478: Mama Gena: Why Successful Women Lose Their Feminine Fire (And How to Get It Back)

Summary

The Bossbabe Podcast – Ep.478

"Mama Gena: Why Successful Women Lose Their Feminine Fire (And How to Get It Back)"
Host: Natalie Ellis
Guest: Mama Gena (Regina Thomashauer)
Release Date: September 4, 2025

---

Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth, candid conversation between Natalie Ellis and acclaimed author, teacher, and “pleasure revolutionary” Mama Gena (Regina Thomashauer). Together, they unravel why many high-achieving, financially successful women feel disconnected from their “feminine fire” and how to rekindle pleasure, sensuality, and deep polarity in relationships. The episode is raw, practical, and rich with personal anecdotes—perfect for women balancing ambition with a desire for meaningful connection and intimacy.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Princess Myth & High-Achieving Women’s Dilemma

[01:49–04:10]

• Mama Gena discusses how traditional fairytales (e.g., Cinderella, Sleeping Beauty) influence women to expect a “prince” to rescue and fulfill them.
• This conditioning persists, even as women achieve professional and financial independence, creating internal conflict in relationships.
  • “How can he be a prince if you’re out earning him? …What is he offering that you could not get yourself?” – Mama Gena [03:23]

2. Personal Journey: From Wounded to Reclaimed

[04:20–10:45]

• Mama Gena opens up about her own healing from childhood trauma and the transformative power of connecting with pleasure.
  • She recounts how a self-care class changed her life:
    • “I’d never created pleasure for myself...when I met my own gaze, I saw the very thing I’d been looking for. I saw the goddess inside of me.” – Mama Gena [08:30]
• Emphasizes the need for pleasure as a foundational practice for women, particularly those who are “doing it all.”

3. Partnership, Power, & Letting Go of ‘Big Dick Energy’

[10:45–23:13]

• Mama Gena describes her struggle to find a partner who cherished her, sharing vivid stories about her relationships with “Peter” and an “Alpha guy.”
• She reflects on being unable to accept genuine attentiveness and love, and how this dynamic is common for high-achieving women conditioned to “swing their big dick around”:
  • “I couldn’t even see the way he held me…because I was so into the capitalistic, colonialistic, myth-making ethos.” – Mama Gena [13:36]
• Using MDMA as a healing tool revealed her suppressed vulnerability and reawakened her capacity for love.

4. The Turning Point: Reclaiming Pleasure and Opening the Heart

[16:08–23:13]

• A key moment occurred when Mama Gena realized for the first time that her “head, heart, and pussy” could unite in love.
• After losing Peter to another relationship, she learned (with help from coach Annie Lalla) to love selflessly and expand her heart, even in discomfort.
  • “I could have never in this lifetime learned to truly love a man were it not for this opportunity to love Peter while he was deep into a relationship with another woman while keeping my heart wide open.” – Mama Gena [19:18]

5. Volitional Heat: The Art of Turning Yourself On

[23:14–32:45]

• Mama Gena introduces the “courtesan” archetype and the idea of “volitional heat”—a woman's ability to cultivate desire and turn herself on, as opposed to waiting for biological or external factors.
  • “Practicing pleasure is the game changer...Women have a choice: anger or pleasure. And no man can make that decision for us.” – Mama Gena [26:40]
• Discusses practical “swamping” for transmuting anger to turn-on; emphasizes daily micro-pleasures and sensual rituals.

6. Relatable Struggles: The Breadwinner’s Softening

[27:52–29:02]

• Natalie and Mama Gena joke about competing “d*ck energy” in relationships, highlighting shared frustrations among ambitious women who struggle to soften and receive.
  • “Sometimes it does feel like you’re in this dick measuring contest, and it’s the worst place to be because nobody’s gonna win.” – Natalie Ellis [28:08]

7. Practical Pleasure Rituals & Micro-Practices

[30:05–34:24]

• Mama Gena shares hands-on pleasure practices:
  • Resting a hand near the vulva (“pussy”) to connect with life force [30:05]
  • Self-touch (face, body) to calm the nervous system [31:44]
  • Using affirming “womantras” (e.g., “I have the hottest pussy on Instagram”) [32:06]
• Science behind pleasure: Reduces cortisol, increases endorphins and serotonin, and fosters a shift in energy toward self-worth and self-respect.

8. Sisterhood, Support, and New Models of Relationship

[37:39–42:44]

• Highlights the essential role of women’s communities and supportive friendships.
  • “We need women like we need oxygen…we can make it happen together.” – Mama Gena [40:45]
• Introduces her new course, "The House of Turn On": A practice-based community for reawakening pleasure and reclaiming the “womanly arts.”

9. Navigating Resentment & Restoring Connection

[36:19–50:28]

• Emphasizes "swamping" for emotional release; recommends practices like "spring cleaning" with a supportive sister for purging emotional gunk.
• Mama Gena on reframing requests to partners for best results:
  • “What works for me is, I turn it into a question…‘Did you mean to hurt me?’...Because I already know, he didn’t.” [46:25]

10. Critiquing the Capitalist Value System in Relationships

[50:28–56:20]

• Both discuss how capitalism has skewed the way women value themselves and their partners (focusing on financial worth vs. emotional support/attunement).
  • “We are all so poisoned by thinking the highest value is the bottom line...and we lose so much life with that perspective.” – Mama Gena [50:41]
• Natalie shares her pivotal moment of resigning from her company to prioritize family and pleasure.

11. Redefining Feminine Priorities

[54:45–56:20]

• True fulfillment is found not in money or status but in pleasure, attention, and connection.
  • “The number one most important thing for a woman is not a bank account, it is not diamonds...it’s attention or pleasure, that’s the thing she longs for the most.” – Mama Gena [55:20]

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You must, must, must connect with pleasure, because you will not make it if you are continuing to man up and strap on that gigantic cock that we all have, the energetic cock.” – Mama Gena [05:08]
• “I’m going to stand for my turn on, for my surrender, for my expanding love...” – Mama Gena [19:18]
• “Women have a choice: anger or pleasure. And no man can make that decision for us.” – Mama Gena [26:40]
• “We need women like we need oxygen.” – Mama Gena [40:45]
• “The number one most important thing for a woman is not a bank account…it’s attention or pleasure.” – Mama Gena [55:20]

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 01:49 – Mama Gena outlines the “prince” conditioning in modern women
• 04:20 – Healing childhood wounds with pleasure
• 10:45 – Difficulty accepting genuine love and partnership
• 16:08 – How MDMA revealed new pathways to intimacy
• 23:14 – Lessons from courtesans: volitional heat
• 30:05 – Hands-on pleasure rituals demonstration
• 37:39 – The power of sisterhood and community
• 42:44 – Addressing why women “do more work” on themselves
• 46:25 – How to make requests from a place of turn-on, not criticism
• 50:41 – Critiquing capitalism’s influence on relationships
• 54:45 – Redefining feminine value: pleasure over possessions
• 59:39 – Mama Gena’s daily pleasure rituals and self-care tips

---

Practical Takeaways

Daily Pleasure Practices

• Practice self-touch (anywhere on the body) to reconnect with yourself during a stressful day [30:05–31:45].
• Affirm self-worth with customized "womantras"; swap self-doubt for playful, sensual self-talk [32:06–32:45].
• Institute an "IV drip" of pleasure throughout the day: flowers on your desk, music you love, bathing rituals [34:24–36:00].

Emotional Maintenance

• Release resentment and anger through “swamping”—dancing/moving and expressing emotions privately [36:19–36:57].
• Use “spring cleaning” sessions with trusted women to air grievances safely and return to gratitude.

Relationship Communication

• Transform criticism into loving requests framed as curiosity or questions [46:25].
• Lead with pleasure, not agitation, for deeper polarity and more satisfying intimacy.

---

Ending & Next Steps

• Mama Gena encourages listeners to start by embracing even small pleasures (e.g., buying oneself flowers), asserting:
  “It’s a privilege to be me… I’m worthy and I’m going to honor myself. And that simple shift changes everything.” [57:51]
• For further guidance, Mama Gena recommends downloading the “Ultimate Guide to Getting What You Want” from mamaginas.com, and following her on Instagram/Facebook for more teachings.

---

In summary:
This episode is a potent mix of humor, hard truths, and actionable wisdom for ambitious women navigating the intersections of power, pleasure, and partnership. Mama Gena’s philosophy is clear: to rekindle feminine fire, women must reclaim pleasure, build sisterhood, redefine what “success” means, and refuse to outsource their joy.

---

Transcript

[A]

Mama Gina, welcome to the podcast.

[B]

So good to be here.

[A]

Natalie, I am so excited about this. I first discovered your work, I think it was seven years ago. And I remember the first.

[B]

What was the moment? Was it. Was it reading a reclamation? It was boom, boom, boom.

[A]

What's so funny is that I just been on a plant medicine retreat. I was like in the thick of just, just figuring out all my things and I came out of it just like a whirlwind. And I got drawn to this book. But me and Stephen were going away for the weekend with our friends and I took this book and I didn't put it down. My head was in it the whole time. And his friends were like, what is that that you're reading? And I couldn't put it down all weekend. And it was amazing. The best introduction to your work ever.

[B]

I am so, so, so, so glad. It's exactly what I wanted it to be.

[A]

It's the best.

[B]

I wanted to be like, yeah, it like ingests that whole chapter and verse of feminine, sensual, erotic education that gets left out for all girls and women. So I'm so glad that I hit you. And also that really open time right after a plant medicine journey. Potent. Okay, so you and I have been in dialogue for seven years without you knowing it.

[A]

So I'm a big fan of your work and I'm so glad that you're here because I feel like you are the perfect woman to speak to my audience where they're at. So giving you a little tldr of where most of the listeners right now are at. Very high achieving women, most of the time, the breadwinners of their family and really, really struggling to create that polarity in their relationships. Some of them even listening to this are like, natalie, what is polarity?

[B]

Oh, that's right.

[A]

Can we dive into that? Why does this happen and is there a fix for it?

[B]

Okay, first of all, when you were a little girl, did you ever hear of somebody called Cinderella?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Sleeping Beauty, Snow White. I heard about those people too. And I have to tell you, Natalie, I tried so hard when I was raising my daughter Maggie, and she's 26 now, I tried so hard to keep her away. I thought if I just keep her from Disney, she won't, like, get into that whole mythology of thinking someday a prince is gonna come and awaken her and save her and support her and lead her to her dreams and provide everything that she needs or wants. But of course it didn't work because whenever she'd go for a sleep, what Would they watch and the next Disney movie? And so we are steeped, like, almost like brood in this construct that a prince will come to take us to our dreams, to support us and take care of us. And it's a kind of pleasant thought. It's, you know, we all want that rich daddy man to look after us. And then when life strikes and passions awaken in a woman, and we want to have our voices heard in the world, and we have longings and desires for more presence, to serve the world in our very specific ways. And sometimes we're so fucking clever, we actually out achieve, out earn the guys that we're seeing or dating, and then that just, like, messes with our heads because it's not how we thought life was supposed to be. And so this is something that no woman on this planet is exempt from because you don't want to hold back your gifts and talents. You don't want to hold back your power, your ability to be the fullness of who you are. And at the same time, how can he be a prince if you're out earning him? How can he be a prince if you're out creating him? Like, what is it that he is offering to you that you could not get yourself? Those are the questions. And then this is, like, the worst part. And this happens to me. And by the way, between my partner and myself, I make a shit ton more money than he does, and I choose him. And it has not always been that way. I tried to get rid of him, and perhaps I'll tell you that story in a moment. I just want to say, if you're thinking about getting rid of him, allow this podcast to sort of, you know, steep through your soul, because you may have some alternatives for you.

[A]

I love this.

[B]

Y. Oh, I'm so, so glad.

[A]

Tell me about that. I really love how you said that. I still. I choose him. What did it look like when you were thinking about leaving?

[B]

Okay, here's the story. So I, much like you, created myself from my own imagination and kind of my awakening. I. I was so. You know, I had a really challenging childhood with a lot of abuse, and so I've always felt broken, and it wasn't until I connected with pleasure, which is a. If you want to make this voyage with your dude, you must, must, must connect with pleasure, because you will not make it if you are continuing to man up and strap on that gigantic cock that we all have, the energetic cock. I don't meet a real one. Don't you know, like, I mean, your energetic is Big baby. And I know I, I like, I, I, I, I really like to brag about my energetic coc. It's vast, wide, and I'm proud of it. But it's not useful in the partnership. So my journey started with my heartbreak of my childhood. And then as I grew up, I was always searching. When I was little, the goddess came to me when I was a child, and she sat on my pillow and she looks not that different from you. You know what I mean? Like, I could, but I couldn't really see her. She was my periphery, but there was just something, like she was holding a radiance. And when I was in her presence, I could just feel this beautiful butterscotch feeling inside my body. And I was like, that. That's how I want to feel. And I turned to look. Woof. She would vaporize. So I learned she was in the periphery, and it became my quest to search for her and find her. And after a long, you know, circuitous journey. Because all longings start with desire, and desires do break us and remake us over our lifetime. So as I found what I was looking for in the most unexpected place. Because I swear, when I was a little kid, I figured there had to be a church where there was a goddess leading the parade. But there really is. Not yet there will be. So I was doing a class, and part of the homework invited me to create a special sacred place for myself, which I'd never done before. Because I grew up, I was raised by a 1950s housewife who taught me, your job is to take care of your brothers, take care of your family, take care of your boss, take care of your girlfriends, take care of everyone, but don't take care of yourself. So I was running on empty, and this class invited me to, like, buy flowers for myself, a special drink that I. I wanted little snacks, give myself a bath, light some candles, only for me. I'd never created pleasure for myself. I didn't even know that was an option. I thought my only purpose was to take care of people in places and things. And so in so doing, I felt time and space change. I felt my interior chemistry melt. And the next part of the exercise I was we were to look in the mirror and look for what was right. Now, when you look in the mirror every day, do you look for what's right? Me neither. No, I always look for my flaws. I'm like, okay, puffy, not puffy hair. Do I have to wash my hair? You know, like that kind of check of what is missing. And so this was the first time I literally ever gazed at myself with the eyes of a child, when I met my own gaze, I saw the very thing I'd been looking for. I saw the goddess inside of me. And I was like, oh, my fucking shit balls. This is not just me. It's every single woman. We don't know that the goddess lives inside of us and that we get to her by experiencing pleasure. No one tells us this. And so I knew immediately that was my calling. I didn't know how to do it or what to do or where to go. And I ended up having to have a huge education first for many, many years. But I knew that it was time that we awaken that divinity within, or we are useless. We always be the cog in somebody else's wheel. We will always be being pushed around, bossed around, used, but not in charge of our own magic and majesty and in connection with our life force and in connection with, most importantly, our divinity. Because it's not just man that was created in God's image. It was the feminine is inhabited by the goddess. And so that changed me and made me a lifelong practitioner of the discipline and the practice of. Of pleasure. Okay, this is the deal breaker, sisters. I know you already do too much. I know you're already working too hard. I know you're already at the end of your rope. But the practice and the discipline of pleasure is the game changer. And it is the thing, the fuel that starts to feed partnership differently. And you'd think I would know this shit because I'm mama fucking Gina, but, you know, I raised my kid myself because I get divorced when she's a little girl. I build the pleasure revolution, the School of Womanly Arts. I scale my business from 10 women in my living room to thousands of women at the Javits center and other venues. Like, so I'm feeling myself, I'm feeling like, okay, we're bringing back the goddess. We're doing good now. I'm swinging my big dick around the world, bossing people around, making shit happen, you know, and how strange, curious. I couldn't really attract a partner in that time, lovers. Oh, no problem. I could. I had. That was no big deal. But someone who cherished me, I think my dick was just too big. No one could get close. It was a monster. And. And I think our men weren't taught that they had to, like, deal with that, so. But I longed for that. And one day, just really right after pussy came out, a man kind of wandered into my world. Peter. And he was the most loving, attentive, attuned man that I had ever met. Patient, always showing up for me. And, of course, I'm just saying this as, like, a cautionary tale. The last thing I wanted was for him to be anywhere near me because he loved me. And I was like, ew, this is so gross. He's so attentive. What's wrong with him? I really could not comprehend, like, how could somebody be that way? It took me a really long while. Did you have that, too, or did you grow up, like, with a loving, loving household and your daddy cherished you?

[A]

No, I grew up in a very chaotic, abusive household. So much going on. But I will say, I don't know how I always attracted really amazing men, but it took me quite a long time to figure out how to be in relationship with them. And I'm. I'm still. Still learning. I'm eight years married now with my husband, and I'm still very much learning.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So I'm. I don't know how I didn't play out my patterns in relationship. I attracted great men, but being in relationship with them, I found very challenging.

[B]

Yeah, I think you're right. That is. The challenging part is, like, how do we not fall into that mythology that will scorch us and torch the partnership? And how do we stay in connection with are pussies first? Because I think it's pussy, heart, head. It's got to start with a woman being sovereign about owning her pleasure and not thinking that her guy or her female partner is responsible for her pleasure. So Peter and I got together. He was unbelievably, like, just beautiful, loving, connected. And after we'd been together and we were engaged, actually. Although the day he proposed to me, he was like, I got this ring. Let's be engaged. I was like, what? Really? You know, and then I was like, calm down, Regina. Calm down. You can do this. And then we got engaged. But very soon after that, I started to think, he can't be exactly right. I'm like an alpha. I'm Mama Gina. I should be with a king, a world changer, somebody who's leading the frontiers like I am. We should be charging together on our white stallions towards conquering the world. We should be a power couple. And then, of course, the great pussy in the sky being who she is, you might call it fate, destiny, God, universal life, flow, whatever. But I met somebody that seemed to be that. And so I thought, okay, this will be great. I will kick Peter out, and I'm going with him. I'm going with alpha dude. Alpha, Alpha, Alpha dude. Okay. So that lasted about maybe a year and a half, and then I was really starting to see, like, I missed that attunement. I miss being cherished. I miss being seen. I miss the way he held me. And here's how bad I was. I couldn't even see the way he held me. I so didn't acknowledge it. I didn't let it penetrate me because I was so into the capitalistic, colonialistic, myth making ethos that I was about, like, getting bigger and getting more powerful and growing the business or setting more and more women free or whatever I thought I was doing. I, like, missed that he painted my mailbox pink because pink's my favorite color. I bought a beach house, and he carefully took out each brass doorknob and polished it so the brass color could be shiny. Like, I didn't take those things in. And so there was a crucial day. I mean, you brought up plant medicine. So for me it was mdma. Have you enjoyed that one yet? Yes, it's quite lovely. It is, in my case. Changed my fucking life because I made this decision, like, I've got the Alpha man and Peter. Even though he was dating someone else, dating a lot of other people, but dating someone else specifically, he never lost touch. He always had a hand at my back. He was always there if I needed. He would check in on me. We'd have sleepovers now and then. And so I thought, let me do MDMA with Peter, and then I'm gonna do it with Alpha guy, and I'm gonna see which one.

[A]

That's a good plan, wasn't it?

[B]

It was practical. It was practical. It was like a boss babe thing to you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I had that experience and I didn't realize, honestly, how much trauma I was holding in my body. MDMA is used to help people heal from ptsd. They've done so many studies on it with people that were in war zones. And it works better than decades of therapy at allowing someone to connect with their heart and open their heart again after they've been broken. And as soon as the medicine hit my system, I just looked at Peter. You know how that is when you take that medicine and then you see somebody and is it like you see their soul? Is that how it is for you? Have you tried it with your husband?

[A]

I have, yeah. We. We used to have a. A little ritual. Obviously not in this season, but we have a ritual, and it's amazing because we could go into ceremony just being at each Other. And then the minute you feel it hit, it's like everything melts away. And you just see their heart and.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

It's a really beautiful experience.

[B]

And did you find that that experience of seeing and feeling their heart, like, it doesn't ever leave you, even after the drug goes away?

[A]

Yeah. We can sit and just look in each other's eyes, and I feel like we can just drop into place, which is really beautiful. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. It's amazing. I'm glad that you have that with him because especially now with the babies, it's so.

[A]

We need all the help we can get.

[B]

All the help you can get. It is. You know, it's almost like, how do you even find each other when there's so much and so much expansion so quickly?

[A]

Yeah. And in the moments where you don't have hours and hours of ceremony, how can you really just drop into seeing each other?

[B]

Right, right, right, right. So once the walls came down and I saw Peter, and just, like, my eyes filled with tears, here was the crazy part. I never had my and my heart in the same bed with the same man before. And it was like, whoa. I could feel this much love. I could be this vulnerable, and my pussy can be turned on. Wow. And I just felt like I turned to him. Literally probably an hour into the experience, I was like, peter, I can marry you now. Like, all that that was before it melted away. I could marry you. And meanwhile, I didn't really know that Peter was going to. Oh, that's interesting. Okay, can. You know, Good for you. What about my feeling last year and half? But it was, like, such a breakthrough. And that led to. Since I told him that, and we were so vulnerable, and I thought that we were going to. Now that I was really going to be able to be the Cinderella and the sleeping Beauty that was long for. We were going to go off and we were going to get married and live our dream for happily ever after. Land. And instead, a few days later, he called me and he said, oh, you know that girl I was dating? We decided to move in together. Chilly, right? Okay, it was chilly. But it was the greatest learning curve of my life because I was pressed against the wall. And suddenly, instead of me being the recipient of his open heart for all those years we've been together, now I had to learn how to open mine. And I didn't know how to open my heart. I knew how to check things off my toes to do list. I knew how to decide if he was adequate or not at the task he just completed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I knew how to be in criticism of him, and I knew how to have expectations that were quite lofty that he could never fulfill. I was good at that also, but to keep opening my heart. And then actually. And do you know Annie Lala?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay. She helped me so much with this, of teaching me how to love. She's a coach, and she taught me, okay, Regina, like, can you love that Peter is finally, instead of trying to please you all the time, please himself and stand for himself and stand in his masculine instead of waiting on you hand and foot? And I was like, oh, such a relief. It's such a relief. And so she's like, okay, then love what's happening now. Love that he's got this other woman in his life. Love that this other woman brings parts of him forward that you were unable to bring forward forward. And it became the greatest learning curve of my life. Because, honestly, I could have probably never in this lifetime learned to truly love a man were it not for this opportunity to love Peter while he was deep into a relationship with another woman while keeping my heart wide open. I did receive a lot of criticism from people. They're like, what the fuck are you doing, Regina? Just walk away. And my mom was like, really? You're just going to be pathetic like that? But I believed. I think I believed deeply inside of me that he would come back one day because I decided that I was very as horrible as I was at loving him. My plan was to be great at it. And I think that's the thing about having a big dick, because big dicks get things done. And I thought, I'm going to have big dick love. I'm not going to stop until I get great at it. I'm not going to stop until I hold the space for my pussy to stay open. I don't know why that makes sense. Like, a big dick would help your pussy stay open. But somehow it made sense inside as a metaphor. Yeah, yeah. Like, I was like, I am going to stand for my turn on, for my surrender, for my expanding love for him. Okay. One time he even said to me, will you please have lunch with her? Take her to lunch so that you can reassure her that you don't want me back. And I was like, I don't think that's a good idea. I don't think she's gonna be reassured.

[A]

Like, oh, my goodness, what did you do?

[B]

He said, please do it. She's quite nervous about you. And I was like, okay, I'll do it. And I remember it was like, right Around Christmas. So I wrote her this beautiful note about how grateful I was that she was in Peter's life and how she was expanding him and I was seeing him grow in ways I couldn't have ever dreamed. I bought her beautiful bathrobe and I met her for lunch. And I had made a promise to myself. Do not tell her about your plan. One day, get him back. Give it to yourself, Regina. But right before I left, one of my girlfriends called me and she asked me where I was going. I told her and she was like, well, you're going to tell her the truth, right? About what you want. And I was like, no, Peter doesn't want me to do it. And she said, well, you are somebody that teaches women to stand for their truth no matter what. Why would you stop today? Bam. I know. It was like that. It was like the mic dropped. And so I went, I met her. We had a lovely time. We talked about our kids who were both single moms. La la la. I've reassured her I appreciated her. And then it was time to go. And just as we're about to get up from the table, she goes, and who is Peter to you? And I said, my beloved. The man I love above all other men. And then we left. And I think that was kind of. It was probably a pivotal moment because instead of wondering, she knew. And eventually, over the next six months or so, my continuing to just be so right with everything and to see the queen in her and the king in him and to support them both for as long as this was gonna happen between them. The tide eventually changed. And I think it would've been stressful if I were in her spot because he would see me now and then throughout this. And I have only the highest regard for her. But ultimately, it was not something that she wanted to continue with.

[A]

I get that.

[B]

And so eventually, Peter and I got back together again. And fast forward, which I thought it was going to be, like the happiest and was going to be nothing but, you know, butterflies and Bambi and a big white wedding and all those kind of things. And instead, eventually I got guided exactly back into that cock sucking fucking spot of me thinking, wait a minute, I'm the fucking breadwinner. How am I supposed to soften my pussy now? Oh, God, help me, help all of us. But here's the thing. There is a chapter in Pussy, a Reclamation, which is about the courtesan. Do you remember that chapter? It was about these women who lived in, like, Venice or Paris.

[A]

Oh, yes.

[B]

These women who actually were they weren't prostitutes. They were personages. They were people that cultivated the womanly arts inside of themselves. And they did it because you know how you are. Like, you built a business based on your vision and your desire, and it went boom. So, you know, you have this ability. It's not just the power of attraction. It's almost like you are a quantum physician and you created something with your intention, your turn on your trust, your vision, your desire. And courtesans knew this, and how they would approach their lives would be they had to turn on. Whether they were keeping the company of some gnarly old toothless king or his hot stable boy. They understood that we as women have something called volitional heat. And what is volitional heat? Like, if you were a horse and I was a kitten. We don't have volitional heat. We only go into heat when the estrous cycle kicks on in our body, and then suddenly our ovaries are popping and we're ready to be fertilized. And then all the alley cats are chasing me, and all the stallions are running after you, and that's the animal world. But humans, we have volitional heat, meaning we can turn it on anytime we want to turn it on. You know, like, you go out with your girlfriends, and you see a. In our single days, we go out with our girlfriends, we see a hot guy in a bar or at a party, and we're like, oh, yes, hello. Suddenly we're like, turn it on. We're not giggling with the girls anymore. We're like, were turned on. And so I studied the courtesans, and so I knew that these were women that cultivated the practice of being so much in their pleasure on such a consistent basis, practicing all the womanly arts, owning their beauty. The womanly art of flirtation, the womanly art of having fun no matter what. You know, that's not an easy one, especially when you have babies. The womanly art of turning on your inner bitch, inviting abundance. Like, these were women that practiced these skills, and we weren't even taught these skills. It's why I started the school in the very beginning, was because I thought, you know, we can be successful and we can cultivate the practices of pleasure that attune us to the enjoyment of the privilege of being a woman. So that's when I doubled down, when I started to see us going flat, and I started to see my disapproval rise, my criticism, and me swinging the big cock out once, you know, just so I could have, like, I don't know, What? That was Dungeons and Dragons with Peter's cock and my cock, you know, there was going to be. It was clear victory. So what I would do is when I would get really, really stuck, I would throw down a mat, throw in a piece of music, put on my lingerie, and if I was raging and angry, I would just rage with that music. And I would just rage and rage and rage. It's a practice called swamping that I teach. And pour all of that anger instead of at Peter, it was between myself and the music. And I would rage until it morphed into turn on. So instead of it just being, it turned into hot, hip, grinding, pussy drenching rage that flooded through every part of my being. And suddenly, instead of being, I'm going to kill you, it was, I'm turned on. And that was a different place to approach him. So it became. And I don't want it to sound like another thing on your to do list, because we have too many things on our to do list. But honestly, women have a choice. Anger or pleasure. And no man can make that decision for us. He might have opinions about it, but we're just gonna get pissed at him if he asks for that. But when we ask for that, we feel like a genius. We feel like a courtesan. We're like, oh, I am so good. I'm gonna take this rage that I wanna ch and just, like, punch his lights out. And I am gonna turn it on with this swamping practice. I'm gonna hit the mat and I am going to get all hot and turn. And then from there, you can actually make a request of your partner that will king him and queen you. So for me, I absolutely did not want to do this. I wanted him to be wrong. Like, what is that about women that we want our men to be wrong? Can you please explain that to me?

[A]

I wish I could, but I totally get it when you're talking about swinging the D. Sometimes it does feel like you're in this dick measuring contact, and it's the worst place to be because nobody's gonna win. Nobody is gonna leave that situation feeling good.

[B]

Right on. And don't you think, like, between us, your dick is a lot bigger than his?

[A]

We all think.

[B]

Yeah. No, I'm.

[A]

What's so funny is they are normally happy to let you believe that too. And then they build resentment, and then your building was happening. It's just. Just like, you never win.

[B]

Got. Yes, exactly. And I have tried so many different hacks about this. Like, I've, like, let's say Peter wants to connect with me sensually. And I'm all wound up from a big work day. I'll look at that situation and I'll be like, he wants to connect with me centrally. All I want to do is, like, have a hot bath and a cigarette, and I don't even smoke. So then I'll be like, okay, Peter, you're gonna have to leave a hundred bucks on the dresser. Cause it's a night that Regina can't show up, but my cortisone could. For cash.

[A]

We'll do it for cash.

[B]

I don't know why. Why did that make a difference? It might not be everybody's candy, but it helps me. Yeah, I think it's just like a thing that will remind me that I am in charge of my turn on. And the difficulty that I am than all women have is, first of all, we don't have a cultivated practice of turn on. We aren't doing things every single day that will fuel us. We're massively undercumbed. We do not have nearly enough orgasms to keep our divinity inside of our bodies. We're always chasing it, thinking that after the long day, maybe we'll have a bath and treat ourselves well. But it really takes, like, countless minuscule decisions throughout the day that lead to a woman being able to fuel herself with pleasure. So do you want to do some practices right now to serve the people? Yeah. Okay, great. So, all right, let's just take your hand and just rest it on your pussy right now.

[A]

Oh, my goodness. This is probably something no one's seen the boss made podcast before.

[B]

Okay. It's like the source of life itself. You don't even have to put it exactly on, just even just a little bit apart. And I want you to see if you can feel that there's like, a little heat cultivating between your hand and your pussy. And your pussy is starting to get warm or maybe a light buzz happening in there. Can you feel her aliveness? Okay, great. That aliveness is the goddess. That's the life force. Can you feel that? And maybe it's just really pussy centric, just right there, but it's just like a little kind of tingle that you've awakened that your body is already. You know, we've got 10,000 nerve endings dedicated to pleasure in our clitorises. And those 10,000 nerve endings, if we don't pay attention to them, they shut down, they atrophy. Not your clit. Your clit never atrophies. Never, never your whole life long. But. But you know, just like a muscle. If you don't use it, you. She'll just put the shutters up. So just activating her. Can you just feel like it's a slight, energetic shift in your body now? Okay, that's a perfect, easy one. Another one that you can do that nobody really will suspect you're activating. You can just run your. Your hand, like, really slowly anywhere, really. I mean, it could be. You don't have to, obviously, running your hand slowly and evocatively on your face while you're doing podcasts. I'm like, that means no one will know too well. You know what, though? It's so riveting when a woman does do something. Like, even if she just strokes her own eyebrow, Isn't that pleasurable just to watch a woman taking pleasure from?

[A]

Yeah. So calming.

[B]

It does you. Calms your whole nervous system down.

[A]

It's amazing.

[B]

It's amazing. Okay, so that's another little trick. Another one is if you have a womantra, which is, you know, where you just have a thought in your head. Like, for you. My. The womantra I'd pick for you might be like, I have the hottest pussy on Instagram.

[A]

Okay, great.

[B]

And you don't have to say it out loud. You just sit there and you're thinking.

[A]

So you just see us saying it in your head.

[B]

You just have it in your head as a thought. Because we don't even clock the amount of hours that we spend in self doubt, self hatred, self criticism, self deprecation. But if you just have a little mantra that you practice, and then suddenly, instead of having to think, oh, God, I should have thrown the wash in before I left today. There's nothing in the house for dinner. And I think I put on a couple of pounds after, you know, going out to dinner three nights this week. Oh, God. And then you think, I have a lot of fussing on anything. It's shifting.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

And what you're doing there is you're using the practice of volitional heat. You're turning yourself on, and you're also, by doing, you are turning on your neurotransmitters, such as beta endorphin, prolactin, serotonin, and you are ridding yourself of cortisol, all those stress hormones, and you're turning on all of these beautiful hormones that activate inside you and create a pleasurable experience. So imagine if, I don't know, you just put your phone on timer, and once an hour, you put your hand near your pussy to feel a little buzz. The next hour, maybe you go on, do it with me. Uh huh. How hot are you? Oh my God. Like that is your next hour. And the. Or you could just like, you know, pick your favorite mug that you cherish and just have a sip of. Mm, so yummy. Just even taking the time so. So that you begin to start instead of filling yourself with stress, which is what women have been taught to do, you start to counter that by little tiny drops, like a little IV drip of pleasure all day. You won't hate him nearly as much because men do this thing which is so important and so needed, especially by women like us. They love us more than we love ourselves. That's how much he loves you. He would lay his life down for you and I promise he would not do the same. I certainly wouldn't, but Peter certainly would.

[A]

I think that's true. And like my babies, he'd be like, I got you.

[B]

Right? And so. And part of it is in this value judgment, judgy culture that we live in that teaches us that earning is the most precious thing or important thing that we could do. Not to mention we've been acculturated to. To be like little men. Yeah. That's how we succeed is we have to man up rather than woman up. So we just get. We start to diminish the value of being cherished. And I certainly did that. And I almost lost the greatest man I've ever known. And I'm not saying I'm not gonna be close to firing him again and again again. But it's. I'm getting better at the practices.

[A]

Thank you for sharing all of that. And thank you for sharing that you're still in the practice of it too. Because I think that that's such an important reminder, especially for those of us that are really high achieving, who. I mean, I know for me, whenever I have a lot on my default is to jump into hyper independence. Just check off the to do list, all of those things. And it feels like slipping into the other side of me is so much easier when there's no stress. And that's just not life.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so it's cons. I love the practices you've brought up because one thing I'm always thinking about is how do you make that transition to just a little bit easier? You can notice it, but it can be so hard to get out of it because that's. I don't know, the way I grew up, it was just like survival do more. Like that's all it was. And you just. I Just hustled my ass off.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And.

[B]

And it got you. Be where you are.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

And so it's almost like you want to cling to that island because that's how you survived. And now the evidence is there. Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly. But now you. There's. You know, you're just screwed, Natalie, because you read there's no going back.

[A]

And. And how do you suggest dealing with the resentments that build up in relationships?

[B]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I got one for you. First of all, that practice called swamping is really, really good because you can swamp your rage. You can swamp your frustration. You can swamp what a loser you think he is at that particular moment. You can swamp your grief.

[A]

You can swamp, like, the fact that the towel was maybe like a meter from the. Of laundry.

[B]

I feel you so hard. How about the toilet seat? Tell me about the toilet seat. Was it up or down?

[A]

All the little things, the towels.

[B]

It's funny how we are.

[A]

I know.

[B]

God, like already, don't you find yourself to be so much more of a loving woman in partnership than, let's say, the women of your generations? Like your mom, your grandma, your great grandma.

[A]

Yeah. And I feel like growing up, I don't know about you, but was just like the Persona that I saw as a wife. A mother was almost this martyr of self sacrifice. And you know, my mom, she was in complete survival. I'm one of eight, and she could barely afford to feed us in certain weeks. And she was in complete survival. That. That's what I saw, was she put everyone first. Yeah, but she's still that way now. She'll never put herself first.

[B]

And did you get her a copy of Pussy?

[A]

I'm. I'm going to. I've tried seeding some. Some books her way, but I call.

[B]

Her, if you want me to call it. Yes, she might be scared of me, but I can see her.

[A]

A pep talk. But it's that. And I'm sure that's what she saw growing up too. Just this complete self sacrifice of, I'm fine, I can handle it, but I'll take care of everyone else around me. And that is the pattern I can so easily fall into. Or I'm like, I'm doing everything for everyone. And then I'm like, can you see what you're doing and saying? But it's such a default that I have to work really hard to pull myself out of that and be in a different point.

[B]

It really makes a difference. There's a few things that make a big difference. One Is sisterhood like if you have another sister, another woman who's practicing pleasure and who also has the same goal as you, which is that you truly want it all. Meaning you want to not just achieve, but you want to soften. You want to be penetrated by love. You want incredible orgasmic experiences, and you want to run a baller company. Like, it helps to have somebody that could. For example, in the fall, I'm launching this brand new course.

[A]

Oh, tell me all about it.

[B]

Okay. It's called the House of Turn On. And it is a course where I teach all of the tools, the arts, the practices, all of this. Like, how do you take. Take a life and build. Turn on in your work, turn on in relationship to your pussy. Turn on in connection with partnership and sisterhood. And the whole thing takes place. It's only women. And so there. It's a. Literally a community of practice. So, for example, if we were in the class together or, you know, now that we know each other, there's a practice called spring cleaning in. In my book. And this particular course where I will hold space for you, safe space, and you get to vomit up all of the bullshit. You'd be like, he left the towel on the floor. He didn't do the laundry. He did this, he did that. And then I hold it, and I hold it. And then at the end, we say thank you and the practice is finished. And then we go back to bragging to turn on, to a dance break, to something to restore you to your center so you have a place to. To dump the gunk and be held by a sister. Because we do not have the kind of sisterhood that's gonna allow us to build unless we build it. We need women like we need oxygen. But not women in the sense of people to complain about our lives with or to put our men down. Women who want the same things we want kings. And. And how do kings take shape? They take shape when we are willing to clean up our side of the street and celebrate the shit out of his greatness and not like, punish him for the small affronts that are inevitable in life. And women can hold each other in this potent way. We can hold each other's desires. You know, it's almost like we not only can hold each other's greatness, but the more radiant, the more sensual, the more connected to your divine partnership you are. You give me permission to be that for myself and for my partnership and for my life. So it's not about a competition in my sister goddess communities or in the Course this fall. But it's about how do we all expand exponentially together? Because, you know, the voice of woman is so needed on this planet right now. Not the voice of our rage, but our desires, our vision. You know, we're like the greatest untapped natural resource on this planet. And the time to tap is now. It's time. And together we'll get there. But separately, we're hosed. So the house of Turn on is coming this fall.

[A]

Do you know what month is coming?

[B]

Yeah, it's gonna start the very first week of October is when we're gonna begin. When's the baby coming?

[A]

Just a couple weeks before that.

[B]

Okay. All right. Well, it's.

[A]

I can make it happen. Oh, yeah.

[B]

Totally can. Because you could listen on Zoom.

[A]

Yeah. You know, and then I will join. Probably so many of our women will join, too.

[B]

Okay, that'll be amazing. I would love to know, because, like, we need more sisters, that we can remind each other that we are divine and we're not just mean bitches yelling at the world, which is how I was raised. And it sounds like you were, too. Not through any fault of our moms, but they didn't have the. You know, it wasn't like your mom. When she was a little girl, someone pulled her on her mom pulled her on her lap and said, tell me about your desires. Tell me what you long for. Do you know you have 8,000 nerve endings dedicated to pleasure? Let's talk about what you want. You know, we didn't. It wasn't about that then. Yeah, it was about survival, like you described. Putting food on the table. And we're just so blessed to be in a different time. I'm not saying it's easy. It's a lot of hard work changing. Thousands of years of conditioning. But with each other, we can do it. We can make it happen.

[A]

I love this. And what do you say when women say, but I have to do all this work and he doesn't have to do it? I hear this all the time.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

Like, women are just more complex.

[B]

I feel like. Yeah, okay. I think we're, like, so far ahead of them in so many ways, like, it's not even kidding. And yet they love us so deeply, so potently, so selflessly. Like all men want. This is my theory. You can fight me on it, bitches. I'll take you out on this one. But men live to serve women. I agree. They don't know what it is we want, always. They don't always know how, but they want to. Are you gonna have a little boy or a little girl? Do you. You don't have to tell me. You're my.

[A]

Shh.

[B]

But like those of your listeners who have little boys. And you. If you notice the little boy, all he wants to do is, like, help. How can I help if he bakes a giant mud pie in the backyard and brings it into the kitchen with a white, shiny, clean floor? He's just doing that because he wants to make you happy because he made you a pie. You know, and. And men live to serve us. And our moms and us. We didn't do a good job of teaching them how or what it is. We want what it is. We long for what it is that would light us up. And so here's the hard part. It's kind of like. It gets exasperating, like, your daughter is still at the adorable age, the intoxicatingly adorable age. But there are passages of raising a child where it's just like, I have to tell her to clean up her room again. I'm gonna kill somebody. I'm still the parent. So I have to figure out, how do I do this in a way that will invite her into her highest self. And it's my opinion that women lead in this regard, that we are the change makers. It's our vision that will begin to shift the world. And right now you can see how out of balance the world is. It's way too dominated by male perspective. And what's happening is so much destruction and so much darkness and so much devast and cruelty. And because we do not have the voice of the feminine present, we can't sit around and wait for permission for men to say, here's a seat at the table. And it doesn't feel good if we, you know, swing our big dicks around, you know, to destroy them, to take our seat at the table. It feels good. If we can center ourselves through pleasure, which, reminding you, that's where the goddess enters the human body. We are the holders of the divine. We create life. Like we do that. That's us. And from that place of being filled with our joy and with our pleasure, we say, did you mean to leave those things on the floor of the bedroom for me to pick up? Was that what you meant to do? And then he's like, oh, no, baby, I'm so sorry. Shit, I was in a rush. Let me handle it. And then you're like, okay. And then you've gotten what you wanted, his manhood is intact, and you feel like a friggin Fucking cortisone queen. That is even more delicious because she has been able to lead with her lusciousness instead of her rage.

[A]

I love that. And it feels so good to ask and get a response like that, then enter into a fight.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You also had mentioned previously about, let's say you were feeling angry. You'll go really transmute your rage into turn on and then go make a request from that place. So let's say you want to make a request for a different behavior or anything. How would you frame that in a way that will generally get better results?

[B]

First of all, I don't always want to do it. And I make mistakes a lot. And I probably am like, mean or, I don't know, submissive or eye rolly to Peter way more than I want to be. But if I'm calculated because I studied orgasm and pleasure for so many years and I have pretty good strong practices in that area, I can. Can feel in my body when I have a wire crossed. I can feel you can too, right when it's like, caught him. Okay, let me just see. I mean, you're gonna smack him with this. And I can. And I can feel that energy inside of me. And so usually, like, for me, the quickest is I call a girlfriend and I'll do a quick spring clean where I'm like. Or if no one's available, then I will put on a, like a rage against the machine and I'll have a little temper tantrum and restore to my turn on and then see if I can find the place to instead of criticize to. What works for me is I turn it into a question and I say in my favorite way to do it is, did you mean to hurt me or did you mean to leave me out of, you know, or something? Or. And because I already know in advance, he didn't. It was something. And so we are ahead. We have to be patient. But we have sisters and we can have bitch fests in controlled circumstances. Because I do not. Any woman in my course, if she puts down a man, she is not permitted. That is not allowed. We do not allow that in the classroom. It's kept inside the swamping practice or the spring cleaning practice. And you know, just in the same way you wouldn't put down your kid or it doesn't even work if you get a puppy. And believe me, I'm not suggesting you get a puppy. In fact, if you tell me, do you?

[A]

Well, I have a dog. She acts like a puppy.

[B]

How old is she? She already changes. She she has broken.

[A]

Yeah, she.

[B]

Oh, thank God. Then you're allowed to keep her because two babies, you do not want a puppy. Oh, my goodness. I think, actually, I saw her sitting on the couch like a queen. Is she rather bald?

[A]

Yeah, she's a Pomeranian, but she has alopecia, so she's kind of looks like a teddy bear.

[B]

Now, I know several dogs that. It's kind of cute.

[A]

I know the face is cute, but I wish the rest of it had would grow in.

[B]

Did. Did it happen because she got a buzz cut too short and then.

[A]

No, it's actually really sad. The truth of what happened was I think she got really stressed when I had my daughter and lost her hair, which is so mean. But I. She went from being the baby of the house, and I think she got stressed.

[B]

Oh, that is so sad and funny.

[A]

I know. But then also, some people say, no, it happened at the exact age that it seems to happen to Pomeranian. Going to go with that story. But I think the true story was.

[B]

Spring Clean on it. So you can rip yourself of the guilt.

[A]

I think it was just. I've let go of the guilt. I mean, we're just. We were doing what we had to do.

[B]

She doesn't even look like she minds. She doesn't mind guys passing through. She was. She hardly looked at me. She was just sitting there looking like, I'm stunning.

[A]

She's very regal. She doesn't mind. She's like, I'm still cute no matter what, so.

[B]

But the reason I brought up puppies is because we are actually kinder to dogs than we are to our men. You know, we're like, oh, come here. Oh. Oh, you're so cute. And then if they do something naughty, we'll be like, what did you do? You know, we're not nearly so sweet to our guys, but it's helpful because, just like, they've discovered that it's wrong if your puppy makes a mess in the kitchen floor, you're not supposed to put their face in it, which is how I. My parents taught dogs when I was a little kid, show them that they pooped in the wrong place. But that doesn't work. All you're supposed to do is say, come outside. Good boy. This is, you know, so it's the same kind of. I don't mean to be demeaning or comparing puppies and men, although there's certain. I don't know, similarity. But the method of addressing their greatness and celebrating the sides of them that are coming forward as your king are equally effective. In both areas.

[A]

I love that. And another thing you said too, when you were telling your story about your relationship with PETA was all around how you'd been looking at his value from a very capitalistic perspective.

[B]

Oh God.

[A]

Can we talk about this?

[B]

We really need. Let's talk about this. I've needed somebody to talk to about this.

[A]

I feel like this is a really big conversation.

[B]

Yeah, I really, I agree. It's almost like we need another hour to get into this because I think that we are all so poisoned by thinking that the highest value is the bottom line, the dollar bill. And we lose so much life with that perspective and it's killing the earth. You know, our earth is getting savaged because people need to order on Amazon.com three times a day and we're losing our rainforests. And what's your perspective about it? What do you see? Feel hope for Wish I feel like.

[A]

I had to go through the journey of. In my company especially, it was just this concept of growth at all costs, costs, you know, even to a point of I wasn't even looking at the bottom line for a certain period of time. It was just like more revenue, more team, more this, more that, more, more, more.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I had a full life changing moment where I just been chasing this so unconsciously. I wasn't aware that I was really driven by that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Growing up I always equated money to freedom because I always thought, right, my mum wouldn't be in the situation she is if she could afford to leave.

[B]

Leave. Right.

[A]

So I just went on that.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And I had a moment where. And, and everyone listening kind of knows this moment. But it was when I ended up resigning from my company. It was. My little girl was about six months old. She was in her bedroom crying. She had her first flu, which, you know, it just kills you, kills you. And I wanted to be with her and I had to be on this meeting.

[B]

Oh God.

[A]

And it was almost like I floated outside my body and just give myself this pep talk of what the are you doing? You have everything you've ever wanted. You are still chasing more and dealing with what comes of that when it's absolutely not where you want to be like you want to be in that room.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And once I saw it, I couldn't unsee it. And it changed the way I was looking at everything. I, I looked at so many things like that. I'd seen valued my relationships like that. You know, it was very, very capitalistic and it was always this pursuit of more and I just had to really look at what is good enough. Firstly, can you feel already fulfilled? And it's fine to want to grow, but consciously and from a different. Not from a place of grasping for more of wouldn't it be fun if. And inviting that in. And it really changed. I mean, my marriage, my relationships, my business, my relationship to all of it. But I do feel like I had to go through that to see it.

[B]

Yeah. And it's so beautiful that this desire. Right. You're longing to be a mom. And then you had your daughter brought you to a higher level of consciousness in relationship to the work that you do in the world. And it wasn't through money. It was through the depth and breadth of your love for her. And you're longing to really, like, just squeeze every delicious drop that there is out of being a mama. And you know, like, those days that, like, especially now, my daughter's all grown up and my daughter lives in London, by the way.

[A]

Oh, she does.

[B]

I go to the UK a lot.

[A]

That's amazing. I love London.

[B]

And Also my stepdaughter, PJ's daughter lives in London, too. So that this time where you can actually soothe your child. You know, now that my daughter's big, if her heart breaks, I can't, like, pick her up in my arms and rock her like a baby and tell her everything's going to be okay. I can tell her everything's going to be okay, but. But it's like there's something so precious about being the one that can just make everything feel better to a little human being. Like, wow, I'm getting chills thinking about you and your little girl.

[A]

It's the best. And it. And it taught me a lot. But one of them was that. That lesson of just seeing money as the value.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because so many of us see that as like, if you are in survival, that's the way out. And I get that. And I love being able to help women become financially free. I think that's incredible. But that's not everything.

[B]

It's not everything. And also, like, let's say if we go into a different direction, if, let's say we did get the Prince, we did get the Jeff Bezos or the Elon Musk or the Donald Trump, the billionaire. Would you want that?

[A]

I definitely wouldn't want that.

[B]

You would not want that. You would not want anything like that. I mean, definitely what he did and, you know, with. With guys that are so devoted, you know, that was kind of extreme. But let's say, why do you think women run Away with their chauffeur, their hot chauffeur, because they're not getting the attention from their wealthy Prince Charming that they're getting from the guy who's opening the door of the car for them. Helping them out, hearing about their day. Like it's really that love that we long for, that attention that we long for. In fact, you know, would you live in a tar paper shack on the beach for a night of ecstasy? Yeah, yeah, yeah, there you go. Every woman says the same thing. We do not need the four seasons. We want ecstasy. We want to have ecstatic experiences in our lifetime in our bodies. So like the true feminine value, the number one most important thing for a woman is not a bank account. It is not diamonds. And whatever it's attention or pleasure, that's the thing she longs for the most. And we can't put the responsibility for our, our pleasure in the hands of our partner. We have to partner with them about what is pleasure for us. And that's a journey where we have to put our key in our own ignition and turn that baby on, take her down the highway, or we'll never be able to invite passengers. Never ever, ever.

[A]

What about for the woman listening who's so uncomfortable hearing you say that?

[B]

She has to go to my website, mamaginas.com. i'm going to spell it because it's spelled so strangely. M A M A G E N A S. And sign up for the ultimate guide to getting what you want. And in that it's like play by tiny play. It's not put your hand on your pussy time, it's how do we begin to slowly and gently reorganize our lives around our pleasure. So even doing something like putting a fresh flower on your desk is an act of, of radical pleasure, revolutionary action. Because you are choosing to make a workspace feel good to you. You're not totally about service, service, service, service, taking care, making sure everything, making sure you're about. I am worthy of flowers, by the way. White roses are my favorite.

[A]

They are the best.

[B]

I just don't even want to see any other color ever. I just, I know I'm a obsessed with these and just the energy of them, the fragility, knowing they're not going to last forever. It's just amplifies the beauty. So you don't have to start with pussy or reclamation. That doesn't have to be the first book that you read. It can start with simple tiny acts of pleasure that start to shift the energy inside your body where you Are saying to yourself, it's a privilege to be me.

[A]

Me.

[B]

I'm worthy and I'm going to honor myself. And that simple shift starts to turn on those neurotransmitters and enter that, like, goddess feeling inside of a woman's body where she knows she's sacred. And it changes everything. It's funny, isn't it? Usually we equate sensuality or sexuality with pornography. And so people get scared because they think, oh, I cannot look at pleasure because, oh, whoa, that's pornographic. And that wouldn't be good in my neighborhood on the PTA meeting. But actually it's a way of connecting with the holiest part of you. It's actually a sacred moment. It's a sacred act.

[A]

I love that. So would you recommend that's the next step for everyone listening?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

We have that beautiful little offering on our website. And you could start today by taking one little tiny step of pleasure. That's actually radical. And that will actually start to shift things and will actually make you view the world and yourself differently. It's miraculous. And then they've got to email you and then tell you everything that happened when they did one pleasurable thing. And then you have to call me and say, oh my God. Another got another email from a woman who never ever bought herself flowers or drew herself a bath, and she did both in one day. And they'll be like, yeah, this.

[A]

I feel like there's just nothing better than that when you just see a woman, like really prioritizing herself.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

I love that so much.

[B]

Yes. It's so beautiful.

[A]

My final question for you. I've loved this so, so much. My final question for you is asking about daily rituals you have that really help you cultivate this on an ongoing basis. What are some of your favorites? Are things you do regularly?

[B]

Yeah, there are things I do regularly. Absolutely a lot of them. I taught you today of small self touch practices during the day that will bring me back to myself when I can feel myself spinning out in stress. But what I always do is start in the morning. My morning starts with coffee exactly the way I like it. And I'm a writer and for me the writing time is in the morning. So I will light candles and in so doing, I will create intentions for my writing. Or sometimes like I. I have a friend whose partner's in the hospital, so I lit a candle for him today. Or other things that I'm long longing for in the world. I'll light candles for those things or for my daughters. And then I'LL write with my coffee. As soon as I put that to bed, I throw a mat down on the floor, I put on a song for my playlist, and I tune into myself and I'm like, feeling a little cranky. Eugenia, you're feeling a little tragical. Are you just feeling kind of good. You just want to move some sensual energy. And then my teacher for this. Did you ever hear of Sheila Kelly?

[A]

No.

[B]

She does a pole dancing class called S Factor and she taught.

[A]

You know, I used to be a competitive pole dancer.

[B]

Holy. I worship you. Do you have a pole at your house?

[A]

No, I don't at this one. I used to.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

I know.

[B]

I'm fangirling you. That was so hard right now.

[A]

Life of mine.

[B]

Oh, my God. You need to show me some videos as soon as we're done.

[A]

Oh, my God. It's so. Yes, I will.

[B]

Okay, so I'll move. I'll move, like, because, you know when you have that beautiful sensual energy coursing through your body, how beautiful that feels. And that kind of sets me up for the day. I'll also. I never take a shower. I always take a bath. And when I take a bath, I'm always putting on music. I'm always lighting a candle. Really, even if I'm in a rush, I'll take a 10 minute bath. Even if I have to wash my hair is happening in the bathtub. So it's just feels good to me. And so it's starting to begin to be what I call a pleasure researcher. Somebody that is always, every single day, researching a new thing that you can extract pleasure from. I mean, on my drive over here, I was in the car with Lily and I was like, what's your favorite music? And she's like, chapel Roan. Hello. So we just had like the whole Chapel Roan album on the drive over. And so that was a new pleasure. So it's just constantly looking for what would pleasure you. And by the way, the plus the bonus of this, once you start to learn that, then you can start to train the world. And when somebody says, oh, I was thinking of picking up flowers, you say, white roses, please. And somebody says, where do you want to go to dinner? You already know all the new restaurants in Austin that you want to be taken to. So it's kind of like a way of not just connecting to yourself, but knowing yourself well enough that you can invite the world to serve you.

[A]

I love this so, so much that. Thank you so much for being here. I've been so excited about this and it was amazing.

[B]

Thank you. Thank you. Natalie.

[A]

So you've we know the starter kit to start with. Is there anywhere else people can find you?

[B]

Oh yeah, they should come and join me on social. I have a really fun mama Gina whatever on Instagram and Facebook. That's a great way to join. And join my newsletter. Cause I write gorgeous blogs. They're not written by ChatGPT, they're written by me. I just really enjoy to write them and so they come out every single week and I'm very inspiring.

[A]

I'm on your list. I love you.

[B]

Oh really? Thank you for saying that. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Thank you for inviting me, making me feel so welcome and taking me into your beautiful world. I think we did so good with our colors too.

[A]

I know, look at us.

[B]

It did the white, beige. The whole thing worked out really well.

[A]

We nailed it. Thank you so much.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Wait, wait, wait. Before you go, I would love to send you my 7 figure CEO operating system completely free as a gift. All you've got to do is leave us a review on this podcast because it really supports the growth of this show. This is my digital masterclass where I'll show you what my freedom based daily, weekly and monthly schedule looks like as an eight figure CEO, mama and high performer. And I'll walk you through step by step how to create this for yourself, yourself. It includes a full video training from me and a plug and play spreadsheet to literally create your own operating system. It's one of our best trainings and it's worth $1,997. But I will unlock access for you for free when you leave us a review. I know, wild, right? All you have to do is leave your review on the podcast, take a screenshot of it and then head over to bossbab.comreview to upload it and then you'll get instant access to the seven figure CEO operating system system again, head over to BossBab.com review to upload your screenshot and get access. We are so, so grateful for all of your support and can't wait to hear how the podcast has supported you.