B (2:49)

Yeah, this is like the motherfucker with the art. And you're that guy, right? You buy a painting that's sort of the jump off of all this, right? A beautiful painting that looks like what.

D (3:03)

I wouldn't call it monochromatic, but it's whitish in tone. There's a couple like diagonal stripes, another little line at the bottom. It's by a very well known painter named Antrias.

E (3:18)

It's just a white square.

D (3:19)

I know it's not.

B (3:21)

Yeah, you have a lot of opinions.

D (3:22)

It's not just a white square.

C (3:24)

I mean, this is the play you're watching. Guys, calm down. And that's it. That's the play in a whole.

B (3:31)

This was actually your idea, I heard, to maybe bring back art and you wanted to play this role.

C (3:37)

It's a part that I've always loved and a play that I think is due a revival. You know, this is a play that, whether in London or in New York and across around the world consistently. You know, I think was it 27, 28 years ago that it was on here and it won best play at the Tony, it won best play at the Oliviers. And it's. And what's interesting about that is sometimes a play won something 28 years ago and you know, you pick it up and read it and you think, I don't know if this could work today. This feels of a different time. This. I mean, we're certainly finding now in rehearsals. This feels like it could have been written two months ago. It's so rich. The dialogue is so great. And you know, I think what Neil said is right. The construct of it is such a perfect theatrical experience. It treats the audience with respect. It treats the audience. It accepts that they are going to listen, that they're okay with context and nuance and differences of opinion. And the whole play is under 100 minutes, no intermission, and it's done. And it's funny and it's hopefully moving. And I couldn't. I'm loving the whole experience so far of being in a rehearsal room with these two, just watching them, working with them. Scott Ellis directing the play. It feels so wonderful right now.

B (5:04)

In all those years of hosting the Late Late show, were you just looking at guests thinking, like, who do I want to do Broadway with? You guys? Were both, weren't you both guests on all the Time.

C (5:12)

All the Time Were you? Yeah, yeah, all the time.

B (5:15)

Who'd be fun to do a play with on Broadway?

C (5:17)

Well, often. Well, also you. It's not really about who you do a play with. It's just because I would always go and see all the guests before the show started. So I'd always go and see them. And that's really where you get to sort of hang out and chat and you get a very strong sense of like, oh, man, I would love to work with those guys. And I have such respect for Neil and Bobby, who, you know, it's very, very rare for performers who are so in demand in film and television not to be just completely consumed by film and television and sucked into that world very, very quickly. You know, if you talk about, you know, Series of Unfortunate Events, Boardwalk Empire, all these shows are huge. And it's very, very easy for actors to say that they love the stage and say that that's what they want to do and that's where their true love is. But sure enough, you look up, in 12 years, 13, 14 years later, they haven't stepped back on a stage. And my respect for Neil and Bobby as performers to keep the discipline of being committed to that is. Is incredible. And that was really. As soon as it became clear that they were interested in doing it. It was a no brainer, really.

B (6:31)

I mean, I've seen you all do extremely high energy performances on stage. This feels like it's gonna be interesting because I feel like you have to probably stay extremely alert for those hundred minutes.

F (6:41)

Right.

B (6:41)

What was it like doing a play like this? It's the three of you just talking. It's very simple. It's very much about the people and the emotions and the story. What is it like getting ready to do something like this and getting in that rhythm in rehearsal?

D (6:54)

It's intense calibration, I think, because Yasmina Reza, who's the playwright, she wrote this very specific construct and it's a big discussion with differing opinions. And we're in Paris and so the archetypes are argumentative men who. What are you talking about? That can't be true or you don't even know what you're talking. It's like, it's that vibe, but. But it's written really specifically long sentences with complex vocabulary within it to get your point across. It's almost like Mamet in Paris. And so we have to be on our own game really well. And then we also have to be listening to each other because as we shift with interest, like a pause here or a different tone here, then everyone's kind of moving. So that's what we're doing in rehearsals right now. And I just think it's great. We're in a time right now where differences of opinions is really triggering for people. Our algorithmic world makes us only talk about things we agree with, people we agree with. And so I think it'll be fun to sit and watch people really disagree about things in a passionate way in 2025.

E (8:17)

It's a puzzle too, right? The play, I mean, like, you know, to James Point, the play has been so critically acclaimed and lauded and it's won every award. They teach it in the. They teach it in the curriculum in France. You know, kids have to. They learn about this play. And so, you know, I wouldn't say the pressure's on, but it is a puzzle, right? I mean, you'll be working on it and then you'll get three quarters of the way through and you'll realize my argument doesn't make sense from how. Because of how I've been playing this earlier in the play. And you have to figure it out, right? It's an unlocking of sorts. And so you can look at it and go, well, it's only a 45 page play. It's only 100 minutes, less than 100 minutes. But it's a lot of work to try to figure out how to try to remain emotionally true to these characters through, straight through from the beginning to the end, not show as many colors as you can and, you know, make the evening believable, realistic and entertaining. Right. It's like, you know, you could say about any play, but it's really so well constructed and people know that this play has been recognized for so long. You really do want to feel like you're gonna get it right. And there are times when you have to kind of go back to square one and go, I have to rethink that now because I. I don't know that my argument. I've earned the argument in the end. And so it's really an interesting thing to work on. I go home and I walk around for a long time in my head thinking about these arguments that I may have had paralleling my life. And it's really, it's a joy to get to work on it. But it is an intense mental exercise working on this play.

C (9:53)

It's strange rehearsals as well, because you rehearse a play for long enough and there is one massive component that's missing, and that's the 900 people that will be sitting the Other side of this line. So you're rehearsing in this bubble, really. And then at some point. At some point, you just have to show. It's why you do previews, right? You show it to these people, and they start to tell you where perhaps the timing should speed up or slow down or the gaps that you never thought might be there won't. That. You know, it's a.

G (10:26)

It's.

C (10:27)

It's an extraordinary process.

B (10:28)

There's something so masculine about this play. And I know that Yasmina has said that she doesn't want women to perform it. It's really written for men, you know, Like, I have a friend whose name I will not say who just, like, has to tell me his opinion, even if he knows, like, that it's gonna piss me off. You know, Those are people. They just have to, like. They just have to. There's just something in that. Right. And I know that you kind of, like, start to play that way, don't you?

E (10:51)

Character. Yeah, he's. He cannot. So funny. Yeah, he cannot help himself. It's who he is. And he. Not only that, but he's already 20 years into an established relationship in which the roles have been defined, at least to him. You know, there's a line later on in the play that's been haunting me every night where he talks about how he is, you know, in moral quicksand. This guy, you know, he's sort of stuck in this quicksand. And I've been thinking about that a lot and what that means and, you know, and trying my best not to get too caught up in it and. Because, you know, what does that mean? When somebody, at least when somebody that you're close to views you that way, does that just throw you off your access, off your axis? I think it does. When a good friend is critical of your behavior, of the person that you are, even though they've been friends with you all these years. So I think those kind of unexpected surprises that are revealed in the play between these friends, I think is, like, really, it's where I think the rubber meets the road in terms of anybody who comes in who doesn't know anything about the play, I think they will be able to get down with it, that they will be able to recognize themselves. I think anybody can recognize themselves on this play. It might seem like it's a play about three well to do guys arguing over a piece of contemporary art. But I'm positive that anybody can get down with this play and see themselves in any of these characters.

D (12:20)

Can I say, too, it is an absolute joy to be rehearsing with these two specifically, because even hearing you both answer questions, like, there's a deep appreciation for the source material. It's not like they're coming in saying, well, I know that this is the script, but this is like, I'm gonna do my own thing, which I've been a part of, too. But we're all, like, so dedicated to figuring out the written sentence within each scene and how it can make sense and questioning when it doesn't. And I think that's just so fantastic that you both care so much about it. It really has been making the process.

C (13:02)

A joy, I think, when you know what the play can be as well and what it can mean to audiences, like, when you've seen it before. I've never done a revival before. I've only ever done new plays. And so the feeling of, you know, there'll be two separate audiences that will see this play. There'll be people that have never seen it or never heard of it before and will be coming in completely fresh. And then there will be people that we've all met over the. Since this was announced who go, oh, man, I saw Alan Alder and Victor Garber and Alfred Molina do it. Oh, I can't wait. And you just go, oh, shit. Okay.

B (13:36)

Or like, george Wundt was awesome. I mean, so many guys have done this play. And the trio of actors, it's really special. And I feel like you're actually becoming this little Broadway legacy, right? You're now the new art trio, and it must be fun at this point in your career. I always wonder what it's like for actors to get to sort of jump into these new friendships and families, and what is it like actually getting to know each other.

C (14:00)

We have a wonderful director, Scott Ellis, who's directing the plays. A fantastic energy, and lets us play around when we will need to play around. And it's very serious in the points when we need to be very serious about the play. And it makes the whole thing. There's a lightness to it, which sometimes when you're doing a play, it can be very, very serious, almost too serious. You can talk yourself around in circles sometimes. And yet this just. I think Neil's right. There's an appreciation of the text. There's an appreciation of the experience from every single person in the room. And it's so far making it a joy. I can already feel like it's that thing when you try and go, ah, you know, you look back at stuff Sometimes you think, oh, they were the good days, you know, And I'm already really, really trying to remind myself that, no, these are the good days. I'm living these good days. Because it's inconceivable to me that. That at some point in five or 10 or 15 years time that I will look back on this time and go, oh, my God, it was just a blast. Cause it already feels like that. And so it's trying to hold onto that whilst we're doing it.

E (15:12)

I've never laughed so hard.

D (15:13)

We're doing a play that is not constructed as a comedy.

F (15:17)

Right.

D (15:18)

It's really. Yasmina wrote it as a tragedy. And so we're picking apart these sentences, not thinking, there's going to be a big laugh here. We're thinking about, like, what does it mean? And we're fighting, we're arguing. And I've never laughed so hard in rehearsals, like, having the best time throughout it, even though our end goal is not comedy. So it's just been the joy.

A (15:43)

And Keanu Reeves and Alex Winter reuniting in the revival of Waiting for Godot. We had a quick chat with both stars asking Keanu what it means to be making his Broadway debut alongside one of his oldest friends.

G (16:00)

To get a.

H (16:00)

Chance to do this play on Broadway. I mean, the question is actually the answer, you know, and. And to do it with you, man. I've been saying this, but it's a dream come true. And.

F (16:14)

And you're killing it. I must know.

H (16:16)

That's. That's kind.

F (16:16)

You are.

H (16:17)

But no, no, no.

F (16:18)

I don't know.

D (16:18)

I don't know.

H (16:19)

But you're killing it.

D (16:21)

Yeah.

F (16:22)

Now we're gonna do that game.

H (16:23)

No, no. Sometimes when I'm asleep on stage, I, like, open an eye. Cause I like watching your.

F (16:32)

Damn.

H (16:32)

It's so good. You know what actually, for me was like, doing the. Doing the Tonys and then. And then also recently getting the photograph that you took of the billboard of the theater. Like, that to me was like, oh, it's real.

G (16:53)

Oh.

H (16:53)

Oh. You know, like when we did the photography for that, you know, what is that?

G (16:59)

Year.

H (16:59)

Year ago? Over a year ago.

C (17:00)

Yeah.

H (17:00)

You know, but then to see that, when you showed that to me, I was like.

F (17:05)

Well, Keanu called me about doing this thing three and a half years ago. So. Yeah. And then we got Jamie, like, three and a quarter years ago.

G (17:18)

Yeah.

F (17:19)

And then we had the ability around our other work to marinate in this and research and get together and read through the play and read through it with Jamie. So, you know, it was a gift because things in our business move so fast and this play is challenging. So I personally am very grateful that we've had time.

H (17:39)

Well, yeah, I mean, we went to the. We went to the archive in Redding. You know, we've met in New York with Jamie. We've read the play. You read the biography.

C (17:50)

Yeah.

H (17:52)

This Thick, which is fantastic.

F (17:55)

Keanu works very hard, and he's a very physical actor as well as being.

H (18:00)

Great in But It Ain't Broadway. And this guy's been. You've been like, I'm in Pilates.

G (18:07)

I'm training.

H (18:08)

I'm lifting weights. I've got the diet. You don't know what it takes.

F (18:12)

I didn't say that, but I did tell you what I thought it took. I did say that this is more about physical endurance than anything else. And, yeah, I was lucky. I came from a dance background, so I started doing that kind of stuff when I was very, very young. And I watch actors do it now. And often where they falter is not so much not getting their lines or that. It's the physical prep and recovery that you need to do. Eight shows a week, and these guys are on stage the whole time. And so, yeah, I started training as soon as Keanu said, what about doing God? I'm like, great. Click. Okay, let's get started. Because we're older and I wanted to make sure I'm in shape. So, yeah, I mean, it is. It's a marathon. It's a marathon every night.

H (19:06)

It's great to have an audience. You learn so much, and it focuses in a way that perhaps you wouldn't do on your own. Like, you can look at each scene, but then when the audience comes, it makes you consider it in a different way, perhaps like the timing of a scene or what you're doing. Right.

F (19:26)

It's like we rehearsed and rehearsed. Jamie's very rigorous, and it was great for us to be able to bring a first preview to audiences. That was the show. But I'll tell you, we learn so much every night from the audience, and we come off and go, oh, let's do this, this, this, and this. So it was helpful.

A (19:44)

And finally, on this episode of the pod, let's talk about one of the longest running and most loved musicals in Broadway history. Yes, that's right. The Lion King. Tony nominee Gavin Lee is a new scar in the Lion King on Broadway. It's Gavin's third role in a Disney show, and we had a chance to talk. It's so good to see you.

G (20:07)

I'm so happy to be here again. It's been eight years.

A (20:10)

I can't believe it. And we still look so young.

G (20:13)

Well, we do haven't aged a bit.

A (20:15)

Oh, my gosh. What was it? It was spongebob last time, right?

G (20:19)

It was spongebob. Yeah. All the Tony bars during the awards season had a fabulous interview with you and it was very exciting.

A (20:26)

And now we're talking Disney.

G (20:27)

Now we're talking Lion King.

A (20:29)

Was this a role that you had looked at before and said, oh, that would be fun? Or I don't know, you know, what was it? What was it about this one, I.

G (20:37)

Gonna say six, seven years ago, just start putting it out there into the world. If ever this role comes up anywhere around the world, I want to be seen. And then I got the powers that be at Disney, found out and so, like, okay, good. Good to know, Gavin. You know, your Disney family. And then last fall, the role came up and I was actually in London because I was doing the world arena tour of Les Misrabes playing thenardier. And so they saw me in London with the creative there. The final callback was in New York on a Tuesday. And Tuesday night, I was flying to Zurich to rejoin the Les Mis arena tour. Did my audition at about 2 o', clock, got home, my wife was literally. We were getting in the car with my suitcase. Take me to the airport to fly to Zurich. And the associate director called from the audition room, said, there's someone would like to speak to you. And so it's like, hello, this is Julie Taymor, originator of everything Lion King. We loved your audition. We'd like you to be our next Scar on Broadway. And I was like, it's my role for a while and I can really find this character. And I already am finding this character, but there's so much to explore. He's so dastardly. Yes.

A (21:59)

What makes Scar so delicious? Like, I know as an audience member, but I don't know as a performer.

G (22:03)

He's just despicable. Every line is sarcastic. Or a new discovery of how it's all about. He wants to be king and he's going to do anything. He's going to kill the king so he can be king. He's awful. And he's got these three idiot hyenas that will do anything he says and his big number. Be prepared. When you've then got 50, an army of 50 hyenas all dancing around you saying, you're going to be king. It's just I've had a moment in Be Prepared. I call it my Evita moment. Because I just. The music's pumping and the hyenas are dancing away, and I just turn to the front and I just feel I'm hitting an Evita pose. Like, Evita like this. Because I'm just like, I'm gonna be king.

A (22:51)

You know what's funny about that role is that every time I've seen the show, I'm like, okay, this time maybe it'll be a little bit nicer to at least the child, right? And I know the story, but I keep hoping it's gonna change somehow. Isn't that funny? Cause he's so awful.

G (23:07)

Yeah, it's fun because, you know, we have fabulous actors playing young Simba. And I just. I'm trying to find places where I'm. I'm talking to him, but I hate his guts. I hate young Simba. And so for no reason, I'm finding places where I can just shove him out the way or poke him. But the young Sim is so oblivious, like, hey, Uncle Scar, what are we gonna do today? And you're just like, get out of my way. And it's so nice to act, being horrible to a little young cub.

A (23:38)

I guess it has to just feel so amazing at the end of the night, though, because, you know, the people that come to see this show all over the world and every the. So everyone's just. They're sitting in it there with you when they come into that theater, you know, it's not like they don't know. You know, they under. Most understand the story, but it's just gotta be amazing to see that.

G (23:58)

What's amazing is I. I'm the first Scar is the first scene after the fabulous opening circle of Life. So I'm downstage, right, singing along in the wings because I'm not in that number, seeing all this magic happen on stage. And three times during the opening, the audience erupt because what they're seeing, the visuals are so delicious. You know, the elephant coming down the aisle, getting up on stage, the giraffes, the pride rock coming out of the ground, seeing the young baby Simba. I mean, the audience has gone wild before I even set foot on stage. So the number ends, blackout. And I get such a buzz that the audience is already cheering. And I come on in a blackout. I find my little white cross on the stage. I have my stick, I have this massive costume, and I just flick my switch, which works the mask that goes vroom. So I get in position in Blackout. They're still cheering, silent. And I just go, voom. And I'm in that mode, and I'm like, here we go, audience. You were all. Everything was joyful. Now I'm about to kill a mouse. The first thing I do is this little shadow mouse comes across and. And with my stick, I poke it, spear it, and my first line is like, life's not fair, is it, to this mouse? And that first line just sets up, oh, you're that guy. I'm Scar on Broadway in the original production of Lion King. How lucky am I?

A (25:25)

Can you say that enough, even?

G (25:26)

Oh, no. I live out in Jersey. So I get on the train, get off at Penn Station, and I walk up 7th and I'm walking towards all the lights of Times Square. And just as I get to 42nd Street, I get to 44th, and I see the massive Lion King sign. And I'm seeing all these tourists, all these people that come to New York to see theatre, to see New York City. And I'm working on Times Square in the best show on Broadway. And I walk into Stage Door, and I can't believe my luck. And let's hope in five years time, I'm still going and I'm still there.

A (26:01)

I have a feeling we'll be right back here. I'll be right here waiting for you.

G (26:05)

And I'll be all bitter and jaded like, oh, that makeup chair drives me mad.

A (26:08)

And that cost you 50 minutes.

G (26:10)

My hips hurt.

A (26:14)

How much joy does it bring you? And what do you do to unwind afterwards? Because I'm assuming, do you do stage door afterwards?

G (26:20)

I do stage door on the days that I haven't got to run for a train.

A (26:23)

Okay, okay.

G (26:24)

That boring regular life, if I miss another New Jersey train, it's another hour. So some days I have to whip out. But the funny thing about many of the characters in Lion King, we're so heavily made up that you can walk out, straight out stage door with a cap on and walk out, and no one would know it was you.

A (26:46)

Right, right, right.

G (26:47)

It's different. You know other shows where you Where I look like this? Yeah, you walk out and they know who you're playing. But then, you know, you go, hi there. Do you enjoy the show? And you start taking Playbills to sign, and you could feel they're a little bit embarrassed. They're like, who did you play? But then when you say Scar, because Scar's such an amazing role, they're like, oh, Scar. Oh, my God, we love Scar. Scar's our Favorite character.

A (27:10)

Okay, Keep signing.

G (27:11)

Yes. Yeah. Can I have a photo? And so you're like, the photos used to. Because they used to be like, who's that random English guy? He was a big cat earlier.

A (27:21)

Oh, how do you unwind after that? Get on the train.

G (27:25)

I get on the train. Yeah. I quite enjoy my half hour train back out to Maplewood, New Jersey. And I read a book or I watch some Netflix and just chill. Cause by the time I get home, wife and kids are already in bed. So I don't really want to because I got to get up for school. For kids, School in the morning, make their pat lunches, you know, real life.

A (27:43)

How do the kids feel about dad being a scar?

G (27:45)

They're always a little. Yeah, they're not theatrical kids. You know, we kind of drag them to go and see shows that me and my wife are really excited about. And they've seen me play weird, mean characters, you know, like Squidward in spongebob and the Grinch at Madison Square Garden and thenardier in Les Mis. They're all pretty down negative characters. But when I was around the dinner table, you know, a good few months ago when I got the role and said, I've got a surprise because I was about to go out and do Les Mis in Europe. So they were sad that I was leaving again for a few months. My next job is in New York City. They were excited about that. That wouldn't be going. And it's. And I pulled up a photo because I'd been down to Epcot and Disney.

A (28:37)

Yeah.

G (28:38)

About five years ago, I actually did a little gig down there for Disney and I'd taken a photo. There's a massive scar with his massive big model of a scar. And I took a photo and I think I posted on his Insta, like, you know, dreams or putting it out there or something like that. And so I pulled up this photo and I said, guess what I'm playing. And I just went like that. And they went, you're playing Scar. So they were, oh, good. So you got some, you got some.

A (29:04)

Kudos for that from the kids.

G (29:06)

But I think they, we saw the show like three years ago in London, the London production. And so they're not rushing to see it because they've seen it, you know.

A (29:14)

Like, oh, you're playing me that way.

G (29:16)

Exactly. And then I then I, you know, FaceTime them from the, from the dressing room on a break in the intermission, and they're like, oh, God, your makeup's fun. And then they're back to their devices. I'm like, oh, okay.

A (29:29)

Well, I'm impressed by you, Gavin. I'm impressed by you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. You're just wonderful. You're wonderful. You really are. Congratulations on an incredible role.

G (29:39)

Thank you. I'm very lucky.

A (29:40)

Yeah, it's wonderful. I can't wait to see you in it. That's gonna do it for this latest episode of the Broadway show Uncut. But there is still plenty more to come. Until next time, I'm Tamsen Fadal.