← The Briefing with Jen Psaki
The Briefing with Jen Psaki
Trump spirals as shutdown calls for leadership skills he lacks, a problem endemic to his team
00:40:52
Jen Psaki points out Attorney General Pam Bondi's strenuous efforts to avoid having to answer for anything happening within the department she leads, which is a problem throughout the Trump administration and is particularly acute in Trump himself, who not only famously refuses to take responsibility for anything but seems to have no real idea what is going on with the things he's supposed to be in charge of.
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- [00:00]
A
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- [00:58]
B
Lots to cover. There is no question that that Attorney General Pam Bondi was given some very specific marching orders when she testified on Capitol Hill today. I mean, orders like don't answer many questions or any questions, pass the buck to the FBI, which I would note she oversees, that's under the Department of Justice. And when all else fails, launch personal attacks against the senator questioning you, that seemed to be the strategy. But whatever strategery was given to her by the Trump team, and they gave her some, didn't seem to really land well. I mean, here was one exchange between Attorney General Bondi and Democratic Senator Sheldon Whitehouse about Trump's relationship with child sex predator Jeffrey Epstein.
- [01:43]
A
There's been public reporting that Jeffrey Epstein showed people photos of President Trump with half naked young women. Do you know if the FBI found those photographs in their search of Jeffrey Epstein, safe or premises or otherwise? Have you seen any such thing?
- [02:05]
B
You know, Senator Whitehouse, you sit here and make salacious remarks, once again trying to slander President Trump left and right when you're the one who was taking money from one of Epstein's closest confidants. I believe I could be wrong. Correct me.
- [02:21]
A
The question is, did the FBI find those photographs that have been discussed publicly by a witness who claimed Jeffrey Epstein showed them to him? You don't know anything about that? Okay.
- [02:41]
B
I mean, it was a very specific question, one she should know the answer to. So first she avoided answering a very specific question. Then she tried to redirect by attacking Senator Whitehouse. And did you notice that, that she kept consulting during that exchange? Apparently they weren't just meant to help her answer the questions, which they clearly did not do. Eagle eyed photojournalists spotted that some of those notes were full of pre scripted attacks on people like Senator Whitehouse. And then once she seemed to run out of attacks, she just sat there staring blankly, saying nothing. And that wasn't the only way she evaded questions. I mean, this was many hours of a hearing today on multiple occasions. We also saw her pass the buck to the FBI many times. Just look what happened when multiple senators asked Pam Bundy about reports that the Department of Justice spiked an investigation into Trump's border czar, Tom Homan, after. And we all remember this insane story. He allegedly accepted a $50,000 cash bribe in a paper bag from undercover agents.
- [03:46]
A
Is there a tape that has audio and video of the transfer of the 50,000?
- [03:52]
B
You would have to talk to Director Patel about that. No, I'm talking to you.
- [03:57]
A
Will you support a request by this committee to provide that taper tapes to the committee? Yes or no?
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B
Senator Schiff, you can talk to Director Patel about that.
- [04:07]
A
What became of the $50,000? Did the FBI get it back?
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B
Mr. Whitehouse. Excuse me, Senator Whitehouse, you're welcome to talk to the FBI.
- [04:17]
A
The report to you. Can't you answer this question?
- [04:21]
B
They report to you. That's a statement of fact. The FBI is part of the Department of Justice. I'm going to keep stating this, but Pam Bondi would like everyone to please forget that she's actually the one in charge of all of this. And that's really sort of a theme today that struck me. I mean, consider Bondi's answer to this question about the Trump administration's decision to deploy the National Guard to American cities.
- [04:43]
A
They are going to transfer Texas National Guard units to the state of Illinois. What's the rationale for that?
- [04:50]
B
Yeah, Chairman, as you shut down the government, you voted to shut down the government and you're sitting here. Our law enforcement officers aren't being paid. They're out there working to protect you. I wish you loved Chicago as much as you hate President Trump. I mean, what she was asked about this administration's highly controversial decision to deploy American troops in American streets. Something that was only recently ruled illegal by the law in another American city. You would think the nation's top lawyer would have a view even if she legally defended it. Who knows? Nope, that's not what she had. Just avoid the question and blame. It's a Strategy that might work if you actually have no power, if you're the party out of power, trying to hold to account those governing. But here's the thing. Democrats are not in charge of the federal government at all. Republicans are. They are in charge of all of it. The White House, the Senate, the House, the Justice Department, to say Nothing of the 63 Conservative majority on the Supreme Court. They are in charge of everything. And yet they have still built their entire governing and public communication philosophy, it seems, around playing the victim in almost every situation, like they are observers of the problems happening in the world, including the ones they created. I mean, perhaps the same strategic geniuses who prepped Pam Bondi for that hearing have been in charge of the White House strategy around the government shutdown. Maybe that could explain it, because Republicans have spent a week pointing fingers at Democrats, even though the majority of the public isn't buying it. It's not working. I mean, in poll after poll, Americans blame Trump and Republicans in Congress by wide margins. Poll after poll, which makes sense because again, they are in charge of basically everything and they aren't helping themselves when their answers make absolutely no sense. I mean, for example, right now, airports from Burbank, California to Nashville, Tennessee are literally going dark thanks to a shortage of air traffic controllers, which has prompted delays around the country. Trump was asked about those delays earlier today, and this is what he had to say. Are you concerned about the delays at.
- [07:02]
A
Airports and how do you see the shutdown? Oh, sure. I mean, it's. They're all Democrat delays.
- [07:07]
B
There are delays at the airport that.
- [07:09]
A
Stand.
- [07:12]
B
Delays at the airport. Those are Democrat delays. I guess he was trying to blame things, but also those delays are standard and fine. Nothing to see here. I mean, I don't know what to make of that. It's like he's torn between trying to blame Democrats for the shutdown, trying to pretend that everything happening under his leadership is hunky dory. Delays are normal. I don't know. He has no idea clearly, though, how to deal with the fact that he is the one in charge of everything. And so his behavior has been all over the map. I mean, yesterday Trump claimed he was finally negotiating with Democrats over the shutdown and suggested he was even willing to work with them on their key demand to restore the ACA health care subsidies that would keep premiums from skyrocketing.
- [07:54]
A
We are speaking with the Democrats and some very good things could happen with respect to health care.
- [08:00]
B
Would you make a deal with them on the ACA subsidies if we, if.
- [08:03]
A
We made the Right. Deal. I'd make a deal.
- [08:06]
B
I mean, sounds good, right? Everybody wants this shutdown to close. People want the ACA subsidies. The overwhelming majority of the country wants them to be extended. Sounds good, right? Except that came as news to senators of both parties because it was entirely untrue. And after he was called out on that lie, he abruptly reversed course, saying Republicans would not negotiate an end to the shutdown that would extend the ACA premium credits. Look, we've talked about this a lot before. Trump is not a policy guy or a details guy. Apparently, he's not a negotiations guy either. It remains unclear one week in if he even knows what this is about and how to bring it to an end. And that's pretty pivotal for the President of the United States to be involved and understand and know how to end this. Which is probably why his administration has effectively handed over control of their shutdown strategy to Trump's budget director and architect of Project 2025, Russ Vogt. I mean, today we learned that Voats office is now circulating a memo arguing that the administration does not have to pay federal employees back pay for the work they do during this shutdown. Now, I should note here that it is technically illegal to deny those workers the back pay they are owed. It is a direct violation of the Government Employee Fair Treatment act, which was signed into law by none other than Donald Trump during his first administration. In fact, guidance put out by the White House prior to today said that all furloughed workers should get automatic back pay. But when Axios asked the White House for comment about their plan to deny workers that pay, a senior White House official replied, quote, omb is in charge, referring to the office run by Russ Vote. I mean, again, what? You are the White House. If I ever told a reporter that OMB was the final call when I worked in the White House about something like this, I would have been escorted out of the building. But today, Donald Trump was given a chance to clear all of this up when he was asked directly whether his administration plans to deny furloughed workers their back pay. He could have cleared it up, but instead, Trump just made everything even more confusing by suggesting he would withhold back pay only from some federal workers, specifically the ones he doesn't think deserve it. Is it the White House's position that furloughed workers should be paid for their back pay?
- [10:22]
A
I would say it depends on who we're talking about. We're going to take care of our people. There are some people that really don't deserve to be taken care of, and we'll take care of them in a different way.
- [10:33]
B
So not the law. The law says you have to pay federal workers their back pay. Again. A law he signed during his first term, Russ wrote, says no federal workers are entitled to their back pay. And Trump says he wants to use back pay as some kind of tool for retribution, I suppose. Okay, that's all bad. Maybe the Republican leader in the Senate can tell us what is actually happening. Please.
- [10:58]
A
I haven't looked at the memo specifically yet. My assumption is that furloughed workers will get back pay.
- [11:03]
B
There is a law that federal workers who are furloughed get back pay. What is the president talking about then, when he's suggesting that some groups may not get paid? Is that even allowed?
- [11:15]
A
I don't know the answer to your question. I haven't seen their legal analysis.
- [11:20]
B
I mean, what. These people are in charge of everything. That is the Senate majority leader, that was the President of the United States. They're about as clear as mud. The leaders of the Republican Party who are in charge of everything are acting like they are mere spectators to all of this, like they are not the ones in charge of running the government and negotiating a way to fund it. It's not even clear that the president really knows what is happening from moment to moment. And Democrats like Senator Mark Kelly have not been shy about pointing out Trump's apparent inability to grasp what exactly Democrats are fighting for here.
- [11:52]
A
It didn't even seem the feedback we got. It didn't even seem that he understood what these premium tax credits were. So the first step here is the president has to understand what's going on.
- [12:02]
B
Yeah, the first step here is definitely for the president to understand what's going on. Who can deny that is a complete statement of fact? It does not matter what political party you are from. It's no secret that Donald Trump spends the bulk of his free time watching Fox News. We all know that. So it's no surprise that Trump saw those comments by Senator Kelly and immediately started rage posting about it on his social media account, saying, quote, why is Fox News and Peter Doocy putting on Democrat Senator Mark Kelly to talk about totally unabated or challenged health care? Republicans are so tired of this fight with Fox. Always trying to be so politically correct. Thank you for your attention to this matter. I love that last part, always. I mean, look, Donald Trump is the most powerful man in the world right now, or one of them. He's supposed to be the one leading his party out of this shutdown fight as any president would be. But instead, he's acting like he isn't in charge of anything, sitting back and playing armchair critic on social media, complaining about Fox News coverage. And meanwhile, Democrats are making it crystal clear to anyone paying attention, including the people watching Fox News, that the president does not have any idea what is going on here. Exactly. The person who got under the President's skin with those comments, Senator Mark Kelly joins me here in just 90 seconds.
- [13:19]
A
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- [14:20]
B
Angie Hicks, co founder of Angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair, done well. Kitchen sink install, done well. Deck upgrades done well. Electrical upgrade done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. So we know the difference between done and done well. Hire high quality pros@angie.com joining me now is Senator Mark Kelly, as promised Democrat from Arizona. Senator Kelly, it's good to see you. I mean, you clearly got under Trump's skin there. What you stated is fact though, for any administration. The President of the United States needs to understand what is going on. They always play, I can say this as a staffer many times, a pivotal role in negotiations like ending shutdowns. Now since you did that interview on Sunday, Trump has also said that Democrats and Republicans were negotiating, which doesn't seem to be a statement of fact in a thorough way. He also said about air traffic controllers that it was Democrat caused and seemed to make it Seem normal. Do you have any sense? He has, he doesn't seem to have briefed at this point or briefed himself up. Do you think he has any greater sense of what's going on than he did two days ago?
- [15:47]
A
I think I may have motivated him a little bit. And my sense is he does understand this a little bit better. You know, understands that these premium tax credits are critical to, you know, people's financial well being, that they could be, you know, bankruptcy or they lose their health insurance and, you know, they get sick. And I think he's starting to see that. And my sense is he's also starting to understand that this is a big issue. And that's important because ultimately he's going to have to negotiate this.
- [16:18]
B
No question. He has to be centrally involved. He doesn't even have to. I hope he's there on the policy, but he can just be there on the politics. This is overwhelmingly supported by the majority of the public, including people who identify as MAGA and Republicans.
- [16:33]
A
Rural areas all across our country mostly voted for Donald Trump. And this issue of these tax credits, people possibly losing their health care. It happens more in rural areas because there's no big employers. People don't get health insurance, you know, from their company or maybe from the government, and they rely on the Affordable Care act exchange. And I've, I've talked to people all across my state. I talked to three more today. I talked to some last week. This woman, Robin, you know, Northern Arizona, I talked about her on Fox. Now she could see her premium go from $250 a month to over $1,000 a month. And she said, hey, I'm not looking for a handout. I'm just looking for a hand up.
- [17:13]
B
That's a powerful message. I'm sure many people like you are hearing from their constituents. Let me ask you just how this ends. I know we're not near there at this point in time, but the extension of these subsidies is very popular. It's also the right thing to do for people like Robyn. Do you think that this is Trump realizing the politics of this, Republicans being given direction? Help us understand the machinations of what have to happen behind the scenes here for this to end.
- [17:40]
A
Well, I think the thing we need to just start a negotiation is Mike Johnson, the Speaker of the House, has to get Republicans back here to Washington, D.C. now, I could talk to some of my Republican colleagues in the Senate, but the House is also a critical piece. He doesn't want to deal with this. He also doesn't want to deal with Epstein issues. He doesn't want to swear in Adelita Grijalva, who won a special election that's been certified. She's here. She's in Washington ready to be sworn in. So essentially, the speaker of the House doesn't want to do his job right now. So that has to happen first. And I think it's important for the president to see, you know, what the impact is on real people. I mean, this is going to hurt millions of people who are going to be they're going to wind up being, you know, one illness or one accident away from bankruptcy. I was talking to another woman, I think her name was Vivian today, who said she just wants to be able to stay healthy. That's all she wants out of this. And she realizes that if her Premium goes from $250 a month and if it doubles, which is what the expectation is for her, it's unaffordable. And these folks are often small business owners or they have multiple jobs and they don't get health insurance for their jobs. But they're hardworking people. They're not on Medicaid. They have to buy insurance on the exchange. And it's been affordable for many of them. And with this one bill that they passed months ago, the big beautiful bill as Donald Trump calls, raised these premiums dramatically starting at the beginning of next year. And I think it's important for the American people to know that this was all about just giving this big tax cut to the richest Americans. This was a choice they made. Do they want to support the wealthiest people or do they want to look out for hardworking Americans that are just trying to get by?
- [19:34]
B
Let me ask you about the back pay for furloughed workers, because this is the law to pay back furloughed workers. But Russ, vote today, even Donald Trump, who maybe he's not tracking this particular piece in his briefings, who knows, seemed to suggest that that wasn't guaranteed. Do you think that is they really don't feel that furloughed workers should be paid, that they don't believe that. Do you think it's an attempt at a negotiating tactic? What is going on here?
- [20:00]
A
I think it's the former. I think they don't care about working.
- [20:03]
B
Class people, not military, not anyone.
- [20:06]
A
I don't think they're really looking out for people. I think they look out for people in Donald Trump's orbit. I hope he realizes that he is the one that signed the law that requires that they get back pay. So if he doesn't Give them back pay the furloughed workers. Not only is he breaking the law, he's breaking the law that he signed as president in his first term.
- [20:29]
B
Well, before I let you go, we have one minute left. But do you think Speaker Mike Johnson, the House is pivotal here. Is he going to act unless Trump tells him he should act?
- [20:38]
A
Yeah, I think so. I think it's, I think even without.
- [20:41]
B
Trump telling him, or does he need Trump to tell him to act?
- [20:43]
A
I would hope that the president would tell him to get his people back in Washington, D.C. many of the Democrats in the House are here. They're ready to negotiate. It's the Republicans, Republicans from my state. They're back in Arizona. I'm here willing to talk to anybody about this. I'm talking to some of my Senate Republican colleagues and Democrats or we're trying to work through this. But we're never going to be able to conclude this until Mike Johnson gets his people back here. So it really comes down to him and doing his job. And I know the president could put some pressure on him and he should.
- [21:16]
B
It feels like he may need to call him in order for him to do anything. That's my suspicion. I'll say. You don't have to. Senator Mark Kelly, thank you so much for being here. Clearly got under Trump's skin. Maybe you should go on TV and talk about the furloughed workers and get Trump's attention. That should be the next thing. That's right. All right. Coming up, Donald Trump has asked about a pardon for convicted sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell. And Donald Trump says he will take a look at it, which is quite a thing to say. That's the same person the late Virginia Giuffre called a monster who did things even worse than Jeffrey Epstein did. Virginia Giuffre's brother and sister in law have been advocating for justice in her memory and they. Join me when we come back. Need to restock inventory, cover seasonal dips or manage payroll. Ondeck's small business line of credit provides immediate access to funds up to $200,000 exactly when your business needs it. With flexible draws, transparent pricing and full control over repayment, you can tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. Apply today@ondeck.com and funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by Ondeck or Celtic Bank. Ondeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of Angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well, from roof repair to emergency plumbing, and more done well. So the next time you have a home project, leave it to the pros.
- [22:40]
A
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- [23:18]
B
Even after the Supreme Court rejected Ghislaine Maxwell's appeal of her prison term, President Donald Trump supported still won't rule out a pardon for her. And here's how the late Virginia Giuffre once described the person that Donald Trump won't rule out a pardon for. She is a monster. She's worse than Epstein. She did things even worse than Epstein did. I know that woman. I've known her really well. Put it this way. Epstein was Pinocchio and she was Gesto. She was the guy controlling the strings. Jeffrey Yep, she was pulling the strings. A monster. That's how she described her. Worse than Epstein, pulling the strings. And all of that should be chilling. Well, yesterday, Donald Trump was asked about a potential pardon for that monster. And I just want you to hold Virginia Giuffre's words in your mind as you listen to how he responded.
- [24:13]
A
Well, I'll take a look at it.
- [24:14]
B
I'll say you're considerate. I will speak to the doj.
- [24:17]
A
I wouldn't consider it or not consider it. I don't know anything about it. Why would she be a candidate? I will speak to the.
- [24:22]
B
Why would she be a candidate for clemency, sir?
- [24:24]
A
I don't know.
- [24:25]
B
I mean, I'd have to speak to the doj.
- [24:26]
A
I'll look at it. I have a lot of people have asked me for pardons. I call him Puff Daddy has asked me for a pardon.
- [24:34]
B
But she was convicted of child sex trafficking.
- [24:37]
A
Yeah, I mean, I'm going to have to take a look at it. I have to ask doj.
- [24:42]
B
And joining me now are sky and Amanda Roberts. They are the brother and sister in law of Epstein survivor Virginia Roberts Giuffre. She died by suicide earlier this year. But they're advocating for justice incredibly tirelessly in her memory. And they've inspired so many people, as did their sister. It's great to see you both, and I always wish we were speaking under different circumstances, but you continue to inspire me so much, and I wanted to talk to you because there's so much disinformation that is always being pushed out there on this story, as you know, and it's so important to tell the real story and, you know, the real story. So let me start with you, sky, and by all means, I want to hear from both of you. Sky, when we spoke a month ago here, you were here in Washington, both of you. Ghislaine Maxwell had been moved to a much less restrictive prison with no real explanation. We all remember that. Now here we are, and President Trump is openly musing about taking a look at a pardon, saying he will talk to DOJ about it. We obviously don't know what will happen, but there has been several musings over the last couple of days. It unfortunately feels to me a little predictable that we're here. But you both have been through so much. What goes through your head when you hear that?
- [25:56]
A
I mean, I think it is, it's, it's hurtful for a lot of survivors out there. It's hurtful for me as a family member to even hear the, the, the potential for a pardon that he's considering it, or possibly not considering it, as he said. So he didn't waiver one way or the other. However, I mean, why is this even a conversation? She's a convicted. She was convicted of basically running a sex trafficking ring. And so at this time, like, what, what, what does this teach our children? What does this teach the people around us? I can't even look my daughter in the face and, and give her a square answer about what our government stands for. And, and that's disgraceful. It really is disgraceful, and it's very hurtful. I know my sister would be very hurt by it, because we did believe, based off of the campaign that he ran, that he would do the right thing. And right now, he seems to have amnesia, as does most of the campaign administrators or people that he appointed. They seem to have amnesia that they ran their campaign on this.
- [27:00]
B
Amanda, one of the things that is so incredible about both of you is that as hard as this must be every day to hear this, you just keep on fighting. You just keep on pushing this message out there about what's possible. And this question was, of course, asked because the Supreme Court yesterday declined to take up Maxwell's appeal. Of her conviction. That's why this topic even came up in a briefing. And along with other members of Virginia's family, you put out a statement saying, in part, we remain hopeful that the DOJ will realize that she belongs in a maximum. You're talking about Ghislaine Maxwell there, of course, in a maximum security prison, not the country club one she is currently in. This is a tough story for everybody. For you, even more so. What keeps hope alive for you that that is possible? Virginia, she was able to do something along with her survivor sisters that was unprecedented. They came up against the rich and powerful. She exposed them. And in spite of the backlash, the threats, the lawsuits that came, she stood firm in her truth. And she keeps us going because we know that she would still be fighting. We know that she wouldn't relent. We keep going for all of the survivors out there, the ones that we talk to on a daily basis who find so much strength in Virginia, and we just hope to kind of fill that void for them, for our children, for her children, and that keeps hope. We hope that the next generation sees and they stand up and they act, too. I know you hear from so many people who are survivors who are inspired by Virginia, and I hear that from members of Congress who are inspired by Virginia and they're inspired by the number of people who have come forward. And I hope you hold that very much in your hearts. Let me ask you. There has been a fairly aggressive push, I would call it that you may feel differently from some members of Congress over the last few months to build support for a discharge petition, which representativeI mean they've made a great. They have the votes, essentially. And Representative elect Adelita Grijalva would be the 218th vote for it. She won her race two weeks ago, and yet House Speaker Mike Johnson refuses to. To swear her in. It's essentially. I'm just going to call it out is like holding back, moving forward with this discharge petition that you and so many others have pushed for. Sky, let me start with you. I mean, if he were watching right now or others who are holding this back, what would you want him to understand about how hard this is waiting for all of you who have pushed for this so hard, who have helped build support for this discharge petition?
- [29:49]
A
It's a really good question. I would say that I think he's forgetting that these are human lives. These are actual victims and survivors, including my sister and the families such as myself and Amanda and our family that is still suffering a great loss. And I think he forgets there's a human side to this, that this isn't just a political ring for you to run through, that you're holding against the votes because you just have to defend a person or your friends or whoever it is that's around you that you want to defend at this point in time. These are human lives and this hurts. This hurts every time you come out and you just say, oh, well, only a dozen survivors came to Washington to actually come forward. How many is it going to take? Thousands of victims were were brutally victimized by these politicians and bankers and rich and powerful people. Like my sister being one of them. Like, what is it going to take for you to actually do something? Can it take for us to like a riot for America to stand up and just write about it? I just don't understand what. I don't think he really sees the human side. He just sees the politics and what's in it for him. And he's got to start humanizing this a little bit more because that hurts. It hurts me and it hurts my sister, survivor sisters. And I know it would hurt my sister in this moment.
- [31:14]
B
Well, the human side is exactly why you two are so incredibly powerful. Let me ask you, because there's been some confusion about this, because I thinknot confusion. But I want to make sure people understand what's important to both of you and survivors. At the time. When we spoke a while ago around that powerful press conference, there was this kind of announcement about maybe putting together a client list. And that was something that should never be on the backs of survivors or their family members. It's something that should be on the backs of others, elected officials. Is that something that is important to you and other survivors? Do you want there to be progress on that? If people are calling their members of congress, is that something you want to them to ask for or is it less of a priority? How should people understand that? I think there is a twofold answer to this. I think we survivors are being put in a position that they shouldn't have to be put in because our government is failing them. Again, I think survivors are in a corner where they are so frustrated and so tired that they are willing to break the doors down for justice. But they need protection, they need security, they need safety because we're prepared to go alongside them. If we were protected by Congress, if we were to sit in front of congress and they were going to generally not just hear us, but now advocate for accountability, I think that is something that the survivors would be willing to do. But there is an opportunity to do something right now with this petition getting it to the floor for a vote. And we are looking at every single representative right now to do the right thing because they are, are our voice. They serve us. They don't serve a president. They don't serve an administration. And it is their job to do this. Sky and Amanda Roberts, you're both incredible. How fortunate to have siblings and siblings like you and advocates like you for a community like the survivors of Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell. Thank you both for what you do and for being here with me. Thank you, Jen. Coming up, as the Trump administration sends the National Guard to Chicago and raises the specter of invoking the Insurrection act, this is what is happening in the streets. A mom who is out to buy groceries gets rounded up by masked federal agents. MSNBC's Jacob Sobroff joins us on what's actually happening in Chicago and increasingly more of Trump's America. We'll be right back. Today, amid legal fights over the Trump administration's threat to deploy National Guard troops into Chicago and into Portland, Oregon, DHS Secretary Kristi Noem flew out to Portland to an ICE detention facility that has drawn a lot of protests. A right wing media figure embedded with Noem posted this video of her standing on the roof of the facility with the caption breaking DHS Secretary Kristi Noem stares down Army Vantifa and a guy in a chicken suit. I mean, I'm not sure if it would call a handful, if I would call a handful of people peacefully protesting an army. You saw the people visually on there. And Nome stares down army of antifa kind of loses its bite a little bit when it is immediately followed by a reference to a guy in a chicken suit, which was a part of it. But regardless of the chicken suit, the Trump administration's goal here obviously isn't to calm things down. I mean, right now they are feeding off stories out of Chicago where the administration is performing their ICE operation Midway Blitz, where armed federal agents in military fatigues have busted down doors overnight to men, women and children from their apartments to pull them from their apartments, alongside images of peaceful protesters outside detention, senators being shot with pepper balls and thrown to the ground. It's sick. I mean, look at what's happening on the screen. It's all though about performance. That's part of the sick part of this. I mean, yesterday a coalition of Chicago journalists and protesters filed a lawsuit against the Trump administration over what they described as extreme brutality. They write in their filing that, quote, federal officers Acting on instructions and encouragement from high government officials, have systematically worked to intimidate and terrorize non threatening protesters. Those stories, though, are what the Trump administration wants. All that, plus Noem's goofy rooftop theatrics are part of a larger trend of how the Trump administration and its allies want to label opposition. I mean, in the past week, Trump and his close aide, Stephen Miller, the architect of the administration's cruel immigration crackdown, have also been trying to normalize something else. The word insurrection.
- [36:14]
A
If you take a look at what's been going on in Portland, it's been going on for a long time. And that's insurrection. I mean, that's pure insurrection. I think that's all insurrection. It is domestic terrorism. It is insurrection. It's armed insurrectionists, legal insurrection. This is an all out campaign of insurrection.
- [36:33]
B
I mean, there's a reason they keep saying insurrection and not because it's an accurate description over anything happening. And it is not particularly subtle, their use of the term insurrection over and over again. Trump is threatening to invoke the Insurrection act, which would allow him to deploy more federal troops into more American cities. Today we learned that National Guard troops, including National Guard troops from Texas, are assembled outside Chicago and expected to deploy tomorrow, even as we await a ruling from a federal judge about whether the deployment is even legal. The goal here isn't to create calm, it's to create a pretext. A pretext that allows Trump to expand his power and his crackdown on both immigration and dissent. And up next, we're going to get a view of the reality of the immigration crackdown in Chicago. MSNBC's Jacob Soboroff is there, and what he is witnessing is far from what the Trump administration wants us to see. That is next. Donald Trump is attempting to sell a lie that Chicago is overwhelmed with violence and terror in order to justify deployment deploying US Troops onto the streets of that city. But the reality is there is not a big violent mayhem in Chicago, but there are violent. There are residents getting disappeared off the street by ice. MSNBC correspondent Joko Sobrov is on the ground in Chicago and today witnessed the aftermath of a woman getting snatched by masked Customs and Border Patrol officers and put into an unmarked vehicle. And this video you're about to see was taken by a neighborhood who was also on the scene when this happened. What's your.
- [38:18]
A
Yes, I am. What's your best citizen? I am. Are you okay? I'm gonna need you to stay away from here. Okay? All right.
- [38:24]
B
Senora, como se llama?
- [38:25]
A
Hey. Hey. Senora. Como se llama?
- [38:29]
B
Como se llama, familia?
- [38:33]
A
Don't touch me.
- [38:33]
B
You're not allowed to touch me. Look at. Guys, look at this fascist right here. Joining me now from the Broadview Detention center outside of Chicago is MSNBC senior national correspondent Jacob Soboroff. Jacob, you have a follow up update, as I understand it, from the arrest video we just played. Tell us more about that, Jen.
- [39:23]
A
Since I was on that street and after that apprehension, we have learned that that woman's name is Maricela rosales. She is 53 years old. She has been in the United States since arriving here from Mexico 30 years ago. She has a family and tonight she's here inside the Broadview Detention Center. And we know that because as we were reporting earlier today on the street in Cicero, Illinois, a young woman came up to me and said, I'm looking for my mother. I haven't seen her, and I fear she might have been detained by ice. Her name is Samantha. And I pulled out my phone to show her some of the video that we had. And I want to show you a little bit of what happened next. Watch this. Don't touch me.
- [40:07]
B
You're not allowed to touch me.
- [40:11]
A
We can stop if you want.
- [40:13]
B
Look at guys, look at the splashes right here. That's her. It's her.
- [40:22]
A
I'm so sorry to be the one to show you this picture of your mother. What's it like for you to see her there with her ponytail and her backpack and her pink sweatpants talking to these guys with guns and masks and their bulletproof vests?
- [40:38]
B
I mean, based off her facial expression, she looks ready to cry. And that saddens me because she just wanted to go to the store. She was gonna make some Albon Digas, which is basically a meatball stew. She just wanted to go make a meatball supermarket.
- [40:59]
A
Yeah, a meatball stew. A meatball stew, Jen.
- [41:03]
B
It's so powerful to see this, Jacob. And you're so tireless on the ground. I know you also have video of CBP officers appear to be harassing someone who was filming them on the street shortly before Maricela was arrested. The Chicago Tribune reported that federal agents have pointed weapons at people recording. We've only seen what we see on video. But when you talk to residents of these Chicago neighborhoods, how do they feel? I mean, are they terrified? I mean, I would be.
- [41:32]
A
Don't take it from me, Jen. Let's watch the video. This is what happened in the moments before. Before Maricela was actually apprehended by the Border Patrol. And this was a video taken by another community member. Check this out. Do you guys have any identification on you? Yeah, you see it? It's on our vest. Do you guys have a badge number or a name? I don't need. Why don't I need any of that? You have ID on you? Do you guys need my id? What's the reason for stopping me? What's the reason for following us? Hawking your horn. You guys are going through a neighborhood and you guys are stopping people on the street with no reason.
- [42:04]
B
I suggest you stop following us, all right?
- [42:06]
A
Otherwise we're going to arrest you for impeding your audit. I'm not impeding anything. We're letting you know this is the first warning and last warning.
- [42:12]
B
Okay? You got that?
- [42:13]
A
What are your guys names? This right here, this is what's happening in the streets of of Chicago, all around Cook county and in the Chicagoland area. And the folks that they're going after are not the worst of the worst. And I cannot say that more unequivocally and clearly enough. Maricela was going, as we talked about, to buy meat to make a stew. October 31st, Halloween would be her 54th birthday. Samantha, her daughter, told us she wanted to buy her perfume for that birthday. And she was saving up until she was paid with this paycheck from her job in order to go and do that. Now what Samantha is doing is trying to find her mom in inside this facility after those very agents picked her up off the street today.
- [42:58]
B
Jen, there's been reporting today, of course, that there's more coming tomorrow. We'll see what happens. I'm sure you'll be reporting for us. I remember in LA when you were reporting from the ground, people sort of were staying in their homes. They weren't going to work. People were afraid of going to school or going out into the community at all. Are you seeing the same thing happen in these communities in Chicago?
- [43:19]
A
Oh yeah, there's an absolute chilling effect. I was just actually checking my Instagram direct messages and someone messaged, hey, I was taking a run earlier today while you were interviewing those people, and I ran right by you. I also saw down the street ICE agents in a particular vehicle engaged in another operation. And the message is basically that, that people are terrified. Their daily activities are being interrupted by armed and masked federal agents on the street. You don't have to wait for the National Guard here to see militarized federal policing on the streets of Chicago. It is already happening in a city that is largely peaceful. Nobody's saying that there aren't violent parts of the city and that violent crime doesn't happen just like they do in red and blue cities and states all across the country. But what local leadership is saying here is give us the resources and we will handle those problems with grants to do community based policing. We don't need troops on our streets and we don't even need to wait for the National Guard because those troops are already here. That's why Governor Pritzker said in that press conference yesterday, as you highlighted before the break, that that he believes this is a pretext for invoking the Insurrection act and having troops all across the country.
- [44:20]
B
Jen Jacob Soboroff, so important to see what's going on on the ground. Thank you so much for joining us from Chicago.
- [44:27]
A
Thanks.
- [44:28]
B
That does it for me today. You can catch the show Tuesday through Friday at 9pm Eastern on MSNBC. And don't forget to follow the show on Blue sky, Instagram and TikTok. Did you know 39% of teen drivers admit to texting while driving. Even scarier, those who text are more likely to speed and run red lights. Shockingly, 94% know it's dangerous, but do it anyway. As a parent, you can't always be in the car, but you can stay connected to their safety with Greenlight Infinity's driving reports. Monitor their driving habits, see if they're using their phone, speeding and more. These reports provide real data for meaningful conversations about safety. Plus, with weekly updates, you can track their progress over time, help keep your teens safe. Sign up for Greenlight infinity@Greenlight.com podcast.