07.08.26 The Clark Smart Way To Buy A Mattress / Student Loan Update

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Clark Howard Podcast

Episode: 07.08.26 – The Clark Smart Way To Buy A Mattress / Student Loan Update

Date: July 8, 2026
Host: Clark Howard

---

Brief Overview

In this episode, Clark Howard explores two central themes:

1. How to buy a mattress the smart (and safe) way in a market flooded with options and uncertainty due to a wave of bankruptcies among mattress providers.
2. A comprehensive update on student loans and college funding—including interest rate hikes, borrowing limits, strategies for paying for college, and maximizing the benefits of 529 college savings accounts.

Clark also fields listener questions on high-yield savings accounts, tax documents retention, tracking subscription costs, and investing for children’s futures.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Mattress Market Shakeup & Smart Buying Tips

[00:00–05:53]

• Mattress Prices Are Falling: Mattress costs are dropping despite overall inflation, largely because the market is overcrowded and several manufacturers are going bankrupt (e.g., Sleep Number Bed).
  • "Cost of a mattress has been going down, down, down, down … the industry is going through a shakeout." [01:45]
• Industry Shift: Casper revolutionized the industry with the "shrink ray" concept—making mattresses that can be boxed and shipped easily, displacing traditional in-store shopping.
• Risk of Bankruptcy: With mattress companies closing, refunds and returns are hazardous for customers if the company folds after the sale.
  • "The hazard is you get this great deal on one that you hate sleeping on and then you can't return it because the company's gone bust." [04:55]
• Clark’s Smart Approach:
  • Buy from retailers with their own strong return policy in addition to the manufacturer's policy—Costco highlighted for its no-deadline return policy.
  • Double-layered refund protection minimizes risk.

2. Listener Questions and Money Advice

Inheritance – High Yield Savings Account (HYSA) [05:56–08:11]

• Banks may advertise “teaser” high-yield rates for small amounts, but Clark advises searching for those without such caps—use resources like Clark.com’s best offers list.
• CDs at investment brokerages (Fidelity, Schwab, Vanguard) may offer better returns for those able to lock up funds.

Retaining Tax Documents [08:11–10:19]

• Clark keeps all returns since the 1980s and supporting docs for 6 years.
  • "The IRS has no limit on when they can come back and say you failed to file. So having the return itself is valuable." [09:09]
• Listener’s unique experience retaining decades-old W2s proved unexpectedly handy.

Tracking Subscriptions [10:19–13:44]

• Listener tip: Put all subscriptions on a single (not everyday) credit card for easier tracking.
  • "Susan, I love this. It helps with what I've talked about with subscription creep and all the different things..." [10:33]
• Clark's own discovery of a rogue FuboTV $109.99 charge—caught only because he checks all card statements.
• Discussion about exceptions where cards offer discounts/free subscriptions, but emphasizes importance of vigilance.

---

3. Student Loans & College Costs – The 2026 Landscape

[14:49–21:05]

• Federal Loans Are More Expensive Than Ever:
  • Rates are up to ~6.5% for new student loans.
  • Most loans are unsubsidized, compounding costs.
• Borrowing Limits Are Now Capped:
  • Unlimited borrowing is "over right now"—a positive because colleges can no longer push families to overextend.
  • Rising costs—but now families are shielded from unmanageable loan loads.
  • "The amount you can borrow is capped. And that is forcing a change in colleges that for more than a generation have been raising tuitions at three times the rate of inflation... That is so over." [15:46]
• Clark’s Advice on College Choices:
  • Don’t destroy your own financial future (or your child’s) with excessive loans—be honest with what’s affordable.
  • Consider cheaper community colleges years 1–2, transferring later to the “dream” school.
  • "Nobody really cares where you attended. They only care where your diploma is from." [17:31]
• 529 College Savings Accounts:
  • Stresses the value of starting early—money grows and can now (up to $35,000) be rolled into a Roth IRA if not used for education.
  • "If a kid doesn't go to college or doesn't need the money or scholarships out, well, it becomes a tax free exchange into a Roth IRA..." [20:23]
• Parental Guilt: Avoid sacrifices that will compromise retirement well-being for the sake of a child’s dream school.

---

4. Listener Q&A on College Savings and Investing

[21:05–End]

529 Plans for Grandchildren – Large Balances & Limitations

[21:05–24:49]

• If the beneficiary doesn’t attend college, up to $35K can go into a Roth IRA; remaining funds can be transferred to relatives for qualifying expenses.
• Regulations unclear on split-beneficiary rollover—wait for IRS guidance.
• If non-qualified distribution, the beneficiary pays taxes/penalty only on earnings (not principal).

"Cost of Attendance" Estimates for Planning

[24:24–24:49]

• Clark’s experience: Published estimates were accurate for two of his three children, but sometimes real costs can exceed estimates, especially out-of-state.

Investment Accounts vs. “Trump” Accounts for Kids

[25:59–End] (Clarifies “Trump” is likely a misheard “UTMA” (Uniform Transfers to Minors Act))

• Prefer custodial investment accounts over “Trump”/UTMA unless free matching money is offered, due to tax treatment.
• Warns of maturity issues—don’t tell an immature child until they’re ready for responsibility.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Mattress Buying:
  "Remember that you want the double layer. The manufacturer's right to return for a refund layered on top of the retailer's right to return for a full refund." [04:33]
• On Subscription Creep:
  "Susan, I love this so much … trying to figure out what you’ve got that you don’t really need." [10:33]
• On College Debt:
  "Parental guilt can be a self destructive motivator. And there are so many college options at so many different tuition levels." [16:42]
• On 529 Accounts:
  "If a kid doesn’t go to college or doesn’t need the money or scholarships out, well, it becomes a tax free exchange into a Roth IRA, which gives your kid such a head start..." [20:23]
• On Documentation:
  "You were a candidate of one for a job with this organization. Who else would be able other than you to produce W2s from 20 plus years ago?" [09:01]
• On Custodial Accounts:
  "Truthfully what a lot of parents do is they don’t even tell their kids they have a custodial account. That’s an investment account." [27:04]

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:00–05:53] – Mattress market disruption & Clark’s buying tips
• [05:56–13:44] – Listener Q&A: Inheritance investing, document retention, subscriptions
• [14:49–21:05] – Student loan rates, borrowing caps, parental advice, 529 strategy
• [21:05–24:49] – 529 plans, Roth rollovers, changing beneficiaries
• [24:49–27:40] – Planning for college costs, best 529 plans, UTMA/investment accounts for kids

---

Tone and Language

Clark’s trademark style—friendly, direct, and consumer-focused—runs throughout the episode, mixing actionable tips, empathy, and some gentle humor (especially around quirky or cautionary tales from listeners). The show is peppered with real-world examples and “learn from my pain” anecdotes.

---

Final Thoughts

This episode is a must-listen for listeners considering costly purchases, confronting the realities of financing higher education, or simply looking for practical, trusted money-saving strategies. Clark’s clear, principle-driven advice encourages listeners to act with caution, do their homework, and always protect their financial future—no matter the sales pitch or the circumstances.

Transcript

[Clark Howard]

Foreign. It's my pleasure to welcome you here to the Clark Howard Show. You know, our mission is to serve you with advice and information that empowers you to make better financial decisions in your life. In today's episode, I'm going to start with something we all use unless you sleep on a mat on the floor, a mattress. Today I want to tell you what a deal it is for you to buy a new mattress and why this opportunity also comes with hazard. Also in this show, there's been a lot going on with student loans, how the programs work, what the interest rates are, and what's happening with college tuitions. I want to make sure you are up to date. If you have a kid in high school or you have a kid already in college, there's some things I want you thinking about because the old thing being able just to borrow unlimited amounts of money for college, that is over right now. I want to talk about something that is a great opportunity for you. In an era of so much inflation, the cost of a mattress has been going down, down, down, down. Because flat out, the industry is going through a shakeout. There's way too many providers of mattresses and not just in the United States, just around the world. The mattress market is overwhelmed with manufacturers and it's why the industry is in bankruptcy court so much right now. Sleep Number Bed recently filed for bankruptcy. That's a well known brand, but a lot of brands that have some recognition in the marketplace, not a lot of have gone insolvent just because the process of how a mattress is made and delivered was revolutionized by Casper. Casper was the company that developed the process or at least popularized the process of making a mattress in the factory and then essentially putting it in the shrink ray machine so that it could fit. The whole idea was that you could drive home a mattress from a store and a Honda Civic. Think about before the redesign of how mattresses were produced, what a hassle it was to get a mattress. So mattresses now can be purchased so many ways, online, delivered right to you by Somebody like UPS or FedEx, by Amazon, at the warehouse clubs which sell massive volumes of mattresses. Now traditional mattress stores, so many of them have gone bankrupt because their method of selling has become essentially obsolete. The key in the mattress business now, because the normal mattress buyers not going to a store, laying down on a mattress and saying that one's not quite right, and then you go, try another one, try another one, try another one. Now you're buying something that may or may not suit you. So mattresses now are overwhelmingly sold with the right to return for a refund for a period of time, usually three months. Because you just don't know buying one of these shrink rate mattresses if it's going to work or not. Now there's a new risk with that because with a lot of the mattress companies folding, you could buy one, think, I really don't like this. Oh, but great. I got three months to return it for a refund and then you find out they've gone bust, there's nobody to return it to and you're out your money. So one of the things I want you to think about is buy at a place that in addition to the manufacturer has a right to return for a refund. Think of the warehouse clubs where you have the period of time you can return an item no questions asked for a refund. Costco, with most things there is no time deadline. So you have the ability to return an item within reason for a full refund. And so the betting market offers what I always call hazard and opportunity. The price is so good right now unless you conspire against yourself and somehow you think you're going to get a better night's sleep if you spend a zillion dollars on a mattress. Not my game at all. The hazard is you get this great deal on one that you hate sleeping on and then you can't return it because the company's gone bust. So remember that you want the double layer. The manufacturer's right to return for a refund layered on top of the retailers right to return for a full refund. And by the way, what does return mean? A lot of the companies say, well, go have fun disposing of it. We don't want it back because what are they going to do with it?

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Right? All right, you ready?

[Clark Howard]

I'm ready.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

All right, let's go to questions that came [e-mail] Ask Joshua in Virginia says I'll be receiving about $30,000 from an inheritance.

[Clark Howard]

Well, Joshua, I'm sorry about losing a loved one.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

I'm looking to put it in a high Yield savings account. HYSA. When I look at different HYSAs, they want to pay the interest rate up to a certain amount. Like on $5,000. Is there a better option or will I have to ladder this money?

[Clark Howard]

Yeah, Joshua, there are organizations, there are banks, online banks that offer teaser rates on high yield savings accounts, but only do so on a small amount of money to try to attract larger deposits. Just ignore those and look for ones that want as much money as they can get from you and never more than quarter million a single institution. You're not going have to worry about that at 30. So if you go on, there are several lists. We've [e-mail] There are many others out there where you can see who's offering the best deals right now. And they're not going to be the ones with the gotcha that only up to so much money. And because inflation has gotten worse, I'm going to throw in a little confusion. You may make more money right now if you have an account through Schwab, Fidelity or Vanguard. If you're willing to put the money in a CD for a period of time instead of in a savings account. If you can tie the money down for a while, you'll likely get more money through a brokerage. It's known as Brokerage Place CD with one of the big three low cost companies to invest with. If you have an investment account with any of them though, you also have the option of going into a money market fund with them. That may out earn what you can earn in a high yield savings account at shockingly low risk. In fact, if you go in a Treasury money market fund with one of them, it will be slightly lower risk than even what you get with FDIC insurance.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Ed in Georgia says, I'm the guy who has retained and filed all financial statements from the late 80s.

[Clark Howard]

I remember that. I remember we were talking about that.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

It was fun to hear that you had a good chuckle out of that one. I enjoyed it too. I do have a follow up question. How long should I retain all taxes tax returns? I'm asking because I started a new job this year and I had to submit some W2s from the early 2000s.

[Clark Howard]

You did not.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

As part of my background check as proof that I was employed with a couple of companies that are no longer in business.

[Clark Howard]

Seriously, from more than 20 years ago. Who could do that?

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Lucky me. You already know I had those W2s.

[Clark Howard]

All right, so you were a candidate of one for a job with this organization. Who else would be able other than you to produce W W2s from 20 plus years ago?

[Commercial Announcer]

Wow.

[Clark Howard]

Okay, so tax returns, what I do is I keep all supporting documentation and my returns going back six tax years and then past six tax years. I have copies of my returns going back to, gosh, the 1980s. I guess you want the returns themselves because the IRS has no limit on when they can come back and say you failed to file. So having the return itself is valuable. The supporting documentation is Worthwhile for the last half dozen years. And your situation is such an outlier with you actually needing those W2s from out of business companies. I would say that you're more likely to be hit by a meteor than to have to produce W2s from a generation ago. But you were the one person who said, see?

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

See?

[Clark Howard]

I keep everything. It paid off.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

All right, Susan in Georgia says, here's another way to track subscriptions that you haven't already mentioned. Put them all on the same credit card, preferably not your everyday card. You'll have a complete list of them on every monthly statement.

[Clark Howard]

Susan, I love this. I love this so much. It helps with what I've talked about with the subscription creep and all the different things and trying to figure out what you've got that you don't really need. And you know how I go through our credit card statements. So there was a subscription for a streaming service called Fubo, which is one that Sports nuts absolutely love.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

I think you might have told this when you were doing the subscription thing, but tell it again.

[Clark Howard]

I just saw this. Oh, this week.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Oh, oh.

[Clark Howard]

$109.99. So I click through.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Wow.

[Clark Howard]

A month.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Wow.

[Clark Howard]

So I click through and it's on a card that we have for our son for emergency expenses. And I said, grant, what in the world is this Fubo thing for? $109. He said, I don't subscribe to Fubo. I said, did you ever do like a free trial to watch some game you couldn't get elsewhere? He said, no. So I said, I need for you to figure this out. So he tries. He's got three different email addresses. He tries all three. None of them are Fubo. So we think that maybe somebody got his number and used it to subscribe. But I've been bugging him for the last two days to call Fubo and try to track this down.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Wow.

[Clark Howard]

But if I wasn't checking the credit card statements, I wouldn't have known. But Susan's idea.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

I love it.

[Clark Howard]

Awesome. To use one particular card. Think of it using one of your back of wallet cards, the ones that you used to use but you still have, but you don't really use anymore. And then you can put all your subscriptions on that and then you have an easy way to track them. Great suggestions.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

I love it. The only thing I couldn't do, though, is a couple of my cards offer me discounts on subscriptions are free. If I subscribe, I get money back. But I think you can, you know, that's one exception, but yeah, because your

[Clark Howard]

American Express pays for which one?

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

I don't use American Express, but they do give you a digital entertainment credit on American Express. But a couple of my other cards, I get money off of my Peloton subscription. I get money off of my Apple tv. I get like actually a free Apple tv, stuff like that.

[Clark Howard]

But those things that are free, it's fine.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Yeah, yeah, it is track, though. But you know, you never know. Maybe the deal goes away with that credit card and then you're stuck with a subscription you didn't realize you're paying for.

[Clark Howard]

Right. So again, Susan, this is part of being a member of Team Clark. I love it. Coming up ahead. Oh man, something that's expensive. College. We're going to talk about how the rules of the game have changed.

[Commercial Announcer]

Self directed investing, Trading, full service wealth management, Automated investing, Financial planning, Thematic investing, Retirement planning, few. And to think that's just a small taste of what Schwab offers. Because Schwab knows that when it comes to your finances, choice matters. No matter your goals, investing style, life, stage or experience, Schwab has everything you need all in one place so you can invest your way. Visit schwab.com to learn more. This episode is brought to you by AT&T business. For business owners, connectivity is key. If you are starting your business today, that would be your first concern and your first decision. Reliable connectivity is essential to launching whether you're local or national. For a business owner, it's a decision that pays benefits every day and in every aspect of your operation. Make the right decision. Choose at&t business at&t business is a reliable provider for business owners. Powered by AT&T Business Built to work Get AT and t [e-mail] so college costs bad Ugly.

[Clark Howard]

The cost of borrowing money for college used to be really pretty friendly. Not anymore. The changes with the federal student loan program have become really tough on families. The interest rates that are in effect for this fall started about 6.5% on federal student loans. That's a lot of carry cost and subsidized loans. You're not having to worry about that till you complete your studies. But most borrowing is unsubsidized federal and that's over six and a half percent. So it's kind of like the mortgage thing. Home prices up, mortgage rates up, double whammy. Student loans, tuition costs were going steadily upward and now the student loan rates going up. But there is some good news. One thing I've been happy about, that's counterintuitive I've been really happy that the amount you can borrow on parent plus loans or student loans, both has been capped. Used to be there was unlimited money available to borrow and schools would manipulate parents and students into just signing, signing, signing for loans. And now that can't happen anymore because the amount you can borrow is capped. And that is forcing a change in colleges that for more than a generation have been raising tuitions at three times the rate of inflation in the general economy. That is so over. But it means that if you have your heart set on sending your child to a school that is a zillion dollars and you don't have the resources to pay that and you just want to do it, you want your kid to be able to go to his or her dream school, you are creating what can be a terrible hangover for your son or daughter later in life. Borrowing to the max that they can borrow and then maybe even dipping their toes or fully jumping in for private student loans that often come with variable rates and get really ugly over time. Or you as a parent sacrifice your own financial future to pay that money. What I'm trying to say is that parental guilt can be a self destructive motivator. And there are so many college options at so many different tuition levels. And going to the it dream school that would create a massive amount of borrowing or parents who stop contributing to their own retirement accounts so that their kid can go to that school. And then way down the road when the parents are in retirement and don't have enough money to live on, then the then adult children are like, gosh, mom and dad should have done a better job saving for retirement with amnesia about what got them to where they don't have enough money. All right, I'm getting right here with brass tacks with the emotional things that are involved in decision making. And it is okay for you as a parent to say to your teenager, we cannot afford that college. Period. Now the compromise, the compromise is freshman and sophomore year at a far more affordable college. And the competition is generally much less to be a junior transfer than a freshman applicant anyway. So freshman year, even at expensive schools, a lot of times you're in these factories of these big classes for the 100 level, what are they called? Prereqs or whatever they are the classes you got to take when you're first in school, take those at a much more affordable place and then go away for junior and senior year to where the dream is. Nobody really cares where you attended. They only care where your diploma is from. But truthfully, after you're out of school a while, nobody even asked where you went. Nobody cares unless your team's winning some sport. So be honest with yourself. Be honest with your son or daughter. Be careful with how much debt you're signing up for. And if it involves digging deep into the well that you have to go past these new federal limits of borrowing and dip into the private loan pool, I think it's time for a different priority. And where you pick for a school. Every parent, every child, every family has to make this decision on their own. Because I'm getting into value judgments here and it's not for me to decide. I'm trying to get the conversation in a different place. And one place is from very young, if you can afford it, funding a good 529 plan. Money grows tax free. It's spent tax free and up to 35 grand. If a kid doesn't go to college or doesn't need the money or scholarships out, well, it becomes a tax free exchange into a Roth ira, which gives your kid such a head start on having a comfortable retirement with that money. Having had an opportunity to grow from being a single digit age forward. Fantastic.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Thomas in Florida has a question. Actually about 529 plans. He says, I started a 529 account for my granddaughter that now has over $150,000 in it.

[Clark Howard]

Wow.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

But she does not want to go to college and has no further educational plans.

[Clark Howard]

Oops.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Other than gradually transferring $30,000 to a Roth for her, what else will happen to this money over the next 20 years? There will be a huge amount of money that is locked in an inaccessible account. Help.

[Clark Howard]

Okay, so we got a few possibilities here, Thomas. That's a lot of money in a 529. That's not normal that somebody would have that much. But the Congress specifically made. You said 30. I'd mentioned 35. Set this cap of 35 grand for money to transfer tax free from the 529 unused into a Roth IRA for the benefit of your granddaughter. That will be a huge boost to her through life. The Congress set that limit because they were worried about really wealthy families using the 529 as a massive tax dodge to move money into a kid's hands because the 529 contribution limits are quite large and then allow money to grow tax free in large amounts. Maybe mega amounts. Like your amount, I'd say for many people would be considered to be a mega amount. 150,000. So Thomas, you have the option, you have Another grandchildren or great niece, great nephew, whatever, who needs help paying for college, and you like to help them, you can change the beneficiary designation and use it for that person's college. That's in many families, what happens is when one child scholarships out, doesn't go to college, whatever, it's moved to the benefit of another. That's the.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

You don't want to do that until you've transferred that 30,000 in terms of that account.

[Clark Howard]

So do you know the IRS still has not issued the rules on how that works if you change beneficiary designation on part of the money in a 529? It's still not clear at this moment. So on that issue, I can't answer that yet because the regulations still are not out.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

But I would say if you definitely want to transfer the 35, 000 to her Roth, I would do that first, just in case. Right.

[Clark Howard]

You can't right now. So the raw thing you can, you don't get to do the 35 all at once.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Right.

[Clark Howard]

It's seven or whatever a year, seven something each year. But if, let's say there's nobody else you'd want the money to go to or anything like that, after you've done the 35 into the Roth for your granddaughter over the roughly five years it takes to do that, you could then distribute the rest to her and she would have to pay tax on the earnings plus a 10% penalty. But being in her 20s, odds are she won't be in a really high tax bracket. And so it would not be a brutal tax hit except for the 10% penalty.

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Okay. Allison in Georgia says, I have two sons, a rising sophomore and and a rising eighth grader. And we are not many years away from college, so we're not many years away from college. I've been saving in their 529 account since each one was born. My question is, since you've already had kids in college, did you find the cost of attendance posted by your kids schools to be in the ballpark for costs? Thank you for all your advice. I listen every week.

[Clark Howard]

Well, thank you very much. And two of the three kids, the college cost estimates for for where they went were accurate. One who went to college in California, it was way more expensive than the estimate and so generally will be in the ballpark on the costs. And speaking of costs, I forgot to mention, I said up front a good 529 plan. What makes a good 529 plan? You buy it direct from the 529 plan, no high commission salesperson involved. 2. There are good 529 plans and bad ones, even those sold directly, although there are very few bad ones anymore that are sold commission free. We do a guide that we revise continually on what are the best plans in the country and we have a decision matrix for you in picking a 529 plan for your child, your grandchild, whoever it is you're setting up. The 529 plan for Chase in New

[Clark Howard Show Producer/Co-host]

Mexico says I have two kids, a one year old and a three year old. I've been thinking about how to best set them up financially because right now the biggest asset they have is time for investments to grow. I am on track for my own retirement. I've been saving a little bit of money for each of them to 529 and that will be worth about 30k each when they reach 18. I also plan to open Roth IRAs for them when they have an earned income. But I would like to also start investing a little bit for each of them to use as a down payment or further boost their retirement. Should I open Trump accounts or open brokerage accounts in my name earmarked for them? Neither are eligible for the free Trump account money.

[Clark Howard]

You know, because of the way the Trump accounts are taxed, you are better off doing investment accounts for the kids when they're not eligible for the free money because the Trump accounts are taxed at ordinary income tax. So that's the highest possible tax where if you open investment accounts, they're taxed at the investment capital gains interest rate, which for people, when they're first financially independent, they're not your dependent anymore, but they're in their 20s, usually will be at 0% or 10%. So it's far preferable to do an investment account than do a Trump account unless you're getting the free money for the Trump account. The free money doesn't necessarily have to come just from being eligible under government rules. It also could be an employer that provides free money to the dependents of their employees. That would make it worth having a Trump account. But here's the downside potentially to doing the investment account is that if you have a child who reaches adulthood and is quite immature, they have the ability to spend that money, which they don't easily in the Trump account because of the way the controls work on it. So the investment account, truthfully what a lot of parents do is they don't even tell their kids they have a custodial account. That's an investment account. And they, they keep it just a little, a little secret. Not a bad secret, but a little secret. And wait till a young adult is mature enough to say, hey, by the way, we put this money aside for you long ago and it's your money to do the down payment on your house or whatever. You got to know the kid, too, because some kids have spent every dollar that ever existed and other kids are wired differently. So the maturity level and the outlook with money that varies from child to child, that's a key consideration when you let them know this money exists. And I want to thank all of you so much for being with us today. Thank you for joining us. This is an opportunity for us all to learn together, to be empowered together with knowledge so that you can save more and spend less and avoid getting ripped off. And Friday, our next podcast is when we get to hear how people feel ripped off by me. How bad is that? Anyway, that's when we do Clark Stinks. And you get to hear where I disappointed you, let you down, or misled you. And so it's how I learned how I can do a better job serving you. I'm Clark Stinks. And this is ever anything you're like, well, you really do stink, Clark. Just go to clark.com clarkstinks and post away and you get to maybe hear it coming up or see it this Friday. See you then.