The Bulwark Podcast: Nicolle Wallace – "The Silence of Republicans Is the Bigger Threat"

Release Date: June 24, 2025

Hosts:

• Tim Miller – Host of The Bulwark Podcast
• Nicolle Wallace – Host of Deadline White House on MSNBC and The Best People podcast

1. Introduction and Guest Welcome

[00:43 – 01:19]

Tim Miller warmly welcomes Nicolle Wallace to the podcast, expressing excitement about finally turning the microphone on her. Nicolle shares her initial apprehensions about being on the show, noting her limited podcast appearances due to her demanding schedule, which includes hosting Deadline White House, managing a newborn, and engaging in continuous news coverage.

Notable Quote:

• Nicolle Wallace [01:06]: "You've never formally asked me."

2. Current Political Climate and Ceasefire Discussions

[01:19 – 05:13]

The conversation shifts to recent political developments, particularly a temporary ceasefire announcement accompanied by ongoing bombings. Tim Miller shares a TikTok collaboration with Sam Stein discussing these events. They play President Donald Trump's voice addressing his frustration over Israel and Iran not adhering to his announced ceasefire.

Notable Quotes:

• Donald Trump [02:13]: "So we basically have two countries that have been fighting so long and so hard that they don't know what the fuck they're doing. Do you understand that."
• Nicolle Wallace [03:28]: "We have to be careful not to become amnesic. This is a guy who couldn't pull off the egg roll without annihilating norms and ethics laws."

Nicolle expresses skepticism about broadcasting Trump's statements, questioning his understanding of Middle Eastern affairs and highlighting his unpredictable communication style.

3. Analyzing Republican Leadership and Political Shifts

[05:13 – 12:20]

Tim brings up a recent appearance by Senator Lisa Murkowski on Galen Druke's podcast, discussing her reluctance to join or caucus with Democrats even when it could benefit Alaskans. Nicolle critiques Murkowski's stance, suggesting that Republicans like Murkowski represent a fading faction within the party that clings to outdated conservative principles.

Notable Quotes:

• Nicolle Wallace [09:55]: "There is a nostalgia for the old days and a delusion of the snapback theory... it's delusional to think that it's ever going to be what it was when you joined it."

Nicolle argues that the real threat to democracy stems from Republicans who disregard democratic norms and rules, rather than from ideological differences within the party.

4. Personal and Professional Backgrounds

[12:20 – 26:23]

Tim and Nicolle delve into their respective backgrounds in politics. Nicolle recounts her early career as a journalism student at UC Berkeley and her transition into Republican politics, eventually working as Jeb Bush's communications director during Bush's governorship. She shares anecdotes from her time with Jeb Bush, highlighting his amiable nature and dedication to public service.

Notable Quotes:

• Nicolle Wallace [15:13]: "I was a TV news nerd... I just couldn't take it. So I thought, local news isn't for me."
• Nicolle Wallace [24:23]: "He was easy. He's like zero maintenance."

These segments provide insight into Nicolle's evolution from journalism to active political engagement, and her experiences navigating the shifting landscapes of the Republican Party.

5. Media, Political Stress, and Coping Mechanisms

[26:23 – 43:02]

The discussion transitions to the emotional and psychological toll of covering intense political landscapes. Nicolle shares her strategies for handling the stress of witnessing and reporting on political chaos, emphasizing the importance of bearing witness and supporting one's community. Tim relates by sharing his own struggles after the 2020 election and inauguration, finding solace in building connections with his audience.

Notable Quotes:

• Nicolle Wallace [38:53]: "I have found that... just bear witness."
• Nicolle Wallace [41:52]: "We’re tied together... it’s bumpy, and we knew it was going to be bumpy, but we’re all kind of in it together."

They discuss the significance of maintaining authenticity and emotional integrity in media roles, resisting the urge to disengage despite overwhelming challenges.

6. The Impact of MAGA and Republican Policies on Society

[43:02 – 48:17]

Tim and Nicolle explore the influence of the MAGA movement on Republican policies and societal norms. They discuss instances like Matt Gaetz's conflicts within his own family over political stances, illustrating the deep fissures within the party. Nicolle articulates her concern over Republicans enabling anti-democratic practices and the politicization of legal institutions.

Notable Quotes:

• Nicolle Wallace [49:48]: "Trump's biggest political weakness is his indifference to the cost of things."
• Nicolle Wallace [46:27]: "Republicans greenlighting anti-democratic practices."

Nicolle emphasizes the dangers of party silence in the face of unconstitutional actions, underscoring the broader threat to democratic principles.

7. Launch of Nicolle Wallace's New Podcast: The Best People

[48:17 – 53:50]

Nicolle introduces her new podcast, The Best People, explaining her motivation to create a platform that reappropriates the "Best People" brand amid Trump's departure from this standard. She aims to highlight thoughtful and qualified voices that may no longer align with the current Republican branding.

Notable Quotes:

• Nicolle Wallace [50:08]: "I wanted to reappropriate the brand, the Best People, and bring some of the wisdom that I get from people that maybe don't want to come on the show."
• Nicolle Wallace [51:35]: "I think I wanted to be in the space without trying to replicate what I do on the show."

This new venture represents Nicolle's effort to foster meaningful discourse and provide a counter-narrative to the prevailing political rhetoric.

8. Rapid Fire and Final Thoughts

[53:50 – 55:12]

In a light-hearted conclusion, Tim asks Nicolle to select her "Mount Rushmore" of Deadline White House guests. They share playful banter, highlighting key figures from her show and reflecting on their interactions.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Miller [53:32]: "Where he tells me exactly. That's Nicolle Wallace."
• Nicolle Wallace [54:54]: "I love you so much. Thank you so much for having me on the pod."

The episode wraps up with mutual appreciation, reinforcing the collaborative spirit between the hosts.

Key Takeaways and Insights

• Republican Silence as a Threat: Nicolle Wallace posits that the lack of dissent within the Republican Party, especially against anti-democratic actions, poses a significant threat to democratic norms.

• Media's Role in Democracy: Both hosts emphasize the importance of authentic reporting and maintaining emotional integrity amidst political turbulence.

• Personal Resilience: Nicolle shares her coping mechanisms for dealing with political stress, highlighting the importance of community support and bearing witness.

• Evolution of Political Branding: The launch of The Best People podcast signifies a shift towards reclaiming thoughtful political discourse away from sensationalist narratives.

Conclusions

The episode offers a deep dive into the internal struggles within the Republican Party, the challenges faced by media figures in maintaining integrity, and the personal histories that shape Nicolle Wallace's perspectives. Through candid conversation and thoughtful analysis, Tim Miller and Nicolle Wallace shed light on the nuanced threats to democracy and the importance of vocal opposition within political factions.

Note: Advertisements, musical interludes, and non-content segments have been excluded to focus on the substantive discussions between Tim Miller and Nicolle Wallace.