Will Smith (5:21)

There is going to be great. You're a winner.

Hilaria Baldwin (5:22)

Oh, my God. When I'm talking, you're not talking. No, when I'm talking, you're not talking. This is why, yes, we'll have to like, just cut him out of the show.

Will Smith (5:29)

There is gonna be great. You're a winner.

Hilaria Baldwin (5:31)

Oh my God. When I'm talking, you're not talking.

Brett Cooper (5:33)

No, when I'm talking, look how sad he looks. I mean, that is like, that's worse than any of these ridiculous clips. They are on a red carpet. He is talking to her and he's saying, you're gonna be great. You are a winner. He is complimenting his wife and she goes, cut him out. You don't speak when I'm speaking. Like, can you imagine what goes on behind closed doors if we see these videos come out where she is mocking him, where she is degrading him. They're on a red carpet. A place really where he should be instead of her because he's the one with a long standing career, with the respect that is dwindling at this point. And she is saying, cut him out of frame. Shut. No, shut up, shut up. So that, my friends, is number three. That is an extreme example of the weird social media mockery, making fun of your husband for, you know, laughs and silly things. But obviously if you look at his face, you can see that this is like hurting his soul. Like he doesn't Think the tiktoks are funny. So now we need to get to something that I think is even more sinister. And that, of course, is Jada Pinkett Smith and her husband, Will Smith. Even if there was nothing else that happened in their marriage, Jada deserves this spot purely because she forced her husband to go on her podcast to talk about the affair that she had with their son's best friend. Now, if you don't remember this clip, let me jog your memory from there.

Jada Pinkett Smith (6:45)

You know, you and I were going through very difficult time.

Will Smith (6:49)

Yeah.

Jada Pinkett Smith (6:50)

And we decided I was done with your ex.

Brett Cooper (6:52)

Yeah.

Jada Pinkett Smith (6:52)

You kicked me to the curb.

Will Smith (6:53)

I was done with you.

Brett Cooper (6:54)

Yeah.

Will Smith (6:55)

Marriages have that, though. Marriages have that.

Brett Cooper (6:58)

That's the one moment where you see some kind of honesty. I was done. He's angry. This man is angry. He is hurt. The moment that he stops talking, he goes back to being a downtrodden, beaten man. Genuinely, every time the camera goes to him, it is like the life has drained out of his face. That is the common denominator that you're gonna see in all of these videos. Whether it is Alec, whether it is Prince Harry, whether it is Will Smith. These men look like they have nothing left. Like all confidence has been depleted and beaten out of them. Like they are just a shell of their manhood and their masculinity. That is what we're seeing. And I'm gonna let them continue because I cut this off before we even got to the best part, which, of course, is when Jada calls her affair an entanglement, because we all know that really is what affairs are.

Will Smith (7:44)

I really felt like we could be over.

Jada Pinkett Smith (7:47)

Yeah, no, we were over.

Will Smith (7:49)

And then what did you do, Jada?

Jada Pinkett Smith (7:50)

Well, you know, I think from there, you know, as time went on, I got into a different kind of entanglement with August.

Brett Cooper (8:00)

We were on a break, and I got into an entanglement with our son's friend. And this man is sitting on her podcast being filmed as he has to process all of this.

Jada Pinkett Smith (8:11)

One of the things that was kind of swirling in the press about you giving permission, which is, you know, the only person that can give permission in that particular circumstance is myself.

Will Smith (8:25)

Yes, exactly.

Brett Cooper (8:27)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I did not give you permission to have an affair with our son's friend. This entire situation is so freaking weird. She is so calm. She literally. She's taking this as, like, a moment of empowerment. You see the smug look on her face. She is so happy. This man is so angry. This clip literally needs to be in the Internet hall of Fame. It never gets old. It never ceases to make me want to die inside. They have a track record. If you look at the timeline of their relationship and their marriage, it has been one hit after another. I think that this happened during COVID I believe. But there were multiple times where she would be filming him. She would go on a live stream, like what I'm about to show you here. She would start recording him without his consent. And you see that what is going to be like a trademarked look in this episode. You see that look in his eyes? Just watch.

Jada Pinkett Smith (9:13)

You know, Esther Peral is coming to the table. She's going to be at the red table. Would you say she has been instrumental.

Brett Cooper (9:19)

In you and I redefining our relationship?

Will Smith (9:21)

I would say, don't just start filming me without asking me.

Jada Pinkett Smith (9:24)

Oh, my goodness.

Will Smith (9:25)

If you could film.

Jada Pinkett Smith (9:26)

Sam, come help us again, please. I'm still dealing with foolishness.

Will Smith (9:31)

Don't. No, no. She. Yeah, because she. Don't just.

Brett Cooper (9:34)

This is a caged man. Okay, so I was wrong. This is actually 2019. This is pre Covid. She's bringing somebody onto her, you know, table. The Red Table Talk. That's her podcast to talk about their relationship. Again, she's always airing out their relationship. She is on an Instagram live, turns the camera onto him and says, yeah, why don't you go ahead and talk about how this redefined our relationship? She turns the camera back to her and starts calling him a fool because he does not want this publicly aired out. You can see how painful and how angry he is.

Will Smith (10:03)

My social media presence is my bread and butter, okay? So you can't just use me for social media and not, you know, don't just start roll. I'm standing in my house. Don't just start rolling.

Jada Pinkett Smith (10:14)

Please watch us stare at the red table, because she's helped us a lot. Can't you tell?

Brett Cooper (10:19)

I mean, guys, could you imagine if the roles were reversed? If a man sat down in front of his wife and was like, yeah, my little entanglement that I have where I was in a relationship with our daughter's best friend. Can you imagine the outrage? Can you imagine the outrage of mocking your wife? Oh, she's such a fool. Let me have her in the background of my video when she does not want to be on a live stream, when she's saying, please do not air out our public grievances, and yet you continue to do so. That man would be labeled toxic. And I think the main point with Jada is, why air all of this out publicly? Like, yes, marriages, you know, have ups and downs. Maybe you and Will were really going through a hard time. We know that they had moments where they were, you know, separated, then they came back together. But you feel the need to air this out for views and attention. Like your husband, again, sort of like, Alec Baldwin is one of the most famous men in the world, one of the most famous actors in the world, and you are degrading him. You're using his success to build your brand, to build your podcast, to make you feel better about yourself. That cannot be healthy. That is not making your marriage better at all in the slightest. And Will knows that he doesn't want to be in this situation. He, in my opinion, is scared of this woman. Like, he does not recommend this road that they have taken for anybody. According to gq, this is in his memoir. We could no longer pretend we were both miserable, and clearly something had to change. He went on. Jada never believed in conventional marriage. She grew up in a way that was very different than how I grew up. There were significant, endless discussions about what is relational perfection? What is the perfect way to interact as a couple? Definitely not what she was doing. And for the large part of our relationship, monogamy was what we chose. Not thinking of monogamy as the only relational perfection. He concluded and said, we have given each other trust and freedom with the belief that everybody has to find their own way and. And marriage for us can't be a prison. And I don't suggest our road for anybody, but the experiences that, the freedoms that we've given one another and the unconditional support, to me is the highest definition of love. So I think that that word choice is really important. He's not saying, I don't suggest this road for everyone. He is saying, I don't suggest our path for anyone. But then at the end, he has to tie it up with a little bow and go, this is still the highest definition of love, because I am terrified of my wife, who puts me on blast 24 7. It is so twisted and it is so unfortunate, because now when I look at Will Smith, who is such an icon, who is so talented, who is so funny, I feel pity. We'll dive back in, but first, a quick word from our sponsor. Grand Canyon University is a private Christian university in the beautiful Phoenix, Arizona, and they believe that the American dream starts with a purpose, and they are here to help you find yours. GCU equips you to find your passions and use them to serve others in ways that promote human flourishing and create ripple effects of transformation for generations to come. And by pursuing an education and honoring your career calling, you will inevitably impact your family, your friends and your community. And whether your pursuit involves a bachelor's, a master's, or a doctoral degree, GCU's online on campus and hybrid learning environments are designed to help you achieve your unique academic, personal and professional goals. With over 340 academic programs as of September 2024, GCU truly meets you where you are and provides a path to help you fulfill your dreams. The pursuit to serve others is yours, so let it flourish and find your purpose at Grand Canyon University. It is private, it's Christian, and it's affordable. And visit gcu.edu to learn more today. Every day, women walk into abortion clinics planning to have an abortion, feeling scared and alone and out of options. But because of Preborn, these mothers are offered free ultrasounds. And when they see their child and they hear that heartbeat, everything changes. Ultrasounds double the chance that a mother will choose life. And thousands of women do, thanks to Preborn's network of clinics and services. And this year alone, over 38,000 babies have been rescued from through preborn's work. But they don't just stop there. Preborn cares for the mother, too, providing counseling, classes and ongoing financial support for two years after her baby is born. That is the type of support that makes motherhood possible. And support from people like us makes all of that possible. By giving $28 to sponsor an ultrasound, you are giving a mother the chance to see her baby and choose life. And so if you're ready to get involved and be part of the solution, go to preborn.com Brett to get involved again. That is preborn.com Brett give a gift. $28. Save a life and be the first voice of hope that she hears. Now you might think all of that is bad, but we have not reached number one. Number one and you might have guessed this is Meghan Markle and Prince Harry. And you know, I like to think that Meghan would like that. Meghan likes to be number one. It came out that she still asks her friends to refer to her as her Royal Highness. She doesn't want to be called Meghan Markle. You know, her name is Sussex now. Remember that whole clip with Mindy Kaling? Also, it came out after she did her first podcast interview that she addresses notes to her friends as Meghan her Royal Highness. So because of that, I would assume that she would love to be ranked as the number one worst wife that we should all try to not be like in this episode of the Brett Cooper Show, Meghan does not simply degrade Prince Harry. She degrades his entire family, his entire legacy. And this is a different kind of embarrassment. When she talks about Harry, she does talk about him with affection. She did that interview with the lady with all the Botox, the makeup lady, where she was like, oh, my God, Meghan, Meghan, I love you so much. That whole interview, she was talking about Harry, and in that podc, she said, you know, he is such a stud. He's a fox. I love him so much. All this stuff. So she is not publicly degrading him. But again, what I think she has done to his legacy, to his future, is arguably even worse because she has relentlessly blown up his entire family. She has mocked his heritage, his traditions, his grandmother, the former Queen of England. And it seems like she did so happily. Americans will understand this. We have Medieval Times dinner and tournament. It was like that. Like, I curtsied as though I was like, look at that man's face. She is mocking his entire family. Again, his heritage. The royal family, which is not just his family, but is a prolific historical establishment that means so much to so many people. She's going, oh, it was like Medieval Times. Oh, I had to do this. And he's sitting here. Look at his face again. This is the trademarked look for all of these men. It is the sadness. It is the bags under the eyes. Now, another thing that I want to point out is when she called his family racist on Oprah, that was the entire premise for why they left the royal family, why they did the Great Escape, why they took Tyler Perry's jet, which, in hindsight, that was not the greatest jet to take based on what he's going through right now. But they took his jet and they fled to Canada or America, wherever they went. The Freedom flight, hanging out with Beyonce. We have to be away from the royal family because they're so racist. They're so awful for Megan's mental health. This is what she alleged on Oprah about Harry's family concerns and conversations about how dark his skin might be when he's born. It'll never not be funny.

Will Smith (17:02)

And who.

Brett Cooper (17:05)

Who is having that conversation with you? What? So. And Harry is sitting right next to her.

Will Smith (17:17)

There is a conversation. Hold up, hold up.

Brett Cooper (17:19)

There's several comments. There are several conversations. There's a conversation. All right, now, this is really important because Oprah responds and says, who? Who is saying that? You can even see on the specific TikTok. This person says Meghan needs to name them so an investigation can be done, an investigation into the racism. Okay. She does not respond. Now, that could be because she signed an NDA. It could be because she's trying to protect Harry, whatever it might be. You know, she doesn't want to get into the details, even though she's making these huge allegations. Or it could be because none of it happened and she wanted to have this huge scandal because she wasn't fitting into the royal family. She wanted to be able to leave and build her brand on the rubble of his family based on allegations, based on things that never happened. And that's not just me saying that or assuming that that's actually coming from Prince Harry himself. Because about a year and a half later, two years later, Harry released his memoir, Spare, which was also very, very weird. You remember rubbing the cream on the nether regions. It was very strange. But the most important thing that came out of that memoir was the lack of that entire story, a lack of this alleged racism, the mental health struggles that Meghan was going through. And obviously, reporters asked him about this and said, where is this? This seemed like such an important part of your story. And this is what he said. You accuse members of your family of racism. You don't even.

Will Smith (18:39)

Well, the British press said that. Right? Did Meghan ever mention they're racist?

Brett Cooper (18:48)

She said there were troubling comments about.

Will Smith (18:49)

Obviously there was concern about his skin color.

Brett Cooper (18:51)

Right. Okay. So Harry, did it not happen? You blew up your entire relationship with your family that you, I don't think will ever be able to repair? Based on what the tabloids are saying, all of these, you know, sources are saying that your family is done with you because of the things that you and your wife, your wife specifically has said about them, the things that she has made up, the ways that she has mocked them, the way that you allowed her to do so, that you enabled it. She didn't want to live the life of a royal. She didn't want to have to fit into the confines of what it means to be part of the royal family, something that Catherine Kate Middleton, Princess Kate, has been able to do so beautifully. She made up all of these insane tales, allegedly pulled you out of your family, severed those ties. But more than anything, it's just sad because these are all relationships that could be so inspirational, that could be so empowering, that could be hopeful for young people who are looking to get married. These are all successful, interesting individuals that have been torn down by their wives, desperate need for attention based on the mockery of their Husband. Now, I did have one other woman that I wanted to discuss, and I couldn't figure out whether I wanted this person to be an honorable mention or whether I thought she should be number one. But again, you know, Her Royal Highness, I thought that Meghan would want to be number one, but that would be Michelle Obama, because obviously Michelle Obama has her podcast. We've been talking about that a lot. If you guys saw me on tour, my very favorite thing to talk about is Michelle Obama. I love talking about everything that's going on with their relationship. What she's saying on her podcast, the lies that she makes up, whether it is about her relationship or about Trump, whatever it is, it is hysterical. And literally nobody's watching it except me. But I do it for you guys. But in the moment, I really didn't feel like she deserved the top three position because up until she started this podcast, I felt like she had been a pretty supportive wife. You know, they had a picture perfect family in the White House. They looked so sweet. Their daughters were so adorable. She gave up a significant part of her career to support Barack Obama. But as I was doing research for this episode, I saw a New York Times article from 2007 that made me think that, no, in fact, she does deserve to be here. And she might actually deserve to be the number one spot, because every week in 2025, it seems like she is mocking and belittling Barack, saying that she thinks that he is too well respected, which makes it hard for her to have a career. She's saying that she was so glad that they didn't have a son because then she would have had to raise another Barack. She makes fun of him, all of these different things, but it goes way back, further than this. And this is what the New York times published in 2007. This author writes, usually, I love the dynamics of a cheeky woman puncturing the ego of a cocky guy. It feels very rom com. You know, I liked it in 40s movies. I liked it with Katie Couric and Brian Gumbell and Cybill shepherd and Bruce Willis in Moonlighting. So why don't I like it with Michelle and Barack? And then she puts a quote here from Michelle. Michelle says, I have some difficulty reconciling the two images that I have of Barack Obama. There's Barack Obama, the phenomenon. He's an amazing orator, Harvard law reviewer, whatever it was. Law professor, best selling author, Grammy winner. Pretty amazing, right? And then there's the Barack Obama that lives with me in my home. And that guy's A little less impressive. For some reason, this guy still can't manage to put the butter up when he makes toast, secure the bread so that it doesn't get stale, and his five year old is still better at making the bed than he is. That is something that Michelle said about Barack in a speech that she gave in 2007. The writer goes on and says, many people I talked to afterwards found Michelle wondrous, but others worried that her chiding was emasculating. Casting her husband under fire for lacking experience as an undisciplined child. This was the first lady of the United States saying this about the President of America. And you know, this author is right. Like I said at the beginning, the cheeky woman, the flirting, the puncturing the ego. That is cute in movies when it's done in a funny, loving way. But I don't really feel like this is funny or loving. Especially not when it's done over a 20 plus year span. Because over the long run, continuing to puncture this man's ego, to degrade him in public, all in the name of views and attention and laughs, simply is not it. That is not the formula to having a healthy marriage. And there is a clear difference between doing that in a flirty way in private or making jokes and and doing it in some kind of public forum, no matter what it is, for the sole purpose of attention. And all of this reminds me of an interview that Alex Clark just did with Tilly Dillahay on her podcast. Watch this clip. Telling women to speak their truth. Turning women into nags.

Tilly Dillahay (23:04)

Yes, I think so. But to tell a woman you need to say what's in your heart and mind at all times or you're somehow lying. Lying to yourself. That's something that our grandmothers would have snorted at. Like they would have heard that and just laughed.

Brett Cooper (23:20)

But is that just talking about, is that old fashioned? I mean, why is it bad to speak what's on your heart and mind at all times?

Tilly Dillahay (23:26)

Because sometimes what's on your heart and mind is sinful and wrong. And sometimes it doesn't need to be said. Even if it's true and it's not sinful and wrong, sometimes it's not the right time. And if you want to learn how to love, well, you have to learn to choose the right place and the right time. And also, you know, if you've ever been married to another human being, you know, sometimes waiting, you know, a day means it's not on your heart and mind anymore.

Brett Cooper (23:56)

You know, it's gone. I'm sure that these women like Michelle think that they are some kind of martyr, that they are showing women, you know, how to speak their mind and how to empower each other and all of these things, how to call out their husbands flaws in the public forum. But the public often sees it for what it really is, which is inappropriate, nagging and not actually working through your problems in a way that is healthy and respectful. And guys, it's also not just Hollywood. This is not a famous person problem. This has become a huge trend on social media. You will see thousands of videos of wives setting up their phones and going, let me tell you what my husband did today. I almost divorced my husband. Here I am filming him, making fun of him for whatever he's doing. Oh, here are all the icks that I have about my husband. He walked backwards. Weird. And now I have the ick and I'm gonna post about it. Like, those might seem like small little things, especially the jokes, but that adds up. And the more videos that are like that online, the more celebrity women who talk about their husbands in this way, it just steamrolls into something. It steamrolls into a culture and this idea that that is permissible and that that's okay and that that is actually a key to having a healthy, open communication relationship, when it actually is the exact opposite. And this whole trend has become so big that there are now a myriad of articles that are written about it. Like this one on Medium. This one is from two years ago. And this woman said, my ick is women who mock their men on TikTok. I mean, this is just one example of the hundreds of thousands that you will see if you open up social media. He's putting on sunscreen. And the song that she has behind it, which you might not be able to play because of copyright, is. You look so dumb right now. That's what she's playing. And then she moves over her screen to her list of icks that she has. It is a man putting on sunscreen. I'm sorry, if you do not like your husband rubbing lotion on his legs or sunscreen, you are going to have a long life of grievances ahead of you. And the author of that article that I referenced, she brought up a good point. And she said, what is interesting about this phenomenon that you just saw is that it's a lot harder to find tiktoks of husbands mocking their wives. Ick. That's likely because men could not eat get away with that. That's what I was saying about Jada Smith and Will Smith. Will Smith doing all of that, he would not have been able to get away with any of this. Barack Obama making fun of what his wife was doing at home if she was the President of the United States, he would not be able to get away with this. If a large group of men secretly taped their wives, secretly uploaded the footage and mocked them for doing innocuous things, those men would be divorced in minutes and the Internet mob would tell the woman that she deserves better. Leave him do all of these things. That is what the Internet would say. Husbands and boyfriends are expected to just tolerate being crapped on in public because it's just a joke. But is it, though, what's actually funny about any of this? A guy was stretching before a ball game, which is somehow an ick to his partner. Yay, she posted it and got 14 likes. Validation. Yeah, that's what it's all about, is validation. And it can be in the form of applause from thousands of people and millions of views on your Red Table Talk podcast or Netflix deals. Or it can be the validation from the 14 people who follow you on TikTok, or the slight possibility that your TikTok video will go viral and a bunch of other wives will pile on and continue to crap on your husband and share their stories so that you feel less alone. And it should not be this way, because again, we are all human. We are not perfect. Wives are gonna do things that annoy their husbands. Husbands are gonna do things that annoy their wives. A husband, and I can't believe I have to say this is not a punching bag. He's not a punchline for views. He is your partner. And also, men are really not that hard to please. And according to studies, simple thank you. Being grateful can decrease the chances of a divorce. The University of Georgia did a report on this and they said we found that feeling appreciated and believing that your spouse values you directly influences how you feel about your marriage, how committed you are to it, and the belief that it will last. Importantly, we found that when couples are engaging in a negative conflict pattern like demand withdrawal, expressions of gratitude and appreciation can counteract or buffer the negative effects of this type of interaction on marriage stability. Now, obviously, this does not mean that if you are in a terrible marriage, if you have a deadbeat spouse, if you are angry, if you are in an abusive situation, that all you need to do is be grateful and everything will be fine. That is not what I'm saying at all. That is not reasonable. But if you are in a wonderful marriage, with somebody that you love and you are going through a hard time. If you are dealing with the normal parts of being a complex human that has to live with another complex human, and you are going through the daily happenings of that, then just being grateful and having a decent amount of respect can go a long way. And like I said at the beginning, we can look at all the women that we talked about today. We can laugh at them, we can cringe, we can be embarrassed, but we can still learn from them. We can learn what not to do. That's why I think it's so important to look at them critically and to know that the Jada Pinkett Smiths and the Meghan Markles and the Michelle Obamas, the Chrissy Teigens, the oh my gosh, Nicola who married into the Beckham family, you look at these huge personalities, these celebrities that were so supposed to look up to and try to emulate, that are inspirations and you should not think that they are normal or healthy, that there is something better. So I encourage you to look through that, look for better influences and just try to be grateful. That's for men and women. Have gratitude. Do not shame your partner in public just because it is popular, because it is cool, because it can get you 14 clicks on social media. I promise, for the sake of your relationship, for the sake of your marriage, it is not worth it.