← The Briefing with Jen Psaki
The Briefing with Jen Psaki
DISGRACED by Iran failure, Trump is tormented by Obama's superior skill
00:42:23
Former President Barack Obama has made permanent residence in Donald Trump's head for most of Trump's political life, and now, in the shadow of his failed war on Iran, the contrast between Trump's shortcomings and Obama's accomplishments only add to Trump's burden. Jen Psaki traces the roots of Trump's insecurity about Obama, and talks with House Speaker Emerita Nancy Pelosi.
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- [00:00]
Freedom From Religion Foundation Announcer
America is an idea. For 250 years, that idea has helped expand our rights and our freedoms, but progress isn't guaranteed. Today. Those founding principles are being challenged by efforts to mix religion and government. The Freedom From Religion foundation is working to protect the Constitution and keep power where it belongs with we the people. Visit FFRF US MSNOW or text MSNOW to 511-511-Text MSNOW to 511-51-511 and keep state and church separate. Text fees may apply.
- [00:30]
Thumbtack Advertiser
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- [01:07]
Jen Psaki
Okay everyone, we are live from Chicago tonight because this week is the grand opening of the Barack Obama Presidential center, and we have a ton to get to. A ton. We're packing into this show. In just a few moments, we're going to show you an exclusive first look. You've probably seen some of the clips out there, but this is one you haven't seen. This is an exclusive first look at President Obama's interview with MSNOW's Michel Norris, where the former president offers a quite a candid take on the Trump administration's warped view of what it means to be an American. We're going to show you that in a moment. And then a little bit later, there are a few people whose careers and achievements have been as closely intertwined with the Obama legacy as Nancy Pelosi. And I'm going to have an exclusive interview with her from right here in Chicago. And in just a moment, too, we're also going to speak with Georgia Senator Jon Ossoff. Just last night, Senator Ossoff learned who his opponent will be in his fight to hold on to that critical Senate seat in Georgia, one that Democrats absolutely need. Senator Ossoff will debut his opening message against his opponent, Republican Mike Collins, here on this show tonight as well. So like I said, we have a ton to get to. But it is fitting that we are here at the opening of Barack Obama's Presidential center tonight of all nights. Because in the decades since Donald Trump entered the political stage, there has never been a better contrast in leadership between Trump and Obama. And there has never been a more stark comparison of the way that two very different presidents approach the same very difficult issue as there is right now with Trump's disastrous handling of Iran. I mean, remember it was eight years ago last month when Donald Trump tore up the deal Barack Obama negotiated with Iran to end their nuclear program. A deal that took years to negotiate, that required dozens, if not hundreds of experts from across the government. A deal that was hundreds of pages of long because it was so detailed. And the Obama legacy was very much on Donald Trump's mind today as he signed, in quite a contrast, a flimsy two page document, if you can call it that, to end a war. He himself started an agreement to reopen the Strait of Hormuz that was closed because of that war. He started an agreement that might even result in a $300 billion fund to Iran. I know, yeah, they could make some money from charging fees at the Strait of Hormuz. Basically. Today, Donald Trump effectively capitulated to the very same country that Obama negotiated a tough, hard fought deal with just over 10 years ago. TRUMP even signed that document today at the palace of Versailles in France. Because nothing says we're definitely not going to have another war like a signing ceremony at Versailles. We don't mention that awkward symbolism to Trump. But don't mention it, Please don't. Because he's already clearly just a little bit self conscious about the comparisons between his failure and Obama's success.
- [04:10]
Donald Trump
And you know what the Iranians did? They laughed at Obama and they said he's a stupid son of a bitch. Okay, thank you very much, everybody.
- [04:22]
Jen Psaki
So Trump says the Iranians were laughing at Barack Obama when he got them to agree to wind down their nuclear program, which is obviously not true and definitely not true. But the thing is, Iran may be laughing today because the whole world is now seeing the text of the two page memorandum Trump is trying to spin as a deal to end this war. And that agreement accomplishes absolutely none of Trump's stated goals in this war. The deal is such an indisputable fiasco for Trump that voices from across the political spectrum, including Republican senators and conservative pundits, are calling it a full surrender. That's probably, probably has something to do with why Trump sounded so incredibly defensive when he tried to defend his deal during a press conference at the G Summit earlier today.
- [05:14]
Donald Trump
It's a memorandum of understanding. If it doesn't get done in 60 days, it's all right, we go back to bombing. You can't cover everything in a document, sir. You shouldn't let them have any missile. I said well, what am I going to do? Like, what are you going to do? Say you can never, ever invest in a country? I mean, it's pretty tough. What are you going to do? Let's, let's spend another two weeks. What else am I going to do? Am I going to say, I'm going to take you to court? Let me take you to court. Let me just. Let me sue you?
- [05:42]
Jen Psaki
Nothing says this is a great deal like the guy in charge repeatedly asking, what else was I supposed to do? It's not really a big defense of the deal that he's been touting out there. So Trump must be feeling pretty insecure right now. Clearly he is. I mean, he spent years arguing he could negotiate a better deal with Iran than Barack Obama. And instead, he failed in the most spectacular, costly and unpopular way possible. And that must have felt like things were really coming full circle for Donald Trump. Not in a good way, given that his envy of Barack Obama is what propelled him into politics in the first place. As a Trump confidant once told PBS News, the night that Trump first resolved that he was going to run for president was the night of the 2011 White House Correspondence dinner, where after months of enduring Trump's racist birther conspiracies, Barack Obama mercilessly mocked Trump to devastating effect. Remember this,
- [06:39]
Barack Obama
say what you will about Mr. Trump, he certainly would bring some change to the White House. Let's see what we've got up there.
- [06:54]
Jen Psaki
Now, in retrospect, looking at that photo, that joke massively undersold just how drastic and absurd Trump's White House renovations actually would be. But that image also perfectly symbolizes the difference between the Trump and Obama White Houses and their. I mean, Trump's White House is all about him. Building monuments to himself, holding cage matches for his birthday, surrounding himself only with rich and powerful billionairesthey're the only ones allowed in who would finance and enable his own warped illusions of grandeur. While the Obama White House was about bringing other people into the process, opening doors instead of tearing them down, bringing people together. That's why he ran for president. That's what he did as president. Now, at the exit to the new Obama Presidential center, you will see a quote from his farewell address, and I hope you all get to visit, in which the former president said, I'm asking you to believe not in my ability to bring about change, but in yours, which is such a relevant quote to today. The Obama presidency was about doing the hard work of democracy. It was about empowering people in communities across the country to Accomplish the kind of things that, that no one person can achieve on their own. One of the key people who helped President Obama and I saw this very much firsthand to do just that, was then House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. During the Obama presidency, she whipped the tough votes to pass things like Obamacare, the Economic Recovery act, equal pay for equal work, ending don't ask, don't tell. Nancy Pelosi was central to creating the broad coalitions for change that defined Barack Obama's legacy. And earlier today, I sat down with the former speaker in Chicago to talk about how we should think about that legacy in this new chaotic era. Speaker Emeritus Nancy Pelosi, thank you for taking the time and your busy day to sit down with me today.
- [08:46]
Nancy Pelosi
It's my pleasure. Because we're here to see the Obama Presidential Center.
- [08:52]
Jen Psaki
Exactly.
- [08:53]
Nancy Pelosi
Source of happiness.
- [08:54]
Jen Psaki
It is. And I've thought about that so much as it sounds like you have as well. I mean, in this time where it can feel for so many people out there, of Americans infuriating, it can feel depressing, can feel just completely chaotic. What is it like for you to be here for a couple of days and really remember the legacy of Barack Obama and really what's possible in this country?
- [09:18]
Nancy Pelosi
Well, some thoughts that came through my mind as was going around was it's a measure, it's a symbol of hope. And of course, his audacity to hope message was something so encouraging to the public, to the country, and this will be, too. This is about hope. When you go through there, you see signs of community, empathy, integrity, making change. And the president has always been about training people, leaders for the future. And this is what this is about.
- [09:52]
Jen Psaki
I know you had a chance to walk through a little bit of the garden that is dedicated to you, the Nancy Pelosi Garden Pavilion. What was that like and what does that represent?
- [10:02]
Nancy Pelosi
Well, it was almost tearful. For me, it was because of the generosity of some people in San Francisco, the Conway family in San Francisco. So it should be named for them, but they named it for me. And it was pretty emotional because again, to be associated with what the President has done and what this and he and Michelle have memorialized here. But it's not just a memorial. It's about the future. To be part of that is pretty thrilling.
- [10:33]
Jen Psaki
And I want to talk about that because that's so important for people to take away. I was thinking just about your relationship with President Obama, and I had a version of a front seat to this. Your time was so intertwined. You accomplished so much together. You didn't always agree. You pushed back on each other at times. And we found this quote from his book, from his memoir, A Promised Land, where he describes you and he says politicians, usually men, underestimated Nancy at their own peril. For her ascent to power had been no fluke. Nobody was tougher or a more skilled legislative strategist. And she kept her caucus in line with a combination of attentiveness, fundraising prowess, and a willingness to cut off at the knees anyone who failed to deliver on the commitments they made. Do you agree?
- [11:23]
Nancy Pelosi
I don't agree on the last part, but nonetheless, we got the job done. What I like to think about the president was when we worked together on the Affordable Care act, which is treated at the center. And I can't wait to. I didn't see that today. I'll see that tomorrow, but I'm excited to see it because the night that the bill passed and it took a lot to get to that place, he called me, said, I'm happier tonight than the night I was elected President of the United States. And I said, Mr. President, I'm pretty happy tonight, too. But if you had not been elected President of the United States, we would not have this celebration tonight. For 100 years, presidents had tried, from Teddy Roosevelt, a Republican president throughout, and now we finally had succeeded because of his, again, audacity to hope. The aspiration of it, the inspiration he was, the knowledge he brought to it was just remarkable. And he stuck with us. We wanted to write this bill in the Congress. In the Congress. And that was our. But we had to do so in cooperation with the president. And he knew every detail.
- [12:36]
Jen Psaki
And you were an incredible partner in that process. It wouldn't be in law without you either.
- [12:41]
Nancy Pelosi
And Harry Reid was wonderful.
- [12:43]
Jen Psaki
Him, too, absolutely. Part of the center is about his legacy and many of the Affordable Care act, certainly also the Iran nuclear deal, which is something that he spent years working on. Hundreds of people in the administration did as well. So many partners and allies in Congress as well. It's one of those accomplishments that Trump, of course, ripped up. He slashed, he reversed it. He literally ripped the paper up. And even just today at a press conference, he name dropped President Obama in a press conference, which was a completely crazy press conference where he barely understood what was in the Iran nuclear deal to begin with. Why do you think I've been thinking about this? Why do you think President Trump is so obsessed with Barack Obama?
- [13:34]
Nancy Pelosi
Well, I think it relates to his own failures. You have to. Well, you do understand, but the public should understand that the Obama nuclear agreement with Iran was a masterpiece of diplomacy. To remember that we brought in all the countries, the EU, all at G, 20 countries all over the world, including Russia and China. Russia and China. So to have this virtuoso performance of having an agreement on nuclear, to do so in a way that withstood the scrutiny, the review of it all by so many people, and to have. And then it was a success. We were very proud. I'm very proud of my members in the House because the House had the ability to reject it. It wasn't as if you accept or reject. It's just you could reject it. And our members were very courageous. I have a book. I hope it's in the library, but I'll make sure it is a book of all of their statements as to why and how they reached that conclusion. And for this president to have torn it up and now coming back with even what the Republicans said is a failure. It's a failure if we're giving $300 billion to reconstruction to lift the sanctions on their sale of oil to so many things that again, unfreezing money in banks that they have wanted to have unfrozen. Just a ridiculous giveaway. And not addressing. The one complaint that people had about the Obama nuclear agreement with Iran was that it didn't address the ballistic missiles. And neither does this. So we tore up a good agreement. We went to war. We lost American lives, sadly. But we have something that is costing taxpayers enormous amounts of money to make to give to Iran and paying individually at the pump. At the pump. And this is really something that has hit home hard for people because it cost a lot. It costs nearly, you know, $75, $80 to fill their cars in a week's time. So they're feeling it. Personally, we've suffered from it. The people of Iran have suffered from it. And he just can't base the fact that President Obama had a far superior success with all of that. That thing made us, made us so proud that he could get all the countries, China and Russia to agree. Masterful.
- [16:17]
Jen Psaki
That insecurity, I suspect, but I'm interested in your thought is perhaps a driver of a lot of what we're seeing Trump focus his time on. And I've thought about this primarily because, you know, in the two times I worked in the White House for two presidents, every day I walked in there, I was in awe of the building and the institution. You have walked into that building. I believe, for seven presidents, you've been spent probably more time in the Oval Office than Most people in elected office. And I just wonder, as you've seen the monstrosity of the UFC fight, the effort to build a ballroom, the destruction of the East Wing, what has gone through your mind?
- [17:00]
Nancy Pelosi
Well, I, as a grandmother and a mother of five children, 10 grandchildren, I participate in, I practice medicine on the side without benefit of diploma. I'm just not really down the road yet to be a mental health specialist. But I think there's some, some reason to review his mental state. The thing is though, that you think this and when somebody becomes a president, forgetting the we all want the American president to succeed. When you look at say, oh, we need more security for the entertainment, well then do something about it, but don't tear down the E string. We want to have a fight on. Well, have the fight if that's what people enjoy. Have it in a auditorium, an arena that has been built for that. Don't have that on the lawn and have disgraceful language at the White House, the lawn of the White House. No putting down having a fight if that's what people enjoy seeing, go to the arena. Don't do that at the White House. And then when you see so many of the other things that the president has fallen short on and it's hard to understand. But you know what? Forget I'm here to talk about him. I want to talk about something very hopeful and that is this Obama Presidential center. Because the president has always been about training young people for the future, listening to them, respecting their views and then having them shape their future. And again, when we go to the Affordable Care Act, I could see him sit at the table with us and know the details of every specific provision of it and then go take a call from a head of state to change the subject and talk about how we're going to help Haiti because they just had a hurricane or an earthquake or whatever. So he just had this values based strength. And to see this center teach people about that, but more importantly, learn from young people as they teach us how they want the future to be. When he was president, he talked about this, he and Michelle talked about this. And now they have this dream come true for them, but also for the young people, we want to take responsibility for the future.
- [19:25]
Jen Psaki
When you think about the future, you know, one of the questions, I think if you travel internationally, which you have quite a bit, people ask, will we ever get back? Will the United States ever get back to what they were during the time of Barack Obama or other presidents before him? Even where there was a decorum and there was an ambition of what the United States did. Do you think we will and how.
- [19:48]
Nancy Pelosi
Yes, we will. What gives me hope are young people because it's their future and they'll demand certain democracy. In other words, let's make our democracy more democratic. We have that in our legislation. We couldn't get the votes in the Senate because you need 60 votes, but we will persist in making democracy more democratic. When we talk about the John Lewis Voting Rights act and we talk about ending partisan redistricting, we talk about having disclosed and stupid big money and the contributions that dark money that give, that make people suspicious about the whole process. We have to do that. But in addition to that, we have to respect the offices that we have. You know, I've been in Congress a long time. The integrity of the House is very important to me. Across the aisle, I was speaker of the whole House. And what was important to me was how we. We did our work with transparency, with accountability, and with as much bipartisanship as possible. The other side didn't describe it that way, but the fact is, when people take the oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States, the sacrifice that went into it by our founders, the vision they have for a democracy, the knowledge we should have about our issues as we go forward, the empathy we have for individuals and how public policy affects them, I have every hope that it will. And one thing I always say is the arts will bring us together because that's one place where people find their common ground, whether it's at a play, a concert, a museum, whatever. They may have differences of opinion, but they can laugh together, cry together, be inspired together, and find some common ground that will take our country into the future. The strength that our founders built our country on, shall we say. The Times found them to do that. The Times found Lincoln to save the Union. The Times have found us to bring it back.
- [21:55]
Jen Psaki
Speaker Emerita Pelosi. That was a perfect place to end. Thank you for taking the time out of an incredibly busy couple days for
- [22:01]
Nancy Pelosi
you, my honor to be with you. Thank you so much.
- [22:04]
Udemy Advertiser
Thank you.
- [22:06]
Jen Psaki
They don't make them like House Speaker Meredith Nancy Pelosi that often anymore. I'm so grateful to her for her time. Coming up, an exclusive first look at a piece of my colleague Michelle Norris's interview with President Obama himself that has not aired anywhere yet. You're going to see it first, and you're going to hear him talk about the Trump administration's warped view of patriotism and what it really means to love this country. But first, after watching Donald Trump today, my next guest called him, quote, an increasingly unstable lame duck and a national disgrace. Senator Jon Ossoff is standing by, and he joins me next.
- [22:45]
Freedom From Religion Foundation Announcer
America is an idea. For 250 years, that idea has helped expand our rights and our freedoms, but progress isn't guaranteed. Today, those founding principles are being challenged by efforts to mix religion and government. The Freedom From Religion foundation is working to protect the Constitution and keep power where it belongs, with we the people. Visit FFRF US MSNOW or text MSNOW to 511-511-Text MSNOW to 511-51-511 and keep state and church separate. Text fees may apply.
- [23:15]
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- [23:45]
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- [24:20]
Jen Psaki
Until last night, Senator Jon Ossoff did not know which Georgia Republican would be challenging him for his seat come November. But he liked to describe the two Republican primary candidates vying for that spot like this.
- [24:34]
Jon Ossoff
So we're left with the congressman who's only a congressman because his daddy was a congressman, and the coach who's only a coach because his daddy was a coach.
- [24:46]
Jen Psaki
Those sounded like some great options to me. Now we know the Republican candidate will be the congressman who's only a congressman because his daddy was a congressman. The Trump endorsed election denier Mike Collins won last night's Republican primary, meaning he will be the Republican facing off against Jon Ossoff in the fall. So my question is, I'm sure yours too. Now that Jon Ossoff knows who his opponent is, what's his plan for beating him? Joining me now is Senator Jon Ossoff. Okay, the general election. Thanks for being here. So the general election has started now, as you are well aware, you put a video out today. You've been out there in public today. What should the American public who's just tuning into this know about your opponent, Mike Collins.
- [25:35]
Jon Ossoff
Yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, you're gonna get to know Mike Collins very well over the next few months. And of course, to begin with, he is pro war, he is pro tariff, he's pro cutting your health care. He's also a notorious bigot and anti Semite and an election denying extremist who is only a congressman because his daddy was a congressman and is a Trump puppet who will serve Donald Trump's needs and agenda mindlessly if he is elected to the United States Senate. This is someone with some of the most extreme views and one of the most extreme records in the United States House of Representatives. And this is what I need people to hear tonight because I appreciate that there is confidence in our prospects in Georgia and in the mighty wave that is building across the country. But I need people to reckon seriously with the fact that Congressman Mike Collins, as loathsome as his record is, as low character and low integrity as he is, could be elected in the state of Georgia to a six year term in the US Senate if we don't do everything we need to do to get out the vote like never before in Georgia. And so I'm asking folks tonight to log on to electjohn electjon.com and help me defeat this notorious bigot and anti Semite and Trump poppet so he does not serve in the United States Senate one day, and so that the next five months are the last of his ignominious political career.
- [27:22]
Jen Psaki
This race is clearly on the mind of Donald Trump. He waded into your race today. He didn't take long. He even gave you a new nickname, quite a nickname. What did you think when you saw that?
- [27:35]
Jon Ossoff
I didn't think it was his best work, as nicknames go. But more to the point, he is increasingly unstable. And I think that it flows from the fact that he is globally humiliated from this failed war. This is a debacle for our national security. It is a debacle for the Trump presidency. And we see him lashing out and behaving erratically in ways that put the nation at risk. And I want to remind everybody again that he is going to be all in to elect Mike Collins his puppet to the United States Senate in Georgia. And right now, Jen, this is something I think folks are not talking about enough. National Republican groups allied with Donald Trump have hundreds of millions of dollars more than the national Democratic Party. They will be using those resources, hundreds of millions of dollars, to attack me and to try to install this Trump puppet in Georgia. And so again, I'm asking folks to log on right now, grab your laptop, grab your phone, go to electjohn.com and chip into this campaign so that we win decisively.
- [28:57]
Jen Psaki
So let's talk about what he is a rubber stamp or a puppet for, because you mentioned Iran. Trump gave an absolutely bananas press conference at the G7 today and we can get into the details of that plan. We certainly should. But I just wonder if you watched that press conference, if you saw clips of it and what you made of it.
- [29:17]
Jon Ossoff
This is a disaster for American foreign policy, for the American economy, for American national security, and for the Trump presidency. I mean, folks, remember that it was on day one of this war that Donald Trump assured us it was running ahead of schedule. And then he lied and lied and lied and declared victory Daily, weekly for weeks, victory always either imminent or just around the corner or already secured. And now he is humiliated by the failure of his foreign policy in the Middle east that has made America less safe, that has cost Americans tens of billions of dollars, that has expended munitions and military equipment it will take years for us to replace that has diminished our standing in the world. It will take years to rebuild from this foreign policy failure.
- [30:14]
Jen Psaki
The other thing he did today, which everybody should hear as a clear effort to be able to meddle in elections like the one in Georgia, is he canceledhe abruptly canceled a confirmation hearing for his own nomin, for the Director of National Intelligence, Jay Clinton, who is certainly not a perfect option. But part of what he's doing here is allowing Bill Pulte to remain, who's a Trump sycophant, to remain in the job to potentially likely weaponize the agency. Tell us more. Tell people what they should be focused on here. What do you think is going on here?
- [30:49]
Jon Ossoff
First of all, I think the installation of a thug and a hack like Pulte as the acting director of National Intelligence is maybe the most chilling and the most dangerous nomination or appointment that this president has made. Remember, it was Pulte's predecessor in this post, Tulsi Gabbard, that the president dispatched to Georgia to oversee that ballot raid on an election facility in Fulton County. Now he is putting Bill Pulte atop of the entire intelligence community, a partisan loyalist with no background whatsoever in intelligence or national security. He is putting the national security of the country at risk. His handling of this is putting the United States at risk and making a terrorist attack more likely because he is destabilizing America's intelligence capabilities. But he's also putting someone in who is a political hack who will abuse his authorities in the intelligence community. Everybody saw what happened in Fulton County. We're going to have to defend voting rights like never before in Georgia. And so, folks, forgive me for saying it again, but tonight is the night. Help us defend voting rights. Help us get out the vote. Help us win this crucial Senate race in the most competitive battleground state in the country. @electjohn.com
- [32:19]
Jen Psaki
I'm so grateful you were able to be here. There's so much I can always talk to you about. Senator John Ossoff, thank you again. Your general election is beginning, as everybody heard. Thanks for being with us.
- [32:28]
Jon Ossoff
Thank you, Jen.
- [32:30]
Jen Psaki
Okay, and up next, a piece of my colleague Michelle Norris interview with President Barack Obama that you can get to see before anyone else. We're going to show that to you when we come back.
- [32:45]
Freedom From Religion Foundation Announcer
America is an idea. For 250 years, that idea has helped expand our rights and our freedoms. But progress isn't guaranteed. Today, those founding principles are being challenged by efforts to mix religion and government. The Freedom From Religion foundation is working to protect the Constitution and keep power where it belongs with we the people. Visit FFRF US MSNOW or text MSNOW to 511 511, text Ms. Pass now to 511-511 and keep state and church separate. Text fees may apply.
- [33:15]
Thumbtack Advertiser
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- [33:44]
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- [34:20]
Jen Psaki
Vice President JD Vance has spent the last few days making endless media appearances. He's been everywhere. And during one of those appearances last night, he called Democrats terrible people. He said they don't show gratitude for the United States. He said too many Democrats, Democrats don't show appreciation for the country. And I just want you to hold that in your mind as you listen to what I'm about to play you from former President Barack Obama. This is from my colleague Michelle Norris. Exclusive interview with President Obama ahead of the grand opening of his presidential center here in Chicago this week.
- [34:54]
Barack Obama
I do think it's important to ground what happened during my presidency in this broader sweep of American history. And as I said before, This idea that. On the right, and you see this in the Trump administration, this idea that any suggestion or criticism that America was anything other than perfect is unpatriotic, is
- [35:31]
Freedom From Religion Foundation Announcer
a suggestion that you hate your country,
- [35:33]
Barack Obama
suggesting that you hate your country. Now, the flip side is among progressives, sometimes there is this sense of, well, the only true narrative of America is this one of oppression and exclusion. And I reject both those views. I think it's complicated. As I said, I think it's possible to celebrate the founders and appreciate what they did as well as look objectively and critically at how their values strayed very far from what they professed. I think it's impossible to say that there were populists in rural America and the south and white America that really did believe in equality and justice
- [36:33]
Donald Trump
for
- [36:33]
Barack Obama
white folks and helped to make progress in giving more people opportunity and not ignore the fact that that was to the exclusion of others. And that's the kind of complexity that I hope people get a little bit of a sense of.
- [36:52]
Jen Psaki
You want people to actually marinate in
- [36:54]
Freedom From Religion Foundation Announcer
that when they visit your center.
- [36:57]
Barack Obama
And the reason is this. But because I think when you understand the complexities of America and the contradictions of America, I don't think it makes you love it less. I think it makes you love it more. And I think it also makes you more resilient, because then during periods like we're in right now, where for a lot of folks it's crazy and you feel despair and anger, that perspective allows you to then say, okay, we've gone through crazy periods like this before, we've gone through mean periods before. It fortifies you to say that, yes, this has been part of the journey that we're on.
- [37:44]
Jen Psaki
We've been here before, we can do it again.
- [37:46]
Barack Obama
There's no reason to suggest that we can't get through this one either.
- [37:51]
Jen Psaki
Again, that interview is going to be part of a two hour special featuring President Obama and Michelle Obama starting at 9pm Eastern on Friday night. And up next, you are going to hear from someone who knows Barack Obama and Michelle Obama better than anyone without the last name Obama. We'll be right back. Beyond their families, there are few people who know Barack and Michelle Obama better than Valerie Jarrett. She hired Michelle Obama earlier in her career and went on to become one of the president and first lady's closest advisors. She's now the CEO of the Obama foundation, the leading force behind the Obama Presidential center that opens tomorrow. And earlier tonight here in Chicago, I sat down with her to talk about the opening of the Obama center, her time with the Obamas and that clip I just played from President Obama about what patriotism truly means. Valerie Jarrett, it is so wonderful to see you.
- [38:58]
Valerie Jarrett
It is wonderful to see you. Welcome to Chicago.
- [39:00]
Jen Psaki
Thank you. It's good to be back. I had my heart, it warmed my heart when I came into town on the plane this morning.
- [39:06]
Valerie Jarrett
Memories.
- [39:06]
Jen Psaki
Yeah, exactly. So you have been, as everybody knows who's watching, a close confidant of President Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama since before they were President Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama. You have been there from the beginning. You've been a part of the development of this center from the beginning. What does this week feel like to you? What does it mean to you?
- [39:27]
Valerie Jarrett
Jen, I'm so proud. I'm so proud of them. I'm so proud of everything that we accomplished while President Obama was in office. And I'm so proud of this center and what the foundation is going to be not just to Chicago, but to people all over the world. It's really the permanent home for hope.
- [39:44]
Jen Psaki
I saw this clip of President Obama the other day talking about his favorite part of the center, which is of course the part that is about the letters that he used to read. And I remember this well, he received thousands of letters. He used to read 10 of them in his briefing book religiously every single night. There's a part that is dedicated to that I think that tells you so much about him. What do you think it should tell people about him?
- [40:09]
Valerie Jarrett
Well, as you said, he would read 10 letters every evening, usually late at night when he was doing the piles of work that we sent up to him. And they came from the American people. And he would get about 40,000 pieces of correspondence a day. And as you know, we would sort through them and give him a representative sampling. So if five people Cared about health care. When he'd get, you know, or 50% cared about healthcare, he'd get five letters. And so. And if eight people were critical, 80% were critical, he'd get eight negative letters. So it was his way, Jen, of really staying in touch with the American people and finding out what they were thinking about, what was on their minds and what was in their hearts. And it grounded him in a very profound way. And it was just a reminder every single day that that's who he was there in service of. It was never about him. It was always about them. There's just something magical about having a leader who values the people, the people whose stories often don't make it to the surface. You don't hear about them on your show or on the nightly news, but they're the people who are out there just trying. Good people. Good, decent people who take the time to write to the president, never expecting a response. And yet he did respond.
- [41:23]
Jen Psaki
He did. And that was. And he's an emotional guy, as you saw, and I saw, too. He's talked. He's been out there talking a little bit about the center. We're gonna learn so much more about how he feels about it tomorrow. But just before this interview, we showed our audience an Ms. Now exclusive clip of coverage that someone you know well, Michelle Norris.
- [41:43]
Donald Trump
Yes.
- [41:43]
Jen Psaki
Did as part of a amazing documentary that's going to air later this week. And in that clip, President Obama talks about how what we see. He said that what we see from the Trump administration is this idea that any suggestion or criticism that America was anything other than perfect is unpatriotic. He also says that sometimes we hear from progressives that there is this sense that the only true narrative of America is the one of oppression and exclusion, and that he rejects both views. It's not a statement you hear all the time. You know him so well. What do you think he hopes people hear from that?
- [42:23]
Valerie Jarrett
Well, when you come to the museum, rather than beginning with his presidency, we begin with a Declaration of Independence. And the whole first floor takes you through the zigs and zags of our democracy and how it grew. And how it grew was when ordinary people got together with a common goal and did extraordinary things and all of these different ways in which our country has tried to make progress. But we've gone forward and we've gone back, and it's always been this fight against the status quo. And he welcomes, as you know, from his leadership style, he welcomes input from people of all different ideas. But we can disagree without being disagreeable. And I think part of the message at the center is that people will come and they will gather inspiration from the stories that they hear about as they travel through the center. But that's not the objective. The objective is for them to feel empowered, to go forth in their life and do something to make the world a better place. And it could be a small thing, it could be a little thing that's different. But what we want people to feel is this ability for those ordinary people to do extraordinary things.
- [43:26]
Jen Psaki
When you've reflected as you've been putting together this center and putting together all of the pieces on what the public expected from the Obama presidency in terms of moving past racism because they elected a black president, do you think that people were naive?
- [43:41]
Valerie Jarrett
Well, I would say it was a very hopeful moment. I think there were so many people around the country that felt so good about the fact that our country was able to elect a black person. And that is a sign of progress. And look, we've made a lot of progress just over my lifetime. When we think about what the beginning of the civil rights movement was like until now. But we don't always move forward in a straight line. And there are zigs and there are zags, and you have to make compromises. Back to your earlier question. We have to recognize you can't have 100% of what you want in a big, healthy democracy with this wide variety of different opinions. And you can stay true to your core values, but you have to be willing to give and take. And you have to recognize that it zigs and zags, but it pushes forward faster when we all kind of push together. And I think that's a big part of what the stories that we try to tell in the center. And it's not intended to be stories simply about President Obama, Michelle Obama. It's about lifting up all those stories of the people who made what he was able to accomplish happened in the first place. And if you don't tell those stories, then you don't really tell the full story of those two incredible people. They stand on the shoulders of many people. They stand next to so many people who worked hard and were part of his administration. And as you know, we had to give and take, and we didn't get everything we wanted. And we are very honest in this museum about saying the work that either we didn't get right, healthcare.gov for example, or the work that's leftist left to do. And you run as fast as you can, as hard as you can, you try to do as much as you can during the time you're there, and then you have to turn the baton over to the next generation. And right now, what we want to do is to help that next generation of change makers go out and make a big difference in the world.
- [45:29]
Jen Psaki
Well, I think this week is going to put a big shot of hope.
- [45:32]
Valerie Jarrett
I hope so.
- [45:33]
Jen Psaki
We all could use that shot of hope. Exactly.
- [45:35]
Valerie Jarrett
But not just to feel better, better, but to do better.
- [45:37]
Jen Psaki
To do better. Valerie Jarrett, it's wonderful to see you. Thank you for taking time out of your insane schedule this week to sit down.
- [45:44]
Valerie Jarrett
Thank you, Jen.
- [45:47]
Jen Psaki
We're going to take a very quick break and then tell you about what else we have planned this week in Chicago. We'll be right back. Okay. Tomorrow we're going to have a full day of live coverage here on MSNOW for the ceremony at the Obama Presidential Center. And we're going to be doing this show live from the Presidential center tomorrow night. We have lots of special guests stopping by, including Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker. That does it for me tonight. You can catch the show Tuesday through Friday at 9pm Eastern on Ms. Now. And don't forget to follow the show on Blue sky, Instagram and TikTok.
- [46:21]
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