← The Briefing with Jen Psaki
The Briefing with Jen Psaki
No one is buying Trump's ICE shooting narrative and videos of ICE abuses are making it worse
00:42:03
Jen Psaki reports on new polling that shows Americans are very aware of the deadly ICE shooting of a Minnesota mom and are not buying into Donald Trump's tactic of trying to blame the victim of the shooting. At the same time, Trump's DOJ deciding not to investigate has triggered a rash of resignations, and a non-stop flow of videos of ICE agents brutalizing residents of Minneapolis, including Americans, is further souring public opinion on the job Trump has ICE doing.
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- [00:00]
Narrator/Commercial Announcer
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Angie Hicks
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- [00:46]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
But let me just start here because today Donald Trump was touring a Ford plant in Michigan. You may have seen this already before giving a speech on the economy in Detroit. And when presidents, I can tell you, do these sorts of things, they are usually highly contained and highly choreographed. And that is how Donald Trump likes things to be. I mean, in his safe little bubble, shielded from any form of criticism or pushback whatsoever. He loves to be adored, and they make it that way so that the people around him adore him. But for one brief moment during that tour of that Ford plant today, that bubble was pierced when a heckler shouted at Trump and seemed to call him a, quote, pedophile protector. Now, Trump pointed right at him, mouthed, f you, and then appeared to give him the middle finger. You just saw him do it right there. And the White House seemed to confirm as much in a statement to several news outlets late today, calling it, quote, inappropriate and unambiguous response. I have given a lot of statements from White Houses. I'm trying to imagine, well, any president I ever worked for doing that and defending it, if so. But here we are in 2026. Now, I raise this because it is absurd and ludicrous and crazy that the president did that, but also because the whole episode just kind of perfectly sums up his posture toward the country he is supposed to be running right now. I mean, it kind of feels like that middle finger was directed at all of us, at every person in this country who still believes in common decency right now. Not even in a political way, just common decency. A middle finger to everyone criticizing, say, the COVID up of the Epstein files, to everyone criticizing the decision to take control of Venezuela, to everyone whose health care costs are skyrocketing right now, to everyone speaking out about a bogus investigation into the chair of the Federal Reserve. And yes, a middle finger to every person in this country speaking up on behalf of Renee Nicole Goode and speaking out against the ICE agent who killed her. It has now been six days since that deadly shooting. And after a weekend of national protests and national outrage all across the country. You can see a number of them on the screen there. After NBA players held a moment of silence for Renee Nicole Goode, after Hollywood stars paid tributes to her at the Golden Globes, after people from Minneapolis to Berlin held vigils and lit candles to honor her memory. After all that, Donald Trump is still tripling down, attacking the woman who was shot three times and killed while defending the man who shot her. Do you believe that deadly force was necessary? After watching all the footage, a few days have passed. What's your assessment there?
- [03:33]
Congressman Maxwell Frost
It was highly disrespectful of law enforcement. The woman and her friend were highly disrespectful of law enforcement.
- [03:43]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Okay, so in Donald Trump's version of the world, the woman whose last words were telling an ICE officer, I'm not mad at you, was highly disrespectful. That's how he sees it. And more importantly, in Trump's version of the world, being disrespectful to an ICE officer is apparently enough to justify shooting a woman in the head. And this disturbing and immoral take on the killing of Renee Goode is what is basically being echoed throughout the entire administration.
- [04:15]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Hats off to that ICE agent.
- [04:17]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
This deranged lunatic woman was trying to ram him over with her vehicle.
- [04:22]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
If you look at what the definition of domestic terrorism is, it completely fits the situation on the ground.
- [04:30]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Okay, so they're saluting the ICE agent. They're calling Renee Nicole Goode a deranged lunatic and a domestic terrorist. And here's the thing. These aren't just sick, rhetorical attacks to please their boss. And believe me, they're all capable of that. They're being backed by the full force of the federal government. I mean, the criminal section of the Civil Rights Division at the Justice Department is supposed to investigate any fatal shooting by a law enforcement officer. That's part of what they do. But Trump's DOJ is reportedly refusing to investigate the agent in the shooting, claiming there is no basis to open a civil rights probe. Instead, Trump's DOJ is reportedly pushing for a criminal investigation into a victim of the shooting. Becca Good. Now, Becca is the widowed wife of Renee Nicole Goode who was present at the scene of her death. And they are preemptively exonerating the shooter. Doj, this administration, I should say, and trying to bring the full force of the Justice Department down upon a woman who just lost everything at the hands of that very shooter. But nobody has watched the videos and all of the angles of the shooting of Renee Nicole Good buys the story Trump World is trying to sell, and nobody outside of Trump's cabinet seems to be willing to go along with it. Today, MsNow was first to report that at least six career officials at the DOJ's Civil Rights Division have now resigned in protest in response to the decision not to investigate the circumstances of this ICE involved shooting. And those resignations include six several top leaders, including the chief deputy chief and acting deputy chief of the section that investigates police killings. This is the biggest mass resignation of DOJ officials since the administration dropped its investigation of Eric Adams back in February. Now, Emma Snow has also confirmed reporting from the New York Times that another six federal prosecutors, these ones from the U.S. attorney's office in Minneapolis, have resigned over the DOJ's push to get them to investigate Renee Nicole Good's widow. Those resignations include Joseph H. Thompson, the second in command at the Minnesota U.S. attorney's office, who I should note just for context here for everyone, had previously been Trump's Pick for acting U.S. attorney and who worked on the team that investigated Joe Biden's handling of classified documents under Robert Hurt. Remember that? He was on that team. I mean, not really someone Trump can claim was a deep state liberal of any sort of so career prosecutors aren't buying Trump's lies and neither is the American public. Chris and I were just talking about this. A new poll out today from YouGov and the Economist finds that nearly 70% of Americans have seen the video of Renee Nicole Goode's death and another 22% have heard about it. Now another poll out today from Quinnipiac finds that as many as 82% of voters have seen the video. And those same polls also found that those who responded believe that the ICE officer was not justified in shooting Renee Nicole good by an 18 to 20 point margin. YouGov finds that Americans think ICE actually makes Americans less safe, not more Safe, by a 13 point margin. And Quinnipiac finds that voters disapprove of the way ICE is enforcing immigration laws by a 17 point margin. YouGov even found that 46% of Americans now support abolishing ICE entirely As opposed to just 43% who oppose abolishing ICE. And that's the most support for abolishing ICE that any public poll has ever found since ICE was created back in 2003. As polling expert J. G. Elliot Morris points out, Even back in 2020, at the height of the protests over law enforcement in this country, people still opposed abolishing ice by a 17 point margin. Now, public sentiment has swung so far against ICE that for the first time, more people say we should get rid of the agency, then keep it. That is significant. Whatever you think about abolish ICE as a policy or slogan, the shift itself is remarkable. But if you look at what is happening on the streets of cities like Minneapolis, it's really not hard to see why Americans are moving in that direction. Don't touch her.
- [08:46]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Don't.
- [08:47]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Can't touch you, Sugar. Stay in your room and shut the door. Get back. See, I'm not even touching nobody. Get your hands off of me. Baby.
- [09:49]
Congressman Maxwell Frost
Step out. Stay back.
- [09:52]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Stay back.
- [09:53]
Angie Hicks
Stay back.
- [09:53]
Congressman Maxwell Frost
What the did he do to you?
- [09:55]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Stay back.
- [09:56]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
Did he do.
- [09:56]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Hey.
- [09:57]
Congressman Maxwell Frost
Do not put your vehicle in here.
- [10:00]
Angie Hicks
I'm not resisting.
- [10:01]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
I'm not resisting. I'm not resisting. Those are just some of the scenes from Minneapolis, just some of them. And we have those scenes because people were brave enough to capture them with their video cameras. Sometimes they're reporters, but a lot of times they're just average citizens, and they're sharing them with the public so that people can know what is happening there. The American people can see, thanks to all of those people, what ICE is doing with their very own eyes. They are making it clear they don't approve of what ICE is doing. That is what the American people are making clear. And despite the threat of those violent tactics, the American people are showing up in big numbers to protest. I mean, this was the scene today outside the Washington, D.C. headquarters of U.S. customs and Border Protection, where about 1,000 protesters and several Democratic lawmakers gathered to rally against Trump's brutal immigration policies. The rally was organized in part by the group Indivisible, which is currently calling on lawmakers to use the upcoming budget negotiations to demand changes to the way ICE operates. Now, one of the lawmakers who has already vowed to oppose any budget that does not rein in ICE is Congressman Maxwell Frost, who gave a passionate speech to the crowd about what is at stake. Listen to this.
- [11:21]
Congressman Maxwell Frost
We're talking about a man who looked this woman in the face, who looked Renee Nicole Goode in the face, in the eyes, and shot her in the face. And then her car, in that moment, turned into a casket. Minutes later. Minutes later, this administration, from Stephen Miller to Kristi Noem to the vice President to the President of the United States, label her a domestic terrorist. And then this administration wants to lie to us about what we saw in that video, the calm tone that she had in that moment, the look on her face in that moment. We don't want ICE just out of Minneapolis, but we want ICE out of all of our communities. And we must ensure that we use every tool in our toolbox, which includes voting no on the DHS appropriations bill. No more funding for terrorizing our communities. No more funding for killing our people. For so long, the right wing has held up patriotism as a vibe, as an aesthetic. But patriotism is more than bald eagle, flag and beer. Patriotism is about loving the people who live in the damn country, every single one of them. And if after an American citizen is murdered in the middle of a neighborhood, after dropping off her kid at school, if you can't come to the mic, no matter your political party, no matter what you come for, and express just a shred of humanity, you are not a patriot. You do not love this country, and you do not love its people.
- [13:32]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
And starting us out tonight is Florida Congressman Maxwell Alejandro Frost, who you just saw passionately speaking in that video. What a speech. It was incredibly powerful. I was wondering, as I was watching it earlier, kind of what was going through your head. It felt like there was a lot of built up emotions there. It's really hard to watch these videos. I have a hard time watching them, too. What was going through your mind and what was it like there? What was the crowd like there tonight?
- [13:57]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
There's so much going through my mind, but honestly, it goes back to when I first saw that video of her being shot and killed, is that it was actually a very familiar video to me because as someone who's worked on ending gun violence Since I was 15 years old, this was gun violence, Gun violence done by the state. As someone who was organizing during Black Lives Matter on the streets of Orlando, who saw that video of George Floyd being liched in broad daylight, it reminded me of that.
- [14:23]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Eight blocks from there.
- [14:23]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Eight blocks from there. And so when I think about Renee Nicole Goode and I see that video, it's so eerily familiar to a country that has done nothing to stop our kids from being shot, to stop black people from being shot. And now we're at this point where even a white woman driving in a residential area, this was just killed by an ICE agent, someone who had such a calm tone, who told him she's not mad at him, he shot her. And we heard the profanity he used as her car rolled away uncontrollably and hit a pole. And honestly, Jen, that's the part of the video that gets me the most, is that car just going away. There's a silence just in the entire street as everyone is just watching, shocked at what had just happened. And everyone across the country has to know that if we don't do anything that is coming to all of our neighborhoods, to all of our communities, it's an important.
- [15:18]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
They also reportedly left the scene. They wouldn't let a doctor see her. There's so much cruelty that even followed the shooting. We've seen, you and I have talked about this a lot, just how change can take time. Right. We've seen, though, the polling. We've seen people coming out in the streets in Washington, D.C. and all across the country. And we've seen people really bravely capture what they're seeing in Minneapolis and cities across the country. Do you feel like there is. Are we at a turning point as it relates to the public sentiment on ice?
- [15:52]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
I think so. And I have to remind people that a little more than 20 years ago, the Democratic Party wasn't fully on the same place in terms of gun violence prevention laws. Of course, in the 90s, assault weapons were banned. But when it was time to renew that, there was a bit of a split within our own party. Not everyone is for banning assault weapons. And then somebody walked into a school, Columbine, and then somebody walked into another school, Sandy Hook, and then someone walked into another school, Marjory Stoneman Douglas, and murdered innocent people. And those were turning and inflection points for our own party in this nation. And now more than 90% of this country is for common sense gun reform. So this, I believe, is a turning point where people are waking up saying this is something that has gone way too far. And I think we as Democrats really do have to see this moment and say this is that moment where people are seeing themselves represented in a tragedy that they maybe thought was another person's issue, was an immigrant's issue, was a person's issue in Minneapolis, Minnesota, in a different state. But I think people seeing that video are disturbed, the Democrats and Republicans alike. And I think it's really important that we answer the call that's right in front of us.
- [17:00]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
And they're seeing people dragged from their cars, as we just showed in the days after that, terrorize A school. It's continued. I knew you said that. There shouldn't be support for DHS funding, the DHS funding bill. Their budget, ISPA's budget, has gone up by 200 or 300%. It's completely crazy. They're overfunded, over empowered.
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Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
More than the Marines?
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Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
More than the Marines is an important reminder. What do those changes look like? What does change look like that you feel would be enough or would be satisfying?
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Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Many different things. I mean, I can start by saying they should not allow to be masked. They're the only law enforcement agency that's allowed to go around our communities, terrorize their people and have masks on with no accountability. That's just one simple thing. Right. The other thing is they need to have warrants to be able to take people the way they're doing. And obviously we need to clarify this in the law. And that's something that's very important as well. Those are just two, but we're putting out entire lists as the Congressional Progressive Caucus of many things we want to see happen here. Now, are they going to adopt all them? No, we know they're not. I mean, this is an administration that has no problem with people walking into elementary schools and killing kids. Why would they have a problem with this? But it's important that we put this forward for two reasons. Number one, I believe we should not be voting yes on this bill unless we get those things. If we don't get those things, we have to vote no on the bill, and I assume we'll be voting no on it. But number two is I believe that because the tide is changing, we will take the majority come at the end of this year. And it's important as Democrats that we're in a position where we can say all that money that was given to ICE from the big ugly bill to give billionaires a tax cut and to give ICE unlimited amount of resources. We need to take that back and give it to the people, whether it's in housing, whether it's in ending gun violence and different things like that. And this is a moment where we can position ourselves to talk about both what we do with what's right in front of us in terms of ice, but also connect the dots here for people. Everybody knows they ripped away health care from 17 million people. Everybody knows Trump is against extending the Affordable Care act tax subsidies so health care will go up for 25 million people. Where's the money going? Tax giveaways for billionaires and money to ICE so they can go to your community and do what we saw in that video.
- [19:12]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
The funding will likely be a part of a big package at the end of January. Are you prepared? I mean, it was, the government was shut down in large part because Democrats refused. They stood up for people who weren't getting their health care. Costs escalated as the skyrocket as they are now. Are you prepared to take the same kind of stand on accountability for ICE and defunding and cutting the funding for ice, the government shutting down potentially as a result?
- [19:38]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
Well, I'll tell you this. In the House, if every single Democrat voted no on every single funding bill, the Republicans are still able to move it forward. They run the whole federal government. So no matter what happens with government funding, if the government shuts down, it's because Republicans shut themselves down.
- [19:53]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
That's true.
- [19:54]
Activist/Advocate (possibly a gun violence prevention advocate or Congressional Progressive Caucus member)
But it is up to us to, to take a stand and draw red lines. And we drew a red line when it came to health care. We said, we're not going to vote for a bill that's going to rip away health care from 25 million people. We didn't vote for it. And what happened? We got a vote on the House floor. It passed with, what was it, 17 or 19 Republicans. And now we're moving that forward. A huge win for the people. And so we're in this place where I think it's similar, not the exact same situation, but we need accountability, and we can only use the tools that we have. And this is one of our biggest tools that are right in front of us. So the Congressional Progressive Caucus just put out our official position on this. We're not going to vote to continue this reign of terror on our communities. And most Americans agree with us.
- [20:34]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Congressman Maxwell Frost, you've had quite a day. Thank you for being here. Really appreciate you joining me. Okay, coming up, Donald Trump's speech about affordability in Detroit today was went about as well as you expect. And his effort to go after the Fed Chair with a bogus investigation is going about as well as you'd expect. Also, Senator Elizabeth Warren is here. She spoke with Trump yesterday. Also, there's that. I have so many questions. And she joins me here at the table after a quick break.
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Angie Hicks
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- [21:29]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
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Angie Hicks
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Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
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- [22:40]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Just before President Trump took the stage at the Detroit Economic Club today, where he gave a speech touting his economic policies, insisting that affordability was a quote, fake word invented by Democrats. Quite a message for a speech. There you go. Just before Trump gave that banger of a speech, the New York Times published this Initial Obamacare enrollment drops by 1.4 million. Now, the word initial is key in there because that number is expected to get worse, not better. You see that 1.4 million number, the number of Americans who made the brutal decision to forego health care coverage after their premium costs skyrocketed, literally doubling on average after Trump and Republicans refused to extend health care subsidies last year, that 1.4 million number is made up of people who are well informed enough to have preemptively opted out of their new higher premiums. Lots of ACA enrollees have plans that automatically renew. And those people have not gotten their first bill yet. They may not know how much higher their new premium is. And when those people get their first bill and the sticker shock hits, which it will, the amount of Americans Trump and Republicans will have effectively just priced out of health insurance is expected to rise. Now who could have predicted that? Well, just about everyone predicted that. We talked about it a lot on this show. You know why? Because policy experts and Democrats and all sorts of people out there were jumping up and down, shouting about it for months last year, but Republicans in Congress allowed health care subsidies to lapse anyway. Now, today in his speech to the Detroit Economic Club, Trump turned to something else. He wants to get rid Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell. As Trump put it today, quote, that jerk will be gone soon. Graceful as always. Now, the Federal Reserve is independent. Trump can't actually unilaterally get rid of Powell. But the Justice Department has now opened a criminal investigation into Powell, seemingly trying to intimidate him out of the position, all because Trump is upset that Powell is refusing to change interest rates willy nilly at Trump's command. Again, they're independent. Now, again, we find ourselves in a position where economists and policy experts, leaders on Wall street and Democrats who don't often agree on all that much, are jumping up and down and warning about just how catastrophic for our economy it would be if Trump destroyed the independence of the Fed and politicized interest rates. But Trump seems to be angling for just that. For him, I guess it's full steam ahead, no matter what. Joining me now to talk about all of this is Senator Elizabeth Warren. She's the ranking Democrat on the Senate Banking Committee. Wow. Lots to discuss first. I mean, I read this headline this morning about what Jamie Dimon said, and I thought Senator Elizabeth Warren might agree with this. He basically warned that if Trump tries to mess with the independence of the Fed, that would be bad for the economy and bad for people across the country.
- [25:35]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
It be bad. So here's.
- [25:37]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
I know why, but you tell us.
- [25:39]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Here'S why it would be bad. So setting interest rates is a really important thing to do. And there are kind of two ways you could think about how to do that. You could have some people that you do your best to isolate. And boy, they're economists, they're dull, they're nerds. And what they look at is they look at things like what's happening to inflation, what's happening to unemployment, what's happening to GDP growth. And then they say, we think the place to stay set interest rates is right here. And that's how it works right now with an independent Fed. What Donald Trump wants to do is, frankly, what every president would love to do and say, no, no, no, let's let the president reach in and control interest rates. Because as we get into the months before a presidential election, when you've got a president who is insistent serious trouble on the economy, serious trouble, because families are feeling like an economy that's not working for them, that president is going to be so Tempted just to dial down those interest rates and flood the economy with money. And just think of it as a sugar high for the economy, right? Businesses do more investing because they have cheap, cheap money available. Families do more buying because they've got cheap, cheap money available. A good short term sugar burst, like drinking, you know, five of those energy drinks, Red Bull at once. Red Bull, Red Bull all the way. Long term consequences for the economy, a total disaster because it makes inflation go up, it causes prices to go up overall because of the kind of uncertainty if politicians are driving it. So that's what this fight is really about. And Donald Trump has known it since the day he got into office. He said he was going to fire Jerome Powell Shute. He'd been in office about an hour and a half. He tried to fire Lisa Cook, another member of the Federal Reserve. He has openly said he will only name a Federal Reserve chair who will do exactly what Donald Trump wants. In other words, a sock puppet. So Donald Trump is trying to get his hands on the control so that he can use interest rates in order to try to persuade people that their economic lives are better than they are. But there's a hard reality out there. And that reality, Jen, is people are very worried about trying to build some economic security. They're worried and they're getting angry at Donald Trump.
- [28:21]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
We are seeing that around the country. And the sugar high nature and who cares what happens over the long term feels so indicative of his governing. Let me ask you, I can always ask you about a million of things, which is one of the reasons I love talking to you. You are a former law professor. One of the things we started the show just talking about, of course, what's happening in Minneapolis and the resignation today of six people from the Civil Rights Division of six people from the U.S. attorney's office in Minnesota. So many people, a huge percentage of the country has watched these videos and feels horrified and deeply sickened by it. What is the path to accountability? Is there a path to accountability legally for this officer?
- [29:00]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Absolutely. Now look, we fortunately still have good people in Minnesota at the state level. Keith Ellison, the attorney general is terrific. And boy, if anyone is going to get in there and get a hold of whatever information he can and pursue justice on behalf of the people of Minnesota, it will be Keith Ellison. And of course, he's backed up by both Governor Walz and by the Lieutenant Governor, Peggy Flanagan, who by the way, is running for Senate. Just terrific. A real fighter for working families and also somebody who doesn't take corporate PAC money. So you got a lot of good people who are engaged. So we've got a real possibility of getting some justice at the state level. Also, remember, we just keep pushing at the federal level because that's what we have to do nationally. Show up peaceful protests, keep this issue alive, keep videotaping and keep showing those videos all across the country to keep pushing back on this administration. Look, right now we have an ICE that's just out of control. And it is our job, both in the Senate, in the House, but also people all across this country to push back and say we got to get some constraints in place.
- [30:26]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Yeah. What does that look like to you? I mean, there are some Democrats in both the House and Senate are laboring for the party to, of course, refuse to fund the government unless Republicans agree to rein ICE's ballooning budget. That's a big amorphous definition. What do you think about that and how do you think it should be a part of the conversation leading up to the end of January?
- [30:46]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Remember, we already have parts of the government now that are going to be funded. But I think, look, we need to focus in particularly on putting some constraints on ICE before you just write them another check for zillions more dollars. But overall, I've been clear from the beginning, it was just like Maxwell Frost just said a minute ago, the Republicans own the House, they own the Senate. If they're going to need some Democratic votes in the Senate, which they will, I've been real clear about what it's going to take to get my vote, and that is lower costs for American families. Put some constraints in here on ICE and show that actually if we pass this money, you're going to spend it in the ways that Congress has designated. It's pretty straightforward, nothing fancy.
- [31:37]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Well, I don't know if it, I don't know if they're going to accept all of that, which is why it's important you're going to keep pushing. Senator Elizabeth Warren, thank you for being here as always.
- [31:45]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Thank you, Pat. So good to see you.
- [31:46]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
All right, coming up, we're going to have much more on that chaos inside the Justice Department as mass resignations rock the Civil Rights division here in D.C. and the U.S. attorney's office in Minnesota. As I just mentioned, Stacey young is an 18 year veteran of the DOJ. She resigned from the Civil Rights Division after Donald Trump was reelected. And she joins me next.
- [32:09]
Angie Hicks
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- [32:40]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
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- [33:45]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Okay, Something you should know, maybe you already know, is that Trump loyalist and 2020 election denier Herme Dillon runs the Civil Rights Division of the Justice Department. Back in April, Dillon described her new role this way. Quote, the job here is to enforce the federal civil rights laws, not woke ideology. Quite a quote. Normally among the cases the Civil Rights Division would investigate or suspected abuse or improper use of force by law enforcement against civilians. Like, for example, last week's shooting of Renee Goode by an ICE officer in Minneapolis. But Harmony Dhillon is refusing to properly investigate what happened, a decision that has now led to not only six federal prosecutors resigning from their jobs and at least six leaders of the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division in D.C. resigning as well. The Justice Department has tried to push back against the gravity of those DC Based departures by saying that they had requested early retirement prior to the shooting. But what the DOJ did not push back on was that Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights Harmony Dhillon decided not to investigate Renee Goode's killing. There you go. Joining me now is Stacey young. She spent 18 years at the Justice Department, including in the Civil Rights Division. And after resigning almost exactly one year ago, she founded the Justice Connection to provide support for current and recent DOJ employees and to advocate for accountability at the Justice Department. First, let me say it's amazing that you decided to do that because you served as a public servant for 18. You could have had many things you did. So thank you for doing what you do and all the people you help out there. Let me start by just asking you just what do you make? We're trying to make sense of kind of the Civil Rights Division and what happened today with six people deciding to resign, essentially. A number of them, of course, had asked for early retirement. But what do you make of the Civil Rights Division refusing to investigate?
- [35:37]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
It is horrifying. One of the things that the Civil Rights Division does is it makes sure that police misconduct, that excessive use of force is addressed, is investigated, is prosecuted. And what we're seeing here is the division telling career prosecutors, no, you are not going to go to Minneapolis and investigate what's happened. You are not going to work with local and state law enforcement on this investigation. We are going to hold you back. We are not going to enforce the statute that applies in this case, which is 18 USC 242, which prohibits unconstitutional actions by law enforcement agents under the color of law. It is abdicating its duty to make sure that police abuse is addressed properly. And the fact that you have seen now 12 DOJ prosecutors leave, that is stunning and it should be shocking to every American.
- [36:42]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
And it's important, hearing it from you, how shocking it should be now instead, and we started the show talking about this, they are prioritizing a criminal probe into Renee Goode's widow. I mean, that woman just lost her heart last week, essentially, and now this is what she is potentially facing. Walk. That is obviously crazy and not normal. But you've been there. We were there for 18 years. Tell us how not normal that is and what your reaction to that was.
- [37:13]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
It is so not normal that you have long term, very senior prosecutors resigning over it.
- [37:21]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Yeah.
- [37:22]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
That shows you just how out of the ordinary this is, is when you go after the victim of a shooting instead of investigating the shooting itself. When we know what happened, we all saw the video. We saw how horrific that was. That kind of situation demands a response from the federal government, especially when it, when a federal law enforcement agent is involved, was the one who shot the gun three times. The fact that DOJ is not pursuing this in any kind of meaningful way is shocking.
- [38:05]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
You know very well what it takes working with state, local law enforcement on these investigations. They're often done in partnership, of course, and they are, of course, the FBI is investigating, but they're refusing to share any information with the state of Minnesota. There has been the attorney general in Minnesota announced his own investigation. Everyone, it's the job of people who are elected to be confident and project confidence in how this investigation can move forward. And that's what we all want to see. But you know what it takes? Can this investigation move forward even with a very well meaning attorney general in Minnesota? If they don't have access to the information the FBI has gathered, it's going.
- [38:42]
Former DOJ Official (Stacey Young)
To be a lot harder for Minnesota state and local officials to pursue this investigation because the federal government is pushing them out of the way. One of the reasons the Department of Justice and the federal government generally has credibility in American communities is because they work with state and local law enforcement. They need to build partnerships. And we're seeing those partnerships erode. Instead of working with law enforcement in Minnesota, you're seeing DOJ treatment those law enforcement officials as the enemy. That is not how you address crime. That is not how you address community tensions that we're seeing escalate. That's how you inflame them.
- [39:29]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
No question about it. I can't thank you enough for being here and for what you do, too. It's really important work. All right, coming up, the people of this country, as we've been talking about through the course of this show, are pissed. They're pissed off. We see it in the protests, we see it in the polls. And as my next guest, job to make sure we see it in November, in the outcome. Ken Martin is the chair of the DNC and a Minnesota native, and he joins me next. Welcome back. And joining me now, as promised, is Ken Martin, a Minnesota native and chairman of the Democratic National Committee. Okay. You just announced and launched a major voter registration drive. And I want to get to that in just a moment, I promise, because it's so important for people to hear about. But I've been thinking about you over the course of the week and just all of the videos we watched, the killing of Renee Nicole Goode, what we've seen as the follow up. I know how important Minnesota is to you. How have you been? How are you?
- [40:33]
Ken Martin
Well, thank you. I mean, I obviously am here in D.C. now, and it's painful watching what happening in my home state, communities being torn apart, you know, people, you know, that are on the front lines trying to stand up for their communities, for their Neighbors being harassed and bullied, just the grief. In a state that's seen so much over just the course of this year, where we saw our speaker of the House, one of my great friends, Melissa Hortman, assassinated on the heels of that, just a couple months after her funeral, the shooting at Annunciation, and, you know, five years after George Floyd was murdered in Minneapolis, the community really hasn't had a chance to heal. And so we just can't catch a breath, so to speak. People just need a break. And now what we're seeing, of course, is the federal government weaponizing, you know, the ICE Force, terrorizing communities, ripping people apart and out of their homes, and unfortunately, you know, assassinating a woman in the streets. It's painful to watch. And, you know, my heart breaks for sure. I wish I was home, but I'm here.
- [41:41]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
One of the things we've seen in such a tragic week is really an outpouring of. I mean, the people of Minneapolis are incredible. And I'm going to tell you, people protesting, standing with their neighbors, people protesting across the country, across the world. I know you wish you were at home in Minnesota. I can see it on your face right now. But you have such an important job. Take us. Take us in the bigger picture here of how you can channel that anger, that fear, that sorrow, that horror into Democrats winning back in November.
- [42:12]
Ken Martin
Well, I think it's important for people who care about what's happening in this country, and, you know, not just Democrats, but all people who realize this is unfortunately who we are as a country, but it's not who we need to be in moments like this. We need people to find a path forward who can bring people together and remind us of who we are and that this isn't acceptable, what we're seeing. And that means to continue to stand up and when your neighbors are being harassed, to continue to stand up for them. The thing I love about Minnesota, and I wish more people knew this, it's a very welcoming state. It's one of the reasons we have some of the largest refugee communities who've come from all over the world. It's not because we're a warm place from a temperature standpoint. Right. It's because we're a warm place in terms of being inviting people we care about, our neighbors, our friends, people from all parts of the world. The world. So it's painful.
- [43:07]
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Yeah, I know it is.
- [43:09]
Ken Martin
But, you know, let me say, truly, it's what we need to learn from this, is in moments like this, you always have power, and the power is your voice. The power is standing up and always doing the right thing. It's sort of what MLK said, right? It's always the right time to do the right thing. And in this moment, the right thing to do is to keep standing up and fighting for justice. Right. And when you see communities in this country being treated the way they are, you have to fight for them.
- [43:38]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
No question about it. I know that's what has led you to be in the roles you've been in for so many years. And part of what people should know out there is they have a voice. They have a voice to protest peacefully. They have a voice also to vote when they can vote. And this voter registration drive, it's $2 million for organizer training in Nevada and Arizona. I know you're going to expand it beyond there. What does it look like? What is your goal? How much money are we going to think spend here? Maybe you need money from people watching. I don't know. You tell us.
- [44:07]
Ken Martin
Well, let me say, before I get to that, I want to say that in addition to standing up and fighting back and fighting for justice, one thing that is really important for folks not to forget is that the best way we can put a check on this maniac's power and make sure stuff like this doesn't happen in our communities is to actually defeat them at the ballot box. Right? It's important to stand up against this injustice, but it's also important to realize that elections have consequences. Unless and until we put a check on this power, this is going to happen again and again and again in more places than just Minneapolis and Minnesota. So my ask of everyone listening, of course, and everyone not listening is don't just protest, take action. And the best action you can take is get involved and help elect Democrats so we can put a check in power. Let me just end with this voter registration. So critical. I'm so proud of this program that we launched, the When We Count program, to actually make sure we're creating more Democrats. My job is to win elections, and to do that, we have to create more Democrats. We do that by persuading voters, for sure, but we also do that by registering people who aren't registered, get them involved in their democracy, make sure they understand that they have power and a voice and make sure they're mobilized to the polls. This is a historic investment by the dnc, the largest investment ever in actually reversing the trends that we've seen in recent years where we've lost ground to the Republicans on voter registration. And I'M very excited about it.
- [45:31]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
Ken Martin, thank you for all you do. Thanks for being here.
- [45:34]
Ken Martin
Thank you.
- [45:34]
Host/Anchor (likely Jen Psaki)
We'll be right back. That does it for me tonight. You can catch the show Tuesday through Friday at 9pm Eastern on Ms. Now. And don't forget to follow the show on Bluesky, Instagram and TikTok.
- [45:46]
J
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