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The Breakfast Club
INTERVIEW: Pete Buttigieg Addresses Mysterious Drone Sightings, Travel Inflation, Future Career Moves + More
00:38:21
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- [00:01]
Angela Rye
The holidays are about spending time with your loved ones and creating magical memories that will last a lifetime. So whether it's family and friends you haven't seen in a while or those who you see all the time, share holiday magic this season with an Ice Cold Coca Cola Copyright 2024 the Coca Cola Company.
- [00:22]
Charlamagne Tha God
The holidays are here. It's that time of year to think about, yes, gifts, but not only gifts. It's the guests, the party planning and the true meaning of the season. Spending time with family and friends. We know it's a lot, but we're here to ease your mind and share some tips so we'll make it through together. With the season getting underway, now is the time to shop for amazing holiday deals at Amazon. Amazon has a wide selection for all your holiday needs. I don't care if you want to get your people's laptops, gaming screens, whatever it is they need, Amazon got it. Amazon Last Minute deals are here. Shop Last minute Deals now on Amazon and visit Amazon.com blackeffectpodcast of my favorite.
- [00:56]
DJ Envy
Picks what's it like to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with ATT next up anytime? It's like when you first light up the grill and think of all the mouth watering possibilities. Learn how to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on AT&T and the latest iPhone Everywhere with AT&T's next up anytime. ATT connecting changes everything. Apple Intelligence coming fall 2024 with Siri and device language to set us English. Some features and languages will be coming over the next year. $0 offer may be not available on future iPhones Next up Anytime feature may be discontinued at any time, subject to change additional fees. Terms and restrictions apply. See att.com iPhone for details.
- [01:29]
Angela Rye
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- [01:59]
DJ Envy
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- [02:18]
Angela Rye
Today available features compatible device service and consumer activation of Nissan Connect services package. Required use only when safe and legal. Subject to third party service availability. For more information see nissanusa.com Connect legal Apple CarPlay is a trademark of Apple Inc. Intelligent all wheel drive cannot prevent collisions or provide enhanced traction in all conditions. Always monitor traffic and weather conditions.
- [02:34]
Charlamagne Tha God
Wake that ass up early in the morning.
- [02:36]
Pete Buttigieg
The Breakfast Club.
- [02:38]
DJ Envy
Morning everybody. It's DJ Envy. Jess. Hilarious Charlamagne. The guy we are the Breakfast Club. Angela Rye, of course, is checking in with us as always. And we got a special guest in the building. Secretary of Transportation Pete Buttigieg. Welcome back.
- [02:51]
Pete Buttigieg
Thanks. Good to be back.
- [02:52]
Charlamagne Tha God
Good morning. How are you man? Happy holiday.
- [02:54]
Pete Buttigieg
Same to you.
- [02:56]
DJ Envy
Dump right in. Yeah, jump right in.
- [02:59]
Charlamagne Tha God
Secretary Pete, you are the Secretary of Transportation. What do you know about these manned SUV sized drones flying over New Jersey.
- [03:05]
DJ Envy
Scaring the hell out of us?
- [03:06]
Charlamagne Tha God
John Kirby, the National Security communications Advisor, said they were manned.
- [03:09]
Pete Buttigieg
Yep, y.
- [03:10]
Charlamagne Tha God
Yesterday. What do you think it is?
- [03:12]
Pete Buttigieg
So, I mean, we're helping law enforcement work through it all, mainly a Homeland security issue. Our job is to make sure that any restricted airspace, nothing comes in there that shouldn't be there. That includes airspace over an airport. Sometimes another area could be restricted because it's sensitive. For example, that's close to the Trump Golf Club. There's temporary flight restrictions there. Bigger picture is we're going to have more and more drones. Obviously if it's manned, that's different. But we're going to have more and more things entering the airspace. We got to work to make sure that safe. This is not a world where anything flying is either an airplane or a helicopter. The drones are getting bigger that. Look, it can be a good thing to have these resources to deliver. For example, in a really hard to reach area, you make deliveries. But we're talking about potentially millions of these coming into the airspace. And what we're trying to do, especially on the FAA side, is coordinate all that, make sure it's safe.
- [04:07]
Charlamagne Tha God
But John Kirby said they're manned. Like whose mans is this? Like who are these people? And why is it okay? And why wouldn't they inform the public beforehand?
- [04:15]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah, so they know more than I do on the law enforcement side about the identity of the aircraft. But it is true. Sometimes you look up at something, you think it's one thing, turns out it's another. I think that's what they've been working through on the law enforcement side.
- [04:27]
Charlamagne Tha God
One more quick Donald Trump was on with Joe Rogan. They had a whole conversation about aliens. Not the kind he wants to deport. Actual extraterrestrials. Then Cliff High said 39 days after that interview we were going to start having an alien invasion around December 3rd. That's when all of these SUV sized drones, which I've even seen, started getting seen over Jersey. Is it an alien invasion?
- [04:49]
Pete Buttigieg
I mean no disrespect to New Jersey when I say that I think it's very unlikely that an alien invasion would begin.
- [04:56]
DJ Envy
Watch your mouth.
- [04:57]
Jess Hilarious
We lived it.
- [04:57]
Angela Rye
Hey, I know, but damn.
- [05:00]
Charlamagne Tha God
No, no, nobody wants to come to Jersey.
- [05:02]
Pete Buttigieg
I love New Jersey. I'm just saying I don't think that's the kind of main point of entry that an extraterrestrial. Unless there's something we don't know about.
- [05:10]
DJ Envy
You don't think aliens want to tan? They might go to the Jersey Shore or something like that.
- [05:13]
Charlamagne Tha God
It's wintertime.
- [05:14]
DJ Envy
Oh, you're right. American dream. They might go skiing.
- [05:17]
John Kirby
I bet you did not think this how to interview was parking.
- [05:20]
Pete Buttigieg
I would go for someplace in the Pacific where there's no inhabited space for couple of hundred miles so that I could kind of get my bearings before I go anywhere. Anyone's going to see me, right?
- [05:30]
Charlamagne Tha God
What if they're intelligent life?
- [05:32]
Pete Buttigieg
Well, you still want to take your time, kind of set up, set up shop a little bit.
- [05:36]
Charlamagne Tha God
What if they've been watching us for years already?
- [05:37]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah, maybe, I don't know.
- [05:39]
John Kirby
He has anxiety. He's making my anxiety.
- [05:41]
Charlamagne Tha God
Secretary Pete knows something.
- [05:42]
DJ Envy
Maybe they want to take out the Secretary of Transportation.
- [05:44]
Charlamagne Tha God
If there's SUV sized anything flying in the sky, you know about it.
- [05:48]
Pete Buttigieg
There's like millions of things in the national airspace. Right. So I do actually we do have a, we do have a big board at the USDOT which has the dots kind of show you the tracking of commercial aircraft. But no, I don't necessarily know all that.
- [06:03]
DJ Envy
Okay, well, how are you feeling? I'm sorry to start like that. How are you feeling? How was everything?
- [06:07]
Pete Buttigieg
You know, it's an interesting time. I mean work wise, what we're focused on is we have more grants, we're working to get out the door. Make sure we take the funding that's in the President's infrastructure package and assign it to projects that are going to make a difference. So we have more, more announcements coming on that and then the things we've already announced. It can take years to go from a press release saying, you know, congratulations, we're going to work on the. Let's say the Hudson River Tunnel and it actually happening. So we're trying to move that along. We're trying to finalize a lot of policies we set into motion. We just did one a few days ago on airlines. Again, how airlines treat people and what kind of compensation you ought to get. That was launching a policy. We're also finalizing some policies that we launched a while ago. So we're busy. We're going to stay busy for the next 38 days that we have in these jobs.
- [06:58]
DJ Envy
And we got to talk about the election. How do you feel after the election? What do you think could have been done to make sure that we, the Democrats would have got a win?
- [07:06]
Pete Buttigieg
Look, it's tough and I got to be careful how I talk about it because I'm here as a federal official, so I can't totally get into campaigns and parties. But I'll say this. I think all politics and all policy is about everyday life. And if people don't feel that that's what we're talking about, then they lose touch with what we have to say. And I think we have a responsibility. I try to do all of our policymaking in terms of everyday life, whether we're doing a billion dollar project, how's it going to make your commute better, or whether we're doing a regulation, how's it going to make your life safer? But we have to communicate about that too. And that gets harder and harder with the noise machine and the culture wars. And I think a lot of folks aren't following kind of mainstream media to get their news anyway. It's just getting tougher and tougher to have that conversation. I still believe, at risk of sounding naive, I still believe that if you do the right thing in time, you get credit for it. I saw that happen with the, with Obamacare, the Affordable Care act, where the first time I was running for office in 2010, we got destroyed over that issue. By 2018, it was a winning issue. And even Donald Trump and a Republican Congress couldn't tear it down because the American people wanted understood that it was helping them. I think there's a lot of things like that that we're doing right now. But the simple truth is most of the stuff with infrastructure, most of the stuff we launched in the first half of this decade is going to deliver most of its benefits in the second half of this decade. That's when they cut the ribbon on the bridge that we fixed or opened the airport terminal that we funded or people realize that something like the refund policy we're doing on airlines is working for them. All these EV factories I've toured, many of which, by the way, are in red states. Indiana, Kentucky, Kansas, most of those, when I've toured them, they've been construction sites. And they're going to be. They're already creating all these jobs in the building trades to build them, but the manufacturing jobs in them, they're coming online in like 2025, 2026, 2027. So we're in this stage where you're not always getting credit for good work.
- [09:12]
DJ Envy
I want to ask one question before you jump in, Angela. What is your thoughts on electric cars? A lot of people feel that the electric vehicles are just as bad as the gas vehicles with the batteries, with the things to get rid of them, dispose of them. A lot of people are not sold on them. And a lot of manufacturers, people are not necessarily wanting to buy them. They're on lots, can't sell them. There's huge discounts. And I mean, New Jersey now has taxes on them. At first that was a good thing that you didn't. If you bought an electric vehicle, you wouldn't be taxed, but now they're starting to tax it. So what are your thoughts on electric vehicles and the public's view on them?
- [09:42]
Pete Buttigieg
So I still think it's the future. And I would point out, even with ups and downs in the market, every year more people in America choose to buy them than the year before. So it is growing. But look, it's not for everybody, and we never said it would be for everybody right away. Our goal is by the end of the decade, it's about half and a half. If everybody got an electric vehicle tomorrow, America wouldn't be ready. We don't have the chargers, we don't have the grid, which is why we're trying to build it. Another thing that we launched in the first half of this decade that will be coming online in the out years is all these chargers we're supporting. The first couple hundred are up now, but eventually thousands and thousands to join the. To get to that goal of half a million. Right now, Nationally, we're at 200,000. We're adding a bunch anyway. It's just not true environmentally that it's the same.
- [10:25]
DJ Envy
Oh, it's not okay. People feel like it's just the same or it's worse.
- [10:30]
Pete Buttigieg
The thing that's screwing us up day by day in this country is climate change. And that is happening because of carbon pollution. And EVs are one of the ways that we can cut that because they don't spit out carbon pollution. Are there issues with the materials that go in the batteries? Absolutely. But one really important thing to remember is that material can be reused. You can recycle the batteries, which will become more and more relevant as you have more old cars. Right now. There's not a lot of end of life EVs. Right? But there will be. And then the next generation of EVs, those batteries can be made with them. There's, I mean, any manufactured product, there's environmental issues associated with manufacturing. I don't mean to wave that away, but handling that compared to handling a climate situation, that is almost certainly part of why things like Hurricane Helene and Milton are worse than before. We're getting heat waves in the Pacific Northwest that aren't even supposed to be statistically possible. Why? One of our big projects is dealing with the damage of her superstar Sandy here. Like that is happening now. That is not theoretical, that is real. And EVs aren't the answer to all of it, but they're helping. And the thing I care about just as much as that is the job growth. I was back in South Bend where I grew up, where I served as mayor. About a week ago, when I was mayor, they were telling us that manufacturing was done. We're gonna make things in this country anymore. Definitely. If you were in a union like the electrical workers, they told you, you know, you might as well give up. Few, few people a year, get into an apprenticeship program. I was there. Now they're going to have 500 people working on an EV battery factory. That is multibillion dollars in St. Joe County. That is bigger than anything that happened in the auto industry. Any investment in the auto industry since the Kennedy years, like since before I was born, it's happening right now. So the other exciting thing is like, let's make sure these EVs are made in America. And I got to say, I'm not going to guess what the next administration will do. But I wonder when they're really confronted with the decision of whether to make through on their threats and wreck this EV industry that is employing people in places like where I grew up, whether we're talking about auto workers or whether we're talking about electrical workers, a lot of other people, are they really going to pull the rug out from under those workers, many of whom are in red states. I guess we're about to find out.
- [12:49]
John Kirby
You know, I'm not going to have you violate the Hatch act, but I think one of the things that has been up for discussion is what's going to happen with the Democratic Party. You're, of course, a part of the Democratic administration. And recently I was asked who would be a good DNC chair. And you might not like this, but I thought of you. There are a lot of people who, who are jockeying for this position who the country's never heard of, but you had a really phenomenal moment during this campaign cycle debating undecided voters. The video went viral. You're able to communicate in tough places. You come here, you go on fox. You're able to communicate the messages in ways that I think a lot of the Democratic Party avoids. Can you talk about whether or not that's something that you would be interested in and if not, who you think would be good, not in your official capacity, in your personal capacity, who you think would be the type of chair they need to see to preserve? Frankly, whatever they've built in that.
- [13:53]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah. So. Well, it's not going to be me. I care about that a lot, but it's just not. It's not what I'm going to be doing right now. I'm following it a lot. I can't get into party stuff too much this time. But what I'll say is, you know, whether you're talking about what goes on in the party campaigns or the policy side, and even though we're about to be out of the administration, we've got leaders in, obviously, communities. We've got governors and we've got people on Capitol Hill who are going to, I think, show what leadership from my side of the aisle looks like. And I think a lot of it will be. You're mentioning an experience I did on a channel called Jubilee, which I got a ton of feedback about. That was great because there's different people than the folks who were watching what I might have to say on CNN or fox news or MSNBC.
- [14:44]
Charlamagne Tha God
How many people was it like a 21, right?
- [14:47]
Pete Buttigieg
It was a lot.
- [14:47]
John Kirby
20, 24. Like millions.
- [14:49]
Pete Buttigieg
Oh, the experience. Yeah, it was like 20. It was like a room with 25 people. And what it reminded me of was what it was like being mayor where, you know, I didn't. Somebody stops you in the parking lot of the grocery store because they want to know why you changed the trash pickup from the front of the house to the back of the house. And they're mad at you. You got to explain it. And you can't go to talking points. Right. And I think a lot of the best voices we have are people who are having to have those kinds of conversations in their communities.
- [15:21]
Charlamagne Tha God
Absolutely.
- [15:22]
Pete Buttigieg
And not the stuff that's, that's dominating the attention of a place like Capitol Hill. You know, I, back when I was running, I talked a lot about, you know, needing to have perspectives from outside of Washington. When I got to Washington, I noticed two things. One in all, humility, like, that town is full of a lot of really good people, public servants who come to work every day trying to do the right thing and who care about this country. But also it is a very self absorbed place. Like even more than any other kind of scene that I've seen, more than any city, more than Hollywood. Like, it is a place where like everybody wants to talk about what this senator had for breakfast. You know, what I chastis and I got there. We start reading write ups the next day online about where we were having dinner and stuff. It's just very inward looking. Sometimes we've got to get out of that. And that's part of why I will be out of Washington. Well, not that I'm invited for the next four years, but I think it will be helpful to be out of Washington for the next few years for me.
- [16:26]
Charlamagne Tha God
Well, you know, you're a very cerebral person. Everybody knows that, Secretary Pete. So I know that you've thought about your future. What is the future for Secretary Pete?
- [16:33]
Pete Buttigieg
I don't know. That's just like. No, no, it's true. I mean, obviously there's a lot of different things I might do. People are putting all kinds of ideas in my head. But, you know, I got 38 days to do this job and I got to stay really focused on that. And then I'm not going to just jump into something just so I can do it or just try to have an office just so I can have it. I know what I care about. I care about how places like where I grew up in Indiana and where I live now in northern Michigan, how places like that can grow, how we can replicate the story of the city that I served in that started out that decade being told we were dying and ended growing and creating jobs. And now it's happening in a whole new way, largely because of what happened in the Biden administration. I care about that. I care about big picture democratic reforms and how we change all of the things that make us not that democratic. And I'm not just talking about the whole kind of question of authoritarianism that I think all of us are rightly worried about. I'm talking about stuff that happens out in the open in terms of how our districts are drawn and how our Campaigns are paid for and election stuff. I talk about a lot. I care about that. I care about making sure that our generation comes out ahead. Because if you were born when my parents were born, there's a 90% chance you were going to come out economically ahead of your parents. If you were born when I was born in the 80s, it's a coin flip. So I care about stuff like that. I care about the information environment. What Angela, you and I were just talking about, about the different spaces we go into. But how I do that, whether that's as an elected official or something more political or something a little more out of that space, that's something I will have time to figure out after January 20th.
- [18:18]
Charlamagne Tha God
Is it about the money or the service? Because you can get to the bag. You're Secretary Pete now, so you can write a book, you can start a podcast. There's a lot of things you could do to actually get money. You got kids, man. You're married with kids.
- [18:29]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah, I mean, I need a paycheck. That's right. It's not like I'm a millionaire, but I'll figure that out. That'll be okay. Chasten has also reminded me that we need money. We need to obviously have a living and take care of our kids. And also Chasten, we're like any working couple. I talked to him on the way to the studio. Here he is solo wrangling two three year olds, getting them to school in the middle of a snowstorm. And I just have some catching up to do there in terms of doing my ass back.
- [19:03]
DJ Envy
I need some help.
- [19:04]
Pete Buttigieg
Well, yeah, which is totally fair. Right. And he's been great, but so I'm going to be a little more focused on that. Plus our kids, our twins are boy and a girl are twins. They're three. They're old enough to, not just to notice, but like to care when I'm gone. So I'm looking forward to some period of time when I'm closer to home, able to think. But before we do any of that, like, we got 38 days of real work to do. Because every day we're here, we're going to wish we had it back later on to get more done, to get more dollars out the door, to get more good policies done. So we're pushing hard.
- [19:37]
DJ Envy
I do have to ask about congestion pricing. I mean, you talked about New York and the tunnel that they're building, but they're saying this congestion pricing in New York City could be the guinea pig for the country, for different cities of people. Driving it. A lot of people are against it.
- [19:49]
Pete Buttigieg
Right?
- [19:50]
DJ Envy
It's with groceries, expensive, gas expensive, everything expensive, right. Everything is high. This is just going to be another thing that citizens, Americans have to pay. What's your thoughts on that? Because it's going to hurt a lot of people.
- [20:03]
Pete Buttigieg
So the bottom line is I've got a. This sounds like a cop out, but it's only because federally it's very important to respect that this is a local decision. So from a federal perspective, they've done everything they need to do. We went through a process of, I think more than 20,000 pages of verification to evaluate whether it's met its legal requirements. And it has. Now it's still up to the city, the state, the region to decide if they want to do something. But like from a Department of Transportation perspective, they've demonstrated that to the satisfaction of our department. I know that sounds like a bureaucratic answer, but part of why I'm answering that way is because I respect the fact that that's a local decision. What I will say is there's a handful of places that have done it, but most in other countries around the world, London, Singapore, Stockholm. The usual pattern has been that people. There's a lot of controversy about it beforehand. People in the end have preferred to have it after the fact once they're used to it. But every city is different.
- [21:08]
John Kirby
I had some questions around just thinking of legacy and how things are being left. There's a lot of folks who have come in as Secretary of Department of Transportation and one thing that has remained pretty stagnant is the utilization of dbe so the disadvantaged business enterprises. I'm from Washington State and there was a disparity study done this year looking at all of these numbers. And I think the one time you met my dad, like he ran up on you was like, hey, Secretary Pete. And he had questions about this. He's dedicated his life to this. So it's something that we're really passionate about. But when you look at how the Federal Highway Administration funds contracts, only 1% of those contracts are going to black owned firms. The Federal transit authority, it's 1.0. And then state funded contracts is 0.2%. And this is. It doesn't matter if it's a Democratic governor or a Republican governor. This is something that's remained pretty stagnant. I'm eager to know what you all have done, what you all plan to do. I know that there's a civil rights lead on this, but this has not changed much.
- [22:16]
Angela Rye
The holidays are about spending time with your loved ones and creating magical memories that will last a lifetime. So whether it's family and friends you haven't seen in a while, or those who you see all the time, share holiday magic this season with an ice cold Coca Cola. Copyright 2024 the Coca Cola Company.
- [22:37]
Charlamagne Tha God
What.
- [22:38]
DJ Envy
Does it feel like to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with ATT? Next up anytime it's like when you first pick up those tongs and you're now the one running the grill. It's indescribable, like something you've never felt before. All the mouthwatering anticipation of new possibilities, whether it's making a perfect cheeseburger or treating your family to a grilled baked potato, which you know will forever change the way you look at potatoes. With AT&T next up Anytime you can feel this way again and again. Learn how to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on AT, ATT and the latest iPhone Everywhere with AT and T's next up anytime ATT connecting changes everything. Apple Intelligence come in fall 2024 with Siri and device language to set us English. Some features and languages will be coming over the next year. $0 offer may be not available on future iPhones. Next up Anytime feature may be discontinued at any time, subject to change additional fees. Terms and restrictions apply. See att.com iPhone for details.
- [23:35]
Charlamagne Tha God
The holidays are here and it's that time of year to think about. Yes, gifts. But not only gifts. It's the guests, the party planning and the true meaning of the season. Spending time with family and friends. We know it's a lot, but we're here to ease your mind and share some tips so we'll make it through together. With the season getting underway, now is the time to shop for amazing holiday deals at Amazon. Amazon has a wide selection for all your holiday needs. The reason I love this so much is because it is the holidays. And there's things that I've had family members and friends ask me for throughout the year that I simply would not do. Give them the money to get, but I will get them the actual items. So whether it's laptops, hair steamers, dining sets, makeup, better wigs for Lauren La Rosa, whatever it is they need, Amazon got it. Amazon Last Minute Deals are here. Shop Last Minute Deals now on Amazon and visit Amazon.com black effect podcast for my favorite picks.
- [24:28]
Jess Hilarious
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- [25:12]
Angela Rye
Today available feature Bose is a registered trademark of the Bose Corporation. Nissan Safety Shield technologies can't prevent all collisions or worn in all situations. See Owner's Manual for important safety information.
- [25:23]
Jess Hilarious
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- [26:18]
John Kirby
I'm terrified about what's going to happen because as soon as Donald Trump was elected, Walmart, Starbucks, everybody saying, you know, to hell with dei, we can't afford to do that or be in those positions as black folks. Yeah, right.
- [26:32]
Pete Buttigieg
This is really important. If you look at for example the black middle class in Atlanta, part of how that was built was because the mayor at the time that the airport was going up insisted that black owned businesses had a had a shot at the work that was going on. And they did. And whole companies grew out of that. I've been there, talked to second generation people who are now leading those construction companies and working on new work at the airport where their parents had worked on the original round. So I've seen the opportunity. It can Create. Here's what we've done. We've boosted our goal for the dollars that directly are contracted by our department. We had over 20% goal on SDB small disadvantaged businesses, and we beat it. So we've been able to generate, I think we're now in the billions in terms of doing better than before. But a lot of those statistics that you've found show how when the federal dollars go out to the states or they go out to the communities, those states and communities may not have the same level of commitment to making sure that there's that DBE participation. We have been able to do a lot of things to encourage that, including updating the entire rule, the whole regulatory framework for DBEs. We immediately got sued and right now there's an injunction that's, that's affecting in certain jurisdictions how much we can pursue that work. By the way, they've done this for other departments too. They went after the Small Business Administration's program. They went after the mbda, which is part of commerce. We think that we know that we're on good legal ground, but we're going to have to fight for it and we're going to stay committed. But you know, to some of the numbers you were mentioning, a lot of this does happen closer to home. Right. And so we've got to set a tone that says, wait a minute, it's important to create these opportunities locally. By the way, there's the business side, but also the labor side. I've seen a lot of, I've seen some labor unions and locals that are doing it right. And you see people who just would not have had a chance to get these good paying jobs in the building trades. And there are things that can be done to help make sure they get a shot, including making sure there's more apprenticeships so you can earn while you learn, so you don't have to have money to take time off to be in the apprenticeship program. For a lot of working women, I mean working parents in general, but definitely for working women, it's important to have childcare set up. In Pittsburgh, they set up a childcare center at the construction site of the airport terminal that they're doing. And it means that more people who just would never have had a chance to be part of that are part of that. So we're being intentional about it. But look, the next administration has not shown any signs of being enthusiastic about this. We're still defending what we've done in court, and I would say we've done a lot, but we got A long way to go. And what that means, what that says to me is there is going to have to be a lot at the state and local level to keep the momentum up.
- [29:17]
John Kirby
Yeah.
- [29:17]
Charlamagne Tha God
You know, somebody in the upcoming administration is going to take credit for something you implemented. So what is it we will see from them that's actually you.
- [29:26]
Pete Buttigieg
So there's 66,000 projects we got started. If I went to three projects a day for the rest of my life, I would not live long enough to see them all. Thousands of them are complete, but most of them aren't. These things take years. So you know, when you look at, I mean, there's these big signature projects, you know, the Hudson River Tunnel, that might be the biggest project east of the Mississippi in our lifetimes. There's.
- [29:52]
DJ Envy
How long is that going to take?
- [29:54]
Pete Buttigieg
Very long time.
- [29:55]
DJ Envy
How much money?
- [29:56]
Pete Buttigieg
We're 16 billion into it.
- [29:58]
DJ Envy
Jesus.
- [29:58]
Charlamagne Tha God
So it won't even be this. You won't even see that in this administration.
- [30:00]
Pete Buttigieg
No, no. But some things are, will be underway, are underway now, will be done sooner. The portal north bridge, which is another key bridge, it all comes back to New Jersey.
- [30:10]
Charlamagne Tha God
See.
- [30:18]
Pete Buttigieg
I think, you know, you can go on down the list. Big thing, the high speed rail. You know, I cut, I broke ground on a high speed rail project from Las Vegas to Southern California. They're aiming to be done by 2028. That's an aggressive timeline, but that's what they think they can do. So all of that, yeah, somebody else is going to cut the ribbon on that. But look, we've already seen people who voted against the Biden infrastructure package show up and try to take credit at these things. We're about to see that at a whole new level. And I'm going to be there to remind folks that some people were with us, even some Republicans were with us and a lot of people were against us when we were trying to get this money out the door.
- [30:58]
Charlamagne Tha God
Is that transatlantic tunnel shit real? The New York, the London, that can get you between the cities in an hour and they say it's going to cost 19 trillion to build.
- [31:07]
Pete Buttigieg
I call it more of a concept of a plan.
- [31:09]
Charlamagne Tha God
Okay, okay.
- [31:12]
Pete Buttigieg
It'd be pretty amazing. But yeah, some of this hyperloop, I mean, it's very exciting to think about, but the things you have to do, the pressurization, the tunneling, I mean, you know, kind of hard to. Hard on today's technology. Hard to see how that happens.
- [31:26]
John Kirby
Well, speaking of concepts of the plan, you are saying that's what you have for your future. But you did move to Michigan in 2020. There is a term limited. Governor Big Rich. Yes. Gretchen Whitmer, who is, of course, not running. And then there is a mayor of Detroit who's declared his gubernatorial run, but as an independent.
- [31:49]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah.
- [31:49]
John Kirby
So.
- [31:54]
Charlamagne Tha God
Democrats want you to run for governor of Michigan. No, but.
- [31:56]
John Kirby
But have you thought about running for a governor?
- [32:01]
Pete Buttigieg
I mean, I was gonna say don't.
- [32:02]
John Kirby
Get a lot of loss of words now.
- [32:04]
Pete Buttigieg
You need to hear.
- [32:05]
DJ Envy
He didn't say anything the first time he was lost to words.
- [32:07]
Pete Buttigieg
I'm not here to make new on my future. I honestly haven't ruled anything in Iraq.
- [32:12]
John Kirby
So we're taking that as a maybe.
- [32:14]
Pete Buttigieg
You're gonna. Like I said, people are.
- [32:16]
John Kirby
I've never heard of this.
- [32:17]
Pete Buttigieg
Putting ideas in my head.
- [32:18]
Charlamagne Tha God
They say you met about it this week. You met with people. Democrats in Michigan about it this week.
- [32:23]
Pete Buttigieg
I meet Democrats in Michigan all the time. I'm a Democrat and I live in Michigan. Look, we moved there because of family. We moved there. We bought a place there four years ago. Our having our kids close to their grandparents has been huge. But, yeah, look, I really care about the state. I just can't. I can't get into campaign stuff or anything like that.
- [32:43]
Charlamagne Tha God
Is this something you're even interested in?
- [32:46]
Pete Buttigieg
You're just gonna keep asking?
- [32:49]
Charlamagne Tha God
Have it crossed your mind, like, hey, being governor of Michigan would be cool?
- [32:52]
Pete Buttigieg
Look, I care about the place a lot. And I told you earlier, some of the other things I care about. There's a lot of ways to work on that. You can work on that in office, you can work on that out of office. It's. I'm not trying to be kg. I just. I don't know. And I want to know. I want to have a lot more of my mind made up before I go around talking about stuff like that on the radio.
- [33:10]
DJ Envy
Demand.
- [33:11]
John Kirby
You need a job, if you thought about it. And I think. I think the most important thing is if you just in case you missed it, you're a very public servant.
- [33:18]
Pete Buttigieg
Ish.
- [33:19]
John Kirby
And so even though you're like, oh, I could do this thing politically, and the other thing, you're. You're good at this. Like, this is something that you're good at. Well, my friend Garland is also thinking about a run. Gilchrist, who's fantastic. But there's the one that I think strikes a chord for me is Mike Duggan saying he's going to run as an independent. There are a lot of folks who are upset about that because that could throw the race potentially, which we've seen in larger elections than just gubernatorials in the past.
- [33:47]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah. And look, he's also a phenomenal mayor. We've worked a lot on a lot of things benefiting Detroit, where we've teamed up. But I just. You gotta, you gotta keep me out of hatch jail here. I can't do politics.
- [34:00]
John Kirby
We don't want to be in Hatch act jail, even though it's in the state. But we'll leave that alone. I let you let that fly. I pretend like I'm not a lawyer for that one, Secretary Pete, but I will ask you. So you talked about 38 days left. It's not just 38 days left for you. There's also 38 days left for President Biden. Are there things that you have before the president that you really want to have happen for transportation? Are there other things that you think this administration really needs to get done before Armageddon?
- [34:30]
Charlamagne Tha God
Yeah.
- [34:31]
Pete Buttigieg
You know, he just asked me for an update. We've been writing up some of the latest on what we think we can get out the door. There are a number of grant programs and projects we think we can make happen, potentially still hundreds of projects we can announce before January 20th. And anything we can do, we have to do it right. We can't do it half ass just to get out the door. So we have to make sure we're picking the right projects. We're being responsible with the money. But yeah, I think we can do a lot more. And again, there's some policies we can still finalize, just as we have been doing on everything from worker protection. And it's amazing how long it takes to get a federal regulation finalized. And I understand why a lot of it is that everybody has to have their say. There's procedural requirements that you have to go through. And, you know, a human being has to read every comment, even when there's thousands of comments. So we have to do it right. But we're working on, on things to keep up the record we've had of protecting consumers, protecting workers. But what I already know, even though we're not done, we will leave America's transportation systems better than we found them. Fewer people are dying on our roads. Long way to go, but fewer people are dying on our roads. I think we've made a lot of important advances on aviation safety. We've made major advances on passenger protection, your ability to get a refund or get your hotel covered or something else if you get stuck. Airlines are suing over that, by the way, too. We have to play some defense here, but we've done that. Rail workers. And we came in something like less than 10% of railroad workers could even get sick leave. And now that guarantee is available to over 90% of railroad workers. Supply chains, you remember the first year they said Christmas was canceled, all the ships were backed up. You know, we came in and encountered the biggest set of transportation problems to hit the country at once since 9 11. From airlines about to go out of business to supply chain. You couldn't get toilet paper, all that stuff. Trains, trains. And every one of those has got better. I can't say any one of them is 100% fixed, but every one of them is better. And just as importantly, the trajectory is better. It used to be when we talked about our roads, our bridges, the condition of our infrastructure, we knew that every year it was going to get worse because the backlog was growing faster than we could do the projects. That was the whole idea of the infrastructure. I call it the big deal. That was the whole idea of the big deal was we're not just going to keep playing catch up, we're actually going to change the trajectory. But the nature of my. I mean, the satisfying part about our work is that for the next few years, I'll be able to look at things still being built and improved because of what we did and because of what President Biden did. But the unsatisfying part about it is the same. The other side of the same coin. That's going to take a while.
- [37:12]
John Kirby
Well, I have one. Since you used to. You're talking generics around the grants. Is there any way that we can talk to the airlines about these ticket prices? Because they're surging and I.
- [37:24]
Pete Buttigieg
That's crazy.
- [37:25]
DJ Envy
They're crazy.
- [37:25]
John Kirby
Yeah.
- [37:26]
DJ Envy
Atlanta used to be 200, 300, now 6, 700 to fly to Atlanta.
- [37:30]
John Kirby
I'm going to throw one out. That might get you all in trouble. I don't know if they're a sponsor. American, like American Airlines tickets are like $1,000 more than everybody else's right now.
- [37:39]
Pete Buttigieg
What were you trying to. What. What route you talking about? Because I will say, because it does depend like it does as a category. It's actually one of the few areas where prices went down a little bit instead of up with all the inflation. But that's an average, right? If you're talking about a certain airline or certain route. And the biggest thing that we can do about that is competition. Right? I mean, just that's how it's supposed to work. And the truth is, even though the airline industry lobby will say you know, there's lots of, there's all these flights, there's all these airlines, all these routes. A lot of times for a particular route, there's maybe two airlines actually serving those particular, that particular combination. Right. So it turns into a duopoly. And you know, one of the big problems we've had in the aviation sector is we've gone from dozens of airlines to a dozen airlines to now basically a big four. And the low cost airlines, which everybody's mad at because of the passenger experience, but also it's really hard for them to compete. It's why we intervened on the merger that was proposed with JetBlue, because having even fewer airlines means you have even fewer choices and it means it's less likely that you're going to get a good airfare.
- [38:49]
John Kirby
Well, the one that I'm thinking about, I'm based in Seattle. The one that I'm thinking about mostly is Seattle to jfk and American has a partnership with Alaska Airlines. Alaska Airlines. That same flight will be $1,000 less than American. I don't understand that.
- [39:05]
Pete Buttigieg
Oh, that's interesting.
- [39:05]
John Kirby
It's very weird. So something to look at between these 38 days. But to your point, it's New York to Atlanta, it's LA to Atlanta.
- [39:15]
DJ Envy
It's very expensive.
- [39:15]
John Kirby
Yeah. So Florida flights, that's almost $3,000. Yeah.
- [39:19]
Charlamagne Tha God
I saw you say Trump can't get rid of the new airline refund rules, though. You said it's the law of the land, right?
- [39:24]
Pete Buttigieg
That's right. It got put into the FAA bill. So it would take an act of Congress to get ready to try to get rid of the automatic refunds. And I would love to be there if anybody in Congress tries to get rid of that, because that's really important. And the whole idea there was that not just that you can get a refund, but you can get a refund without having to ask. Because what was happening was it was on the books that you could get a refund and cancellation or some of these situations, but you had to ask for it, you had to fight for it. Sometimes an airline would say, well, we'll give you 5,000 miles. And that sounds pretty good, but if you actually do the math, that's worth like maybe 50 bucks and you're entitled to hundreds. So just saying, okay, if you want something different, like if you tell the airline, don't give me the money back, I'd rather take a rebooking or don't give me the money back, I'd rather take your miles. Fine, great. But you have to choose. It's opt out rather than opt in. And if you don't say anything, you just get your money. I think it's common sense. I think it's good policy, and I'm really glad that Congress backed us up on that and that some of the other things they could undo, but that they couldn't undo unless Congress went along with it.
- [40:25]
Charlamagne Tha God
I know you got.
- [40:25]
DJ Envy
I don't know if you have one more question.
- [40:27]
Charlamagne Tha God
I do have one more question. Because, you know, one thing I always give you credit for is you are not afraid to show up to speak to people who you may not agree with. And you always come speak to people you know, regardless of whether it's campaign season or not. So we always appreciate that. But to me, that's something you can't teach. Like that has to be in you. So where does that come from? Why aren't you afraid to show up in spaces a lot of Democrats don't?
- [40:49]
Pete Buttigieg
I think it comes from growing up in a place where lots of people, including people I really like, don't agree with me. But we're friends and we just talk about it. And I think you get advised and counseled not to take any risks when you get into a job like mine for very understandable reasons. Right. Because anything you say gets picked apart. But if you pay too much attention to that, nothing you say, you don't say anything interesting. You're not talking like you're talking to someone you actually know. And people feel that. They smell that. And I think younger people especially feel that and smell that. And so I think it's probably just because of how I came up.
- [41:32]
DJ Envy
Any last ones?
- [41:33]
Pete Buttigieg
You good?
- [41:34]
John Kirby
I'm good. I asked about my plane tickets. I'm like, if I can't get anything else out of the 38, I mean, I want to pardon for Marilyn Mosby as well. We'd love to have you support on that, but. Yeah, I just would like for things to feel fair. Okay. Especially now since Donald Trump said, oh, it's going to be hard to increase the price of groceries.
- [41:51]
Pete Buttigieg
Let's find out.
- [41:52]
Charlamagne Tha God
You did say something. So playing it safe is over, I think, for politicians. Do you think that.
- [41:57]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah. I mean, it doesn't mean you jump on a political landmine every time you see one.
- [42:01]
Charlamagne Tha God
Do those exist anymore?
- [42:03]
Pete Buttigieg
Yeah, I think so. I mean, you still get in big trouble for saying this or that or I don't know. But to me, it's okay as long as you're. If you're in a controversy because of something you actually did or said or believed, and it's controversial versus, like, you put a foot wrong or you phrase something the wrong way or somebody twisted what you had to say. You know, I always wanted to be held accountable based on results. This is part of why I'm. I got especially fired up during Helene about the hurricane, Helene about the misinformation that was going on. Because it's one thing to have a back and forth over something that's actually happening, and it's another if people aren't even looking at the same reality. So in terms of what risks people take in politics, look, you also tend to take more risks when you're out of power. And so I think you might see more creativity from the team that just got beat. That's just kind of the nature of things. But, yeah, I mean, for my dime, it's always better to just say what you think, explain yourself, and then if people don't like it, at least they're mad at you over something real instead of some misunderstanding.
- [43:12]
Charlamagne Tha God
Do you feel like Democrats are. Well, we know they are, but when did the Democrats get so out of touch with the needs of the American people?
- [43:20]
Pete Buttigieg
That'd be a whole other hour. I think. I think it's. I think that's only half fair. So I think it's. I think we are still the ones who are more connected. If I just think about the policies of our administration, like they have been all about making people's lives better. Everything down to making it easier to get a hearing aid, $2,000 cap on Medicare, insulin, $35 insulin. We did that for seniors. We could have done that for everybody if congressional Republicans hadn't blocked us. I think we were right on the things that affect everyday life. But the half where I do agree with you is I think we got sucked into this kind of vocabulary and this, like, swirl over what matters online and what matters in Washington. That meant a lot of the folks that we get up in the morning trying to help can't even hear us, can't even make sense of what we're saying sometimes. And if we can't. If we can't fix that, then it won't matter what our policies are, because nobody will even know.
- [44:21]
Charlamagne Tha God
That's right. I always say the language of politics is dead. And that's why there's only a few people, I feel, in the Democratic Party who are able to message what you're talking about. Like, yes, y'all might have better policies, but you don't know how to message them. You don't know how to promote them, you know how to market them. I think you're one of them.
- [44:35]
Pete Buttigieg
So I'm working on it.
- [44:36]
DJ Envy
All right.
- [44:36]
Charlamagne Tha God
Your future's bright. Secretary Pete, Thanks.
- [44:38]
Pete Buttigieg
That's right.
- [44:39]
DJ Envy
Well, we have the Secretary of Transportation. We appreciate you for joining us. We're gonna call you in a couple of weeks. If them drones keep going, man, we need it. We need the answers. It's Pete Buttigieg. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning.
- [44:49]
Charlamagne Tha God
Wake that ass up early in the morning.
- [44:51]
Pete Buttigieg
The Breakfast Club.
- [44:57]
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