EXCLUSIVE Afghanistan Intelligence from a Former US Operative that the Corporate Media Doesn't Want You to Know

Summary

---

The Charlie Kirk Show

Episode Title: EXCLUSIVE Afghanistan Intelligence from a Former US Operative that the Corporate Media Doesn't Want You to Know
Date: August 22, 2021
Host: Charlie Kirk
Guest: Dr. Keith Rose, Former US Intelligence Operative

---

Overview

In this urgent bonus episode, Charlie Kirk sits down with Dr. Keith Rose—a veteran with over a decade of intelligence experience in Afghanistan—to discuss the chaotic aftermath of the U.S. withdrawal from Kabul. Dr. Rose provides on-the-ground insights and intelligence that, according to both Rose and Kirk, the mainstream media is not sharing. The conversation covers the failure of U.S. leadership, the fate of stranded Americans and Afghan allies, the broader geopolitical fallout, and how the crisis exposes weaknesses in current U.S. military and political strategies.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Scope of the Disaster in Kabul

• Comparison to past crises:
  Dr. Rose asserts the Kabul situation is worse than Saigon or the Iranian hostage crisis, calling it an “unforced error of galactic proportions” ([02:42]).
• No one saw this coming:
  Even top intelligence minds were blindsided by the swiftness and severity of the collapse.

Quote:

“What we have now is something that even...some of the sharpest minds in the intelligence services and even in the military, retired folks, no one saw this coming. This is an unforced error of galactic proportions right now.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([02:42])

2. Taliban Power and International Implications

• Taliban’s Backers:
  The Taliban is heavily enabled by Pakistan’s ISI, with some support from China and Iran ([04:22], [33:33]).
• Notorious figures poised to return:
  Siraj Haqqani, a key Taliban/Haqqani Network leader responsible for high-profile kidnappings, is reportedly en route to Kabul ([04:38]).
• Taliban’s growing sophistication:
  They now have access to advanced US military equipment, including MRAPs and night vision, which could be shared with adversaries like China and Russia ([10:07], [10:30]).

3. The Failed Evacuation & US Response

• Blocked Extraction Operations:
  While UK and Australian special forces are rescuing citizens outside the airport perimeter, US troops are restrained by leadership and rules of engagement ([06:36]-[07:52]).
• Underestimated American presence:
  Dr. Rose estimates over 10,000 Americans, including many dual citizens, are still trapped, despite the government’s uncertainty ([12:55]).
• Airport Logistics:
  The US controls only the airport interior; the streets outside are dangerous and chaotic, complicating the evacuation ([12:08]). There’s fear of anti-aircraft attacks ([12:20]).

4. Situation in Kabul: Reality vs. Official Narrative

• Taliban “Charm Offensive”:
  They are delaying atrocities in city centers, but brutal acts (executions, targeting of women, etc.) already occur in smaller provinces ([15:24]).
• Biometric Data Leaked:
  The Taliban reportedly have US-gathered biometric data ("bats and eyes"), putting collaborators and their families at risk ([15:31]).

Quote:

“We're hearing the Taliban have the biometric data of a lot of people... Some of them are hiding in houses, some of them with family members.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([15:31])

5. Critique of US Military & Political Leadership

• Leadership Failures:
  Rose claims the paralysis at the top is due to appointments based on “wokeness” and ideology, not competence—singling out Gen. Milley and Secretary Austin ([07:48], [21:16]).
• Failure to act decisively:
  The Biden administration is described as slow, lacking urgency, and not empowering field commanders to act ([08:29], [19:57]).
• Political, not military, calculations dominate:
  The withdrawal is perceived as ideologically driven and poorly planned ([03:43], [26:42]).

Quote:

“This is what happens, Charlie, when you elect people based on their wokeness.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([06:48])

6. The Humanitarian and Long-Term Consequences

• Potential for American deaths:
  Both guests fear a “mass riot” at the airport or Taliban kidnappings are looming, possibly resulting in American casualties ([19:11], [45:02]).
• Allies and US trustworthiness:
  US inaction is damaging global alliances and emboldening adversaries (ex: Taiwan, India) ([11:36], [26:42]).
• Impact on domestic politics:
  Rose suggests the crisis may cost Democrats dearly, stating: “This could be an extinction event for the Democrat Party. I don't think they understand their ice age.” ([31:38])

7. Solutions and Path Forward

• Need for competent leadership:
  Both advocate for nonpartisan, experienced professionals to step in, comparing this necessity to President Kennedy consulting Eisenhower during the Bay of Pigs crisis ([30:28]).
• Apply pressure on Pakistan:
  Strong diplomacy—particularly with Pakistan—is viewed as pivotal ([32:01], [33:05]).
• Realistic timeline:
  Even a “best case” would take weeks to months to resolve ([34:46]).

Quotes:

“We could back down Pakistan in a heartbeat. We're the United States of America.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([42:24])
“Best case scenario, you're...three weeks critical and two months.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([34:48])

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On US arms in Taliban hands:

  “They didn't seize them. It was an Easter egg hunt...they were like, surprise, here we are.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([10:14])

• On the Biden Administration:

  “It's the same Joe Biden that didn't care what happened after Saigon...The problem is...there’s nothing there [in the bullpen].” — Dr. Keith Rose ([36:53])

• On Wokeism and Leadership:

  “When you have nothing important to do, the unimportant becomes important.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([25:49])

• On the future of Afghanistan:

  “There are people in Kabul...that have never known anything but freedom...these kids are coming unglued because their limited freedom meant more to them than anything.” — Dr. Keith Rose ([45:02])

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:42]—How bad is it in Kabul? ("Saigon to Iran, we're actually establishing a new low...")
• [04:22]—Explanation of Taliban's support network (ISI, Haqqani, Pakistan)
• [05:59]—Current reality in Kabul; inability to extract Americans
• [10:07]—Taliban acquisition of US military equipment
• [12:55]—Estimated number of Americans stranded
• [15:24]—Reports of executions and biometric data concerns
• [19:11]—Risk of violence, mass riot scenario at the airport
• [21:16]—Leadership critique: "When you promote people based on ideology and not competence..."
• [26:42]—Effect on US political agenda and governance reality
• [31:38]—Political fallout: "This could be an extinction event for the Democrat Party..."
• [32:01]—Best case scenario and strategy: pressure on Pakistan
• [34:48]—Realistic timeline for resolving the crisis: weeks to months
• [42:24]—How to force Pakistani cooperation
• [45:02]—Likelihood of American casualties and Afghan attitudes toward freedom

---

Final Thoughts

Both Kirk and Rose repeatedly stress that the ongoing tragedy could have been avoided through better leadership and planning. Dr. Rose’s intelligence paints a dire picture for Americans and allies still trapped in Afghanistan, with an urgent call for action and accountability. The hosts close with suggestions for kinetic action (both military and diplomatic) and a scathing critique of current leadership, warning that if changes aren’t made, greater tragedy—including possible American deaths—is likely imminent.

---

Transcript

[A]

Hey, everybody. Today on the Charlie Kirk Show, a special bonus episode with my friend Dr. Keith Rose, who's a jack of all trades and he served internationally in Afghanistan, and he is now involved in trying to protect Americans and get them out of what is happening right now in Kabul. This is brought to you by all of you that Support [e-mail] support. That's charliekirk.com support where you allow us to do these extra episodes. We are doing five church services this weekend. But I was so moved by my phone conversation with Keith Rose, who's actually been in Kabul and has contacts in Kabul and has some exclusive information that the corporate media will not tell you. That's right. There is information that is happening right now in Afghanistan regarding American lives that Keith Rose has, and we're going to share it with you. Email us your thoughts freedomarliekirk.com and if you want to get involved with Turning Point USA, it's tpusa.com thank you guys for supporting us. And please, if you are not yet supporting us, please consider doing so. We have a team of editors and a group of amazing patriots that work nights and weekends so you guys can get this content. CharlieKirk.com support here is Dr. Keith Rose. Buckle up, everybody. Here we go. Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

[B]

Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus. I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks. I want to thank Charlie. He's an incredible guy, his spirit, his love of this country. He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful, powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point usa.

[A]

We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country. That's why we are here. Hey, everybody. Welcome to this episode of the Charlie Kirk Show. With us is my friend, Dr. Keith Rose. Keith, welcome back.

[B]

Thanks, brother.

[A]

You are the Jack of all trades, kind of a Swiss army knife. You served in Afghanistan?

[B]

I worked in Afghanistan. I've been a part of the intelligence community. So I worked there for a little bit over a decade back in.

[A]

So you've been there for over 10 years?

[B]

In and out about 12 years in and out between there and Pakistan.

[A]

So. And you. So you have a great understanding of that region and the complexities, and I consider you to be an expert and in the intelligence community, you know, even more than most. So.

[B]

But we did a lot of humanitarian work, too, ironically enough, we helped a lot of people and we helped build a medical infrastructure which is so critical.

[A]

I only say this just to establish our credibility before we get into all this very important stuff. So people don't say, oh, who is this guy? But you really know what's going on on the ground. Keith, on a scale of Saigon to Iran, how bad is it right now in Kabul?

[B]

Saigon to Iran, we're actually establishing a new low. I wouldn't even put it on the scales with Saigon to Iran. Each had their own problems. But what we have now is something that even who I consider some of the sharpest minds in the intelligence services and even in the military retired folks, no one saw this coming. This is an unforced era of galactic proportions right now. I mean, it could turn into one of the greatest humanitarian crisis in the history of not only our country, but the world.

[A]

So let's go through the timeline. And so you were there for 12 years. We pushed the Taliban out of Kabul very quickly, fought them in the Kandahar Valley, and Biden made the decision to withdraw. And so talk about how that decision was made, not to withdraw, but it seems to be an ideological withdrawal. One of the dumbest military strategies I've ever seen.

[B]

You couldn't call it a strateg. I mean, unless it's a strategy for failure. And really the interesting thing, Charlie, from 100,000 foot view, we were there 20 years, four presidents, trillions of dollars to replace the Taliban with the Taliban. I mean, if you think about that, why were we there that long? It's important to understand how. Where does the Taliban get the fuel for their car? We all know most of it comes from Pakistan. A lot of it comes from the Pakistani intelligence services or the isi.

[A]

Trust those guys.

[B]

Well, you really can't trust those guys because they also support a gentleman who we have worked against our entire time by the name of Siraj Haqqani, who from my. Under my reports, from my guys says is on his way to Kabul and we cannot.

[A]

Who is that?

[B]

Siraj Haqqani is a gentleman that has a $5 million bounty on his head. He runs the Haqqani's network. He likes to hold himself out as a mujahideen, a great jihadi, but he's really the turban version of Tony Soprano. He's about. He's about the money. He's the guy that was responsible for the kidnapping of David Rhodes. David Rhoads, the New York Times reporter?

[A]

Yeah, the journalist.

[B]

The journalist. He was responsible for the kidnapping of Bo Bergdahl.

[A]

In fact, The Trader.

[B]

Yeah, the Trader. In fact, a little inside baseball. We knew where Bo Bergdahl was. There was an active working group that had a plan to get Bo Bergdahl out. That was solid.

[A]

And I want to just tell our listeners, Bo Bergdahl was. He abandoned his company and we traded five Gitmo prisoners for Bowe Bergdahl. This is a big controversy in the Obama era. Just catching up on.

[B]

Absolutely. And one of those Gitmo prisoners we traded, I believe is the number two person in the Taliban right now. That rolled into.

[A]

And he said he was just a shopkeeper, wanted to look after his dad. So, Keith, let's. Now we're going to kind of jump all over the place. But I want to talk about what's happening now, what is happening in Kabul, because we're being told by the Biden regime, and that's what they are. Everything's fine. Just get to the airport. No problem. What is the truth, based on your intelligence of what's happening in Kabul, what's

[B]

going on in Kabul right now? And I apologize. I haven't slept much in the past four days.

[A]

That's okay.

[B]

Because there's a lot of really. Just let me couch this. There's a lot of really good people. I'm just a wheel in the cog. A cog in the wheel. That's how tired I am of folks working. But we're coordinating efforts because the problem in Kabul right now is that we cannot get our people, the people that helped us, the people that hold American passports that are being turned away because they're not on a quote list, into the airport. Now, the Brits and the Aussies have sent teams out and they're picking their folks up outside of the airport.

[A]

So they've authorized.

[B]

They've authorized their special forces to go

[A]

find their citizens, and we haven't.

[B]

We haven't. Our guys could do it. We have the best of the best.

[A]

That's called an ngo, right?

[B]

Is that Rules of Engagement?

[A]

Yes. So.

[B]

But they're locking them down right now. They're not allowing them to go do that. Because I believe that this administration and the leadership. This is what we're seeing as a galactic failure of leadership. This is what happens, Charlie, when you elect people based on their wokeness. You know, if you understand General Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, and General Austin, who's the Secretary of defense, both of those were colonels that were passed over twice for promotion. We call them double passovers. They were unpromotable in this. There's A reason in the system when you're not promoted, it means there's no spot for you. You don't have the leadership capabilities to go to the next level. Yet somehow, miraculously, their careers were, were revived under President Obama. And I believe General Petraeus had something to do with it bringing these guys forward. And now they're at the highest points of leadership. And I can tell you firsthand that they're locked in a room staring at a TV and they don't know what to do because they're not war fighters.

[A]

Yeah. And we did a whole podcast on this which is Millie and Austin are CRT in action. Right. Which is the only type of white male they like is a self hating, obedient white male. And then a diversity pick, Lloyd Austin. But that's a separate issue. Let's go straight to the ground.

[B]

And so the ground right now is our troops can't leave. And here's an important note. We have you hear it on the news. We're authorized for 6,000 troops. Biden authorized 6,000 troops on the ground. As of when I checked it last and that was probably a few hours ago. There's only 2500 plus troops on the ground because they are slow dripping these troops in a battalion at a time.

[A]

Why are we not acting with urgency?

[B]

Well, because we're doing a measured response, Charlie. And the way it was described to me, and this is urgency, this is, we have, we have a lot of problems here. We have the Taliban. And the Taliban to understand them is not just the Taliban. We have the largest number of foreign fighters that we've seen in Afghanistan to date. And this was reported. And the reason I know this was reported to the Pentagon and the reason I know this was reported in the intelligence services is because I delivered those reports. And we said, and I'm sure other people did, we gave them video evidence. We said we are seeing an uptick. And this is a year, two years ago. I remember you and I talked fighters.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

In Afghanistan.

[A]

Remember you and I had that conversation

[B]

and I showed you the video and I said, they're not even fighting now. We were doing just our duty as patriots, reporting on what we call atmospherics. I do a lot of relief work and I wanted to make sure people that I worked with were safe. So when I would get these reports, we would get eyewitness reports from people that have worked with us a long time saying, you have, you know, we have people that are not Afghans that are coming in. And the interesting thing was they weren't fighting they were waiting. They had excellent equipment in what we call kit, and they were just biding their time and growing in number. And if you, if you look at this from a strategic standpoint, we now have more Al Qaeda, whether they're Uzbek, Chechen, wherever they come from on the spectrum in Afghanistan than we did when we got there in the first place. It's much more dangerous. Add on top of that the fact that we abandon our weapons, our equipment

[A]

and Bagram to the enemy.

[B]

To the enemy. And the interesting thing I saw, CNN said Taliban seized weapons in Bagram. They didn't seize them.

[A]

It was a.

[B]

Stumbled upon them. It was a Easter egg hunt. I mean, they went in there and they were like, surprise, here we are. And those weapons. There's a reason that this is important. We have an eyewitness report as of two days ago that three flatbed trucks, each with two MRAPs.

[A]

What is that?

[B]

MRAPs are the large armored vehicles we transport our troops with. But they have armor systems and weapon systems. Armor and weapon systems. And the armor is top secret. It's, it's a new type of armor and they're being taken to Pakistan. Most likely they'll end up in China or Russia and it'll be reverse engineered. So we now have, and you've seen the pictures on TV, you now have Taliban carrying American weapons. We're seeing M4 SAWs, ACOGs. They have our optics, our night vision, and they're walking around. They're wearing our helmets and our kit. And this is why this is important. It's showing the world that not only are we withdrawing from Afghanistan, this is a humiliation of epic proportions. And in a time right now, geopolitically, when our allies should be emboldened, because they're our allies, they're having, I imagine, a lot of second thoughts, like places in Taiwan. So if, if you want to know why we're doing this, I can't tell you, but the effects are going to be felt globally.

[A]

Yeah. The intentions, I can speculate. And that's what we do a lot of. And we're usually right. But I want to get down to the logistics because there's something I'm quite not understanding. And so the airport is one of the only airstrips in all of Afghanistan. Right. This is a 6th century country and we basically built that airport.

[B]

If I'm not. Well, the most secure airstrip we had, Charlie, was Bagram Airfield.

[A]

And we, we abandoned it.

[B]

Easy to defend and we abandoned it.

[A]

Yeah. And so some people are saying we should go retake that. And so the Kabul airport we have control of, is that correct? Interior on the end we have the

[B]

interior of Kabul airport, but a C17, a large transport left today and on its lift out right over the airport, it was shooting off flares. So we have control of it. But who is shooting off the airplane?

[A]

Because what does that mean?

[B]

They're concerned maybe there are some anti aircraft weapons, some air to surface mission

[A]

might be put a rocket propelled grenade out.

[B]

Yeah. And who well know. Or a heat seeking. That's what the flares are for. For something like a stinger.

[A]

Oh wow.

[B]

We don't. I would like to know, did we leave those in Bagram? We. I will tell you, we did have a report of those type of weapons getting to the Taliban a year ago.

[A]

So we control the interior of this airport, but on the exterior, in the streets of Kabul and the other villages, how many Americans are their teeth? Because our own government doesn't even know this.

[B]

We are collecting information. We have people working around the clock collecting information from friends, guys that work there like I did, humanitarian workers, everyone that worked there. And we're collecting this massive amount of information. The best guest I can have with American passports is over 10,000. And these are Americans. Look at it. You know, some people go to Mexico to visit their family. They're American citizens, they're third generation Mexicans, but Americans, third generation Americans that are Mexican and they go to Mexico to visit their parents. A lot of people knew that Kabul would eventually fall, so they went to see their families. What they didn't understand was that the President of Afghanistan would leave in the

[A]

middle of the night, turn over the $69 million.

[B]

Right. And $169 million in cash, as the report would have to be.

[A]

That's like two Gulf streams full of cash.

[B]

No, but it is like a C130. So my question is, who flew, did we fly him out? I don't know that. And. But I think it's a question that could be, should be asked because we're watching Charlie. Just so you ask about Saigon, when

[A]

Saigon fell, when we're pushing helicopters into the ocean.

[B]

Joe Biden has an interesting history in all this because Joe Biden was the senator that blocked the aid that general that President Ford requested after Saigon fell to help the refugees. And he said, and this is, this is easily researchable f those guys, we don't owe them anything. He blocked the aid. He's, he's one of the nastiest, meanest, vile people. That is a racist.

[A]

Yes, He.

[B]

He has shown a history. He worked with Senator Byrd. He is. He has been shown former kkk. Former KKK grand wizard. He has a racist history. And this is not political. This is just describing Joe. So you're right before.

[A]

He is very vengeful. And people don't realize that about his personality things. So. So. So there's 10,000Americans. Where are they in Kabul? Are they in restaurants and diners? I mean, explain to us what's actually happening on the streets of Kabul, because this is hard for Americans, including myself, to kind of. Does the Taliban control every neighborhood? Do they control every street yet? Or is it just kind of this unspoken, like they are in charge now?

[B]

The Taliban are in charge. They're not everywhere.

[A]

They're not ubiquitous.

[B]

They're not ubiquitous, but they're there. And here's what people don't understand. They're the larger city centers. They're doing a charm offensive. But the smaller areas, to give you an example, someone that helped us in a smaller province. I received the video the other night from a relative, and it was him being executed by the Taliban.

[A]

American?

[B]

No, he was Afghan, but he had worked against the Taliban. The other thing is, we're hearing the Taliban have the biometric data of a lot of people. And the interesting thing is we had something called bats and eyes where we would go out and collect biometric data. Our military would retinal scans, fingerprints, and somehow the Taliban has gotten a hold of that data. And you ask where the people are. Some of them are hiding in houses, some of them with family members. I know of one lady who is an American citizen. Her child with her does not even speak anything but English. She was turned away with her passport from the gate three times because she wasn't on the list. Well, and to give people some credit, it's. It's very hard because everyone is at the gates right now. And so there's no processing center.

[A]

It sounds like a mess.

[B]

It's beyond. But there's a way to fix this. There's a way to create a processing center. There's a way to set up an orderly processing. And I don't. For security reasons, I don't want to go into why we're. How we're doing this, but we're shooting for this goal. It's not getting planes into Kabul, and it's not getting people on the list. It's getting them from the street into the airport. And right now we have Taliban that are beating people. They're not committing the atrocities too much in public. They Are committing some. They've killed the four ladies that were trained in the air force, the Afghan women. One was stoned and the rest, three other three were killed on the roof of the palace. They. But there is a confirmed, there are many confirmed reports that the Taliban are going to wait till we leave and when we leave, they're going to systematically go through.

[A]

There's a little bit of kind of a self control order, like keep yourself in line a little bit. You know, don't overly agitate the Americans. What's to say that they're not going to start to kidnap a couple Americans?

[B]

I pray, because they still have the ability to make money right now without kidnapping them. I don't want to go into details, but we want to get our people out safe. That's the most important thing, is getting people out safely. The Taliban could change at any moment. I believe that some of their leaders are trying to show that they could govern differently and to the international, and to the international community. And I think that's great. My prayer is that the Taliban will back up and allow people to leave. But here's what concerns me. Joe Biden has set Aug. 31 for a tentative, like we're going to be out by August 31st. September 11th has meaning in the Middle East. And what we're seeing, I believe, is what happened thousands of years ago when Jerusalem was attacked by Saladin. When Jerusalem was attacked by saladin, there were 12 days of some of the most intense fighting. And on the 12th day, they took Jerusalem. It's 12 days from the 31st to September 11th. Now the Middle Easterners, the Southeast Asians, the AFGHANS, they have 4,000 plus years of history and it means something to them. Joe Biden can't remember what he did yesterday. And if we don't pay attention to history and understand that this is significant and they could use this, this is, this is the, and this is what bugs. A lot of us have spent time there. This is the fulfillment of what Osama bin Laden started. He wrote about it and we handed it to him. And it didn't have to happen this way.

[A]

So in the current moment, this could go wrong at any time.

[B]

It could, it could. Just the other thing, to answer your question on the ground we're concerned about, in 2006, there was a, an accident with one of the MRAPs. They hit some local fruit vendors and some people were injured. Well, anytime that happens in Afghanistan, you could get a thousand, two thousand people crowding around, see what's going on. A soldier panicked and Shot into the crowd with his 50. Some people were killed. And there was a mass riot, and it almost leveled that side of the city. Our concern is a mass riot to get into the airport. If you have a hundred thousand people trying to kick down the walls, that could happen. That could. And so what we're trying to do is figure out from our leaders, and we can't get in touch with them. Now, we understand that there are paralyzed.

[A]

Who is running. I mean, from what I understand, the way that the military apparatus is built, that they have different continental commands, Right? So someone's in charge of Africa or Europe. Who's in charge on the ground? Mark Miller.

[B]

I don't want to go into names, but there's a general that's in charge on the ground there that's doing a great job. He really is. There are a couple.

[A]

He's actually there in Kabul.

[B]

He's in Kabul. There's.

[A]

And he just must be losing his mind.

[B]

But he can only do so much with the support that he's given. There's folks at the UN that are there now. They're not the official UN guys that are always there, but the guys that are running it now, good guys, because they're not the typical UN guys. The people that are there understand the mission. The American people understand the mission. The only people that are holding back this from being a successful endeavor are behind closed doors, looking at a TV screen, and they're paralyzed with fear. And that would be the Biden administration and the Joint Chiefs.

[A]

But all of a sudden, 100American soldiers are going to die or something. Or. Charlie. There's a legitimate fear.

[B]

I mean, you're seeing it. You've seen it with the coronavirus. You've seen it with our military. The southern border, wide open. When you promote people based on ideology and not competence, when a true disaster hits, lays them bare for all the world to see.

[A]

So. So successful in the terms of a disaster. Right. I mean, I guess what we're talking about is the success right now is no Americans die, but the Kabul has fallen. Afghanistan has fallen.

[B]

Kabul was handed away. Afghanistan. Interesting enough, there is a resistance in the Panjshir.

[A]

Yeah, talk about that. And where is the Panjshir?

[B]

The Panjshir is the northern plains, because Kabul is southeast. Well, Kabul is kind of in the center. It's kind of in the center.

[A]

It's right near the Pakistan border.

[B]

Well, it's two hours from Jalabad, and Jalabad's near the Torkin border, which is near Pakistan. Kabul is not in the Middle of the spoke, but it's kind of there. If you go north and east, you're going up into the Panshir, which was where Massoud, the Lion of the Panjshir, that was executed before 9, 11. He was the charismatic great leader in Afghanistan. His son is now the number one military commander for a gentleman by the name of Amarula Saleh. He was a former head of the nds, which is the Afghan intelligence, who is now the de facto president of Afghanistan. He is a serious man. He is a man that is wise. He's got great tactics. He is a strategist, and he has a lot of strategy, and he is working with a very charismatic young Massoud. So they are making a stand there, and I pray that we somehow figure out a way to support these guys, because at the end of the day, we've had this conversation. The Afghans can take care of things. We pushed the wrong thing. We built up an army with people that we just looked at numbers and money. We didn't look at who we were bringing into the army, who we were training. We. We didn't work with the militias that were already established in the good fighters. We brought in a lot of guys from wherever we could put a warm body, and there was no organized building.

[A]

How is it possible the Taliban took back Kabul so quickly? I mean, that's hard for me to believe. 150,000, 300,000 Afghan fighters that allegedly had an air force. How is that possible?

[B]

Well, they had an air force, but the Biden administration didn't let the contractors that work on the planes back in the country. So they have an air force, but they don't have maintenance. You can't fly a plane without maintenance. They didn't fire a shot to take Kabul.

[A]

How is that possible?

[B]

Well, when the president left with. With money, with lots of cash, and says we're. I'm giving it to Taliban that caught. I was. I know where I was when that happened. I had friends calling me, going, what just happened? I think in the final analysis, we're going to learn these. But the Taliban could have been held at bay. We were doing that with just 2,500 troops. We were holding them at bay, but we stopped flying what we call tactical air. We stopped giving air support. We stopped paying attention to the actual intelligence reports that were being passed. I'm not alone in this. It's come out now. The State Department knew. The intelligence community said they warned. But at the end of the day, President Biden was right. The buck stopped with him. We were Always going to leave Afghanistan. But the way we are leaving, I mean, look at the number of Americans we lost at Pearl Harbor.

[A]

2000 plus.

[B]

Look at the number of Americans we lost at 911-3000. We went over to Afghanistan because of 911.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And we stand to lose up to five times as many people and up to four times as many American citizens by our own malfeasance in the way we're pulling this exit. We haven't put enough troops in. We're not allowing our troops to go out into the city and get our people. All because of a leadership. Not our rank and file, not the mid level guys, but a leadership that feels like it's more important that you understand white rage, that you understand critical race theory. I can promise you the soldiers on the ground don't care what color you are. They care about the guy on their left and the guy on their right. They care about their brothers. We call each other brother. No one cares what color you are. And so when you cut, it's real. It's real simple. Charlie. When I was, when we came on a Ford operating base one time, we were in Afghanistan, we'd been out in the sticks and we were stopped by a young officer and he said, you guys need a wheel walker. And I looked at my buddy and he goes, roll this eyes. And a wheel walker means you need someone walking next to your vehicle so you don't go faster than the person walking. So there's no accident because it's a safety issue. We're in a war zone on an operating base, Ford operating base, but we need a wheel walker. When the officer walked off, I looked at my buddy and I go, bro, what's up? And he goes, simple bud. He goes, when you have nothing important to do, the unimportant becomes important. And what you've seen right now is you have a, you have an administration and a military leadership that had a lot of important to do, but they made the unimportant critical race theory wokeness important. And the important stuff has risen up because history has a way of just, you know, sticking its head up and we're not ready for it.

[A]

So now I want to get into the implications of this internally in the White House base and any sources that you. How are they processed? Do they processing this? Are, do they realize. I'm sure they do realize, give us some insight into what the, the atmosphere is there. I mean, I believe this has thwarted their entire political agenda. This is not going away.

[B]

This is. Look, we stopped being Democrats and Republicans when this happened. We're Americans. We have. Our country is in extremists. Our allies don't trust us and our enemies don't fear us. And no society survives like that. And currently, right now, I believe, and from what I understand the Biden administration, it's not that they, they not only don't know what to do, they don't know where to look to find what to do.

[A]

How is that possible in a multi trillion dollar government and a multi trillion dollar military apparatus? No one knows how to win a

[B]

war when you have nothing important to do. The unimportant has been important. You got rid of the people that know how to fight a war. Charlie, In World War II, so many, a lot of generals were fired or killed because they weren't. There was a guy named General Lawton who was in. Was in the Japanese theater, was in the Asian theater. He was very successful. 38 years old. Eisenhower, General Eisenhower recognized what a stud this guy was and brought him over to the European theater. Eisenhower fired his West Point roommate and put this guy in charge. And when he was asked why, he said, because he fights and he wins. We don't do that anymore. We haven't won a war since World War II. We don't fire people for lack of winning. We don't. We don't look at upwards. You fail upwards. And that's. And eventually, you know, when the music stops, we're standing. There's not a chair.

[A]

And so the one thing about war is that it does deal in objective truth where Wokeism doesn't. It's either you're alive or you're dead. You control the city or you don't. And the entire idea of Wokeism, which has now infiltrated the military, is that, well, two plus two can equal five. Well, that's fine. You could believe something that's not true. Do you control Kabul?

[B]

Right.

[A]

That's an objective measurement.

[B]

Right. Who's in control? Right. And you. But here's why they can't understand who's in control. This is the administration that says men can have babies.

[A]

That's right. So you think all of these things are tied together? Obviously, I do.

[B]

I know they're tied together because again, history is the ultimate arbiter of truth. That's why the winners like to rewrite, Rewrite history sometime. But the whole way we go forward is history is our story. You know, it's. It's truth and we have to understand it. And, and as tragic as this is, we could still pull this out. More importantly, I believe this administration has been shown for the failures that they are. Yeah, I don't believe Joe Biden remembers what he did. Ten minutes.

[A]

Yeah, but there's people around him that

[B]

they do and they don't know what to do.

[A]

And so talk about the ramifications for their political agenda internally. Are they, are they scrambling? I mean, this can't be good for any of their ambitions. I'm sure you've seen Biden's poll numbers have taken double digit turns negative in almost every state. I mean, he is sub negative in state. He's like tied for favorability in Oregon. Keith, he's down 30 point favorability in Ohio. I mean, this is, this is serious stuff. Not that I want to politicize this, but. No, politics is how you control the White House. Right.

[B]

Their own internal polling, polling right now shows that 1 in 10 Democrats, I mean, hardcore progressive leftists, have turned away from them and no longer support them. They just lost 10% of their base, not the independents.

[A]

And they can't explain this away. It just seems that even CNN can't explain. There's something kind of in the intuition of a normal American that's like, okay, Trump was a jerk, but he would figure this out. He would have helicopters, bombs, supersonic missiles, whatever it took. There's something that I think that even the normal American can resonate with. Right.

[B]

What I'm seeing, I believe a great thing to do and I would support it, believe it or not, because I love the guys on the ground and I have deep relationships with some of those people in Afghanistan that supported us, is that if the person I believe is running the country, which is Ron Klain's chief of staff of Joe Biden, I would encourage him to reach out and call President Trump's chief of staff. There's actually precedent for that. Back in the Bay of Pigs, I believe Eisenhower came in to President Kennedy, brought Eisenhower in to help him as a consultant. Because this is not a time to talk about tweets. This is not a time to talk about being woke. This is a time to bring our country back to a prominent position. Because when you saw those folks that, that picture of all those people from Afghanistan holding onto that plane, they just wanted to get out. If we don't come together as a nation, there's not going to be a plane that we can hold on to to get out. Where are we going to go?

[A]

I'm afraid this, this regime is not, not willing to do that. And they will suffer a political price because of that.

[B]

Well, it may be this may not just be a losing situation. This could be an extinction event for the Democrat Party. I don't think they understand their ice age.

[A]

Yes. And so, so let's get into like, how prolonged this is going to be. Right. Even in the best case scenario, this doesn't get solved for a week, two weeks, three weeks. Best case scenario.

[B]

Best case scenario is they talk to people that know what they're doing on the ground. They open up gates with control, they allow force to be projected to bring in people and they process and, and they get out the critical people that are under true threat. Those that helped us that not just the ones that are going to get beat up, but the ones that are going to be killed when they do that, they need to. Really an interesting thing, Charlie, is they could fix a lot of this almost immediately if they put pressure on Pakistan. Believe it or not, if we had a State Department that understood the geopolitical, the geopolitical situation right now in that part of the, the world, and we just. Can you imagine a State Department that called the ambassador of Pakistan and said, look, we're not playing anymore. You guys either back off or we're going to make sure that that was the last anniversary you ever celebrate as a country. Because India is going to absorb you. Because we're going to support them with everything we have in Kashmir and everywhere.

[A]

Just India is going to.

[B]

India is going to take it over because we can. We're funding them and we don't have to do that, but we have to have the courage of our convictions. That's real diplomacy and no one should ever hear about it, but they should do it. And they should get concessions. They should say, you're no longer going to support these guys right now. And we're getting our guys out. Because the Taliban have benefactors. That's how they make their money.

[A]

Yeah. Are the Chinese behind the Taliban?

[B]

I think the Chinese have provided support. I think Pakistan is the primary. I think there is Pakistan. Iran and China have always played a role. And here's the strategic significance of Afghanistan that people don't talk about. They have a lot of rare earth minerals.

[A]

And it is landlocked, right?

[B]

It's landlocked with rare earth minerals, but it also shares a border with China, Pakistan and Iran. And if we had a small contingency of people there, maybe we could have an eye on China, Pakistan and Iran instead of just backing. I'm not talking about leaving troops, but we have troops in South Korea, we have troops in Europe. It's not unprecedented, but what is unprecedented is the way we're treating this and just how flippant we are with, you know, we're trying to tear a band aid off a wound that if we do it the wrong way, the patient bleeds to death because they just ripped it off, not realizing it was on a major vessel. And the genie could be put back, but it's going to have to.

[A]

So the best case scenario is this gets wrapped up in a couple of weeks, but we're not on pace for a.

[B]

Well, not even wrapped up. We have to still establish other routes for people to get out. We have to still establish a lot of.

[A]

You're talking about a couple months.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Deal here in the best case scenario.

[B]

Best case scenario, you're. You're three weeks critical and two months.

[A]

And they're not on pace for a best case scenario right now.

[B]

They're not on pace for a scenario right now.

[A]

That's a couple months crisis.

[B]

Well, it could be but a three week big crisis because again, you're running into the historical significance of 9 11. It was. I really believe in don't contribute to conspiracy. What can easily be explained by incompetence? Because I'm looking at who's in the White House, but more importantly back here, Charlie, I pray we fix this. And I also pray that people see elections have more than consequences because right now the British Parliament came out against our military.

[A]

What do you mean?

[B]

I mean against Joe Biden. Not the way our military is not being allowed to perform.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

I mean that's unheard of. When the Brits.

[A]

I'll be honest though, Keith, you know what's so stunning to me? So best case scenario, three weeks, we solve it. Worst case, this drags on for months into the killing season of September and October, early November. I'm really stunned we haven't seen dramatic compensating action from Biden. In a normal regime, they'd say, you know what? Oh my goodness, we screwed up. We're bringing in 10,000 troops. I'm flying to Doha tomorrow. We're setting up a command center. Here's who's in control. It seems almost intentional flat footedness. Am I seeing that wrong?

[B]

No. I spoke to some friends of mine that have their ears in the special operations community and what someone told me today, and I don't know this personally, but this guy is in the know and I've worked with him before. He said none of the special operations teams that we would have on the step to get moving have even been told to get to pre deployment so, again, from multiple sources, I understand we have a paralyzed leadership in the Joint

[A]

Chiefs, and they're just hoping it gets better.

[B]

They're struggling. Opium is not a strategy.

[A]

And did you see what Biden did in the Stephanopoulos interview?

[B]

I did.

[A]

He said, man, no Americans been killed yet. And he knocked on wood. Our president knocked on wood.

[B]

It's the same Joe Biden that didn't care what happened after Saigon. It's the same Joe Biden that was a racist his entire career. He is. And it's the same Joe Biden that's really not there now. The problem is the Democrats, we always say, don't have a deep bench. They're looking to the bullpen, and there's nothing there. And then they also has a problem with the southern border, Charlie. And you can't put that many American weapons into the hands of terrorists and have an open border. There's no math in any type of wokeness that were one plus one equals two on that one, because those weapons could get in the wrong hands. We have a porous border. Then we have to bring in refugees. Then we have to do the adequate.

[A]

We're already doing that.

[B]

Yeah, we are.

[A]

And I came out strong against the refugees because, first of all, we don't know who a lot of these people. And second of all, you don't have to take them into your country. You can accommodate them in other parts of the world. You can bring them to German air bases for all I care.

[B]

Right.

[A]

This idea that they have to go to Arizona and Iowa and swing states across the country is insane. Go ahead.

[B]

Yeah. And a lot of the guys I talked to that need to leave for safety said, look, I don't want to stay gone. I want to go back to my country.

[A]

Well, that's the whole point, is that all of a sudden now we have. And this is where I, you know, the media lost their mind on what I said, which is we do not have an obligation to resettle them in America. We might have an obligation to help them. You could bring them to any of the multitude of air bases we have across the planet, which is plenty in, you know, the great American empire, you know, from Germany to Japan to South Korea. But this idea we now have to give citizenship to someone who might not really share our values, they might have helped us, but they might not share our American values.

[B]

I'll tell you, a lot of them, though, believe it or not, Afghans, there are a lot of really good folks. We got our interpreter here a while

[A]

back, but you got Somalians, though, too, Keith, right?

[B]

Yeah. Oh, no.

[A]

The same narrative is how we got Ilana Omar, right?

[B]

Oh, yeah. And that's. And she's so appreciative.

[A]

No, that's right.

[B]

And her family is just indebted to us forever.

[A]

We agree. I came out strong against this because you can go into the Congressional record in the 90s. You've. All the Somalians are wonderful people, and Mogadishu is our fault because of our helicopter. Whatever. We need to go bring in all these Somalians from Kenya, and next thing you know, Minneapolis is gone. Right. It's an unrecognizable. That's a different conversation.

[B]

Yeah, it's. It. It lays bare so much of the left narrative when you have a tragedy like this.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Look at Covid. You saw people. You see them jammed together every day now. I. I talked to people in all the hospitals in Kabul. I have a lot of friends that are doctors. I said, are you guys overrun with COVID They're like, no, we know how to use hydroxychloroquine, and we had immunity. And, yeah, it's not an. It's not a thing. And I go, seriously? And one of them starts laughing, goes, look, we can't afford Covid. And he wasn't saying that people aren't dying. I mean, have you seen any mask?

[A]

I mean, I have seen cloths over

[B]

cloths over mask, But I'm saying.

[A]

And your tweet was terrific on that, but go ahead.

[B]

You see the C47 or the C17s taking off with all those Afghans stuffed in. No vaccines, no masks, but you can't get on a plane. Or they're saying they don't want you on a plane without a vaccine and mask. No one was worried about those guys. No one was checking temperatures. And it lays bare this narrative that, why are we becoming such a tyrannical regime where we live? And when you see what's going on there.

[A]

And so here's something I want to explore with you, Keith. The minutes we have. I don't know what time it is. Yeah, we got time. Probably 10 minutes. Is that this is the tyranny of the week, is that we are being ruled in an authoritarian nature by rather weak people. It'd be one thing if Biden was, like, this strong man who is willing to use political power. He's willing to use political power against his domestic enemies, but he's not willing to use political power against the Taliban. It's almost like I'm not willing to actually go get These Americans. Is that the word here, Keith, that is missing, is willingness? Because we have the capacity, we have the ability, we have the troops, we have had the funding. Is it a willingness issue?

[B]

It's a morality issue. And that. And that goes to willing. I know a lot of guys that are up day and night right now that don't have to be. They don't have to be involved in any of this. And they're doing it because we feel it's a moral included. It's a moral issue. The founders spoke about this. They wrote letter after letter on this about morality. We cannot lose morality. And the morality is why we self govern. And the problem is the Democrat party doesn't self govern their own lives. They don't have the morality in their, the way they legislate. So I don't think we can expect them to have the morality or the courage of their conviction to go and do the right thing when they specialize in condemning people, creating victims. So they have the right to rebel.

[A]

Yeah. And it, I mean, I totally agree. I think this is a very important teaching moment. I just gave the speech three times. We're about to give it again, which is that critical race theory in classrooms is all fun and games until you have a crisis in Kabul. And then we value diversity, as you said, over competency. It's straight out of our podcast because we're thinking, we process data the same way. And so this is, obviously, this is a crisis. And according to you, this is not going away anytime soon. And the best case scenario is our government starts to actually promote competency in the short term to fix this. I'm not so confident. I think this is going to be a multi month humanitarian crisis.

[B]

Charlie, there's things we need to do kinetically, immediately to move and do.

[A]

What do you mean by that, kinetically?

[B]

I mean set up these zones to

[A]

get people in military.

[B]

But there's also a political and a state strategy to this. And that's where the lack of conviction comes in or the lack of moral clarity. We could back down Pakistan in a heartbeat. We're the United States of America. We give them money. And there's some great people in Pakistan. I'm gonna be honest, I'm talking about the isi.

[A]

Their government is so sneaky.

[B]

Right. But yeah. So you use a big stick and you say, look, we're not going to give you money and we're going to support the people that don't.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And you do it with conviction. And look, they'll take you seriously because they know Your backs are against the wall. That's the thing that it shocks me is their backs are against the wall, meaning the leadership. And they're frozen. When I started working Charlie, over 20 years ago, my boss told me one thing. He said, never do anything, you know, that is morally wrong that you can't live with. And he said something that I'll never forget that I'm sure a lot of other guys have heard. He said, never do anything, not if, but when it becomes known to the American public, will shock the conscience of the nation. And what we are seeing right now in my lifetime is something that has shocked the conscience Democrat and Republicans of our nation.

[A]

And it didn't have to be this way. Right, Keith? We could have had a prudent withdrawal that would have had a concentric circle type strategy of removal of citizens, destruction of weapons and then eventually leaving. It didn't have to be this way.

[B]

No, this is, this is not a forced error. This is an absolute man made using their own words. We're a man made disaster. I mean it's not climate, the only climate change that they contributed to was incompetence. And when you have incompetence or malevolence or malevolence, incompetence and malevolence, their bastard stepchild is tragedy.

[A]

Yeah. And that's what we're seeing.

[B]

And that's what we're seeing.

[A]

And there will be a moment in time and it's coming where even the most Democrat person doesn't want to see Americans slaughtered by the Taliban.

[B]

And I believe that, you know, I've seen folks that are hardcore Democrats that have come out and said this is wrong.

[A]

Well, and the House Democrats on their call with Pelosi, it was leaked, they are screaming at her like you do not know what this is doing in our district. I mean, you're trying to tell me that some of these Democrats and swing districts in Orange county, which is, you know, should be a center right area, it doesn't matter how Democrat they become, become. They don't want to see that.

[B]

No.

[A]

It is a non stop commercial of America decline and humiliation.

[B]

There's no spinning this.

[A]

It's humiliating and it's not going to go away.

[B]

It's humiliating and oh, by the way, Americans are going to die. We have a.

[A]

Do you think that's going to happen?

[B]

There's a good chance of it. I pray it doesn't. But, and, and I like to be an optimist because right now people watch this. I don't want to encourage, encourage them. I will Tell you, there's good people in Pakistan. There's good people in Afghanistan. I'm not talking about the people causing the problems. I'm talking about the everyday people that want their children educated and they want a better life for them. There are people in Kabul, Charlie, that did not grow up under the old Taliban. They have never known anything but freedom. In Kabul, they didn't. They weren't. Now, out in the districts, it's different. But in Kabul, they didn't. They have coffee shops. They're. Not everyone wears a covering or a hijab. Not everyone wears a burqa. And they had a freedom. And these kids are coming and glued because their limited freedom mean more to them than anything. They meant so much to a soccer player that he held onto an aircraft as it took off. And we metaphorically here are voluntarily not even getting on the plane as citizens and engaging in our politics to keep our country free. And I think it's open. I couldn't agree with you more.

[A]

I know what you hope to happen. But realistically, what is the Biden regime going to do? Are they going to wise up or are they going to be just paralyzed by their own gutless.

[B]

The only play the Biden regime has is to ask for help from those that know what they're doing. If they don't, it's not that they don't want to do the right thing. They do not have the ability or the capacity within their current dysfunctional organization, I believe, to do the right thing.

[A]

I think they're going to be forced to do that.

[B]

I pray they are. I pray that, you know, Mark Meadows gets a call and they say, hey, look, we have a bigger problem than our political differences. We have Americans and extremists. And Charlie, can you imagine if he had President Trump come in and consult? Ironically enough, it could help heal the nation.

[A]

I don't think it's going to happen.

[B]

Oh, I don't either, but I just

[A]

said, no, it will. And there are reports Jack Posebic put out that Mark Milley is even saying he wants Trump back because he said, this is. This is a disaster.

[B]

I'll be shocked if Mark Milley's still there in a week.

[A]

You think so why are these generals not resigned? That's a good question.

[B]

Well, it used to be that if you didn't do something, you would resign.

[A]

Well, the Japanese culture, they would put a sword through their own stomach.

[B]

Japanese resigned permanently.

[A]

Yeah, that's right.

[B]

But, you know, again, I saw a meme, but it says everything, and it showed the the most successful general that won World War II and Mark Milley. And Mark Milley has a Christmas tree of all of his ribbons and everything. And the most successful General, World War II has one little line.

[A]

Mark Milley also couldn't pass a fitness test on his best day.

[B]

No, our general should not be wrapped in fat.

[A]

And I told Austin is the fattest general I've ever seen.

[B]

I know a lot of guys that. That gave me inside baseball and General Millie, you know, tell me on his, on his fitness reports when as he would be written up his nickname was Brickhead. It's not a, it's not. It's not inspiring in leadership roles. And, and that's the problem, Charlie. They. It's. It's fine if you just want to talk about wokeness and crt, but it's absolutely tragic.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And, and, and malfeasance when he's in a position where he's not. He. I don't know if he's capable of doing. They should bring back retired generals that know what they're doing.

[A]

Yes. And, and there's plenty of support.

[B]

And a good president would have already fired him and replaced him with someone that would do something. But we don't have a commander in chief.

[A]

No, we don't. All right, we gotta wrap it up. Email us everybody. Freedomarliekirk.com if you want to get involved with TurningPoint USA, it's tpusa.com Please consider supporting [e-mail] Support Open up your beautiful phone right now. And there's a podcast app there. Charlie Kirk show. And your podcast the Scalpel. The scalpel with Dr. Keith Rose. Who knows more about what's going on in Afghanistan than our own president. And you heard. Exactly. Exclusively from him. Again, subscribe to the podcast and support us if you can. Charliekirk.com supportbeatpings thanks, brother.