Podcast Summary: The Breakfast Club – Interview with Dr. Judith Joseph

Episode: INTERVIEW: Dr. Judith Joseph Talks 'High Functioning,' Hidden Depression, Burnout, Achieving Joy +More
Release Date: May 14, 2025
Hosts: DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne Tha God
Guest: Dr. Judith Joseph

Introduction

In this insightful episode of The Breakfast Club, hosts DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, and Charlamagne Tha God sit down with renowned psychologist Dr. Judith Joseph to discuss her latest book, High Functioning: Overcome Your Hidden Depression and Reclaim Your Joy. The conversation centers around the often-overlooked aspects of depression, burnout, and the pursuit of joy in daily life.

Understanding Hidden Depression

DJ Envy introduces the concept of hidden depression, explaining that it differs from the stereotypical image of someone visibly struggling. Instead, hidden depression masks itself behind a facade of relentless productivity.

DJ Envy [02:15]: "Hidden depression doesn't necessarily look sad, but it doesn't feel joy. It feels empty."

Dr. Judith Joseph elaborates on this by highlighting how individuals, such as a single mother juggling work and childcare, maintain a smile for others while internally experiencing a profound sense of emptiness known as anhedonia.

High Functioning Depression vs. Burnout

The discussion transitions to differentiating between high functioning depression and burnout.

DJ Envy explains:

DJ Envy [07:47]: "High functioning depression is different from burnout. Even when you take a high-functioning depressed person out of the workplace, they aren't better because their distress is internal and unresolved."

Dr. Joseph concurs, emphasizing that burnout is typically an occupational hazard that improves when the individual steps away from the source of stress, whereas high functioning depression persists regardless of external circumstances.

Identifying Signs and Symptoms

The hosts delve into recognizing the signs of hidden and high functioning depression.

Charlamagne Tha God shares a personal anecdote about a friend who appeared unusually excited about discovering his depression, illustrating that outward happiness does not negate internal struggles.

Charlamagne Tha God [03:17]: "When you think of depression, you think of suicidal thoughts and not getting out of bed, but my friend was the opposite—he was productive yet unhappy."

Dr. Joseph adds that individuals with high functioning depression often engage in side hustles or excessive cleaning to avoid confronting their inner pain, leading to persistent restlessness and a lack of true joy.

Strategies to Reclaim Joy

The conversation shifts to practical methods for overcoming hidden depression and reclaiming joy.

DJ Envy introduces the concept of affect labeling, a psychological technique that involves naming and understanding one's emotions to reduce anxiety.

DJ Envy [02:15]: "When someone tells you what you're experiencing is anhedonia, it's a scientific symptom. Then you feel as if it's not your fault."

Dr. Joseph supports this by discussing the importance of grounding techniques to help individuals remain present and reduce the fight-or-flight response that hinders joy.

The 5 Es (or Vs) Model

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the 5 Es (also referred to as the 5 Vs) model presented in Dr. Joseph's book, aimed at healing and reclaiming joy.

1. Validation

   • DJ Envy [21:20]: "Validation is acknowledging and accepting how you feel, good or bad, without judgment."

2. Venting

   • DJ Envy [21:16]: "Venting is expressing emotion. You could vent verbally, write in a journal, pray, dance, sing, or cry."

3. Values

   • DJ Envy [23:45]: "Tap into what gives you meaning and purpose. Think priceless versus price tags."

4. Vitals

   • DJ Envy [25:00]: "What nourishes your mind, brain, and body. Be kind to your body and protect your brain from excessive screen time."

5. Vision

   • DJ Envy [26:04]: "Plan joy in the future. Celebrate your wins and keep moving forward instead of getting stuck in the past."

Dr. Judith Joseph emphasizes the unique nature of each individual's journey to joy, urging listeners to understand their personal triggers and sources of happiness.

Dr. Judith Joseph [26:09]: "Joy is a priority. It is a necessity. It is part of our survival, especially in our community."

Practical Techniques for Grounding

DJ Envy shares a specific grounding technique called the 5-4-3-2-1 method, which helps individuals stay present and reduce anxiety by engaging their senses.

DJ Envy [16:45]: "Sit and practice the 5-4-3-2-1 method for five minutes every day. Describe five things you see, four you feel, three you hear, two you smell, and one you taste."

Charlamagne Tha God expresses skepticism about finding peace amidst a busy lifestyle, to which Dr. Joseph responds by highlighting the importance of finding moments of stillness to access true joy.

Conclusion and Takeaways

As the interview wraps up, Dr. Judith Joseph shares her hopes for readers of her book, emphasizing the transformative power of prioritizing joy.

Dr. Judith Joseph [26:09]: "Joy has the power to change people and their communities. We can literally change not just ourselves, but our families, our communities, and the world."

DJ Envy reinforces the message by encouraging listeners to prioritize their unique sources of happiness and understand the science behind their emotions.

Final Thoughts

This episode of The Breakfast Club provides a deep dive into the nuanced aspects of depression and the essential role of joy in mental health. Dr. Judith Joseph offers valuable insights and practical tools for individuals looking to overcome hidden depression and lead a more joyful life.

To learn more about Dr. Judith Joseph and her work, visit drjudithjoseph.com and consider reading her book, High Functioning: Overcome Your Hidden Depression and Reclaim Your Joy.

Notable Quotes:

• DJ Envy [02:15]: "Hidden depression doesn't necessarily look sad, but it doesn't feel joy. It feels empty."

• Charlamagne Tha God [03:17]: "When you think of depression, you think of suicidal thoughts and not getting out of bed, but my friend was the opposite—he was productive yet unhappy."

• DJ Envy [21:20]: "Validation is acknowledging and accepting how you feel, good or bad, without judgment."

• Dr. Judith Joseph [26:09]: "Joy has the power to change people and their communities. We can literally change not just ourselves, but our families, our communities, and the world."