The Bulwark Podcast: Andrew Weissmann and Michael Weiss – "Valentine's Massacre"
Release Date: February 14, 2025
Host: Tim Miller
Guests: Andrew Weissmann, Michael Weiss

Overview

In this episode of The Bulwark Podcast, host Tim Miller engages in deep discussions with Andrew Weissmann and Michael Weiss, delving into significant developments within the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ) and the Trump administration's foreign policy strategies. The conversation provides a critical analysis of the recent resignations at the DOJ, the implications for the Eric Adams investigation, and the Trump administration's approach to Russia and Ukraine. Notable for its incisive commentary and insider perspectives, the episode offers listeners a comprehensive understanding of the evolving political landscape.

1. DOJ Resignations and the Eric Adams Investigation

Timestamp: 02:26 – 24:45

a. Background of the Resignations

Tim Miller opens the discussion by addressing the mass resignation of six senior DOJ officials in response to an order to drop the investigation into Eric Adams, the Mayor of New York City. Andrew Weissmann, a former FBI General Counsel and current co-host of the MSNBC podcast Main Justice, provides an in-depth analysis of the situation.

Andrew Weissmann [03:00]: "There was a meeting last Friday with Danielle Sassoon and her deputies... Danielle Sassoon says there was laid out a quid pro quo of I will enforce your immigration policy in exchange for dismissing the case."

b. Details of the Incident

Weissmann elaborates on the interactions between Danielle Sassoon, the former U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York, and Emile Beauvais, the acting Deputy Attorney General.

Andrew Weissmann [05:58]: "The directive from Emile Beauvais was to dismiss the case without prejudice... It's like, why would you come up with that fictitious reason why not just go with the truth?"

c. Implications for the DOJ

The resignation of high-ranking officials signals a significant pushback within the DOJ against perceived overreach and improper directives. Weissmann highlights the rarity of such principled stands within federal law enforcement agencies.

Andrew Weissmann [14:31]: "What you are seeing within the Department of Justice ... is a sort of 'I am Spartacus' moment where people are really standing up."

d. Future Consequences and Actions

Weissmann discusses potential outcomes, including possible hearings by Judge Ho, actions by New York Governor Kathy Hochul to remove Mayor Adams, and potential disciplinary actions against Emile Beauvais.

Andrew Weissmann [22:16]: "Kathy Hochul... has the authority to remove the mayor... There's an equally good argument that when the mayor is so conflicted... he is not representing the people who elected him."

2. Transition to Michael Weiss's Segment

Timestamp: 24:45 – 25:19

Tim Miller introduces Michael Weiss, the editor of The Insider and former CNN investigative reporter, who shares insights into the Trump administration's foreign policy, particularly concerning Russia and Ukraine.

3. Trump Administration's Foreign Policy: Russia and Ukraine

Timestamp: 25:19 – 55:20

a. Press Conference Analysis

Michael Weiss critiques the recent bilateral press conferences held by President Trump and his administration officials, highlighting mixed signals and strategic missteps.

Michael Weiss [26:14]: "Hegseth's amateur rookie mistake was to offer everything up to the Russians that they want... foreclosing on the possibility of Ukraine joining NATO."

b. Sanctions and Military Strategy

Discussion revolves around Republican proposals for harsher sanctions on Russia and the current state of Russian military effectiveness in Ukraine.

Michael Weiss [28:43]: "Republicans who are putting forth a suite of possible sanctions against Russia that would really hammer the energy economy... Russia is performing quite poorly right now on the battlefield."

c. Ukrainian Sovereignty and Russian Miscalculations

Weiss emphasizes Ukraine's agency and resilience, countering Russian expectations of swift conformity and highlighting Ukraine's commitment to sovereignty and NATO aspirations.

Michael Weiss [32:33]: "Everybody wants to be part of the EU... There is no Ukrainian politician who's going to emerge to say, we must look eastward once again."

d. Trump's Trust in Putin and Negotiation Tactics

The conversation shifts to President Trump's expressed trust in Vladimir Putin and the implications of seeking back-channel negotiations.

Donald Trump [33:20]: "I believe he wants peace. I believe that President Putin... I trust him on this subject."

Michael Weiss [34:25]: "Trump trusts Putin arguably more so than he does his own ministers and his own intelligence."

e. European Response and NATO Dynamics

Weiss discusses the European Union's defense spending and NATO's role, critiquing Trump's approach to burden-sharing and defense investments.

Michael Weiss [38:35]: "Europe has not really carried its weight in terms of the money, it's not equitable... Europeans are very much in favor of this, which is why... Vandelayen announced... to allow European countries to spend even more on defense."

f. Internal GOP Conflicts and Policy Implications

Analysis of internal conflicts within the Republican Party, particularly with figures like J.D. Vance and Jack Posobiec, and their impact on foreign policy coherence.

Michael Weiss [48:36]: "Vance... his staff really hate Ukraine... he's the most hostile to Ukraine person in the US Government."

g. The Bigger Picture: America's Role and Future Strategy

Weiss provides a strategic overview of America's diminished role and the necessity for Europe to bolster its defenses independently.

Michael Weiss [41:54]: "Ukrainians make this argument... Everything we do is met with security assistance to Ukraine... revitalizing and modernizing our own military."

4. Closing Remarks and Anecdotes

Timestamp: 52:13 – 55:51

The episode concludes with light-hearted banter between Tim Miller and Michael Weiss about personal anecdotes, underscoring the contrast between the serious topics discussed and the human side of podcasting. The episode wraps up with acknowledgments and a brief musical outro related to Valentine's Day.

Michael Weiss [52:28]: "I've got two squawking budgies... permanent teeth magically came in overnight... a menagerie that's deeply dysfunctional."

Notable Quotes

• Andrew Weissmann [05:58]: "You need to make that judgment because it's like, why would you come up with that fictitious reason why not just go with the truth."

• Michael Weiss [26:14]: "Hegseth's amateur rookie mistake was to offer everything up to the Russians that they want, by the way."

• Donald Trump [33:20]: "I believe he wants peace. I believe that President Putin... I trust him on this subject."

• Michael Weiss [41:54]: "The Americans are not just giving money to Ukraine; they are revitalizing and modernizing our own military."

Conclusion

This episode of The Bulwark Podcast offers a profound examination of the internal strife within the DOJ and the Trump administration's fraught foreign policy maneuvers. Through expert analysis and candid discussions, Andrew Weissmann and Michael Weiss provide listeners with a nuanced understanding of the challenges facing American political and legal institutions, as well as the broader implications for international relations and national security.

For more in-depth analysis and expert insights, be sure to subscribe to The Bulwark Podcast and explore additional content on Bulwark Takes for rapid responses to breaking news.

Produced by Katie Cooper with audio engineering and editing by Jason Brown.