'Trump was warned': Reports contradict Trump's claims of surprise by challenges in Iran

Summary

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Podcast Summary: "Trump was warned": Reports Contradict Trump's Claims of Surprise by Challenges in Iran

The Briefing with Jen Psaki (MS NOW)
Date: March 28, 2026
Guests: John Brennan (former CIA Director), John Kirby (retired Rear Admiral, former Pentagon/White House spokesperson), Jane Fonda (activist/actor)

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Overview

This episode unpacks the Trump administration’s handling of its war with Iran—specifically, the extent to which President Trump was cautioned about predictable Iranian responses including cyberattacks, munitions shortages, allied reluctance, and strategic risks. Jen Psaki leads in-depth discussions with national security experts John Brennan and John Kirby, spotlighting internal White House disarray, concern over detached war messaging, and public pushback in the form of the burgeoning “No Kings” protest movement, highlighted by an interview with Jane Fonda.

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Major Themes & Key Points

1. Cyber Threats and the Kash Patel Hack

• [00:58] News breaks about a hack targeting FBI Director Kash Patel, with Iranian-affiliated groups leaking “historical” (pre-directorship) personal emails and photos.
• The segment contextualizes the hack within longstanding Iranian cyber capabilities, noting U.S. agencies, including DHS, CISA, NSA, DoD, and FBI all warned Trump a year ago that Iran would retaliate against U.S. aggression with cyberattacks.
• Irony highlighted: Trump recently cut over 1,000 jobs at CISA—the chief federal cyber agency—only to now scramble to rehire 300 amid surging attacks.
  • “Guess what the Trump administration started doing this week after they cut 1,000 CISA jobs…they announced plans to hire 300 more people at CISA.” (Host, [02:18])

2. The Predictability of Iran's Responses and U.S. Unpreparedness

• [02:57] Iran’s closure of the Strait of Hormuz, critical supply chain disruptions, missile shortfalls, and lack of allied support—all warned about by Joint Chiefs Chairman Gen. Dan Kaine—are now reality.
  • “Who could have predicted that Iran would shut down the Strait of Hormuz? The answer is anybody with knowledge of the region and any military expertise.” (Host, [06:36])
• Trump's dismissal of these warnings (denouncing them as “fake news”) is contrasted with mounting evidence, including munitions depletion (850+ Tomahawk missiles used in weeks) and rising U.S. and civilian casualties.
  • “Recent versions of Tomahawk missiles cost as much as $3.6 million apiece…we have already used more than 850 in four weeks.” (Host, [05:25])

3. White House Dysfunction and Fear-Driven Conformity

• [07:58] Reports surface of internal White House disagreements, with many staffers afraid to voice dissent lest they face repercussions.
  • “So many people are afraid of being on the outset. They are just drinking the Kool-Aid and going along with it.” (Anonymous official, quoted by Host, [08:24])
• Trump is described as “getting bored with Iran,” despite ongoing U.S. deaths and injuries—signaling a dangerous indifference.
  • “He’s just bored and wants to move on.” (Senior official, quoted by Host, [08:50])

4. Expert Analysis: Brennan and Kirby Weigh In

John Brennan’s Perspective

[10:02] – [11:11]

• Presidents typically value counsel from intelligence and military advisors—Trump is depicted as the exception, leading the nation into a “quagmire” with no clear or achievable objectives.
  • “Everything that we’ve seen over the past four weeks is unsurprising…this president has no sense, no understanding or doesn’t really care about the impact.” (John Brennan, [10:28])

John Kirby’s Take

[11:47]

• Iran’s success in striking U.S. bases stems from their strategic planning—retaining weapon caches and exploiting exhaustion of U.S./allied defenses.
  • “It’s hard to defend against every single drone and every single missile that comes at you…and Iran still obviously has the capability.” (John Kirby, [12:11])
• Rising U.S. casualties likely underestimated due to injuries like TBI (traumatic brain injury) surfacing over time.
  • “My sense is that the numbers of wounded…will probably go up.” (John Kirby, [12:33])

Depletion of U.S. Munitions & Global Security Risks

[13:34]

• “Where are we getting those munitions from?…We need to have a certain amount…around the globe, including in the area of China and Taiwan. As we draw down inventory, we cannot provide needed capabilities to ensure national security.” (John Brennan, [13:34])

Troop Deployments: Escalation on the Horizon

[15:02]

• The deployment of thousands of additional troops is “a very significant ground force,” indicating serious operational intent—not bluff.
  • “You don’t send them if you don’t intend to use them.” (John Kirby, [16:06])
• Kirby explains key indicators to watch: “prepare to deploy orders,” changes in logistics and medical support deployments.
  • “When I’m listening, I’m listening also for…are they sending logistics, medical, more aviation assets…” (John Kirby, [17:12])

5. Communication & Morale: Problems in Public Messaging

[19:29]

• The Pentagon’s communication is criticized for moving briefings away from media scrutiny and for inconsistent messaging between military and political leaders.
  • “It’s self-defeating…you have an obligation to explain to the American people why you’re doing what you’re doing and for what aims.” (John Kirby, [20:37])
• Kirby notes the disconnect between political and military communications leads to public confusion.

6. White House War Messaging: Detached, Disrespectful

[24:24] (post-break)

• White House criticized for trivializing combat—using war footage with cartoon overlays and video game references on social media.
  • “The war videos are cringe and disrespectful and gross…makes me feel embarrassed.” (Senior official, quoted by Host, [24:44])

Veterans’ Perspective

• “I find it offensive. We need to be better than this…When we’re talking about the lives of America’s sons and daughters…it’s the most serious business an administration ever does.” (John Kirby, [25:38])
• Kirby invokes Eisenhower:
  • “President Eisenhower…said he hated war as only a soldier who has lived it can hate it…” (John Kirby, [26:17])

Intelligence Briefings—Reduced to Montage

• Reports that Trump’s daily briefings begin with “two-minute montage of things blowing up” as opposed to substantive analysis.
  • “They’re just feeding Donald Trump’s narcissism…just giving him videos of things blowing up…really not explaining to him how badly things are going.” (John Brennan, [27:31])
• Brennan suggests:
  • “Only path forward is the 25th Amendment…I think [J.D. Vance] is not somebody who’s going to send US Servicemen and women into battle needlessly.” (John Brennan, [27:51])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Predictability:

  • “Who could have predicted…? Anybody with knowledge of the region and any military expertise.” (Host, [06:36])

• On Internal White House Fear:

  • “So many people are afraid of being on the outset. They are just drinking the Kool-Aid…” (Anonymous official, [08:24])

• On Presidential Detachment:

  • “He’s just bored and wants to move on.” (Senior official, [08:50])

• On Public Communication:

  • “We need to be better than this…war is the most serious business.” (John Kirby, [25:38])

• On Leadership Responsibilities:

  • “If we’re going to try to save this country…they really have to be rethinking whether or not Donald Trump…[should continue].” (John Brennan, [29:05])

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Political and Social Backdrop

CPAC & Divided Trump Base

[32:00] – [36:03]

• CPAC, typically Trump’s stronghold, suffers low energy—Trump skips the event, audience cool to impeachment talk.
  • “Things do feel a little different this year…halls have been emptier.” (Host, [33:02])
• Trump’s core voters openly question his war and economic record (“there’s a new war…stuff’s less affordable. I’m less than pleased.”).
• Steve Bannon urges more debate and “full information” for the base, suggesting internal divisions.

Public Protest: No Kings Movement & Jane Fonda

[36:03] – [46:03]

• “No Kings” protests expected to be the largest in U.S. history—reflecting broad opposition to Trump’s war and authoritarian tendencies.
• Jane Fonda Interview ([38:32]):
  • Fonda decries attacks on the First Amendment, censorship of history, and broader threats to democracy.
    • “We have to understand what’s happening. This is not normal…It’s the cornerstone of all democracies.” (Jane Fonda, [39:26])
  • She attributes protest momentum to the sense of desperation and need for action.
    • “We are the majority. We have to act like it.” (Jane Fonda, [40:47])
  • Fonda notes the current authoritarian threat is “the most frightening time” of her life, moving at unprecedented speed.
    • “This is the first time in U.S. history that an authoritarian regime has broken through…Never happened so fast in any industrialized democracy.” (Jane Fonda, [42:06])
  • On Hope & Activism:
    • “We can save the future. We are the ones that can create history…Neighboring is the new word the Twin Cities has put into the lexicon of resistance.” (Jane Fonda, [43:38])

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Timeline & Timestamps for Important Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |-------------------------------------------------|-----------| | Kash Patel hack and Iran cyber threats | 00:58 – 05:00 | | Trump’s ignored warnings & war escalation | 05:01 – 09:00 | | White House dysfunction & fear | 09:01 – 10:00 | | Brennan & Kirby analysis on war consequences | 10:02 – 18:41 | | Pentagon comms failures & public messaging | 19:29 – 22:27 | | Social media trivialization of war | 24:24 – 27:31 | | Calls for 25th Amendment & Cabinet action | 27:31 – 29:26 | | CPAC and Trump base’s unrest | 32:00 – 36:03 | | "No Kings" protest background | 36:03 – 38:32 | | Jane Fonda interview | 38:32 – 46:03 |

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Conclusion

This episode weaves together damning reporting on the Trump administration’s avoidable blunders and lack of preparation in its Iran war, excoriating analyses from top national security professionals, and the groundswell of American activism manifesting in mass protests. The key message is stark: The dangers of willful ignorance at the highest levels—amplified by poor, even disrespectful public communication and hollowed-out dissent—are now colliding with a self-aware, mobilized opposition determined to defend democracy and fundamental freedoms.

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Transcript

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[Host (News Anchor)]

we woke up to the news. Well, a lot of news. But one of the pieces of news we woke up to was the fact that Trump's FBI director, Kash Patel, had been hacked. A group claiming to be affiliated with an Iranian intelligence agency released a trove of emails and photographs taken from a personal email account of Kash Patel's. The FBI confirmed the hack, emphasizing that the stolen materials that were leaked were, quote, historical in nature, as in before he somehow found himself as the director of the FBI and that they don't involve government information as of now, as of what they've released. Now, we're not going to show you the materials released by those hackers today because frankly, they're really not newsworthy. And it appears the purpose of this hack was, of course to embarrass Kash Patel. Now, to be honest, though, nothing released today was really anywhere near as embarrassing as what we already know about Kash Patel, when what he has somehow put out himself in many ways. I mean, Just last week, ProPublica reported that Kash Patel had been signing autograph pictures of himself at the FBI Academy. ProPublica also reported that Patel made these custom shoes. See them on the screen, featuring the cash sign, the number nine. Patel is the ninth director of the FBI and the FBI motto. So yeah, why not make some commemorative shoes about it, I guess as one does. I mean, this is a guy who was caught guzzling beer and partying with the US Olympic hockey during a trip his spokesperson claimed was an official FBI trip to Milan for security meetings. Not what it appears to be, as far as I can see. And this is a guy who has reportedly demanded that rotating FBI SWAT teams, teams trained to arrest violent criminals and free hostages and fight terrorists, provide his much younger girlfriend with personal security while she performs as a singer and runs errands. This is guy who on more than one occasion ordered FBI security personnel to drive his girlfriend's allegedly drunk friends home after a night's of partying. Now, this hacking group does not appear to have released the entirety of what they obtained from Patel's personal email account. And if they ultimately release something newsworthy, we'll report on it. But for now, the content here. This is my point. Isn't the story. The hack itself is. And that's not because the hack is surprising. A lot of very high level US Officials have had their personal data hacked before. The hack is the story here precisely because of how unsurprising it is. I mean, U.S. officials have been warning about Iran's cyber capabilities for years now. And after the US Struck Iran last year back in June, Trump was repeatedly warned by his own agencies that one of the primary ways Iran could strike back against the U.S. was through a cyber attack. Trump's Department of Homeland Security warned about it, as did cisa, the nsa, the Department of Defense, and the FBI. And nearly a year ago, all five of those agencies warned Trump about the danger of cyber attacks from Iran. But despite those warnings, Trump cut more than 1,000 jobs at CISA, our country's top cybersecurity agency. Well, guess what the Trump administration started doing this week after they cut 1,000 CISA jobs and started a war with a country known for cyber attacks. Well, they announced plans to hire 300 more people at CISA. Oh, you need those guys after all. Who could have predicted that one? Maybe anyone. Tomorrow marks one month of Trump's war with Iran, and one of the defining features of this war so far has been the combination of how predictable Iran's responses have been and also how seemingly unprepared the Trump administration has been in handling those responses. I mean, just take, for example, a few of the warnings that Trump's top military advisor, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Dan Kaine, reportedly gave Trump before he attacked Iran. The Wall Street Journal reported that before the US Went to war, General Kaine told Trump that an American attack could prompt Iran to close the Strait of Hormuz. Trump reportedly said that he thought Tehran would capitulate before closing the Strait and that even if Iran tried, the US Military, they could handle it. Well, now the strait has been closed for nearly a month, strangling the global supply of everything from oil to fertilizer to key components used in computer chips and prescription drugs. Another thing Trump's top general, Dan Kaine, reportedly warned Trump about before the war was that it could lead to shortfalls in critical munitions. Warning that there were so many military targets in Iran trying to actually make a dent would deplete already low stockpiles. Well, guess what? The Washington Post reported today the US has already fired more than 850 Tomahawk cruise missiles in this war, burning through the weapons at a rate that is alarming to some Pentagon officials. And just to put that in perspective, recent versions of Tomahawk missiles cost as much as $3.6 million apiece. Take up to two years to build. Only a few hundred are manufactured every year, but we have already gone through used more than 850 in four weeks. Another thing Trump's top military advisor reportedly warned him about before he started this war was that a lack of support from our allies would add significant risk to the operation and to U.S. personnel. And last week, Trump called on our allies to help guard ships as they passed through the Strait of Hormuz. Most refused. Trump was reportedly furious, irate. Republican Senator Lindsey Graham even said that he had never heard Trump so angry in his life. Then, seemingly, I guess, to save face, Trump insisted that actually the US didn't need any help after all, which is clearly not the case. I mean, take the fact that just today, Trump's Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, was in France meeting with allies of ours that have not sent warships to the Strait, trying to convince them to join us. Who could have predicted that our allies might not want to rush into a war with Iran? Who could have predicted that an all out war with Iran would dangerously deplete our nation's munitions? Who could have predicted that Iran would shut down the Strait of Hormuz? And who could have predicted that Iran would respond with cyber attacks? The answer is anybody with knowledge of the region and any military expertise. The reason a president has the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the reason they have top advisors, is to warn them to play out to Red Team the consequences of their actions as they're making decisions to help them understand what the impact of their decisions will be. Now, I should note that after all that reporting came out about Dan Kaine having warned Trump about how disastrous a war with Iran could be, Trump denied it, said it was fake news and said that Kaine actually thought a war with Iran would be, quote, easily won. Now, is that what General Kaine actually thought? We don't know. But given all his warnings? I seriously doubt it. And now there's new reporting revealing that many within the White House are just going along to get along despite their own reservations about this war. Current former White House officials spoke to MSNOW's Jake Traylor about disagreements they had with how the administration was approaching the war with Iran. And while those current and former White House officials felt fine disagreeing with the White House, anonymously in the press, they said that they do not share those same opinions within the walls of the White House for fear of negative repercussions. One former White House official saying, quote, so many people are afraid of being on the outset. They are just drinking the Kool Aid and going along with it. Well, that's a dangerous situation, to state the obvious. In other words, the emperor has no clothes, but his aides are saying his clothes look great anyway. Except it's of course not Trump's outfit we're talking about here. It's a war. Now, in another gobsmacking, quote, this one from a senior White House official, a current senior White House official that is told msnow that Trump is, quote, getting a little bored with Iran. It's not that he regrets it, this official said. He's just bored and wants to move on. Just to put that in, keep that in your mind with the fact that human rights groups believe that nearly 1,500 civilians have been killed in Iran so far. Thirteen US service members have been killed to date. More than 300 US troops have been injured. And tonight the Wall Street Journal is reporting that even more are injured, writing that 10 US service members were wounded in an attack on a Saudi air base. Two of them were described as seriously wounded. I wonder if Donald Trump is still bored. I wonder. Joining me now, two people who have worked in national security at the highest levels of government. I had the pleasure of working with both of them. They've advised presidents, briefed presidents, and spoken on behalf of presidents. John Brennan is the former director of the CIA and retired Rear Admiral John Kirby is the former Pentagon press secretary and White House national security communications adviser and State Department spokesperson. You've done basically every job and you are a multi generational member of the military as well. Let me start with you, Director Brennan, because you're here. I mean, you have briefed many presidents, you've briefed presidents, you've briefed many high level officials on military action on the impact of it, on what's happening on the ground. I can't imagine you've ever found one who was bored.

[John Brennan]

No. And all the ones that I had briefed and have worked for, were very interested in hearing from the intelligence experts, hearing from the military advisors, taking very seriously what what the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff says, because that is the principal military advisor to the president. And clearly General Kaine, who's a professional soldier and very, very capable and competent, clearly saw and foresaw what was going to happen if we went forward with this military operation against Iran. So as you pointed out in the introduction, everything that we've seen over the past four weeks is unsurprising. And the fact that we are now in this mess, in this quagmire, with no good path forward in terms of how we're going to extricate ourselves from this nor achieve the objectives that have been talked about inconsistently over the past several weeks. It's again clear that this president has no sense, no understanding or doesn't really care about the impact not just on the Gulf region and our financial energy situation, but also in the lives of US Servicemen and women who are in harm's way now because he decided to go forward with, with a needless, unnecessary and senseless war.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Admiral Kirby, let me bring you into this. I mentioned this. I mean, you have been a member of the military. You have family members of both generations up and down who have been. There's reporting that at least 10Americans have been injured in an attack on a Saudi air base just today. I think prior to this war there may have been an underestimation by some, perhaps in the White House, certainly out there, about Iran's capabilities. What is it tell us that they have been successful in hitting our bases? Is it possibly that our missile defense capabilities are being strained or what does it tell us from a military perspective?

[John Kirby]

I think there's a bunch of factors here, Jen. One is that they knowing that they were about to be attacked and certainly there was a long buildup as the conditions were set for military operations. They probably squirreled some things away, hit them. Well, they don't need a lot of time to fire off a drone or a missile. You can do it from the back of a truck. And so they are are still capable at causing damage in these rather pinprick attacks, but they are lethal, as we've already seen. So it's hard to defend against every single drone and every single missile that comes at you. And Iran still obviously has the capability to do that. On the wounds, I mean, it's not uncommon. I certainly saw it in my time that the wounds and injuries don't necessarily all become apparent until sometimes days or even weeks after an attack or a strike, just particularly when it comes to, for instance, traumatic brain injury. So, I mean, we'll see. But my sense is that the numbers of wounded and injured will probably go up.

[Host (News Anchor)]

What about you, Director Brennan, when you saw the news of them, the troops that have been impacted in Saudi Arabia, that they've been successful in hitting a number of bases, it seems?

[John Brennan]

Well, I think, as John pointed out, I think the Iranians have been very strategic in terms of husbanding some of their inventory of missiles, rockets, drones and others, so that they would wait until a lot of the air defense capabilities in the Gulf states, in Saudi Arabia, even in Israel are going to be depleted as they overwhelm some of these air defenses and pointed out how many Patriot missiles have been expended. So again, I think the Iranians are being.

[Host (News Anchor)]

But let me pause you for a second because I just want you to put in perspective how many they have used and how many we have used. What does that kind of mean as a. I just gave the numbers there.

[John Brennan]

Well, I think the number of strikes against Iran is up in the 16, 18,000 going after targets. The number of munitions that have been used by the US Military is just astronomical. And therefore, where are we getting those munitions from? We're getting them from our stockpiles as well as from those munitions that we were sending to Ukraine or whatever else. But we need to have a certain amount of munitions and missiles and capabilities around the globe, including in the area of China and Taiwan. And so as we are continuing to draw down this inventory, it really does not allow us to provide the type of capabilities that we need in order to ensure that we're not just dealing with the current crisis, but also we are trying to make sure that our national security is not going to be threatened and at risk in other areas as well.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Let me ask you, Admiral Kirmi, there are now, as you know, thousands of US Troops deployed to the region. The Wall Street Journal reported last night that the Pentagon is contemplating sending an additional 10,000 troops. As one former Marine interrogator and special ops specialist told Semaphore, Trump has not ordered large footprint military assets in either of his presidencies without actually using those forces. We obviously don't know what's next here entirely, in part because we don't know why this war is being fought or what's going to happen any given day. But when you hear numbers like that, sometimes I think for a lot of people watching, what do numbers like that mean? And we keep seeing an additional several thousand being announced and sent, it feels like every couple of days. How do you hear that?

[John Kirby]

It's a significant amount of ground troops. You're talking about two Marine Corps expeditionary units. Each one is about 3,500 Marines or so. So now you're up at around 7,8000. And then now we're talking maybe 10,000 or more army soldiers as well. That's a very significant ground force. They are capable of a multitude of different missions. The Marines are very good at expeditionary warfare, about taking ground and holding it for certain amounts of time. These army troops that will be coming in might have additional capabilities to bring and could in fact maybe stay longer and sustain themselves on the beach for quite amount of time. I agree with the assessment that he hasn't ordered massive amounts of military into a region without using it. And we just saw that, of course, over the last four weeks when he assembled a tremendous amount of air and naval power to do what he's doing in Iran. So the fact that these troops are being deployed tells me that they do have plans on the shelf. Now, whether they'll execute those plans or if the negotiations go well, maybe they can call it off. But this doesn't look to me like some kind of a bluff or a negotiating tactic. These are serious troops that conduct very, very significant missions on short notice. And you don't send them. They're obviously ready to go. They're kind of a 911 force, but you don't send them if you don't intend to use them.

[Host (News Anchor)]

What are you listening for? We all hear numbers, and it feels like, wow, there are a lot of troops that are going to the Middle East. What else? What kind of language or vernacular from the Pentagon are you listening for? Where you think, okay, they're deploying these troops and they're gonna be fighting on the ground in Iran.

[John Kirby]

Yeah. So you listen for things like prepare to deploy orders. This is where the Pentagon notifies units days or weeks in advance that to be ready. And in order to do that, they often become public because you got to let these units know. Those units have to let their families know and their support infrastructure at home know. So often that gets out into public. So I'm listening for prepare to deploy orders and rumors and leaks about that, because I think that tells you a lot about not only what they're going to send, the capabilities they want to send, but in what scale, what size. So listen for prepared to deploy orders, and I think also now the two groups of troops that we're talking about Marines who are trained for these expeditionary OPS and the 82nd Airborne, which is America's 911 force, an emergency force, they're designed for short term deployments. In other words, get going quickly, get on the ground, and then usually the mission doesn't last that long. So when I'm listening, I'm listening also for are they sending logistics, are they sending medical and medical service support, are they sending more aviation assets and what kind of aviation assets? And then of course, are they going to be sending traditional infantry ground units? These are units that take a lot longer to mobilize and to get on station, but are able to sustain themselves for a long period of time. You start hearing about that and you start, you know, you're going to start to wonder just how much of a ground incursion they really want to try to employ here.

[Host (News Anchor)]

One of the questions I've been thinking about, and it feels that they're talking about negotiations. They're talking about obviously what's happening in Pakistan, what countries are going to be involved. You've been involved in so many of these negotiations in the past. It is not easy to just get a negotiated deal done with the Iranians, to state the obvious, or it hasn't been historically. And it could be a long process. What happens if that negotiation does not work, does not go anywhere, is too slow for Trump's tastes and he walks away. What is the impact? What is left in the region?

[John Brennan]

Well, I think it's the status quo ante as far as Iran's nuclear capabilities concerned. It's defiance of the United States refusal to agree to allow the Strait of Hormuz to be open to free international shipping. There are so many things. And as you pointed out, the Iranians really are tough negotiators. And with the decapitation of the senior leadership, it appears as though more hardline elements now have surfaced as being in charge of military intelligence, security as well as the government itself. So this is going to be a really tough negotiation and I'm going to not really all that hopeful that the Iranians are going to concede any of those 15 points that supposedly the Trump administration now has put forward.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Admiral Kirby, let me ask you just about how the Pentagon has been communicating about this, because Secretary Hegseth has obviously given a number of briefings. He's berated the press. They've moved the Pentagon press corps to an or tried to move them to an annex. They've kicked them out. There have been a number of steps that have been taken. I mean, you are somebody who's probably briefed from the Pentagon podium more than anyone else, maybe even more than secretaries of defense. What has stuck out to you about the lack of communication about the war from the Pentagon over the course of the last four weeks?

[John Kirby]

So I'll caveat this by saying I'm glad they're doing briefings. I wish they were doing them more often and I wish that in the briefing room there were more traditional, conventional media who were really, you know, bring with them the kinds of tough questions that any policy needs to be scrutinized over rather than outlets that are decidedly of one of one ilk and not necessarily conventional press. That said, I feel like, well, I don't feel like I know it's self defeating. And I really hope that Mr. Hagseth and the Pentagon leadership will come to think about their obligations to the American people and to the press corps in a different way. Now, I recognize they probably won't, and I understand that. But I think it's actually doing a disservice to themselves, to their ability to convince the American people to have a narrative and to hold their policies up to the scrutiny of an independent press. I always thought I took that podium for three different secretaries of Defense. And I always felt like those briefings and that access, the constant interaction with the press corps in the building every day really made for better policymaking because you know how these things are going to be viewed and aired in the media. You know what the headlines are going to be if you're talking to reporters, you know the angle they're going to approach that kind of policy with. And it really does help inform the process itself. I think it makes it better and it's certainly more healthy. And again, I think if you're going to be spending this much money and you're going to be putting this many lives at risk, and I'm not saying, you know, that that happens in war. I understand that. But if you're going to do it, you have an obligation. It's not just an opportunity, it's an obligation to explain to the American people why you're doing what you're doing and why you're spending what you're spending and for what aims. I will say that when I watch the Pentagon briefings and I do pay attention to them, General Kaine and actually to a degree, certainly Mr. Hegseth too have been pretty consistent on the limited objectives, the military objectives that they are trying to achieve, and they brief to those objectives pretty consistently. But what gets confusing for the American people is that the political leadership isn't always parroting those same messages. And the messaging at the political level is a little bit all over the map. And so that that makes it hard, it makes it hard to develop a cohesive narrative. It makes it hard for the Pentagon, I think, to make the case that this is in fact important in the national interest.

[Host (News Anchor)]

A lot of that the fish rods at the head, as they say. So Director Brennan, John Kirby, please stay where you are. We have to take a quick break, but there's one more thing I want to ask you about, and it's something even one senior Trump White House official just called cringe and disrespectful and gross. We'll talk about it when we come back.

[John Kirby]

Lifelock, how can I help?

[Host (News Anchor)]

The IRS said I filed my return,

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[John Kirby]

Don't worry, I can fix this.

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[Host (News Anchor)]

Donald Trump is not the only one in the White House detached from the war he started. You can see the detachment from the war's human toll in the entire communication strategy on social media. The White House accounts have been trivializing the service of American troops by turning war video into cheap content that makes it look like a video game or turns it into something to put cartoon references on top of. And the latest reporting from Ms. Now is that the strategy has become a point of contention even inside the White House. One senior White House official told msnow, quote, the war videos are cringe and disrespectful and gross and that it makes me feel embarrassed. No kidding. We're back with John Brennan and John Kirby. Okay, Admiral Kirby, let me, as I continue to remind the audience who all know you, of course, you've served in the military. You have children who've served in the military. You have family members, parents who've served in the military. I just want to ask you about this kind of from a personal perspective, because when you see these videos, I'm sure you've seen them. SpongeBob SquarePants, Call of Duty, it feels we have the best military in the world, bar none. It is trivializing. It feels, it does feel embarrassing. But what do you think about it?

[John Kirby]

I find it offensive. We just really, we need to be better than this. When we're talking about war and peace, when we're talking about the lives of America's sons and daughters who have been sent to a foreign country to conduct war. This is serious business. It's the most serious business that an administration ever, ever does. And it's the most serious decision that any president ever makes. And I would hope and I would beseech them to find a way to communicate what they're achieving and what they're trying to achieve in ways that doesn't trivialize the service and the sacrifice and now the loss and the injury to the men and women that they're sending into harm's way. I'm reminded of President Eisenhower who said he hated war as only a soldier who has lived it can hate it only as someone who has known its brutality, its futility and its stupidity. And that's a man who also occupied the Oval Office, but knew very well the high stakes of national security and of war. And I would just hope that we could bring a little bit of sobriety back to the job of communicating this conflict.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Director Brennan, it's not just how they're communicating publicly. As you know, we've long known that Donald Trump is not a policy wonk, that he doesn't have a lengthy attention span for policy details. But this week there was new reporting that over the course of the last few weeks during the war, during the pdb, they've been starting it with a two minute montage of things blowing up during the war. You have beenyou have led those briefings. You've been part of putting together the materials, briefing presidents. I just wonder what you think of that and what impact that kind of approach has on how the President may approach this, how they're all approaching says

[John Brennan]

to me that the White House, senior White House staff and advisors are not doing their job. They're just feeding Donald Trump's narcissism, his self centered approach to everything. And by just giving him videos of things blowing up, they're really not explaining to him. And I don't know whether or not he can comprehend or even cares about just how badly things are going. Yes, we can blow everything up, which is why when I think about going forward, Donald Trump is just so identified with this war that personally, I think the only path forward is the 25th Amendment. And I'm being very serious. As much as I don't like J.D. vance's policies, he is not somebody who's going to send US Servicemen and women into battle needlessly, and he's not going to sacrifice them. He also, I think, is going to be better able to actually strike a deal with the Iranians to negotiate, because the Iranians, I think, are determined to embarrass Trump and to show that he is not going to win this war, that they are going to be the ones who emerge victorious. And also, if Donald Trump continues to go down this path, we're going to lose a lot of Americans soldiers, and the Republican Party is going to be destroyed in the process.

[Host (News Anchor)]

How do we get to a JD Vance being in charge if the Cabinet,

[John Brennan]

if the members of the Cabinet recognize just how badly things are going? And watching that Cabinet meeting yesterday, listening to Donald Trump talk for almost five minutes about charges.

[Host (News Anchor)]

You told me you listened to the whole thing in the car.

[John Brennan]

Yeah. It's clear that Donald Trump is not able to carry out the responsibilities, the obligations of a commander in chief and chief executive. It should be clear to everybody. And if we're going to try to save this country from going down a path of just having more and more, you know, problems in the region, having more American service women and men die and just, you know, devastating, you know, the global economy, I do think that they really have to be rethinking about whether or not Donald Trump, who watches those video games of bombs exploding, really need to rethink whether or not this is the right way going forward.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Director Brennan, Admiral Kirby, I think everybody watching knows this, but you have both been in the room with so many presidents and secretaries and people actually making these decisions. People you have both people who haven't been afraid to speak the hard truths. And that's not happening right now. But I think it's so important for people to hear what actually needs to happen and the big questions we really need to be focusing on. So thank you both so much for being here. I really appreciate it. Very informative. Okay. The legendary actor and activist Jane Fonda is standing by. She held an event outside the Kennedy center in defense of the First Amendment today, and she's headed to the flagship no Kings protest in Minnesota tomorrow. And as the opposition only becomes stronger and more unified in this country, we are seeing, shall we say, a little less unity from Republicans right now. We'll have much more on that when we come back.

[John Kirby]

How many of you would like to see impeachment hearings? No, that was the wrong answer. Lifelock how can I help?

[Host (News Anchor)]

The IRS said I filed my return,

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but I haven't One in four tax paying Americans has paid the price of identity fraud.

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[Jane Fonda]

My refund though.

[Host (News Anchor)]

I'm freaking out.

[John Kirby]

Don't worry, I can fix this.

[LifeLock Advertiser]

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[LifeLock Customer]

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[John Kirby]

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[IXL Advertiser]

a parent and want to help set up your child for success, then IXL is right for your family as an effective and affordable online learning program. IXL covers math, language arts, science and social studies using interactive practice problems for kids from Pre K to 12th grade. Listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership when they sign up [e-mail] 20. Visit ixl.com 20 to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price.

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[Host (News Anchor)]

The annual conservative political conference known as CPAC is currently underway in Texas and it's gonna be rockin all weekend long. Everyone get excited now. If you're not familiar with cpac, it is one of the largest and most influential right wing conferences in the country. And it's typically the a pretty good indicator of the current direction of the Republican Party and the broader American conservative movement in the moment. Which means that these days it's basically a four day long MAGA rager filled with long winded dear leader like speeches praising Donald Trump and discussions about the right's latest culture war issues and targets. Now just to give you a sense of the vibes I'm talking about, here are the names of just a few of the sessions this year. Defeating Communism and we mean it. Don't Sharia my Texas who worked on that one. Give them a button. Cigars, steaks and ivermectin a Maha survival guide. The President will sue you. Now how the legacy media was defeated, which literally was immediately and I love this part and with zero hint of irony followed by the censorship industrial complex. Now the other thing to know about CPAC is that it's kind of like a bizarre right wing comic con where conservative activists, politicians and personalities together to rub elbows. You can see anyone from top elected Republican politicians to key Trump administration officials like the number two guy at the Justice Department, Todd Blanche. Yeah, he was speaking. You can see border czar Tom Homan and right wing media figures like Steve Bannon. Heck, you can even see Trump pardoned seditionists and proud boys leader Enrique Tarrio there, seen here palling around with adjudicated liar and disgraced former Border Patrol commander Gregory Bevino taking a little thumbs up photo together there. The MAGA fever dream that is cpac, everyone. That is what it is. But I have to say, things do feel a little different this year. Part of that is probably because Donald Trump himself, who hasn't missed CPAC in a decade, isn't planning on attending. He's going to be hunkered down at Mar a Lago this weekend instead. Which is a little surprising given his CPAC attendance record and given the fact that he really misses an opportunity to have a room full of his cult followers clap for him. According to msnow reporter Rosa Flores, Trump's absence is part of the reason why the halls have been emptier. But even setting aside the fact that Trump's not planning on going, the CPAC crowd has been a little well off this year. I mean, take a look at what I mean.

[John Kirby]

Come on, be happy. Be happy. Cpac. I know we kept you up late. How many of you would like to see impeachment hearings? No, that was the wrong answer.

[John Brennan]

Let me try it again.

[John Kirby]

How many of you would like to see Impeachment hearings?

[Host (News Anchor)]

No.

[John Kirby]

Can someone bring some coffee out for the. We've got to keep this House majority.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Yikes. That did not go as match lot planned. They got that one wrong by MAGA standards, twice now. Whether that's an under caffeinated crowd or whatever happened to you there during this year's CPAC, MAGA World is obviously not 100% on the same page on a few issues and probably none of them are bigger than Trump's war with Iran. One young Trump voter told the Washington Post he ran on no new wars. There's a new war. He ran on making stuff affordable. Stuff's less affordable. I'm less than pleased that voter even went as far to say as to say I'm considering not voting in the midterms. I mean, can you blame him? Look, Trump's base is clearly divided right now. The cracks are showing. I mean, just listen to Steve Bannon on the CPAC stage earlier today.

[John Brennan]

We're in the middle of a war right now, let me say, probably the start of a war. The decision in going forward is obviously the commander in chiefs, but he's got to have people have to have his back. And you're only going to do that with full information. You have to be convinced. All this debate goes on and you know who's right, who's wrong, what's going to happen. It's a debate that has to happen.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Look, Trump's base is all mixed up right now, magazine of sorts, and honestly, it all seems a little low energy. But while that hot mess unfolds at seat back across the country, in cities and towns in all 50 states, the opposition to Trump and his administration is growing and getting stronger and getting more unified. And tomorrow that will be on full display with the third round of no Kings rallies planned nationwide in what could turn out to be the largest single day of protest in American history. Legendary actor and activist Jane Fonda will be attending the flagship event in Minnesota, and she joins me next. On June 14th of last year, Donald Trump's birthday, more than 5 million people took to the streets all across the country for the first official no Kings protest against Trump and his administration. And at the time, it was considered to be the third largest day of protest in US history. Now, a few months later, on October 18th, that record was broken when no Kings outdid themselves with a second nationwide protest. Organizers say roughly 7 million people turned out for that one. And now, as I'm sure you're aware, no Kings is gearing up for their third and potentially largest protest yet tomorrow, Saturday, March 28, over 3,000 protests. 33. Wait, 3,000 protests are planned for all across the country. It is no secret that more Trump acts like an authoritarian, the more he acts like an authoritarian, or a king, for that matter, the more Americans of all stripes feel like they need to stand up against it. It's why you see demonstrations like the one outside the Kennedy center Today in Washington, D.C. artists, musicians, writers, all speaking out against attacks on the First Amendment. And one of the organizers was the legendary actor and longtime activist Jane Fonda, who issued a very clear warning about what's at stake right now.

[Jane Fonda]

I want to say that the First Amendment suffers greatly in times of war as the government works to crush internal dissent. Our parents, our forefathers, fought and died for these rights, for these freedoms. We must not sit by quietly and watch them taken away. If we wait to act, if we hesitate out of fear or the feeling that it doesn't affect us, it may be too late.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Joining me now is the one and only Jane Fonda, actor, activist, and founder of the Modern Committee for the First Amendment. Jane Fonda, it is such a pleasure to be speaking with you. I watched your event today. We all watched your event today. And I should note for the audience, you were in Washington, D.C. today, speaking outside the Kennedy center for an event. This is what I'm referring to in defense of free expression. So tell us about the event and the message you were really trying to get across to people watching.

[Jane Fonda]

Well, the attacks on the arts, on literature, on film, on museums, the National Endowment of the art, all of these are under attack right now. They're being defunded, they're being censored, they're being removed. History, especially racial history, the history of slavery, is all being erased now. And we wanted, because it's kind of like here and there, siloed. We worried that people and the press don't see clearly enough the breadth and depth of these attacks. And we have to understand what's happening. This is not normal. This does not happen in a democracy. And we have to call it what it is, and we have to end it. We're the Committee for the First Amendment. It's the First Amendment for a reason. It's the most important. It's the cornerstone of all democracies. It's freedom of speech, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, and freedom to protest, including the right to criticize our president if we choose. All of this is under attack.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Let me ask you about an aspect of this moment. It's so challenging but that is, I think, positive, which is the reaction, the activism we've seen out there. You have been an activist for so many years, and we now tomorrow, the no Kings protest may be very well, the biggest one yet we've seen during the Trump administration. You're going to be appearing at the flagship rally in St. Paul. Why do you think the no Kings movement specifically has been really able to galvanize and energize so many people thus far?

[Jane Fonda]

People feel desperate. People are. I mean, we're the majority. We are. So we have to act like it. And they're not sure what to do. So the no Kings, these rallies are fun. They're like a festive, you know, and it's like dipping your toe in. It's a first step. And so we should all go tomorrow. But we shouldn't just go. We bring five people, bring people that we know that have never been to a protest. It's like a first step. You know, you meet new friends, you build community. It's very important because it's not affecting his pocketbook. Trump maybe doesn't care about the no Kings, but we do. It's important that we see how big our numbers are.

[Host (News Anchor)]

It's creating a community, I think, that so many people need. You became an activist, as I think anybody watching knows. But just to remind people, during the anti war and civil rights movements, which were both, of course, very violent, incredibly tumultuous times in our nation's history. But last year, you described the second Trump administration as the most frightening time of your life. Just level set for people. What sets it apart from what you've seen over your lifetime of that activism?

[Jane Fonda]

Well, I'm speaking from the vantage point of a white person. I think black people in this country have experienced authoritarianism. I mean, Jim Crow, there were no rights for people who were black. This is the first time in the history of the United States that an authoritarian regime has broken through. And worldwide historians who study these things, they all agree it has never happened so fast in any industrialized democracy. He is moving to consolidate very, very fast, which means that right now we have to use the tools, we have to stop it.

[Host (News Anchor)]

You hear a lot from people, and you may hear this. I'm so tired. I fought during the first Trump administration. I just don't know if I have more in me. Even though there are so many millions of people out there. Give us some. Give us some advice. Give us a little quick pep talk for people out there who feel tired. Given the longevity you've had as an activist, over the course of your life.

[Jane Fonda]

I don't know if I'm going to do that. But I'll tell you something. I am so grateful that I'm alive right now. This is such an important time to be alive because it's in our hands. We, we can save the future. And I say, and it's literal save the future because this guy takes a bath in fossil fuels. The climate is being forgotten about. We are facing an existential climate crisis and fossil fuels are everywhere with this guy. So we're fighting two existential fights and they're very connected. This is the time. We are the ones that can create history. We can change what's happening. We are the majority. We don't have a lot of time. So how exciting to be a grown up person right now, to be able to be part of this. Because history, this has never happened before, which means that history is going to be very much on top of this. They're going to know who was on which side. I don't want to be judged by history and by my children and grandchildren of not having done all I can. Everybody has a role. Carpenters in Minneapolis are repairing the doors that ice, you know, pushed down. People babysitting, helping. There's a woman who's just given birth that gives her breast milk to the immigrant child next door because the mother has been taken away. I mean, neighboring has become the way to change the world. Neighboring is the new word that the Twin Cities has put into the lexicon of resistance. Get to know your neighbor, reach your arms out. Bring in people that you may not fully agree with. It doesn't matter as long as you believe in freedom, the right to speak, the right to express yourself, even if you don't agree with it. This is a new possible world. People are angry right now. The majority of people are fed up with the chaos and terror and disruption and economy that's happening. We can change it. We can't. But we have to do it together. Don't do it by yourself. Strengthen numbers. Join an organization. Join a church. It can be a synagogue, it can be the neighborhood. But do study what's happening in Minneapolis and make it happen where you are.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Jane Fonda, you may not have intended a pep talk, but I think for any 22, 32, 42, 52 year old, watching that put it in their veins, that was such a dose of hope and, you know, hopefully prompting some people to be active. Thank you for being here.

[Jane Fonda]

I'm 88 for what you do. I'm not tired because I'm so excited.

[Host (News Anchor)]

I know you're making, I think you're making everybody watching plan. They're looking up how to get involved tomorrow. I'm so grateful you could be here with us. Thank you again for everything you've done and beyond. Yes, absolutely.

[Jane Fonda]

Thank you.

[Host (News Anchor)]

Quick reminder that MsNow is going to have coverage of the no Kings protests all day long tomorrow with reporters fanned out across the country. The Last Word is also going to be talking a lot about the protests in the next hour. They also have former Labor Secretary Russell Robert Reich standing by. And we'll be right back. That's gonna do it for me tonight. Thanks for being with us.

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