Podcast Summary: The Charlie Kirk Show
Episode: Can California Turn Red with Pastor Rob McCoy
Date: September 6, 2020
Host: Charlie Kirk
Guest: Pastor Rob McCoy
Overview
In this passionate episode, Charlie Kirk sits down with Pastor Rob McCoy of Calvary Chapel, Thousand Oaks, to discuss whether California—a Democratic stronghold—could shift politically to the right. Their conversation covers church resistance to government pandemic mandates, political awakening among Christians, the mechanics of cultural and political change, ballot security, and the spiritual importance of worship and music. The dialogue weaves together religious conviction, civic engagement, and optimism about potential conservative revival in California and beyond.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Keeping Churches Open Under COVID Mandates
- Pastor McCoy's Defiance:
- McCoy shares that his church chose to stay open during the pandemic despite legal challenges and government pushback.
- Church attendance exploded from 400 to over 2,500 since reopening on May 31—revealing a significant public hunger for leadership and freedom.
- "Open your church. ... People are coming who wouldn't darken the doors of a church. They're wondering who's going to lead them out of this draconian misery." (Rob McCoy, 02:12)
- Legal & Health Details:
- The church was fined $3,000 and faces ongoing contempt hearings.
- No COVID cases have been traced to their gatherings; they use air filtration but do not enforce social distancing or masks.
- "There's no social distancing, no masks, because there's no empirical data to support that. And they're trying to muzzle the church." (Rob McCoy, 04:19)
2. Why So Many Pastors Remain Compliant
- Many pastors hope for the best and prefer peacemaking over conflict, but are gradually realizing the government has little interest in accommodating churches.
- Hundreds of California churches are beginning to defy restrictions, indicating the start of a larger movement.
- "You may have the best of intentions ... but the governor is not interested in your church surviving. It's time to open up and push back." (Rob McCoy, 05:25)
3. Spiritual and Political Liberty
- Kirk and McCoy connect religious liberty with civic liberty:
- "The gospel is the most important thing. But the second most important thing is protecting the government that protects the preaching of that gospel." (Rob McCoy, 06:46)
- They reference biblical confrontation of tyranny (Moses vs. Pharaoh) as a parallel to churches resisting state overreach.
- "When you have oppression that supersedes God in a society, you must stand up against it." (Charlie Kirk, 08:28)
4. Political Transformation: Minnesota as a Case Study
- Kirk notes Trump's surprising competitiveness in Minnesota as evidence that no state is permanently blue or red.
- "If you would have told me five, ten years ago, Republicans would be contesting in Minnesota, I'd say, 'What are you talking about?’" (Charlie Kirk, 10:28)
- McCoy draws parallels to California:
- The Arkansas example—legislature flipped from Democrat to Republican through perseverance.
- "We're looking at California, which has 15,280,000 evangelicals. Half have not been registered to vote." (Rob McCoy, 12:22)
- Awakening among churches, especially with high-profile examples like Nancy Pelosi’s salon visit, is bridging left-right divides in opposition to government overreach.
5. Demographics, Voter Engagement, and Hope for California
- Huge untapped potential exists if evangelicals register and vote.
- Hispanic pastors and congregations, traditionally Democrat, are engaging with conservative ideas due to frustrations with current governance.
- "With an awakening comes a revival. ... There’s hope for California down the stretch." (Rob McCoy, 13:16)
6. Divisions on Splitting California
- McCoy critiques movements to split the state, arguing efforts should focus on winning legislative seats instead.
- "Politics is done by addition and multiplication, not by division and subtraction." (Rob McCoy, 18:13)
7. Vote by Mail and Ballot Security Concerns
- Pastor McCoy recounts his wife's experience receiving multiple ballots after an address change, raising fears of fraud.
- Ballot harvesting in 2018 is cited as a key reason for Republican losses.
- Churches are encouraged to help ensure ballots are delivered safely and that congregants are registered.
- "It's not illegal. Run the voter registration. ... Make sure those ballots are taken to a secure setting." (Rob McCoy, 24:16)
- "Do you think vote by mail is one of the impediments from taking California back?"
- "I think it’s dangerous right now, but I think we can overcome it if we're vigilant." (24:19)
8. Signs of Political Change on the Ground
- McCoy observes less publicly visible support for Biden/Harris than previous Democratic candidates, even in blue areas.
- "In California, I don't see Biden signs, but I see Trump signs." (Rob McCoy, 25:29)
- Fear of social reprisal keeps support for Trump under wraps, but overt displays are increasing.
9. The Spiritual Dimension of Music and Worship
- Discussion on fighting state bans on singing in church:
- "You can't fellowship and sing with masks on, and you can't fellowship with social distancing. And neither of them have empirical data." (Rob McCoy, 28:21)
- Charlie Kirk references St. Augustine on the spiritual nature of music, the absence of evolutionary explanation for music, and the role of music in worship and culture.
- "Music is something that is spiritual in nature. It is not physical in nature." (Charlie Kirk, 28:52)
- Both agree that music in worship is essential, and banning it reflects the tactics of totalitarian regimes.
- "The great dictators always ban music first. Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao—they go after the musicians." (Charlie Kirk, 32:05)
- McCoy shares the story of "Amazing Grace":
- "It combines freedom, it combines slavery, it combines redemption and understanding. I mean, what a profound ... that's the beauty of music." (Rob McCoy, 33:57)
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- "Going to church via the Internet is like watching a fireplace on your computer screen. There's no warmth."
— Rob McCoy (04:19)
- "Liberty is not man's idea, it's God's idea. ... Set the captives free."
— Rob McCoy (04:19)
- "When you have oppression that supersedes God in a society, you must stand up against it."
— Charlie Kirk (08:28)
- "Politics is done by addition and multiplication, not by division and subtraction."
— Rob McCoy (18:13)
- "Music is something that is spiritual in nature. ... You can tell a lot about a culture by the music it embraces."
— Charlie Kirk (28:52, 29:45)
- "The great dictators always ban music first."
— Charlie Kirk (32:05)
- "It combines freedom, slavery, redemption, and understanding ... that's the beauty of music."
— Rob McCoy on "Amazing Grace" (33:57)
Important Timestamps & Segments
- 01:14 – 02:12: McCoy describes legal challenges and church attendance surge
- 03:23 – 04:19: Addressing why other pastors aren't resisting
- 06:46: Linking gospel freedom with civic liberty
- 08:19 – 09:04: Biblical examples of resisting tyranny
- 09:47 – 15:38: Kirk and McCoy discuss political landscape shifts in Minnesota and implications for California
- 17:13 – 18:13: Debate over splitting vs. reclaiming California
- 22:19 – 24:48: Ballot security, vote by mail, and church-based voter engagement
- 25:04 – 27:00: Visible political support in California and trend observations
- 28:21 – 32:46: Importance of music in worship and spiritual/totalitarian implications
- 33:57: The meaning behind the song "Amazing Grace"
Tone & Language
The conversation is bold, unapologetically conservative, and impassioned—with a strong sense of urgency, faith, and optimism. Both Kirk and McCoy speak with conviction and occasionally theological depth, infusing the political discussion with spiritual language and biblical references. Their tone is hopeful but combative, positioning themselves as voices of resistance within both the church and the broader political landscape.
Summary
In this episode, Charlie Kirk and Pastor Rob McCoy argue that California’s political future is not fixed and that religious and political renewal are within reach. They call on churches to reopen and believers to become civically engaged, challenging both governmental overreach and voter apathy. They critique vote-by-mail processes, discuss demographic and policy trends, and connect the current political moment to deeper spiritual and historical themes. Through discussion of worship, music, and biblical leadership, they invite listeners to see both religious liberty and political freedom as essential and interconnected—and to take action to protect both.