Two American Soldiers Killed as Trump’s Iran War Spirals

Summary

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Episode Overview

Theme:
This emergency episode of The Bulwark, hosted by Sam Stein with guest retired Lt. General Mark Hertling, centers on the escalation of the U.S.-Iran conflict, following the deaths of two U.S. service members at a base in Jordan. The discussion dissects the significance of the attack, the strategic importance of Jordan, the increasing intensity of hostilities in the region, and the challenges faced by U.S. and allied forces as the war intensifies and options for de-escalation dissipate.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Latest Attack and Immediate Impact

• [00:00–01:10]

  • Sam Stein opens with the news: Two more U.S. service members killed in Jordan, bringing total U.S. losses in the Iran war to 16. The soldiers died at Malafak Salty Air Base after a confirmed attack—one more is missing, several others wounded.
  • This tragedy is contextualized as a foreboding development amid a war now spiraling with no clear path toward de-escalation.

• Quote:

  • "It's obviously horrible. It is, frankly... pretty foreboding, honestly, because this comes amid the falling apart, the absolute dismantling of the memorandum, understanding with Iran, the escalation of hostilities and frankly, as it becomes harder and harder to see any de-escalatory path out of this." — Sam Stein [00:37]

The Strategic Importance of Jordan

• [01:11–03:13] – Mark Hertling:

  • Explains the critical location of Malafak Salty Air Base near Azraq, eastern Jordan—strategically positioned near the Iraqi and Saudi borders and not far from Israel.
  • Describes the base as a coalition airbase, a hub for U.S. Air Force operations (fighters, ISR aircraft, tankers), as well as special operations forces.
  • Explains that Iran didn’t randomly target Jordan; the intent is to hit both U.S. operational capacity and alliance capabilities—not necessarily to harm Jordan directly.

• Quote:

  • "If I were explaining this, I'd say Iran didn't randomly select Jordan because this is an operational hinge. They're not trying to hurt Jordan. They're trying to hurt the US and the alliances we have and our potential to not only conduct operations in Iran, but also to support operations in Israel and Lebanon." — Mark Hertling [02:48]

Details of the Recent Attacks

• [03:13–04:42] – Sam Stein:
  • Reads from The New York Times: Outlines a series of attacks—King Fasal Air Base (five wounded), hit on U.S. Blackhawk helicopters, missile strike on Malafak Salty Air Base (20 wounded but no deaths in that barrage), culminating in the fatal Friday strike.
  • Plays (verbally describes) videos showing the violence and effectiveness of the attacks and interceptor attempts.

The Nature of the Attack & Defense Failures

• [04:42–06:39] – Mark Hertling:

  • Reviews video evidence and estimates the explosives used (~200 pounds, much more powerful than typical mortar or rocket attacks in Iraq).
  • Warns of traumatic brain injuries (“not just headaches”) among “returned to duty” service members, highlighting how such injuries are downplayed at official levels.
  • Clarifies (from video analysis) that the attack likely used drones due to their slower descent, not missiles.
  • Details why interceptors are less effective: Iran’s attacks have damaged U.S. and allied radar and command/control nodes; increased volume and frequency of attacks are overwhelming fixed defensive systems.

• Quote:

  • "What Iran is attempting to do is overwhelm the defensive measures. You can only fire two or three at any given time against a missile. So if you shoot four or five missiles or five or six drones at one location and do it sequentially, it's just going to overwhelm the systems that are defending it." — Mark Hertling [07:21]

The Broader Escalation (Beyond Jordan)

• [07:42–08:51] – Sam Stein:

  • Cites broader regional escalation: continuous U.S. nighttime bombing of Iranian sites for seven days straight; Iranian retaliations not only in Jordan but also attacks on a U.S. base in Saudi Arabia and an oil facility in Kuwait (which caused injuries).
  • Notes U.S. striking Iranian infrastructure—particularly desalination plants—impacting tens of thousands (water shortages) and causing civilian disruption.

• Quote:

  • "What the hell's going on?" — Sam Stein [08:50]

Analyzing U.S. Military Strategy in the Escalation

• [08:51+] – Mark Hertling:
  • Breaks the conflict into three phases:
    1. Phase One: U.S. tried to “blind” Iran—destroying radar, air defense networks, command, airplanes, and arms caches.
    2. Phase Two: Focus on degrading military capabilities—launchers, drone bases, aircraft, IRGC facilities—to reduce Iran’s offensive options.
    3. Transcript ends mid-explanation before phase three is detailed.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the emotional and human toll:
  • "Not just the service members, but their families, too, because anyone that's assigned in Jordan, their families know where they are more than likely." — Mark Hertling [01:12]
• On the shock and trauma of attacks:
  • "That's going to spill your coffee. And what I'd also say is for the Injured that are returned to duty... this is going to cause some traumatic brain injuries and some concussions." — Mark Hertling [05:37]
• On defensive challenges:
  • "You can't say, hey, we're going to defend here today and defend here tonight and defend here tomorrow and get everything coming in at the same time." — Mark Hertling [07:05]
• On humanitarian consequences:
  • "Iranian authorities, officials in Iran said about 10,000 people are facing water shortages because of those hits to bridges, roaches and desalinization plants." — Sam Stein [08:38]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:00–01:10 — Breaking news: Two more U.S. troops killed, conflict background
• 01:11–03:13 — Why Jordan is a key target, strategic analysis
• 03:13–04:42 — Recap of a week’s attacks, U.S. and Iranian actions, video descriptions
• 04:42–06:39 — Analysis of attack footage, weapons used, inadequacy of defenses
• 07:42–08:51 — Escalation beyond Jordan: regional context, humanitarian fallout

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Tone & Style

The conversation is urgent, clear-eyed, and detailed, mixing military analysis with emotional awareness and a sense of foreboding about the future. Both speakers prioritize accuracy, personal experience, and a strong sense of the gravity facing service members and their families.

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Summary prepared for listeners who haven’t heard the episode. For the latest insights and community discussion, visit The Bulwark.

Transcript

[A]

Hey everybody, it's me, Sam Stein, managing out at the Bulwark. I am joined by Mark Hurtling, who is here on a Saturday afternoon, 5pm or so. We're coming to you kind of in an emergency setting because news is broken earlier today about the death of two additional U.S. service members in the war that we are engaged in with Iran. That brings the number of service members, according to New York Times, who have died in the war, up to 16. These two service members were killed in Jordan after an attack on the base there. Seccom confirmed it. And look, it's obviously horrible. It is horrible. It is, frankly. And Mark, you can take over here. It's pretty foreboding, honestly, because this comes amid the falling apart, the absolute dismantling of the memorandum, understanding with Iran, the escalation of hostilities and frankly, as it becomes harder and harder to see any de escalatory path out of this. But let's start with the service members. Mark, you've lived through this and I just sort of would love to hear your thoughts on what people in the service must be going through, the horrors they're going through right now.

[B]

Well, yeah, Sam, not just the service members, but their families, too, because anyone that's assigned in Jordan, their families know where they are more than likely. But what CENTCOM reported was the death of two. There's another service member that's still missing and they talked about the wounded that were returned to duty and some had minor injuries. But we'll show the film, I think, in a minute. But this all occurred at the Malafak Salty Air Base, which is in Jordan. It's near a town called Azraq in eastern Jordan, which is about 60 miles west of the Iraqi border. And it's part of the rat line that goes from Syria through Jordan into Iraq. It's about 25 miles from the Saudi border as well. But if you were to see the map of this area, it's not only a strategically important coalition air base because of what's going on now in Iran, but it's also very close to Israel from a military perspective. Mafu AQ Salty matters, because, yeah, it's a airbase of one of our partners, Jordan, but it's also a forward operating location for U.S. air Force fighters in intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance aircraft, tankers, which are especially important when you're talking about the long legs from the Middle east and the Levant to Iran. But it also has special operations forces there. It's one of, in my view, one of the principal hubs supporting the operations over both Iraq and Syria, and it's a critical node for CENTCOM operations throughout the Gulf. So if I were explaining this, I'd say Iran didn't randomly select Jordan because this is an operational hinge. They're not trying to hurt Jordan. They're trying to hurt the US and the alliances we have and our potential to not only conduct operations in Iran, but also to support operations in Israel and Lebanon.

[A]

Yeah, you got ahead of a question I was about to ask, which is why. Why Jordan seems to be such a focal point right now for these attacks. You mentioned the troops who have been hurt in addition to those who have been killed. I'm just going to read from the Times, and then I want to show the video. The first attack to hit forces in Jordan struck a residential facility at the King Fasal Air Base, wounding as many as five US Service members. Second hit a base in eastern Jordan where the US Blackhawk helicopters were operating from damaging a significant number of them. Then, 48 hours ago, Iranian missiles hit the hit Jordan's Malak Salti Air Base in Azra, which is the same base where the troops were killed on Friday, which we referenced, the earlier strike wounded about 20 troops. U.S. troops rushing to take cover in bunkers. No one was killed in that barrage. But on Friday, when the Iranians struck the base again, two U.S. troops were killed and four other service members were injured. That's according to U.S. officials. Let's play two videos in a row. Let's play the one to show sort of just how violent the hit was and how dramatic it was. And then we'll play the one with the interceptors. Jesus. Okay, and here's the interceptors.

[B]

You can see in this one, the interceptors going up. And there's a mingling of both the interceptors and the. And the. Either missiles or drones coming down. And then you see the strike pattern of the two hits. I would guess that's probably about two or three kilometers away. And it's some pretty good explosions.

[A]

Let's talk about the first one, the first explosion, because I don't think people would usually get that type of footage.

[B]

It was close, Sam. And I also think it was very large. I mean, I'm not a explosive ordnance demolitions expert, but I would say that's at least 200 pounds worth of explosive. That's more than you're going to get. Certainly on what I experienced in Iraq is mortar rounds or even rockets that were fired at bases. That's going to spill your coffee. And what I'd also say is for the Injured that are returned to duty. I'm hearkening back to when President Trump said a couple of years ago when a base was hit in Iraq, he said, oh, yeah, they're just a couple of headaches. No, no, no, this is going to cause some traumatic brain injuries and some concussions.

[A]

Forgive me for my ignorance here, but what is Iran firing here? Are those missiles? Are those drones? Are those drones with some explosive technology on them? What exactly do you think they're firing at the base?

[B]

It looked like, and this is just a guess on my part, those were drones because of the slow movement toward the ground. If you had true missiles coming in, they'd be coming in a whole lot faster.

[A]

And why did the interceptors not. Obviously, nothing's infallible and things will get through. But in this case, it appears, of course, to reporting that the interceptors are not getting as much, that they're. That the rate of interception is declining significantly.

[B]

Yeah, and I think that's because Iran has destroyed a lot of the radar systems for incoming missiles. They've also destroyed some of the command and control, the guys inside the vans who are pushing the buttons. But they're also, from what I can see in that video, they're trying to overwhelm the defensive systems. When you have air defense, it's something you can't move them around, around a lot. So it's a point defense. And you can't say, hey, we're going to defend here today and defend here tonight and defend here tomorrow and get everything coming in at the same time. Any kind of air base is going to have good defensive measures around it, especially with that amount of U.S. aircraft using that Mafua base. But I would suspect that what Iran is attempting to do is overwhelm the defensive measures. You can only fire two or three at any given time against a missile. So if you shoot four or five missiles or five or six drones at one location and do it sequentially, it's just going to overwhelm the systems that are defending it.

[A]

Let's back up a little bit because what we've had now is a aggressive escalation of hostilities. Over the past seven days, we've had nighttime bombing of Iranian sites by US Forces. For seven days in a row, we've had Iranian retaliation, not just in Jordan. There was a. I'm going through the list here. A ballistic missile launched at a US Base in Saudi Arabia. The Iranians struck a vital oil facility in Kuwait, which you could see from satellite imagery was burning oil workers. Oil sector workers were injured there. And then on the US Side, we have now taken to going after desalination plants in southern Iran. There is questions about how aggressively we're doing that, but Iranian authorities, officials in Iran said about 10,000 people are facing water shortages because of those hits to bridges, roaches and desalinization plants. Mark, what the hell's going on?

[B]

Yeah, what we've seen, Sam, I'll break it into three phases. Early in the war, the first phase is the US Was trying to blind the opponent and destroy radar, integrated air defense command networks, airplanes, locations of arms caches. In phase two, the US Was trying to destroy military capabilities, the launchers, the drone bases, the ammunition depots, the aircraft, IRGC facilities, the Republican Guard, Navy. And that's reducing Iran's offensive capacity. It didn't work real well because Iran is a big country, and they.