← The Briefing with Jen Psaki
The Briefing with Jen Psaki
Postmaster shocks with honesty about Trump's anti-mail ballot scheme
00:42:05
Michael Steele shares a jaw-dropping exchange between Senator Gary Peters and Postmaster General David Steiner in which Steiner admits that a new proposed Trump administration rule would withhold mail ballots from states that do not comply with Trump's voter database demands. Senate Peters joins to discuss.
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Narrator/Announcer
America is an idea. For 250 years, that idea has helped expand our rights and our freedoms. But progress isn't guaranteed. Today, those founding principles are being challenged by efforts to mix religion and government. The Freedom From Religion foundation is working to protect the Constitution and keep power where it belongs, with we the people. Visit FFRF US MSNOW or text MSNOW to 511511. Text MSNOW to 511511 and keep state and church separate. Text fees may apply.
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Michael
You know, recommendations can be great. Maybe someone recommended this podcast and here you are. But home projects are different. If a podcast isn't your thing, you lose a few minutes. If you hire your cousin's neighbor to mount your tv, you might end up with a lopsided screen and wall damage. Maybe I know a guy. Just isn't enough for your home. That's why thumbtack works. It matches you with top rated local pros with photos, reviews and credentials all in one place. For your next home project, try thumbtack. Hire the right pro today. Well, folks, we all know Donald Trump isn't exactly a policy wonk. Okay, let's just put that out there. But when it comes to policy, there is one thing he cares about more than anything else. Overhauling our country's elections to rig the rules in his favor. Now, remember, this is the guy who called for Republicans to nationalize elections and take over voting procedures from the states, even though the states are constitutionally entitled to run their own elections. The same guy who just yesterday derailed landmark housing legislation in yet another attempt to pressure Republican lawmakers to jam through his voter suppression bill. And once again, the guy who has tried to unilaterally rewrite voting laws through convoluted executive orders. Well, yesterday, in an absolutely jaw dropping exchange, Democratic Senator Gary Peters of Michigan asked Trump Postmaster General about one of those executive orders, one that Trump signed in March to create a federal database of eligible voters. It not only required states to share voter information, it also empowered the US Postal Service to be the gatekeeper of who is able to vote by mail. And that's exactly what Senator Peters got Trump's Postmaster General to admit on the record yesterday.
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Senator Gary Peters
If a state refuses to turn their absentee voter list over to the federal government, will the Postal Service still mail their ballots under this proposal rule? Under our proposed regulation, no. We would tell the state that we need the manifest in order to, you know, look, what we're asking. That's the answer you tell no. So the proposed rule basically coerces states to conform to these new requirements and hand over their absentee voter rolls or face the consequences of not being able to vote by mail.
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Michael
All right, folks, sit with that for just a second. If you're not on Trump's administration's list, you can't cast your vote by mail. And if your state doesn't bend the knee or some other state body part, then nobody can vote by mail. That is Donald Trump's vision of democracy. But today, we actually got some good news on that front. Yes, there is a calvary out there. Just this afternoon, a federal judge struck down that executive order restricting vote by mail. And that decision came just one day after a different federal judge blocked another executive order intended to restrict voting. One requiring proof of citizenship like your birth certificate, just to register to vote. Now, as the judge in that case pointed out, the Constitution does not grant the President any specific powers over elections. Just a little constitutional law for you there. Yep. Donald Trump 101. Come on, you can't do it. Well, that rebuke may explain why Trump suddenly launched a new pressure campaign that aimed it straight at Congress yesterday. You see, that ruling I just mentioned came down Yesterday morning at 9:51am, just 35 minutes. At 10:26am Trump made that infamous announcement that he would not sign the bipartisan housing bill until Congress passed his restrictive voting bill, the so called Save America Act. Now, maybe that was just a little coincidence, you know, just some bad timing. But the fact that Donald Trump is once again trying to bully Republicans into passing his stalled voter suppression bill does prove one thing. Trump knows that he can't just rewrite American election laws on his own. If he wants to make it more difficult for you, every American out there, to vote, he knows he is going to need Republicans in Congress to do it. And right now, it doesn't look like that will happen anytime soon. Currently, Trump's election overhaul wish list is stuck in the Senate, where the Republican Majority Leader, John Thune has maintained repeatedly that he doesn't have the votes to pass it over the 60 vote filibuster threshold, let alone enough Republican votes to kill the filibuster and pass it with a simple majority. Last night, guess what John Thune did. He got consent of all 100 senators, every last one of them, to start their July 4th resource. They gone. And honestly, folks, Senators, take your time. It's a long summer. Enjoy it. Joining me now is Democratic Senator Gary Peters of Michigan. Senator Gary Dude, I don't know what voodoo or mojo you found to get that moment, but how did you manage to get Trump's Postmaster General to make that incredible admission in the first place, you've had this administration stonewalling and saying all kinds of stuff. But to hear someone actually admit, yeah, that's what we're going to do. We're trying to limit mail in voting unless states turn over their voter rolls, you had to be thinking yourself, this is a good day to be a senator.
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Senator Gary Peters
Well, it was remarkable. But you can't hide the facts. It's very clear what the President was trying to do was to basically, as you've mentioned in the opening here, is to take over elections at the federal level. And we all know the Constitution is incredibly clear that it's the states that run the elections. It's the history of our entire country, our local communities and, and states run these elections. You don't want the federal government involved. Certainly our founders were very concerned about that kind of overreach. And to use the Postal Service, you know, here it is a very trusted institution where people know that if they put an address on, on an envelope and drop it in the mailbox, it's going to go to where it's supposed to go. It's an incredibly important service. In fact, the Postal Service is actually written in the Constitution. You know, Ben Franklin was the first Postmaster General. They thought that the only way you keep a very large and diverse nation together is by having a postal service that delivers to every single address in America. It's the only entity that does that. None of the private companies do that. They can't do what the Postal Service does. And so when it comes to probably the most important mail that the post office delivers, which are ballots which are fundamental to our democracy, to use that power, to say, we're going to use that leverage. We're not going to allow mail in voting unless we get all of these records and put it into a federal depository. And what kind of. What could go wrong with that? We know a lot can go wrong with that. In fact, we understand that the Homeland Security Department is looking at how they might be able to cross reference some of this information that's coming into the Postal Service. This should be incredibly frightening to all Americans to think that this could possibly go forward. It's why we have to push back very aggressively, as we are, and certainly in my committee and other folks, I signed a letter with every single member of the Democratic Caucus calling out the administration on that. You mentioned the court case that we had today. But that we also have to remember that only covers 23 states. The 23 states that brought the lawsuit. So the other 27 states aren't part of that. They could be subject to this. So, and I suspect we'll have the Trump administration also going to be appealing this decision. So this fight's not over. But it's certainly, as you mentioned very, very accurately, this is another indication of the kind of drastic actions this administration is willing to take in order have federal control over elections that in the Constitution, very clearly lie with our state governments.
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Michael
Yeah. You know, Senator, you struck a number of important notes there, starting first and foremost, and I really appreciated the history lesson that you imparted to folks. So they understand the role of the Postal Service in this country is a constitutional service, if you will. It's one that has been protected by the Constitution because they realize the value of having information, mail, reach everybody in a way that was effective and free, not coerced and tainted the way Trump is looking to do it. So that leads me to ask a couple of things. One is this executive order is purposely designed to be convoluted and, in my words, stupid, because that works for Donald Trump is dumbed down in a convoluted way. But then it also gives Republicans a chance to sort of elbow their way, find some wiggle room to give Donald Trump what he wants. Are you worried about that as well, that he will be able to find enough Republicans to capitulate here, particularly given, as you noted, that 27 states are not a part of this lawsuit and therefore could make that case, if you will, for their reckless behavior?
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Senator Gary Peters
Yeah, I certainly hope so. We're going to be doing that. I mean, there has been usually very strong support in a bipartisan way in the Senate, because all my colleagues understand how important the Postal Service is to communities, as we talked about bringing them together. One place where the Postal Service in today's world is even more important is in rural areas. Rural areas depend on the Postal Service to a considerable degree more than you'll have in urban areas. And many of my Republican colleagues represent very rural states. So any attack on the Postal Service or any attempt to try to undermine the impartiality of the Postal Service, the trust that the Postal Service has with the American people should be something that they are very careful about damaging. And certainly we will continue to make that point every opportunity that we get.
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Michael
Do you have any sense, Senator, the number of votes that are going to be necessary by Trump to kill the filibuster and what kind of pressure Republicans are, you know, are going to be under to actually nuke it and the consequences of that?
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Senator Gary Peters
Well, they certainly are under a lot of pressure right now and they don't have the votes. And let's hope that that continues because as you mentioned in the opening, the reason they want to kill the filibuster is to have another attack on voting rights to make it more difficult for people in this country to vote and a way to disenfranchise large numbers of people who they think are not going to be voting for them. You know, this is clearly a Republican Party that is feeling desperate. They understand that things are not going well. The cost of living goes up. You had Donald Trump refused to sign a housing bill that would help bring down the cost of housing in America because he'd rather meddle with the elections, because he knows the only way that they may have a chance to win is if they change the rules. And that's what we're seeing here. They're changing the rules. And that's why it's so incumbent on all of us who, who love this country and understand that this democracy requires the most fundamental action of voting has to be protected. That we show up in unprecedented numbers this election and make that very clear to not only the United States, but the whole world, that the American citizenship will never allow anyone to tamper with the most fundamental right in this country, which is the right to vote.
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Michael
That part right there. Senator Gary Peters, as always, nailing it and making it clear. Thank you so much, sir, for being with us. And joining me now here at the table, Emma, congressional reporter Michael Snell. I've been so excited to meet Michael. We've passed each other and you're here at the table. Welcome. And chief Washington correspondent for Midas Touch, Scott McFarlane. We get to see Scott quite a bit. Welcome to you both. So, Michael, let's start with you. And just the kind of stunning nature of how all this unfolds. You're right there in the midst of all of this. You get this series of things happening early yesterday morning where we look like we got the bill signing all set up. Everybody's psyched, you're ready to go. President tanks it. What was the mood, the response that you heard and what Republicans in particular were saying? Cuz I understand a number of them were really ticked off.
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Scott McFarlane
Yeah.
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Michael
And so how did you see it?
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Michael Schnell
It was pure shock. I mean, and to underscore that the stage was literally set in statuary hall where the signing ceremony was supposed to take place. I had walked through just a few minutes after this announcement had been made. There were seats there with the name of senators on them. There are signed seats where there. I mean this was going to happen, this was going to happen and Republicans were thrilled about it. For months they've been being hammered on this affordability message that it's going to be so key for the midterm elections. We have particularly seen it with these rising gas prices, rising inflation. That's been a problem for Republicans for defending. They were happy to have this housing bill then in their arsenal to go on the campaign trail and talk about it. And it completely blew up in their faces, not to mention it blew up in their faces for an issue like the Save America act, something that the Senate has tried time and time again to pass as recently as late last month and it just hasn't been successful. And I've been speaking to a number of Republican senators who want this bill in law, they want this to be enacted, but they've recognized that the votes just simply aren't there both to pass the legislation and to nuke the filibuster. So they're willing to move on. I mean John Kennedy, the senator from. The senator had said that he wants a Porsche but you can't just get what you want so you have to move on. So it was sort of a double edged sword here. The fact that A, their big win was taken off the table, really ripped from their arms from the President and then B for an issue that they have been trying to turn the page on but they're just not able to do it because the President is so fixed.
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Michael
So I just gotta follow up cuz the stupid here is just rank. I can't even. They know the President votes by mail, right? The President has voted by mail. He just did it a couple of months ago in the Florida primary. Voted by mail and then bragged about voting by mail. Well, because I'm the President, I get to vote by mail. No, everybody gets to vote by mail. Do you know how long voting by mail has been going on in this country? You remember we mentioned Ben Franklin just a moment ago? That long? I mean, it's crazy to me. So the irony is clearly not lost in a lot of these Republicans. They just, they just. And they wanted, they want to kill this. They want to kill the ability for people to vote by mail. They like the SAVE Act.
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Michael Schnell
Some do and some don't. And that's why we've seen it being unable to pass Just more. The most recent time, there were four Republicans who voted against this. Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski, Thom Tillis and Mitch McConnell. There are a lot of folks in the Senate who want this to be done. There are some folks, enough folks to block it, who don't. And I think that something that's sometimes lost in translation here is what President Trump is pushing is the Save America Act. So that is, yes, doing away with mail in voting for most circumstances. It's also requiring voter ID and proof of citizenship, which, by the way, Democrats have said that they have problems with that because, for examp example, a married woman, her identification may be different than her married name, which is why there are concerns with this bill going forward. Lisa Murkowski has been very clear. She's supportive of voter id. But the way that this bill is written, she says that a number of Alaskans will be disenfranchised because they're not on the road. So they may not have the proper identification. But it's not just those issues in this bill the president's pushing. He also, it would include preventing transgender women from playing in men's sports. It would also ban transgender surgeries for minors.
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Michael
Oh, has what to do with voting again.
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Michael Schnell
Right. And so that is sort of the crux here is that you have the opposition on the matters at hand. You also have the opposition with the wider bill. And again, the fact that it's very clear this doesn't have the votes. The president won't move on, but Republican senators just want him to already.
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Michael
Yeah. Well, good luck with that, my man. Scott, you were there for the bill signing. You got the flavor after the word had come in. As Michael said, you know, the chairs were set, the tables were ready. I had a comfortable seating thing, my feet up, ready for fun. This is going to be fun. Walk us through what you heard, what you saw, and really kind of following up on where Michael was in her coverage of this, the Democrats and how they look. Because, remember, this is the big, first bipartisan piece of legislation that we've seen in a while happening with this president who's not the most bipartisan player at the table, and yet he took a knife to it.
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Scott McFarlane
Let's not get it twisted. Democrats wanted that bill signing. They wanted that bill.
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Michael
Right.
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Scott McFarlane
They wanted to go home and tell their constituents they're doing something to reduce prices. Everybody wants to go home and tell their constituents they're doing something to reduce prices. There are battleground Democrats, too. I spoke to one of them today, Josh Riley, rural New York, the 19th district. He has a potentially competitive reelection. He was one of the authors of this bill. He wanted to go home and show it off. So it's not just Republicans who got burned on this. But let's not undersell the master's degree in knuckleheadlery that went through this whole process. If he is going to hold hostage, the president's going to hold hostage critical pieces of legislation his party wants, everybody wants in the name of the Save America Act. That is like trying to find a shortcut home. By driving the wrong way on the highway, you are getting farther away. If you're trying to help Republicans by messing with the Save America act, you're making life harder for Republicans. They want actual work product to show, oh, by the way, if this thing did get passed by a miracle, it wouldn't be implemented in time to affect this election.
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Michael
You know, that idea of just trying to help Republicans is not in his worldview politically. I mean, I don't think the president really has that connection. Doesn't look that way to the party as an institution that, you know, you need in order to actually control the House and the Senate. The president is quoted as saying that he didn't really, you know, telling the GOP lawmakers, I guess in this meeting he didn't really care about housing. No one cares about housing. Is that what lawmakers really think when they're, you know, they gotta take that message back. Now how does this play? How do you juxtapose the president telling them no one cares about housing so vote my kill the Voting act kind of bill?
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Scott McFarlane
I think that's the bigger problem. Canceling the ceremony is an intriguing way of spending the day. Canceling the ceremony looks silly, it looks shortsighted. But him dunking on the bill is a much more pernicious problem for his party. His own staff was saying this was a big landmark bill that was going to help make housing more affordable for Americans. Rural, exurban, suburban, big city. And he says it's not a big deal. Where are we going in an election that is clearly being driven by prices, by inflation, by costs?
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Michael
Well, you two, I don't know how you do it. That's a whirlwind of crazy up there. But you are in the middle of it. We thank you for being there and bringing us the sound reporting you're doing. Michael Schnell, Scott McFarlane again, thank you guys very much. Coming up, folks, I'm going to play some tape of Donald Trump that I think his hand picked justices on the Supreme Court really need to see and hear tonight. Kristin Clark is the former assistant Attorney general for Civil Rights. She's now the general counsel for the NAACP and she will join me next.
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Kristen Clark
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Michael
We only met a month ago, Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find pros for all your home projects@angie.com. Today the conservative majority on the Supreme Court cleared the way for the Trump administration to potentially deport more than 1 million people, most of whom just happen to be not white. For years now, Trump and his Stephen Miller friend have been trying to get rid of what is called Temporary Protective Status, or TPS for short. That's a program created by Congress decades ago to provide legal immigration status to people from countries impacted by wars and natural disasters. A program, quite frankly, folk that happens to have allowed the migration and immigration of lots of non white people into this country. For years, Trump has been pretty damn open about why he wants to get rid of tps. He said a lot of really horrible and really racist things about all of it. But today, in the conservative majority's opinion on the matter, Justice Samuel Alito had the gall to write that race wasn't a factor here because none of the statements made by the President on this issue were overtly racist. Now, in her dissent, Justice Elena Kagan called BS on that. She cited statement after statement on this issue from Donald Trump using his words and while I could read those to you, I think it's best you hear them from the horse's mouth.
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John Kirby
Take a look at what's happening in Haiti. A tremendous problem with aids. Many of those people will probably have aids, and they're coming into our country. They're eating the dogs. The people that came in, they're eating the cats. I've also announced a permanent pause on third world migration, including from hellholes like Afghanistan, Haiti, Somalia, many other countries. I didn't say shithole. You did. We had a meeting, and I say, why is it we only take people from countries?
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Michael
Right.
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John Kirby
Why can't we have some people from Norway, Sweden?
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Senator Gary Peters
Just a few.
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John Kirby
Let's have a few from Denmark. Do you mind sending us a few people? Send us some nice people. Do you mind? But we always take people from Somalia.
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Michael
Just let that sit for you just a moment there. Joining me now is Kristen Clark, general counsel for the NAACP and the former Assistant Attorney General in charge of the Justice Department Civil Rights Division. Kristen, you know, there's a lot that I have thought about this, and going back to when those original comments were being made by the president and how this was an ongoing narrative of how the president viewed people of color, not only in this country, but those who want to come here because where they are is dangerous for them. Where they are is not the opportunities that we have here. And they're seeking help. They're seeking asylum. Help us understand legal why it matters that Trump's motives here are clearly racist.
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Kristen Clark
Yeah, well, I was in the courtroom today when the Supreme Court issued this devastating decision, which has tremendous impact on the lives of hundreds of thousands of lawfully abiding Haitian nationals who pay taxes, who work, who are disproportionately represented in the healthcare industry in our country, who now fear, you know, face potential deportation. What's deeply troubling about the Supreme Court's ruling here, authored by Justice Alito, is that the court is turning a blind eye to ugly, vile, stark racial discrimination which runs contrary to the 14th amendment of our Constitution.
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Senator Gary Peters
Mm.
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Kristen Clark
We're dealing with the fallout from the Supreme Court decision in the Calais ruling that eviscerated the Voting Rights Act. But now we see the court really hollowing out the Reconstruction Amendments, hollowing out the 14th Amendment, unwilling to call it for what it is, Ugly, intentional racial discrimination that should have no place in American democracy. It runs so contrary to our values.
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Michael
I mean, that's an important note. I mean, look, we all know how this all came together from the beginning. You and I weren't written into those words, but we own those words today. We the people. Right. The Constitution applies to us, even though parts of it weren't even written for us to give us the power that we have today. What do you make of this ruling in the context of other major Supreme Court rulings, like the one from April, that limits the use of race in redistricting, for example? And I'll just pull the lens back a little bit further, put my cards here on the table. I liken Alito's opinion today to that of Justice Taney, the Dred Scott decision in which it was decided that black people, even those who were freed, were not citizens. And here we are now looking at the world and saying, again, people of colors seeking asylum. Right. Even those who have already received it are not welcome here.
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Kristen Clark
Yeah. This is a dark chapter in the American story. And today it stands another stained page in the story. I am deeply concerned about the fate of Haitian nationals and so many other folks in our country who face deportation. And now is the time to ask. Now is the time for Congress. Congress can correct this. Congress can course correct. By passing legislation now.
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Michael
And can I emphasize on that point real quick, because you're talking about 1.3 million people potentially being deported as a result of this.
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Kristen Clark
That's right. And families that have been here for years, children whose lives are disrupted. Congress can act, but it's also a time for Americans to act. We need folks to vote this election cycle. But another part of the conversation needs to be about the need for Supreme Court reform. We need to be talking about ethics reform. We need to be putting an end to the shadow docket. We need term limits. We need to figure out a way to reinvigorate our nation's highest court, whose rulings have become incredibly predictable. We've seen more six, three rulings this term than we have seen previously. And so Supreme Court reform has to be a part of the, of this conversation.
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Michael
You touched on something just down. And really, it made me just in that moment think about how this resonates with the American people, you know, because I'm thinking back to a lot of the immigration conversation and the predominant attitude that was conveyed, even though I don't think it was one that was predominantly held, was, oh, yeah, we need to get rid of all these people.
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Aaron Ford
Right.
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Michael
All these people who violated the law shouldn't be here. And then when Donald Trump started locking up grandmas and babies and everybody was, you know, everybody was like, what's he doing? What? They slept through the part where he said, that he was going to do the thing that he's there. Watching him do. This feels a little bit like that where because it's largely a community of people that folks don't have a lot of time with or have, you know, connection to, they're somewhat not connected to what something like this means. Can you put in terms from your legal work and the cases you've handled what this really means, what this could start to look like in this country? Because, you know, if it starts with folks from Somalia, yeah, it's a recipe
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Kristen Clark
for chaos and discord. And it's coming to your community, if it hasn't already. You know, this administration has shut down the refugee program with one exception. They've opened the door widely for white South.
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Michael
Oh, yeah, they get iPads now when they show up.
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Kristen Clark
Yeah. But what are we talking about a lot, you know, ICE now breaking down doors, entering homes and schools and workplaces to strip away hundreds of thousands of people who are in this country doing the right thing, paying their taxes, working in the healthcare industry and more. And it's also important that we thread the needle with other things that are happening right now. We have a Voting Rights act that has been eviscerated. They're seeking to strip us of voice. They're seeking to strip black people from this country. They're seeking to erase our stories. Now is the moment where everyone should be outraged, everyone should be focused on voting this midterm election cycle despite the obstacles that this administration is determined to put in our path. And we need to, at the end of the day, really figure out how we get our Supreme Court back on track. We need our nation's highest court to be an institution that is committed to fairness and interpreting the law and the Constitution in an even way. And it doesn't feel like that right now.
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Michael
Well, you know the 14th amendment is next, right? We know that. Kristen Clark, as always, thank you so much. Really appreciate you. Up next, folks, I'm going to talk to Democratic nominee in one of the most competitive governor's races in the country. And thanks to Donald Trump, he just got a whole lot to work with on the campaign trail. We're going to talk about it right here. We'll be back.
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Michael
you why have I asked my electrician I found on Angie.com to bury my pet hamster Nibbles in our yard for me? Because I was so moved by how carefully he buried my electrical wires, I knew I could trust him to bury my sweet Nibbles after his untimely end. Nibbles gone too soon. May he scurry in peace.
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John Kirby
Hey, sorry about your pet, but I just wire stuff.
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Michael
Nibbles would have loved you like a brother. Connecting homeowners with skilled Pros for over 30 years, Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find pros for all your home projects@angie.com. It's become very clear that the two issues that will define this campaign cycle are affordability and voter suppression. And sitting right in the middle of both of those issues is Nevada Attorney General Aaron Ford. Nevada and more than 20 other states were able to get a federal judge today to block a Trump executive order limiting mail in voting and another judge yesterday to permanently block another Trump executive order. On elections and on the campaign trail. Well, well, that's where he's running for Nevada Governor Ford has come out swinging against Trump for sinking that housing bill yesterday, saying Donald Trump is blocking bipartisan legislation that would lower the cost of housing for working families in Nevada. Trump is proving yet again that he doesn't give a damn about making life affordable for working families. Joining us now is Aaron Ford, attorney general and Democratic candidate for governor of the great state of Nevada. Welcome, sir.
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Aaron Ford
Thank you so much for having me.
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Michael
Good to have you at the table, bro. You're looking good.
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Senator Gary Peters
Good to see you.
- [35:17]
Michael
You don't look like a candidate out there. You look like you've got the right kind of steam. And look, it helps when the president is lobbying this kind of crazy that is taking away an opportunity for Republicans to make a case and make it harder for them to tell voters, this is what we're going to do. We're going to help you with affordability. We're going to help you with opportunities to access the ballot box. How are you finding the campaign trail? And what are people saying to you about affordability in your state? And are they keyed in on just how important voting will be this November?
- [36:01]
Aaron Ford
Well, absolutely. We got things to do, Michael. This Lombardo Trump economy, it is harming Nevadans. It is crushing them. I've had direct conversations with Nevadans all across our state at the University of Nevada up in Reno, at UNLV down in Vegas. Two different institutions, two different parts of the state, two different students, but sadly, similar stories. They are selling plasma to pay their rent. Okay. I've had conversations with a woman in a rural county in Douglas county telling me she was grocery shopping and had to buy a prescription, picked up her prescription, saw the price and left those groceries right there in the aisle. She couldn't afford both. And what we see now is the cruelty of Donald Trump and the cowardice of Joe Lombardo is a dangerous combination. I am running for governor to get us out of this horrible mess. And it begins on accountability day on November 3rd when I am elected governor.
- [36:57]
Michael
Well, yeah, I think that's the idea. Because in order to win an election, whether it's you or your opponent, anyone else who's running on the ballot in the state, you've got to be able to vote.
- [37:10]
Aaron Ford
Absolutely.
- [37:11]
Michael
You've got to be able to have access to the ballot box. You had the post office, the postmaster general, telling senators yesterday that the United States Postal Service will not deliver mail in ballots in states that don't turn over their voter rolls to the Trump administration. They want that data. They want to call out the voters they don't like. The federal judge's ruling today negates that possibility, at least for the time being. What do you think this says about this moment? How can you go about protecting the rights of Nevadans to vote when you have this federal effort to undermine their ability to do that?
- [37:57]
Aaron Ford
Well, Michael, I'm not new at this. I've been doing this for seven years. I've met Donald Trump in court dozens of times, probably 10 times on the election stuff. And I win every single time. I beat him because he's on the wrong side of the law. He does not have the right to sit in the White House and dictate how states are going to run their elections. That's our assault. That's our ability to do that we have gone to court. I've co led these lawsuits. Yesterday we won a lawsuit and today we won a lawsuit. Both of them relate to these unlawful executive orders. I'm gonna continue to stand up. Now. What's interesting about it is that I heard you on your other segments. Donald Trump has voted by mail. Joe Lombardo, our governor, has voted by mail. Yet they both are hypocrites in claiming that vote by mail should be limited. I'm not.
- [38:40]
Michael
How does the governor justify that?
- [38:43]
Aaron Ford
He justifies it by doing what he always does, lies down for Donald Trump. He refuses to stand up. He's kowtowing, kissing up. And he won't stand up to Donald Trump. And the Baddens know the difference between a person who's gonna fold like Joe Lombardo and a person who's gonna fight like Aaron Ford. And that's the reason that, that's the distinction between the two of us. That makes a big difference. And you know, look, we were talking about affordability. This isn't a foreign concept to me. I'm not talking about what I heard, like we say in church, I'm talking about what I know. I grew up eating stale candy bars for dinner that my dad found next to the dumpster behind the grocery store he worked at. I was a single parent in college living on Medicaid to keep my son and me healthy and food stamps to keep us fed. And so when this bill they call beautiful, I have a different description for it is going to make 100,000 Nevadans lose our health care or when they pit healthcare versus snap benefits last November during Thanksgiving. I feel that differently. And I sign up and I sue and I, I win. Even though our governor says that these are unfortunate lawsuits, at the end of the day, I'm going to stand up, protect Nevadans. And that's what this is all about.
- [39:44]
Michael
Well, stand tall, my friend.
- [39:45]
Aaron Ford
Thank you.
- [39:46]
Michael
Stand tall. Aaron Ford, thank you so much for coming and being being a part of the conversation tonight. Coming up next, folks, the Trump administration wants $80 billion of taxpayer money for its war with Iran. Did I say 80 billion? I did. I said $80 billion. I think I thought they just got a trillion. But anyway, while Iran is estimating their control of the Strait of Hormuz could mean a windfall to the tune of, oh, guess what, 40 billion a year for them. Sure. Tell me again how we won this war. Folks, we'll be right back. I can't even. It was just over a week ago when Donald Trump sat down in the palace of Versailles and without a hint of irony or any awareness of history, he signed an agreement to end his war with Iran. And today that agreement faced its first real test. Msnow has confirmed that today Iran attacked a vessel that was attempting to cross the Strait of Hormuz. As a result, a UN Shipping agency said it would pause all evacuation efforts in the strait. And speaking of the strait, the Wall Street Journal reported today that Iran is estimating it could rake in $40 billion a year off of the strait by charging fees after it reopens. The Journal also notes that if Iran implements those plans, it would give Tehran cash flow and control that it didn't command before the war. Oh, the irony of Versailles. Joining me now is former Pentagon press secretary and State Department spokesman, retired Rear Admiral John Kirby. Sir, the irony is just too much. I definitely want to get to you about what happened in the Strait of Hormuz today. And there were no reported casualties. Gratefully, Iran now claims the ship was violating the routes it had approved. What's your make of what's going on there?
- [41:58]
John Kirby
Look, from an operational perspective only, Michael, this was not that significant an event. More than 60 some odd ships transited the strait today. That's one of the best days we've had in about a week. Most of them, roughly 40, used the process that the US Navy is shepherding and providing to get ships through the strait along that southern route hugging the coast of Oman. This particular ship was not using that process and so was probably a little bit more vulnerable to the drone attacks by Iran. That said, from a political perspective, this is a significant attack. It proves three things. Number one, that Iran still has the military capability to hit these ships. In this case, they used a long range drone. Number two, that they very much see these capabilities as leverage at the negotiating table. It shouldn't be lost on anybody that they conducted this attack while these talks are still going on. And more importantly, number three, and you kind of edged to it here when you introduced me there, they're striking out for a new normal, a new, as one analyst described it to me today, a new navigational order where they will have some measure of control over traffic in the Strait of Hormuz, which they didn't have before and which should be unacceptable to the entire world.
- [43:10]
Michael
Yeah, speaking of what they didn't have before, cash, Donald Trump wants to put $300 billion on the table so that they can rebuild Iran. And now we're talking about Iran pushing to bring in $40 billion in revenue from reopening the Strai. Just yesterday, Secretary of State Marco Rubio said Iran will not be permitted to charge tolls or fees, saying that would risk total chaos. Do you think, Mr. Secretary, given Iran's leverage here, that Tehran will eventually just kind of back off and just avoid the profit take here?
- [43:47]
John Kirby
No, sir, I don't think they're going to back off. I really believe that they are committed to a new normal here, this new navigational order. And they want to have some sustainable long term control and a way to profit off traffic in the strait. It is and should be unacceptable to everybody. And so I welcome the comments by Secretary Rubio. I think he's 100% right. And whatever happens at the negotiating table, one outcome has got to be that Iran cannot have any measure of control over traffic in an international waterway. And it's not just about this strait, Michael. There's other international choke points in waterways such as the southern Red Sea and over in the Indo Pacific that other actors could learn from Iran here and put coercion and other kinds of threats to those international waterways and therefore obstructing economic traffic throughout the world. And so that's a dangerous precedent that could be set here.
- [44:40]
Michael
Before we let you go, I want to get your take though on the fighting between Israel and Hezbollah. How worried are you about that and what impact or effort could it lead to tanking what is seemingly the deal, the post Obama deal. That's Obama deal.
- [45:02]
John Kirby
I think that the fighting, I'm not surprised by the fighting. Look to Israel, this is an existential threat that they're dealing with from Hezbollah. Their cities and towns and people are still getting attacked. They have a right to defend themselves. I think the pressure needs to be put on Iran here. Iran resources, Hezbollah. Yes, there's some, some semi autonomy for Hezbollah, but they answer to Tehran, they answer to the irgc. Iran needs to be more active in restricting those activities by Hezbollah. If they, if they really want, as they say they do, for the fight against Hezbollah to be a part of this deal, then they in Tehran need to put the pressure on Hezbollah's leaders to stop these attacks.
- [45:42]
Michael
All right, John Kirby, as always, thank you friend. Appreciate you. Folks, we'll be right back. Well, that does it for me tonight.
- [45:53]
Narrator/Announcer
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- [46:08]
Michael
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