Geraldine Brooks Honors Her Husband

Summary

Episode Summary: Geraldine Brooks Honors Her Husband

The Book Case episode titled "Geraldine Brooks Honors Her Husband", released on February 27, 2025, delves deep into the emotional journey of acclaimed author Geraldine Brooks as she navigates the sudden loss of her husband, Tony Horowitz. Hosted by Kate and Charlie Gibson, the episode offers a candid exploration of grief, resilience, and the healing power of writing.

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Introduction to Geraldine Brooks and Tony Horowitz

The episode opens with Kate and Charlie Gibson introducing Geraldine Brooks, highlighting her recent success with the novel Horse. They segue into the heartbreaking news of Tony Horowitz's unexpected passing at the age of 61. Tony, an accomplished journalist, was not only Brooks' husband but also her journalistic partner. His sudden death during the writing of Horse left Brooks grappling with immense grief while managing her burgeoning career.

Charlie Gibson shares, “[Geraldine] put off grieving for a couple of years... She decided, 'I'm going to finish this book. I'm going to get it done.'” ([02:07])

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The Grieving Process and Delayed Mourning

Geraldine Brooks discusses her unconventional approach to grieving. Faced with the dual responsibilities of completing her book and supporting her family, Brooks consciously deferred her mourning process. She explains, “I did something really interesting. She put off grieving for a couple of years. She just decided, I'm going to finish this book.” ([02:07])

Charlie's reflection on her strength underscores the gravity of her decision: “...she really made a conscious decision to say, I'm gonna put off my grieving so I can get my kids through this...” ([03:26])

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Embarking on "Memorial Days"

Three years after Tony's death, Brooks embarked on writing Memorial Days, a tribute to her late husband. She chose Flinders Island off Tasmania, Australia, as her secluded writing sanctuary, emphasizing the need to isolate herself from daily distractions to process her loss.

Geraldine Brooks shares the impetus behind her book: “I realized that my whole life was one long performance... And I had to do something about it... So that's how this book came about.” ([04:29])

She describes the writing process as less about crafting a narrative and more about therapeutic self-expression: “...I was just pouring it out, really.” ([08:44])

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Insights on Grief and Personal Transformation

Throughout the conversation, Brooks offers profound insights into her personal experience with grief. She challenges the traditional stages of grief, asserting that personal healing doesn't necessarily follow a linear path. “I don't know if everybody has to do anything... This is something that we all have in common,” she notes, acknowledging the diversity in individual grieving processes. ([12:21])

Brooks further distinguishes between mourning and grief, defining mourning as an active process and grief as something one endures: “I think mourning is an active process and grief you just endure, you can't really control.” ([14:30])

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The Therapeutic Power of Writing

Writing Memorial Days served as a healing mechanism for Brooks, allowing her to confront and articulate her emotions. She describes the act of writing as “ferocious noticing,” a way to document her experiences and honor Tony's memory. This process not only facilitated her healing but also provided readers with a window into her profound journey.

Upon completing the book, Brooks shares a sense of reintegration into her authentic self: “I felt like I wasn't pretending to be normal. I actually felt more like myself.” ([15:44])

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Honoring Tony Horowitz

Brooks emphasizes that Memorial Days is both a personal memoir and a tribute to Tony. She cherishes the books Tony marked up, viewing them as tangible remnants of his presence and personality. “It's like having him there to discuss the book with him,” she reflects, highlighting the enduring impact Tony has on her life and work. ([16:08])

When asked about her principal message for readers, Brooks humbly redirects the focus: “If I had to say what I hope they get out of this book is go and get your health checked.” ([17:17])

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Concluding Reflections

As the episode draws to a close, both hosts commend Brooks for her vulnerability and strength in sharing such a personal narrative. Kate Gibson remarks, “These books do an amazing job of opening their arms to readers and saying, you are not alone.” ([18:18])

Charlie Gibson adds, “Grief is for People,” reflecting on the universal nature of loss and the importance of shared experiences in healing. ([18:57])

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Notable Quotes

• Charlie Gibson: “Geraldine put off grieving for a couple of years... She decided, 'I'm going to finish this book. I'm going to get it done.'” ([02:07])

• Geraldine Brooks: “I realized that my whole life was one long performance... And I had to do something about it... So that's how this book came about.” ([04:29])

• Geraldine Brooks: “I don't know if everybody has to do anything... This is something that we all have in common.” ([12:21])

• Geraldine Brooks: “I think mourning is an active process and grief you just endure, you can't really control.” ([14:30])

• Geraldine Brooks: “It's like having him there to discuss the book with him.” ([16:08])

• Geraldine Brooks: “If I had to say what I hope they get out of this book is go and get your health checked.” ([17:17])

• Kate Gibson: “These books do an amazing job of opening their arms to readers and saying, you are not alone.” ([18:18])

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Conclusion

This episode of The Book Case offers a poignant look into Geraldine Brooks' journey through loss and healing. By sharing her story, Brooks not only honors her husband's memory but also provides solace and understanding to listeners navigating their own grief. The candid conversation underscores the transformative power of writing and the universal experience of loss, reminding us that while grief is deeply personal, the path to healing is one we share collectively.

Transcript

[Wanda Sykes]

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[Kate Gibson]

Hello and happy Thursday. Welcome to the bookcase. It is the week after Valentine's Day, which I'm sure means everybody is on their treadmills working off all of the bon bons. I am Kate. I'm Kate Gibson, one half of the hosting team.

[Charlie Gibson]

And the roses may have faded a little bit. Roses don't last more than a week. And I suspect most of those little candy hearts that we belittled last week have been consumed. So, anyway, we can get back to books. I'm the Charlie Gibson part, and this is the bookcase with Kate and Charlie. And it's good to have you with us.

[Kate Gibson]

You know, I don't know about the chalk hearts. I think the chalk hearts are like Heath Richards. They just have like a half life of like, hundreds and hundreds of years.

[Charlie Gibson]

Like, I'm just saying they've been consumed.

[Kate Gibson]

They have been consumed. But nuclear war will hit and those little hearts, Keith Richards will still be here.

[Charlie Gibson]

And cockroaches, there's no question that they would survive a nuclear attack, I think. Absolutely. So much for frivolity, because it's a very serious subject this week. Geraldine Brooks is with us, and you know her, certainly her most recent novel, Horse, was an extraordinary success. While she was riding Horse, her husband, Tony Horowitz, who was an accomplished journalist, much honored, much awarded indeed. He and she were journalistic partners at one point. But while she was writing that book, her husband unfortunately dropped dead. It was totally unexpected. He was young, 61 years old.

[Kate Gibson]

He was in shape. He was in great shape.

[Charlie Gibson]

Great shape. And she had to deal with that, the suddenness of it, obviously a tremendous shock. And she did something really interesting. She put off grieving for a couple of years. She just decided, I'm going to finish this book. I'm going to get it done. Da, da, da da. And I'm going to take some time down the road to really think about this and to honor Tony by writing about him. So she went off to a remote island off of Tasmania in Australia.

[Kate Gibson]

Like you do.

[Charlie Gibson]

Like you do. The nearest shop was 30 miles away. And she wrote a beautiful book.

[Kate Gibson]

I think it's also important to say about her grieving process, not only did she have to finish a book, not only did she have to go on book tour for that book, but she really made a conscious decision to say, I'm gonna put off my grieving so I can get my kids through this, so that I can focus on my kids, so that I can focus on Toni's family and friends. And she. I mean, that was a big part of the reason she put the morning off as well. And again, the fact that she then decided to sort of tear open her scabs at this remote island of Tasmania and then took her readers along for the journey just, I think, takes incredible strength. And I'm very thankful that she did it. It's an amazing thing to share with your readers if you can do it.

[Charlie Gibson]

I should mention the name of the book, which is just out, Memorial Days. Geraldine Brooks shows you just what an accomplished writer she is in this book. And she moves back and forth between Flinders island, which is this place off Tasmania, and then where she and Tony live, which is in Martha's Vineyard. And you learn a lot about their marri as she looks back on it. But I think it is a wonderful way to pay tribute to somebody. If you can write like she does, as well as she does, to be able to pay tribute, to make you understand just what an extraordinary individual this was, is really, really, really nice. Memorial Days is the book Our Conversation with Geraldine Brooks. Geraldine Brooks, it is really a pleasure to have you in the bookcase. Memorial Days is the book about the sudden death of your husband, Tony Horowitz. Husband of how many years?

[Geraldine Brooks]

Almost 35.

[Charlie Gibson]

Almost 35. I have written this book because I needed to do it. You say, why did you need to?

[Geraldine Brooks]

It had been three years since he died, and I was not right in the head. I realized that my whole life was one long performance. Every time I left the house, it was as if I was putting on a costume and a mask and going out and acting a role. And that role was woman being normal. So I did all the things I was supposed to do if I were a normal woman, like be the secretary of the PTO and serve on the local conservation commission and do my work and even go on book tour. But I didn't feel normal. And I realized that I was going to have to do something about it. And I had kind of that head slap moment when I thought to myself, you're a writer. That's how you make Sense of the world. It always has been. So why don't you write? And so that's how this book came about.

[Interviewer]

So that's how the book came about. I'm interested as to what was the first thing that you did. Where did you start?

[Geraldine Brooks]

The day I got that sudden shocking news, which could not have been more unexpected. He was, as far as we knew, a radiantly healthy man in the prime of life. And nothing had prepared me for it. And I then, you know, was just tipped headlong into the bureaucracy of death and all the things that you have to do, particularly if you've got kids, just to keep your life functioning. So I'm dealing with all the kinds of things that you don't want to be thinking about, like credit cards and health insurance and just all of it when you're just desperately sad and wish you could just go and sit under a yew tree and throw a veil over your head. But modern life doesn't allow you to do that. And so, because I had just squashed any possibility of properly grieving him down for so long, I realized that I needed to get away from all that noise and go somewhere extremely quiet where all I had to do was think about him and think about what had happened to me and try and make some sense of it. So the first thing I did was think where would be good to do that, and booked a shack on a beach on Flinders island, which is the most remote place I could think of. It's in the Bass Strait between the Australian mainland and Tasmania. Very, very few people lived there, and none of them lived anywhere near the shack. So I just was completely alone, and that was what I needed. And once I was there, it was just a case of get back to the day it happened and try and remember everything that happened and allow yourself to have the feelings that you didn't allow yourself on that day.

[Charlie Gibson]

You waited two years before you started writing. It's now three years, Almost three. Yeah. And I wonder, did you know consciously I have to wait in order to process this, or did you think, gee, I'm so busy now I can't get to it? Which also strikes me as counterintuitive. What caused the delay before you wrote this?

[Geraldine Brooks]

Well, there was a year of just complete confusion and picking up threads and learning to do the things that kept my life going that I hadn't had to think about for 35 years. I hadn't filed a tax return in 35 years because he always did that. I didn't realize, you know, since we'd Become self employed people. How you even did that, it was all new to me. So I was doing the stuff that I always had done and then doing everything he had done, which was a lot, and just learning it and just being confused and disoriented the way you are when you have a big loss like that. And then dealing, you know, with my kids and their struggles. And I didn't have time to think about how I was feeling. And then three years into it, things started to fall into place more. And that's when I realized I was not right in the head.

[Interviewer]

Did you know when you sat down to write it that that was how you wanted to write it? Sort of short, declarative paragraphs that exposed your brain.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Thinking, writing. You know, it's not like my normal work where I'm very much thinking about the shape of the narrative and the person who might pick it up and read it. I wasn't thinking about anyone else or craft. I was just pouring it out, really.

[Charlie Gibson]

I'm a crier. You indicate and you write. I knew if I started crying, I might not be able to stop. So I shut it down. And for the past two years, I haven't been able to cry at all. That's Geraldine Brooks. A level of compartmentalization that I don't know many people would be capable of. How'd you do that?

[Geraldine Brooks]

I don't know. I used to. Literally, I was a joke in my family. Geraldine cries at the weather report. Geraldine cries at soppy TV commercials. And that's over. I don't cry anymore. I don't know what happened. You know, I'd probably have to spend a fortune on some psychiatrist's couch to figure it out. And it's not worth it. I'll just go on like this.

[Charlie Gibson]

You cried out.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Guess so.

[Interviewer]

So you really knew when you sat down to write this that you were writing it for you, not for the reader. How did that change your process? Was it freeing to Kate, write it that way?

[Charlie Gibson]

Kate, I would add one more. Is she writing it for the reader? Is she writing it for herself? Or is she writing it for Tony Horowitz?

[Geraldine Brooks]

Ah, no, I was writing it for me. I was writing it for me. I just. It was something I needed to do. I wasn't thinking. Freeing, not freeing. Process, not process. It's very unsatisfactory to say this, but it was just. This was what I did. This was my practice. I would get up and try and think about the next thing that had happened three years ago and just get that all out. And then I would go for long walks and notice things. And I actually think writing is ferocious noticing. And so I would write down what I noticed, and the book just fell into the structure that it has organically.

[Interviewer]

Did you edit as you went, or again, were you just like, I just need to get it all out and then I'll worry about all that stuff later?

[Geraldine Brooks]

Yeah, I wasn't even thinking I would worry about it. Honestly. It was less of a writing project and more of a therapeutic project.

[Charlie Gibson]

You also say in the book, I do know this, my job is to carry his light. I have written this because I needed to do it. So it seems to me there must be some element in your mind about, I need to honor him in some way. And this is how I just wanted.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Yeah, I wanted to bring him back through remembering and setting it down. And, yeah, I guess if I thought about anybody in relation to this book, it was my two sons and wanting to set down some things maybe I'd never shared with them about how we met and what he was like before they came along.

[Interviewer]

You said when he first passed, you started immediately sort of putting on the defense of, yes, we were so lucky, weren't we? And you thought that was sort of acceptance, but you said that leapsfrogs so many stages. Now, having gone to the island and written this book, am I to understand that you really believe in those stages of grief and that you really believe everybody has to go through them one by one?

[Geraldine Brooks]

I don't know if everybody has to do anything. Honestly. This is something that we all have in common. Everybody we love is going to die. I'm very aware that I come from a place of immense privilege to have been able to take this time. You know, if you're trying to work two jobs to keep food on the table because you just lost your breadwinner, you're not going to be able to do this. So I'm not going to tell anybody else what they need to do with regards to grieving.

[Interviewer]

I think what you're saying is make perfect sense, which is, you know, stages of grieving. Sure. If they work for you, if something else works for you, then do that, because we all get through it differently.

[Geraldine Brooks]

You know, what. What really surfaced, it surfaced on the island, and it just surfaced again, clearly as I started this book tour. Dreams, Angry, angry dreams. And, you know, angry in the dream, it's about something Tony's done, which is very unfair. I'm just angry that he's not here. And so these crazy, angry dreams. And we had very, very few Arguments in real life. But in my dreams I had arguments.

[Charlie Gibson]

You do mention it in the book. You say I have vaulted right over denial, anger, bargaining and depression and landed in the soft sands of acceptance. The vault I had attempted was impossible. These sands are quicksand. But are there seven stages of grief?

[Geraldine Brooks]

I didn't get a chance to bargain. That was off the table for me. He was gone between one breath and the next, as one of the reviewers of the book in Australia put it. It was like he died mid sentence, you know, So I didn't have any bargaining opportunities.

[Interviewer]

We had a great conversation last year with Anna Quindlen, who wrote a book called After Annie. And we talked about the difference between mourning and grief. Do you think there's a difference between mourning and grief? And how would you define the difference?

[Geraldine Brooks]

You know, I don't know that it's useful to me that grief. I think mourning is an active process and grief you just endure, you can't really control.

[Charlie Gibson]

There's another thing which is the word closure. I hate that word because there is no such thing. I don't think there can't be. This is something that you carry with you all the time. It's the new normal. And there is no putting it to bed.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Yeah. And a couple of friends have put it very eloquently. One just said, you know, after a really tremendous loss in her life, she realized one day she was laughing about something and she realized that now the joy and the sadness are just going to have to walk hand in hand forever. And I find that a very useful idea. And then another friend said, you know, you don't have to go looking for grief. It's like the shark fin. It will surface when you least expect it.

[Interviewer]

When you write a book that is this cathartic, this personal, I'm going to sort of ask you a personal and perhaps invasive question, which is I'm interested to know how you felt and what you did when you finished it.

[Geraldine Brooks]

I felt way better. I really did. I felt like wasn't pretending to be normal. I actually felt more like myself. I was able to come back into the world with a. Just back to what I recognized as my generally positive attitude to the incredible experience of being alive on the planet.

[Interviewer]

One of my favorite parts of Memorial Days is the different ways that you treated books in your marriage. And now you couldn't imagine marking up a book or making notes in the margins or dog earing a page. And now you treasure every book Tony touched for that precise reason. It leaves a mark from him.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Well, it's great. If I pick up a book I haven't read and he had read it because he just. His marginalia is extensive and extremely blunt and brusque at times. And it's fun to read along with him and see how his approach to the book squares with my own. So it's like having him there to.

[Charlie Gibson]

Discuss the book with him and reflective of his personality very much, yes. Because in the end, and I'll finish with this in the end, is there a principal thing that you want in the reader's mind when he or she puts this book down? Would you want it to be, gee, I now know Tony Horowitz, and he is somebody who was worth knowing and whose passing should be memorialized in this way or in a general sense. Do you want people to put it down and think, gee, Geraldine Brooks has given me a good idea of how to grieve.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Look, I think it's very presumptuous to say what any reader should get out of a book because it's a magical and undefinable thing. And I know myself when I read a book, if I read it again, I get something completely different because I'm a different person. Yes, I would love people to know, Tony, but honestly, if I had to say what I hope they get out of this book is go and get your health checked.

[Charlie Gibson]

Geraldine Brooks, thank you very much.

[Interviewer]

Thank you so much.

[Charlie Gibson]

And thank you, Tony Horowitz. It's. I. I do feel like I come away with a good sense of. Of what. Of what the old fellow was like and he wasn't old enough when he passed. All the best to you. Thank you.

[Kate Gibson]

Memorial Days by Geraldine Brooks. This, I think, will go into the canon of books where, I mean, if you have the gift of writing and you're able to open up your grief and share your grief with readers, I. I pick up one of these books, I feel like I'm learning. And I also think grief, especially grief for somebody that is so close to you, that is a member of your family, can feel very isolating. You'll feel, you feel. You look around the world and you say, I'm alone. Nobody understands what I'm going through right now. You know, how can you be mowing your lawn when I just lost my mother? How can you be driving a car when I just lost my son? And I think these books do an amazing job of opening their arms to readers and saying, you are not alone. These emotions are not cliche. They're very hard, but they are common. And we can go through them together. I think it's an incredible gift that.

[Charlie Gibson]

They give readers and it teaches you about the person that is being written about. And Tony Horowitz was a really interesting character and you bring him to life in a way in a book like this. And we've all lost people that are close to us that we wish we could honor in such a way. Unfortunately, we don't write like Geraldine Brooks and therefore it's harder to do. But Joan Didion did it about her husband and then we had that wonderful book not long ago. Grief is for People. Sloane Crossley, I think was the name of the author, authoress, and it was really again, she lost somebody suddenly who she had been very close to and she was dealing with it. She was dealing with it in writing and I, I hope it's cathartic for those who write it. And it's also, I think, a wonderful object lesson for all of us. So we're going to take a pause for a moment. We'll come back and we've got some rapid fire questions for Geraldine Brooks.

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[Interviewer]

Rapid Fire Questions for Geraldine Brooks. Favorite place on the Vineyard.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Aquinnah the cliffs. And you have to walk all the way around until you're underneath the lighthouse.

[Charlie Gibson]

How do you explain the perfection of Martha's Vineyard and Cape Cod in Nantucket? Because I feel it. How do you explain it?

[Geraldine Brooks]

It's one place that we haven't thoroughly buggered up yet and I hope we never do. It's one place where nature still is holding a rear guard action against all our terrible degradations.

[Interviewer]

So we just talked about how much you treasure the books that Tony marked up and how anti marking up books were. Do you now mark up your books.

[Kate Gibson]

For your kids still?

[Geraldine Brooks]

I wouldn't get a screwdriver and scratch an antique table and I'm certainly not going to stop marking up.

[Charlie Gibson]

Good for you. It is antithetical to my mind. Absolutely antithetical. Although I'll talk about that in a minute. You know, you mentioned whether you sort of thought he would be coming back. Sloane Crossley, who I mentioned, wrote this book grief is for people. She kept thinking her friend, who she memorializes would be coming back. Maybe he just ate a bad oyster. She thought. Do you ever feel that, that he's.

[Geraldine Brooks]

He's going to show up again for a long time because, you know, he was on book tour and I'm used to him being away on book tour. And then he would pound through the door and start throwing dirty clothes out of his bag and telling me some hilarious story that had happened and some bad behavior that he witnessed. And I for quite a while expected or not expected but had this, you know, magical thinking about around that lesser.

[Interviewer]

Known book you recommend to everybody.

[Geraldine Brooks]

Lesser known book. Okay. My favorite work of American historical fiction is by Brian hall and it is called I should be extremely happy in your company.

[Kate Gibson]

That's a great title.

[Geraldine Brooks]

It's about the Lewis and Clark expedition and it's a masterpiece of historical voicing.

[Charlie Gibson]

Is there something you felt you had to read before you wrote Memorial Days?

[Geraldine Brooks]

Not before. But I did finally gird my loins and read, you know, in the literature of lost classics like the Year of Magical Thinking and the Light of the World and A Widow's Story and other lovely books on grief by Jennifer Senior. And I was just. Because I had avoided reading them because I wasn't sure I'd be strong enough. So I took a few of those with me to the island.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Geraldine Brooks, thank you so much. Tony sounds like an amazing man and Memorial Day is a great tribute.

[Kate Gibson]

That was terrific. I am super excited by the Way this week because we are going back to having a bookstore. It's been a while, and I have missed talking to bookstore owners.

[Charlie Gibson]

And this is a good one. Yeah, this is a good one. Arlene Lines. Her name is L Y N E S. And so her name of her book is Reading Between Bookstore is Reading between the Lines. L Y N E S. Very clever. And she has had the bookstore for 20 years in Woodstock, Illinois. And she has weathered some tough times. The recession of 2008, Covid and how she coped is really interesting. So we had the pleasure of talking to Arlene Lynes, of Reading between the Lines. Arlene Lynes, it's good to have you with us. Read between the Lines. L Y N E S. Very clever. Very clever.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

Thank you.

[Charlie Gibson]

You've been in business 20 years. Why did you get into this crazy business?

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

Well, when I moved here in in 1997, there were three bookstores here on our Woodstock Square. There was a used bookstore, a Christian bookstore, and a general bookstore. And by the year 2000, all three of them, two of them had gone out of business and one had moved off the square. So I really missed them. I had fallen in love with an independent bookstore up in Manchester, Vermont. North Shire Books. Well, my parents. That is where my parents retired. So it was my dream to bring an independent bookstore back to the Woodstock Square.

[Charlie Gibson]

And you had to know that this is not an easy business.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

I really did not know that, Charlie. There really was a lot of things I did not know. My husband and I did attend how to open an independent bookstore school, Paz and Associates, down in Fernandina Beach, Florida. And basically they told me they weren't so sure an independent would work here in Woodstock, Illinois. So there were two things they recommended. One was I was going to rent a space that shared a building with a national coffee chain, which is the only corporate business on our square. So our doors were opposite each other. And the second one was I'd have to be event driven. And we went wholeheartedly into running all sorts of events pretty much up until the pandemic. And we're just now getting back into the flow of things.

[Interviewer]

But, Arlene, I gotta know. I mean, there's gotta be a story.

[Kate Gibson]

There you go.

[Interviewer]

From a class where at the end of the class the teacher says, arlene, I don't know about opening a bookstore where you are. And yet, by God, you hung out a shingle and 20 years later, you're still here. So how did you go from, I'll show you, mister. You don't know anything to actually hanging out that first shingle. And did you get to prove that person wrong right away or did it take some time?

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

Well, we were pretty on a pretty strong trajectory right off the bat because I just constantly did events. But the other thing is, is Woodstock is a very interesting community. They really, if you support them, they support you. And that's how I've really been able to do this for 20 years. I have a tremendous amount of support from our community. I think they were very thankful that I took a chance and brought a bookstore back to the square. You know, we just kept our nose to the grindstone and I wasn't stopping.

[Kate Gibson]

Arlene, you mentioned during the recession of 2008 that you actually went through periods of like not taking a salary in order to keep a staff. When Covid hit, how did you end up having to deal with that?

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

So I did already have my website set up. So people just kept ordering through the website or if they weren't tech savvy, some of our seniors, they called me and we just put their orders together. And I would spend most every afternoon in my car driving around our county hand delivering, like leaving packages on people's front doors, which I don't know, might not have been legal, but I felt like if the UPS driver could leave a package on somebody's porch, why couldn't I? So that's what I did. I think if I can share one of my very favorite stories is I had a phone call one day and I answered the phone and this woman said to me, oh my gosh, a human voice. And I'm like, yes. So she Sundays, I'm an 85 year old woman and I'm housebound. And she said, all I do is read. And the library is closed, I have no reading material. She said, so here's what I want you to do. I want you to go to your shelves and I want you to choose eight books. And she goes, I prefer hardcover. And she said, I want you to choose books. And really my only request is that they have a dead body in them. So it was great. And she, she regularly calls us every couple of weeks and we deliver, we still deliver her books to her.

[Charlie Gibson]

I looked up Woodstock, Illinois on the map. It's a long way from Punxsutawney, Pennsylvania. A long way.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

It sure is.

[Charlie Gibson]

But you observed Groundhog Day. Why and what did you do?

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

All right, so we observe Groundhog Day here in Woodstock, Illinois, because we are the movie set for the movie Groundhog Day. Uh huh. So it was Filmed here, I believe 1992 was when it was filmed. So every year Groundhog Day is celebrated. The movie location manager who chose Woodstock for Harold Ramis, his name is Bob Hutchins. He flies in from Texas every year and leads walking tours and tells all the behind the scenes stories. So we have Bob and then we do on February 2nd at 7:07 in the morning. The scene is recreated right down to a live ground hug.

[Interviewer]

Really?

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

Oh yeah.

[Kate Gibson]

Right from the movie there's a recreation.

[Interviewer]

With a live groundhog.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

With a live groundhog. And this year the proclamation was read by Stephen Tobolowski, better known as Ned Ryerson. He has come through a couple times. So Ned was or Steven was here in 2019 and then he returned this year. And Stephen has two books and we are lucky enough to get to be his bookseller.

[Interviewer]

That's great.

[Charlie Gibson]

What a great story. Does your 85 year old lady want a book with a dead groundhog in it? I hope not.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

You know what? No, I don't think we have any of those.

[Kate Gibson]

Groundhog Day.

[Interviewer]

The Intense Day.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

The Intense day.

[Kate Gibson]

I love it.

[Charlie Gibson]

Arlene Lyons, we wish you great luck.

[Unknown Bookstore Owner]

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

[Charlie Gibson]

I love the idea of an 85 year old woman saying, I want eight books and I want a dead body in every one of them. I, I just think that that, that is terrific.

[Kate Gibson]

Well, you got a lot of bookstore owners who then don't go, I think maybe I have to call the cops on that one. Like, I mean, they know exactly, they pick up exactly what she's laying down. You know, they like, oh, I know that.

[Charlie Gibson]

So we're going to give you a little preview of what's coming up soon. We had some very good listener response when we talked to a couple of academics, a couple of Dickensians about A Christmas Carol, which we did just before Christmas. And some people said, well, you really should take some time and talk about other classics and how they came about and talk about the author, et cetera. So we're going to do the Great Gatsby and we have two experts in the writings of F. Scott Fitzgerald. And that'll be coming up next week.

[Kate Gibson]

If I can take a moment, I'm gonna expose a hole in your incredible education. My father is an incredibly well educated man. Read just about everything written a whole bunch.

[Charlie Gibson]

Are you gonna throw me under the bus? Are you gonna throw me under the bus?

[Kate Gibson]

The bus is passing by and I am picking you up by the collar, my friend. Have you ever read the Great Gatsby?

[Charlie Gibson]

Next week I want you to Tune into the bookcase with Charlie. It's, it's gonna be a single anchor. Kate Gibson is gonna disappear. Okay, go ahead, throw me under the bus.

[Kate Gibson]

So I'm metaphorically throwing him under the bus here, and I think next week he's actually going to throw me under a bus. But have you ever read the Great Gatsby, sir?

[Charlie Gibson]

Yes, I have, because I just finished it. Reading it for the first time, I'm embarrassed to say, as a Princetonian, Princeton being a big part of F. Scott Fitzgerald's writing. And I just read it.

[Kate Gibson]

I have to say, it brings to mind there was a great table at a bookstore that I once passed that had a sign over it that said, really read the books you've pretended to read. I thought that was such a great. I thought that was such a great table. There's stuff There like 1984, Sid Arthur, like all of Gone with the. It's great stuff. So he will have read Great Gatsby and we will be talking about it.

[Charlie Gibson]

We will indeed. We want to make you aware again, there's just no secrets on this podcast, are there? We want to make you aware of the folks who work on this podcast. And then we'll have a coda from Geraldine Brooks.

[Kate Gibson]

The Bookcase with Kate and Charlie Gibson is a production of ABC Audio and Good Morning America. It is edited by Tom Butler of TKO Productions. Our executive producers are Laura Mayer and Simone Swink. We want to make mention of Taylor Rhodes, Amanda McMaster and Sabrina Kohlberg at Good Morning America, as well as Josh Cohan from ABC Audio. Please follow the bookcase wherever you get your podcasts and be sure to listen, rate and review. If you'd like to find any of the books mentioned in this episode, we have them linked in the episode description.

[Geraldine Brooks]

My coda is the best piece of writing advice I ever got and I got it from a lovely writer and mentor, Judith Biost. And she said, when there's no Wind Row.

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