The Charlie Kirk Show

Episode: Ben Shapiro on George Floyd, Israel, and Gen Z
Date: September 9, 2025
Host: Charlie Kirk
Guest: Ben Shapiro

Overview

In this dynamic episode, Charlie Kirk hosts Ben Shapiro for a sweeping discussion centered on three major topics: the George Floyd case, the ongoing Israel-Hamas conflict, and generational attitudes (especially Gen Z) toward civilization, politics, and Western values. The conversation also delves into Ben's latest book, "Lions and Scavengers," which provides a philosophical underpinning to many of these debates. Throughout the episode, both Kirk and Shapiro challenge mainstream narratives, critique media coverage, and urge listeners to uphold traditional Western principles.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Nature of Rights & The Tim Kaine Clip

[03:08 – 11:04]

• Charlie Kirk opens with an extended meditation on the source of rights in America, contrasting the Founding Fathers' idea of natural rights (from God, not government) with what he sees as the Democratic Party's (exemplified by Sen. Tim Kaine) belief in government-granted rights.
• Notable Clip: Tim Kaine equates the American and Iranian views on rights, questioning the idea they originate from a Creator.
  • Charlie’s reaction:

    "He believes the government gives you rights, that laws give you rights. That's why he's okay with aborting babies, because those humans have no rights. Because the government hasn't given those rights to him." (06:31)

• Kirk uses this as a foundation to discuss the existential divide in America regarding what government is and should be.

2. Media Narratives & Race in Crime

[12:34 – 19:40]

• Van Jones’ Criticism of Charlie Kirk (CNN Segment): Jones accuses Kirk of “race mongering” regarding a recent crime where the perpetrator referenced race.
  • Van Jones:

    "For Charlie Kirk to say we know he did it because she's white, when there's no evidence of that. It's just pure race mongering, hate mongering." (14:06)

• Charlie’s Response:
  • He clarifies he was quoting the attacker and accuses the media and left-wing activists of inconsistent standards since the George Floyd case.
  • Critiques Van Jones and broader criminal justice reform efforts, claiming these enable repeat offenders to harm more people.

3. Deep Dive: George Floyd Case

[19:40 – 21:21]

• Ben Shapiro On Medical Evidence:
  • Shapiro summarizes his research on George Floyd’s autopsy, asserting the cause of death was an overdose, not police action.

    "The autopsy report showed that he had a massively enlarged heart, that he had extraordinary quantities of drugs including fentanyl in his system. Enough fentanyl to kill a normal person multiple times over... The medical evidence does not suggest that he actually died as a result of Derek Chauvin's knee on his neck. It suggests that he died as a result of probably excited delirium..." (19:40)

• On Racism & George Floyd:
  • Kirk and Shapiro both point out that even federal prosecutors did not charge Derek Chauvin with a racially motivated crime.

    "Literally zero evidence was provided to the idea that Derek Chauvin killed George Floyd because George Floyd was black. That just was not inevitable. It wasn't even alleged." (20:48)

4. Israel, Gaza, and the Concept of "Civilization"

[21:21 – 34:52]

• Israel’s Military Actions, Qatar Attack:
  • Kirk asks Shapiro to explain a recent Israeli bombing in Qatar; Shapiro details Qatar’s role as a Hamas sponsor and the complexities of regional negotiations.

    “Qatar sort of plays both sides... It has provided extraordinary material support to Hamas directly. Billions of dollars... The idea that Israel would be able to fly 10 F16s all the way across the Middle East to Qatar... without American knowledge beggars the imagination.” (22:01)

• Endgame in Gaza:
  • Kirk raises the question of Israel’s definition of victory—whether unconditional surrender is the aim, drawing a parallel to WWII Japan.
  • Shapiro responds the goals are to release hostages and eliminate future military threats, but criticizes Israel for not acting more rapidly.
  • Discusses the realities and limitations of "perfect war" and the PR battle Israel faces.
• Accusations of Genocide and Ethnic Cleansing:
  • Shapiro refutes claims of genocide or ethnic cleansing by Israel, citing statistics and Israel’s humanitarian efforts.

    “There has never been a genocide attempted in world history in which the food that was being shipped in was more than the daily caloric intake of the average American into the areas where you're supposedly attempting to genocide the population.” (29:38)

  • On ethnic cleansing:

    "Moving people out of heavily urbanized areas that are honeycombed with terrorist booby traps pretty much everywhere is not the same thing as, quote, unquote, ethnic cleansing." (32:50)

  • Both challenge media coverage as biased against Israel, mocking the conspiracy theory of Jews "owning the media."

5. Ben Shapiro’s Book: "Lions and Scavengers" & Civilization vs. Resentment

[35:52 – End]

• Premise of the Book:
  • Shapiro presents a philosophical divide—every individual and civilization has "lions" (builders, defenders, creators) and "scavengers" (the envious, resentful, destroyers).

    “...there really is the dutiful part of you that wants to engage in what God made for you... And then there is the part of us that's driven by envy... tries to rip down the lions out of pure envy.” (35:52)

  • He links this to coalition protests and activism on college campuses, arguing disparate causes unite only in their shared hatred of Western civilization.

    "Queers in Palestine get thrown off buildings. So what is the answer is that the radical LGBTQ group doesn't have much in common with the pro Hamas group, except that both really, really hate the west..." (36:45)

• Is Islam Compatible with Western Civilization?
  • Shapiro’s critique: Islamic societies, as currently constituted, lack vital Western virtues like property rights, rule of law, and individual freedom.

    “You’re not seeing a lot of Islamic countries on planet earth right now that live by any of the fundamental principles like freedom of mind, private property, equal rule of law..." (37:54)

• What the West Lacks: Courage to Stand Up
  • Calls on “good people” to be less apologetic and more confrontational about defending Western civilization.

    “It is totally fine to say to people who wish to destroy our civilization, no, your values suck and they don't belong here.” (38:43)

• Roots of Modern Resentment:
  • Shapiro locates anti-civilizational resentment in boredom, envy, lack of gratitude, and a culture of blame—particularly in the context of higher education.

    "Gratitude as a characteristic of human beings has to be cultivated... Envy is totally natural..." (39:37)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Charlie Kirk on rights:

  “Government does not make your rights. Government can only respect them or violate them.” (04:48)

• Charlie Kirk on Van Jones:

  “Race hustler, Marxist, Van Jones... Your magical spells don't work here. Your little hocus pocus. You are racist. Boop. Doesn't work here. We got holy water here.” (13:48)

• Ben Shapiro on George Floyd:

  “The original coroner suggested that if they had found George Floyd dead in his home, they would have assumed that he died of a drug overdose.” (19:40)

• Ben Shapiro on Israel-Palestine PR War:

  “The charge that Israel has been indiscriminate in its use of force in the Gaza Strip is an absurdity on its face. Israel has complete air superiority over the Gaza Strip. If it wanted to level the place and turn it into a parking lot October 8th, it certainly had the military capacity to do so.” (27:27)

• Ben Shapiro on radical activism:

  "The radical LGBTQ group doesn't have much in common with the pro-Hamas group, except that both really, really hate the west and believe that the traditional values of our civilization need to be destroyed..." (36:45)

• Ben Shapiro on defending the West:

  “It is totally fine to say to people who wish to destroy our civilization no, your values suck and they don't belong here.” (38:43)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Opening and Tim Kaine natural rights debate: 03:08 – 11:04
• Van Jones criticism & Charlie’s response: 12:34 – 19:40
• George Floyd case & autopsy discussion with Shapiro: 19:40 – 21:21
• Israel, Gaza, and Qatar bombing explained: 21:21 – 24:18
• Israeli goals and occupation prospects in Gaza: 24:18 – 26:57
• Critique of Israel’s war strategy and PR challenges: 27:27 – 29:31
• Genocide/ethnic cleansing accusations addressed: 29:31 – 34:52
• Ben Shapiro on "Lions and Scavengers"/civilizational dynamics: 35:52 – 39:37
• Roots of resentment & Gen Z worldview: 39:37 – End

Tone & Style

The episode is energetic, argumentative, and unapologetically conservative, featuring rapid-fire debunking of mainstream media narratives and forceful advocacy for Judeo-Christian and Western principles. Kirk's delivery is combative yet laced with occasional humor and sarcasm; Shapiro brings his trademark logical rigor and philosophical framing.

Conclusion

Listeners to this episode will come away with a comprehensive conservative critique of contemporary debates around rights, race, Israel, and the generational struggle for the soul of Western civilization. Ben Shapiro’s guest appearance provides both factual counterpoints (on George Floyd, Israel) and larger moral-philosophical arguments, culminating in a thesis on the importance of defending the core principles of Western society.