← Everything Is Energy with Cathy Heller
Everything Is Energy with Cathy Heller
Monica Berg on Manifestation, Desire & the Kabbalistic Path to Certainty Beyond Logic
00:59:35
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- [00:00]
Kathy Heller
I want to share something that I've learned recently. It turns out that clarity is its own kind of power. I softened into the truth and that changed everything. I stopped saving seats in my life for people who preferred the dimmed version of me. And now the room just feels different. I chose peace without guilt. I chose joy without explanation. And my whole frequency rewrote itself. When you stop performing and you start receiving, the whole world shifts around you. There's a version of me who stopped caring what wasn't hers.
- [00:26]
Monica Berg
And.
- [00:27]
Kathy Heller
And that's who you're hearing from right now. If you're in this season, choose yourself. Choose your joy. Choose the life that actually feels like yours. And come join me. Come be a part of my membership. We're doing a special Black Friday deal this week where you can try the membership for one week for just $1. This is the space where you wake up different. This is the space where you shift your energy every single morning. This is the place where you stop abandoning yourself and start creating from the version of you who knows that she is a masterpiece. A piece of the master. Go to kathyheller.com life to get your one week trial of the membership for just $1. Hey guys, it's Kathy Heller. Welcome back to the Kathy Heller Podcast. I hope that you had a beautiful weekend. I had a really good holiday because for the first time in as far as I can remember I decided not to self abandon this holiday. I decided that so many Thanksgivings I have spent feeling very grateful and at the same time just really feeling obligated to make sure that every single person is okay. And even if it comes at the expense of my own well being. And this holiday I did not do that. And it's amazing, it's truly amazing that we can set down this part of us that wants to over function this part of us that feels that we have to perform and show up a certain way. And it's just amazing how good life can be when we just stop betraying ourselves. So if you needed to hear that, I hope it gives you permission to just keep remembering that you have to put the oxygen mask on yourself first. And also I'm excited because this coming Tuesday I'm teaching a masterclass on this month. We are now in the month of Sagittarius, which on the Hebrew calendar is the month of Kislev. That's the name of this month in the Hebrew. And I'm going to be teaching you all about the energy of Sagittarius. And why is this the month that we can tap into the energy of miracles. It's so cool. And if you want to join us, you can go to kathyheller.com life and you can join us. This class is happening on Tuesday and if you register before Monday night, you can still get in our Black Friday deal, which means you can join for only a dollar, which also gives you a trial of my membership for the week. So come on and grab that. Go to kathyheller.com life so today is going to be a delightful conversation. I'm joined by Monica Berg. She is an international speaker. She's a best selling author of 50 Fear is Not an Opinion, Rethink Love and the Gift of Being Different. She also co hosts the popular podcast Spiritually Hungry with her husband Michael Berg. It's an incredible show where they have down to earth conversations about the big life questions that spark your curiosity the most. So definitely go take a listen. Monica is known for her gift of translating thousands of years of Kabbalistic wisdom into accessible, practical guidance for living a life of purpose, connection and abundance. She brings both fear, fierce honesty and deep compassion to every conversation. And today she shares some of her most powerful teachings on desire, receiving and the spiritual art of becoming. I could have talked with her for hours. We speak such similar languages when it comes to this kind of Kabbalistic idea and thought and I love that we could go layers and layers deeper. You're going to just love her and learn so much from this. So without further ado, please welcome the remarkable Monica Berg.
- [04:10]
Interviewer
Monica Berg, I am so happy to have you on. I had the absolute pleasure, the schut, the merit to be in the room several times now and listen to you channel so much beauty. And I have been in this world as you have for several decades and it's so rare to be with someone who embodies it as much as they speak it. And I am so impressed with your goodness, with your chain, with just the fire in you. And I also told you you happen to be a fashion icon and I'm telling you it like God is so smart in the way like people are chosen for roles because your ability to also synthesize values that come from Kabbalah, come from Torah, come from like thousands of years of wisdom, but then always relate it to like a book you just read or a movie you just saw or a song that you love is so important and makes it so accessible. And just the fact that you have such a willingness to be so vulnerable all the time and just whatever's coming through, you're gonna Break into song, you're gonna break into tears. I just think it's like, it's really special. And I'm really just happy to have you here.
- [05:37]
Monica Berg
Thank you so much. I mean, really, you're touching my heart. And I think that with all the kind things you just said about me, I'm just getting to know you, but I can see that they're in you too, because we can't recognize in something. Something in someone else and appreciate it unless we also have that in us as well. So I'm excited to talk to you today.
- [05:58]
Interviewer
Thank you. Me too. Oh, my gosh. So there's so much that I want to cover, but I feel like people love something that's like 45 minutes or less because they want to feel the satisfaction that they completed it. So we're going to do as much as we can in the next 40ish minutes. Okay, so first of all, what was it for you personally that led you to immerse yourself in the study of Kabbalah?
- [06:21]
Monica Berg
Well, it's interesting. I can give you a 1% answer, and I probably will, but I think that part of who I am and always have been is I'm super curious and I give myself a lot of emotional feedback. So I didn't know what that word was when I was little, but I knew for sure that we didn't come to this world to suffer for no reason at all. And I actually don't believe in suffering, but I think that pain has a unique purpose, but we're not meant to stay there. So as things happen to me in life, and even before they did, I always had questions like, why are we here? What is the point of living? Not that I was depressed, not that I didn't want to live, but just why? Why? So that question was always there. And then I did experience pain. And then I guess that was the big opening for me. My parents had been studying Kabbalah. My grandmother was the first to study. And there was a Kabbalah center a block from where we lived. And at first I rejected it, and then my father took me on a trip to Israel, and there was a Kabbalah center event there, and it was Passover. So my father said, well, we have to do the Seder. We were very secular in. But that was something that we did. And it was just like coming home. It was truly like coming home. Things that I had asked about, but also things I hadn't contemplated, like reincarnation, just were automatic. I just knew it. And I knew that I had rediscovered Something that was in me all along. So I almost feel, and actually I do believe that we all have this knowing inside of us. It's just how available do we make ourselves to ourselves to be able to hear that message, hear that calling. And that's why some people find the wisdom early, like I did when I was 17. And some people find it when they're 50 or 60 or never, depending on how much access they have to themselves and want to make meaning of not just their life, but all of the things that happened, the gifts and also the challenges.
- [08:21]
Interviewer
That's so beautiful. I love that your grandmother is the first one. And I love that there's like a strong woman that is part of this story. It's such a cool response. I don't think I've heard that.
- [08:33]
Monica Berg
I don't think I've like, she was the ultimate matriarch. She passed a year ago, lived until she was 96. Just a force and.
- [08:43]
Interviewer
Yeah, and everybody followed and just love that so much. I started studying all kinds of spiritual wisdom when I was like 18, 19. I was reading Martin Buber and reading about Siddhartha and the path of Buddhism and kind of comparing Moses and Siddhartha and thinking, oh, they both grew up in a palace and they went into the wilderness. Like, this is so interesting. And then I went to Jerusalem on just what I thought was a three week trip. But I stayed for three years. But I remember feeling as though somebody hit Control, alt, delete on the program and gave me a new software update. And I was looking at the world through new lenses. And I want you to talk about so much of what I've heard you talk about is this concept and you just related to it, you know, suffering. I heard a rabbi once say that pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional. And one of the things about new lenses that I felt I got, which I'd love for you to talk about, is I stopped seeing the world through an illusion and I started seeing the world with reality as a capital R. What is reality through a spiritual. This lens? And it, it took away a lot of, just the edges of, of suffering. And it gave so much purpose and so much meaning and just actually was the most joy filled way of living my life. And so when I recently just had the, the blessing of spending Rosh Hashanah with you, one of the things that really is central is this idea of like just seeing with certainty beyond logic, beyond the illusion. Can you talk about that? Because I think that really changes our relationship with things that we currently feel are our aspects of suffering, I think it really changes. It really helps us plug into the electricity and bring so much more joy and so much more synchronicity into our life.
- [10:42]
Monica Berg
So, yes, I want to unpack all of this. I want to rewind just a little bit to what you shared about what the rabbi told you. There is truth 100% in that, that we will all experience pain, but suffering is optional. I think there's another layer to that, especially with a kabbalistic lens, that how we view pain and how we experience pain is also meant to change. So if you're really doing the work and living the wisdom, then what was painful before is not painful anymore. Of course there are aspects of pain, but as the ego becomes diminished through the work, then your relationship with pain and challenges and disappointment changes completely. So then that leads into certainty beyond logic, because how do you get there? Right? So certainty beyond logic. And it's not. I think we have to define what certainty is because, you know, like Tony Robbins will describe it one way. It's like, you know, for sure this is gonna. I'm certain, you know, most of us, right? I'm certain this is going to happen. This is what I want and I believe in it. I'm going to manifest it. That's not what we're talking about. Certainty is that all indication points to this is not going to happen. This does not make sense. And still you push with desire, but also an openness that wherever you end up is ultimately the best, right? So certainty beyond logic means I know this is going to be the best thing for matter how it turns out. And then what we need to get to the other side of is how do we feel about that thing, right? So often I say the process is the purpose. It's everything that you learn along the way that ultimately becomes the purpose, not what you thought or intended the purpose to be. And when you go through life like that, then you're never really in pain, you're never really disappointed because there is this deep knowing that you are connected to your source and there's something greater in this world that you are attached to, that knows more than you do. No matter how hard we try, we're living in physical bodies. We live in a very physical existence. And therefore we are going to be influenced by our five senses. Sight, smell, taste, all these things are going to direct us in one way or another, right? The 99 world is all of the other things like empathy, compassion, kindness, purpose. And the more that you feed that, the more you're tapped into that the more clarity you have and then you're able to really see things as they truly are, your perception changes completely.
- [13:12]
Interviewer
It's such a huge mic drop and it really is not something that we are fed. It's really so beautiful when you start to align yourself with what you were just saying, that, yes, we've all heard this idea of certainty. Like, I'm certain X is going to happen. That's my, you know, I'm going to manifest it through the certainty that this is going to happen exactly this way. And really so often when we check in with our soul, the things that we thought we wanted were coming from a part of us that had outsourced a sense of our worthiness or validation. Like I want this person's approval or I want to have this achievement and I'm certain of it. And like when you let go and the certainty you have is that you will be always at the right place at the right time according to your divine assignment, all of a sudden, that level of certainty, it takes you out of trying to control right, what it is that you think is best for you. And we all have a zillion of these stories, literally, like micro moments, macro moments. But I recently told one the other day, which I hadn't told you, which was just that when I went to Jerusalem in The summer of 2001, in June of 2001, my sister, who was living in New York City, older than me, working at the World Trade center at the time, I was like, you should come with me to Israel. I'm just going to go, I don't know, six months, three months, whatever. I had just graduated college. And she's like, well, I'm an actor, I'm doing Broadway tours. I have the perfect job that lets me work here, then go on tour. I can't leave this job because it's so hard to find another one. And of course we know what happened is that she came with me and instead of being in the second tower, literally three months later, she was standing with me in Jerusalem. We were actually, that day, buying our first cell phone on Confineshrm, like in Jerusalem, like at a cell phone store, looking at the horror of what was happening on tv. And at first we thought it was more local, we thought we were looking at Tel Aviv. And then we found out it was Manhattan. And in a moment we realized that her choice to come with me, and by the way, she was thinking it was going to be so dangerous because this was during the second Intifada. And she wasn't wrong to have that fear. And again, there's a zillion examples of this. Like I, that's not the one and only from my life, but I thought about it the other day, like that is such a quantum leap, right? And at the time, if you wouldn't surrender the reins of what you think you're meant to control or what you think is your destiny, right? She might not have left because she graduated from Tisch and NYU and she had a certain goal and a certain dream and she was so certain and all this stuff and she thought this was going to pull her off her timeline and there's just such bigger dreams waiting for us. And so I think that this is not talked about enough. That certainty is the certainty that God's running the world and that you get to trust that.
- [16:15]
Kathy Heller
Right?
- [16:16]
Interviewer
And that is epic. And that is not what we're taught in school and that is not what most of the well meaning adults around us talk about. And so it's just so major. I can't underscore what you just said enough. And I really want to make sure people really heard what you just said.
- [16:32]
Monica Berg
Such a powerful story. I always bring it back to this. I think we have to know our why. Why is it that we pursue the things that we want? And more than that, because we might think we know, we have to keep checking that our why aligns with our soul. Now if you're not in touch with your soul, then you're never really going to have that real conversation with yourself. It's important at every step of your life. Because this is part of the problem with the way our reality is set. We have a lot of goals that are set by our parents. Well meaning, of course, but especially if there's not a spiritual home. They're going by what they know and how they were raised by society, by what the world tells us. It's important. That means go to school, get a good education so you can find a great job, get married, have children, you know, buy a house, get security. And now you find yourself probably at 50 and you've amassed these things. Maybe you haven't, right? So there's still the struggle there. But let's say you have. And then you're saying, but wait, am I happy? I have all these things, but why do I have all these things? It becomes the thing that actually enslaves us. And then we stop asking the question of what do I want? We stop growing, we stunt ourselves, and then we're really unhappy. And what happens to the next 50 years? And that part Sounds really depressing for most people, right? You don't have a lot to look forward to, especially, you know, I think for my mother and I think her generation, you know, like, oh God, gray hairs, menopause, like you don't want any of these things. It's all downhill from there, right? My thing is this, and this is why I talk about it so passionately. It's up to us to keep asking, what is the why? So the story about your sister, why did she want those things? Why was she so invested? And I have to stay on this course because I can't lose time. If I deviate from this plan, then what? Well, whose why? Was it? Was it something parents told her she should do? Was it something she thought would make her happy? Was it something she thought would get her to the next thing? We have to know our why. And when we know that, then we can more clearly say, okay, well, this isn't really what I want, or this isn't really aligned with who I'm becoming or the person I want to be five years from now doesn't really want that, or ten years from now. I mean, even picking a partner, right? I always say, forget about where you are today. Imagine who you want to be five years from now, 10 years from now, and pick a partner based on that, right? At least you know where you're going and you can grow together. I remember when I was 17 and I wanted to go to Israel and I was saving up money, I was working on my own, and my father, it was very dangerous there, he did not want me to go. And we went to my father in law, kabbalist Rav Berg, who found the center with his wife Karen. And we both respected him. He was my, my teacher, my first teacher, even at that age. And so I said to my father, you know what, let's ask the Rabb what you what he thinks. If he thinks it's safe for me to go, I'll go. And if he doesn't, then I'll stay like you want. And he thought it was a great idea because he was sure the Rob would agree with him. As a father, you know, it's not safe. So we go over and we asked the question, say I want to go to Israel. My father thinks it's not safe, but we both agreed that whatever you think is what we'll do. So. So the Rav turns to my father, his name was Abe. He said, you know, Abe, if you're asking me if you should go, I'd say no, absolutely not. But Monica, she has certainty, so I think she should absolutely go. And we look at each other and we made a deal to. Honestly, to my father's praise, he was like, okay, we made the deal. You can go. But that's the kind of. It's more. What are you tapped into and what is your why? I mean, we found ourselves in Israel with my daughter's bat mitzvah just during this last war. And the siren started at 4 in the morning the night we got there. And I didn't have fear. I didn't have fear. Even when we were in a car and there was no shelter and the bomb was coming directly to our car, I didn't have fear. Why? Because I knew my why. I still felt like us going there, we did it for the right reasons. I felt like I'm living the life I meant to. And I felt like if it was my time to go, I had that much trust in the Creator, that that's the time. It's a different way to live honestly. And I hope I'm articulating it, because it's. It's really freedom, ultimately. It's freedom.
- [20:36]
Interviewer
Yeah. Wow. There's so much in what you just said. I feel like so often part of what this, you know, the root of this is do we have. And you said it like, do we have a relationship with our souls?
- [20:50]
Kathy Heller
Why? Right?
- [20:52]
Interviewer
And I think for me, the first mic drop. My rabbi, Rabbi David Aaron, who lives in the old city of Jerusalem, is the, you know, sort of McCarvey. I've been studying with him for so long, and the first thing that, like, changed my life is he said to me, you're someone. You're some of the one. You're a masterpiece. You're a piece of the master. I said, what did you just say? He's like, you're a divine soul, right? Kathy is an avatar. But what's inside of you, what's pouring through you, that's lasting, that was you, is you will be you. Right? Is a very unique aspect of the Creator of the universe. And what I realized then, and I want to just name it because you said it at the beginning, and now that I'm 46, what I realized then, I was 21 then, is where everyone else was looking to, you know, amass certain achievements and piles of things. And whatever those goals were, my goal became, and it still is before the sun sets today, how much closer can I be to my soul? How much closer to God could I get today? And it never fails to bring me to tears because the Noise and the pressure and the ridiculousness of what we think we have to do to find some sense of whatever, feelings of enoughness, feelings of whatever. And meanwhile, it's always those hidden little jewels of moments where you, you know, I remember asking Rabbi Aaron, while I was living in the old city, I'm like, what's the most spiritual thing I can do? You know, is there a mikvah? Is there a thing? And like, obviously there's all those things. And I remember he said to me, he hands me an address, he says, this woman is a widow, knock on her door, ask to do her dishes. He's like, I think that's it for today. That's the most spiritual thing you can do. And I just wept, right? And we miss out. Like, the reason, yes, the reason why. Like, selfishly now, it's the best thing in the. It's the best feeling in the world for me, right? You know, yesterday I was at my birthday party picking up my daughter from a birthday party of her friend and the sister of a woman. So this woman, I don't know, she starts to tear up, telling me she just got divorced. And I sat with her and just reflected the courage in her. And she said, you don't know how much I needed to hear that. I'm like, you don't know what it means to me that you let me yet to contribute, right? So this is the conversation, right? It's like, what is the actual why when you get quiet, right, Versus what every well meaning person told you, which is wake up and make as much money as you can, or wake up and have as many impressive things to post on Instagram as you can. You know, is that really your why?
- [23:54]
Monica Berg
Here's the next part of that. And I love Viktor Frankl. I love his work. He said that when you know your why, you can endure any how. So when we go back to the conversation about pain and suffering, then when you know your why, the how then makes you can endure really anything and make sense of it and make meaning of it, and then your experience of it is different. And that's why it's so important. This why piece. Most people, though, go through life avoiding that. Most people are really uncomfortable in their skin. They're uncomfortable with themselves. They're uncomfortable in silence. I know Elvis Presley famously had a TV on in every room because he could not stand silence and at all, right? It's a tortured place to be in. And I think that it's never too late. You know, I always say the longest, most important relationship you'll ever have is the one you have with yourself. Of course, that part of you that's connected to the Creator because it's one and the same. But that's the thing where you feel comfortable in your skin. But more than that, where you're able to like a masterpiece, you're able to see your unmet potential. You're able to see yourself like a slab of clay and realize that we're meant to keep molding and chipping away at it until we become the masterpiece that we are each individually and uniquely meant to be.
- [25:07]
Interviewer
It's so beautiful, what you just said. So beautiful. The last sentence could be like, one of those people could put what you just said, like, on a mug or a T shirt. Like, it's gorgeous, beautiful. One of the things that is very challenging for people, especially once they start to awaken to their spiritual quest. They don't know how to reconcile this idea of wanting more, wanting to manifest so much abundance of everything, Abundance of love, abundance of wealth, abundance. They don't know how to reconcile the desire to expand for so much. If what we just said is that being spiritual is like really just. You could have a small cup of rice and a tea and you could wash someone's dishes, and you should feel as though you were on top of the world. It seems as though these things are in conflict. And I really want you to speak to this, because I don't see them in conflict. Right. And I love teaching people how much God is so rooting for you to receive at the biggest level. But it really is something that trips people up. Right. They feel like it's either or. So could you please speak about what you believe about that and what you would love for people to understand?
- [26:31]
Monica Berg
I love this question because it really irks me when people judge other people and say, well, if you're spiritual, you shouldn't do X or Y or have X or Y. And it's like, who made this rule book? As far as I know, the Creator is all loving, all encompassing, and wants us to receive goodness in all areas. Now, we are made up of body, mind, and spirit. So it wouldn't make sense that we're only meant to feed the spirit. And I don't know who defined that as being satiated by a bowl of rice and a cup of hot water. Right. I believe that we're meant to have the best of everything. We're meant to experience everything. I mean, that's why we're able to have pleasure in all ways. Also in physical ways, we're able to experience all of these things. Why give somebody the desire if you're not meant to receive it and experience it? Now, with that said, the spiritual part of that, when the bend there is that we're not meant to take it too seriously. So you can have these things and you can achieve them and you can enjoy them, but you have to know its place, right? You have to know its purpose. It can't be everything. And also it can't be external. It can't be for external validation, for external approval, for people to like you, for people to remember your name. So it's so important to build the spirit so that you know where your ego is and you put it in its place and your soul is able to accept, experience all of these things. But again, it will be in a beautiful balance when you understand what it's there for. And again, the why. I think too often people say they want these things all in the name of spirituality. You know, I want to make millions of dollars. I want to give it away. Is that really true, though? And how do you know once you have those things, you're actually going to be able to do it? They're going to say, well, I. It took so long to make these millions, maybe I should really kind of keep it. I'm just going to give a little bit away. But if you keep chipping away at the ego and you keep connecting your soul, the Creator just gives to you and you enjoy it, but you also understand its purpose and its place.
- [28:31]
Interviewer
Yeah, all of those things are things that I've heard so often. Each way that you express that we could do a whole conversation on each of those things. Because, gosh, there's so many ways to go back to what you said. But I'll just take this one, which is there is a false belief that humility is not having anything. And I've met so many very, very sweet people who purposely almost, you know, clamp down and. And force upon themselves a certain amount of, like, you know, we'd say in, like, Yiddish, like, in Hebrew, it's like this bits hole. Like, who am I to have this? Like, I want to be a pious person. And I'm sitting there staring at them like, what are you doing? Like, I understand the intention, but it doesn't make any sense to me. Like, there's an entire buffet and you're eating a crumb, and God has placed the buffet so you won't allow yourself to get the plate and, like, actually have, like, fluffy pancakes. Like, you're just gonna eat the crumb on the ground.
- [29:32]
Monica Berg
I love this conversation. I just got the goosebumps when you were talking because here's the thing. What is humility? Humility is be being able to make yourself small while also being great. So being humble is being able to have all these things and not take it seriously and not let it define you and not let your ego take hand of you. Being humble is to be able to be, let's say a billionaire and not even think that that really means anything at all in the real scheme of things. That's humility, not the other. Like, oh, yeah, I don't really want that. Because what you're doing is you're. You're denying yourself things you actually want, desire. And then what happens is that doesn't become a restriction or spirituality. That becomes repression over time because we live in physical bodies. So that just doesn't work long term. That doesn't even. That's not even a real way to live. I mean, the reason we've come into this world according to Kabbalah, is if you think about it, right, the soul can live without the body, right? In the upper worlds, there's no body. It's just the soul. In the lower worlds, the body is without a soul. In this world that we're in, in this reality, as we call it, which is the 1%, you have body and sou. Soul together. That's a really uncomfortable place to be because the soul just wants to share and the body just wants to receive. So they're in constant conflict every single day. That conflict is there and set up so that we choose soul every day over body. That doesn't mean you don't receive things for the body. It doesn't mean you don't enjoy them. But soul always wins. Soul leads. Soul tells you don't take this seriously. Soul tells you share the things that you have. Soul tells you that thing that you got. Give first to somebody else and then receive it. That's the whole formula for life and for our purpose of existence. So of course you need to have those things because you need that struggle. Ultimately, that's how growth spins.
- [31:23]
Interviewer
It's so beautiful. And one of the best examples of this that always comes to mind for me is King David, because most people know the Psalms. And you think of this person who was such a giant spiritually and so wealthy, like so much wealth. This person ran an empire, a wealth that's different than the Kardashians, okay? They would never know this level of wealth that he had. And his whole life was about Singing these psalms and trying to, like, rip open his heart to be as close to whatever version of the truth he could muster. Perceiving, right? It didn't like, you don't even remember. Oh, yeah. That he had so much wealth. It's like, why? Because what was he. He was longing. He was. His longing was for something so much greater than piles of stones, right? So it's. It is. It can. It's so important, what you just said. And there is a level of repression, and it's really all about how you're aligning with everything. It's really all about how you hold the intention, how you hold the perception. I want to go back to a word you use, which is a word you use twice. You used it in Hebrew and in English, which is the word Kabbalah means to receive. And you just talked about receiving. And often when I tell people that the word Kabbalah means to receive, you know, the cabela is to receive. They're like, what the heck does that mean? It's a. It's a whole language of receiving. I'm like, correct, Right, So more kava. Homer, more to your point, right, the whole journey here is to be a receiver. So can you explain from. I'd love to hear from your vantage point, what does it mean to you that the mandate is to become the best receiver possible? What does that mean?
- [33:08]
Monica Berg
Well, fundamentally, the first thing you learn in Kabbalah is that we're meant to change our experience of receiving. So how we go through life, especially if we're not really spiritually aware or conscious, is desire to receive for the self alone. Desire to receive for the self alone. Satiate self, self. The transformation that happens, it's supposed to be. Now, desire to receive for the sake of sharing. That's a big leap, right? And all the things, right, that process is the purpose. All the things that happen in the middle of that taking to receive for the self alone, to becoming a being of sharing is the whole point. So it's so beautiful because, yes, of course, we're meant to receive. And I like to use examples of children all the time. If a person, an adult, a parent, has the mindset that, no, no, we're not supposed to receive, and that's spiritual, then what are we teaching children? We're saying, go against your basic human nature. It's not not to receive, it's to. To transform it, keep receiving, but for the sake of sharing. And again, the only way we could do that is by diminishing and reducing the ego. The ego has Such a big hold that it's. There's not enough to go around or pitting women against women, you know, there's not enough room at the top. It was hard to get here in the first place. It's all of that noise. It's all the opposition that gets in our way. But that battle has to occur so that we can choose to be that being of sharing. But it's all about receiving. The point that we stop receiving is death. Right. The point that we stop desiring is death. That's the only time that that is gone. So I think that the beauty of that is that the secret to the question of why we're here is in the. The word itself. It is to receive, but it's to. To elevate it.
- [34:48]
Interviewer
I love that. How simple and how profound that is, that it's. When it's for the sake of sharing, this light, it's like, game on. It's so simple. But it's such. Like you said, it's a. It's a big leap because it's not for you. It's for you to be like a light bulb in the room. And that's what feels the best. One of the things that's also so interesting about, I think, Judaism in and of itself and the way we talk about the aspect of this in Kabbalah specifically is the word desire. Because that is such a taboo word. That is a word that people associate with filth. That is a word that has become so shamed. Yes. That when you're talking to people in Kabbalah circles, the word desire is the complete opposite of that. The word desire is like, oh, my gosh, like this rotson, this desire that you have, like it should just grow and expand. And it's like, say what? Like, I was raised to believe that I should quell, you know, dampen any level of desire. So can you help us understand how desire becomes a holy thing, a righteous thing, a beautiful thing, a gift? When we've been taught something so different about that.
- [35:59]
Monica Berg
It's human nature and pure to desire. If you look at a child right when they come out of the womb, they desire to be held and to be loved, and they desire to be fed and taken care of. That desire is innate in our existence or what happens. And this is where it gets confusing for people. If your desire is connected to your ego versus your soul, the things that you're desiring are probably things that are not good for you, that create a short circuit for you and the universe. So it becomes this thing of like, oh, they desired so much. All we have to do is define for people, where is your desire rooted in what is it connected to? Is it connected to things that are eternal, that will last even long after we're not in this physical body? Or is it connected to things that are just to feed yourself alone? And of course, those kinds of things tend to be a little bit uglier, right? But desire in itself, I mean, there's so many words that have changed over time, and that means something else. But if we go back and we look at the root of it, and if we really look at it from a spiritual perspective, of course it makes sense. We never stop desiring. If once we stop desiring, we no longer can stay in the physical body and then the soul has to leave.
- [37:16]
Interviewer
It's so fascinating because, you know, so many people have really embraced yoga, mindfulness. There's so much beauty to the Eastern practices. So much beauty. So I have so much deep love for Eastern tradition, and I have practiced it. I've spent years studying mindfulness and meditation. I became certified to teach it, love it. And in that vertical, okay, all suffering comes from desire. And so really the idea of so much of that world is that if you don't want to suffer, you just. You feel satisfied with nothing, right? There's like this. This way in which. And so people sometimes think that, like, well, I know what I'll do. I just won't want anything. I'll just be so satisfied with not turning on the pilot light under this bigger dream, this bigger vision, right? And. And it's interesting because there's a part of us that just won't let go of what we desire. And so then you feel bad about it and you feel guilty for it. It's like, no, what if there's a way that all of it gets to make sense?
- [38:25]
Monica Berg
I have the answer. It's one word because it's. It's so interesting because there is truth in what you said, but it's missing one key fundamental word. The reason that we have pain. It's because what we desire is because we have an attachment to the desire. That's the only thing. You work on, the attachment part, and then you're fine, keep desiring, but you're not going to be attached to whether you get it or not, or if you keep it or not, or the outcome or not. And that word, attachment, that's code for ego. And that is the big shift that has to happen. And that's what creates transformation. Non attachment to physical things. Desire Them, but non attachment to it. And then, you know, keep going for it. Forward, sire, away. That's the only word that's missing from that sentence. For it to be a true statement.
- [39:09]
Interviewer
That is so good. That gave me chills because it's so. Oh, it's so precise. And my whole nervous system just like it. It hits, right? It's like as soon as you take away the attachment, then you can just be in God's playground.
- [39:26]
Monica Berg
You can create the history. Yeah, absolutely.
- [39:31]
Interviewer
One of the things that your husband, who's. Okay, I want to say two things about your husband. First of all, he's brilliant. But second of all, I turned to my friend Sanam Guillaume, who's the reason that I even met you, and I said to her, I'm so struck by how much room he has made for having such a powerful wife. And it's awesome. It's so awesome. Awesome to see it, you know, to see a man who's such a amazing speaker, good father, like, great at what he does. And just his face, when you are shining, it's like, ugh. Like, he is so lit up to see you. And I just think you have a very uncanny knack for speaking. And so it's like. It's just. I love. I just. I really got so much out of his humility to both be so great and also let you be so great. I just loved it. And one of the things I heard him say the first time I ever heard him speak, which was a couple months ago, so beautiful. He was talking about this concept, talking about receiving and talking about this concept that one of the greatest ways to manifest everything that we truly desire in our life is to practice making 100 blessings a day. And this idea of what does it mean to practice the muscle of receiving right now? And I say to people all the time, like, if you want to receive so much, how much are you currently receiving? If you look at, you know, the chakra system, which is people don't usually know the word spirit, so they know, like, about chakras. They know, like, energy centers in their body, right? I'm like, how much does your heart receive in this moment? How much is your third eye receiving? How much vision? How much is your throat? How much of what you want to say? Are you saying, how much in your gut are you intuitively feeling into? It's like, oh, yeah, everything's off, Everything's turned off. It's like the radios are all off, so there's no receiving. So can you talk about in this moment today, how we can practice the art of becoming a better receiver in this moment, with everything that's already here to receive.
- [41:38]
Monica Berg
I love the question also, and it's something I thought about the other day on Shabbat. Actually I shared this. The portion was about Noah. We all know the story, even if you're not spiritual. Everybody's heard the song and everything else and it talked about how when the flood happened, right, it was a reset of nature. And this water that came down, the rain that came down, was actually wisdom. Because what is wisdom, right? You can't heard that because at that time the world was so selfish. Everybody had gotten into a state of only a desire to receive the self alone. So there needed to be a mass, this massive immediate reset. So when this water came down, it was meant to give wisdom to people. So what does that mean? Because if you think about it, Abraham didn't have a teacher. Who was his teacher? Where did he get this information from? And in the world today, we look to everybody, you know, And I remember I had a homeopath who was my best friend. And it was a time in my life where I didn't really believe in myself. And she was always like the voice of reason in my head, like, no, keep on this path. No, keep like not on the path, the path I never deviated from, but just my. My place in it, right? My voice. And then I moved to new and I was so excited because she lived here. And then she got very sick and died a few months after that. And so I think maybe I came at that time to help her transition. Then my father in law passed and my mother in law passed. And I'm looking around like, where are all my teachers? Who's going to replace them now? And I understood, but not fully until just a few days ago, that I was meant to. I understood that I was meant to get the information directly from the Creator and to cultivate that relationship. But the layer that I hadn't gotten until Friday, this past Friday, was that. So what is wisdom, right? If Abraham didn't have a teacher, it means that you learn from everything and everybody. You learn from nature, you learn from this table, you learn from every single thing that exists in this world. So what that means is that let's say you walk by a tree and something makes you look up at it and you're inspired. You can look at the tree and you can actually get information. I know I sound a little crazy right now, but just stay with me. You can get information, right? You can get a message that you Wanted to because we have all the information we need inside of us. But sometimes it's hard to access it unless we're inspired by the things in this physical world we live in. Sometimes, you know, I'll walk in New York City and I'll see something that is disturbing or a homeless person that's having a hard time or just something. And right away I ask myself, why am I seeing this? And how can I appreciate something in my life that I didn't appreciate a minute ago before I saw this? Because now I'm seeing somebody in real pain or danger or conflict. What was it that I felt lack 5 minutes ago about. Or pain about 10 minutes ago? And right away, it's a reset to appreciation. So that's really how you live in this world where you're able to access that part of you. It's because you access it all the time through everything you experience in the nice person and the mean person. You know, I went to a concert last night with one of my kids, and I sat next to somebody who was sitting by themselves, and when she walked in, I had my jacket because the concert pretty started already. My jacket was on her chair. And she's like, I'm sitting there. I'm like, this is all good. We're at a concert. We're gonna have a good time. Move my jacket. And then she started singing through the concert. She had a beautiful voice, so I noticed that. And then next thing I know, like, she's crying the entire show. So I give her Kleenex. Like, we had a connection. I don't know her name. We didn't say anything other than that. But I wanted to take care of her.
- [45:04]
Interviewer
Now.
- [45:04]
Monica Berg
If I had had an attitude about my jacket was there, she wanted to move it. She came lit. I was just like, this is a person. We're meant to experience this conc. And I'm going to welcome her somehow. That's wisdom, right? Wisdom is being able to see the opportunity, the beauty, the blessing, and every single thing. The taxi you went in, the driver you noticed, even if it's not meaningful, look for some spark of light in it. And that's how you connect to that part of you, and that's how you really love it.
- [45:31]
Interviewer
That's so beautiful. And I so appreciate that you so vulnerably just shared specifically for you about losing all of these amazing teachers in your life. But also, even as recently as like, a few days ago, like, going even deeper with, like, finding your own. Just all. All the. All the signs, right? All the simonym. All the ways that you're being pointed towards the truth. And I think it's a mic drop. And I. I recently shared something on Instagram that as much as you think you're scrolling looking for an answer, you're listening to a podcast, trying to find the answer. Like, really, like, God wants to have a relationship directly with you. And as crazy as it sounds, you do have a pipeline.
- [46:13]
Kathy Heller
Like, you.
- [46:14]
Interviewer
You. There's a. There's just this uncanny way that if you just pause for a moment and close your eyes and said, what do I need to remember today? There's this, like, unbelievable, transcendent whisper that just always has a message. And we just don't cultivate this sanctuary within ourself. We're not really guided to that. And every regular person has this way of tapping in. And so I think it's just such a massive point that you just made that Abraham, you know, didn't have a teacher, right? He went right to God, right?
- [46:49]
Monica Berg
And to nature, you know, and the people that he met.
- [46:52]
Interviewer
All of it, all of it's. You know, it's all God's appearing in every form. One thing I want to ask you, just because I get asked this question all the time, and I think it's helpful. A lot of people don't know what Kabbalah is, and they've never heard this word, and they don't know about anything. They've only, like, seen, like, oh, Madonna likes it, or there's a hashtag, or someone has a sweatshirt or Ashton Kutcher and they don't know what it is. And so people will say to me, you know, I'm a Christian, you know, am I allowed to listen to this? Or what is it? Is it new? Like, did this start, like, you know, in the 90s when it became popular? Like, how do you express to people what this wisdom is?
- [47:28]
Monica Berg
Yeah, I like to make it really practical for people and make it very actionable. There's so much information out there in the world today, and there's a lot of inspiration, especially on social media. This is inspiring. That's inspiring. Okay, that's great. I'm happy. We feel good in that moment, but that's not really the goal. The goal is transformation. And Kabbalah is all about transformation. And more than that, it gives you a roadmap and tools and practical ways to transform and change so that you can become the person that you are meant to become. We come into this world with a soul, and through desire to receive yourself alone, we cover that. Right? So if you imagine you have a light bulb and you put a sheet over it, that's one covering and it's going to dim the light a little bit, right? But you can still see the light. Put another one, it's going to get a little bit darker, and another one before you know it. A lifetime, 50 years of covering that, suddenly you can't see anymore. Now, through our negative actions or selfish actions, have we changed that spark inside of us? Have we dimmed our soul? Absolutely not. The goal, though, is to keep peeling back the layers, taking off the sheets until you can shine brighter and brighter and follow your soul's desires. The reason people have an easier time following ego desire is because we've covered, right? We put so many layers, so many filaments over the bulk, over the light. So Kabbalah is the most useful tool to be able to do that. It's a 3,000 year old wisdom. It is the first wisdom. So I get that question a lot too. If you're a Christian, by the way, people have said it's made me a better Christian. For other people who aren't even in any religion or affiliated with any kind of belief. They said it brought them back to a knowing they always had. It's like a homecoming. So, I mean, that's it in a nutshell. Honestly, I think that it's the way to make sense and meaning of life and very practically and very actionably.
- [49:17]
Interviewer
It's so beautiful. I love how you share that. I think something that people don't understand is that, you know, you mentioned Abraham before and you mentioned this being 3000 years old. When I said earlier that Rabbi David Aaron said to me, you're someone, you're some of the 1. The central prayer in Jewish wisdom is Shema, sorry, Al Hashem Echad. Right. God is oneness. And so it's for all of us, it's universal. This is not a wisdom that is only for any.
- [49:44]
Monica Berg
Why would it be chosen for only a select group? It's for all mankind. Absolutely.
- [49:50]
Interviewer
Yeah. It's very. It's just extremely progressive to think a thought like that. And so I think people somehow don't know that that could possibly be true. Okay, so speaking of all of this, I need 19 more hours with you. This is like, how is this what's happening? Okay, but for those who want to have, have 900 more hours with you, you have your own podcast with your husband. Spiritually hungry, right?
- [50:15]
Monica Berg
Yes.
- [50:16]
Interviewer
Okay.
- [50:16]
Monica Berg
You're gonna be on it soon.
- [50:17]
Interviewer
Oh, my gosh. That's right. I love that So I want you to tell them where they can, like, stay in the wisdom. Stay with you guys what the podcast is about, and we'll link to it, too.
- [50:29]
Monica Berg
Well, it's about everything, but under a kabbalistic lens. So we talk about relationships, about pain, about aging, death, growth. I mean, literally every single thing with the Kabbalistic bend. And then the other feedback we get often is that it's a relationship podcast, because it's my husband and I doing it together. And of course it's not. But I think that what they're saying is that a lot of people haven't experienced a healthy relationship up close or witnessed it. And they see, and I think to your point before, about how my husband is allowed or created, helped create space for me, a relationship where we have the same goals and the same sense of purpose, but deeply respect one another and we laugh together and there's levity and there's purpose, you know? So I think for that, too. It's a great podcast.
- [51:19]
Interviewer
Speaking of you and your husband, I just want to say this, and I definitely want to have you back on, but just in this moment before I have part two, there's so many things that I was so moved by with you and both of you. And one of those things, I mentioned several of them. One of the things was all of your kids that were involved in Rosh Hashanah. Several of them, I was witnessing your daughter.
- [51:43]
Kathy Heller
She's so cute.
- [51:44]
Interviewer
And your oldest son interviewed you. You guys talked. You had a really real conversation. That was beautiful. But one of your kids has down syndrome. And I turned to my friend and the tears were streaming down my face, and I'm like, this kid is just unbelievable. Like, he has enough energy moving through him that he could power Times Square. And you also spoke about him specifically, but I was just in awe of the way that he just stands in his own strength and light. And I've never really seen anything like that. And I thought it just speaks volumes to your level of certainty and how you can just see people until they can fully see what's inside of themselves, regardless of what the world tells you. So I'm just really impressed.
- [52:47]
Monica Berg
Thank you. Thank you.
- [52:49]
Interviewer
It's so beautiful. It's just.
- [52:51]
Monica Berg
You're so beautiful.
- [52:52]
Interviewer
Part of the reason I wanted it. Part of the reason I wanted to share that, too, before we close is because you are extremely bright, and it's very powerful. And when someone is really powerful, it's easy on some level to think, well, she's just so beyond. And there's Nothing about her that I could possibly relate to. Right. And when we remember that human beings have all kinds of cards that get dealt to them and the ways that they face different aspects of reality and, and there's a version of you that is who you are as a speaker and as a teacher. And there's a version of you that's a mom and there's a version of you that's had all different kinds of kids and there's a version of you that was once, you know, handed a baby who was given a certain life trajectory and you just had totally other plans. And I just, I think that that aspect, just every aspect, we can all aspire, but I think that aspect is very, it's really riveting actually. And I just didn't want to end the episode without people hearing that part.
- [54:03]
Monica Berg
Of you, but I have to have to share something with you. I've actually really spoken about this, funnily enough. But. So Josh is my second child of four and Josh is the one who is the exceptional light and also has down syndrome because I don't define him by that. But pregnancy was really difficult and there was bleeding early on. I almost miscarried. I carried really small. People were making comments all the time. And my mother in law, she loved a good psychic. You know, she was like going all over the place like, what's going on with Monica? What's going on with the pregnancy? And there was this one woman that was always really accurate and she said, the baby's healthy, baby's healthy. Don't you know, everything's fine. So then I gave birth. The first person my mother in law, Karen called was her. She's like, hey, so the baby's healthy. This baby has down syndrome. And she said he is healthy, though physically he's healthy. He didn't have a hole in his heart. He didn't have any of the markers physically that you could see and not in his spine, his neck, his fingers, like really literally nothing that you could tell. And she said this, she said Monica needed this child. There were many other aspects, but this one thing I want to share with you and I can, that could be a whole other episode because I can tell you 150,000 ways how he's gifted me in this lifetime. I could not manifest and become who I'm meant to be without my husband or without Josh. I mean, all my children have shaped me and continue to mold me. But on a very soul piercing level, that is a true statement. So she added, you know, Monica, nobody would really listen to her. They would write her off and say, oh, you know, she's not relatable. Literally, what you just said to me, you know, look at her. Look how she is. She needed this so people could say, oh, this is the entry point. I understand she's experienced pain before, and I'm going to listen to her. I just think it's just so funny. You literally said exactly that. And this was 23 years ago. I heard that.
- [55:58]
Interviewer
I have tears in my eyes. But I want to say one thing to you before we close. When I was learning, I spent three years learning in seminary in Israel. And one day we were all sitting in one of the rabbi's lectures. And he's a profound person. Holocaust survivor and teaches, like, just unbelievable. Master and really loving person. But very serious, right? But very, like, warm and loving. But you're all in. When he's speaking, and in one class, we're all looking at him, and I guess somebody had entered from the back of the room. And we were turned facing him. And he stood up, which he doesn't usually do that. Like, he'd stand up because someone entered. Usually people enter. They enter quietly. They sit down. He's still talking. He stands up. So we look to see who's there. And he asked us all to stand up. And it was a woman and her son who had down syndrome. And he said, you know, hello to them, whatever. And then when they left, he said, if you ever see somebody like that, you should stand for them because it's so obvious that the reason that their soul came into this world is to elevate you. They have such an. Like, their soul is so elevated. You have to stand up. I will never forget that. So thank you for one of the most beautiful conversations. Thank you for being so exceptional. We will put links to all of your things so that people can go and spend all the time with you. And I'm just so happy that you were here.
- [57:30]
Monica Berg
I'm happy I was here, too. I look forward to connecting more.
- [57:34]
Interviewer
We will.
- [57:34]
Monica Berg
Thank you.
- [57:36]
Kathy Heller
How amazing is Monica? Okay, here are the takeaways. Number one. We all have this knowing inside of us. It's just how available we make ourselves to hear that message, hear that calling. Number two, certainty is that all indication points to this is not going to happen. This does not make sense. And still you push with your desire, but also an openness that wherever you end up is ultimately the best thing that you have. Number three, the process is the purpose. It's everything that you learn along the way that ultimately becomes the purpose. Number four the longest and most important relationship you'll ever have is the one you have with yourself. Number five Keep receiving for the sake of sharing. Number six Keep desiring, but don't be attached to the outcome. This is the big shift that has to happen and that's what creates transformation. Number seven Wisdom is being able to see the opportunity, the beauty, the blessing in every single thing, even if it's not meaningful. Look for some spark of light in it. That's how you connect to that part of you and that's how you really live it. Thank you so much for listening. I'm so grateful that you continue to show up and listen to this podcast. We have great episodes coming up, so make sure that you follow along on Apple Podcasts or Spotify wherever it is that you listen. And if anything from this episode or any other episode has resonated, please share the show with somebody that you love and also leave us a review. I love this one that we got recently. It says Love and Light. Kathy always brings the passion, the light, and the pathway to walk alongside her on a journey to where life feels free and like play. She's so many things to so many people, but to me she's a beacon. A beacon of the power a woman can walk into when she lives the life she's meant to. She reminds us that we are already here and who we are already we have the power to be. Thank you Kathy for holding the lantern for so many of us can come out of the dark and into the light with you. That is just so generous. Thank you so much. It makes me so happy to read these beautiful reviews. So if you haven't left one already, you might want to go ahead and do that. And last couple of things, I'm going to be doing that masterclass that I talked about. It's called Manifesting Miracles. It's happening this Tuesday and you can join us for just a dollar because right now you can get a trial of my membership for just a dollar as our Black Friday is still happening. Until Tomorrow, go to kathyheller.com life and not only will you get to be present for the workshop, but you'll also get a week of daily meditations and you'll get so much more juicy stuff. Stuff. So come and join us for just a dollar. I think you'll love it. Second of all, if you're looking for a holiday gift to give your friends and family, you might just want to get my book Abundant Ever after because it's now available on paperback. I've been reading the most beautiful reviews and I really believe in this book. It seems like it's really doing the trick. So if you have not read it, or if you want to grab one for your friend or family member, you can go to kathyheller.com book and grab some awesome bonuses when you buy your copy. I love you so much and I'll talk to you again soon.