A False Gospel Infecting the American Church with Allie Beth Stuckey

Summary

Episode Summary: "A False Gospel Infecting the American Church"

The Charlie Kirk Show
Guest: Allie Beth Stuckey
Date: January 2, 2021

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Main Theme & Purpose

This episode features a deep and candid discussion between Charlie Kirk and author/podcaster Allie Beth Stuckey, focusing on the challenges facing American Christianity—namely, the rise of a "false gospel" rooted in self-love, secularism, and new age philosophies. The conversation navigates faith, theology, the pitfalls of modern cultural trends, and their effects on society, especially young people and church communities.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Foundations of Christian Faith

• Personal testimonies: Allie discusses growing up with a strong faith foundation from her parents, emphasizing the importance and privilege of being raised in a Christian home, but also the necessity of making faith personal.

  • “Things become your own when you go off on your own in college and then you're in the real world and you realize that it really does have to become personal, because it also becomes ... a little bit of a battle.” (03:16 – 04:38, Allie Stuckey)

• Faith & Doubt: Both acknowledge that doubts are natural and even necessary for strengthening one’s faith.

  • “Faith without doubts is like a body without antibodies.” (04:57, Allie Stuckey)
  • Ali encourages seeking wisdom in scripture and not fleeing from the faith community when questions arise.

2. The Bible’s Unique Role

• Scripture’s Authority: Allie responds to claims that the Bible is "just mythology," pointing to theological resources like Wayne Grudem's Systematic Theology.
  • “Secular humanism ... can't answer questions like why do we long for purpose?... That’s only answered in this idea that we were made in God’s image.” (08:21 – 09:39, Allie Stuckey)
  • Charlie reduces the Bible’s story to three words: “Creation, fall, redemption.” (11:37)

3. Cultural Consequences of Rejecting Biblical Truth

• Rise of Postmodernism: The pair critique postmodern trends and moral relativism, connecting them to increased societal confusion on fundamental questions (e.g., gender, life, and freedom).
  • “Because we've been infected by postmodernism, which I like to say makes hearts of stone and brains of mush, we're now asking ... very stupid questions. Because we don't know what truth is anymore.” (12:02 – 13:51, Allie Stuckey)

4. Impact on Young People—The “Misery of Self-Love”

• Nihilism & Self-Love Culture: Allie critiques self-empowerment mantras, arguing they lead to isolation, purposelessness, and mental health struggles in Gen Z.
  • “We do not have a self-love deficit in this country... What we need is a purpose outside of ourselves.” (15:09 – 16:08, Allie Stuckey)
  • “The generation that has been the greatest beneficiary of [self-love]... is more depressed, more anxious, more lonely, more purposeless, more godless than any other generation.” (16:32)

5. Christianity vs. Other Religions & New Age Influences

• Contrast with Eastern Religions/New Age: They compare Christianity’s focus on outward service and Christ’s sacrifice with introspective/self-focused philosophies from Buddhism and the New Age, including the Enneagram.
  • “Christianity says, look, Ephesians 2, you're dead in your sin ... and then Christ comes down the hill to rescue you and to make you alive. That is the gospel.” (21:30 – 22:47, Allie Stuckey)
  • Warnings are issued about the infiltration of New Age thinking, especially in women’s ministries (see discussion on the Enneagram at 21:12 – 23:11).

6. Redemption Narratives in Pop Culture

• Sacrifice Resonates: Charlie and Allie highlight how popular films—Saving Private Ryan, Braveheart, Gladiator—unintentionally resonate with the gospel message due to their themes of sacrificial rescue.
  • “Those are the movies that we want to watch... our hearts are after the gospel. Even fricking weirdos in Hollywood.” (24:42 – 25:03, Allie Stuckey)

7. “False Gospels” in the American Church

• Women’s Ministries & Oprah Theology: Discussion centers on the popularity of watered-down, self-help Christianity, particularly in megachurch women’s ministries in the South.
  • “This kind of self-love women's ministry culture in a lot of mega churches ... is growing like crazy.” (28:14, Charlie Kirk)
  • “Every book that we read and every sermon that we hear is just about how society is so bad and ... all you need to know is that Jesus is there to tell you that your hair looks pretty. It’s like no woman. Your biggest problem is ... you're a sinner who's going to stand before a holy God.” (30:14 – 30:50, Allie Stuckey)

8. Politics & The State of the Nation

• Concerns for the Country: Allie expresses worry over the direction of America politically, the influence of intersectionality, and rising radicalism in government.
  • “I'm worried about if it doesn't go the way that ... Republicans and conservatives want it to go. I'm worried about the legislation that's coming down the pipeline ... we're talking about, as much as they can, a radical reconstruction of our systems for the worst.” (26:06 – 27:04, Allie Stuckey)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “The self can’t be both the problem and the solution.” (20:53, Allie Stuckey)
• “God says, no, I'm getting off my throne. Coming down to you to save you.” (22:40, Allie Stuckey)
• “Because we’ve been infected by postmodernism, which I like to say makes hearts of stone and brains of mush, we’re now asking ... very stupid questions.” (13:41, Allie Stuckey)
• “If you just pray more, you'll automatically be happier ... No, I'm talking about having an eternal sense of purpose.” (16:45, Allie Stuckey)
• “Do you know what's going to happen next? If the answer is no, then I hope you look into this podcast.” (31:50, Charlie Kirk)
• “I was told that if you wear a mask, that you'll never die.” (32:02, Allie Stuckey, satirically)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|----------------------------------------------------| | 03:16-04:38 | Allie’s personal faith journey | | 04:57-06:50 | Wrestling with doubts in Christianity | | 07:51-10:38 | Why the Bible is more than myth | | 12:02-13:51 | Cultural consequences of secularism | | 15:08-17:13 | The “misery of self-love” and Gen Z struggles | | 18:42-23:11 | Christianity vs. Buddhism/New Age and Enneagram | | 24:06-25:36 | Gospel narratives in pop culture | | 28:14-31:40 | The rise of self-help gospel in women's ministries | | 26:06-27:46 | Political concerns: Georgia, Biden, and the future | | 31:40-32:54 | Facing mortality and the enduring truth of scripture|

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Closing Thoughts

Allie encourages listeners to seek deeper theological understanding, warns against the seduction of self-centered ideologies, and emphasizes finding hope and identity in the Christian gospel rather than in self-empowerment movements. Both hosts stress the significance of serving others, pursuing truth, and standing firm amid cultural shifts.

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Guest Info:

• Allie Beth Stuckey’s book: You’re Not Enough (And That’s Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love
• Podcast: Relatable on BlazeTV

Host Reminder:
Subscribe, send questions to [e-mail], and support the show at charliekirk.com/support.

Transcript

[Charlie Kirk]

Hey everybody. Today on a special episode of the Charlie Kirk show, we have Ali Stuckey. To kick off a new year, the wonderful Ali Stuckey. We talk about faith, we talk about life and so much more. And this program, like many others, is brought to you by our friends@express VPN ExpressVPN.com Charlie Protect yourself from big tech and big government by going to expressvpn.com Charlie if you want to support our program, go to charliekirk.com support to get behind our program. If you want to email us your questions, email us freedomarliekirk.com Ali Stuckey is here. Buckle up. Here we go. Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

[Ali Stuckey]

Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.

[Charlie Kirk]

I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.

I want to thank Charlie. He's an incredible guy. His spirit, his love of this country. He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point usa.

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Welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show.

[Ali Stuckey]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Charlie Kirk]

I heard you gave a great speech.

[Ali Stuckey]

Oh, thank you.

[Charlie Kirk]

At our Student Action Summit.

[Ali Stuckey]

Thanks. I love it. It's my second favorite conference right after ywls.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, and that one we're going to be doing again, hopefully in person.

[Ali Stuckey]

I know. Super sad that we couldn't have it this year. Year.

[Charlie Kirk]

But for obvious reasons.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

So there's a lot to talk about in the world.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, there is.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so I asked you, what do you want to talk about? And you said, I don't know, anything.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, I'll talk about anything.

[Charlie Kirk]

So let's folk. I mean, I just said, well, let's talk about the Bible. So why not? Because I actually love when we get to talk about faith on this podcast. We do it every so often. Your faith's very important to you. We have a lot of people that have a misperception of Christianity.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

So tell us why you're a Christian.

[Ali Stuckey]

Well, I'm a Christian, thankfully. I have a really good foundation in my parents. I know that you do as well. Some people kind of scoff at the fact that, oh, you have the same beliefs that your parents do. You're only a Christian because your parents raised you that way. I actually think it's an immense privilege to be able to say, yeah, I had parents who brought me up in the Lord and brought me to church and taught me who made the world and who makes the rules. And that really is the foundation of my faith. But, you know, things become your own when you go off on your own in college and then you're in the real world and you realize that it really does have to become personal, because it also becomes a little bit of a. A little bit of a fight, a little bit of a battle. When you're up against people who don't believe the same things that you do, you have to know why you believe what you believe. It's not just that God makes sense of the world. I don't understand the existence of truth or morality or right and wrong or any kind of moral order without the Creator. But also there has to be a dealing with injustice. There has to be a dealing with sin. Sin. And that's the biggest question, I think, that all of us deal with. Like, who's going to deal with the bad stuff? Not just in the world, but also in me. And we have this, like, internal longing for redemption, for things to be made new, for things to be made better, for us to be made clean. And that is only found in Jesus Christ. And so just talking about kind of the philosophical and theological why, that's the why. It deals with the good and the bad. And it gives me hope for a culmination of all of life's great craziness, that one day there will be perfect peace. We won't be talking about politics. We'll be worshiping Jesus together, thankfully. Yeah. And that hope, it just anchors us in the midst of all this craziness.

[Charlie Kirk]

So people ask all the time, Charlie, do you ever have doubts? How do you answer that question?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yes. So I heard a pastor once say that faith without doubts is like a body without antibody. So we actually need doubts to be able to wrestle through our faith and answer those tough questions. The good news is that people that are much smarter than me have wrestled with the very same questions that I've had. I think a lot of times we have this hubris to think that if I have a question about, like, why does God let bad things happen? I'm the first person to ever ask that, and the answer is going to be found somewhere deep inside me. And so we have this. There's this trend of deconstructionism that is really kind of a progressive movement within the church to deconstruct your faith, but then not reconstructed into any kind of biblical Christianity, but reconstruct it with all of these secular progressive ideologies into something that really doesn't look like Christianity at all, in a way to try to pick and choose what you like from the Bible and discard the things that you don't like from the Bible. But when we have doubts, when we have questions, when, for example, maybe you had a church leader growing up who ended up being a huge hypocrite, and that just made you really doubt your faith and wonder if all of this is true. The great thing is, is that there are Christians, tried and true Christians, who have fought through and answered these questions, who can tell you where to go in the word of God. So rather than fleeing the church, fleeing scripture, and fleeing the Christians who have surrounded you your whole life, go into that community, go into scripture and ask those questions. Those questions are good. God's not scared of your questions. He's not too small for your questions. He's not like, oh, I've. I've never heard that question before. If he is the creator of truth and he's the source of all wisdom, then the Bible says that if we ask for wisdom in the book of James, that he promises to give it James 1. So, yes. So wisdom is both a promise, but it's also a process, as the book of Proverbs tells us. And so we seek wisdom in the place where we know it is in God's word, and we ask in. In humility for God to give us the wisdom that we're looking for.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, I. I love when you and I go to a lot of campuses where there's kind of a guy that comes up and he's 19 years old, and he. 19, 20 years old, and he believes he's the first person ever to think of the question, how could God ever allow bad things to happen? And he loves asking the question. God bless him for that. And there have been. People have been wrestling with this since the beginning of time. And so can you talk about. You know, we have a lot of people that are searching on this podcast, and we get wonderful emails, people that are really committing their life to Christ, which is awesome. And that is not the primary focus of this podcast. We're unapologetic of our beliefs, obviously, but we talk about a lot of other stuff, as you all know. But I think it points people to Christ as the more we talk about liberty, we want to find its source. Can you talk about how the Scriptures have impacted your life and why do you believe the Bible? Some people have emailed us in disagreement. They say, oh, it's just a bunch of mythology. It's a bunch of fables. It's outdated. It's more than that. Why is it more than that for you?

[Ali Stuckey]

Well, that's a. That's a really long question. And like I was saying earlier, there are people who are so much smarter than me that thankfully have wrestled through that and have looked at the history of the Bible, why the biblical canon includes those 66 books. That's what Protestants believe anyway. And why we believe that's the inerrant word of God. And so I. There's this resource. It's a huge resource, and it's called Systematic Theology. It's by Wayne Grudem.

[Charlie Kirk]

Oh, yeah, Wayne's great. Wayne's been on our podcast.

[Ali Stuckey]

I was about to say he's the perfect fit.

[Charlie Kirk]

He's in Phoenix, too.

He's great.

[Ali Stuckey]

He's incredible. But he's such a wealth of biblical theological knowledge, and that is an amazing resource for people to look into for how did we get the Bible? Why is it trustworthy? Why do we believe that it's different than any other book. And so we could go through the history and the logic and the apologetics of all of that. But I'll just direct you to that. I think one of the most compelling arguments that I've heard for Christianity, kind of what I was saying in the beginning, is that it helps us deal with these external existential questions that all humans are born having. Like secular humanism. It doesn't have an answer for these questions because it basically just sees us as evolved animals and so we are just these clumps of matter. But it can't answer questions like why do we long for purpose? Why do we long for belonging? Why do we long for beauty? Why is there such a thing as beauty? All of these very big and almost intangible questions that all human beings have, they're found in the source that created these things. And it's only answered in this idea that we were made in God's image. Which doesn't mean that we are gods, that we are divine ourself, but we have attributes that are similar or that reflect the triune God's nature. And I am someone who really cares about, I really care about fairness. Like I hate injustice. I hate bullies. I hate when people get away with bad things. I hate when people are deceitful or manipulative. I hate when the vulnerable are trampled on and we can look at the world. And sometimes I just feel like despairing because it feels like justice is never going to be executed. Like right will never prevail. And then I think about the promises in God's word that going back to that question of why does God let bad things happen? Well, actually God promises to defeat the evildoers. He promises to defeat Satan forever and to rule in perfect beast that God is not just letting bad happen, he's going to exact revenge on those who do evil. And so putting my hope in that, in asking or answering all of those existential questions that I and every human being since the beginning of time has had in such a beautiful and redemptive story of Jesus taking away our sins and then defeating evil once and for all, I can't think of a better satisfaction for those ponderings that we all have naturally.

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yeah, the Bible in three words. Can you believe it? Is creation, fall, redemption. Yeah, it's hardly, you know, there's a lot more to it than that, but that's, that's the story of the Bible.

Yep.

Can you talk about where you think our country has been going because we've decided to kind of discard the Bible as a coffee table book or something that's not even worthy of, you know, reading. What do you think the consequences have been culturally in our country and across, across the world?

[Ali Stuckey]

You know, some people think that this is a very recent phenomenon, that only in the past five years or so have we kind of embraced postmodernism and progressivism, this idea that, you know, there is no absolute truth, that, you know, moral relativism and all that. And yes, I do think things have accelerated over the past five years, but this has been happening for a very long time. And there are various avenues in our country that we can look at. Okay, where did this leftist, progressive, postmodern, secular indoctrination start? I mean, you can look at teachers unions, how they became more activists in the 1960s. You can look at some of the values in our government. And so there's a lot of different possible sources of it, but I think what you see is just a detachment from reality and a detachment from truth. I was talking to an atheist the other day who I really like and really respect, and she said something along the lines of, you know, it must be funny to people on the right to see us arguing about what is a man and what is a woman. And. And I said, you know, actually it's sad because to me, that's the consequence of godlessness. Because what is anything like what is right, what is wrong, what Is biology. Why does science matter more than someone's feelings? Why does biology matter at all? Why do definitions matter if there isn't a transcendent source of truth? Is it if there isn't, as C.S. lewis says, a great moral lawgiver from which we get our definitions of right and wrong? Of course, we're going to be arguing about things that we thought, you know, had been decided for millennia. But now we're asking such basic questions like, what is life? When does life begin? Why do we care about babies, lives? What is a man? What is a woman? Is freedom really good? Should we even want freedom? These are very basic questions that have been asked and answered by a lot of people. But because we've been infected by postmodernism, which I like to say makes hearts of stone and brains of mush, we're now asking, you know, very stupid questions. Because we don't know what truth is anymore.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes. And so can you talk about the impact you think it's had with young people in particular? I think it's created the most miserable generation in American history because they have no idea what it actually means to live a meaningful life, and they don't know what to try to pursue. And so human beings are aiming creatures. We need something to aim at. And the Bible and Christ give us the ultimate aim, which, of course is truth and is his sacrifice for us and his love, but a love in a very specific way. I think that we throw around the word love too often. You know, the. Probably one of the most used sermons ever. It's kind of like the Introductory Sermon 101 for a Pastor who kind of give, who has to pinch. It is the different types of love, which you know well of Philo, Eros, Sergei and Agape are the different types of love that God has given us. But where do you think this impact has had on young people and students? And if there is a young person listening to this right now that is kind of stuck in this nihilistic postmodern rut, what can they do?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, I think where I see it the most, you know, my audience is predominantly young women, probably college age, to, you know, young moms. And what we are bombarded with on a daily basis, speaking of love, is this self love culture. And that's why I wrote a book about it.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's kind of why I asked.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, yeah. Because I've been seen just so many young women, but young people in general who are weighed down by. I know this sounds paradoxical, but the misery of self love, this misery of self sufficiency. And even though self love and self empowerment, it all sounds really good because of course we don't believe in self loathing, we don't want self deprecation, of course, and I agree with that. But this idea that you are enough on your own and all you have to do is to love yourself more and you'll be happy, you'll be able to chase your dreams, all your relationships will come together, all it is is what I call trendy narcissism. It's actually making people far too focused on ourselves. I posit that we do not have a self love deficit in this country. That we're all kind of born with the natural instinct of self protection and to, to meet our own needs, we don't actually have to be taught to take care of ourselves. What we need is a purpose outside of ourselves. And because if self love were the problem, then we would all be a lot happier by now because we have been preached the message of just think about yourself, put yourself first. All that matters is that you're happy in the moment. Just love yourself more, feel good about yourself, empower yourself. Okay, well the generation that has been the greatest beneficiary of that generation Z is more depressed, more anxious, more lonely, more purposeless, more godless than any other generation. So it can't, that can't be the problem. Self love can't be the problem. I would say if we're looking at the problem, look at the correlation between godlessness, the increase in godlessness in this youngest generation and their misery and their, and their sadness. And I'm not saying, hey, if you just pray more, you'll automatically be happier. And that's. And that's it. No, I'm talking about having an eternal sense of purpose. That, that this world is bigger than you, that your life is bigger than you, that other people matter too, that you don't just exist for yourself. And to make yourself ha. To make yourself happy and to serve yourself. I think that does wonders to people's mindset. And even you know, that overused term today, mental health.

[Charlie Kirk]

And if you have a service mind, you actually end up being a lot more fulfilled. And that's what happens when you mature. The definition of maturity is, is when people start to look at not just what their own actions impact themselves, how their actions might impact other people. And a immature person is someone who, no matter what they do, their actions will never impact other people. For example, an immature person, someone who never leaves the basement no matter what they do that day, unless they do something on social media or whatever, if they just play video games by themselves, their actions are gonna have really no bearing on other people. That's immaturity. It takes actually a lot of responsibility to go and someone relies on you to show up on time to actually produce something of value. And all of this is rooted in the biblical, you know, canon and the biblical ideas and biblical truth. And this also has had to do a lot with kind. And I want you to talk about the differences between Christianity and other religions because there's been this kind of Eastern religion influx where a lot of the self love nonsense actually comes from this kind of quasi Buddhist yoga culture where I can ascend to a higher level of peace because it's all about me. And I make a very provocative argument, but I don't really care. It's what I do. That Buddhism is the ultimate most selfish religion. It's all you care about is yourself. You spend seven hours a day not talking, being completely unproductive. That's unbelievably selfish. Like you're just, you're wasting your time just worrying about finding your own inner peace. That's like self love gone completely awry.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

And there might be some therapeutic meditative reason to do that for some people, but the idea, the highest level of achievement for Buddhism is to never talk again. If you talk to a legit Buddhist, it's never to speak. Right.

[Ali Stuckey]

You're doing a terrible job.

[Charlie Kirk]

No, I know, but it's interesting though.

But in Christianity, though, in John 1, speaking is actually the ultimate form of pursuit, right?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

The spreading of words, the spreading of truth. They couldn't be more polar opposites. And there's other religions we can contrast. Why is Christianity different?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, that's so interesting that you make that connection. And I do talk about that in my book, not specifically about Buddhism.

[Charlie Kirk]

What's the book named title?

[Ali Stuckey]

You're not enough. And that's okay.

[Charlie Kirk]

I was going to paraphrase it, but I was going to say like escaping the toxic culture. Don't love yourself. And that's okay.

[Ali Stuckey]

No. So you're not enough and that's okay. Escaping the toxic culture of self love. And just to clarify, it's not a book about self loathing or why self loathing is better, but why God's love is profoundly more satisfying than superficial. So definitely check it out. But we talk about in the book this new age idea that I think is infiltrating the church and in particular women's ministries. And here's how it, here's how it manifests itself without even people realizing. And so you read in something like girl, wash your face that the, the most important thing is your journey to your inner self. And that underneath all of society's expectations and your insecurities and your self consciousness is this perfect inner goddess. And this is not what they say explicitly, but this is the underneath of these kinds of self love books is this perfect inner goddess. And that if you just journey to find yourself, you find your true authentic self. No matter what people say. If you can brush off the patriarchy and capitalism and all these unjust systems that are holding your true goddess self back, then finally you'll manifest goodness. You'll manifest good things in your life. You'll finally be happy and healthy and chase after your goals. And well, as I like to say, the self can't be both the problem and the solution. So if you're going to read one of these books because you're like, ma', am, my life is in shambles and I'm looking for something to make it better because you know, I've got these bad character traits or these things in my life, whatever. Well, you can't go deeper inside yourself to find the solution that is also in yourself. You have to go outside of yourself, namely into the God who made you, who provides the satisfaction and fulfillment that you're trying and failing to find inside yourself. That's just one part of Christianity. Ultimately, why Christianity sets itself apart from something like Buddhism, which is ascending to a higher self, which is, by the way, I know I'm going to make some people mad.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's perfect.

[Ali Stuckey]

But some, but some people don't understand that that is also the philosophy that is behind something like the Enneagram. The Enneagram was created by New Age philosophers who believed in ascending to your true self and that personality types would help you get there. I am not slamming all personality tests is completely destructive.

[Charlie Kirk]

Just be a female thing.

[Ali Stuckey]

But just understand that that is the philosophy behind a lot of these things. To understanding your, your true self and knowing who you really are. That obsession. I've gotten so many emails from women saying thank you for writing about this. Cause I was so. I got an email from someone the other day who said I was so obsessed with my Enneagram type that I could not read the Bible without thinking about that. Cause I couldn't figure out which number I was that everything that I saw was. I was trying to figure out the lens through which I should see the world rather than scripture. I was thinking about my Enneagram type, so it can become an idol. This New Age stuff for some people and it clouds out their real faith. But so those type of New Age movements, Buddhism, other kind of religions, and a lot of other religions tell you how to ascend to God. So climbing the proverbial hill to get to God, you have to do these things to make yourself holy enough to be godlike or to get to the top of the hill. Christianity says, look, Ephesians 2, you're dead in your sin. So if you're dead, you're not just a bad person, you're dead in your sin, you're helpless, you're lifeless, you're a corpse, you're going to be buried and then Christ comes down the hill to rescue you and to make you alive. That is the gospel. Christianity is the only one who says you cannot ascend the hill. There's no sacrifices that you can do. There's no good that you can do. There's nothing that you can do to make God love you. God loves you because he created you and sent his son to die for you. I'm going to get off my throne. That's what Christmas is. I got off my throne, I came down and I rescued you because you could not save yourself. Every other religion tells you how to ascend to God to save yourself. God says, no, I'm getting off my throne. Coming down to you to save you.

[Charlie Kirk]

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A movie that was unintentionally, a great example of this unintentionally, but it's A phenomenal movie where someone goes and serves sacrifices and dies so someone else might live is Saving Private Ryan. It's a perfect movie of a rescue mission.

Again, it was.

It's. It's about actually amazing American heroism. But it's the gospel. Perfectly.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah. Right.

[Charlie Kirk]

Where this is a guy. Right. Who's slated to be killed and all of his brothers are killed. Right. Who's going to go save him? Well, someone who lives a comfortable life gets and comes and then dies so he can live.

That's the gospel.

Right.

[Ali Stuckey]

And isn't that interesting that those are the movies that we want to watch? No one wants to watch the movie about cowards. Like, no one wants to watch the movie where one of the greatest sacrifices. Yes. And all of the best war movies and a lot of just the best movies in general are about that redemption and are about that sacrifice.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Ali Stuckey]

Again, that speaks to the fact that our hearts are after the gospel. Even fricking weirdos in Hollywood.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, of course. And I mean, you look at two other movies. That one was made by a guy who is a Christian. I hear he's fun, to put it lightly. Is Mel Gibson, Braveheart Dies.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

Right. With William Wallace. Literally died. But. And then also Gladiator.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

But that idea of sacrifice for something of a greater purpose.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, that.

[Charlie Kirk]

That is a very. That resonates with us on a level that is more than anything we can even process.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

There's a spiritual kind of rhythm to that.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah. Because we're made in the image of God. And whether we admit it or not, we are all seeking after that. We are all seeking after God in one way or another, in our affinity for that sacrificial story is God created us with it as a tool to guide us to him.

[Charlie Kirk]

So in closing here, let's kind of talk a little bit of politics. Where do you see things? You take it any way you want.

[Ali Stuckey]

Oh, well, I'm a little. I don't know when this is coming out, but as I'm recording this, I am worried about the state of Georgia and how it is going to affect the state of the country. And I'm really worried about if it doesn't go the way that, you know, Republicans and conservatives want it to go. I'm worried about the legislation that's coming down the pipeline. I don't think the Democrats care one bit that even if they push all the radical legislation that they want, that they're going to lose the majority in the House and in the midterms, which they would. I don't think they care. I think that they are going to, you know, they're going to do whatever they can while they have the opportunity. And we're talking about, as as much as they can, a radical reconstruction of our systems for the worst. Like we've already seen with Biden's perspective picks for his administration, that he is much more concerned with intersectionality and narratives about economic and environmental justice and injustice than he is about actually getting anything done that's good for the country. And Donald Trump, you know, whatever people think about certain parts about Donald Trump, one thing I really liked about him is that he cared about getting things done. He cared about having effective cabinet picks. And I really do think, like you did a panel with about China earlier at SAS that I just thought was incredible. And there is no worse man for this moment than Joe Biden when it comes to a threat like China and when it comes to our domestic needs and with all of the personality traits that Donald Trump has, he was the right man for the moment. And I'm worried about the shift of going back into the Obama years, except worse. But, you know, for such a time as this, we'll figure it out.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, your voice is more important than ever before in this moment.

Thank you.

What the title of the book is you're not Enough. And that's okay.

[Ali Stuckey]

And that's okay. I got the second, Escaping the Toxic Culture.

[Charlie Kirk]

I only asked you just because I always, I always screw it up. I think I did it in our first interview. I totally screwed it up. I was like, you're not okay.

[Ali Stuckey]

You're not okay. And that's enough.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, that's what I said.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah. Well, I guess that's. No, that's not really true. It's a little pink book. Guys can read it. It is kind of geared towards women, but it is a little pink book.

[Charlie Kirk]

I want to compliment you though, because this, and I meant to chime in, but you, you were doing a phenomenal job detailing it. This kind of self love women's ministry culture in a lot of mega churches. And it's really interesting, particularly in the south. This is growing like crazy. I don't know if you've seen that or not as well, but especially in Georgia and Alabama and Texas.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

There is a massive movement of this kind of Oprah style theology. So Oprah theology.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

Is like, well, there's a God, but we'll never know him. And yeah, he's ambivalent. And you don't pray. You just kind of exist and meander and you know, we'll go buy a bunch of lotions and something like whatever, right?

[Ali Stuckey]

Essential oils, Charlie. Yeah, essential oils.

[Charlie Kirk]

I don't know what a mimeogram is. Okay, whatever that thing.

I meant to interrupt you. I have no idea.

[Ali Stuckey]

It's a personality test.

[Charlie Kirk]

Is it like horoscope?

[Ali Stuckey]

Well, that's. It's similar, but defenders of the Enneagram will get really mad if you call it that.

[Charlie Kirk]

What is it? What is it? Is it immigram?

[Ali Stuckey]

Enneagram.

[Charlie Kirk]

You see, we're learning.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, it's. It's personality. It's personality type.

[Charlie Kirk]

Is it very popular? They like roll dice and stuff or is like they fill out things?

[Ali Stuckey]

No. I bet Erica's probably taking it. I've taken the test. I guarantee Erica can tell you what's your numbers, so. But I don't even know. No, I'm not a three. I'm not a three because I'm not an accomplisher. But

[Charlie Kirk]

let me, let me ask you. Let me ask you this last question though, about that. Why do you think women are more likely to. To do that than men? I've never even heard of it.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, well, because I think that we are, and I mean this in a really good way. God made us this way. We're more emotional creatures. Like we really want to empathize and understand and that includes ourself. But the Bible doesn't really call us to that kind of like self understanding journey. Not that it's bad to understand how we work and the personality and the gifts that God gave us. I think that's all well and good, but when we obsess over that kind of thing, like the self becomes the idol. And it's like that girl who emailed me. It's like you're not even able to see the world through a biblical lens. And what is God calling me to, but what is appropriate for my personality type? The Enneagram was created by a freaking lunatic who was. I'm not kidding. He says he was visited by a demon who told him how to create this whole thing. And so it's crazy, but it's infiltrated the church. Like churches are using this stuff. Like is the word of God not sufficient for. For self understanding? I don't know. Yeah, women are attracted to it, I think for that reason. And a lot of women weren't taught theology. It's like, oh, men need the hard stuff and. And women just kind of need to be told that you're not fat or something like that. Like that's our biggest problem in the world is that we're insecure about our bodies. And so every book that we read and every sermon that we hear is just about how society is so bad and we have been oppressed. And all you need to know is that Jesus is there to tell you that your hair looks pretty. It's like no woman. Your biggest problem is men's biggest problem, that you're a sinner who's going to stand before a holy God one day. And if Jesus Christ is not your justification, then your destination is the same as any sinner. That's the woman's biggest problem, just like anyone else is. And if we're not taught proper theology and soteriology, then we're destined. Destined for hell, just like anyone else.

[Charlie Kirk]

I tell people, and we say this on our podcast, the best way I can get people's attention about the gospel is you will die one day, no matter how hard you try. Do you know what's going to happen next?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

If the answer is no, then I hope you look into this podcast.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, definitely. But I was told that if you. If you wear a mask, that you'll never die.

[Charlie Kirk]

Oh, is that the new mark?

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah, that's. Yes, that's. Well, the God of scientism told me that.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes, that is the new. That is the new religion.

[Ali Stuckey]

That's the new doctrine. Yeah. And patron saint Anthony Fauci is.

[Charlie Kirk]

You know what's amazing is that there is more truth about epidemiology in the bible than anything Dr. Fauci has ever said. No, it's interesting. You look at the rabbinical laws, washing your hands before eating.

[Ali Stuckey]

I've ever thought about this.

[Charlie Kirk]

Quarantining the sick. It's in Leviticus. Leviticus 3. Right, Andrew? Or something. Leviticus, which is if someone in your community or something is sick, remove them. They understood germ theory before anyone else. And the earth, not the earth. The Bible has more insights into a spherical earth. I mean, the Bible is a scientific document just as much as anything else.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

When I say that the secular.

[Ali Stuckey]

Angry. Angry.

[Charlie Kirk]

But they've never read the Bible. Yeah, they don't under. They don't know that. But that's another discussion for another time.

[Ali Stuckey]

Yeah. Yeah, that's interesting.

[Charlie Kirk]

Allie, thank you for joining us. And your podcast is.

[Ali Stuckey]

Thank you. Relatable. And it's on BlazeTV. You can get it anywhere. You listen to podcasts.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's terrific. All right, thank you, Ali.

[Ali Stuckey]

Thank you.

[Charlie Kirk]

Thanks so much for listening, everybody. Again. If you want to support us, go to charliekirk.com support email us your questions. Freedomarliekirk.com thanks so much for listening. God bless.