acting, but I was like, I saw your shit. You're fucking great. And as I'm getting up on stage, I hear him saying, anyone thinks they could do stand up now? And points to me. And by the way, you said, nice job. Yeah. And I was just celebrating his acting. Do you know what I mean? And so. But my point to you is that to me is inspiring because now he has to sit and watch me simply because he was after me.

[Bobby Kelly]

Joe List is an asshole. I'm just gonna say he's a piece of shit. He's a narcissist. And I do have a podcast. I don't like him.

[Eddie Pepitone]

But here's, here's the funniest thing about that, though. It's those lines. It's. And I think, again, older and wiser because I've been doing this now 28 years. You've been doing it 30 years now, Bob. I know it's nuts. How long? But, like, now I'm forgetting. Come on, give me back, Bobby.

[Bobby Kelly]

It's crazy because I've been doing it for a long time. And older, wiser, yes.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Wiser of getting people to come on Bobby pot.

[Bobby Kelly]

Getting people to see you as a.

[Doug Ellin]

As you get older, you get some wisdom and you learn how to not take things personally.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Not take things personally for sure.

[Jay Oakerson]

Things don't bug you as much.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Yes, things. I bug you as much when people. Well, I said to take. I remember having that attitude of when, like, you know, I remember one time there was like, it was like a strike years and you're not even like the original strike one. Further years back and there was like, they said Dax Shepard started doing stand up comedy now and something I was like. And I remember having that kind of like, I guess anyone can just do stand up comedy now. But the reality is you get older and do it long enough and find your own lane too. A lot of that's due to your own self. Like, sure. You know, satisfaction in some way to go. Anybody can, like it's a dumb statement because anybody thinks it gives you stand up. You. Right.

[Bobby Kelly]

But anybody can. Anybody can for a minute.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Sure.

[Bobby Kelly]

For a while and then it usually fades out, you know, You've been doing it how long you been. Like four years now.

[Doug Ellin]

I've been doing it almost 10 years on the road. But like I've been touring since 2017.

[Bobby Kelly]

Right.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah. And the thing is a long time, dude. Well, well, to civilians, to you guys, you look at me like I'm a newbie, but the reality is I'm a hybrid in the way that the stage is my home and I've gotten notes, you know, from, from, from I personally, because I listen. One comic said to me, you know how I know you don't suck? I said, how he goes. Because everyone's silent about you and if you sucked, they would be fucking gloating.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, like shit again.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah. And that's the reality. That's the, the culture. And I get it. You guys got to work so fucking hard. And another comic said, you'll never be a real comic. And I said, why? And she said, because you didn't have to go through what we went through. Now.

[Commercial Announcer 2]

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[Jay Oakerson]

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[Bobby Kelly]

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[Jay Oakerson]

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[Eddie Pepitone]

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[Bobby Kelly]

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[Doug Ellin]

All the trials and tribulations of an actor. I started at 8 and broke through at 40. So I had 32 years of grinding. So I understand the discipline and, and, and I love it. But I don't take any of this stuff personally. I wouldn't. When, when I get on by, by comics, it's like, great, come and see my, my stuff. But I was getting these notes.

[Jay Oakerson]

Do actors get stuff like that?

[Eddie Pepitone]

Like when like a Pete Davidson comes out of just doing stand up and blah blah, and then gets a bunch of acting thing is there, does it go the other way where they're like, this guy thinks he's an actor now. Because it seems like no one ever gives that direction.

[Doug Ellin]

No, that's my, that's my point.

[Bobby Kelly]

When actors can't comics, we're almost obliged to. You know what I mean? We, we yap, we talk about each other. We trash other people. Actors, when you're, they do that very quietly. Be behind. You'll never know when an actor is talking shit about you.

[Doug Ellin]

Look.

[Bobby Kelly]

Because you'll walk up like, oh my God, we're just talking about you. Good to see you not knowing. They were just talking about what a piece of shit actor you are. You know what I mean?

[Doug Ellin]

I mean this kind of like correlates with, I think where we're at in this culture right now, to be honest with you. Because I think people are also dug in and defined by their opinions and their politics that when you have a conversation with someone, for me, if you're available to have your mind changed, then we're all good. We're golden.

[Bobby Kelly]

Are you listening to him? Paco?

[Doug Ellin]

But yeah, Paco, fucking listen. Do you know what I mean?

[Bobby Kelly]

Like Paco trying to get him to be A woman. And it's not working.

[Doug Ellin]

But. But my point is like, you know, when it's like, listen, I'm defined by my point of view, and if I let in you're on the other team, if I let some sort of logic come in, I'm gonna lose my identity. I'll lose my whole fucking identity. And I think with, with comics, when they look at me and they go, this fucking dude. But the reality is, if you see my set and then you say that I'm all good, but I've gotten notes. I remember this comic was giving me notes. I was like, that's. Those are really interesting notes. Did you see my set? And he goes, I didn't see your set, but he was giving me notes. You know what I mean? So. And they were good notes, but they weren't. Had nothing to do with what you said already. Nothing.

[Bobby Kelly]

What?

[Doug Ellin]

So. And it's all, it's all, you know, I. I can't say who Russell Peters, but.

[Eddie Pepitone]

He'S like, this is appealing to 7 billion Indians. Well, then maybe rewrite it.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer]

Did you. Do you feel that you.

[Doug Ellin]

Sorry, okay.

[Host/Interviewer]

Do you feel particular that you broke through at 40? Because I mean, for me there's like you were in Holy Grail things. For me, the Larry Sanders show is top of the mountain. Especially now, as we were talking about the other day, that late night shows are 20th century model that don't seem to work anymore.

[Doug Ellin]

Yes.

[Host/Interviewer]

But coming from Second City.

[Doug Ellin]

Yes.

[Host/Interviewer]

And then getting the Larry Sanders Show.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah, that's huge. It was absolutely huge. And you're absolutely right. Garry Shandling was, God rest his soul, an absolute genius. And it was my first job out of college. No, sorry. Second City was my first real job. But so, you know, getting that and being able to witness that type of genius. It was. The Larry Sanders show is. Was the first bit of original series comedy on hbo and from that came Soprano, Sex and City, Entourage, blah, blah, blah. But that was. So if you even look at any of the like top 10 from the 90s, it was always Seinfeld and Larry Sanders 1 and 2, whatever. But being on that was. And being surrounded by that type of writing and insight was an absolute gift. So that was amazing. No, I didn't feel like a fresh face. I just think the irony of being 40 movies into the game, being a working actor, a journeyman actor, which I still am, but getting that award was really funny to me. You know what I mean? And none of it makes any sense how you're viewed. That's nothing. We Don't. We don't need to think about how we're viewed. That's why when I say to you, when. When I get on, you know, for. For. For doing this, Lane, it doesn't matter. It's inspiring to me.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Right.

[Doug Ellin]

Because I want you to. To watch. And. And then if you. Then if you have notes, great, tell me, because I just want to get better. But once you extract how Bobby feels.

[Eddie Pepitone]

I tell him, look at the comments on Reddit about you in that cupid outfit, and it'll be good as fuel for you. Be fueled.

[Bobby Kelly]

I will not.

[Doug Ellin]

Okay, okay. Yeah. I mean, we know that it's not healthy to look at what people say about.

[Eddie Pepitone]

I think that one, though, you'll be.

[Jay Oakerson]

Surprised how positive it'll be. Yeah, just give it like.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Just read like a hundred of them.

[Bobby Kelly]

Listen, what people think of me is none of my business.

[Host/Interviewer]

I told Jay those were the. The Tooth movies that I. Well, the Larry Sanders I just rewatched. The William Shatner speaker phone scene, which I watch regularly, bro.

[Doug Ellin]

Those guys were so good, literally, as an actor, as. And I was a kid when I did it. Those Jeffrey Tambor, Ripton, Shandling, those dudes were so funny that literally I'm in this scene and I've been on stage my whole life, and literally all. There were times when my only point of concentration was to not laugh because they were that fucking funny. You know, Jeffrey Tambor, you know, would just, you know, they say, how do you play comedy on camera? Does you play it a little more serious than drama? And this motherfucker would dig in, and he was such a fully committed buffoon, and it was all. All my. I just didn't want to ruin a take because he's. That was that good. So it was an honor to be a part of that. Yeah, for sure.

[Host/Interviewer]

The other thing.

[Doug Ellin]

Thank you for celebrating me.

[Host/Interviewer]

Well, the other thing you did at the same time, which I love, is Grosse Pointe. Blank.

[Doug Ellin]

Gross point blank. Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer]

The scene I identify with is you keep saying, hey, Jenny Slater, because I was not getting the beautiful. Still having a crush on the beautiful girl in. In high school.

[Doug Ellin]

Well, we.

[Host/Interviewer]

Great scene.

[Doug Ellin]

So I went. I grew up since I was 8 years old with Cusack, and so those were all my guys. And there was a girl named Jenny Stone that we all were in love with and couldn't get her attention, so I just changed her name a little bit and just would improvise. And everything I did in that movie was improvised. And all those 40 movies I did before Entourage, it wasn't on the page, that's just me improvising. And they didn't yell cut, and I just kind of kept going. And that's why they put me in, you know, any of these things even like. Yeah, and so it's funny because improvising, thinking on your feet, obviously, is crowd work and comedy. So it all kind of informs, you know what I mean? So when people go, bro, you can't do stand up, it's like, well, brother, I been. I've been writing comedy on my feet, on sets my whole life. I know it's a little different and. And bits. You know what I mean? But it's almost like, well, you were a. You know, a collegiate wrestler, and how could you possibly be in the octagon? Well, that's. That skill set translates.

[Bobby Kelly]

You have. That you have a stage confidence is a huge thing.

[Jay Oakerson]

What's we saying?

[Eddie Pepitone]

You have a building block already.

[Bobby Kelly]

Yeah. It takes a long time for you to get. Get like young comic. My advice is just get on stage, because there's a certain point where you get on stage and you. You're just confident enough to talk about what you want to talk about. And they get that. When you are more confident than them is when they feel that, and then they're listening to you, which is a big part of comedy. So you already had that rolling in.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

Because you had that stage.

[Doug Ellin]

You.

[Bobby Kelly]

You know. You know how to get up there, and. And these people are there to see you. But is it like. People were there to see you. You know, you've been on all these things. Has it changed over to. These people know you just from stand up. Well, do they? Oh, is it still all.

[Doug Ellin]

Here's what I. What I'm hearing after my shows, and you guys are gonna think that I'm making this shit up, but people come up to me and they go, we didn't know you were this funny. Which to me is a backhanded compliment because it's like, wow, I've been.

[Eddie Pepitone]

You've been funny. So much stuff.

[Doug Ellin]

I'm over 80 movies into my career.

[Bobby Kelly]

I hear the same thing, by the way, every show.

[Doug Ellin]

So. So to me, it's. It's a real shot in the arm because it's like. Because when you're up there, it's all coming from me. When I was playing Ari Gold, I would pitch all these jokes, and the reality is Doug Ellen wrote a hell of a script, and, like, you know, so it was always like, well, when do I pitch it? When's the right moment? When will it Best be received. And, you know, it's really. It's. It's hard to get that in there and then. So the freedom that you have when you're up there, there's. There's nothing like it. It's so addictive. So to hear people say that about my stand up is. It means a lot to me. And also selfishly, you know, you guys know, from doing. From doing press on the road, the worst question is, so what can we expect from you Friday, you know, at the Improv? And you're like, really? What? Can you.

[Eddie Pepitone]

How about your closing bit?

[Host/Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Doug Ellin]

How about some jokes?

[Bobby Kelly]

What gay radio show are you doing? Hey, guys, listen, I want to do it.

[Doug Ellin]

You came.

[Jay Oakerson]

Was it.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Was it nerve wracking to do, like, like heavy dramatic roles coming from? Because it seems like everything was kind of drawn towards, like, comedy. Second City is all funny and stuff like that. When you were younger, were you doing drama stuff?

[Host/Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Eddie Pepitone]

That's got to be a lot of it.

[Doug Ellin]

This will sound like I'm making this up, but I was doing Chekhov at 8 years old.

[Host/Interviewer]

I swear.

[Bobby Kelly]

I don't believe you.

[Doug Ellin]

You.

[Bobby Kelly]

I don't.

[Doug Ellin]

Okay.

[Bobby Kelly]

I think you're acting.

[Doug Ellin]

Will you. If. If you look at the PIV theater website.

[Bobby Kelly]

You have a theater?

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Bobby Kelly]

You have your own theater.

[Doug Ellin]

Well, I grew up in the theater. Yeah. That's why at 8 years old, Cusack and I switched. They needed a kid.

[Bobby Kelly]

Oh, I believe you, by the way. I was just. I was acting.

[Doug Ellin]

Oh, okay. That was amazing.

[Bobby Kelly]

I was doing my acting, bro.

[Doug Ellin]

That was.

[Bobby Kelly]

I believe you 100%.

[Doug Ellin]

Michael Chickless.

[Eddie Pepitone]

I thought you were crossing a line.

[Jay Oakerson]

That was.

[Bobby Kelly]

Thank you very much, guys. Thank you very much. This is my acting.

[Jay Oakerson]

Thank you.

[Bobby Kelly]

By the way, when I cross my hands.

[Doug Ellin]

No, but that. Yeah, they. But by the way, I was butchering Chekhov at 8 years old. That wasn't good.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, you weren't nailing.

[Doug Ellin]

Oh, no, I sucked. But I was up there doing it. And so one of the things that my parents would teach us when we, because we were kids, we would do, you know, these Chekhov or Kurt Vonnegan or Shakespeare. We were butchering everything. But then we would do improv scenes in between. We would get suggestions from the audience as kids, you know what I mean? Doing basically, like, you know, improv and crowd work as kids. So, like, there was no difference between comedy and drama. You just. You commit to everything.

[Host/Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Doug Ellin]

And the reality is something is. Is tragic and then funny. So I didn't think there was any difference. So when you say you Know, were you intimidated? Yeah. I was a kid opposite De Niro and Heat, and I had, you know, almost no lines, but kept improvising and, you know, made a little bit of a role for myself. By the way, that was a movie of all time. That's a great movie. And one of my. I shouldn't tell the story. Yeah, it's all right. You're not in the sequel then, sir.

[Eddie Pepitone]

There's a sequel?

[Doug Ellin]

There is a sequel.

[Eddie Pepitone]

It's gonna be. It's a prequel slash sequel. Right. It's like both. It's gonna go back and forth.

[Bobby Kelly]

I want to be in Ghost Town 2.

[Doug Ellin]

I'm sitting there getting ready to audition for Michael Mann, who obviously wrote and directed it, and, you know, a Chicago journeyman actor. And you're sitting there, and after the first hour, you know, you start to go a little crazy. And hour two, people get up and they're leaving, and then you text your agent. Yeah. And then they go, just leave. And then I had this thought, if you. If I stay here long enough, I get to be in a scene with Robert De Niro. So I stayed there for three hours and I watched. I wish I could say this actor's name, but I saw an actor craft, and he picked up the casting assistant and he threw him up against the fucking wall. And at that moment, the door opened and it was the casting director and everyone else. And, you know, it was not a good look for him.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Tom Sizemore.

[Doug Ellin]

By the way. Yeah, by the way. No, no. Unbelievable guess, because.

[Bobby Kelly]

Give yourself a pivot.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah. Because no, God rest his soul, but he was as eccentric as they come. So I. And there's. There's Michael Mann. You know, he's got the hardcore Chicago accent. Okay, you're here to do. But Dr. Bob. Go ahead. And it's like my. My moment. And I, you know, I did it. And he goes, you know, he's got his glasses down here. And he goes, that was good. That was good. We gotta do it again. And the castrant goes, he can do it. You saw him do it. He goes, well, I gotta call Bob De Niro. And the castrant goes, you don't gotta call Bob. Guy's got two lines. He just, you know, he just crushed it. So he made me do it again, and I did it in Ult. Ultimately, you know, if you don't lose your mind and you stay in it long enough, you're going to live your dream. Yeah, I know that sounds so. Like, I'm doing a TED Talk of talent, too.

[Bobby Kelly]

You do no no, you stop real quick. You did check off an ace.

[Doug Ellin]

I was butchering it.

[Bobby Kelly]

Yeah. I was picking my nose and eating it.

[Doug Ellin]

So was I. But then I got up on stage.

[Eddie Pepitone]

I'm 48. I'm still unfamiliar with Chekhov.

[Bobby Kelly]

He was installed. He's installed Trek.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Oh, they put the thing in his ear. And we're at the con. Yeah, that is correct.

[Bobby Kelly]

We have a question from the back of the room. What's up, Lou?

[Doug Ellin]

Hey, hey.

[Bobby Kelly]

Black Lou, over here.

[Doug Ellin]

Black Lou, what's going on?

[Bobby Kelly]

What was your favorite monologue from the show Entourage that Ari Gold did?

[Doug Ellin]

Because there were so many great monologues in the.

[Bobby Kelly]

In the series.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah, that's a great question. And on that note, you know, one of the reasons why we talked about the fact that I. You guys aren't great at schmoozing. I am a late bloomer to it because I had to be word perfect on those speeches. I had to approach the whole thing like a play. So by the time I got to set, it was like I was in month three of a Broadway show. So I had been running these monologues for anyone who would listen. That's. That's another secret to acting. It's like. Like you want to put yourself in the most uncomfortable position, you know, you possibly can doing that scene so that by the time you're on set, you're like, I've already done it for the most judgmental people. Yeah.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Everybody else is playing along.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah. And these people are buying in. But I was in my kitchen doing it for people like, you suck. And so it's all good. So. So I had to be, you know, word perfect and to the point where then you can have fun and make it feel improvisational. But I would say the breakthrough moment it was, it was season one, episode seven, which was Ari's Coming Out Party, where it's a tracking shot all the way through Josh Weinstein's house. And I get to the bottom of. And it's all one continuous take. And then I have a four page monologue. And so I had. You had to hit it from, you know, getting out of the car and crushing it. And so that, to me, because it was the coming out moment, and ironically, now that I think about it, I did kind of throw in the, you know, a couple little tiny improv zingers that, like, somehow made it through. Let's Hug it out was an improv. Little things that became catchphrases. Right. But I think that moment, because up until then, you have to understand, I had one Scene in the pilot, I was thought of as, you know, fringe player. I took an 80% pay cut to do the show. You know what I mean? And then I shouldn't tell you all this stuff, but took a very interesting, different type of contract where it was like, you know, give me nothing if it does. Well, yeah, it's like no money, no trailer, no billing, no nothing. And then if you prove yourself, then you win. And that's kind of what happened.

[Bobby Kelly]

That's great.

[Eddie Pepitone]

That was a great question, Black Lou. You're getting yourself a white Piven for.

[Bobby Kelly]

That one worth more than a black Piven. This month.

[Eddie Pepitone]

This month. This month exclusively. Jeremy Piven is going to be at Sony Hall.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Go down Sony hall in New York City, October 19th.

[Jay Oakerson]

After that, you can see him in Irvine, California.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Addison, Texas.

[Jay Oakerson]

The improvs.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Both the improvs there.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah, why not? Why not?

[Eddie Pepitone]

Those are both great clubs.

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah, man.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Make sure you check them out. Thank you so much for being.

[Doug Ellin]

Thank you guys for having me.

[Host/Interviewer]

This was.

[Doug Ellin]

This was really fun and I'd love to be your co host, please.

[Eddie Pepitone]

Third mic, anytime. Honorary.

[Bobby Kelly]

What the fuck?

[Doug Ellin]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. This is. I'm in.

[Bobby Kelly]

Yeah, I'll take your spot. I want to be a Jewish tap dancer.

[Doug Ellin]

Famous last words.

[Eddie Pepitone]

You've always dreamed of being a Jewish tap dancer.

[Bobby Kelly]

Bye.

[Commercial Announcer 2]

Now is your time to get into a new Dr. Horton home by taking advantage of its national red tag sales event. This Friday, January 2nd through Sunday, January 25th. Stop by any of its participating communities and find select red tag homes at incredible prices. So whether you're buying your first home or looking for an upgrade, you don't want to miss the red tag sales event starting this Friday. Discover the Dr. Horton Difference. Tap your screen now or visit Dr. Horton.com Dr. Horton, America's builder and equal housing opportunity builder.

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