← The Breakfast Club
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- [00:00]
Podcast Announcer
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:02]
Jason Lee
Guaranteed Human
- [00:06]
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- [00:29]
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- [00:35]
Starbucks Advertiser
what's up y'?
- [00:35]
Amber Grimes
All?
- [00:36]
Starbucks Advertiser
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- [00:58]
Jason Lee
That chill.
- [00:59]
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- [01:23]
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- [01:54]
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- [02:27]
Amber Grimes
youf Knew Better with Amber Grimes, a production of the Black Effect podcast network and iHeartRadio.
- [02:32]
Jason Lee
Well, there's been a few times I have crossed the line. I will say one, I will say that I haven't talked about. The Internet literally exploded and it was cardi b Who called and just said, like, nah, you crossed the line.
- [02:56]
Amber Grimes
Today's guest is Jason Lee, a media personality, entrepreneur, and founder who has built one of the most talked about platforms in culture. Hollywood Unlocked. Jason opens up about becoming more intentional, how he moves, what he says and what he truly stands on. From creating viral moments without a plan to understanding strategic chaos and building a real business behind it. This is a reflection on growth in real time. We talk about accountability, discipline, sobriety, and the people who've challenged him to level up. Plus what it really means to invest in yourself, your platform, and your vision for the long term. And as Jason steps into his new venture with beta, he's in a different season, more focused, more grounded, and clear on what actually matters now. I'm so happy to have you here.
- [03:42]
Jason Lee
I'm happy to be here.
- [03:43]
Amber Grimes
I was so taken aback when you messaged me and said that you would come do the show.
- [03:47]
Jason Lee
Of course I saw it pop up on social media. Then I went down the whole trope of what this was, and I was like, yo, I love pulling up for people who look like me and who are out here doing their thing. And so, you know, you've been doing your thing for a while in music, so I'm like, oh, she trying to take my job. Let me pull up. Never.
- [04:05]
Amber Grimes
I learned so much from you. I love your interview. So you are somebody who inspires me in the media space. So, yeah, it's just always an honor to feel the same way. Like when I sat across from Charlamagne for his book, and I'm like, oh, Jason's coming. I'm sweating bullets.
- [04:18]
Jason Lee
And Charlamagne is literally the God. Literally been somebody that I've been, you know, following his. His. The way he's designed his. His brand and the trajectory of his career. So, like, I've been, like, really following him. And I followed him into therapy. I'm in the therapy. We have the same therapist now.
- [04:34]
Amber Grimes
So, like, yeah, you obviously have this big platform that we're all aware of Hollywood unlocks, which has been amazing. But I think you do a great job of having this business, but also being Jason Lee and sharing your personal life, sharing your journey, sharing the story. You built all of this independently, which is so inspiring, but you continue to build your business and build yourself. You work on yourself. It's a beautiful thing. What do you hear when I talk about you growing and where you come from?
- [05:03]
Jason Lee
Yeah, you know, I recently did this interview with Forbes, and I was saying to them that I've learned how to master code switching without switching up. Because like when people say, oh, my God, he's changed, he's changed. No, I'm evolved. I'm evolving. Life to me is an evolving experience and experiment where you start off as one thing and the world will say you're a sum of that one thing. But no, you get to do it all and be it all. So I've just been evolving. But the interesting thing is you're talking like, I really feel like I'm evolving backwards. Because when I got into the industry, I had to give them what they wanted. They didn't want me to come in and be Jason Lee, the probation officer who used to work at probation. They didn't want me to be Jason Lee the educator. I worked in education. They didn't want me to be Jason Lee the union guy. They wanted me to be the tea spilling Internet wreckage. Being that I gave them. And once I gave it to them and saw the reaction, saw all of what it was doing and the money I was getting, I was like, yo, let me just keep doing more of that. Because it was that spaghetti thing. Like, let me throw spaghetti at the wall. And whatever sticks or when it sticks, just keep doing more of that. But then it's interesting because as I started evolving, I started feeling like, man, the people aren't going to want me to show up the way that I really am because they're not going to be able to accept that, and that's not who they fell in love with. So I started to feel like I was enslaved to that. That person I created adjacently that people know. And then you get to a point where you're like, nah, I just. I just gotta just live in my true, authentic self. And there are days that I want to show up and burn the world down. And I do in a different way than I did before. Before, there were no boundaries. There were no. Well, there were boundaries. Don't attack kids. Don't out people. Other than that, everything was pow, pow.
- [06:45]
Amber Grimes
You even take grandmas out. Nothing.
- [06:47]
Jason Lee
Just kidding. Grandma. Grandma could get it for sure. Absolutely. Grandma. And some grandmas probably got it. Ye.
- [06:54]
Amber Grimes
So I hear you, but I know that Jason Lee with the Nasty Reid was always a part of who you were.
- [07:02]
Martha Stewart
Yeah.
- [07:02]
Amber Grimes
You're just saying you were more multifaceted than what you showed.
- [07:06]
Jason Lee
Yes.
- [07:07]
Amber Grimes
Talk to me then about having to play this character, Pick one character and make it larger than you and really, like, suppress some of the things. Like, did you. You wanted people to know these other things about you, that you have balance.
- [07:20]
Jason Lee
Yes.
- [07:21]
Amber Grimes
But felt like you couldn't.
- [07:22]
Jason Lee
Yes. I mean, you can't build a 50. It's probably more than 50 now. $50 million company from scratch and not know how to conduct business. Right. So, like, yes, I can give a nasty read. For example, recently, I just went viral, and I haven't told anybody talked about it, but, like, you know, I got this cease and desist letter from a basketball player. Oop. Oh, that was the first time I said it was a basketball player. This person sent me a cease and desist letter. I'm like, I know. This person that got my phone number that asked me spend the night at the house did not send me a cease and desist letter. Now, o. Jason probably would have started. I probably would have went and bought the jersey and a headband and start bouncing some balls and say, oh, I bounce these balls. I gotta figure out how I want to say what I gotta say. I wouldn't even said no name because I wouldn't have had to. Right. That's the Jason Lee that learned how to master what the people want to see. But the real message is we don't need to play this game of let me go ahead and legally try to put a restraint on you because I'm afraid of showing up who I am, who my true authentic self. So the Jason leaf from back in the day probably would have been doing all the extra charades and gone viral, Whatever. And so this time I was sitting on my couch and I just said, come on, come on, we don't want to do that. But the Internet knows the Jason that lives within, and it still did its thing. Like 1.3 million views in less 24 hours. It was tagging in this. So I guess, you know. Yeah, I know the Internet. I've mastered how it works. I do create strategic chaos. Chaos have always created strategic chaos. I just think back then when doors weren't opening for me, gatekeepers keeping things close to their chest and not wanting me to get in, people hating and trying to cancel. What. What's uncancellable. I was just like, yo, okay, it. I'm just gonna kick all these doors down and I'll take names later and, you know, whatever.
- [09:17]
Amber Grimes
So tell me about that one chaotic moment where you maybe said, I did too much. I gave the people a little bit too much of what they wanted.
- [09:28]
Jason Lee
Well, there's been a few times I have crossed the line. I will say one I will say that I haven't talked about was I was in a podcast and I didn't have a lot of people around me that would say, damn, you shouldn't have said that. Right. And so I would just say, and I mean say anything I wanted. And at the time I felt like I just felt some type of way about Ariana Grande.
- [09:52]
Martha Stewart
Okay.
- [09:53]
Jason Lee
And I said basically what I was. I, what I said came off as misogyny. And it was. And the Internet literally exploded. And it was Cardi B. Who called and just said like, nah, you crossed the line. You gotta, you gotta go back and fix that, cuz you can't. That, that, that wasn't right. You're better than that. And, and, and so although nobody was around me at the time I said it or edited it and it went out, you know, Cardi was able to check me to go back and fix it. And so I looked at him like, you know, I got five sisters. I probably would have felt some way if somebody did that to my sister. So she didn't need to, I didn't need to deliver it that way. And so I did go back and apologize. But what I learned was, you know, and I made the mistakes many more times because when you're like on live radio or you're at the Breakfast Club and you just say something, it's like that left my mouth. It ain't. You can't take it back, you know, Do I regret it? Nah. Because I had to go through these experiences to learn the power of my platform, the power of the tongue, the being responsible and owning it. Right. And that it's okay to apologize when you cross the line because people do want to see you're human and know you're not just an emotionalist tree that don't care about other people's feelings. So yeah, I've made mistakes, but I've learned from them.
- [11:05]
Amber Grimes
There was a moment on TV that people remember and I think you would say, wanted to define you by, in which you did not allow yourself to be defined by this moment. Talk to me about that love and hip hop moment.
- [11:22]
Jason Lee
Yeah, yeah, that was the drink toss, the famous drink toss. I mean, I think the thing for me was that, you know, there were so many different doors I was trying to get into in the industry, nothing would let me in. The only thing that open was love and hip hop, which wasn't a show that I thought because it had already had its first season where I was like, oh, that is not the environment for me because I don't know how to act like I'm not on tv. Like I just am really in it, whatever it is. And so, so when I Saw it. It was funny because Queen Latifah, who I had known since I was 15, and Floyd Mayweather, who I had become really close to, I went to both of them and said, love and hip hop is going to let me do the show. What do you think? And Queen Latifah was like, nah, like, you're better than that. That's not for you, don'.
- [12:08]
Amber Grimes
It.
- [12:08]
Jason Lee
And then Floyd Mayweather was like, you know, three people are going to tell you not to do it. A hater that don't want to see you do it, a person that don't need that door to open for them, and somebody that's already got it. And if. And. And if that door is open for you, take it. And I remember going, okay, I'm going to take it. So I took it. And when I went in, I went in just truthful and honest and open and said, look, I'm going to give you guys everything you want. I'm going to read people, I'm going to be. Make their business my business. I'm going to get. I won't give you my relationships because that's private. Going to ever never be on tv, intimate with anybody or open or expose that part of me. And then the other part was, I don't want to shoot with this person. The first scene was with that person. I didn't know, though.
- [12:53]
Amber Grimes
That's how TV works.
- [12:54]
Jason Lee
I didn't produce you then. I didn't know they produced it. Well, of course I had the reaction. What I learned in the experience was a couple of things. One, I had to learn that I went into the show not wanting to show my intimate relationships because I didn't want to be put in a box of the gay guy, even though they did that anyway, you know, because I think tv, especially mainstream tv, does a really horrible job of showing what being black and gay looks like. We're. We're not a monolith. We're. We're everything from me to Billy Porter. Hey, Billy. But what I learned in that experience was a couple things. One, that I had to be completely comfortable in whatever experience I find myself in, whether it's showing up in a show where combat and conflict is the chaos it creates in order to be successful. So I have to show up as my true authentic self, but also be very aware of what I'm doing. And then also I have to be very comfortable and confident with all of who I am, no matter if there's a camera rolling or not. And so that experience did a. And then third Oh, I also learned that, like, we're all worthy of redemption. Like, and how do you navigate through the chaos? So I had to, like, teach myself how to. From the minute that the drink was tossed, I knew I had six months until it came out. I had six months of preparation for the world seeing me differently than I saw myself because they saw this moment. And so I just rode the wave. You know, I let people hate me for a couple years. I mean, it was the hate. And then when I saw that, that was it. I said, okay, let me rise up to meet them. So I gave them more chaos, and then it became normal. And then I slowly started turning it down. And they came down with me because the advice that Queen Latifah told me was get the culture in the headlock and then take them on a journey with you as you evolve. And that's what I've done. So now there are some people that just in the airport the other day, oh, my God, I loved you. I love hip hop. I'm like, that's 11 years ago.
- [14:43]
Amber Grimes
Can you actually talk about what that experience is? To show up somewhere and decide, I'm going to be on TV and I'm going to give them what they want? What do they want? What are they looking for? And how do you. If you. If you could try to maintain some balance, understanding what you understand now, that people are going to look at you a certain way. But also, is this your big opportunity? How do you.
- [15:08]
Jason Lee
You know, I was having this conversation with an artist the other day, and they were saying. And I was saying, like, why don't you. They were asking me, how should they come out as a bisexual artist? How. What does that look like? I'm like, well, there was Frank Ocean. There have been examples. It's just, what are you comfortable doing? They were saying, well, I don't really know how to navigate that because I don't really see how people will buy into me as a brand. I'm like, well, don't sell yourself as a brand. Just sell your music, sell your art. What does your art look like? What is your art supposed to translate? And I feel like when I went into love and hip hop, the. The first conversation I had with Mona was when they. When the network said, we want to own 10% of Hollywood Unlocked, I was like, no, because I'm building a billion dollar brand, so I don't want to give you anything. I. But I need to be able to promote my brand. Every event that I have is going to be about Hollywood Unlocked. Every scene That I start is going to start with Hollywood Unlocked. I need to be able to interview people on the show for Hollywood Unlocked uncensored podcast. So they agreed to that. But they were like, okay, well, if you don't give us any percent, we're only going to give you $1,000 an episode that you show up in. So the first season, I only made $3,000 and I shot for six months exclusive. So I say that and say I went in knowing what I wanted to accomplish. I went in knowing I have an exit strategy. I have a deck that outlines day one and the day I sell it. I know all the verticals I want to build. I had the Impact awards idea way back then, but it was blogger brunch, because it was my idea. Wasn't as big as it was. I wasn't dreaming as big until I got in and was like, oh, this brunch is cool. But what if I went to the Beverly Hilton where. Where Clive Davis does his party, and I make a better party than him? And I did. So, yeah, I think it's been like one of those things where I went in knowing what I want to do. I don't know that people know what they want to accomplish anymore. I just want to go and be famous. Nothing worse than being somebody super famous and broke, and I never wanted to be that. So ownership from day one was always important to me. Ownership, freedom, and being able to do what I want to do on my own terms.
- [17:12]
Amber Grimes
A long time ago, my first day working for Boo, he told me, the first day you get a job, you need to be thinking about your last day. What are you going to do when you. If you get fired, if you quit, whatever it is, you need to make sure you've accomplished what you set out there to do. Or you just leave the company and now you're looking for another job, and you didn't even. Your resume didn't even get any better to get you to the next place. And so I have gone into a lot of opportunities. Exactly what you're saying, okay, cool. I'm working here. This is what I want to do here. And once I do that thing, I'm like, you know, if I. If it's great, I'll stay. But once I've accomplished what I came to accomplish, now I'm. I've been here for too long. There's nothing else for me here. It's time for me to evolve and go on to the next thing. Which is why I've never been scared to leave a job. And so to hear you say that as the advice of, like, hey, I know y' all kids want to be on tv. I know you want to be famous and whatever. Why, Right? I don't think that people are asking themselves why.
- [18:09]
Jason Lee
Is it because you were sheltered as a kid, didn't have no love, weren't popular? And now this thing, this drug of social media is making you feel a certain way. Because Melissa Ford used to always say, fame is a drug. And most people needed to get that hit in order to feel like they were living. For me, everybody knows I don't need to be famous. I want influence. My why has always been very clear. Impact, influence, and making a shitload of money and just having total freedom and ownership. And so I never went into love and hip hop saying, I need this show. I treated that show like I didn't need it. I wanted it, but I didn't need it. I could have went and found somebody at the Abbey. Hey, I'm gonna give you $50 an episode. You my boyfriend, like the rest of them did. I ain't doing that. I don't need to fake love. Fake act like we together. Go give me a girlfriend and a boyfriend. Now I'm in it. Now I'm gonna. You know, because the way reality TV works is, you know, that camera time will drive the insane story you come up with. But now you're enslave. The thing that I'm enslaved to is just being truly authentic myself. With Hollywood unlocked, I know there's going to be an exit at some point. And this is the important piece. Like, as you've gone through your career journey and I'm going through mine, I'm not. Whatever I'm in is not defining who I am. I had to tell somebody yesterday in City Hall. They were telling me, basically, you're just way too beyond the scope of what a council member should be. You're acting like you're this and you're that. I said, the craziest thing is this chair didn't define Jason Lee. Jason Lee is defining the chair. Just so you know, more people knew about me than they knew about Stockton. So we'll just be very clear. I'm never going to fit in whatever box you want to put me in. People that go into reality TV and don't have a plan is simply setting themselves up to fail. You're going in, you're going to get famous, then you're going to be broke, and then be slave to an image that you won't be able to sustain. So why put yourself through all of that. It's not going to work in the long run.
- [20:05]
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- [20:10]
Jason Lee
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- [20:16]
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- [20:25]
Jason Lee
I can never unsee that.
- [20:28]
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- [20:35]
Rob Gronkowski
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- [21:45]
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- [22:43]
Martha Stewart
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- [23:28]
Amber Grimes
What is the difference between influence and fame?
- [23:31]
Jason Lee
Influence is when you can actually move stuff. Fame is when you are just disrupting the space and you're a bunch of conversation. I feel like, you know, again, I'm not going to say names because there's. There's people out there. A lot of people are famous. I. I went to a red carpet event. I was invited by somebody to go to a premiere. So I got to the premiere. I walked in. I didn't want to be there because I don't even go to premieres. I don't want to be nowhere, really. Okay? I'm here because I want to be here. So I get to the premiere, and I'm like, where's my seat at? And my seat was in row Q. I don't even know where row Q is. And that's not even ego. That's just. I don't sit in Roku. I mean, C, D, E. Okay. F. Now we around, and you gonna find out. But yeah, that G. Gotta go. H. Hell, no. Jay, you jackass. Put me over here. K. Okay. L. Let me get the out. Now it's getting worse. Yeah. Did you put me over here? No, no, no. Oh, no. Punk ass punk. Okay, so it's getting worse as it gets higher. So anyway, Q, I was like, yo, I'm out. I'm out. And they were like, oh, no, no, no. We found you a better seat. I said, okay, okay. Because I was literally at the door. Walk back, Jay. Jay. Y' all have a good night. And I left. Okay? So I just. I've built influence where my influence matters, and I never allow other people to forget that. And that's not ego. That's just. I've earned that. And my team, they'll tell you, I'll be on, like, what are we doing? And. And. And part of that, though, is as part of the team, always pushing people to acknowledge the influence that I've been able to amass. I know that any celebrity I want to reach, I know how to reach them. All I got to do is go on Instagram. They're going to get it. So that's influence versus, you know, somebody that's Going to go run against traffic just for the sake of going viral for one moment and then we forget you. The next week, I will be putting
- [25:28]
Amber Grimes
the Jason Lee Alphabet.
- [25:30]
Jason Lee
I can go all the way to
- [25:32]
Amber Grimes
Z. I know you can. When you do cause chaos with no plan, do you believe you can still come back from that? Is there a way to get that redemption like you said, and to continue to evolve? And how do you do that? If you went in not focused on a strategy, just the opportunity?
- [25:52]
Jason Lee
Yeah, you can always pivot, but you really have to be dialed into your why at some point and you can pivot at any moment. Yeah. I didn't go in thinking I was going to have this chaotic moment. I knew I was going to go in and create chaos with the cast, with my business, but I didn't see that chaotic moment happening once it did. As part of my overall plan. I'm like, how do I. How do I go from this crash out moment into crushing it in my business? Because there's. Nobody's going to like me from that. And Floyd Mayweather said, just if they say you're all of that, just go be a savage. Fuck it. Who care? Just go fuck it. And I fuck it became a mentality for a long time where it got to a point where I was like, damn, I got. I got to know what I give a fuck about now because I just said fuck it so much that I didn't know. And so, so there has been a journey where I went from like, complete chaos that was unplanned to strategic chaos, to managing a library of chaos, to then, like, controlling the chaos. And now the chaos is different. I don't have to go and blow up the Internet like I used to. Now that I am an elected official as the vice mayor of Stockton, kids are watching me, educators are watching me, parents are watching me. And I'm trying to balance politics and pop culture in a way where I still stay authentic to who I am, but I also create the type of impact that I want to today.
- [27:20]
Amber Grimes
Now, you said something important a little while ago about not code switching and how you said you're not letting your. Your seat in the district define you.
- [27:31]
Jason Lee
Code switching, but not switching up, but not switching up.
- [27:33]
Amber Grimes
That is very important because I feel like now there's. There's no room for anybody to just do one thing or be one thing. Like the economy's bad. But it's very inspirational, I think, for others to see that you can be an entrepreneur, you can do this, you can do that, and you can Even go and run your whole. The whole city, the town that you grew up in. But I think most people would then say, I gotta straighten up and fly right and do this, and then ultimately end up not being themselves.
- [28:02]
Jason Lee
Not with Donald Trump kidnapping presidents, bombing leaders, killing their whole families, getting $400 million planes donated from the Saudis, then flying, tearing up the White House. He tore. We don't let our kids go and tear people's house. This motherfucker went in and tore up the east wing. I have pictures in the east wing. Can't find them anymore because the east wing is gone. And he's gonna build a ballroom so people can come and dance to the tune of whatever he's selling democracy for. So, like, yeah, when you look at that, why can't I have an opinion about somebody's music? Like, why is the standard for black people so higher than other folks? If the President of the United States can call women fat, get found guilty of sex assault, say that a group of black kids at Central Park 5 should be murdered when they were not guilty, say the first black president was not even American, can be married to an immigrant, then turn around and say, every other immigrant that don't happen to look like that one has to go back to their country. Now, birth or rights are. I mean, like, this is gas. Cost me $130 the other day because this motherfucker. So I just think, like, why is it shocking that I'm the vice mayor, he's the president, we have to get out our minds that we can't be anything we want to be. We could be anything we want to be. And Donald Trump, I'll give him the credit, has shown us that we can be anything we want to be, including pure evil. I'm not pure evil. I could be messy, but I ain't evil.
- [29:35]
Amber Grimes
Oh, how are you more responsible with your role and understanding that? I can be whoever I want to be. I can be all of the Jason Lee's in one, but I'm not doing those things. I'm more responsible with the position that I have and the people that I'm responsible for.
- [29:53]
Jason Lee
Well, I'm not at City hall saying, I need this job, I don't need it. The people of my city know I don't need to be there doing this. I don't. I did a video once where I said, because the mayor, she's white. And I had supported her during the campaign. I said, she cares more about our penises and our policies. And she played it at city council. I Said, can you rewind that and turn it up? Because I don't know if people can hear it. I need them to hear what I said. And then when she played it, I said, if you see me say it, I said it. I stand on what I say. I'm not running from that. And then I used it as a moment to say, as black people, we know how you love our culture. We know how you love our men or our women. We know how you objectify us, sexualize us. But when it comes to standing with us in the fight that we have to go through every day, where are you? You can't be found. So I didn't say it that way because I knew that delivery I gave was going to get it played at city hall. So it was strategic chaos that I baited her until she walked into it, and then I walked her right through the flames. And then when it was done, the people took that clip and put that out. So it just only made it even worse. Yeah. So I'm very aware, like, when I'm in it, like, anything, I'm not going to be enslaved to city hall. Like, I felt enslaved to the chaos people had fallen in love with. Because for a while, I felt like I had to keep showing up being viral Jason in order to be Jason. I'm like, nah, I don't have to be, because I'm still make. I make the same amount of millions of dollars that I'm going to make without doing that. So why am I doing that? I'm doing that because I feel like that's who I have to be to make people happy. And I was like, no, I don't. I don't have to do that. So I just stopped. And it's. It's interesting because the other day I was in the airport, and somebody goes, man, used to read the hell out of people. And I go, damn, this person. Does this person think I fell off? Does this person think that I'm not that guy? But when I go back and look at the clips of who that guy was, I'm like, damn, who was that guy? That guy was a fool. You know, I miss him sometimes, but, yeah, I can't stop the energy I'm on right now.
- [31:49]
Amber Grimes
What part has therapy played in that for you?
- [31:52]
Jason Lee
Sobriety. So I'm almost in three years of being sober. Sober sobriety was important to me because when I started therapy Charlemagne, you know, we were, me, Charlamagne and Tiffany Haddish. We all share the same therapist. We were at Tiffany's bar, Mitzvah and bar mitzvah and Charlemagne said to me, he says, why you always look mad? I said, nigga, what you mean, why I always look mad? Now I'm mad because you judging me, right? And he goes, you always look mad. You need to go to therapy. And I felt like he was judging me. He would always tell me when I go to breakfast, you need to go to therapy. You need to go to therapy. You need to go to therapy. Well, one day Tiffany picked me up. Tiffany came and met me at a party and. And I had my sprinter. And so she got in with a guy and she was like, oh, where are we gonna go? I said, we're going to the Abbey. So we went to the Abbey. We got shit face drunk. This is when her and I both drank. And this guy was there and he's this straight guy just sitting there watching us, just. I mean, it was a zoo. Well, I found out that's the therapist. So he saw me in my crash out. And I thought, man, he's gonna judge me. So I go to my first session with him and I go, all right, Elliot. Like, what's up? What's wrong with me? And he said, I don't think anything's wrong with you. I just want to know what you want to work on. I'm like, oh, okay, so not judging me. I said, well, I kind of want to work on, like, not partying as hard because I was spending like 50 grand a month on partying, drinks, whatever. And so he said, okay, well, when try to go out without drinking. So I went out without try to and fail. Then he said, okay, well, try to go out and have one drink. So nobody ever, you know, you can't have one drink. You have one drink, you go to sleep, you have two drinks, you got the whole bottle. So it was like I couldn't find a balance. Then it dawned on me. I wasn't in control of it. And then I had a birthday party where I super crashed out. And I was like, okay, that's it. And I literally stopped and haven't drank since. So. So. So therapy's just been kind of like that ongoing check in. Like, how you doing? How you? What's going on? And we work on whatever I want to work on in that moment.
- [33:41]
Amber Grimes
I want to talk to you about this because I stopped drinking when I turned 21.
- [33:44]
Jason Lee
Oh, congrats.
- [33:46]
Amber Grimes
Thanks.
- [33:46]
Jason Lee
Wait, that's. Well, we don't have to age you, but that's a while ago.
- [33:49]
Amber Grimes
That's okay. Then over. Over a 10 years ago, yeah. People know. I have to remind people all the time. It's like a new thing for everybody all the time. After 15 years, I'm like, I'm good, y'. All. But it is probably something that has made me the most disciplined. I owe all my discipline to that, and it's made me the most honest and most clear. And I get that from you right now because I'm an old, seasoned, not drinking vet, and I go, oh, yeah, that's it. If I go somewhere and I'm not having a good time, I know I'm not having a good time, and I leave.
- [34:20]
Jason Lee
Right.
- [34:21]
Amber Grimes
Makes you very honest. And when you do have a good time and you're not drinking, you're like, man, this is a fucking good time.
- [34:27]
Jason Lee
Yeah.
- [34:27]
Amber Grimes
And I love that clarity. And you said the word control.
- [34:31]
Jason Lee
Yeah.
- [34:32]
Amber Grimes
I do just want to touch on that. You know, I'm not telling anybody they can't drink or what to do. But I also don't know if people are aware of power, of having control of yourself and your life and your decisions and your night. Everyone does not have that experience. So can you. Can you share with us?
- [34:49]
Jason Lee
When we were going out, we had to have a driver for the Sprinter because we had to have a Sprinter because there were at least six or seven of us. We had to have at least two security, two to three, because you had to manage the entire environment. I used to wear tons of jewelry. I was going out looking like a rapper. Okay, Hundreds of thousands of dollars of jewelry, spending thousands and thousands of dollars going out. And. And then there was processes to. When we got home, make sure we have all the credit cards, make sure we didn't lose id, make sure we take off all the jewelry. If I brought somebody home or two, make sure that all of my property is in the safe and that nobody steals it. All my guns are put away. So, like, it became a thing where everybody around me was managing this chaotic experience. Well, I thought about it. I'm like, yo, this is. Not only am I out of control, I'm now forcing my friends to help me stay in control. Once I got sober, I realized you're not just in control of you. You can control everybody else, too. You can control every room you go in. You can control the day you're gonna have. You can control the day. The people that interact with you are gonna have you. You are in more control of everything. Your business, your bottom line. You're saving money. So the discipline, for me, it became a challenge. And once I mastered it, you know, people Go, oh, when are you gonna go back to drinking? I'm not. I have no desire to go back to drinking. Drinking. I'm not going to say I'm enslaved to being sober because to those people who are drinking, like, do what you want to do. But I, I do run across a lot of, like, younger people in their 20s, because I don't know how you were, but in my 20s, I was 30s, 40s, I was burning it. I'm drinking just a few years ago, I was a mess. I tell people in your 20s, have a good time, have a great time. But had I known better or if I would have known sooner, I would have done all this sooner. So I would have had more years. But I don't regret it because I am where I am today because of all that of it.
- [36:32]
Amber Grimes
So, yeah, yeah, I'm glad that you said that because you even brought in the control. Like, you literally, you can control everything.
- [36:42]
Jason Lee
Everything, everything. Yeah.
- [36:44]
Amber Grimes
And there's a lot of people around you all the time that are very out of control. And you really see it when you're in control.
- [36:51]
Jason Lee
Think about when you own Hollywood Unlocked and you're having a bad day because you went out and burnt out and now you're telling, you're seeing things and now you're driving the conversation that's driving thousands of people to talk about something. Like, it's also being more responsible with the platform that, you know, could change somebody's day or life. Because we have had to do things and say things because of what's happening in a way that has probably caused some of the reputational harm that I had early on. Right. Like, I, I love a lot of people and when I see some stories, I'd be like, ugh. Now, I know we can say this in a way that's not going to hit the way that it's going to hit, but it, you know, let's put it out. Well, now we're way more responsible, way more in tune, way more in control. And also we. We're way more thoughtful in how we approach stories and how we approach talent in our relationship management system is better than just it, like, let it fly and we'll deal with it later. Where we used to do that, now it's, you know, we will call and check in. Hey, you know, so and so this is out here, what's happening. We do try to make sure we're sharing their perspective. Yeah, of course, of course. Yeah. Because it's just the responsibility thing to do is disingenuous to have A relationship and then not really care when it benefits you. You know, that's. That's kind of crazy.
- [38:10]
Amber Grimes
Well, one, I want to say I'm proud of you.
- [38:12]
Jason Lee
Thank you.
- [38:12]
Amber Grimes
It gets easier as you go. I don't think about it. It's not even a thought about, do I want to have a drink or get drunk? No. But three years is amazing.
- [38:22]
Jason Lee
Yeah.
- [38:22]
Amber Grimes
And like, congratulations.
- [38:24]
Jason Lee
Thank you.
- [38:24]
Amber Grimes
And I'm very, I'm very happy for you to have the experience of control, clarity, and discipline.
- [38:31]
Jason Lee
Yeah. I'd have been that vice mayor on the news. And, you know, when you're elected, you. It hits different, you know, like I could make shade room and neighborhood talk right now. I can hit complex. When you hit. When you're an elected official, you hit that news that. You hit that news in a different way where they're like breaking news. I don't ever want that. I don't want it. You know, when I drive, even if, when I'm home and I'm driving, I see the police, I'm over the police department, over the city, I still am looking at them like, don't pull me over. My tags are good. I don't want no smoke. Because that, that idea of having a mug shot. As a elected official, you are very
- [39:09]
Amber Grimes
thoughtful, very mindful, your future. And I think that that is what's missing sometimes for our young 20 year olds that are just having a good time.
- [39:19]
Jason Lee
Yeah.
- [39:19]
Amber Grimes
You're gonna grow up.
- [39:20]
Jason Lee
Yes.
- [39:21]
Amber Grimes
And I want everybody to have a wonderful time. I had a wonderful time. You need to be thoughtful always that you're gonna make it to your 30s, you're gonna. And some people don't believe that they will. If you're gonna make it to your 30s, you're gonna make it to your 40s, gonna make it to your 50s. Who do you. Who do you want to be? What do you want to do? Like you said, ask yourself. Why? Because I hear you now saying I'm this type of vice mayor, but I ain't that type of vice mayor.
- [39:46]
Jason Lee
And I have a friend right now who's, you know, he's late 20s, not late late, but, you know, mid to late 20s. And he's figured out what he wants to do. He's an athlete and he loves to party. So when we go out, I'll let everybody come out. I'll get the bottles for people to drink who are drinking. And he loves to get wasted. And the next day I'll just be like, like, okay, I don't want to be an enabler while I'm getting you drunk all the time. But, like, why do you feel you need to get drunk all the time? Like, I used to be that person. So I want you to come out, have a good time, but I also want you to come to brunch or come just hang out at the crib, like. Or just go. Go over here with us, but you don't. Why are you doing that all the time? Now? He's very. I'm not going to get drunk. I'm gonna have one drink.
- [40:31]
Starbucks Advertiser
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- [40:32]
Jason Lee
So I see the influence I'm using back to influence and the responsibility of it. I do see the influence I'm having on people. And I'm telling. Look, I'm not telling you. You have to be sober like me. I ran that ran its course for me. You're still in your process and having a good time in your 20s. I had a great time in my 20s, but just be. If. If I had known better, then I would be more responsible. And so I could see it happening in a way where I'm not forcing him to do it or judging him for do. I'm just saying, like, as a friend should, like, why are you doing all that? You know?
- [41:00]
Amber Grimes
Yeah, I mean, I. Sometimes that's all it takes is like one friend to. To ask you a thoughtful question. It's not judgment. It's not, you know, this is what's going to happen. You have no idea what's going to. What someone's future holds. But I don't know that There's a lot of people that are surrounding themselves with people that are holding them accountable or willing to ask them, have you ever thought about this?
- [41:20]
Jason Lee
But it's okay to let your friends know you care about them. You know, like, just hanging out with me because my credit card is never going to get declined doesn't show me that you actually, actually care about me. Like, when you're around me and you say, I think you just hurt that person's feelings, or, you know that fan that wanted a photo, you know, my friend was over there, he'll tell me, do you ever see how you, like, look at people sometimes? And I'm like, shut up. I'm. I'm always nice, what the fuck you talking about? And he's like that. But then, you know, one time we were in the elevator and, you know, I was having a bad day, and this person was waiting to tell me that they wanted to cook for me. And I was like, okay. So I got there, they saw this person right here, said that they want to cook for you. And I said, I don't today's and I'm not having a good day. I don't want to talk. And I got in the elevator and I was kind of looking down and the person got in the elevator and it was real quiet and everybody was just hoping that nobody's saying anything. And she goes, oh my God, I can't wait. I want to cook for you. And the door open. I said no, and I just walked out. And then I felt bad when I did that because it was like, like literally it was so quiet in there that I know that person built up a lot of courage to say, I want to cook for you. And it was a nice gesture. I want to cook for you. And I was having my moment being whatever, still in my drinking phase, but I wasn't drinking that day. And I just. As soon as the door opened and they go, I really want to cook for you. And I just turned and said no. And I just walked out and that was it. And I didn't even look back. I then went back and apologized and was like, you know, sorry about that, and then found out it was my friend's mom. I'm like, oh my God, this is really bad. So I had to call him and apologize. Anyway, so I've learned and I have good friends around me who constantly check me because we all are going to have a bad day. Not not drinking or not. We're just all going to have a bad day. Especially when you're an entrepreneur or you're in a relationship or you're in pursuit of a relationship, you're going to have a bad day. It just doesn't give you license to make somebody else have a bad day.
- [43:13]
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- [43:19]
Jason Lee
I can't stop scratching my downtown. Mm, yeah, but I'm not itching to go downtown and tell a receptionist I'm here to talk about my downtown. Some things you'd rather type than say out loud.
- [43:33]
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- [46:44]
Amber Grimes
I don't know if this is a new thing, but you're very good at holding yourself accountable or hearing your friends when they're holding you accountable.
- [46:52]
Jason Lee
I'm not. Oh, I'm not perfect at holding myself accountable. I have people. I will hold myself accountable sometimes, but I have everybody around me holds me accountable in their own way. They know. Like I know when I have hit the asshole stage in any conversation. My publicity team. I know when I've hit the asshole wall. I'll give you an example. My last publicity firm that I was with, there was this one person that I had on my team that I really, really liked. I think we took a trip to Stockton. This is when I was living in LA and I was going to Stockton for an event or something. We had got a jet, flew up there or whatever, and I was a complete asshole. That person quit my team. When we got back, I said, well, where'd that person go? I was like, damn, I really liked her. But I had lost that person. I have. There are moments where I've lost things because of. Of how I've behaved and it will rein me back in. Or there were people who. They know how to ask certain questions. And it reminds me of when I worked with Ye. Ye had nobody around him but me. And maybe one other person that would say, like, you can't talk like that. You can't act like that. That's not cool, you know? And I always tell people out of everybody he dealt with, he only disrespected me one time. We only had to have that conversation one time. But I saw that I had to hold him accountable because there was nobody else holding him accountable. I never want to be that. And I'm not shading him. I'm just saying you get to a level of success, fame, fortune, influence, impact. And it's like, I don't want to be away from that because that, that I need to gravitate towards that so I can get some of it. No, I want people around me who said, I will leave if you act like this, or I will not be around you if you're going to behave that way or treat people like that. And I have friends that do that.
- [48:37]
Martha Stewart
Yeah.
- [48:38]
Amber Grimes
And you, you've said a couple of times here, which I also respect that you've said, okay, cool. My friends have hold me accountable. Somebody told me, and I apologize. Everybody can't turn their ego down for that. What does that look like for you to balance that ego out and say, you know what? I need to.
- [48:55]
Jason Lee
Life will sit your ass down. What you talking about? What I've said life will. Life with you. I always joke around. And this is the thing. I think people that don't know me, when you do get to know me, you're going to see. You come to my homes. All I'm playing is gospel music. Most of the time we're referencing some Bible scripture. I always say, touch not my anointed, do my prophets no harm. And I always say it to my colleagues at the council because they all failing. Like, you just lost this, you lost that. You over here, you know, you know, ran out of Olympic things ain't working out for you. It's because you. You trying to do his prophet harm. You're intentionally trying to hurt me. You. You and, and, and my friends will tell you it ain't even like voodoo. It's literally manifestation of God. I will literally say something. I'm at a party in Miami. True story party. I look at the clock, it's 4 o'. Clock. I'm tired. I'm over it. We leave the party, we get in the car, we driving down the street. I'm like, man, Rihanna's not this before. We were friend friends. She ain't responding to my dm. Why I'm out here looking. She ain't responding to my dm. I don't have her number. She ain't responding. She respond. I'm like, I want some Doritos. At four in the morning? Walgreens. Let's go in here and get some Doritos. I pull in the parking lot, I got a truck full of people. I tell, my friend was over there and another friend, can you go in and get some Doritos? I'll wait in the car. They go in, they're like, rihanna's in here. Swear to God. I'm like, what? There's no way. There's nobody else in this Walgreens but Rihanna and Rocky and their security. Nobody. So I walk in, I'm like, really? This is how I gotta find you? That's how we became locked in. That happens to me all the time. I had a dream the other night, and I'm not going to get into the dream, but it was a really bad nightmare. And I woke up and I told my friend, like, this is the nightmare I had. Later that day, the thing connected to the nightmare happened. So I really feel like when I say touch not my anointed do my prophets no harm. That's really real. When I say, warning comes before destruction, I repeatedly say it over and over. I tell people, warning comes before destruction. Watch. And then the next thing, something critical happens. And that's because I really feel like I'm walking to my purpose. I really feel like I am connected literally to the source of every blessing I've gotten, every bad thing that's happened. Brother getting murdered. Tragedy. Would I be where I am right now without that experience? Probably not. Because that gave me purpose. That. That showed me, like, I can survive. That showed me that, like, I know what the. The worst feeling in the world feels like. I know what it feels like. There's nothing anybody can do or take for me. That's gonna ever make me feel that. So. Never. There's nothing. No. No. There's nobody else on earth that can die right now that will make me feel that. Because since I felt that level of pain and survived it, I, like, know what it's going to feel like. So I'm prepared for it. I know I'm going to survive it. And I know that for a while it's going to be weird or hurtful and awkward or whatever, and it's not going to ever be the same. But you will be fine. My faith is something that I'm. That I. That I stay true to my book. God must have forgotten about me is a testament of the fact that God has not forgotten about you. You. He's literally showing you what trials, tribulations and triumph is faith over fear. He's showing you. You're going to go through. Sorry, God, but if you just stay steadfast in your faith and focus, you're going to be okay. And. And throwing the drink be okay. Mama on drugs and foster care. I'm gonna be okay, brother. Laying here dead. I'm gonna be okay. Whether I win another election ever in my life or not. I did it already. I'm good. When I sell Hollywood Unlocked, if it's a billion dollars or 500 million or 2 million, that was what God wanted me to get. Now I'm going to keep going in pursuit of whatever it is that I feel like I'm supposed to be doing. But I ain't going to be broke and famous. That is never going to be. I'm never going to be broke again. I'm sorry. Ain't no way I can't be broke.
- [52:42]
Amber Grimes
Is fame required to be influential? Or can you start with the goal of being influential?
- [52:52]
Jason Lee
So one of my friends is Robert F. Smith. Do you remember when that guy paid all those students?
- [52:59]
Amber Grimes
Yes.
- [52:59]
Jason Lee
Okay, that's Robert F. Smith. So he's not famous. As if he walked in the room and sat down right here, you'd be like, I know who that is. But he's highly influential. He's at Davos with all the millionaire billionaires of the world, all the world leaders. He is the second wealthiest black man in the country. So yeah, you can be influence influential. You can go to a graduation, give a speech and pay off everybody's student loans. That's influence. You can just. He just had HBCU fest where he's always uplifting black voices, black culture. He's invested in earn your leisure, created a space for them with their conference. He's heavily invested in black Kim, Richie Liu, me. We're all connected in the sense that we're all trying to drive real influence and power for black culture and black people and black voices. Right. But he's not famous. I look at him online sometimes, like, okay, you know, you're making the cute videos and all that, but are you doing that like Drew Ski? So that way people say he needs to be on Netflix because Drew Ski started out with the sketches and comedy, and now he's. He's dominating culture right now in his lane. And so, yeah, I think that you don't have to have fame to get influence, but if you want fame, know what you want it for and build the influence. Build that in order to have influence. Because when Drew Ski's done, you know, doing what he's doing now, he may want to be behind the camera, but you have to have the influence of moving the industry and people seeing your value. Tyler Perry started out as Medea in the plays, and then he became the owner of the largest studio in the business. And he's Tyler Perry now. So he. I don't think he wanted to be Madea to be famous. I think he wanted to build a successful tour in the Bible Belt and take those people on a journey with him. And now look where he is. Number one show on Netflix.
- [54:42]
Amber Grimes
Can you talk about the importance of ownership? It obviously is something very important to you. And I'm not sure that that message comes across all the time. Even when someone is just making skits or just doing something for fun, that there has to be a point then where you care that you own something.
- [55:01]
Jason Lee
At the end of the day, people say, oh, you need to own something so you could pass it on. I ain't have no kids. I ain't even going to get foster kids. I can't pass this on to my dog folks. So I'm not building something to pass on, per se. I just don't like people telling me what to do. And I don't like people telling me the limits of what I'm able to do. And I like being able to do what I move to do. And in order to do that, you have to be in control of your own thing, even if you are. And I always say to my friends, like some of them who have had successful careers working at institutions they don't own, you're doing all that to build their bottom line. Even if you make 5 million a year doing it, when they're done with you, that 5 million is over, and you got to Go find your next 5 million. So your lifestyle is going to be predicated on what they want to feed you. So you can do that. And I understand doing it, but. But why not do it to save up to go and build your own thing? Because when you realize you really don't need nobody, all you got to do is put your head down, find a good team, work your ass off, stay dedicated to it. And, And. And that foundation, once you built the floor and then you start building the walls, all of a sudden, damn you In a skyscraper. You didn't even know because you was so far in the work that you looked up. And now you in the penthouse looking down at Wendy or whoever. Whoever that person is. Y' all can edit this shit later. I'm just saying, power of ownership critical. Now, I say that knowing I have employees watching my interviews, right? But I also tell them, how far do you want to go? Because I'm going to keep elevating. So now that I'm getting in production, now that I'm getting into acquisitions, do you see yourself as the director of digital or do you see somebody. Do you see yourself as the vice president of digital? Do you see yourself as somebody who. Director of digital or. Now are we building a joint venture to go out and create documentaries? So what are we doing? I'm open to partnering with my team and helping them get their own. And right now I'm looking at equity in this thing that I'm building. And for some of those have been with me from the beginning. Because I feel like you built this from the ground up with me. You deserve to eat too. And that is why I think God's going to keep blessing me. Because I don't need to be the only billionaire. I do want to be a billionaire, because being a millionaire is lonely. It's like this. Just. I want to be in the billionaire boys club, you know, And I want everybody to get it. So. But ownership, man, is freedom. It really is truly freedom. And. And I feel like we all got the hot sauce. We just gotta turn the noise down. Stop tiktoking all day long, maybe a couple hours. You're gonna do it. Structure your time, compartmentalize your time. But, like, what documentaries are you watching? Go back and watch Warren Buffett's documentary. I learned a lot from that, you know, start learning from other people. I watched Charlamagne, what he's been able to do. And then I look at other people who are trying to do what Charlamagne is. Like. You're not authentic because you try and do what Charlamagne did. What is your thing? So, yeah, ownership is important.
- [57:49]
Amber Grimes
I love that. And the people that you name, because you're all of the audacity and the confidence that you have is because nobody
- [57:58]
Jason Lee
can tell you what to do, not even Charlamagne. I'd be talking shit to him, too. I love Charlamagne, though. But we talk in a way where I look up to him, and I love the fact that I've gone from somebody who's looked up to Charlamagne and now I'm his peer and there's mutual respect. I'm not submissive to Charlamagne. He's not to me. We share ideas, we share disagreements, we share resources, and it's not competitive. I celebrate him when he wins. He celebrates me when I win. That truly is what black excellence is, where you're not looking at somebody and saying, man, I don't want that person to be better than me. And I will say, I feel in our culture, we do a really good job of going, I want everybody to win, but I don't want them to win more than me. And we do shit to institutionalize obstructing people from making it. And that's why I look at a lot of people now and I'm like, damn, I could help you, but I'm going to let you starve because I watched how you let me starve. I watched how you intentionally try to stop me. So I'm not going to be the better person to help you. I'm actually going to watch you start, but I'm going to go help the person over there that literally needs me. And it's not a negative thing. It's just, this is your karma or this is your lesson, and hopefully you learn from it and do better next time.
- [59:10]
Amber Grimes
Absolutely.
- [59:11]
Jason Lee
The Bible said, when you know better, you do better. See Scripture.
- [59:14]
Amber Grimes
So you talked about the power of ownership, but you have an incredible partnership coming up with bet.
- [59:22]
Jason Lee
Yes.
- [59:23]
Amber Grimes
Talk to me about that. What can we expect from the Jason Lee show on bet?
- [59:27]
Jason Lee
So the lesson, two lessons I learned. Let's go back to when I first decided I wanted to do what Wendy did. I want a talk show. This was years ago. I go to Queen Latifah and I'm like, I want a talk show. I don't even have Hollywood unlocked. At the time, Queen Latifah's company, Sha Kim, and at the time, Shelby Stone. Yanley's over there now, but Shelby Stone. I mean, we went and pitched a show that it was. I think it was Jason Lee's show. I probably may have been Jason Lee show. We pitched it to bet. This was so far ago. This was Robbie, Reed, Laritha, and I forgot who else was in the room. Well, they didn't see it. They were like, like, have you ever done a show before? I was like, no. Do you have a tape? No. Okay, well, so, like, why are you ready for the show? I'm like, cause I'm Jason Lee. Like, what do you mean I wasn't ready? So they didn't. They said no. Then we went over to Revolt, pitched it to Andre Harrell. He was like, this ain't what we do. I'm like, okay. So then fast forward. Years later, I've been on Revolt and now I'm at bet. So the lesson, first lesson was don't ever give up. Don't ever give up in pursuit of whatever it is you're doing. Because now I'm on the network that I first started, before all of it, where I wanted to go. So. And I'm grateful for that. The second part is what I told BET when they did the deal. I ain't going to change, so get ready. You're going to get phone calls, you're going to get complaints. People are going to be happy. And there are still conversations where I'm like, yo, I don't know why the legal wants to look at what I'm doing, because you can see it when it airs like, this is. This is what it is. But there's such a respect there that they trust me. And BET has said, we don't want you to be nobody. But Jason, the deciding factor for me was in the trajectory of supporting black creators. BET is launching a creator studio for black creators. So I'm like, yo, this is aligned with a bigger purpose. You know, it's not about more money, more marketing. There's more marketing, but it's about, like, who else can come along with me? Not behind me, along with me to have a platform to create. And that falls in line with what I have been standing for. So that was the deciding factor. And you know, me and Lemio, we on the phone talking about what else we going to create together. Because he has the Impact Awards with which is coming up and this year is gonna be bigger than ever. And so I love the fact that I'm able to partner with him and a black creator and now be at BET with Lewis and Orchid and the new team over there that's taking BET in the direction that we all, as people of color needed to go.
- [61:48]
Amber Grimes
You said that somebody asked you this question. I'm gonna ask you this last question to close it out today. What does Jason Lee give a fuck about?
- [62:00]
Jason Lee
Okay. Right when you said that, I started feeling a little emotional. I will say the kids in Stockton, like, it's crazy looking at kids who, like, are literally where I was as a kid. Mom is struggling, father's not there, violence and chaos around them, lack of opportunity or a disinvested community that they live in. And I'm like, damn. Like, I know where I am right now. I know where I'm at in life. I've met presidents and I've traveled the world, and I've seen things. I've been on private planes and, you know, and. And I've done all the things that. That I want to do. And I'm, like, looking at these kids sometimes who have this look in their face, like they don't see it, that I care about. That. That's the thing that makes me go, you know, I'm gonna go to City hall and deal with these motherfuckers today. Like, I don't want you. Like, damn, I don't want to see none of these people. A couple of my colleagues, I do. But, like, I don't even want to. But that, to me, is. It's reminding me. And I was at a school the other day talking to these kids, and they were out doing the Day of Action, but they weren't calling it Cesar Chavez because of what's happening right now with them saying about the sex assault and all that. But these kids, mostly Latino, and I said to them, today is a great day because you're learning how to use your voice. I just want you to remember, throughout your whole life, don't never let nobody tell you your voice don't matter. And they got it. So, like, that, to me is like, that's. I give a about that. I don't spend my time going to a bunch of events, speaking at a lot of things, taking a lot of pictures with people. But I tell people, if it has something to do with motivating kids, inspiring kids, helping to elevate the life of a child, I will do that. Because, you know, there weren't a lot of people that did that for me.
- [63:44]
Amber Grimes
So really, really cool, Amazing.
- [63:47]
Jason Lee
Like, give a fuck about Rihanna, too into that woman, that piece of shit woman. That piece of shit woman that shot up her house. Who shoots up Rihanna's house anyway?
- [63:55]
Amber Grimes
That Rihanna should be on all of our lists, right? What do we give a fuck about but no, I do just want to make sure I give you your flowers. 1. You practice everything that you preach. The same way that you just said you could help somebody else. You coming onto my platform, you didn't have to do that. And I am deeply grateful.
- [64:13]
Jason Lee
Amber's the boss. Let me tell you something. Amber being. She got an airport hookup, y', all, I'm gonna just put her out there real quick. When I saw Amber was in this little luxury department. What is that thing? I don't even know what it's called. Yes. P.S. none of you know it because we can't afford it. It's the thing. She's in this thing where, like, she don't even gotta. She drives up, hangs out in the suite, eats good food, gets walked to the plane. I'm like, yo, I need that. I aspire to be that. So now when I saw you on doing this thing, I'm like, well, she's doing her thing. I gotta pull up. By the way, you have great skin.
- [64:43]
Amber Grimes
Thank you.
- [64:44]
Jason Lee
Yeah, you kind of look like Sza a little bit. Do people tell you that?
- [64:47]
Amber Grimes
Yes.
- [64:47]
Jason Lee
I know. I'll tell sis now. Oh, yeah. I can see it evolves with every artist. Maybe this podcast need to be on tde. They got both of them, you know. But no, of course, I had to pull up and support. I love supporting people who are like, the real deal. I've always found you to be the real deal and always, you know, kept it real with me. So thank you.
- [65:07]
Amber Grimes
Well, I respect this industry. I respect the media industry. I respect what you've done for it. So I just want to do my best. And it is so refreshing to be in a pivot state and to have somebody that I respect in the business support, because that is not always the experience that you get when you're doing anything.
- [65:25]
Jason Lee
Of course.
- [65:25]
Amber Grimes
Even if you've been doing it for years. And so it means everything, and I'm proud of your growth. I'm going to celebrate every day, month or year that you want to of your sobriety, because I'm super proud of that too. And I can't wait to watch you on BET and all of your Jason Lee.
- [65:40]
Jason Lee
Thank you. Can you tell some of Walker to unblock me, though? Because, I mean, you got her number. Summer, stop playing. You know, I fuck with you. Summer, summer, summer, spring, winter, fall. Okay, Unblock the damn Instagram. We cool? I love Summer Walker. I'm like, what did my team do to Summer? But, no, I just appreciate you all your success. She got a man. Y' all. I met her, man, a minute ago. I don't got nobody. Well, not nobody permanent, but I still check my DMs so they can't find me over there. We will.
- [66:10]
Amber Grimes
You come back here and I'll get your life together with relationships, if that's what you need.
- [66:14]
Jason Lee
That's where I live, you know? I don't know. Today I want one. Tomorrow, probably not.
- [66:18]
Amber Grimes
A lot of people leave this house and be ending up getting engaged and stuff.
- [66:22]
Jason Lee
So we got my ring fingers empty. Let's do it.
- [66:25]
Amber Grimes
Silly. Jason, I appreciate you and shout out to your team. Thank you guys so much for making this happen. All right, if you knew better, your goal would be to be influential, not famous, period.
- [66:37]
Jason Lee
Ain't nothing worse than being famous and broke. I'm telling you, I've seen it. It's horrible. Jesus. Especially if you can't get your edges done. Wow. What? Or a lineup.
- [66:47]
Amber Grimes
Let the people rest.
- [66:48]
Jason Lee
Anyway, good night, y'. All.
- [66:49]
Amber Grimes
Good night. If you Knew Better with Amber Grimes, a production of the Black Effect Podcast Network. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Connect with Amber Grimes at ambergrimes on all platforms and make sure you subscribe for future episodes of if youf Knew Better with Amber Grimes.
- [67:09]
Podcast Announcer
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- [70:09]
Podcast Announcer
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [70:12]
Jason Lee
Guaranteed Human.