Detailed Summary of "Tommy Vietor: Deniability Is All That Matters" – The Bulwark Podcast | January 30, 2025

In this compelling episode of The Bulwark Podcast, host Tim Miller engages in a robust discussion with Tommy Vietor, co-founder of Crooked Media and former national security staff spokesman during the Obama administration. The conversation spans a wide array of pressing political issues, offering insightful analysis and sharp critiques of recent political events and figures. Below is a comprehensive breakdown of their discussion:

1. Introduction and Current Political Climate

Timestamp: 00:00 - 01:00

Tim Miller opens the episode by highlighting significant ongoing political events:

• Cash Patel and Tulsi Gabbard Hearings: These are taking place simultaneously, indicating a day filled with high-stakes political maneuvering.
• Press Availability with Donald Trump and J.D. Vance: The focus is on Trump's comments regarding a tragic plane crash in Washington.

Miller introduces Tommy Vietor, emphasizing his background with Crooked Media and his expertise in national security.

2. Trump's Reaction to the Washington Plane Crash

Timestamp: 02:10 - 05:26

The discussion shifts to the tragic midair collision outside Reagan National Airport, where Donald Trump attributes the disaster to the Federal Aviation Administration's (FAA) diversity initiatives.

• Trump's Claim:

  "They put A big push to put diversity into the FAA's program. Then another article, the Federal Aviation Administration..." (02:10)

• Miller’s Analysis: Trump suggests that the FAA's diversity hiring, targeting individuals with intellectual and mental health challenges, contributed to the crash. He also criticizes Pete Buttigieg, labeling him a "disaster."

Tommy Vietor's Response:

• First Bucket: Blaming the crash on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) without any investigative findings.
• Second Bucket: Comparing Trump's response to previous administrations, noting the deviation from traditional presidential mourning speeches to more self-centered declarations.

"It's just, this is like the Trump era, right? It used to be you didn't want to own bad stories or disasters, and now he's just puts himself in the middle of everything." (03:25)

Key Insights:

• Vietor Highlights: The lack of meritocracy in appointing reality TV personalities to significant roles and their inability to effectively respond to crises.
• Human Impact: Miller underscores the insensitivity of Trump's remarks to the victims' families, particularly minorities and those with mental health issues.

3. Critique of Biden Administration's Nominees: Cash Patel and Tulsi Gabbard

Timestamp: 11:03 - 39:05

Vietor delves into the qualifications and controversies surrounding current Biden nominees, focusing on Cash Patel and Tulsi Gabbard.

a. Tulsi Gabbard:

• Nomination Concerns: Gabbard's handling of sensitive foreign affairs, particularly her meetings with Syrian President Assad, raises significant ethical questions.

  "She met with Assad's wife and then Assad himself, lying about the spontaneity of these meetings." (21:36)

• Vietor's Critique: Questions Gabbard's ability to manage intelligence briefings and the potential bias in information she might present to Trump.

  "Is she going to bring in credible stuff? Is she going to filter intelligence information to the President in an ideological way?" (25:08)

b. Cash Patel:

• Controversial Actions: Patel's alleged misinformation during a Pentagon mission, nearly jeopardizing a Navy SEAL operation in Nigeria, is a focal point of concern.

  "Cash Patel ... lied about getting access to Nigerian airspace, nearly blowing up a successful rescue mission." (30:16)

• Vietor's Analysis: Highlights Patel's untrustworthiness and lack of relevant experience, questioning his suitability to lead the FBI.

  "He's an unqualified, deeply dishonest person. That seems like a bad thing for an FBI director." (29:40)

Miller’s Observation: Both nominees exhibit a pattern of denial and dishonesty, undermining their credibility and raising doubts about their capability to hold significant governmental positions.

"Republican senators see things happen where they know a nominee that they're about to vote for just lied and don't care." (34:13)

4. Medicaid Reform and Policy Misunderstandings

Timestamp: 11:03 - 13:00

The conversation transitions to Medicaid, with Vietor criticizing Trump’s misunderstanding of the program.

• Trump’s Misstatements: Claims Medicaid has premiums and deductibles, which is largely inaccurate for the majority of beneficiaries.

  "Medicaid is not working for Americans... premiums are too high, the deductibles are too high." (12:21)

• Vietor's Response: Emphasizes the federal-state funding structure of Medicaid and Trump’s lack of understanding of its fundamental aspects.

  "Medicaid is fully paid for by a combination of federal and state funds." (13:00)

Key Takeaway: Misrepresenting Medicaid not only undermines public understanding but also hampers effective policy reform discussions.

5. Foreign Aid Freeze: Implications and Consequences

Timestamp: 39:14 - 44:05

Miller and Vietor analyze the administration's fluctuating stance on foreign aid and its potential fallout.

• Aid Freeze Details: The administration's inconsistent policies—freezing, rescinding, and unfreezing aid—create uncertainty, particularly in critical areas like anti-AIDS programs (PEPFAR) in Africa.

  "They're going to cut all USAID... undermining our soft power and influence globally." (40:08)

• Vietor's Analysis: Highlights the strategic importance of foreign aid in combating global health crises and maintaining geopolitical influence, especially against China's expanding footprint.

  "PEPFAR is George Bush's greatest accomplishment... cutting it would remove our influence in critical regions." (40:31)

Impact Assessment: The aid freeze not only disrupts essential health programs but also diminishes U.S. influence in regions where China is actively expanding its presence through infrastructure and aid.

6. Democratic Party Strategy and Messaging

Timestamp: 44:16 - 59:36

Vietor provides a critical evaluation of the Democratic Party's current strategies and suggests ways to enhance their political effectiveness.

a. Messaging Critique:

• Current Approach: Emphasizes collaboration and common ground, which Vietor argues is ineffective in the current opposition landscape.

  "These Democrats are an opposition party with no power... you have to act accordingly and raise the awareness and the cost of some of the most egregious things Trump is doing." (46:27)

• Suggested Shift: Focus on aggressive opposition to Trump’s policies rather than seeking common ground, to better resonate with voters and media.

  "Be interesting, talk like a human being, pick a fight, go into places that are unusual so that whatever you're doing gets shared on social media." (47:50)

b. Leadership Void:

• Vietor's Observation: The Democratic leadership lacks a charismatic and assertive figure to galvanize the party and effectively oppose Republican maneuvers.

  "There is not a Democratic leader... there's not a nominee." (50:07)

Recommendations:

• Democrats should adopt more combative and distinctive messaging strategies.
• Highlight and escalate their opposition to key Republican policies to increase visibility and voter engagement.

7. Crypto Market and Democratic Engagement

Timestamp: 54:58 - 59:36

The conversation briefly touches on the cryptocurrency market, with Vietor expressing frustrations over missed financial opportunities and discussing the need for regulation.

• Crypto Critique: Vietor laments the prevalence of fraudulent activities within the crypto space, such as rug pulls and Ponzi schemes, while acknowledging the aspirational aspects that attract users.

  "Trump coin thing and how this whole thing is just like such an obvious fraud... it's a Ponzi scheme." (57:05)

• Democratic Opportunity: Suggests Democrats capitalize on the anti-establishment sentiment within crypto by promoting regulatory measures that protect consumers while acknowledging the innovative potential of blockchain technologies.

  "Capture part of the aspirational narrative while also addressing the fraudulent aspects." (58:15)

Strategic Insight: Balancing the regulation of crypto to prevent fraud while fostering innovation could position Democrats as protectors of both consumer interests and technological advancement.

8. Search for Hope in Global Leadership

Timestamp: 59:36 - 61:21

In a lighter segment, Vietor discusses global leaders he admires, though both participants express skepticism about finding truly inspiring figures amidst current international turmoil.

• Preferred Leaders:
  • Anthony Albanese (Australia): Noted as a positive but lacks detailed discussion.
  • David Lammy (UK Foreign Secretary): Mentioned without extensive elaboration.

Conclusion: While global leadership presents challenges, identifying and supporting competent and ethical leaders remains crucial for international stability and progressive policies.

9. Closing Remarks and Final Thoughts

Timestamp: 62:11 - 63:35

Miller and Vietor wrap up the episode by reflecting on the necessity of persistent and strategic opposition within the Democratic Party to effectively counter Republican narratives and policies.

• Vietor's Final Insight: Emphasizes the importance of obstruction and strategic moves to safeguard Democratic interests and maintain political influence.

  "Obstruction works. Mitch McConnell built an entire career off of that." (51:51)

• Miller’s Acknowledgment: Recognizes the value in Vietor’s strategic recommendations and underscores the ongoing struggle within Democratic messaging and leadership.

Closing Quote:

"Let's come together, Libs. We can do this. We're going to make it through this." (63:15)

Notable Quotes:

• Trump on FAA Diversity:

  "They put A big push to put diversity into the FAA's program..." (02:10)

• Vietor on Trump's Communication Style:

  "It's just how communications is now... this is the Trump era." (04:26)

• Vietor on Tulsi Gabbard’s Qualifications:

  "Why her? No one can answer the question why does this person make sense for this job other than some kind of payback for a political favor?" (25:08)

• Miller on Democratic Strategy:

  "If Republicans are going to vote for this guy anyway, are we sure that giving a speech that goes on YouTube or TikTok isn't a better use of time?" (35:27)

• Vietor on Obstruction as Strategy:

  "Obstruction works. Mitch McConnell built an entire career off of that." (51:51)

Conclusion

This episode of The Bulwark Podcast offers a sharp and critical examination of the current political landscape, highlighting the inadequacies and missteps of both Republican and Democratic strategies. Tommy Vietor provides valuable insights into the flaws of Trump’s responses to crises, the questionable qualifications of Biden's nominees, and the Democratic Party's need for a more aggressive and engaging strategy. The discussion underscores the complexities of modern political communication and the urgent need for effective opposition to safeguard liberal democracy.

Listeners gain a nuanced understanding of the interplay between political narratives, leadership decisions, and policy implementations, all delivered with Vietor's seasoned perspective and Miller's incisive questioning.

This summary encapsulates the key discussions and insights from the episode, providing a thorough overview for those who have not listened.