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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the Business with Beers podcast. This is the place where we help entrepreneurs expand their business, build their wealth, and generate passive income. I'm your host, Brian Beers, an entrepreneur who's on a mission to inspire growth from everyone around me. Remember that you need to take the actions others won't, and you can live the life that others don't. Please be sure to check out my weekly newsletter that now drops every Thursday. Includes one quote, one tweet, one podcast recommendation, plus some business and investing insight. For me, it's short and it's sweet. My goal is to provide you with just a couple gold nuggets, help inspire your growth. Go to brianbeers.com to subscribe. Hello, everyone. I'm excited today to bring back Cliff Kennedy. He is the CEO of Frio's Pops, which is my daughter's favorite treat. I get hounded every day. Now we're about out of popsicles, and she's like, when are you buying more? When are you getting more? Anyway, welcome to the show, Cliff.
- [00:57]
B
Thanks, Bron. Excited to be back, my friend.
- [00:59]
A
Awesome. So today. Today's. Today's episode is gonna be a little bit different. Me and Cliff are gonna, you know, have an open conversation about franchising, the things we're seeing, you know, from my perspective as, you know, a franchisee, helping people buy franchises. Cliff, you know, running a great company that just crossed 100 units in the Frios Gourmet Pops system. So let's start off by that the unit count. How important is to. If we're a franchise, if somebody's looking at one or you guys talking about the franchise world, how important is 100 units or a thousand units or 50?
- [01:34]
B
You know, I was thinking about this, and so we had 24 hours to celebrate. We've always been pushing and pushing to get to the 100 unit mark because you get out of that emerging status in the franchising space. But I've come to really realize that that number only matters to private equity groups. It matters to the franchisor so they can claim triple digits, but in reality, it doesn't mean much. It's it. You can do it a bunch of different ways. I was thinking about earlier. I was like, what if all my territories were just 50,000 people? I'd be at 300 units right now. So what is that number? It's kind of made up of what it really represents. It's all about the people, and it's about how many franchisees you actually have, which is more important in the focus of as us, As A franchisor. Focus on the franchisees, not how many territories you really have.
- [02:20]
A
You can sell one guy a hundred units, and you have one human you're working with versus, you know, ten humans who buy ten each or a hundred that buy one each. Right. Like, and. And that. Those are completely different businesses to manage from a franchisor spot. And then the. The quality and the strength of the system.
- [02:35]
B
Right, exactly. It goes back to just. Okay, yes, we were. It's great to market that. We're 100 units across the country. That's great. But now it should get out of our marketing campaign. It doesn't matter what the numbers are. It's about successful franchisees making sure they're happy and validating the company that we're building and building that platform for success for them.
- [02:55]
A
You know what's funny, too? In the FDDs, it doesn't report franchisees. Right. It's only units.
- [03:01]
B
Exactly. And again, you can't even.
- [03:03]
A
As a system. Right. You can't even. I was trying to look at what brand the other day. I was like, how many franchisees, like humans have signed? And it has all the names listed by location, but sometimes it consolidates. You know, if someone owns a bunch of territories, it could just say Midas Philadelphia or, like, whatever. And then it's, you know, Brian Beers doesn't actually say that. Hey, he's got. It's 5 or 7 or 10 or 1 or so. It's like.
- [03:24]
B
And you got to go sit there and count individual. It's not something that's presented to you. So what's the point of that? Even in the document, to be honest, we're going back for it. And, you know, as you change lawyers, as we all do in franchise law and everything, it's like, we're even going through it now. They're like, oh, well, some of these numbers have to change because we don't look at it this way. It's like, how are there so many people looking at it a different way? It should be black and white. Like, this is what this means. Even if we change companies, it shouldn't change our numbers.
- [03:52]
A
Yeah. So what are some of the biggest misconceptions that you see out there? Like, you're talking to franchise candidates. You have franchisees who've been in for new ones and ones that obviously been in it for a long time. What are some things that you think people don't realize they have this idea, but then it's like, reality's different.
- [04:09]
B
Yeah. I think when they get in, look, that's the great thing about franchising. We all say you go in business for yourself, but not by yourself. And sometimes I really feel like they put a lot of the pressure on the franchisor to run their business and the keyword being their business. So once they really focus on getting out of it, if they face a little competition that we all have, they've got to have that great determination to overcome those obstacles. We can give them the resource on how to do it, but at the end of the day, it's their business. They have to run their business for themselves.
- [04:40]
A
Yep. Yeah. I think there's a big misconception out there. I think some people think that it's like, you know, buying the franchise is like you're quasi corporate and it's like, well, if I don't, you know, if nobody shows up for my, my shop, like someone, like they're going to send somebody who's going to run it, right? And like, no, no, it's not what's going to happen. Like, you know.
- [05:00]
B
Yeah, go ahead.
- [05:01]
A
Like, you're a business owner. I'm a business owner and I just happen to like, buy into a system and I happen to agree to play by rules and then I pay rent in the form of royalties to, to play, play by those rules. Like, but it's my business. I go and I operate every single day the way I want to do it. And as long as I'm, I'm in the, I'm in bounds, you know, everything's good. Right. But it's, but it's my business. I just happen to operate within a franchise system. And I think that's like, that's like, it sounds minor, but it's, it's like super important.
- [05:31]
B
Very much so. And I think sometimes they all think because they're joining a franchise brand. It's all Starbucks, which is not franchise, but it's TACO Bell, it's McDonald's, like, just people are going to beating down their door first thing of the day and like, there's gonna be people all day long coming in their business, but they don't realize those brands are massive. They've got, you know, billions of dollars in revenue and everything and brand awareness. But for some of the brands, be it Frios or some of the others, like, they really have to go out there and be boots on the ground. And that's what they don't get sometimes. I think, you know, we go through that. Like, oh, well, why aren't people just showing up? Because it still takes, you have to Let your area know about yourself. Even for you, with being a big brand of mine, it's like you. You still have to go out there and do the mailers and do the things you have to do to get cars who come to your location.
- [06:18]
A
Yeah. I mean, traffic. Driving traffic is like one of our number one focuses for every brand too. And it's. I think one of the most important things is really realizing, like, when you're going into it, like, what are the key metrics that drive traffic? And, you know, it's always a combination of things, right. There's, like, there's digital marketing, so a lot of the brands say, hey, we're gonna do all this digital marketing for you. You know, we're gonna Facebook and, you know, PPC and SEO and all this fancy stuff that changes all the time, that turns, leads to a call center and they convert them, which is all great. Right? And. And you know, it works really well sometimes, but then other times, like, there's shifts in, you know, what Facebook does in these algorithms. Right. And that what worked a week ago could potentially not work like this week. And so then the brand, like, hopefully the franchise is using like a third party or has in house people, right, who are really like, on their. On their shit and can. Can adapt to it. But it's like, it's like a roller coaster up and down on the digital world just because of, you know, how fast it changes.
- [07:17]
B
And I can imagine that's what you have to go through is you're trying to get new franchise candidates.
- [07:21]
A
Yeah. And so then the other part of it, right, is like supplementing that with the boots on the ground, which is like the Frios. Like, it's the going and building and shaking hands and like, knocking on doors and doing the work that's like, not scalable. That's hard. And that's why you need local people who are driven to do it. Cause it. You have to go physical. And I think that's like the people who really understand that and, like, can execute on it. I think those are the people that have a ton of success.
- [07:48]
B
Yeah. I mean, it's. It goes back to guerrilla marketing, hacking systems and everything. I mean, you look at all these marketing podcasts and articles that come up, they're like, oh, well, you have to change a square picture to a long picture. You have to do it where it's this word versus that word. I mean, it is constantly chang. Changing. We. We're always flooded in our inboxes, like, oh, you. This is. The algorithm has changed. This isn't working anymore. So. But what really has never changed and what always works is getting out of your car, getting going to the people, meeting the people, shaking their hands, like you said, knocking on doors. As much as people think that's old school, old school still works. It has never gone away. The power of a cold call still works. You just have to do it. And it requires hard work. And I tell the people all the time, like, we're not going to get into that system where we all see on LinkedIn now, like, those DMS constantly get them fed. But it's like, if you're strategic in how you do it and what you're wording, your ROI will be much higher than just going out and just trying to randomly get people.
- [08:53]
A
Yeah. So how do you. How do you guys go about coaching people into that mindset of to go out and be and be, you know, do the outbound work that's. That might be uncomfortable for people.
- [09:07]
B
Yeah. I mean, there's a couple different ways that we do it where you take those baby steps, because a lot of them are like, oh, well, I'm just nervous about doing that. Okay, so do it with your friends first. Like, you just started this business. Reach out to your 20 people in your phone that you just text, like, tell them what you're doing, so you have, like, that rapport with them already. And then what works and what gets them excited? Start making those cold calls, like, using the same tone, use every. The same words, all that. And then you'll start to gravitate towards people. That. Or gravitate towards a system that works for you and how to speak to people. And you'll get really comfortable being uncomfortable, as they say.
- [09:44]
A
Yeah. And then it's like, just overcoming the fear of rejection is, like, a huge part of it. Right. Like, we have this. Like, we don't want to make the call because, like, we're afraid they're going to. They're going to, like, yell at us or they're going to, like, hang up the phone. Or, like, they hang up the phone, they yell at you. Like, what's the worst that happens? Like, you just. You just pick up the phone, you call somebody else. Right. But it's like, you know what I mean? But, like, a ton of people, like, even I've been in that role where I had to, like, cold call people, and it's like, you just, like, don't want to do it. And then it's. But then you do it and you're like, all right, I have to do it like, what's the worst that can happen? They hang up on me. What's the best thing that can happen? Is they buy and then you. Then that person loves it so much, they refer you to five other people, and each one of those love it so much they refer to five other. Now you have 25 people in sales off of one call that you didn't want to make because you thought it would have hurt your feelings.
- [10:32]
B
And so what I do with some of our franchisees, let's just say they're really nervous and they don't know. We step it back. We say we're going to be very specific. You're just calling schools so you have that same mindset of who you're talking to. So if the first school says no, call the next one, change it up a little bit. Then you're going to see what works and then report back to us after you've called 30 schools, let us know how many schools you landed, and then what happens? And then start that list back over and see if you can get the nos into yeses, because as you know, you got to have no three times before it's a real no. So then they start to get methodical in their process and learn what works and what doesn't and then go on to the beyond schools. Go to churches or go to resorts or country clubs and then perfect your model every time.
- [11:19]
A
Yeah, I mean, we're doing the same thing with the painting business, right? It's, it's, it's building referral partners, it's. It's realtors, it's property maintenance, it's electricians, it's roofers. Like, you know, it's knocking on doors of like, hey, we're in the neighborhood, we're doing a job over here. And just, you know, you need anything, let us know. We give free estimates, blah, blah, blah. Like, we don't want to be a bother, right? And then like, even that, like, they teach. How do you. How do you knock on a door? How do you break the ice? Like, and that's like, super awkward for a lot of people, but like, like, it works. Like, it totally works. And you can build a massive business on, on, on doing these things that other people don't want to do. And it's a matter of, like, your ability to, to say, hey, I want it more than anybody else, and I'm going to do whatever I have to do and lead the team, right?
- [11:58]
B
To.
- [11:59]
A
To do the things that they have to do, then coaching them.
- [12:02]
B
And some of it's Innate in the people that love selling. Like for me, I love selling. Um, and so everyone on my team knows that if you tell me can't, you're going to drive me nuts. Because there's always a way. Or if someone tells me no, that even drives me even more nuts. I just look at it like I didn't explain it to them in a way to get them to say yes. So what did I do wrong? It's not that they don't want it. They, it's. It's the same philosophy that a lot of people say or analogy. Every day when you wake up, someone's got your money in their pocket and they just haven't given it. You just, they just don't know know it yet.
- [12:36]
A
That's right.
- [12:37]
B
So that's that mentality. You gotta have like they have your money in their pocket. You just got to figure out how to get them to say yes and give it to you.
- [12:45]
A
Yeah, yeah. And a lot of that, I mean that just goes back to being an entrepreneur. Right. And starting a business and being a business owner is that you have that drive that a lot of people just don't have. Right. And they don't have what it takes. And then, you know, they're kind of, you know, better suited, you know, as an employee, which is totally fine. Right. But for the people that like, are never going to give up and like are going to keep doing whatever it takes, that's where, you know, having that business that, that you then have unlimited possibilities. Right. Because no one's going to hold you back. Yeah.
- [13:14]
B
I think, Brian, I'd love to get your viewpoint on this. And I think that's maybe the. One of the biggest things in franchising versus just single business owner that's not in franchising is I think they believe that once they come into a franchise, they buy into the system, there's going to be no struggles. They're not going to have that worth rough first year where they've got to grow, build up that book of business. I think out of the gates they're like, we're going to be super successful. Everything is rainbows and sunshines. Let's go. Versus that young entrepreneur that's going on it themselves. Like they know there's dark days ahead. Like they've got to grit and figure it out. I think that's the biggest difference between franchising versus single operator.
- [13:53]
A
Yeah, but even, I mean the franchise we. I try to set the same expectations with people and it's hard. Like those first couple months are hard. Like, no matter what business it is, to get that plane off the ground, like, takes a ton of acceleration, ton of hard work, and like a franchising makes it easier, right? Because you've got the systems, you've got support. Like, there's a bunch of people, you know, you're struggling. You can, you can text, you can call, like they can coach you, right? Like there's, there's lots of like the systems and support, but at the end of the day, you got to go still and, and, and get that plane off the ground. Then once it's, it's, it's, it's cruising, then it's, you know, it's, it's easier. Right? You can make these adjustments and you can, you know, get back on the, the right path. But like, even in the pain business, we're like, we have three territories. Like we're going to hit our budget for the first month. One of them has sold 80% of the the budget though, right? And then, and then 10, then like 10% and like 10% or something like that. So like one guy is absolutely crushing it, the other two are struggling. Right. And so it's like a matter of, yeah, we hit our goal, but like, you know, we think it's going to be a third. A third, A third. But in reality, you know, it's always like that. I mean, even in, you know, in our multi unit, you know, the business, we have stores that absolutely crush it and probably make 80, you know, the 20% make 80% of the money. And that, that rule applies and it's. But if you only have like one location or one thing, sometimes, like, you know, until you can build that big enough, you know, it's this roller coaster ride, right?
- [15:14]
B
Yeah. And even if you're a single unit operator, it, it's 80% of the things that you do aren't making you money. So focus on the 20%. Like when I first started Frios or when I bought Frios, we used to give options. They used to have 30 or 40 flavor options at one time. Like that wasn't economically sound for you to buy all these flavors. Like now we've pared it down. Like, you probably only need 10 flavors at one time. And then if you really look at your sales, there's only about three or four of them are making all your sales. So I mean, it's crazy how all that works. And if it's your strategies that work and what works for you, is it door knocking, is it flyers, is it SEO? What are you trying to do that works and then just really focus in on what gets you the best. Roi.
- [15:54]
A
Yeah. And it's that simplicity, I think, that's, like, the biggest thing that I think a lot of business franchises I've seen concept too, or the concept's too complicated. There's, like, too many things going on. And even for Midas, I've complained about this for years. I mean, it's just our business model, but, like, we've tried to be everything to everyone, where it's like, we're going to do quick oil changes. Oh, now we're going to sell tires, and we're going to do brakes, and now we're going to, oh, we can replace your engine. Like, like, we can do the most basic tasks and the most complicated task, which we, we do have people that can do that. But then, you know, there's other brands out there that all they do is tires, and they're the best in the world at just doing tires. Or, like, all they do is oil changes, and they're the best because that's all they have to do. Right? Well, we need, you know, our business is pretty complex because we need a tire guy, a brake guy, a diagnostic guy, an oil change guy. Right? Like, we need these different skill sets, you know, and different equipment, different marketing, different. Different customers have different expectations based on, like, what they're coming in for. And so I don't know. There's never a way we're probably gonna get more simple in that business. But I, I, that's like, one of the things that I'm looking for in any business that we invest going forward is the simplicity. And that's why, you know, painting's pretty simple. Like, we're putting, we're putting paint on walls. Like, there are complicated things to it, but it's not like we're getting into all these other lines of business. Like, oh, we're also, clean out your gutters while we're up there painting. Or, oh, we'll hang Christmas lights because we got ladders, right? Like, like, there's lots of ways these companies, it's like, what are you doing? Like, just keep it simple and just go, like, you know, go on, be.
- [17:19]
B
Really good at one thing. Like, your core business. Be really good at. And that's for us. It's like people all always pitching us, like, oh, can we carry your product? Like, no, we're Frios Gourmet Pops. Like, that's our brand. That's what we're. We're not trying to become Frios Gourmet. Concession stand. It's, you know, so if we stay at what you're good at, you're going to be fine. Just be a master of one, not a jack of all trades.
- [17:41]
A
Yep. And then just like, and then in franchising, the best part, right, it becomes duplicatable. So then you can just do it over and over and over again. So like you don't solve like you always have problems, but like they're never new problems. It's like, all right, this thing happened again. It happened last, you know, a month ago or a year ago. And like we know how to handle it, right? Because we've already seen it, we know how to fix it. Like, and then we make an adjustment going forward to try to reduce the frequency of this happening versus like somebody who has five different businesses. It's like, you know, there's five different problems in different economics and business plans and marketing plans and people and like, and if you don't have like key leaders, then you're like now you're so deluded. Right. Because you have all these different things you got to think about versus like I got one thing, I'm just gonna like crush it in this one thing and, and I'll, I'll get my creative juice out some, somewhere else.
- [18:29]
B
Yeah. But you, you kind of went over the point there is like that's the one thing great about franchising is that somebody's done something wrong before you bought into that franchise. So you don't have to do it now as and especially if it's a single unit. Okay, how do I build myself up to the multi unit owner? There's been a lot of people before you that have figured out, okay, this did not work. This is not the way to scale your business. Perfect. I don't have to do that. But if you do break something and you're a single unit operator, guess what? Then the franchise or can then share it with everyone saying, hey, this franchisee just tried this, it didn't work. Our system was broken and marketing, whatever it was, didn't register very well. So let's fix it. And then how you can spread that across your company. I think that's the big thing about franchising too. That gives you this, that power of.
- [19:14]
A
Community thinking about like in this multi unit thing, like you know, I always tout like multi unit, multi use, but all this stuff. Right. But like so I'm, I'm a, we're a partner in a home health care business that's you know, non medical senior. It's it's in Philly and you know, we've got, I think it's three territories. I don't know, it was an existing one we bought. But like you know, we service 30, 30 clients a month and it'll do about 2 million a year in revenue. It's like a, you know, it's, it's, you know, it's a high paid thing, right, for somebody wants care. And it's like, you know there's like 150,000 seniors in this, in this market and we serve 30, you know, 30 of them. And it's like we talk about, oh we're going to buy all these locations by all Philly. But it's like, man, we could just like we can get to like a $10 million business if we had 150 of 150,000. Like I don't even know what that decimal is. It's like a tenth of a percent, right. Like so sometimes we think like, oh, we need all this big geographical area and we need more offices and we need more people. But then in some of these businesses like the opportunity within them is they're so big that like you know, we can build a massive business with one office and like one core staff and like you know, but our team gets bigger, right? So we're not multi unit from a, from a, from a like a number of offices standpoint. But like we be, we build a bigger business that becomes more resilient, right? Because now we have multiple recruiters, we've got multiple salespeople, right? We've got, you know, different, it's just, it's just a different structure, right? And I think that's like what we're going for, multi unit is reducing risk of a single location, right? Of a single thing. You build a bigger business, you've got more payroll dollars, you can hire better people who take on more responsibility. That gives you more freedom, right? Because like you're not involved in all the little stuff anymore. But like even in that business, like we can build a $20 million a year business in, in you know, three territories or one, one area because you know, the opportunity so massive, it's just not multi unit but it's, we have, we, we can build that infrastructure. I don't know. So I've been thinking about that recently.
- [21:17]
B
That's a great point. It's like, you know what happens in our business because we're a mobile franchise is that it's the, the mentality of ooh look new shiny thing or ooh look, new company outside of my territory. And so yes, with permission, they can go outside their territory, but yet they're missing all that amazing opportunity. Like we have a sizable territory, 150, 200,000 people. So but yet they're going, they're like, oh, I got to go outside of my territory. Outside of my territory. Like if you really focus, it's like growing a business. If anything, if you're a home services or mobile business, if you just stay really, really close to the nucleus of where your home base is and then snowball that and scale it out. There's so many opportunities. If you just started to put like a little 1 mile radius around your territory, like, all right, what can we do here? That's really good. And then let's go further out and further out and then that's where you build that multi unit mentality is like, I got really good at a small location. Now just imagine if I had two, three, four territories doing the same thing.
- [22:13]
A
And it's this balance of. I think it's easier to have more average than to have less really good. Right? Like it's easier to have a whole bunch of average locations that just do okay, like you're doing the bear, you know, whatever, the average to get by. Like that's easier in a lot of ways than saying, hey, I'm going to like, you know, even for us, like we have a bunch of average stores, we have a bunch of below average stores, like, you know, versus, hey, I want to get all my stores to 2 million bucks or two and a half million or 3 million. It takes like a lot of work to get this the store up there. But the rewards are so much more like, and that's the other part. If we can grow same store sales, our goal this year is to grow our same store sales by $10 million, which we would make. We have a significant margin on that incremental $10 million because all of our costs are covered for the most part. We have incremental payroll and incremental cost of goods and royalties. But like rent's already paid, utilities are paid, insurance, back office overhead, like all the stuff's already paid. And so like once you can get your business up to a certain point, then all the incremental growth is way more profitable than the first. You know, the first like 10 million or 40 million. In our case, the next 10 million is equally profit to the first 40.
- [23:26]
B
Yeah, and I think that's the difference of mentality. You just have it. I feel like, you know, the people are like, I don't See how I can ever be successful, like. But yeah, this is one location. Like, think if you did this, you don't have to have all these added resources and as much people. Yes. There are things that go up. Your cogs go up. Exactly. Royalties kind of go up a little bit, but your baseline is just dropping, just dollars to the bottom line. Because you can grow, but yet you still got everything so short. Yeah. You got all the cost or fine. Yeah, exactly.
- [23:57]
A
So for you guys, like, in your, you know, you manufacture all your pops and it's just like, you could probably. I don't know, I. I bet you could double your output of pops and like, you know, it's not like your cost double. Right. Like, from a. From a fixed cost diluted. The machines are the same, the utility is the same. Obviously you've got incremental costs of, of the variable. But, like, and that's like, as the business gets bigger, like, and that's what we're really starting to see now is these, these, like, it gets diluted and diluted and then, you know, becomes a more profitable business, which is like an easier business to run because, like, you've got more margin for error. Like, we can hire. We can take a risk in hiring somebody who doesn't work out, but, like, you know, we can have that risk because we've got the margin. Right. And they do work out. Like, man, we got a ton of upside now because we got this really good person. If they don't, it's like, well, we tried, but, like, you know, it's not breaking the bank. And so that's like, having that margin of safety is like a huge part in wanting to grow any, any business.
- [24:51]
B
Yeah, it's just getting there to that point. Now you've spent money to get there. And that's the. What they say, you got to spend money to make money. So there is a little bit of that. That's part of that growth. Like you said, as long as you got your fixed cost in line and you've got them registered, you're like, I'm covering all our carrying cost. Let me grow exponentially. That starts to drop to that bottom line. So as we try to tell franchisees, like, hey, look, this is what you're doing in one territory. Think of what happens if you buy two. Now, yes, there's territory fees and added royalties, but look, you're not really adding much to your fixed costs. You might get a couple of cards for us. Or if you're buying three territories, you might buy an additional band, but look how much more revenue you can potentially have by doing that.
- [25:34]
A
Yeah, it's awesome. So what questions do you have for me?
- [25:39]
B
What's next for you? I feel like, what is your plan, Brian? You get to always. I got to think about it. Well, you always talk about you got Midas, you got T1P now home health care, like, are you trying to be the next Flynn? Are you gonna just keep going and going? Or, like, are you trying to go wide? Are you going wider with more brands? Or do you want to go deeper with, like, do you want to buy an extra 30 territories? Like, what. What's that for you?
- [26:06]
A
Yeah, so, like, I've kind of seen it as a funnel. I. I tweeted about this a couple days or, I don't know, a week or two ago. It's like trying to map out, right, Because I think about this a lot too. What's the goal? And it's like, everything starts at the top of operationally running great companies, right, where we have great people, we run great companies, we pay well, we like happy customers, happy employees, all this stuff. And so that generates A, money, B, stories, lessons learned, things that I can then help teach other people. And so I think it all starts with do cool shit in real life. Other than that, there's no credibility. There's no, like, it doesn't matter, right? And I think there's a lot of people, you know, online and, you know, out there toting things that just aren't true because they don't. They just don't have, like, the. The learned experience. Like, you know, book knowledge is great, but, like, learned experience is. Is way better. And so, you know, I think, I think I. I do well just, you know, online and into the podcast and everything because, you know, I've got real life experience. And so it all starts with that. Then I think a, then it goes into how can we help more people? And I believe that the more people I can help and build the audience through Twitter and newsletter and all the platforms, that it just opens up so many more opportunities into my world. Because then people get to know you, they get to trust you. People come to me all the time with ideas, and then that also then attracts higher quality people into our world. That instead of me going out and trying to find someone, I got people coming to me to say, hey, here's what I've done. I'd love to try to work with you, blah, blah, blah. And so I think the audience is the key part to opening up the world. You do it through educating People through showing them options, opening people's minds to an opportunity that exists. And then from there, so we build the audience. Then it's like there's two ways it goes. One is through getting to know people. Deeper is through this mastermind we just launched called the eight figure franchisee. So it's for driven franchise owners who want to be surrounded in a private group with other driven franchisees. And so we've got people who are just getting started opening the first franchise. We've got a guy who runs 100 whose partners in a brand that does over 100 million a year as a franchisee. And so we've got a wide range of, of people and where they're at in their journey. But they, but we all share the same core values and ideas around building an eight figure, like franchise life through franchising. So 10 million in sales, 10 million of cash flow, 10 million of net worth, right? Like it's trying to build this thing. And so anyway, through that we are now like, you know, I'm getting the right people in the right room and we're helping a ton of people. And through that now I get to know people, right? And I think through that group, like, I will find part, find partners. Because the franchise is all about people, right? We're all in the people business that happened to sell pops, fix cars, paint houses, whatever, doesn't matter. We're in the people business. And so, like, to be successful, you have to have a great team. And so like, I kind of see as this funnel that, you know, the audience leads to, you know, education, which then leads to this mastermind or so I can get to know people on a personal level, which then leads to, you know, hey, we may find someone through this group that like, we get to know, we get to trust. And now, you know, now we're become partners, right? Where, you know, we've got the money and the experience and maybe the resources to kind of help them take their business from, you know, wherever they're at now to 10x bigger and, and I could be a part of that and I would enjoy that, right? And so like, I get more joy from, from that side of the business now than I do from the operations of, of the, of the business, right? Like, I've got an excellent COO who's like an excellent leadership team on that side who absolutely crush it. And they are better at that stuff than me, I think. Like, you know, as a business owner, like, you evolve. Like I used to do it all. I used to be, you know, store Manager, the district manager, the CEO. I guess I'm still the CEO. But then you realize, like, what are you really, like, passionate about? What are you really good at? Like, in my skills, like, I'm better at this, right. The communication, the ability to kind of open people's eyes to new ideas, to new concepts, to kind of walk them through that vision. And I get more joy out of that than it's like digging deep into how do we become more efficient at this thing. Right. Or how do we solve this specific operational problem, which I would get frustrated or bored or it wouldn't be good, versus letting the people who are really good at that stuff do those things. And so, yeah, I mean, I kind of see it as, do I want to own 100 mighty shops? Like, probably not. Am I going to continue to fill in the market that we currently have, where we currently have resources allocated and really good teams where I think we can plug and play? Yeah, we're going to do those all day long and then it's going to compound. Right? I think the coolest thing about social media and the podcast and newsletter and all this stuff is it just compounds over time and then it gets faster and faster and then that leads to just more and more opportunities. And, you know, I'm going to do my best to say no to as many of them as possible.
- [31:19]
B
So that's awesome. Look, I don't think anyone's ever heard that at link like that. At least. I know, I know. So it's, it's great to see that, you know, you're more people focused now. You've gotten to that stage where it's like, okay, you don't have to be in the operations, you don't have to be in the nitty gritty. You can come in 30,000ft now and really you found your space through your experience, which is, you know, leading first in class in this industry, but also what you're doing as a broker, you know, as that's what's more important. I feel like what I see, which is the opportunity of where you are, where you are on social media. It's crazy that, you know, I have mutual acquaintances. Like mobile, where I live is not known for franchising. I think I'm the only franchisor. Maybe there's one or two of us here. But it's crazy that someone will see on Twitter that you posted about Frios and they're like, dude, how do you know Brian? Like, are you serious that you know Brian get all this content? Like, what do you think about it. I was like, great guy. We just spoke the other day. So it's really cool what you've done beyond what you even know and the people that speak to you and how highly they speak of you. So, yeah, I think you're doing a great job. And it's. And it's well known by people outside of the franchising space as well.
- [32:40]
A
Yeah, no, I appreciate that. And, yeah, it's even amazing to me because, like, I don't know, last. I got. I started on Twitter last May, so it's almost a year now. You know, almost two years, I guess. Almost two years. And, like, you know, I started with 200 followers, and I was just like, all right, let me just like, talk about real life experiences, like, in the business we're building and the struggles we've had. And, like. Like, it's a game, to be honest. Like, you learn how to write, you learn what works, you learn what doesn't, like, you know, in its constant iteration. But, you know, even now, like, I get. I get 2 million views a month, which is, like, even small in the Twitter world, but to me, it's still like, wow, like, there's 2 million eyeballs that view the stuff I write every day. And so it's just. I mean, it's just an amazing thing to say, hey, you can start for nothing, and then you can build this. Ultimately build an awesome business and everything around. Around it, right? In terms of education and media, and then, you know, the brokerage and the mastermind and then just, like, partnerships that we're gonna be working on. And now what I'm trying to figure out is building a team. Like, then. Then you gotta build a team around a personal brand, right? And that becomes a whole nother. Like, that's a whole nother topic. But, like, it's a challenge. I mean, it's not easy, but. But people do it. Like, all the people, you know, like, I mean, there's Cody Sanchez, or you got, like, Dave Rand. You got all these famous people, right, who, like, they are the person, but then they have a whole team behind them, and it's this balance of, you know, continuing to grow and grow, and you can't do everything yourself, just like a business. But then how do you, you know, how do you find those people? How do you vet them? How do you train them? How do you make sure that everything that goes out is in aligns with, you know, your message, your vision, you know, the culture? Like, you're authentic, like, who you are as a person.
- [34:12]
B
You become bigger than what you were known for. Like, you, you're. You become bigger than your business and you become the business of what you've created because of your experiences and the content that you're putting out and sharing. I can only imagine, because then it's not about representing your brand as a, as a company, be it Midas or T1P is representing you.
- [34:34]
A
Yes.
- [34:34]
B
So that means as a person, more important. Look, I mean, like you, I mean, I saw what you did, I've seen what others have done, and it's just being consistent on social media, bringing value in every post almost. And so, I mean, just from starting January 1st to where we are now in March, I went from. Started with like 30 followers. I'm up to like almost 400. That's nothing compared to what you have. But still, the, the connections that I've made, the relationships that I have formed just through dms, it's amazing what's out there. And as you start to build that brand, it becomes more important.
- [35:13]
A
Yeah. And I've, I've, I've personally invested like a ton of money too, into learning all this stuff. Like, it just doesn't. Like people, like, these people see the output, they don't see the work. Right. That goes into it. And like I've, I've been part of multiple, like, personal brand coaching. Right. Like, I just, I just paid one now. It's, it's, you know, it's a good amount of money to be in this mastermind, this coaching program about, you know, building, building like a personal, A business around a personal brand. Right. And that many people do. And it's, it's. It becomes a real business. It's really cool and you know, I enjoy it. Like, so that's like, exciting to me. Just like tinker with all these different things and how it works and what doesn't and you know, then talking about something that I, you know, that I truly believe in and has ultimately changed, you know, my life and has been part of my life since I was born. Like, you know, my dad was a franchisee in 1990, 76 when he was 22 years old. I even, I. My mom found this. These like, whatever, like these, these cartoon things, I guess I drew when I was like in kindergarten and stuff. And I think I wrote like, something about being like. Like I don't know if I wrote franchisee. I don't think I knew that word. But like, you know, that I was going to be in Midas or whatever and with my dad because I idolized, you know, idolized him and you know, I saw him how he's a hard worker and you know, and so anyway, so it's been in my whole life forever. So like I'm truly passionate about it and I, and I truly believe in it. Right. And then it's the, then it's the game of O. Do I. How do I communicate everything in a way that people, that, that captures people's attentions and that, like that, that they can feel the passion that I have about it and then they can start to believe it and then they have to see it for themselves. Right. Like they get to see it and believe it and touch it and feel it and all that stuff. So, you know, the communication's just like the first, you know, one of the first steps. Yeah.
- [36:56]
B
I mean, it goes back to how we started this, you know, 30 minutes ago, whatever it was like. But that's how you become a better writer, a better content creator, better storyteller, because you live those experiences and you're passionate about it. So it makes it a little bit easier. But you're constantly trying to evolve and make yourself better, which only makes your companies better, your people better, and tells that story a whole lot better. And that's, I think that's what's important, is just being consistent in what you're doing to better yourself. You know, I tell people all the time, like, you can push yourself through your education of how smart you are, through running your business every day. You can push yourself physically through working out, exercising. What people really don't do a lot is they push themselves mentally of what they're capable of doing because they get comfortable and they quit. Or it's just that complacency. So getting yourself uncomfortable by posting every day and putting content out there when you know it might fail or not, might get the traction that you really wanted it to do. But showing back up and pushing yourself mentally, that's what I try to do every single day, is just get yourself out there mentally, like a business coach. I did. I did for a short time. I thought about bringing it back. Thought it was great. It was, you know, it was like, man, I need a coach. Like, why me? I was like. But I was like, Tiger woods has a coach. Like professional athletes have coaches. Like, that's really important that someone can help me in what I'm doing and help my team.
- [38:23]
A
Yeah. So I'm like, I joined this, this group of like, you know, business owners, high net worth people or whatever. 2020, right? February 2020, right before COVID and like, so I joined this thing and like, you know, there's guys in there who have $100 million net worth, $200 million net worth, you know, and then there's a little, little on me. And you know, so over the, over the course of, you know, being a part of this thing, I'm still a member today, but I saw there's a pattern that a lot of the most successful guys had coaches, some of them multiple coaches, right? And it was like, well, you're so successful, like, why do you need a coach, right? It's like what you think. But then a lot of times, like, I am, I am successful because I've had great coaches, right? You see the. After, you don't see. Like I said, you don't see the work. And so I said, all right, well, if they all like credit all this stuff to coaching, you know, I should go hire a coach. And so I, so I hired this coach, Trevor McGregor. Google him. He was like Tony Robbins platinum, whatever. He was like under his, under his umbrella for a while. He started his own program. So I started with him in January of, I guess 22, I think. No, maybe it was 21. I forget. It's been a while. I'm still with him, Jay. I'm talking to him in an hour or two. But even having that person has changed my life just because he taught me a whole bunch of things that I never knew. And a lot of it was Tony Robbins related things, but a lot of it was mindset and being uncomfortable and how to overcome fear. And what is it that you really want? A lot of the stuff hasn't actually have anything to do with business. It has to do with how you think about things. In the frame you see the world and like the ability to see the world in a way that like, suits you to, to be honest. Like, I see the world in a way that like, makes sense to me. And then I can, I can see it. I have clarity. I know what to do, right? And I think the, the, the I, the point of the coach is to, is to open up the frame so that you see multiple options and that you then have. Now you have choices, right? And I, you know, he always says like that, you know, my goal is just make sure you have options. Like, a lot of people think like, I only have one option. Like, and then they're all like upset cause they, they feel like they don't have a choice and they're forced into this decision. And his goal was to help you reframe thinking about things in a different way so that you see the three different options. You can weigh it, you can make. Now you feel like you have power, you have a choice, and you may still pick that first option, but now your mindset and the way you believe and see it is completely different.
- [40:36]
B
And that's what I was working with my coach. It's like you've been quite successful and very successful, many would say, in what you've done with your businesses and everything is like, oh, so it's like that first impression, like, I'm doing everything right. Why would I need somebody to tell me do something different? But they're not coming in there to tell you how to run your business. They're telling you how to run your life yourself, how to approach things, how to mentally be prepared for it, how to prepare yourself for adversity and, and how do you build your team up? And that was one of the biggest things, was like, wow, you're not like taking over my business as a coach. You're not telling what to do. And like, hey, run this P and L this way or run your business this.
- [41:11]
A
Yeah.
- [41:11]
B
No, you're telling me like, it's your decisions. Here are your options out there. Like, here's. The road is not split into two. It's split into tentacles everywhere. And like, how do you face those adversities? And that's one of the things I've done. It's like it goes back to it, you know, you got to find your outlet. For me, it's ultra running and facing those adversities on the trail. When you want to quit, it's like, okay, that's awesome. I've been prepared for this now.
- [41:36]
A
Yeah. And then it's like fear of rejection. Like, even I like me, you know, I, I had a ton of fear around even launching this. The mastermind. Right. And it was like, you know, I've had this thing for, I have this vision for a while. I'd planned for a while, but then it was still like, well, what if I start this thing and no one signs up or we can't deliver the value or I've always fear then it's fear of rejection of. Then I don't do something because in my mind I'm going through all these worst case scenarios and then eventually it's like, once again, well, that's the worst that could happen. What's the best that can happen? Well, there'll be a great demand. We'll change a bunch of people's lives. It'll lead to all these other partnerships and then you realize, well, the odds of all that, then what's the odds of that happening versus the odds that, like, you know, you don't communicate it well. Right? And they don't see the value. And you need a better job communicating the value. Right? Because the value is there. And anyway, so, like, whatever pushed me to do, I said, yeah, you're right. Like, right. But I had to overcome that, right? And even so, people at every level have fear of whatever it is, starting the eviction business, rejection of picking up a call, starting this new thing. And, like, and then you overcome it. And then, like, even that thing, I was met, you know, we had a hundred applications. You know, we got whatever, 35 people. Like, we've already had people, like, rave reviews. Like, tons and tons of value. Like, we're delivering on everything we promised and more. But, like, it was still, like, I had this fear of, like, you know, should I even do this? Like, should. Is it worth it for me? And, like, what if I get, you know, how am I going to feel about myself if, like, I get rejected? Right? Like, you run through all these things in your head, and everybody, like, deals with it, and it's.
- [43:08]
B
Yeah, it's lost aversion, and everyone goes through it. It's like, you know, it's, oh, what can I potentially lose here? The failure. What are people going to think about me rather than, what can I potentially do? How great can I be? And it's like, I'm. I'm trying to launch something now. I was like, look, I just really feel that there's something franchising here that everyone's kind of overlooked and started to feel a fear of failure. Like, what if this doesn't work? Am I. Am I considered a failure? Like, no.
- [43:32]
A
Your face goes on a billboard somewhere and said, cliff, biggest failure ever, right?
- [43:38]
B
Looking at you. But no one is, like, nobody's really paying attention. Jim Carrey said something, and I think it's like, I forget where he was. And he said, if you're gonna fail, fail at something you love. Like, that's just it. If you really, like, think you're gonna fail, like, might as well do something you really love and fail, so why not be miserable you?
- [43:59]
A
Like, I mean, I view it now. It's. It's never failure. I just learn what doesn't work, right? Or I learn what needs to adjust. Or, like, even the podcast here, like, you know, the first episodes I did, and my coach actually, my. So my coach pushed me to do the podcast. I credit him for that. But, like, you Know, they were super awkward and like I, you know, it's ums and ahs and whatever you want to think and like, what are we going to talk about? And like, my background looked like I was like a kidnap, like a hostage. It was just like white. And so. But then you get over all that stuff, right? And it's just like.
- [44:24]
B
And it's.
- [44:24]
A
It's like no big deal. And so anyway, I don't know. And I kind of coach all the people we work with, like, you know, who we help find a franchise because everyone's going through the same things or they just started the franchise or they're trying to scale it and it's like we all deal with the same stuff. And it's your ability to figure it out is what makes the difference.
- [44:42]
B
And that's what builds your brand is like you're telling your story. It's, you know, we always want to share our wins and everything. You never want to share your losses because people are going to make fun of you or look down on you or you made a mistake and you did this. It's like, you know what? I took my shot. You. You've taken shots you've missed, but you've learned from. And how do you grow out of them and adjust is what makes us human beings and what. What makes us better at running our businesses and gives the respect of your peers and gives you more opportunity. If somebody comes in my office, like, one of the questions like, what are you not good at? What's your biggest failure in life? And how did you learn from it? If they go, oh, I've really never made a mistake, like, you're not the right person, I don't want that.
- [45:24]
A
What's your biggest failure?
- [45:27]
B
My biggest failure. I took a big shot a couple of years ago in my business and it failed miserably. It just failure launch, huge expansion opportunity.
- [45:37]
A
Didn't another brand or in Frios.
- [45:40]
B
It wasn't considered Frios. It was more like a manufacturing opportunity to really scale, um, best resources and all that kind of stuff. So just got to grow out of. On that side of the business and everything. But. But I learned a lot from it. I took my shot. I'm done saying sorry. I said that to a lot of people. But you move forward from it. You learned so. Or I learned a lot so. Yeah. What about you?
- [46:08]
A
I would say I don't know. So we got in this franchise years ago. That was just the wrong. Like I thought, you know, I could. I touched it. It turns to gold, right? I thought it would be easy. I thought it would be like all this stuff and I didn't do a good job. I think really matching the brand to, to me and my skills and like, I didn't know. I didn't. I thought I knew what it would take to be successful. I didn't really know though. And so yeah, we lost. I mean we lost $300,000 over six years. It was just like 50k a year. We just like put it in this thing to keep like payroll and just going and you know, there's a ton of weight in my soldiers about that. And then eventually, you know, we got out of it. But it wasn't a good relationship with the franchisor and feeling like, you know, I felt stuck, like, you know, threatened to sue me if I close it down. And you know, all the, all the bad stuff that you could imagine, like is what I was feeling, which is honestly a big reason why I do all this stuff. Because I want to help people like avoid that mistake and get into a brand that A doesn't match them. Like that was a huge part of. It was like it was a B2B business. And like, I'm not a B2B guy. I'm like the B2C, the big funnel, right? I'm like the, the call conversion shit. Like all that stuff. I love it. But this is like B2B is like, you know, your relationship, you're like shaking, shaking hands, kissing babies, like dealing with all the stuff, right? And like you got to like, you got to. The owner has to do that at least in the beginning. And like I always tried to hire it out and it just, there's. Nobody could build it. Like the owner builds it it in the beginning. You know, I think once it's mature and stuff, it's fine. But like, so, so we just could, we couldn't really grow the sales. Number 1B unit. Economics, like the business changed. Like the number. The things I thought I was buying into was from like the business that was successful 10 years ago. But over the last couple years with technology and the way, you know, things have changed, like it was way harder to compete today. And the ones that were doing well, it's because they had, you know, a 10 year track record, right? That was kind of really built up. And then it was just, it was, you know, it was heavy inventory, it was low margin, it was like tons of carrying costs. It was like you had to do massive volume, make any money and you know, and then we just couldn't sell enough to do the Massive volume. And you know, thus, thus lose 50,000 a year for six years.
- [48:16]
B
Yeah, but I mean, that's, that's the thing though. It's like you've learned from that. So you realize now I have very good clarity.
- [48:21]
A
Right on. That's the other thing I like, I teach, I talk about now and I've got this, whatever. It's this email course thing I do, which is talking about having very clear what it is of a business model checklist. I am looking for these five things in a business whatever it is. And my checklist is completely different than your checklist because it's for you and business is personal. And so for me, I wanted out of that because that was a complicated business. That was asset heavy, right? That was like, you know, inventory and real estate, like lots of expenses. And so I was like, all right, I'm with the opposite of that, right? So I want something that's simple. It's like, doesn't have a lot of moving parts, that's easier to manage, you know, if I'm not going to be involved in the day to day. Like, it needs to be simple because I need to be able to know like, is this thing working or not?
- [49:06]
B
Not.
- [49:06]
A
Like there's like a million different mousetraps it has to go through. I wanted something that was asset light, right, that didn't have a ton of assets in inventory. I mean, you know, this thing had 300,000 hours of inventory like that. Then you know, like if you didn't move it, like that's how you, that's how you make your money. I wanted something that was, was like a. I could own Philadelphia. I wanted something that, you know, because I could, because I wanted to grow it. But then sales and marketing driven, consumer sales and marketing driven because like that's what Midas is. That's where we have success in the B2B side. Just, it's a. It's a different animal. And like I realized that is not for me, but other people absolutely crush it because that's perfect for them. And they, they don't like any of the B2C stuff. And so I think it's just, it's understanding that there's this process that you have to go through. I think for me that's like, that was probably one of the biggest lessons I learned was, was about myself, right? And the type of business that I would excel in.
- [50:02]
B
But like, look what you just said though. You didn't say my biggest failure. My biggest lesson learned. It's also like mentality, how do you.
- [50:10]
A
What are you.
- [50:10]
B
How are you speaking to yourself? And how are you looking at that? So looking at as a lesson learned. So don't ask me, what's your biggest failure? Asking, like, what's the biggest thing you've ever learned about yourself? And that's what I've always tried to tell my people is like, it's just a framework. It's a mentality. It's what it really is. It's like, do you have that grit? Do you have that hunger and determination to overcome? You're going to come up against the wall. I tell people all the time, Frios is one of the simplest businesses you can ever run. It's literally selling ice cream. That's all it is. I mean, it's a freezer, all that kind of stuff.
- [50:40]
A
As you prepackaged ice cream, it's even simpler.
- [50:43]
B
You're not making anything. It can't get any easier. I even did a. I don't know if you saw, I did a YouTube video the other day, and I was like, hey, this is. I'm let you, you know, a little bit of training that we do here at Frios and how we set up for an event. Open this, you open the serving window and you're done. Like, that's it. That's all you got to do. Set up.
- [50:59]
A
So tell the AI you'll have like, they just. It's a vending machine. They just stick their. They. They put their phone and then it just spits out a popsicle.
- [51:06]
B
Exactly. That's the future. Right? But I'm telling it still requires hard work. You're going to make mistakes. You've got to overcome that adversity. And I think it goes back to, like, that's the mindset. Can you can't really tell when they're coming into the pipeline. If you've got every single one of your employees or every brand you've ever worked with, everyone's gonna be the greatest employee ever. This is going to be the greatest business ever. It's when you really get into it. And that's what I've learned is like, you can hire fast. That's just the thing. It's either you ask a couple questions, you're going to get it, but you got to hire faster. I mean, you got to fire faster. That's one of the things that becomes really tough in businesses and franchises. You've got to be able to, like, let go of the ego, because ego is the enemy, and say, I made a mistake. This is not the right fit. This isn't you? Sometimes everyone else, as much as I try to say I never fire anyone, they fire themselves. But that might just be because I'm not a right fit for the culture as well. And I'm sorry about that.
- [52:01]
A
Yep. That's awesome. Yeah. So what's like on your horizon? Anything you can, you can share that you guys are working on?
- [52:07]
B
Yeah, we steadily. This is one thing that I'm working on. This is not, not a failure. I'm learning quickly. We're trying to launch a new product and it's just not right yet.
- [52:19]
A
And so flavor or new line?
- [52:21]
B
It's new flavor. New type line is it's going to open up a new product, customer base and everything else. I thought I was going to be ready for this months ago, but something is just not right in the flavor and the taste and everything. So I'm just like bringing more ingredients, bringing in all these different things until we just get it absolutely 100 perfect. So that's kind of my thing. Not a failure, but I'm learning quickly. That does not as easy, you guys.
- [52:49]
A
Like, you've got manufacturing, franchising and like the sales and just like actually running the business. Right? There's industry, franchise. There's always industry and franchising. Right. You have to know roofing, you have to know how to franchise. In yours, you've got, you know, you've also got to be a manufacturer, which.
- [53:03]
B
Is, yeah, I got to put two hats on all the time. So it's fun. Look, it's you, you get to experience both of. Because for me, my franchisees get to go out there into the world and say, oh, this flavor works, this flavor didn't. And we learn a lot. And so then we clean up on the manufacturing side and produce you amazing new flavors.
- [53:22]
A
It's awesome. Cool. So where can people connect with you? I think following on Twitter. Right? Give me, give me some of the links.
- [53:29]
B
Yeah. Cliff Kennedy3 on Twitter. Because Cliff Kennedy is, I guess, a famous artist as well. Not me by any stretch of the means. Find me on LinkedIn or Cliff @ Frios Pops. Easy enough.
- [53:41]
A
Yep. Awesome. Cool. Thanks again for coming on and chatting about all the things about franchising and success and mindset and like this is kind of an insight I think for everybody listening into kind of like, you know, the things that people who run, you know, franchise businesses and any, any business really start to think about.
- [53:56]
B
So thanks, pal. See you soon.
- [54:00]
A
That's all we got for this episode with the Business with Beers podcast. One thing that would really help both us and other new potential listeners is to rate the show and leave a comment in itunes Stitcher wherever you listen. Also, make sure to link up with me on your preferred social media platforms, LinkedIn, Instagram, Twitter, Facebook. You can find all my links@brianbeers.com please just share the podcast with anyone who you think might enjoy it. And until next time, remember to take the actions others won't, to live the life that others don't.