'He's not going to be president forever': Pritzker vows accountability for Trump officials

Summary

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Podcast Summary

The Briefing with Jen Psaki

Episode: 'He's not going to be president forever': Pritzker vows accountability for Trump officials
Date: January 21, 2026
Host: Jen Psaki
Guests: Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker, Maryland Gov. Wes Moore, Congresswoman LaMonica McIver

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Overview

In this episode, Jen Psaki marks the one-year anniversary of Donald Trump’s return to the White House with a deep dive on the administration’s escalation of federal power in American cities—especially surrounding the killing of Renee Nicole Good by an ICE agent in Minneapolis. Psaki interviews Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker about his state’s response to federal overreach and his vow for future accountability, Maryland Governor Wes Moore about the moral challenges National Guard members now face, and Congresswoman LaMonica McIver, who is appealing charges brought against her after she attempted congressional oversight of an ICE facility.

With a somber, urgent tone, Psaki and her guests dissect the erosion of democratic norms, the intimidation of state and local officials, and the administration’s growing use of military power against Americans. They also focus sharply on how Democrats are preparing to resist, both legally and practically, and vow that accountability will come—even if delayed.

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Key Discussion Points & Highlights

1. Trump’s "Accomplishments" and Authoritarian Showmanship

• Anniversary Press Conference Satirized

  • Trump’s White House marked his first year back in office by having him brandish a “book” of accomplishments—before tossing it aside disinterestedly.
    • “He flipped through it...and apparently didn’t feel like reading it in the moment. So he just literally tossed it to the side on the floor.” (02:33)
  • Psaki and the panel deride Trump’s performative power displays:
    • "Trump thinks the town looks better...when you have armed military personnel marching down the streets." (05:09)

• Trump’s Comments on Territorial Ambitions (Greenland, Panama Canal)

  • Responses like, "You'll find out," and "I don't want to tell you that. Sort of, I must say, sort of," display cavalier attitudes toward global diplomacy. (03:42, 04:20)

2. Escalation of Federal Force in Minneapolis

• Killing of Renee Nicole Good by ICE and Aftermath

  • Trump’s DOJ blocks state and local investigations; federal ICE and other agents reportedly abuse both residents and local police, particularly people of color.
    • “If it is happening to our officers, it pains me to think how many of our community members are falling victim to this every day.” - Minneapolis police official, recounted by Psaki (08:18)

• Legal and Tactical Standoff

  • Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz puts National Guard on alert while Pentagon readies 1500 Army troops for possible federal deployment—two armed forces under potentially competing orders (09:07-12:04).

3. Democratic Governors Respond: Pritzker on Resistance and Accountability

• Legal and Civic Pushback

  • Pritzker describes Illinois’ "playbook"—encouraging peaceful protest, filing lawsuits, and resisting federalization of the National Guard:
    • “We immediately went to court…And frankly, we’ve won most of those cases.” (12:04)
  • He stresses the importance of fighting disinformation from federal agencies:
    • “Tricia McLaughlin…consistently lies, doesn’t have any facts, will come out with statements a half hour after an incident when she doesn’t really have any information...they’re just making things up.” (13:28)

• On Trump’s Intimidation Tactics

  • Pritzker notes punitive acts—loss of federal childcare, food assistance, healthcare—targeting blue states and Democratic officials for political reasons (21:48).

• Investigative Subpoenas and DOJ Attacks

  • With DOJ now issuing subpoenas to Democratic state officials, Pritzker vows not to fold:
    • “My response…is, you know, come and get us. Because everything you’re saying is a lie. And you cannot cower in the face of Donald Trump. He is a classic bully.” (20:59)
  • On accountability for federal abuses:
    • “He’s not gonna be president forever. And having the information in order to come after those people...they’re going to be held accountable one way or another when this administration goes away.” (24:37)

4. Democratic Fears Over Election Interference

• Concerns Over DHS, ICE, CBP at Polling Places
  • Discussion of active plans among Democratic governors to “monitor the polling places...clearing out the interference that Donald Trump is trying to bring.” (16:53)
  • Pritzker warns of potential “armed confrontation” between state and federal forces; emphasizes every effort will be made to avoid it. (17:38)

5. Economic Policy Tone-Deafness: Trump Cabinet Members’ Remarks

• Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins' $3 Meal

  • Rollins claims Americans can eat for $3/day by skimping on basics; tone-deaf and widely derided.
    • “I didn’t need a thousand simulations to understand what she was saying was crazy.” - Gov. Wes Moore (29:48)

• Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant’s Comments on Retirees Owning Multiple Homes

  • Out of touch with average Americans’ reality:
    • “This idea that somehow you have people who have their multiple homes as they get to retirement is a fantasy.” - Gov. Wes Moore (30:16)

6. Military and National Guard as Political Pawns

• Morale and Lawfulness
  • Gov. Moore, an Army veteran, voices concern for National Guard and active-duty troops:
    • “The challenge is that this is not about the authority of the president. This is about does it have both the moral clarity and the operational necessity for it to be real. And those are fundamentally different questions.” (34:39)
  • Moore underscores the importance of orders being lawful, not just issued from authority.

7. Congresswoman McIver and Abuse of Federal Charges

• Congressional Oversight Retaliated Against

  • McIver, charged for oversight at an ICE facility, is appealing a lawsuit, emphasizing legislative immunity and her refusal to be intimidated:
    • “Trying to silence me means silencing the people that elected me, and that’s 800,000 people. And I refuse to be silent.” (39:59)

• ICE Oversight Challenged by New DHS Restrictions

  • DHS requiring 7-days’ notice for facility visits, which McIver argues violates the statutory right of members of Congress to conduct unannounced oversight (43:16).
  • She warns, “What are you trying to hide?”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Authoritarian Aesthetics:
  “Trump thinks the town looks better...when you have armed military personnel marching down the streets.” (05:09)

• On Legal Resistance:
  “My response...you know, come and get us. Because everything you’re saying is a lie. And you cannot cower in the face of Donald Trump. He is a classic bully.” – J.B. Pritzker (20:59)

• On Future Accountability:
  “He’s not gonna be president forever. And having the information in order to come after those people...they’re going to be held accountable one way or another when this administration goes away.” – J.B. Pritzker (24:37)

• On Out-of-Touch Policy:
  “I wish I lived in the world that Scott Bessett was bringing up…this idea that somehow you have people who have their multiple homes as they get to retirement is a fantasy.” – Wes Moore (30:16)

• On Congressional Oversight:
  “Trying to silence me means silencing the people that elected me, and that’s 800,000 people. And I refuse to be silent.” – Rep. LaMonica McIver (39:59)

• On Preparedness and Warning:
  “We’ve got to protect our ballot boxes and protect our voting booths and protect those polling places and how we might do that…Imagine that on steroids.” – J.B. Pritzker (16:53)

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Important Timestamps

• Trump’s “Book of Accomplishments” Toss (02:15–02:33)
• Trump on Military in Cities, ICE Killings in Minneapolis (05:09–07:54)
• Minneapolis Police Describe ICE Abuses, Including Against Police (07:54)
• Gov. Pritzker on Litigation and People’s Power (12:04–14:51)
• On Subpoenas and Standing Against DOJ Intimidation (20:59–21:49)
• Pritzker on State-Level Accountability Commission (24:21–24:37)
• Brooke Rollins’ Tone-Deaf Meal Comments, Moore’s Response (29:05–30:16)
• Moore on National Guard and Moral Clarity (34:39)
• Rep. McIver on Fighting DOJ Indictment and Oversight Rights (39:59–43:16)

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Flow & Tone

Throughout, there is a palpable sense of alarm at the transformation of federal authority in the Trump administration's second term. The episode’s tone is urgent, resolute, combative, and empathetic—embodying serious concern for both policy and rule of law, but also highlighting tactical, nonviolent strategies of resistance and the vital importance of continued vigilance, oversight, and eventual accountability.

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Conclusion

Jen Psaki, joined by Governor J.B. Pritzker, Governor Wes Moore, and Rep. LaMonica McIver, outlines in vivid detail how Trump’s second term has upended norms, escalated federal force against American citizens and even officials, and attempted to suppress oversight. Yet, key Democratic leaders remain undaunted, developing legal playbooks, accountability mechanisms, and public campaigns of resistance—restating the belief that, while justice may be delayed, it is not denied, and that democracy’s defenders must, and will, continue the fight.

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Transcript

[Jen Psaki]

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[Governor Wes Moore]

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[Jen Psaki]

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[Governor Wes Moore]

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[Jen Psaki]

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[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Angie Hicks, co founder of of Angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well, from roof repair to emergency plumbing and more done well. So the next time you have a home project, leave it to the pros. Get [e-mail] is all in on this Tuesday night. The briefing with Jen Psaki starts right now.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Good evening, Jen.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Chris, it's so hard to summarize the hellscape we've all lived through over the last year. Since it's one year and you did, I just watched your entire show. Incredible job doing that and also touching on the news that we're living in. I'm going to try to do my best with that with I have some big help from Governor Pritzker and Governor Moore. Oh, that's a great, that's great. Yeah. So I'm going to get right to it, but lots to talk about. Looking forward to seeing your book events too. Have a great night.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Thanks, Jen.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Okay, as I just noted, as I think you are all probably tracking, it has been one year since Donald Trump returned to the White House and began his absolute assault on what most of us believe in fundamentally. And to mark the occasion, he decided to hold a press conference where he did what he always does, ramble incoherently for approximately 80 minutes before taking some questions. Now, it was clear from the outset that this was supposed to be some kind of a special appearance where Trump would list all of the things his White House considers his biggest accomplishments. One year in, they announced it in advance. There was a whole lead up countdown in the briefing. He had a big stack of paper they wanted him to basically go out there and sell his first year, as insane as it was. But that idea went straight into the waste bin as soon as Trump started talking. And I don't mean that as some sort of figurative turn of phrase.

[Jen Psaki]

Here's the book on accomplishments. Here's the book. These are all things we have. I'm going to read a few of the samples, but look at this. These are all each Line is something that we did. Nobody did that before. And it's big stuff, too.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Look, we have the hottest country in the world. I mean, some poor White House staffers, I'm just gonna feel for them for just a moment here, probably spent weeks drafting that, searching for anything in the past year they could spin in their own warped version of a Trump policy achievement. And Trump definitely did not read it in advance. That's clear. He flipped through it. Good for him. And apparently didn't feel like reading it in the moment. So he just literally tossed it to the side on the floor. That sound you heard, was it thumping on the floor? Which isn't really surprising at all when you think about it, because the man is not a policy wonk and he does not actually care about anything you might call a policy achievement, even those wackadoo ones they spun up from his team. What Trump cares about, which is very clear, is performatively exercising power. And he also made that very clear again today over the course of almost two hours in the briefing room. Take what he had to say about Greenland.

[Governor Wes Moore]

How far are you willing to go to acquire Greenland?

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

You'll find out. You'll find out. It's like he's in a western movie or something. I mean, there are European forces literally amassing in Greenland. Given the threat, most European leaders the United States relies on for a range of things and has for decades are irate, to put it mildly. And his answer was to make his plans for Greenland some sort of a weirdly phrased guessing game with a wink. But wait, there's more. Earlier on last year, you had mentioned you had indicated that you wanted to take back the Panama Canal. I know we've heard a lot about Greenland. Is that still on the table?

[Jen Psaki]

I don't want to tell you that. Sort of, I must say, sort of. That's sort of.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

First of all, all the things happening. What a key, hard hitting question there from the White House briefing room. But the more important point is Trump is like the little boy playing Battleship, a weak leader who aspires to use the military to get whatever he wants, whenever he wants it. And that's why I think the most telling thing he said in that entire hour and a half, and believe me, we're not torturing you with it, of rambling nonsense, was this.

[Jen Psaki]

I don't know.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

To me, a town.

[Jen Psaki]

It looks better when you have military people. These are big, strong guys. The bad guys look at them and they say, we're not gonna mess around.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Trump.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Trump thinks the town looks better that's literally what he said when you have armed military personnel marching down the streets. He loves the idea of US Cities being occupied by American troops. We know that. We've watched his actions. He loves using the military as a prop to make himself feel like he is more powerful. And when Donald Trump first started marching troops into places like Washington, D.C. and Los Angeles and Chicago, a lot of people said the same thing over and over. And I probably honestly said it many, many times that those cities were a, quote, testing ground for Trump's larger ambition of using the military as a domestic police force. A kind of a dry run, not only to normalize the presence of federal troops in American cities, but also to punish the predominantly Democratic mayors and governors that ran them. But now, one year into Trump's first term, I think it's safe to say that the test is over. We're no longer in the experimental phase. Trump is now weighing the use of the Insurrection act to deploy troops into Minneapolis, a city that's already been turned upside down by federal agents. And, of course, it's now been 13 days, just 13 days since Renee Nicole Good was shot and killed by an ICE agent in that city. And Trump has made clear he has no interest in seeking justice for her killing at all. I mean, immediately after Good's death, the FBI reportedly opened a civil rights investigation into the officer that killed her. But over the weekend, Deputy FBI Director Todd Blanche suggested that investigation had been shut down, claiming no investigation into the shooting is warranted. And this is even more appalling. It's already appalling, but it's even more appalling given the fact that the Justice Department has tried to open an investigation into Renee Nicole Good's widowed wife, prompting at least six career DOJ officials to resign in protest. All while Trump's DOJ has not only shut down the investigation, but they are reportedly stonewalling any effort by local officials to investigate the matter themselves. And now DOJ has taken the extraordinary step of investigating Minnesota's Democratic officials. They have now sent subpoenas to the governor, the mayor of Minneapolis, the mayor of nearby St. Paul, the state attorney general, and even the Hennepin County District attorney. They're investigating the very state officials that the FBI would normally be working with on a case like this. And that is not the only example we have of Trump's federal forces actively impeding local law enforcement. Today, in an extraordinary press conference, various Minneapolis area police officials spoke pretty handily about the way federal law enforcement has taken over their communities. And those officers revealed it's not just Minneapolis residents, but police officers themselves who have reported abuses by ICE and other federal agents.

[Jen Psaki]

Recently as the last two weeks, we as law enforcement community have been receiving endless complaints about civil rights violations in our streets from US Citizens. As this went on over the past two weeks, we started hearing from our police officers the same complaints as they fell victim to this while off duty. Every one of these individuals is a police person of color who has had this happen to them. In Brooklyn park, one particular officer that shared her story with me was stopped as she passed ICE going down the roadway. When they boxed her in, they demanded her paperwork, of which she's a US Citizen and clearly would not have any paperwork. When she became concerned about the rhetoric and the way she was being treated, she pulled out her phone in an attempt to record the instant the phone was knocked out of her hands, preventing her from recording it. The officer had their guns drawn during this interaction. If it is happening to our officers, it pains me to think how many of our community members are falling victim to this every day.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

So those are. I mean, it's stunning to hear. He's describing local police officers coming forward to say that even they have faced abuse by Trump's ICE forces in Minneapolis. So Minnesota's police are not only being overwhelmed by the chaos Trump has created, they have become victims of it themselves. And Governor Tim Walls is now mobilizing the state National Guard troops to help deal with the situation, though he hasn't deployed them yet. And at the same time, the Pentagon is reportedly readying its own Force of 1500 active duty soldiers for possible deployment to Minnesota. Not National Guard troops, but army infantry battalions from the 11th Airborne Division, troops based in Alaska that specialize in cold weather operations, according to defense officials who spoke to the Washington Post. And that means that we could see two separate groups of armed US Service members deployed to the streets of Minneapolis, one at the direction of Governor Walz and the other at the direction of Donald Trump. This is new territory. This is Trump ratcheting things up in a way he never has before. And it's important to say that it's putting these men and women in an untenable position, too. There's one sliver of good news here this year, and that is that the American people have learned how to respond. In the years since Trump took office, Americans have learned how to peacefully yet forcefully demonstrate against his agenda. In the years since Trump took office, Americans have learned how to protect their neighbors, how to train and prepare for ICE raids, how to warn people when ICE is coming and how to make sure people know their rights when ICE shows up. And Democratic leaders have also learned how to stand up to Trump, how to not be intimidated by his threats, how to take legal action against military occupation and ice abuses. Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker is one of the leaders who has been on the front lines of pushing back on the Trump administration. He has successfully seen his state through ICE raids, troop deployments, and repeated Trump threats. He knows what it's like to push back against this administration in the streets, in the courts, and in the eyes of the national public. One year into this administration, as Trump escalates his war in American cities like never before, Governor Pritzker is exactly the kind of leader I want to hear from. And Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker joins me now. Governor Pritzker, I have thought of you so much over the last 10 days, 12 days since we saw the horrific killing of Renee Nicole Goode and the events that have happened in Minneapolis since then. I mean, the state of Illinois, I don't have to tell you, but to remind everybody watching, has been on the front edge of Trump's targeting. And he is now, as you all know, threatening to bring the military into Minnesota against the governor and local leaders wishes. Today, he said he thinks a town looks better with the military on the streets. I know you watch all of this closely because what happens to one state could happen to another. Have you thought about this kind of scenario and how you would respond if Trump tried to do that in your state? I know we had the National Guard, but this is a next level here.

[Jen Psaki]

Well, I want to credit, first of all, the people of Illinois, the people of Chicago, for having helped us develop the playbook about how to deal with the onslaught from the federal government. We, of course, encouraged people to peacefully protest, and they did. We encourage people to speak up and speak out because it matters if we're being loud in favor of democracy and pushing back. And importantly, we, we've taken them to court, you know, from the very, very beginning when they were talking about bringing the National Guard or at least federalizing, bring them into our cities, we immediately went to court. And on every issue throughout the first year in office for Donald Trump, we have at every turn pushed back, taken them to court. And frankly, we've won most of those cases. And so I feel good about at least the judiciary is holding up in this time of, well, challenges to democracy. I want to also add, though, that, you know, what's really affecting people's lives on a daily basis. And I don't want to discount what's happening on the streets in neighborhoods where people are being attacked by ICE and cbp. But remember that other people who are not directly affected by that, their lives have been made worse. You know, the promises that Donald Trump made about lowering prices, about affordability, about making people's lives better, all of them were lies. And over and over again, we've seen this administration not only fail to live up to their promises, but persistently when they're challenged, they lie. And I want to say that about ICE and CBP and DHS. You know, Tricia McLaughlin, who's their spokesperson, consistently lies, doesn't have any facts, will come out with statements a half an hour after an incident when she doesn't really have any information. They're just making things up to so that the public will think, oh, everything's just fine when they're shooting moms in the face. I mean, this is a, you know, the American public are beginning to see that this administration is a danger to their futures.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

No question about it. And I think what we're all watching here, I started the show talking a bit about how Governor Walz is in this position where he has put his the National Guard on alert and just in case the president of the United States sends in the military an army battalion into the state of Minnesota. And I just wonder what you think about that dynamic, whether it is the US Men and women who are serving in the National Guard or in the army battalion or just how to manage that as a governor, where you have troops who are on different sides essentially of deployment.

[Jen Psaki]

He's fomenting this kind of clash that is on its way. Donald Trump thinks that it's okay to call in the military to declare the Insurrection act, even when it's just about people peacefully protesting, because, as you heard him say, he thinks it's better if there are troops on the streets of American cities. And we know, by the way, that this has nothing to do in his mind with how it looks. What he wants is ultimately to control American cities because he wants to affect the elections in 2026, because he knows he's going to lose if he doesn't do that. And deploying troops, and I mean, including CBP and ice, deploying people who are wearing uniforms and carrying automatic weapons, this is going to intimidate people who want to go vote. And he may very well try to carry out what Michael Flynn said back in 2020 that Donald Trump ought to do, which is seize the ballot boxes so he can count because, oh, there's fraud in the election. Look, they're just making things up at this point. The brave men and women of our armed forces, the brave men and women of our National Guard are being used as pawns, political pawns, by this president.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

No question about that. I think they're putting. Put in an incredibly untenable position. Let me ask you something. We're in 2026 now, as you fully know, and you have been warning about what Trump is trying to do with the ballot boxes and just basically to make it harder to vote. I heard an interview this morning from one of your fellow governors, Gretchen Whitmer, and she said that she expects further efforts from pro Trump figures to disrupt voting in her state. Something you've been saying for a while, saying even that it is not paranoid to think that the Trump administration will use DHS to interfere with the elections. I know you've been expressing concern about this. She referenced how governors have been talking about this. I'm sure, I assume you've been a part of that. What are you all talking about? How are you preparing for it? Because I think you and others have been warning people about it, and now people are wondering, what are we going to do about it?

[Jen Psaki]

Well, the question is, how do we monitor the polling places? How do we make sure that we're actually clearing out the interference that Donald Trump is trying to bring to our. To our elections? And we've been talking. I don't want to talk fully about, you know, all the things that we've been working on, but let's just say that, you know, traditionally in elections, when you're concerned about whether it's going to be a fair election or not, and there have been concerns before with, had nothing to do with National Guard or Donald Trump or troops. But traditionally in an election, you have monitors, you have people who show up and, you know, they're poll watchers, right, who are maybe in contact with a state's attorney or a prosecutor who can come in and make sure that things are happening in a fair way. Well, imagine that on steroids. And that's really what we're talking about. Imagine that we've got to protect our ballot boxes and protect our voting booths and protect those polling places and how we might do that. Look, in the end, what we don't want, the last thing that any of us want, is an armed confrontation between, let's say, our National Guard or our state police and federal troops or federal ICE and cbp. So we're looking at ways to try to manage through this very difficult situation. And avoid those confrontations. Cuz that would be just disastrous.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

I just played a clip of Minneapolis police talking about some of their police officers being targeted. People of color who were off duty by ICE agents. It feels like it's coming. There's so many more things to ask you about. We have to sneak in a very quick break, but we'll be right back with Governor JB Pritzker in just a second. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. When you use ANGIE for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well, from roof repair to emergency plumbing and more done well. So the next time you have a home project, leave it to the pros. Get [e-mail] Tyler Redick here from 2311 Racing game night's fun until someone spends five minutes lining up one shot.

[Jen Psaki]

Chalk.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Breathe.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

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[Jen Psaki]

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[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

CTC's 21 plus sponsored by Jumba Casino. Come to DSW for the shoes, stay for the fun. Because let's be honest, if shoe shopping isn't fun, are you even doing it right? So go ahead, try something new. Try something different, good different. Try something that feels like you, you know, the real you. And then definitely brag about it later. Because at DSW you've got unlimited freedom to play. Find the shoes that get you at prices that get your budget at DSW stores [e-mail] Let us surprise you. We are back with Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker. Governor Pritzker, I wanted to go back to Minnesota because you're one of the few people who's had to really think through with people in your state. The most effective way to push back the use of force in your state and also the use of kind of legal threats. And today we learned, and I'm sure you saw this, that the Department of Justice has subpoenaed the offices of Minnesota Governor Tim Walz, the Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Fry and several other local and state officials. It wasn't really too long ago when Trump said that you and Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson should be arrested. I remember very clearly you basically said come get me or some version of that. So that an effective pushback. But it feels like it is now escalated again where the Department of Justice issuing subpoenas makes it kind of puts a little bit more legal meat on it, I suppose. Have you thought about this? If you are a favorite target of Trump, if you and other officials in Illinois are subpoenaed by the Department of Justice, how you would handle that?

[Jen Psaki]

Look, this is the world we're living in where Tim Walls and Jacob Fry are being targeted, where I'm being targeted by the president of the United for just doing our jobs. And that that attack that he's bringing is one where, you know, my response and I know Tim Wells response is, you know, come and get us. Because everything you're saying is a lie. And you cannot cower in the face of Donald Trump. He is a classic bully. You've got, you can't step back, you can't get back on your heels. You got to stay forward on these things and, and fight back. And the American public sees that. It's B.S. you know, what, what Donald Trump is trying to do to his political opponents. He tried to take away childcare from five blue states.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Why?

[Jen Psaki]

Because the governors are his political opponents. He tried to. He is taking away food assistance and health care. And you know, the American public is not going to stand for this. And indeed we're going to see it in the 2026 elections. And I believe that the law and the power of the courts allows us to finally, because we understand that they are going to stand on our side to push back. And I'm not suggesting that the Supreme Court is exactly the way we'd want them to be, and they certainly have made some bad decisions. But in general, the court system has stood on our side. And so we've got to use that as well as the power of the people. People power. In the end, here is what's going to win this the day. And Donald Trump is afraid. You know, when he sees his numbers falling, you can hear him start to soften his tone and express that, you know, he's just not as popular as he used to be and doesn't understand why. And so I really believe that we're having the intended effect here. But look, the attack by the Justice Department on us as individuals, as elected leaders, we have to recognize that when they're going after turning this country into an authoritarian regime, that the only thing you can do is every single day push back. Because every day that you're not pushing back, they're advancing their cause and making us weaker. So we've got to push back. And again, everybody peacefully, but you can't go a day without saying something or making sure that you're protecting the people.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

That you represent, you have been tireless. Certainly, I know I've talked to you a number of times. The other piece that just as it relates to the law and how they're using the legal system, I mean, over the weekend, Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche said the Justice Department is not investigating the ICE officer who shot Renee Goode in Minneapolis. And as you well know, I mean, the Minnesota State attorney general and the Hennepin County District attorney have launched their own investigation. Something that would happen, of course, in other states. But normally, as you all know, the states would work with the FBI. And right now, the FBI is also not giving them access to information gathered at the crime scene. What do you. I know you've thought about this because you also signed an executive order back in October creating a database to basically track the unlawful actions by federal immigration officers in Illinois pertinent today. What do you think? What do you do when the federal government is essentially obstructing justice at the state level like this? You have your database, but what can you do to hold people like this officer and others to account at this point?

[Jen Psaki]

First of all, it's more than a database. We created something called the Illinois Accountability Commission. It's headed by retired federal judges who are gathering testimony, including video, including, as you said, a database of all the information that we have.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Why?

[Jen Psaki]

Because we are gonna hold them accountable. And yes, it's true when Trump and J.D. vance are saying that these federal officers have absolute immunity, they do not. But they do if the president is going to pardon them or not, hold them accountable while he's president. You know what? He's not gonna be president forever. And having the information in order to come after those people, to make sure that they are held accountable when the time comes, I know it's not good enough. I'd like to be able to hold them accountable today. But it is true that the Supremacy Clause makes that very difficult for states. So we're gathering the information because in 2029, in January, Gregory Bevino is going to have to answer for his actions. Kristi Noem, Tom Holman, and frankly, the line officers that are abusing people and in some cases, shooting people in the face, they're going to be held accountable one way or another when this administration goes away.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Elections have consequences. It's a perfect place to end. Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker, thank you so much for being here with me tonight.

[Jen Psaki]

Thanks, Jen.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Coming up, members of Donald Trump's cabinet reminded everyone today how wildly out of touch they are with the problems facing the American people. And I'm going to play you a couple of comments that you really have to hear to believe. And I get reaction from Maryland Governor Westmore as well. We're back after a very quick break. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair done well. Kitchen sink install done well. Deck upgrades done well. Electrical Upgrade done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. So we know the difference between done and done well. Hire high quality [e-mail].

[Jen Psaki]

Bubba Wallace here with Tyler Reddick. You know what's more nerve wracking than waiting for qualifying results?

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Waiting for the green flag to drop.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Instead of pacing, we rev up with.

[Jen Psaki]

Chumba Casino's weekly new releases.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

It's like a fresh set of tires for your brain.

[Jen Psaki]

Play for [e-mail].

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

No purchase necessary.

[Governor Wes Moore]

VGW Group Voidwear prohibited by law.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

CTC's 21/plus sponsored by Jumba Casino. Ah, DSW Earth place of the humblebrag Here. The shoes are so good.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

No one would ever know how little.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

You paid if you didn't go telling everyone that is. And with never ending options for every style, mood and occasion, all at really great prices, we'll definitely give you something to brag about. So go ahead, stock up on fresh sneakers from your favorite brands or try those boots you always secretly knew you could pull off. Find the shoes that get you at prices that get your budget at DSW stores [e-mail] Let us surprise you. Want to know how the first year of Donald Trump's second term has gone for Donald Trump's personal finances? Well, according to the New York Times, Trump has used the office of the Presidency to pocket more than $1.4 billion for him. And as for the rest of the country, the Trump administration's message is essentially if you eat less, you can afford more. You might recall last week when Trump's Agriculture Secretary, Brooke Rollins, told Americans to save money on meals by eating a piece of chicken, a stock of broccoli, a tortilla, and one other thing, claiming it only cost $3. Well, apparently she thought that message was so effective the first time she doubled down and defended her idea of an affordable, healthy meal. Earlier today, we had run almost 1,000 simulations and between three and four dollars is a fair number if you can have access to that food. So just about an hour ago I saw new numbers that were run a full day, meaning three full square meals and a snack is about $15.64. What are these simulations? But if you thought that Rollins is somehow the most out of touch member of Trump Cabinet, Treasury Secretary Scott Bessen essentially said, hold my beer, everyone, because today when he was speaking about the housing crisis at the World Economic Forum, Secretary Bessant shed light on how he thinks American retirees are living these days.

[Jen Psaki]

Maybe your parents, for their retirement have.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Bought 5, 10, 12 homes.

[Governor Wes Moore]

So we don't want to push the mom, it pops out.

[Jen Psaki]

We just want to push everyone else out.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Joining me now is Maryland Governor Wes Moore. Governor Moore, it's great to see you. There's so much to ask you about. But I just have to start, I mean, with those, I don't know how else to call them other than cringy out of touch clips I just played of Scott Bessant and Brooke Rollins. I don't know what world these people are living in. It's not the one that most people are living in. But you think about affordability, a lot of the cost of living crises that people are facing all the time. As the governor of Maryland, what did you make of those clips?

[Governor Wes Moore]

I didn't need a thousand simulations to understand what she was saying was crazy. And listen, I wish I lived in the world that Scott Bessett was bringing up. I come from a place where I was raised by an immigrant single mother who did not get her first job that gave her benefits after my dad died until I was 14 years old. That I lived in a home that was bought by my grandparents who my grandfather who immigrated to this grandmother and grandfather who immigrated to this country from Jamaica and had a home that was barely big enough for them, but they figured out a way to make it big enough for all of us, that I was raised in a family where, as my sister said, my mom wore sweaters so we could wear coats. And so this idea that somehow you have people who have their multiple homes as they get to retirement is a fantasy. And we are seeing how just since Donald Trump has come into office, how beef prices are now up 14%, coffee is up 20% for our farmers, that fertilizer is up 39%, everything is more expensive. And the only thing that continues to go up are both prices and the stock market for his hedge fund. And so this is, this is the type of, the lack of reality, the disconnect that people are so frustrated by because for a president who said that this is what he wanted to do when he got into office. It's amazing of how little focus that has actually been of this administration.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

And even today the stock market went down because it's so crazy what he's doing. I wanted to turn to Minnesota because you and I have talked about this a lot before. Your background as an army veteran and how it makes you think about how he's using his role as commander in chief. And I know how seriously you take your role as commander in chief of your state's National Guard. And right now, as you well know, the Department of Defense has put roughly 1500 active duty army soldiers on standby for possible deployments, deployment to Minnesota, a state in the United States of America. That state's governor, Tim Walls, has also been in a position where he has had to mobilize the National Guard in a readiness posture because they're under threat from the federal government. How do you think governors should be thinking about this? Because this is not just a one off. We've seen this pattern over and over again, and this is an escalation of it. We've still seen this pattern over and over again across the country.

[Governor Wes Moore]

I think the commanders in chief should think about it from the lens of their soldiers. Think about what it's like for that young man or young woman who joined up to serve the National Guard, who for many of them, this is not their only job. They're serving another job that maybe they are a teacher or maybe they are a construction worker, or maybe they are a police officer. But they decided to take on this additional responsibility because they believe in their neighbors and because they believe that in a time of crisis that there are missions that they alone can actually do and execute. And they also took the oath with the full expectation that the commander in chief would have a soberness about how they would use them, that they would keep in mind that they. Every time you deploy, you have to leave your family. Every time you deploy, you have to leave your job. Every time you deploy, you're deploying with an understanding that you might not make it back. And so they're deploying with an appreciation that the commander in chief is taking that deployment seriously. And so what happens when you see these deployments not being taken seriously? What happens when you see the commander in chief who's not using the military to de escalate situations, but is actually using the military to escalate situations? What happens when you realize that the commander in chief is using you and your life not as something that is helping to bring our society back together, but actually Helping to tear it apart. That's the challenge. That's the situation. That's what we are seeing and facing right now. And that's why, if you really want to understand what is happening on the ground, talk to the people who are closest to the ground. That's why these decisions should never be made to governors. They should be made with governors. And we are not seeing that right now in this situation.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

You and I have talked in the past about just the fact that anyone who's active service military does not have any obligation or should they abide by or follow unlawful orders. And we've heard a number of people make that argument. Have you thought about what advice you would give to men and women serving now who might be asked to be a part of the Insurrection act or might be are being asked to potentially deploy to Minnesota? Are those legal actions that they should be abiding by? What advice would you give the servicemen and women being asked?

[Governor Wes Moore]

Well, this is the challenge of this situation because, you know, technically the president does have the authority to operationalize the Insurrection act in the case where something like that becomes essentially your last tool. Right. The challenge is that this is not about the authority of the President. This is about does it have both the moral clarity and the operational necessity for it to be real. And those are fundamentally different questions. And for each and every one of us, we did, we had to take an oath that we would follow the orders of the command, the lawful orders of the commander in chief. That challenges the idea that we even have soldiers and sailors and airmen and Marines and Coast Guardsmen who even have to think for a second about whether or not the order that I'm getting is it lawful or not, highlights and underscores the fundamental problem with the operations that are taking place right now and the fundamental challenge that we are now asking our service members to put themselves into.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

It's unfortunately what so many of them are grappling with right now. And unfortunately it will continue to be an ongoing issue. Let me ask you about some news from your state. Earlier tonight, the Maryland Redistricting Advisory Commission approved, approved a new proposed congressional map that would give Democrats control of all of Maryland's eight House seats, as you are fully tracking now. Of course, for everybody watching who's tuning into this, it now has to pass the legislature. And the leader of the Democratic Senate in Maryland has been in vocal opposition to these new maps. I think it's fair to say a governor's political bandwidth is not unlimited. I mean, are you going to put your full political will behind making this happen. How do you see this as a priority for you?

[Governor Wes Moore]

Absolutely, this is a priority for me because I believe that fighting for democracy, democracy is a priority. Fighting for democracy is never a nice to do. It is something that is absolutely imperative to understand our national future and our national foundation. And I put together this redistricting advisory commission, which, by the way, is a bipartisan commission which has been listening to Marylanders for months and actually making sure that our maps are reflective of their will and not reflective of the will of Donald Trump. That when Donald Trump is picking and choosing which states go through this process, we in the state of Maryland said, well, if Texas and if North Carolina and if Florida and if Ohio, if they are going to do this, then you know what? The state of Maryland should have a process to determine whether or not we have maps that represent our people as well. And I'm really proud of the work that the commission did where for months they've now compiled information, listened to Marylanders and have now come up with recommendations. And so it is going to go in front of both the House and the Senate. My urge, my push is that they debate the maps. They can make adjustments if they see, if they see so fit, but then take the vote because people want to see that democracy is not just going to be safe in the state of Maryland, but democracy is something that the people of the state of Maryland are going to push for ourselves as to what this should look like. These maps represent the will of the people. The people of our legislature should now vote on them.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Governor Westmore, thank you so much for being here with me tonight.

[Governor Wes Moore]

Thank you so much.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Coming up, Congresswoman LaMonica MacGyver was trying to conduct oversight of an ICE facility, and then Donald Trump's Justice Department indicted her. If that doesn't sum up the first year of the second term year, I don't really know what does. And today Congresswoman McIver announced how she plans to appeal those charges. And she joins me now next. As Trump's Department of Justice spends their time investigating elected Democrats in Minnesota for what they are absurdly claiming is obstruction of ice, one of the first Democratic lawmakers targeted by this administration is still fighting her case in court. And you may remember this chaotic scene in May of last year outside an ICE detention facility in Newark, New Jersey, where ICE agents arrested the city's mayor, Ross Baraka, on direct orders from the number two at Trump's doj. I should note now during that scrum, three Democratic members of Congress who were there performing oversight, which I would just reiterate is a part of the job for members of Congress. Those lawmakers attempted to keep the agencies, the agents, from swarming the Newark mayor. Now, a federal judge dismissed the charges against Mayor Baraka, but Trump's Justice Department did end up indicting one of those lawmakers who was there that day. Congresswoman Lamonica MacGyver was charged with three counts of assaulting or impeding federal agents. Now, she is still fighting those charges. And just today, she filed a notice to appeal a federal judge's decision not to dismiss the criminal charges against her. In a statement, the congresswoman said, what happens here matters far beyond what happens in this one case that is such. And Congresswoman MacGyver joins me now. I was so eager to talk to you. I almost didn't introduce you. I. It's such a powerful point you made there because I think since you have, since you were targeted, we have just seen this absolutely escalate. Let me start by asking you about your decision to appeal these charges and the announcement you made today.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

Well, Jen, I said from the start, even on this show with you and many others, and whenever I get a chance to talk about it, we are not going to be intimidated. I'm not going to be intimidated out of doing my job, and I'm going to continue to fight this. And this is the next step of the fight for us. Right. A local federal judge didn't decide to dismiss the charge and charges. So now we're going to the Third Circuit to appeal that. And it's about me having legislative immunity, not because I'm above the law, but because legislative immunity protects me for doing my job, and it protects members of Congress for doing their job. And Donald Trump is just trying to silence me. He doesn't understand. Trying to silence me. Well, no, he does understand silencing me means silencing the people that elected me, and that's 800,000 people. And I refuse to be silent. And that's why we're filing this appeal, to continue to, you know, have the voice for the people that I represent.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

And I've had the pleasure of speaking with you about this a number of times. You have never been silenced. Just to be absolutely clear, I've wondered, as you've watched, especially the news today, about all of these officials, many of whom, you know, who have been subpoenaed by the Department of Justice in Minnesota for also doing their jobs. Their. What reaction you had to that made you think about it made me think.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

About the warning that I put out last May about how this is just not about a little black girl from the city of Newark representing the people that are assigned to her to represent. It was going to be bigger than this. It's about silencing critics. It's about making sure we can hold him accountable, that this administration can't be held accountable and this president can do anything that he wants to do. And it's way bigger than me. And now you see every day someone is being under attack from this Department of Justice or this president has taken away funding from Democratic states and cities. We constantly see him doing things like this, and he's not going to stop. Every day it gets worse and worse. Like, I mean, it's just not going to stop.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Part of your job, which I said in the beginning, but it's important to keep stating, is oversight. As a member of Congress and you were trying to visit a facility which you have every right to visit. You have been on oversight trips since then. Tell us a little bit more about what you've seen.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

I mean, we've seen these facilities, especially the one, particularly in my district, Delaney hall, where a man died there less than 24 hours. A healthy Haitian immigrant went inside there and did not come out alive. And that is why I continue to show up at these facilities and conduct oversight. This is why I call on the Oversight Committee to investigate these locations and shut them down. And we have to continue to have oversight over this agency. I mean, people are dying. I mean, we've seen broad daylight of people being beat, pepper sprayed, mistreated. Imagine what they're doing in the dark, you know, and the American people deserve to be protected. And we should be protecting them from this agency and from this President, quite.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Frankly, and from many of the people who work for him, frankly. I mean, as you well know, the Secretary of Homelands, the DHS Secretary of Homeland Security, issued a new set of regulations. Basically, you have to give seven days notice, right?

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Which sounds, on its surface, reasonable. It is not reasonable. And you know this. Well, Explain to people why it's not.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

Well, first of all, Congress statutes, you know, via statute. Right. We have the right to show up unannounced for a visit of an ICE facility. So this new, you know, protocol that they're putting in place is literally just to play games with us, you know, and try to stop us from coming in to do oversight. We do not have to give notice. We can show up unannounced. Literally. A judge just ruled that. Again, you know, literally, with the case that just came from the 12 Democrats filing the lawsuit against it. So the fact that they're trying to stop us from doing that, I mean, it just shows. What are you trying to hide? What is there to hide? Right. Why do we have to give you notice? Why can't we show up? Right. I mean, it's just, it's ridiculous.

[Jen Psaki]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

What do you, there's a lot of debate about this right now. What do you think is the role of Congress in trying to reign in ice?

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

Yeah, well, I think the number one role of Congress, I know the role that I'm playing, Jen, is to protect the people that I represent. We have to protect, protect the American people from this president. And that protection goes beyond ICE as well. We have to protect them from ice. We need to protect them by making sure cost is not rising, making sure we're protecting them to make sure they have health care. I mean, it is our job to do that. And that's what I have said I'm doing. I'm going to continue to do. Look, we are moms, right? You're a mom, I'm a mom. The protection comes naturally. And so that is what we should be doing. We have to, to talk about doing that and we have to actually do it.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

I know you're trying to do that every day. Congresswoman, thank you so much for being here.

[Congresswoman LaMonica McIver]

Thank you.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Okay, coming up, the story of one Republican senator tells you everything you need to know about how Donald Trump operates. That's next. Not even a year ago, Republican Senator Bill Cassidy made a deal. He'd cast a deciding vote to confirm RFK Jr. But he'd get promises RFK would protect vaccine access and messaging. And he'd avoid getting Donald Trump angry enough to endorse a primary challenger. Now, basically, all of the promises Cassidy received are in tatters. Diseases like measles are roaring back. And as of this week, Cassidy doesn't even get to avoid a Trump backed primary challenger. The President just endorsed Congresswoman Julia Litlow's bid to unseat Cassidy in the Senate. And so Bill Cassidy learned a classic Trump lesson. You can sell your soul to him, but it's only a matter of time before he sells you off, too. That does it for me tonight. The Last word with Lawrence o' Donnell starts right now. Hey, Lawrence.

[Jen Psaki]

Hey, Jen. Senator Cassidy disgraced himself in that situation and deserves everything he's getting politically right now. But Jen, we have breaking news that occurred during your hour. This is a stunning, stinging defeat for Donald Trump. Another defeat for Donald Trump. And that his, his favorite fake U.S. attorney Lindsey Halligan has been forced out of the Eastern District of Virginia by the judges who actually run that district from the bench. And it's a Trump judge. It's a judge named David Novak, who Trump appointee, I'm reading from the New York Times reports of the breaking news warned Ms. Halligan that continuing to file court papers in which she is listed as the U.S. attorney would be, quote, a false statement made in direct defiance of valid court orders, end quote. And that is a federal crime. So she had to have a federal judge tell her, you do this again, you are committing a federal crime. In fact, you've already committed a federal crime. They got her out of there tonight. And so Donald Trump's choice of a completely incompetent US Attorney to try to prosecute James Comey and Letitia James is now finally out of there. The judges are going to be choosing the U.S. attorney for that district.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Well, that's some good news. Who thought that an attorney with no prosecutorial experience who would do the bidding that no one else would do, who wasn't even political in the office would do, wouldn't last that long. But big news to now. Look forward to watching you talk about it.

[Jen Psaki]

Yeah. Total humiliation for Lindsey Halligan. Total humiliation again for Donald Trump.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Trump. Yeah. There you go on year one anniversary.

[Jen Psaki]

That's what it is. Thanks, Jen.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Thanks, Lawrence.

[Jen Psaki]

Thank you.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Jen Psaki or a news anchor)]

Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair, done well. Kitchen sink install, done well. Deck upgrades, done well. Electrical upgrade, done done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. So we know the difference between done and done well. Hire high quality [e-mail].