AOC warns Dems on new progressive candidates: Hear them out.

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Briefing with Jen Psaki

Episode: AOC warns Dems on new progressive candidates: Hear them out
Air Date: July 1, 2026
Host: Jen Psaki (MS NOW)
Featured Guest: Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (AOC)

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Overview

This episode centers on the recent surge of progressive victories in Democratic primaries—especially in New York—and addresses the backlash and skepticism those new candidates face, both from Republicans and within the Democratic Party itself. Jen Psaki interviews Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez about her insights into the Democratic Party's evolving landscape, her own experience as a political newcomer, and what advice she has for the new generation of progressive lawmakers.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The 'Watergate Every Day' Era under Trump (02:33–08:15)

• Psaki opens by referencing JD Vance’s remark at the Nixon Library, suggesting that if Watergate happened today, it would be only a "12-hour news story" due to constant, ongoing scandals.
  • She draws parallels with seemingly endless examples of corruption in the current Trump administration, which she argues would have individually warranted impeachments in prior eras.
  • Quote (Psaki, 03:17):
    “What is really so unbelievable about the Trump administration this time around in Trump’s second term is how Trump does Watergate-level impeachment worthy stuff so often that we can hardly process it before we have to move on to the next thing.”
• Psaki contrasts this with the healthy internal debate within the Democratic Party (“the big tent”), as opposed to the cultish, personality-driven nature of the GOP.

2. Republican Fear Mongering around Progressive Candidates (08:20–09:48)

• Psaki highlights right-wing media panic over new Democratic nominees, quoting conservative talking points labeling them as "the most radical candidates to ever run for office," "socialists," and an "enemy of the United States".
  • This segment sets up her interview with AOC as an example of someone once painted as extreme, but who ultimately ushered in wider Democratic gains in the House.

3. Progressives and What the Primary Results Mean (09:49–12:05)

• Ocasio-Cortez sees the primaries as a mandate for an agenda that:
  • Lowers costs, tackles corruption, makes healthcare a right, raises wages, and supports unionizing.
• Quote (AOC, 10:39):
  “Voters are just really ready for a Democratic Party that stands for something...I think that these results are a very good sign for November.”
• She frames her own primary win in 2018 as a signal of openness among voters to bold, future-oriented candidates.

4. The Overblown “Democratic Socialism Panic” (12:05–14:07)

• Psaki asks if the right-wing outcry over socialists distracts from the broader diversity of primary winners.
• AOC: Republicans use “fear” as their main strategy—fear of immigrants, fear of socialists, fear of women, etc.
  • She urges a focus on real issues: healthcare, housing, affordability.
  • Quote (AOC, 13:00):
    “If you are not afraid of someone who is your neighbor, you're going to realize who's actually pickpocketing you, and that is large corporations engaged in profiteering…”

5. Advice to New Progressive Members—and to Incumbents (14:07–16:56)

• Psaki asks what AOC’s advice is to incoming members facing early vilification.
• AOC’s key counsel is for incumbents, not just newcomers:
  • Quote (AOC, 14:51):
    “You will create a self-fulfilling prophecy by deciding who these young women are before you've met them. And if you are already panicking...you are creating the antagonistic dynamic that we do not need.”
  • She openly critiques the hostility she faced from the Democratic caucus when elected, urging colleagues to withhold judgment and learn from new voices.
  • Personal story about being judged and ostracized in the House cloakroom (17:24), emphasizing the human toll of internal division.

6. On Controversy and Growth in Office (16:56–20:59)

• Psaki presses AOC about specific criticisms against new candidate Daria Liza, who attended a protest after the Hamas attack and had old tweets about abolishing police and prisons.
• AOC responds:
  • Candidates should have room to learn and evolve in office.
  • Quote (AOC, 16:56):
    “We have to give people the opportunity to occupy their beliefs within the gravity of becoming a duly elected member of Congress...It's very different than when you're only speaking as an activist.”
  • Warns against erasing “humanity” of new members based on out-of-context past remarks.

7. Defining Change and Leadership in the Democratic Party (21:36–24:50)

• Discussion about House leadership, specifically Speaker candidate Hakeem Jeffries.
• AOC: Change is only real if it is prescriptive—clarify what kind, not just call for “new leadership.”
  • She will support Jeffries if he stands firmly for public housing investment and a working-class agenda.
  • Quote (AOC, 22:27):
    "When we talk about change, we talk pretty specifically about the kind of changes that we want, because there are a lot of people...that want the Democratic Party to become even more pro-corporate than it is."

8. Accountability vs. Policy: Balancing Priorities (27:18–30:52)

• After playing a Mike Johnson clip about Dems running “investigative Congress,” Psaki asks AOC how much Democrats should focus on accountability versus policy.
• AOC: We “can walk and chew gum,” but investigations and accountability are crucial:
  • Cites ongoing corruption and the coverup of Jeffrey Epstein files.
  • Johnson’s “protection” rhetoric is, to AOC, extortion:
    Quote (AOC, 28:50):
    "If you don't want to be prosecuted for crimes, don't do crimes. ... He wants to protect a class of impunity in America."
  • Ultimately, progressives must focus on making life better for everyday Americans, not just fighting corruption.

9. The Changing Political Climate (30:52–35:20)

• Psaki closes by asking AOC what modern leadership requires, compared to when she first entered Congress.
• AOC: The context has shifted from simply fighting chaos to addressing the deep roots of inequality and democratic decline that fuel authoritarianism.
  • Many positions that were labeled “extreme” are now mainstream (“common wisdom”, 33:22).
  • Calls for limits on big donor influence and campaign finance reform as essential for real democracy.
  • Quote (AOC, 34:23):
    “You cannot have extreme levels of income inequality and a functioning, thriving democracy at once. We have to choose.”

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On the GOP’s anti-progressive rhetoric:
  “The Republican Party’s brand is fear and they have to constantly churn what they want people to be afraid of.... They just want a solution.” (AOC, 12:40–13:10)
• On the responsibilities of new members and their critics:
  “You will create a self-fulfilling prophecy by deciding who these young women are before you've met them.” (AOC, 14:51)
• On leadership change:
  “Not everyone talking about change is talking about the same thing.” (AOC, 22:44)
• On accountability:
  “If you don't want to be prosecuted for crimes, don't do crimes.” (AOC, 28:50)
• On moving from ‘stop the chaos’ to ‘build real democracy’:
  “Making the lives of working class Americans better means that our democracy gets stronger.” (AOC, 34:55)

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Key Timestamps

• 00:57–02:31: Light banter—skip to main content
• 02:33–08:15: Psaki’s monologue on Watergate, Trump-era corruption, and healthy vs. unhealthy political parties
• 09:49–12:05: AOC’s take on what the primary results mean for the Democratic Party
• 12:40–14:07: Republican fear-mongering and AOC’s response on what voters actually want
• 14:31–16:56: Advice to new members, with a focus on incumbent openness
• 17:24: AOC’s personal story about early isolation in Congress
• 20:59–24:50: House leadership debate, and criteria for AOC’s support of Jeffries
• 27:18–30:52: AOC on balancing oversight/accountability with policy
• 32:59–35:20: What leadership now requires and the need to challenge systemic inequality

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Overall Tone and Takeaways

• Engaged, conversational, pointed. Psaki and AOC both maintain a tone that is frank and reflective, frequently drawing on personal experience as well as policy.
• AOC’s message: Embrace, not fear, new progressive voices; don’t prejudge; focus the party’s agenda on bold solutions for working people. Leadership must be clear and prescriptive, and reform must focus on campaign finance and resisting big money influence.
• Psaki’s framing: Internal Democratic debate is healthy and proof of democracy, not dysfunction. The real “disarray” is the GOP’s refusal to move beyond Trump.

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This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the Democratic Party’s direction, tensions between progressives and establishment, and how internal debates can be generative rather than destructive. AOC’s insights offer both a warning to Democratic incumbents about repeating past mistakes and a hopeful prescription for a party aligning itself with grassroots priorities and ethical governance.

Transcript

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[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

You're welcome.

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[Jen Psaki]

Yes, the same Monday.com briefing with Jen

[Jacob]

Psaki starts right now. Good evening, Jen.

[Jen Psaki]

First of all, Jacob, I love your show. It is so refreshing and good. I get why people love it. I also love your version of the prediction markets. It's very fun and it's one of your the things that is your superpower. So I'm so enjoying it.

[Jacob]

Would never ever trust those online prediction markets. Jen and I. You come on anytime open invite you come. Come on. It's early in the morning.

[Jen Psaki]

I'll come out with you. I know I want to come out for the prediction market, but I could talk to you forever, as you know. But I'm about to talk with Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio.

[Jacob]

I cannot wait. Go do it.

[Jen Psaki]

I know. I see I said the full name, but everybody knows aoc. We will use the formal name but everybody knows aoc. But I am really looking forward to talking to her. I think she's such an interesting, fascinating person, not just in politics, but really in terms of connecting with people right now and really reading what's happening out in the out in the country. So I'm really looking forward to talking to her about all of it.

[Jacob]

I can't wait to watch that interview. Exactly for the same reason that you have said, I watch her all over the country. I saw her come out to Los Angeles and draw crowds with Bernie Sanders. Unlike crowds I have ever seen in Los Angeles ever before in my hometown. She is an incredible communicator, an incredible connector. And after watching what happened here in New York on election night, she was the very beginning of a wave. I think we're just starting to feel,

[Jen Psaki]

no question, we'll see, we'll talk about that. Lots of people won on Tuesday, too. Jacob, I will see you tomorrow morning on my television.

[Jacob]

Thanks, Jen. Have a good weekend. See ya.

[Jen Psaki]

Okay, as I was just saying to Jacob, and I'm just gonna remind you again, Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez is going to be with us tonight. She's gonna join me here in just a moment. And we have a ton to talk about. We will talk about all of it. But I have to start tonight with something I really honestly I never thought I would say, and that is I agree with JD Vance. If Watergate happened tomorrow, it would be like a 12 hour news story. Okay, J.D. that was J.D. vance at the Nixon Library yesterday making what I would say is a very good point that I don't think he intended to make. Stay with me here. While bizarrely trying to downplay the seriousness of the Watergate scandal, Vance basically made the very astute point in the process that the Trump administration does stuff like, stuff like Watergate all the time. I mean, there's the obvious stuff like how Trump tried to overturn the results of the 2020 election, how he encouraged a violent mob to march to the Capitol and stop the election from being certified, a mob that actively tried to hang his own vice president. All of that definitely feels worse than Watergate. But I actually think the point JD Vance accidentally made is more fine tuned than that because what is really so unbelievable about the Trump administration this time around in Trump's second term is how Trump does Watergate level impeachment worthy stuff so often that we can hardly process it before we have to move on to the next thing. Seems like every month we learn about a new perceived Trump enemy that the Justice Department is targeting with sham investigations. But like a frog in a slowly boiling pot, that almost feels normal now. And it's hard to focus on because there's just so much else going on. There's the fact that Trump's son in law has reportedly been soliciting billions of dollars for his investment firm from countries in the Middle east while acting as one of Trump's top negotiators and advisors in that very same region, which he swears is ethical. I mean, there's the fact that companies with ties to Trump adult sons keep landing major government contracts which they say is okay because the president isn't involved, or that foreign countries keep enriching the Trump family to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars while Trump makes decisions as president that affect those same countries and laughably insists there's no conflict there. Then there's the whole list of People who Trump pardoned or commuted the sentence of, which the White House insists has nothing to do with the donations or other favors those very same people have made. Then there was Trump's sham lawsuit and so called settlement with his former personal lawyer that attempted to create a slush fund to reward people who had committed crimes in his name. And the deal Trump made with his own IRS to block them from auditing him or his family or their businesses. I could go on here. I mean, any of those scandals could easily be another Watergate. There's a lot we don't even know about all of those scandals at this point. Like the militarized horrors Trump has ordered on the streets of American cities, the innocent Americans who have been killed by federal agents, the thousands of innocent immigrants who've been rounded up and thrown into prisons. So, yeah, J.D. can I call you J.D. i'm going to. I agree. Given the sheer quantity of Trump scandals, yeah, I think Watergate probably would be just a 12 hour story these days. Probably would be. I mean, on Tuesday, just this last Tuesday, Trump publicly blurted out that he pressured a US Attorney to launch an election fraud investigation in California without any real evidence. That was Tuesday. Do you even remember that story? That's what I'm talking about here. I mean, in a normal world, any of the scandals I just mentioned would be worthy of an impeachment inquiry and possibly even criminal investigation. Richard Nixon resigned the presidency over far less. But back then, he, and this is a key part, the Republican Party had some capacity to actually feel shame and some incentive to actually do the honorable thing. In contrast, the Republican Party of today is just a cult of personality. The Republican Party doesn't have any real internal policy debates anymore. You're either with Trump or against him. And if you're against him, you have no place in the party. We've seen that in the primaries in the Democratic Party there are plenty of disagreements. There are centrist Democrats and progressive Democrats and Democratic socialists and independents that caucus with Democrats. And that is healthy. That is what a democracy is supposed to look like. I mean, just this Tuesday, we saw those debates within the Democratic Party play out in primaries in multiple states. In New York, we saw a big slate of progressive candidates sweep the primaries. That was a big deal. And outside New York, we saw lots of other factions of the Democratic Party win. But for whatever reason, when Democrats have actual internal political debate, when our democracy actually looks Democratic and like a competition of ideas, the political world and a lot of headlines say Democrats are in complete disarray. Now, look, I'M not saying that getting the big tent that is the Democratic Party these days to come to agreements won't be difficult. But that is how a democracy is supposed to work. Members are supposed to be pushed by their constituents who vote for them. Then members are supposed to push to make policy better. They're supposed to debate it. It's actually very, very healthy. The unfailing unity around a cult leader we are seeing from the Republican Party these days is not. But rather than look within at just how unhealthy their own party is right now, conservatives have spent the past week fear mongering about the new Democratic nominees.

[Conservative Commentator]

The socialists, the Marxists have nominated some of the most radical candidates to ever run for office and they're running for Congress.

[Jen Psaki]

Don't let your friends play with commies and certainly don't ever be governed by them. These people are going to steal from us. These people want to hurt us. This isn't like your regular Democrat. They are now in many cases the

[Conservative Commentator]

enemy of the United States.

[Jen Psaki]

People whose goal it is to destroy America are trying to get elected to Congress. This is war without soldiers. This is the most serious threat to our country since its existence, in my opinion, 250 years ago. This is a major threat to our country. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. We're on that one. And of course, this isn't the first time we have seen this exact dynamic. Our version of it, at least eight years ago tonight, actually, which I don't know that she remembers, it was tonight. A young progressive politician named Alexandria Ocasio Cortez won her first primary election ousting a longtime incumbent, somebody who was thought to be a potential successor to Nancy Pelosi at the time. Just to give you a sense of. And the New York Post front page the next morning said simply, red alert. I'm showing it to you right on the screen there because we thought it was so crazy. And guess what happened that November Democrats won 40 seats back in the House. Joining me now is Democratic Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez of New York. Congresswoman, thank you for being here with me tonight.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Of course, thank you for having me.

[Jen Psaki]

Let me start by just a lot of people, not just in New York, but across the country. There have been a lot of takes, shall we say, are trying to make sense of what the elections meant, what they mean for the Democratic Party. What do you think they mean?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

You know, I think that these elections mean, of course, they are reflections of the constituencies and communities that elected them and that rendered them and I can say absolutely, at least in the city of New York, voters are just really ready for a Democratic Party that stands for something and has a very strong agenda to make our lives easier, to tackle corruption, to lower costs, to make health care a right for every American, to raise wages, to make unionizing easier in the workplace. And they want to make a forceful statement in how, in how badly they want to see us fight for that. And I think that in any robust year for Democrats, I believe you're going to see an expansion of a party and a deepening of our commitment. And so I actually think that these results are a very good sign for November. To your point, when I was elected in 2018, an election like mine where voters were willing to really trade in someone that was supposed to be the presumptive next speaker of the House in my predecessor and trade that in for also a Democratic socialist, a new organizer at that time, I think that that is actually an indicator of places in other parts of the country willing to elect Democrats. Even if the politics are not the same, even if those communities don't align with those with those same exact agendas, they are willing to take a chance for a better future. And so I don't think that people should be seeing this as a zero sum game. I think they should be seeing it as encouraging for November.

[Jen Psaki]

It's interesting because even in the state of New York, and you alluded to this, I mean, Michael Lasher, you probably don't share every opinion or position with him. You definitely don't share every position, I don't think, with Richie Torres on a number of things. Both of them won in primaries that night. I mean, Michael Lesherin, a very competitive one. Do you think this is because, and I just paint, I just played some of what people on the right wing are saying on television that this is an overtorking of the rise of democratic socialism and not enough of a focus on the broad people who won. Or how do you see that because you're a Democratic socialist yourself?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

I mean, I think that the one thing that we know is that the Republican Party's brand is fear and they have to constantly churn what they want people to be afraid of, to be afraid of socialists, to be afraid of immigrants, to be afraid of women, to be afraid of. They constantly want Americans in fear of somebody, because if you are not afraid of someone who is your neighbor, you're going to realize who's actually pickpocketing you, and that is the large corporations that are engaged in profiteering and jacking up your prices for no good reason. It's going to be in this administration that is engaged in record levels of swindling, thefts, tariffs, your housing. And so this is kind of their new thing of the day. But I think that people are feared out. I think that the nerve, everyone's nerves are shot in constantly being taught and told of what country, person, community to be afraid of. And they just want a solution. They want their groceries to be more affordable, they want to figure out how we're going to get health care, they want our housing to get under control. And I think that we're ready for an affirmative vision and we're ready for an affirmative agenda.

[Jen Psaki]

You talked about this week kind of how the fear mongering you had deja vu, I think is how you described it and you just alluded to that and what you just said. Now, what advice are you giving or would you have for these new members who are coming in and are already being painted in a certain way? And I want to talk about them too, but what advice can you do you have for them about how to get things done while still shaking up the system at the same time?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Yeah, you know, I think new and incoming members have no shortage of advice that's being given to them.

[Jen Psaki]

Well, but you lived it.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Yes.

[Jen Psaki]

You lived it in a very different way.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Yes. And I mean I'll get to them, but I actually think the more important advice that I would give would be to my incumbent colleagues, which is you will create a self fulfilling prophecy by deciding who these young women are before you've met them. And if you are already panicking and sending little messages in your group chats about how these people need to be reined in and tamped down and shown their place, you are creating the antagonistic dynamic that we do not need. These are two young, talented, intelligent women that got elected against all odds, against millions of dollars. Perhaps there is something we can learn from them.

[Jen Psaki]

The people chose them. And democracy and the Democratic Party is about what the people pick. It is not about any elected official or any leader. And I believe that. Do you, I mean there are, and I wanna ask you about this because I think they are being painted in a certain way. And Daria, Liza specifically, who is going to be a member of Congress, I think people should recognize they are going to win in these districts. She has said a couple of things and I think for people who are watching right now, I just wanna remind them of that she attended a pro Palestinian rally in Times Square the day after the Hamas attacked Israel she said she was worried about an outsized reaction that cost thousands of people their lives. She has not backed away from attending that rally. She also, she deleted a Twitter account that had a number of posts that called for the abolishment of police in prisons. According to CNN, in 2021, this is what there's a reference to. She posted. A world without borders, just like a world without prisons or police is possible, necessary, and the only moral way forward. She's again has said those posts don't reflect who she is today. You do not speak for her. You speak for yourself. And I know she's tried to distance herself. She's probably under a greater level of scrutiny she's ever been in her life. But does any of that give you pause?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

I think that, as you said, she has indicated that she has regret over the way that she made issued those statements. And I genuinely believe that the gravity and the responsibility of this role has a way of inhabiting you and I. I genuinely believe that we have to give people the opportunity to occupy their beliefs within the gravity of becoming a duly elected member of Congress. And I think that in the process of running for election, in the process of getting to know your constituents, it's very different than when you're only speaking as an activist or years ago or whatever that may be. But I think where we are right now is that the people of New York's 13th district have elected her and she is responsible and has absolutely, I think, expressed a sense of responsibility in how she wants to lead. And so, again, I would say I think it's important to not issue a verdict before these folks arrive. And, you know, I went through the same thing. I will never forget. I had this moment. There's, you know, everyone sees the floor of the United States House of Representatives on C Span or whatever when we're casting our votes. But there are these little rooms attached to that floor, and it's known as a cloak room. And in the cloakroom is where members can rest in between votes or if you need to get a snack or something. And they have televisions there. And I remember my first term, I was sitting down on one of the couches and there was this big television screen. And they were going on and on about, you know, the way that they were clipping something that I said out of context to look extreme and to look far more inflammatory than what it was and most importantly, who I am. And I remember sitting next to a congressman, my colleague, a Democrat, sitting next to me on the same couch, and he was looking up at that television screen in disgust and just shaking his head. And I was sitting there right next to him. He had never once struck up a conversation with me, but he had made a judgment and determination of who I was. And it was incredibly dehumanizing. I was met with so much hostility and cruelty by the Democratic caucus when I was first elected. And I think that it created so much more antagonism than what was necessary in that time. And so I think that both ends of this relationship require work, right? Both ends require a stepping up and a certain magnanimity for us all to get what we want done. I'm an unabashed progressive and I want to guarantee health care to every American. That's my agenda. That's why I'm in this business. And there are other Democrats that don't agree with me, and that's all right. They know what I'm after and I know where they're at. But what I'm not going to do is allow my humanity to be erased. And I don't think that these newly elected officials should have theirs erased either.

[Jen Psaki]

I think what you're saying, what I'm hearing you say is you think people should give these people a chance and see what they do when they govern. And the challenge seems to be that you, as a leader of this movement, as one of the leaders, are gonna have to make sure this doesn't define what the movement is about. I think.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Well, also listen to what they're saying now. Everyone's talking about pulling statements and things from years ago, but they just ran an election. Listen to what they've been saying now. Listen to what they ran on now and the mandate and the message that they gave their voters, because that is their voters expectation of them. And so I would say for everyone, for every one statement from years ago that someone wants to pull up, please pull up 5 of what she's been discussing in her debates.

[Jen Psaki]

I want to talk about where things go from here because I think there are so many hopes, probably from every person watching, people, anybody out there who's concerned about what they're seeing from Grandpa in the Oval Office to happen right now, about what Democrats will get done. And I know you've said in the past you would support Hakeem Jeffries for speaker. And you can tell me again if that remains the case. Senator Slotkin, who I would say is one of the Democrats that you may agree with on a lot, you may not agree with on everything, I suspect she had this to say. She said we need significant New leadership. If people can't recognize that the game has fundamentally changed and can't adapt, then they need to make room for others who can. And she was referring to Jeffries, and she's of course, in the Senate to Schumer as well. Do you think, what do you think about that and what do you think Jeffries needs to do to prove that, if you think he needs to do anything to prove that?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Well, I think that anyone who says and issues a statement like this, I think it's important for them to get prescriptive about the changes that they want to see. I've been pretty clear about where I think the country should go. I think that we need to move forcefully to guarantee health care to every American. I think we need to move forcefully towards raising wages and taking on corporate corruption and profiteering. But there are a lot of folks who talk about change in leadership that don't necessarily articulate what their direction is. And so I would say that it's important that when we talk about change, we talk pretty specifically about the kind of changes that we want, because there are a lot of people in this country and, and there are a lot of forces and lobbyists that want the Democratic Party to become even more pro corporate than it is. And so not everyone talking about change is talking about the same thing. And so when I talk about change, I talk about orienting the Democratic Party to be unabashedly working class and to orient itself again around working class Americans. And I think that that part of the conversation, because it's kind of in vogue to be talking about change when people aren't prescriptive about what those changes need to be. I think we need to be asking further questions.

[Jen Psaki]

I read just a part of what you said. I take your point. Do you still feel, though, if Democrats went back the House, that Hakeem Jeffries is the white one?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Right. You know, I've engaged in many conversations with Leader Jeffries, and for me, one. And we have a broad caucus, right. For me, I have made very clear that one of my priorities in determining and in a leader determination is securing public housing financing for New York City. And Leader Jeffries has made his prioritization for the residents of public housing very clear. And for that reason, I will be supporting Hakeem Jeffries for leader.

[Jen Psaki]

You know how this works. We have to take a very quick break. You've been so generous with your time. We're going to stick around. First, I just want to play you something quite telling. You may have seen this, but it's been a busy day, in case people haven't seen it at home, that Speaker Johnson told a room full of Christian conservatives at the Faith and Freedom Coalition's annual summit today, it's quite something.

[Conservative Commentator]

If we were to lose the midterms, heaven forbid these Democrats, y', all, impeachment's not even the big concern. They will turn every committee of Congress into an investigative body and they'll go after the president's family, the Cabinet, his donors and friends. Half of you in this room will be targeted. I run the protection program. I'll take care of you.

[Jacob]

Okay.

[Jen Psaki]

I'm gonna get your thoughts on that when we come back.

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[Simone Sanders Townsend]

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[Jen Psaki]

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Clock it with Simone and Eugene. All episodes available now.

[Jen Psaki]

We're back with Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez. Okay, before the break, I played a clip of little Mike Johnson, as I like to call him, laying out how a Democratic majority in Congress would investigate the president, the cabinet, donors and friends. It all sounds, I think, probably to a lot of people watching and a lot of people out there who were infuriated by the level of corruption, pretty good. But you've also talked about a lot of things you deeply care about. Health care, affordable housing. I know there are many other things. What do you see as the right priorities, balance of things, especially as it relates to investigations and accountability. Where does that fall and how much time should be spent on that?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

I mean, I, of course, I spent many years on the oversight on the Oversight Committee in Congress, which is in charge of investigations during the first Trump administration. I helped, you know, I helped on the investigation of Michael Cohen at the time, which led to a record settlement from Attorney General Tish James. But I think that it really is a, it genuinely is a situation of we can walk and chew gum at the same time. There are certain committees that I think will be spearheading real investigations into this administration. There has to be accountability and it has to be because we cannot allow this level of corruption to, to consume our public service and our government ever again. And the only way that you allow that or the only way that you set that precedent is by aggressive investigation and consequence. And oftentimes some of the things that do come out in congressional investigations sometimes yield to either state pursuits, et cetera. And, you know, Mike Johnson paints this as though it's some partisan witch hunt, but if you don't want to be prosecuted for crimes, don't do crimes. And he's talking about running a protection racket. And we are already seeing that this Trump administration has run what some have called one of the largest pedophile protection programs in American history. In the COVID up of the Epstein files, they violated the law. When Congress mandated that they release the Epstein files, they're still hiding Epstein files. Protecting, protecting some of the most gruesome behavior that is shocking to the human conscience. And so when Mike Johnson tells a group of wealthy donors, I'm the only thing standing between you and a consequence that should rattle at the conscience of every American. What he wants to do is create, and rather not even create because it's already been created, but protect a class of impunity in America that say you can commit whatever crime and so long as you pay a check to us, we will protect you. And that is a model of extortion in American politics. And you know what? That's their pitch. That's their pitch. But at the end of the day, like I've always said, they have money, but we've got people. And that's why our pitch needs to be focused on making the lives of everyday Americans better. Because they're sure as hell going to be making the lives of billionaires better and better and better every year. Our job is to make the lives of single mothers and working families and students trying to waitress through school and, you know, mechanics, trying to keep a business afloat. That needs to be our focus. And that's the only way that we're gonna be able, I think, to turn this ship around is through tackling on the extreme levels of inequality and corruption that persist in America.

[Jen Psaki]

We're here, of course, in Washington D.C. tonight, and J.D. vance, I played this at the top of the show. Did you see what he had to say about Nixon and Watergate? I just have to ask you about this because I started the show talking about how I think he was telling on himself for themselves a little bit. I mean, the notion that if Watergate happened tomorrow, it would be like a 12 hour news story is quite a statement to make. Obviously, he was down playing Watergate, which is insane to begin with, but what do you make of that, that statement? What is he trying to do there? What do you think about that?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

You know, I think it's. I think the statement is fascinating and there are many different ways to say why it's interesting. Some of it is that it's true. Right. But I think what it reveals more is about what JD Vance's vision for America is, is that he wants more of the same. He doesn't want anything to change in this country. He wants to continue the reality that corruption is, you know, banal, normal. And he loves the way that the country is being governed right now. He loves that you can start in a legal war and make tons of people rich and, you know, send Americans into harm's way and that it'll barely be a blip on people's radar. He loves that we can engage in record levels of corruption and get away with it. And so in that statement, it's less about the acknowledgment of the reality, but it's that his vision for the future is exactly the same and that your life won't change if so long as he's in charge.

[Jen Psaki]

You are very well aware that you were on so many lists for all sorts of things. New York Senate president, all these things. I know you're not going to make news here tonight. On this show, you're focused on the midterm elections. But what do you think this moment requires of leaders that might be different from when you came in to office eight years ago?

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

I think that when I first came in, it was during the first Trump administration. And what so many people wanted was to stop the chaos and to bring us back to where we were. And I think that, you know, that was a huge part of what unified the country in electing President Biden is this idea of restoring the soul of America. I think we're now in a new time, and I think there is greater recognition of the brokenness that led to President Trump in the first place, which is that this growing inequality yields to authoritarianism and that economic instability and the collapse of democracy are intertwined. And I think back then, a lot of what I was maligned for and told was extreme is now almost seen as quite common wisdom. These billionaires like Peter Thiel and Elon Musk and, and all of these folks that have been supercharging the corruption of this administration, dismantling the very foundations of democracy, have proven that you cannot have extreme levels of income inequality and a functioning, thriving democracy at once. We have to choose. And the good news in that is that making the lives of working class Americans better means that our democracy gets stronger. And I think that is what our focus needs to be. But I do think that that will require a choice in a system that is controlled by big money and dominated by large donors. I think that many people will have to make a difficult decision to walk away from and limit and rein in the excesses of a campaign finance system that wants to purchase Congress.

[Jen Psaki]

Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez, I think nothing has reminded us of all of what you've said in the corruption that we have seen in this administration. More thank you so much for being here tonight. Thank you.

[David Farenthold]

Appreciate it.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Thank you.

[Jen Psaki]

Okay, Coming up, I have been thinking all day about the gut wrenching story Pete Buttigieg shared earlier and I'm going to share some thoughts of my own on that story when we come back.

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[Simone Sanders Townsend]

and I have known each other for more than a decade, tussling over politics and policy when she worked in the White House and I reported on it.

[Jen Psaki]

And now we're friends and colleagues and on our podcast Clock it, we are positioning ourselves at the intersection of culture and politics.

[Simone Sanders Townsend]

Clock it is where we talk about what we see and hear in the news. So you can start to clock it too.

[Eugene]

Clock it with Simone and Eugene. All episodes available now.

[Jen Psaki]

I work closely enough with Pete Buttigieg to know he is a very calm guy generally and a pretty private person who deeply loves his family but doesn't talk all the time publicly about his private life unless he feels it's necessary. So it was even more powerful when this afternoon Pete Buttigieg posted online a heart wrenching account of a recent attack on his family. And I have to say, and I'm gonna read you some Big chunks of this because I think that tells you so much about who he is. So let me start with reading some of the chunks of it through right now. I'm just gonna get. Okay. A few days ago a police officer and a Child Protective services worker showed up at our house. They explained that there had been an allegation against me and it concerned our four year old twins. And that a forensic interview had been arranged for the children the following day. I could not be present at the children's interview, nor could any family member sit in. I was bewildered and troubled, but tried to stay calm. Then the CPS worker told me something that made my stomach turn. I was not to be alone around the children, at least until the interview took place place the next day. We agreed that the kids would stay at their grandparents house. 24 hours until they returned are among the darkest hours of my life. I have been denounced, yelled at, protested, threatened and heckled. I've been through political attacks in office, death threats in public life and rocket attacks in war. But this is the ugliest thing that has happened to me since my career and service began. After spending a sleepless night wondering what the hell was going on, the appointment time for my interview finally came. Then the officer explained what the allegation actually was. An anonymous caller had contacted cps. The caller said that he had spoken to a woman who claimed to have met me at a conference several years ago in Alabama where she said. I told her that I had committed unspeakable violent crimes and the caller believed my children were were still at risk. That was all. The officer asked if I had been to the town where the woman claimed she had met me and I have not. Then the officer made clear that he believed this was politically motivated. Nothing in the forensic interview with the children led to concerns. I'm a reasonable man. I try to keep as calm and low key as possible. But I cannot describe the mix of rage and sadness that I feel at the idea that someone brought our children into this. They're four years old.

[Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez]

Four.

[Jen Psaki]

They do not know or care what a Democrat or Republican is. They should be worrying about what kind of ice cream they're getting this afternoon, not why they're being brought into a meeting with a grown up asking strange questions or why their papa is suddenly unavailable to read them at bedtime.

[Monday.com Advertiser]

Story.

[Jen Psaki]

For God's sake, they are kids. They are just kids. We don't know who was behind this attack on Pete Buttigieg and his family. We do know and that is outrageous on its own. We do know that MAGA voices have spent years attacking Buttigieg simply for having a family. And because of that, two innocent kids are now subject to harassment and abuse by strangers they have never met. And no matter what your politics are, no matter what your capacity for selective outrage and hypocrisy are, shouldn't some things be off limits? Surely we can all agree that no family and no child deserves what Pete Shastin and their family have been through this week. We'll be right back. As America celebrates its 250th anniversary. Coming up next week, Donald Trump's great American state Fair on the national mall here in D.C. looks to be, well, getting off to quite a rocky start. The Washington Post described it as a bumpy beginning, which included power outages that led to ride delays and melted ice cream. A writer for the Washingtonian had more critical words, calling the fair bleaker than expected and sparsely attended and shockingly boring. There now, that was all from yesterday's opening. As for today, well, one of our producers headed down there this afternoon to check things out. And as for crowd size during that time, I'll let you judge for yourself. There's a photo right there. But like any fair worth its salt, there is a Ferris wheel, and it was working. Trump's fair also has this, a miniature version of his planned vanity arch. That certainly is something. Now, this fair isn't the only thing experiencing some hiccups on the National Mall. There are also the ongoing issues with his costly renovations to the reflecting pool. Tonight, the New York Times has new reporting that the reflecting pool turning green probably didn't have anything to do with vandals. What do you think? It likely had something to do with Trump's UFC birthday party. The Times, citing two people briefed on the situation, reports that the Trump administration ordered a contractor to temporarily remove devices called nanobubblers, which were keeping algae at bay. And according to the Times, the Park Service did not provide a reason for the removal. But it coincided exactly with a June 12 promotional event which drew crowds to the reflecting pool. And by the time the purification systems were reinstalled 36 hours later, enormous algae blooms were starting to spread unchecked, turning the water green. Joining me now is David Ferenthold. He is a New York Times journalist who contributed to that reporting. Okay, so the saga of the reflecting pool, I'm sure you feel this way, feels like it could finally be coming to an end. Do you think we now have the definitive answer of what caused the allergy? And is it? Is it finally being dealt with. What do we know?

[David Farenthold]

Well, yeah, I think we have a couple of causes that seem pretty plausible. One is that they filled the pool with city tap water, which is actually full of stuff called phosphates that are supposed to design to stop corrosion in pipes, but also feed algae. And also that they turned off the filters for 36 hours to have a better backdrop for this UFC fight. So, yeah, I think that's a pretty good explanation of why we saw that bright green algae bloom that really mucked up the pool for several days. I still want to know more about why the bottom of the pool is coming off, though. Remember, we spent millions and millions of dollars to put blue coating on the bottom of the pool. And after a few days, it started peeling off and floating to the top. They're gonna have to drain the pool again to fix that. And I'd really like to know what went wrong that allowed that to happen so quickly.

[Jen Psaki]

Yeah, I mean, there have been. You're talking about the peeling paint liner, of course. There've been lots of stories. I mean, President Trump blamed it on vandalism. What do we know? I mean, what are the big questions you have about it? What do we. What do we really know about it at this point?

[David Farenthold]

Well, the thing to start with here, Jen, is that this was a no bid contract, right? The government gave away a contract to this company that had never really done any project like this before, never done any government contract before without doing the things that make government contracting work. Usually looking around for other bids, seeing if they could find people who could do the job better or more cheaply. They just chose these people in hand this money in this contract. And along the way, there were warning signs. People within the Interior Department warned that their paying job had bubbles that had holes and blisters. There were concerns that it wouldn't really work. And so once they fill the pool with water and it starts peeling up. Yeah, then there's millions of dollars spent on this job that didn't even last a month.

[Jen Psaki]

The Reflecting Pool is hardly Trump's only focus, shall I call it? In terms of renovation projects, are there any other aspects of Trump's commemoration of America's 250th anniversary raising red flags for you where you really have additional questions you're digging into now that we should all watch out for in the coming weeks?

[David Farenthold]

Well, so many of these things are no bid contracts, right? The filtration system on the Reflecting Pool is a no bid contract to a company owned by a guy who lives near Mar A Lago there's no bid contracts to renovate the fountains in front of the White House in Lafayette park that went to the same company that's building Trump's ballroom. There's no bid contracts to put gold leaf on some statues near the, near the Lincoln Memorial. So much of this stuff was done outside the regular procedures and what you see often, and this is a pattern, I think, that repeats across the Trump presidency. The things Trump wants done the most are often the things that are done the least well because everybody falls all over themselves to be a yes man and doesn't ask the questions that it would allow the job to actually be done right.

[Jen Psaki]

David Farenthold, I'm not sure you thought with all of the incredible award winning investigative reporting you've done, that your beat would currently be reflecting polls, national park projects, But I'm just gonna reiterate, having worked a lot in government, how important this because no bid contracts means they're not going through the proper process. Money could be used and not in a way that makes sense. It's over budget. So thank you for your reporting. Thank you for being here with me. We'll be right back. Thank you.

[Eugene]

Listen to your favorite Ms. Now shows anytime as a podcast. Enjoy new episodes of Morning Joe, Deadline, White House and the Rachel Maddow Show.

[Jen Psaki]

Every small d Democratic muscle that we have is for every flexing.

[Eugene]

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