INTERVIEW: Devale & Khadeen Ellis On Vulnerability, Connecting With Their Audience, Role-play Disasters + More

Summary

The Breakfast Club Podcast Summary Episode: INTERVIEW: Devale & Khadeen Ellis On Vulnerability, Connecting With Their Audience, Role-play Disasters + More
Release Date: May 5, 2025
Hosts: DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne Tha God
Guests: Devale & Khadeen Ellis
Transcript Highlights: [01:04] – [41:53]

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1. Rebranding from Dead Ass Podcast to Ellis Ever After

[01:45] Charlamagne Tha God: "We rebranded the Dead Ass podcast to Ellis Ever After. Let's discuss the growth of that title."

Devale and Kadeen Ellis delve into the reasons behind their podcast's rebranding. Initially, the Dead Ass Podcast focused on sparking conversations around gender dynamics and what husbands and wives feel. Over six years, recognizing the rise and sometimes divisiveness of the "men vs. women" debates online, they sought a fresh direction that emphasized positivity and progressive discussions.

Kadeen Ellis explains, "Ellis Ever After is the change, because this is us after we've evolved as humans. Going to therapy, working on being a better couple, working on being better people."

They also highlight their efforts to address critical issues like black maternal health, citing their 2017 vlog of their third son's home birth, which coincided with a rise in home births within the Black community. This initiative demonstrated their platform's influence in offering alternative perspectives and options to young Black women.

Devale Ellis adds, "We want to keep doing what we've been doing for 23 years, almost 15 married. People have literally watched us over the past maybe a decade on social media, just putting our life out there, sharing with people, hoping people can relate."

2. Evolution and Impact of the Podcast

The Ellis brothers reflect on the growth and reception of their podcast. Initially facing pushback for openly discussing personal and marital issues, they persevered, emphasizing the importance of vulnerability and honest communication.

Kadeen Ellis shares, "In the beginning, it was so much pushback. People thought Deval was arrogant or an asshole because he was an educated Black man speaking about his emotions." Over time, their transparency has normalized discussions around mental health and emotional expression, especially among Black men, fostering a more open and accepting community.

They acknowledge the positive feedback from listeners who credit the podcast with saving marriages and encouraging couples to communicate more effectively. This affirmation reinforces the brothers' commitment to their mission of inspiring and uplifting their audience through honest dialogue.

Devale Ellis: "People say you guys have saved my marriage, or you've showed me that I'm able to open up to my partner and bring up these topics that are once taboo or uncomfortable to discuss."

3. Personal Growth and Communication in Marriage

A significant portion of the interview focuses on the Ellis brothers' personal journey in fostering a strong marital relationship through effective communication. Kadeen narrates a pivotal moment when he realized the need for vulnerability:

[10:03] Kadeen Ellis: "The first five years of our marriage was terrible... I couldn't tell her how I felt... one day, she was pregnant, and after a heated argument, I asked, 'Why don't you just tell me what you're going through?'"

This heartfelt revelation led to a profound transformation in their relationship. From that point forward, they committed to open and honest conversations, ensuring that both partners felt heard and understood without judgment or resentment.

Kadeen Ellis: "From that moment on, whenever I feel something, we sit down and talk. We make a decision that we’re not going to argue about it, and we’re not going to harbor resentment if we don’t agree."

They emphasize the importance of choosing each day to be present and communicative with each other, reinforcing their dedication to maintaining a healthy and supportive marriage.

4. Handling Disagreements in Front of Children

The Ellis brothers discuss their approach to managing disagreements within the household, especially in front of their children. Contrary to many parents who prefer to shield their kids from conflicts, the Ellises adopt a transparent method that teaches empathy and respect.

Kadeen Ellis: "If we disagree on something and the kids are there, we have a discussion. I explain to Jackson, 'See how I spoke to your mom? You see how I didn’t have to be disrespectful?'"

This strategy not only models healthy conflict resolution but also instills values of empathy and understanding in their children. By addressing disagreements calmly and respectfully, they demonstrate that it's possible to handle conflicts without damaging relationships.

Devale Ellis: "We’re trying to find where to have a comic. It's important for our kids to see that while disagreements are natural, they don’t have to lead to disrespect or resentment."

5. Relationship with Extended Family and In-Laws

A notable segment of the conversation centers around the Ellis brothers' relationships with their in-laws and extended family, highlighting the challenges and rewards of building connections across different cultural backgrounds.

Kadeen Ellis recounts a transformative experience with his father, which deepened his understanding and respect for his parents:

[15:26] Kadeen Ellis: "Two months ago, my dad stayed with us to help with the boys. We had a three-hour conversation where he shared his fears and worries... I saw my father as a human for the first time, not just as the disciplinarian I knew growing up."

This newfound perspective fostered a more open and communicative relationship with his father, breaking down long-standing barriers and promoting mutual understanding.

Similarly, navigating his relationship with his West Indian mother-in-law required patience and empathy. Through open conversations about their differing cultural backgrounds and experiences, Kadeen was able to build a strong alliance with her.

Kadeen Ellis: "By putting my wall down and understanding her experiences, I was able to see her as my biggest ally in the household."

6. Balancing Public Persona with Private Life

The Ellis brothers address the complexities of maintaining authenticity in a world where their personal lives are under constant public scrutiny. They emphasize the importance of distinguishing between their public content and private matters.

Kadeen Ellis: "There's nothing to keep up. We're not trending on something or performing for an audience. We're just recording and putting out our life."

They discuss the challenges of dealing with unsolicited opinions and projections from listeners who may not fully understand the nuances of their relationship. By staying true to their values and intentions, they mitigate the impact of negative feedback.

Kadeen Ellis: "I don't let someone else's projection define my day. I know what my intentions are, and I focus on that."

7. Role-Play Disasters and Maintaining Humor in Marriage

Towards the latter part of the interview, the conversation takes a lighter turn as Kadeen and Devale share amusing anecdotes about their attempts at role-playing to keep their marriage lively.

One such story involves a miscommunication during a role-play scenario intended to spice up their relationship. Kadeen recalls requesting a specific scenario, only for Devale to surprise him with an unexpected twist involving a leotard and missing accessories.

[32:06] Devale Ellis: "I said, 'Dusty.' That's not what he wanted."

Despite the initial frustration, the couple found humor in the situation, reinforcing their ability to laugh together even when plans go awry. This ability to find joy and laughter in their relationship challenges highlights the importance of maintaining a sense of humor and flexibility within a marriage.

Kadeen Ellis: "We sat there, we picked the shoes up, then we got... it was just like, yo. Yeah. We started laughing after that."

8. Addressing Public Misconceptions and Building Empathy

The Ellises discuss how societal perceptions often misjudge Black families in the public eye. They acknowledge that many people may not see the full picture of their relationship and may project their own experiences and biases onto them.

Kadeen Ellis: "If someone grew up never seeing a positive Black family and all they’ve seen is despair and violence, when they see us on Instagram, they can't believe it's real."

Understanding this, the brothers cultivate empathy towards their audience, recognizing that their authentic representation can challenge stereotypes and inspire others to seek healthy relationship dynamics.

Devale Ellis: "Our podcast can open up intergenerational healing by encouraging conversations that were previously taboo, and that helps our community as a whole."

9. Encouraging Thoughtful Communication and Reducing Noise in Public Discussions

In response to the pervasive nature of social media and the rush to form opinions, Devale and Kadeen introduce a new segment in their rebranded podcast called "OP or No OP" (Opinion or No Opinion). This initiative encourages listeners to discern when they have the knowledge and expertise to form an opinion versus when it's better to refrain from commenting.

[26:31] Kadeen Ellis: "Do you have an opinion about this matter, or do you not?"

By promoting thoughtful and informed discussions, they aim to reduce unnecessary noise and foster a culture of meaningful dialogue.

Kadeen Ellis: "We’re trying to push forward, thinking to myself, do I have the facts to be able to comment on something and have an opinion? Or can I just let some things go?"

10. Conclusion and Final Insights

As the interview wraps up, Charlamagne Tha God commends the Ellises for their commitment to personal growth and effective communication within their marriage. He highlights the valuable lessons their relationship offers to listeners striving to build strong, honest, and supportive partnerships.

Charlamagne Tha God: "Growing as individuals is a lot by itself, but growing as a couple is insanity. If you're not constantly communicating, you might wake up one day and not know who that person is."

Devale and Kadeen express gratitude for the platform, acknowledging how their appearances on "The Breakfast Club" have allowed them to inspire and influence their audience positively.

Kadeen Ellis: "The Breakfast Club is inspiring people. I hope y'all know that. We appreciate y'all, man. This has been a part of our lives living here."

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• [01:45] Charlamagne Tha God: "We rebranded the Dead Ass podcast to Ellis Ever After. Let's discuss the growth of that title."

• [02:48] Kadeen Ellis: "We want to put out content that people can say, let's elevate and move forward."

• [04:43] Lauren LaRosa: "You guys were so honest about this. The first time I saw a young Black couple that was still, like, regular."

• [10:03] Kadeen Ellis: "The first five years of our marriage was terrible... I couldn’t tell her how I felt."

• [15:26] Kadeen Ellis: "Two months ago, my dad stayed with us to help with the boys. We had a three-hour conversation."

• [22:35] Kadeen Ellis: "Are you ready?"

• [26:31] Kadeen Ellis: "Do you have an opinion about this matter, or do you not?"

• [40:58] Charlamagne Tha God: "Growing as individuals is a lot by itself, but growing as a couple is insanity."

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Conclusion

Devale and Kadeen Ellis provide a profound exploration of vulnerability, effective communication, and personal growth within marriage. Their journey from the Dead Ass Podcast to Ellis Ever After exemplifies their dedication to fostering meaningful conversations that resonate with their audience. By sharing their triumphs and challenges openly, they inspire listeners to prioritize honesty and empathy in their relationships, ultimately contributing to healthier and more supportive communities.

Transcript

[DJ Envy]

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[Jess Hilarious]

Panoramic moonroof, ambient lighting, Bose and massaging leather appointed seats are optional features.

[Carlos Miller]

Taking control of your career is empowering. Just don't tell my boss I said that. Just kidding. I am the boss. This is Carlos Miller from the 85 South Show. And building a career isn't just about a job. It's about creating a path that impacts our community and future generations. Whether you're starting out or even making big moves, State Farm is here to support you with resources to help protect what you're working hard to achieve. They've got your back every step of the way. Because like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Find out more@state farm.com Wake that ass.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Up in the morning.

[Kadeen Ellis]

The Breakfast Club.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yep, it's the world's most dangerous morning show. The Breakfast Club. Charlamagne the God. Just hilarious. Envy is out, but Lauren LaRosa is in. And we got some special guests. Dval and Kadeen Ellis are here. Good morning, my people.

[Devale Ellis]

What's up, man?

[Kadeen Ellis]

How's everything?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I'm blessed, black and highly favorite. How y'all feeling?

[Devale Ellis]

I love that.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Feeling good.

[Devale Ellis]

Happy to be back, back home. It's a glow that I feel like I have the minute I hit LaGuardia Airport. It's just being back home in Brooklyn, I feel like it brings us to life again.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You miss New York for real?

[Devale Ellis]

I do, yeah, I do.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Not enough to move back.

[Devale Ellis]

Not enough to move back, sure. Well, yeah, I come and get my little fix, you know, and get my bacon, egg and cheese. What I got to get and I get back.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

There you go. There you go. Now y'all are here for a bunch of different things, but y'all rebranded the Dead Ass podcast to Ellis Ever After. Let's discuss. Discuss the growth of that title.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah, well, it was a lot for us when we first started deadass Podcast. It was just, you know, it was like we were joking about men versus women and what husbands feel versus wives feel. But over the course of six years. We watched how that kind of exploded on the Internet. And we don't want to take credit for being a reason why there's a man versus woman debate, but the shit is annoying. And we kind of just feel like we want to put out content that people can say, let's elevate and move forward. So let's talk about topics that really affect us. For example, we. We will take credit for this. In 2017, we vlogged our third son being born at home, Right? And we vlogged the whole process for about six months. And a new study came out that, as in of 2018, home births in black community have gone up. And we feel like that's a direct correlation for us, showing young black girls like there's a different option. And the reason why that happened was because with our first child, we almost lost K. She had to have 24 stitches.

[Devale Ellis]

27.

[Kadeen Ellis]

My bad. Let me not take my washcloth.

[Devale Ellis]

We had babies. We know what it is. But no, you're right.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah. She had to have emergency surgery right after pregnancy. And we did a lot of studies on black maternal health, and we was like, let's just use our platform to focus on positivity. So we said, ellis ever after is the change, because this is us after we've evolved as humans. Going to therapy, worked on being a better couple, working on being a better people. So that's what it's about.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So it had nothing to do with moving out of New York and not even using the term dead ass no more?

[Devale Ellis]

No, we still used to use it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

We still use that.

[Devale Ellis]

We sure did. We sure did. And the crazy part about it, we had to fight for the name Deadass initially because, you know, if you're not from New York and if you're at the companies that have, you know, mostly white folks, that's just like, we don't know what that means. How will we ever get ad dollars behind a name like that? They're not going to subscribe to that. So there was a lot of explaining that had to be done, but we. We stayed true to it. I think part of us really didn't want to detach from that New York Persona for a long time, but it's been. It's time.

[Jess Hilarious]

I do like Ellis Ever After. The who. Who. Who made that up collectively or who. That was you.

[Devale Ellis]

It was.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I'll take credit for it. But we always do everything collective, even dead ass. Like, we sit down and we like, what you think about this? What you think about that? We had a couple Other options. We also liked House of Ellis, but we liked Ellis Ever after, because it was the evolution of. After what? After all the bullshit. You know what I'm saying? After all the talking about what we had to do to get to this point and if. If you ever followed us. That's what we're known for. We're honest about what we've been doing, what we've done. We don't hold back.

[Devale Ellis]

So we want to keep doing what. 23 years in the game, almost 15 married. You know, people have literally watched us over the past maybe, what, decade?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah.

[Devale Ellis]

On social media. Just putting our life out there, sharing with people, you know, hoping people can relate.

[Jess Hilarious]

Y'all are definitely the roughest point for a lot of people, because even my son's dad, Rome. Oh, my God. My first done. My first son's dad, man, he. Man, you ain't. You gotta listen to what. This one was dead ass.

[Devale Ellis]

Like, y'all.

[Jess Hilarious]

And even y'all shows, he follows everything y'all do. And he has five kids by five different, you know, moms, you know, and he likes to. He'll listen to one of y'all podcasts, and he'll be calling him, telling him, no, no, no. Because with Devout and KAD said they. They was, you know, and wow, he gets hung up on a lot, creates a lot of arguments, but he ain't. He ain't the deville type.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I would love to know how wrong.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Can even.

[Jess Hilarious]

Just tell them. Listen to the podcast. Don't try to preach you ain't developed.

[Lauren LaRosa]

But it's right. Cause y'all real life, though. Like, y'all. The way y'all be going through stuff on y'all. I watch y'all channel a lot, the way y'all deal with stuff.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Y'all were.

[Lauren LaRosa]

The first time that I saw a young black couple that was still, like, regular. Like, yeah, regular. Like, y'all were so curated. And, like, I was like, oh, they probably hang where I would go at and stuff like that.

[Devale Ellis]

And we still do.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Devale Ellis]

We walk around and people be like, why y'all without security? Why y'all? And I'm like, cause this is my hood. Like, what you mean? You know, dead ass.

[Lauren LaRosa]

So Rome, dead ass. I felt like he could, like, relate to y'all, because that's, like, a big thing for your audience.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I will say this about Rome. Like, Deval now, wasn't the Deval when I first started.

[Jess Hilarious]

Okay.

[Kadeen Ellis]

The Deval when I first started was probably closer to Rome. I was. I don't know him But I was immature. I lacked emotional intelligence. I didn't understand. But I. I take pride in showing the growth because I don't want anyone to ever be like, I gotta be perfect to be accepted. Nah, fuck all that. I was never perfect. I'm not perfect. I may fuck up again. Hopefully y'all give me grace if I fuck up. You know what I'm saying? And that's what I want. People to walk around the earth feeling like, you don't gotta be perfect for people to just accept you. And if you expecting everybody to accept you, that's a problem anyway.

[Devale Ellis]

And to be honest, some people just.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Not gonna accept you.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah, no, to be honest, we almost just didn't do the podcast anymore. So last February, we had a bunch of live sold out shows. Apollo. It was like historic. It was great. So we're like, you know what? Why don't we go out on a high? You know, we did all we've done. I feel like we've spoken aloud, you know, dealt with our issues publicly as a form of therapy through the podcast. Right. And we felt like we've done all we had to do in the podcast space. And people literally like, you guys cannot do this. And to your point, we meet people on the regular, in the airport, random places, and they're like, y'all can't stop doing this because you have saved my marriage, or you've showed me that I'm able to open up to my partner and bring up these topics that are once taboo or uncomfortable to discuss. You know, and people say if they wanted to vow, you have to be a Kadeen and vice versa. So tell Rome. Make sure that he's on the straight and narrow. Exactly.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I think one thing that, that is great about what y'all do is it's just open lines of communication.

[Kadeen Ellis]

That's it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Now, regardless if you're in a. You want to start a podcast, that's what you should have with your partner. If y'all want to just sit in your living room every day and say, okay, we're going to talk for two hours, but we're going to talk. We may not record it and put it out, but we're going to talk. It's just about communication.

[Devale Ellis]

Encouraging that. Absolutely.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And you know what's funny? Most people when we first started the podcast, thought it was so crazy. Y'all talk to each other. And I'm like, we married. Like, we married. You talk about sex, you talk about money, you talk.

[Devale Ellis]

Or how, how could you talk to her like that? Like, people were Offended for me.

[Lauren LaRosa]

They used to be real upset.

[Kadeen Ellis]

They used to be real.

[Lauren LaRosa]

I remember they used to. Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Let me tell you.

[Lauren LaRosa]

They felt like you were, like, the super controlling, like, arrogant. This is all about me.

[Devale Ellis]

That was the farthest thing from it. But I had, from my perspective. But I get it right, And I.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Had to accept that, because you have to show people over time. Right. You can't expect people, when you first put something out, to say, know who I am.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

It took years. We did our podcast for seven years, 15 seasons. Won a Webby Award. But it took time. In the beginning, it was so much, like, pushback. Oh, devour. Arrogant. The val an asshole. He always talks down. But what I realized, they weren't used to seeing an educated black man speak about his emotions. And it triggered a lot of women. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's the fact, like, I'm not gonna sit back here and not say what I need and require, because I'm also gonna ask her what she needs and require, and I'm going to deliver on that. But now this is my turn to talk about it. And a lot of people didn't like it. But now it's come more normalized. Like I used to when we lived in New York, I heard Charlamagne every morning, talk about mental health. My sons now know about mental health. It's not taboo anymore. And they speak their feelings. Mom, I don't feel good about this. I'm nervous about that. And we want to keep showing young men, like, that's okay. You know what I'm saying?

[Devale Ellis]

To be like that, especially when within our community, Black men and women are always pitted against each other. And if we want our black men to open up to us, why not create a space for them to do that? So I'm, like, devout. I want you to be honest with me. It doesn't have to be a brutal honesty, but I want you to be honest and transparent about how you feel, because I'm not trying to guess. Like, the good thing about Devale and I, for the years that we've been together is that we've always given each other a choice.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Devale Ellis]

And the choice happens because we are fully communicative about the things that we want and need. So every morning, I wake up with the choice to be here, and I decide to be here. And it's been working for us.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You know, y'all been together 22 years.

[Kadeen Ellis]

22.

[Devale Ellis]

About to be 22 years.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Me and my wife been together 26. It'd be 27 this year, I want to ask the ball, when did you. And this. It's gonna sound crazy to some people listening. When did you realize Kadeen was a safe space for you to be your absolute most vulnerable?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Wow. That's a good question. And I always preface. I'm gonna preface by saying this. The first five years of our marriage was terrible, right? And it wasn't terrible for the reasons people think it was terrible. People automatically assume it's terrible because of infidelity or money, but that wasn't it. It was terrible because I did not feel safe telling her how I felt about things. So I bottled it up. I suppressed it. I would go in the bathroom, sit on the toilet, turn the shower on. I'd be crying, trying to figure out what I was gonna do with my life. Because I just come from being in the NFL, making a lot of money. I had to start all over again, and I felt like less of a man. But I can't tell that to my wife. And it was one day, she was pregnant with Cairo, and I had said to her, we was having a whole argument about stuff, and I was just at the point. And you know how it is when you're a man. You get to the point where you just don't care no more.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Word up.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I was done. We was getting a divorce. And I was like, you know what? You lazy. You don't trust me. You don't believe in me. You don't do all this. And she's like, deval, I'm not lazy. I'm fucking pregnant. And I was like, the hormones, like, the attitude, like, the nausea. She was like, I was trying to find a way to surprise you and tell you. And I said, well, why didn't you just tell me? And then when I said, why didn't you just tell me? It hit me. Why don't I just tell her what I'm going through?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's right.

[Kadeen Ellis]

That was the moment. I wrote about it in our book, We Over Me. New York Times bestseller, by the way. But it was that moment I said to her, why didn't you just tell me? And then it was like, bing, why don't you tell her? And from that moment on, it was 2016. The minute I feel something, sometimes she don't be in the mood. I'd be like, yo, we gotta sit down and talk.

[Devale Ellis]

And she be like, all right, here we go now.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And I tell her. And the minute we done, we've made a decision that we not gonna argue about it. We not gonna harbor no resentment if we don't agree. We don't agree. But this how I feel. This is how you feel. And we work towards, you know, being better.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's why I asked, because it doesn't matter how long you're with a person, and it don't have anything to do with you. It's really just us as men.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Absolutely.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

When do we realize, okay, this is a safe space? This woman that I have devoted my life to, the mother of my children, is a safe space for me. It's hard for men to find safe spaces, man.

[Kadeen Ellis]

But you know why, though? We don't. I can't even find safe spaces amongst my boys. Forget a woman. If I go to tell my homeboy that I'm feeling away, nigga, you soft bitch ass. And it's like, am I. You know what I'm saying? You asking, am I? You know what I am? Let me. Let me toughen up. So if my homies feel like that about me, I can't tell my girl I'm going through it. It took maturity, it took me to realize that I chose this woman and she chose me to spend the rest of our lives together. What my homies think don't matter. What the world think don't matter as long as we can get on the same page. So she's always the first person I go to now, but it wasn't always like that. And that's when we struggled the most.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah. And there's a resilience there, because think about it. He. We could have thrown in the towel a long time ago. So when we meet people now in their dating phases, and they're just like, what should we do? They writing for advice on the podcast all the time. And we're just like, I feel like this generation at least coming up, nobody wants to put the work in. Nobody wants to tough things out. Nobody wants to be honest. You show up as a representative of yourself, and you're expecting someone to be honest with you. You know, it's. It's really hard out there. So we went through that together, and it was hard as individuals trying to grow at 17, 18 years old. Now we hit the fourth floor. Yeah. You know, we 41. It's like so many years of trying to grow together, to respect each other's space, figure out who we are, grow as individuals, raise children at the same time. I mean, when I look back on our. Our years, it's insane.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah. Yeah. I love how transparent y'all are with the public and even with y'all fans, like, you know, y'all built such, like, a fan base for, like, marriages. And, you know, people who been even divorced, like, look for y'all for. To y'all for advice. Because y'all put it out there, the highs and the lows, right? How do y'all handle disagreements in front of your kids, though? Because if y'all. Y'all real with us, right? How is it? And then, you know, parents, you got two types of, like, situations like that. A lot of parents don't like their kids to see them disagree. Like, that's not realistic, though. So we.

[Kadeen Ellis]

We handle disagreements as a family. Spot on. We. If we disagree on something and the kids are there, we gonna have a discussion. And the minute we have a discussion, I will go to Jackson and say, you see how I spoke to your mom? You see how I don't gotta be disrespectful? You see how I don't gotta raise my voice? Do you understand what it means to have empathy towards someone who thinks differently than you? And they'd be like, yeah, I see it. And I'm like, now understand this. Me and your mom may disagree, but that's my wife. Because they gonna be somebody's husband someday. They have to see what it's like. So I never wanted to put my kids in a situation where I was. My parents never argued in front of me. But then they would go in the room and be screaming and hollering. I'd be like, yo, what is going on? Then your pops come out. You like that. Why are you talking to mom like that? He looking at you like, boy, that's my wife, right? I'm checking.

[Jess Hilarious]

I'm like, no explanation.

[Kadeen Ellis]

But then that didn't give me any emotional maturity to deal with my wife for the first five years, right? So there was a couple of days where I came home and I was making money. She wasn't working, and the food wasn't ready because she had Jackson. And I'm like, what's going on? Because I'm thinking that this is what a man's supposed to be. And she was like, she from Brooklyn. I'm like, well, that's not the response my mom gave my dad.

[Devale Ellis]

You see the neck and the shoulder starts to go in, right?

[Kadeen Ellis]

I just started to realize, like, that wasn't the way. Like, the stuff that we saw growing up, and we just felt like, if I emulate this, I'll be successful wasn't making me feel good.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

We didn't know no better. We didn't. I mean, that's what you was learning from Just observing. Like, there's no manual that comes with any of this. That's why I give my father a lot of grace. Because when me and my father had a real conversation and he told me about his mental health issues and I knew about his substance abuse, it just made me realize, oh, he just a man trying to figure it out.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like, I wasn't talk about it. Charlamagne.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's it.

[Devale Ellis]

That's it.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Two months ago, my dad stayed with us to help with the bulls.

[Devale Ellis]

Oh yeah, that's a good story.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And I'm gonna try to talk about this without crying. Cause my dad and my mom came and it was the same thing happened. And my dad was kind of short with my mom and I was in the car. Now I'm grown, so I'm driving and my dad gets short with my mom. And I'm like, yo, you having a little tantrum for no reason. I need to chill, right? And my dad looking at me like, nigga, I'm still your pops. But he's still like, you know what? We talk about this later. We go in the living room and we have like a three hour conversation. And just like your dad, he was telling me all the things he'd been through, all his fears, all his worries. And for the first time, I saw my father as a human. And I said, yo, you were just trying to do that. You got married at 21, you had me at 22, then my brother at 24.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Wow.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like, who taught you? My grandfather was an army guy, didn't talk much. You know what I'm saying? Do as I say, not as I do. Follow my lead. Like nobody spoke. So after speaking to my father, man, my heart got so big. Cause I saw him as a person. Like now he my dude now like, yo, pops, let's talk. And here's the funny part. He said to me at the end of it, I gotta be better for your mom. I was like, that's why I said, I'm trying to do it, not cry. Cause my mom is my heart. You know, you grow up in a house and you. My mom's small in stature, she's five'two and my dad is six foot. He big, right? And I see sometimes my mom just be like, I'm not even dealing with him today. And I told her, my mom don't have a voice in this house because sometimes you don't give her a voice. And he looked at me and said, I'm gonna do better for your mom. And for the rest of the, like the week, I saw him try. Now he still had his slip ups, like we all do, like I do, you know, but he tried. And I was like, this is making me feel good. Because it's not always about paying it forward. Sometimes you gotta pay it back. Teach that generation how we do things now. And he's open to it.

[Devale Ellis]

Our podcast, even we meet people who are older than us and they will be like, wow, you guys, you guys are younger, but you guys are talking about things that I've experienced my entire life. We've actually opened up the gates for discussions too, with my side of family as well. Coming from a Caribbean household, like having discussions about how you feel about things, like, that wasn't really a thing. And my mom has opened up to her son in law in ways that she hasn't even opened up to me. I feel like as a family unit, intergenerationally, we're starting to just heal. So that way we can pass that down to our boys, you know, and to piggyback off of Deval with your question, Jess. They see sometimes the disagreements, but there is such an abundance of love in our house that we sometimes get flack for Deval, you know, grabbing my ass or, you know, walking past and kissing. And you know, Kyra, our second son will be like, get away from each other. But the love is so abundant that the moments that we may have disagreements, it far is like outweighed by what they see between mom and dad and the love that we share.

[Lauren LaRosa]

You said that your mother in law is talking to you now. Yeah, like, differently now. Like, what are the conversations like now at this stage of the marriage versus where they were prior.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Once again, understanding where to meet my mother in law. My mother in law is a West Indian woman from Jamaica, came here when she was 17. There's a lot of intersectionality between West Indian people and American people, right? But there's also a lot of disconnect, right? Coming here, a lot of West Indian people just thought that Americans were lazy cause we wouldn't do the jobs that they were willing to come over here and do. And I had to explain to her our thought process as black Americans and what we fought for. But us even talking about history as black people led to me understanding, like, why did you come here? She said, I came here at 17 from Jamaica looking for a better life. I came here by myself, had to live with my mom's friends. If I came home late from working at Burger King, I had to sleep in the hallway on the floor because they thought that I was out gallivanting. I started to see her. When I started to see her and realize who she was and realize how she protected the things she loved, I understood why she was so hard on me when I was coming after and courting her daughter. So once I was able to put my wall down because I saw her, I was able to understand. And then once I put my wall down, she put hers. And now in the house, that's my biggest ally. Because when she's my mother in law will be like Kadeem.

[Jess Hilarious]

Hey what up y'all?

[DJ Envy]

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[Jess Hilarious]

Panoramic moonroof, ambient lighting, bows and massaging leather appointed seats are optional features.

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[State Farm Representative]

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[Bom Han]

Things, it's your boy, Bom Han, and I'm bringing you something epic. Introducing the K Factor, the podcast that takes you straight into the heart of K Pop. We're talking music reviews, exclusive interviews, and deep dives into the industry like never before. From producers and choreographers to idols and trainees, we're bringing you the real stories behind the music that you love. And yeah, we're keeping it 100, discussing everything from comebacks and concepts to the mental health side of the business. Because K Pop isn't just a genre, it's a whole world. And we're exploring every corner of it. And here's the best part. Fans get to call in, drop opinions, and even join us live at events. You never know where we might pop up next. So listen to the K factor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This isn't just a podcast. It's a movement.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Are you ready?

[Bom Han]

Let's go. Let's go.

[Kadeen Ellis]

When the last time you gone on a date? And I'll be like, you've been on.

[Devale Ellis]

A date minding my business.

[Kadeen Ellis]

But it should be like I'll have the kids. She'll tell her like, yo, go put on something nice. Go take. And I'm like, this is the things that when people. People need to see that, right? Cause we hear all of the messed up stuff. You live with your in laws that shit crazy.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And I'm like, yeah, but maybe it's not. Cause maybe I could take my wife on a date because the grandkids are taken care of by their grandparents and people like, oh, I never thought about it like that.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah, it's their grandparents.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah, they were able to survive. That's why we here today. They holding down the for know with the boys back home.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Also, man, just everything I'm hearing is just have conversations with your parents, have conversations with your in laws, like they had a life before they were your parents. And there's so much you can learn from that about where you are.

[Devale Ellis]

Yes, absolutely.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I learned more about her by speaking to her parents.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah, I think we wrote about that in the book as well. By speaking to the in laws, you're able to kind of get a better understanding of your spouse and the things that make them tick and why they are the way they are. There's certain things about Deval, I'm like, oh, that was a direct correlation between what happened with your mom or why your dad is the way he is. So it's just about getting to have a better understanding across the board.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah, I watched y'all on the Lovers by Shan.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah, I did.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yes.

[Lauren LaRosa]

One of the things that y'all talked about, I was like, you guys are so honest about this. The conversation when he wanted you to dress up like the maid.

[Devale Ellis]

Yes.

[Lauren LaRosa]

It was a maid, right?

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah. It'd be a different character. Yeah, yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Cause I don't know why I thought writer's in it, but when you said that, you, like, y'all were talking about the fact that when he asked you to do it, you was like, I don't really know about that, but we can meet in the middle. And he was like, no, this is what I want, though. Specific. I'm like, yo, if I had that conversation in my group chat, my friends probably would hate my person after that because they would feel like, hold on, what's going on here? Because you should be able to make your choices. But for you, it was like, well, I want to make sure that my man. You know what I mean?

[Devale Ellis]

Like, because who are we trying to appease, the group chat or my man.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Right.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Devale Ellis]

You know what I'm saying?

[Lauren LaRosa]

But even talking about that publicly, I was like, oh, like, they. Y'all be really getting to the shits.

[Jess Hilarious]

Well, Lauren don't. She don't have a man. So, like, the group chat a little bit.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Not even a piece of potential.

[Kadeen Ellis]

You so cute.

[Devale Ellis]

Look at you. Thank you.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

She was with girls this weekend in Atlanta. We had the Black Effect Podcast festival. She was surrounded by studs. Then she went to Magic City, got with a scriff.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Do you guys discuss how far you're going to go in those real conversations? Because getting into the bedroom, I was like, dang, nothing's off limits.

[Devale Ellis]

Everything's pretty much been on the table with us. Like, there's nothing that's. And we feel like if we show up as our true selves, nobody could hold nothing against me. Nobody. There's no room for you to create a narrative. You know, it's funny. We have, with the evolution of the podcast now, a new segment that we've introduced that people are loving so far, and it's called OP or no op. And it's pretty much, do you have an opinion about this matter, or do you not? Okay.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Right.

[Devale Ellis]

So we've realized that with social media, everybody got a phone, everybody got an account, everybody got an opinion sometimes about things you have nothing. No knowledge about, no facts, no expertise. But everybody wants to comment on something. So we're trying to now push forward. The battle of the sexes is done. Now we're trying to push forward. Thinking to myself, do I. Am I have sound mind? Do I have the facts to be able to comment on something and have an opinion? Or can I just let some things go? You know, like, let's start that as a culture. Like, we don't always have to have an opinion about something.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Like, you don't. I don't need to know if you think you can beat a gorilla.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah.

[Devale Ellis]

So let's start doing that. Like, what do I think about? I don't know. What's the scenario that's happening right now? Current events.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Anything in current events.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Michelle Obama and the Barack Obama stuff.

[Jess Hilarious]

Oh, and Kanye said, you know, he was sucking his cousin's peeing.

[Kadeen Ellis]

So perfect example.

[Devale Ellis]

Perfect example.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Perfect example. Somebody asked me, how you feel about that? I don't feel about.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

How do you feel about Kanye.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Somebody. That's how it be. I'll go do interviews. I'll go do press.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And it'll be press about the book. Right. And the first thing I sit down is like, song. Guys, you have a book coming out. Kanye west said. And I'm like, what the does that.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Got to do with my book here?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Right, Right. And they're like, well, what you think about it? I don't think about it. I didn't until you sold me about it. I didn't know what happened. So I don't have an opinion on it. And then just like, you don't get.

[Lauren LaRosa]

From your family to the dick that he was.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Because let's think about the world.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Right.

[Jess Hilarious]

Bow, I wouldn't.

[Devale Ellis]

So we don't even entertain.

[Kadeen Ellis]

See how they tried to correlate it.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Yeah. I would come in on the family tip, like, well, Kanye said he can't see his kids because he came out. I would have asked.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Well, I mean, that's how they tried to, like. But ultimately it was clickbait, because what they wanted was to be like. Deval talks about Kanye.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yep.

[Kadeen Ellis]

That's ultimately what they wanted.

[Devale Ellis]

Right.

[Kadeen Ellis]

So we're trying to create a trend where it's like, say, for example, Charlamagne just asks, what do you think about it? And then the interview goes, I don't have an opinion.

[Jess Hilarious]

And then now you're disappointed you didn't get your nose. Nobody want to hit. Yeah. Nobody.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like, I don't want to talk about that. I don't want to talk about any of that. I do want to bring up something, though.

[Devale Ellis]

What's that?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Because Lauren brought up about the sex thing. Right. And I do want to bring up this point. Right.

[Devale Ellis]

Okay.

[Kadeen Ellis]

If a man says, this is what I require. This is what I want, the first thing in the group chat, all the girls is, nah, you should be able to have a choice to da, da, da, da, da, Right. But as her husband, I ask her, what do you want? What you require? And the minute she says what she wants and require, there's no negotiating.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

So for us, what we're trying to show people is that there doesn't have to be a battle of the sexes.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

She said that her man want this, she gonna do it. He said his wife want this, he gonna do it.

[Devale Ellis]

And why would we not want to do that for each other? Cause who else am I do it for?

[Kadeen Ellis]

I'm not pledging allegiance to my gender. I'm pledging allegiance to my partner. Like, this is.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's a ball.

[Kadeen Ellis]

That. Make sure y'all get that on camera. You know what I'm saying? My God. Make sure you get that one. Make sure you zoom in real quick. What I said again, I'm not pledging allegiance to my gender. Pledging allegiance to my partner. Partner. Partner you gotta love. But no, but seriously, though, that's why it's easy for me to just be honest. Because it's just like, if your boys are upset. Man, you said that. Yeah. So, like, we ain't fucking. Like, well, you not gonna do nothing for me, so. Yeah. So my wife wants this. This what I'm doing.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Well, I could if you let me. Do you like Kanye?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Did I stupid? That was actually.

[Jess Hilarious]

He'll never miss a moment.

[Lauren LaRosa]

What happens in those moments, though, where you or her are like, yeah, nah, but I'm just sitting on it. I don't wanna do that.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Then we talk about it. And like, seriously, there's been times. There's been times. Like, I'm like, yo, like, yo, you ain't gonna dress up on that night.

[Devale Ellis]

She just like, I'm like, word, Rain check. I'm a rain. I'm a rain check queen, honey. I'll be like, can I rain check that?

[Kadeen Ellis]

She'll rain check. But then in the morning, I'm gonna wake up and I'm gonna be. Get a tap. And I'm gonna open my eyes and she gonna be in that nurse outfit or something. Cause sometimes she not in the mood.

[Devale Ellis]

We get it.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And you gotta understand businesses, this stuff.

[Jess Hilarious]

Going on, you know, you ain't trying.

[Kadeen Ellis]

To the night, okay? They always tell, we got the rest of our life, bro. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's never a deal breaker. Like, if you ain't doing this tonight, then it's gonna be a problem. Nah, you don't want to dress up tonight, fine. Well, sometimes she'll be like, you know what? I ain't dressing up tonight. But I'mma bless you, though, and I'll dress up tomorrow. You know what I'm saying? We talk about.

[Devale Ellis]

We trying to find a comic.

[Jess Hilarious]

Has there ever been a role that you ain't want to play? You like, I ain't doing that shit. That's not.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Nah. We tried to think about I got.

[Jess Hilarious]

Stories, bro, or anything like, kinky. Like, you ever dress up like a white girl and he dress up like the black guy and children like Dr. Umar. Yeah, she was a white girl.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I was Dr. Umar. My bad. Dr. Umar. I know that's not sacrilegious to you. I don't want to go there, but that would actually be a really good role play. You know what I'm saying? Shut up. Take this black. Sorry.

[Devale Ellis]

This was up in California.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yes. I knew that's where he was going, bro. So I. I was very specific.

[Devale Ellis]

He was specific. What did you ask for? It was like down to detail. I had color contacts, and I think I had done like a photo shoot or something.

[Kadeen Ellis]

This is fun. This is funny, right? She had. Did a photo shoot with Janelle where she had on these hazel color contexts. She had this big curly, like.

[Devale Ellis]

Yeah, it was like a big wig. I looked like, different.

[Kadeen Ellis]

She didn't like herself like somebody else. I was like, yo. I was like, yo, I want you.

[Devale Ellis]

To put on that.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Put on a cheerleader outfit.

[Devale Ellis]

That's what it was.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Bomb, right? So now she's like, I got you, babe. This was. This was New Year. We were at our parents house. We was having quiet sex for a couple days. So we was over it. I don't want to no more fucking. I'm trying to back.

[Jess Hilarious]

You know what I'm saying, all that.

[Kadeen Ellis]

So we get home in Cali, right? I'm like, ready. I'm sitting at the edge of the bed, I'm waiting. She come out. There's no weave, There was no contacts. And she had on the leotard.

[Devale Ellis]

It was this real cute, savage crotchman. It was a vibe. I had a little thigh high to go with it. And I was like, this is fire.

[Kadeen Ellis]

It's not what I asked.

[Devale Ellis]

And he was like, yo, this is literally what happened. That's not what I asked for.

[Kadeen Ellis]

She. She walked over all seductively, like she had music. We had a fireplace. She put the fireplace on. She's.

[Devale Ellis]

I was set in the mood.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Straight face, like this, right? So she get down. She got her hands on my knees. She going down right there. And she get to the bottom and she like, what's up? Like, this is like, what's this for you, sir? I'm like, where the cons? Contacts. She like, deval, I'm downstairs right now handling business. And I said, no weave, no contact. And you got on this dirty ass leotard that said Dusty.

[Devale Ellis]

I said, dusty.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I said, dusty.

[Devale Ellis]

This dusty ass leotard. I'm like, first of all, it's not a leotard. It's a teddy. And I had a.

[Jess Hilarious]

It was stained up.

[Devale Ellis]

It was.

[Kadeen Ellis]

No, I said Dusty because it wasn't what I wanted.

[Devale Ellis]

That wasn't what he wanted.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I was just mad. I was just mad. She was mad.

[Devale Ellis]

And I was like, so because you did not get exactly what you asked.

[Jess Hilarious]

For, it's a problem.

[Devale Ellis]

I'm still here to do the job.

[Kadeen Ellis]

And she didn't even have heels on. So I got mad, right? So I got up and I go in the bathroom, right? But it just so happened, when I walk in the bathroom, I seen all her heels lined up in the closet. And we had just moved to this big house. I said, you got all these heels here. You ain't put no heels on. So I go in there and I throw all the heels out the closet.

[DJ Envy]

What?

[Kadeen Ellis]

The gang sure did. Now this is the funny thing. She goes. And I'm getting.

[Devale Ellis]

I'm standing up. I was like, you gotta pick every shoe up. Are you kidding me?

[Kadeen Ellis]

She says to me, look at your stupid ass in there throwing heels around and your dick's still hard. Yeah, that's what Broke me out of it. That's what broke me. I looked at her, I started laughing. And we started laughing after that. It was a rap. It was just like, yo. Yeah.

[Carlos Miller]

It was like, look at us.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like, look at. Like, look at us.

[Devale Ellis]

And I was like. And picked all the shoes up.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah. So this is shoes. We sat there, we picked the shoes up, then we got.

[Devale Ellis]

That was the one time. It's like, he asked for one thing, and I was like, here, I'm doing something else cute. And he was like, sound like y'all was role playing.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah, he was.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Marriage. That's fun.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That sounded like a Tyler Perry scene. You throwing the heels.

[Jess Hilarious]

No. Did y'all. Y'all never thought about doing a reality show?

[Devale Ellis]

We've turned down.

[Kadeen Ellis]

We turned down.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Don't do it on your YouTube channel. So why not?

[Jess Hilarious]

Crazy.

[Devale Ellis]

That's a part.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Why we control everything. Everything. One thing I fear because we sat down with. And I don't want to put producers out there. We sat down with number of producers. Right? This is always the first thing. This. Come on so and so. I know. I know y'all. You're perfect. I get it. Right? So there's nothing. You don't have anybody. Like, she's not. And I'm like, the first meeting, you're coming to me and asking me things. Disparaging things that I could say about my wife. Man, get the fuck out of my face.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like, I'm not doing this.

[Jess Hilarious]

I get it.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I got four sons, and that's what you want me to do.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Right?

[Kadeen Ellis]

No, I. Personally, I know this is gonna get some slack, but I love Bill Cosby. Right? Not for the things that he did, but for what he represented. This man was so brilliant in the fact that he had a black psychologist on the set of the Cosby show every day to make sure that everything they put out didn't show black people in a disparaging way. Right. Like, when you think about the Cosby Show. A different world. Lil Bill. This is the content we want to create. We have a cartoon series that we've been pitching for about our kids called the Ellison. The Time Machine. Cause we wrote a book called the Ellison in the Time Machine. Why do we have to say Black Lives Matter and it's an animated series about history? These are the things I wanna do. I don't wanna get on television and argue with my wife about trivial stuff. I'm also not gonna include my friends. Right. For example, you friends with Jess. Hilarious. What's she like? I know. That's the stuff they ask, and I'm like, I'm not doing that. So we're not doing the reality show thing unless we own it.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRosa]

How y'all deal with people trying to bring out the, like, what, like, the negative or whatever? Because I remember when people were. A lot of people do still couple goals, you guys. But I remember you guys had a conversation, I think you had it again on the Lovers by Shan podcast, too, about how when people post y'all as couple goals, people instantly are like, it's no way. It's as happy and as good as.

[Devale Ellis]

It looks all the time. And people. It's funny because we have a contingent of people who've been following us for so long, literally since our Brooklyn apartment days when Deval was holding up his iPhone to now. So we have people who will jump in and be like, no, don't. Don't come for the Ellis's. Like, if you're new here, clearly you don't understand, like, the track record that they have and what they've shared over the years. And it hasn't always been perfect, but they've actually let us in to have a front row seat to see them work through their issues.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I will say this, though. When you learn to have empathy for people, right? I can understand that. If you grew up and you've never seen a positive black family, and all you've seen is just despair and violence and anger. When you see this on Instagram, there's no way you're gonna believe this is real.

[Devale Ellis]

There's no way.

[Kadeen Ellis]

So I understand that. That's why I don't get upset at it. Like, I look at some of my family and they look at me. These are people who know me and be like, you and K ain't really always happy, are y'all? And I'm like, nah, we not always really happy. But we talk about the stuff. And they're like, you really talking. These are my family members. So if a stranger who's never met me before feels that way, then I understand you've never seen it. How could I be mad at something that you've never seen before?

[Lauren LaRosa]

I have empathy.

[Devale Ellis]

I think 2.

[Lauren LaRosa]

Age is a part of it, too. Because, like, for me, I never before I got but here and saw, like, Charlemagne. Envy be young in a marriage. And they're happy and they love, I don't know, young people who are just, like, happily married, maybe. It's like they're old. That's why they're happy, because they're like, where else you gonna go?

[Kadeen Ellis]

Right?

[Lauren LaRosa]

Right Versus y'all are young, living life, your kids are growing up, y'all are doing things, y'all both are working, and y'all are figuring it out.

[Devale Ellis]

Absolutely. Figuring out. And then people always ask us too, why? How do you guys keep this up for so long? I mean, you've been in the social media game doing all this for 10 years. How do you keep it up? And it's like, this is not a facade. There's nothing to keep up. We're not trending on something or I.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Legit love her to death.

[Devale Ellis]

Like, this is just us literally recording and putting out our life. Oh, you put out so much. You guys share everything.

[Kadeen Ellis]

We don't.

[Devale Ellis]

We share a 60 second video. That's one minute in a day.

[Kadeen Ellis]

If you go back and look, there's 1,440 minutes in a day, right? I share one minute video. That means you know, 1 1,000th of what happened my day.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You don't know these people.

[Devale Ellis]

You don't.

[Kadeen Ellis]

But we also gotta understand that they don't know us. So if they're commenting, they're commenting from their own experience. Oftentimes it's projections. I'm never gonna let someone else's projection define my day. Like, I can't sit back and look at the comments and then just be like, oh, these people. Nah. Unless you know a hit dog, holla, and you feel seen and you doing something unsavory. And I was like, damn, they see me. That's when you kind of feel away. But I don't. I know what my intentions are. So, hey, you feel that way. That is what it is.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Question. When it comes to personal issues between y'all, do you feel like you have to work it out in the public because of how much of y'all lives y'all share with the audience?

[Devale Ellis]

No, definitely not. No. There's a lot of things that happen behind closed doors. Again, to Deval's point, you see a portion of what we share, you know, but we may, after the fact, talk about it on the podcast. Like, hey, guys, we were going through this in this moment. Here's how we were able to internally process it, deal with it, overcome it, agree to disagree, and then we'll share it on the podcast and say, hey, guys, has anybody ever been in a position where this has happened? And then more times, often than not, you realize, damn, I'm not the anomaly here. In this situation, there are other couples, there's other men, there's other women who are dealing with the same things we've Even realized that sometimes there's women who are more like, I agree with Deval on this one. Sorry, K. Like, that was me all day. Or vice versa. The guys would be like, hey, you my girl. I felt you when you said this. So, no, you know, some things we do still believe are for private places, and other things can be for public consumption.

[Jess Hilarious]

Yeah, because people will feel like they know your life based off that one minute that you were talking.

[Devale Ellis]

Oh, for sure. And then they create a whole narrative around it.

[Jess Hilarious]

A whole narrative. Like. Like when Kanye said, oh, I'm 14, I was sucking my cousin dick. He could have been on the honor roll. He could have won the basketball game that day in school. Like, it's. I'm just saying. Because people act like they knew him.

[Kadeen Ellis]

I know you, though. But you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right.

[Jess Hilarious]

I'm glad y'all listen, man.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Dval and Kadeen Ellis. I love talking to y'all because growing as individuals is a lot by itself, but growing as a couple is insanity. If you're not constantly communicating, you know, you might wake up one day and not know who that person is. So we can learn anything from. Y'all have to constantly communicate with your partner.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yes, sir.

[Devale Ellis]

Indeed. And thanks for growing with us, too, Charlamagne. I mean, we've been on the Breakfast Club a couple times over the years. Our third time. I appreciate you for always rocking with us.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yeah, we appreciate it.

[Devale Ellis]

And it's so great to meet y'all in this space. Congratulations.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Thank you.

[Jess Hilarious]

That's work that you're doing, and y'all making other people do same thing here.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Like the things y'all are doing here. Talking about mental health, I can't stand politics because it gets on my nerves, but bringing the information to people is all we can do, right? The greatest thing you can give humans is inspiration. That's right. And the Breakfast Club is inspiring people. I hope y'all know that. We appreciate y'all, man. This has been a part of our lives living here.

[Jess Hilarious]

Thank you, bro.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Yes. And my kids know y'all, too. The kids listen.

[Devale Ellis]

We keep them still very, very New York.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Mr. Baller. Kadeen Ellis. Make sure you subscribe to the podcast Ellis Ever after. If you're not subscribed already, it's the Breakfast Club.

[Kadeen Ellis]

Wake that ass up early in the morning.

[Jess Hilarious]

The Breakfast Club.