The Clark Howard Podcast: Ask An Advisor With Wes Moss
Episode Date: December 30, 2025
Hosts: Wes Moss & Kristin Dee
Episode Overview:
In the final Ask An Advisor show of the year, Wes Moss and co-host Kristin Dee explore the essential role of social connections in retirement happiness, dissect the latest U.S. jobs report and broader economic trends, and answer listener questions on topics like estate planning, bond fund selection, Roth IRA withdrawals, and retirement account strategy. The hosts combine up-to-date research with actionable personal finance guidance in a warm, conversational format.
Main Theme & Purpose
Focus:
- Understanding how strong social networks contribute to happiness and success in retirement, based on Wes’s "Retire Sooner" research.
- A deep dive into the state of the U.S. economy and labor market post-government shutdown.
- Tackling listener questions on estate planning, bond evaluation, tax strategy, home buying, and optimizing retirement savings.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. The Power of Socialization in Retirement
[03:46–11:34]
- Social connection is a crucial "retirement asset"; it requires effort and intention, not unlike building a financial nest egg.
- Wes references his 2025 Money and Happiness in America Study:
- Americans with more close friends are significantly likelier to be “happy retirees.”
- Social isolation has increased: In 1990, few reported having two or fewer close friends; by 2024, almost 40% of Americans fell into that category.
- Even with social media, “actual close connections” haven’t increased.
- Optimal Network Size:
- Having 1–2 close friends makes you 22% less likely to be a happy retiree.
- Having 5+ close friends makes you 21% more likely to be in the happy retiree group.
- Quote — Wes Moss (07:41):
“If you have one to two close friends, you're 22% less likely to be a happy retiree… If you have five or more, you're 21% more likely.”
- Social networks change as you age (moves, divorce, illness, death), so maintaining and growing your network requires ongoing attention.
- Organized groups and intentional effort pay off—“socialization begets more socialization.”
2. Retirement, Trusts, & Estate Planning Questions
[11:34–14:41]
- Listener David in Texas: Should his 18-year-old be a guardian/trustee if both parents die?
- Wes advises against giving such responsibility to an 18-year-old, prefers a trusted adult as guardian and possibly a responsible family friend or professional as trustee.
- Trusts allow for money to be dispersed based on specified criteria (health, education, maintenance, support, or "HEMS").
- Quote — Wes Moss (12:15):
“I think the 18-year-old could probably be a successor guardian down the line, maybe when he's in his early 20s. But even that's really, really young.”
3. Evaluating Bond Funds: What Matters Most
[14:41–16:51]
- Listener Terry in Ohio: What are the right metrics for bond funds?
- Key factors: Type of bond (corporate, Treasury, high-yield/junk), yield, duration (interest-rate sensitivity), expense ratio, comparison to a suitable index.
- Quote — Wes Moss (15:30):
“Just remember, high yield is a fancy word for junk bonds… Duration is a really big part of this…the higher the duration, the more the price will move.” - Advice: Shorter durations are less risky; always check fees and index volatility.
4. Roth IRA Withdrawals for Short-term Cash Needs
[16:51–20:49]
- Listener Dick in Arizona: Is it wise to withdraw $100k from Roth IRA to temporarily fund a home purchase?
- Wes says “No”—best not to tap the Roth or IRA.
- Preferred: Explore using a brokerage account (and paying cap gains only on the gain) or a HELOC for a very short period.
- Quote — Wes Moss (18:19): “No reason to use the Roth… Use the brokerage or the HELOC and you’re home free to Arizona.”
- Rationale: Tax implications and the 60-day rule make Roth withdrawals unattractive unless absolutely necessary.
- Wes says “No”—best not to tap the Roth or IRA.
5. U.S. Jobs Report & Economic Catch-up
[23:25–28:46]
- Backstory: Economic data was delayed due to the government shutdown, leading to a “dam burst” of jobs numbers for October and November.
- Labor Market Trends:
- Unemployment rate ticked up to 4.6% (from 4.3%) — not ideal, but “not bad” given an influx of job seekers.
- November: Net gain of 64,000 jobs; October: Loss of 105,000 (“mainly due to government buyouts, not layoffs,” Wes explains).
- Prime Age Employment-to-Population Ratio (ages 25–54) is 80.6%—still healthy and steady.
- Quote — Wes Moss (26:58): “That’s a number that you may want to be looking at… It’s still in the green zone, not the red zone, not even in the yellow zone. So good news for the job market.”
6. Further Listener Q&A: Saving Strategies and In-Plan Roth Conversions
a. Young Adult Saving for Retirement & Home
[28:46–31:17]
- Sarah (Florida): Should she maximally fund her Roth IRA now when planning to buy a house in 3–5 years?
- Wes: Yes, go ahead and fully fund the Roth. If needed, contributions (but not earnings) can always be withdrawn tax/penalty-free for a first home; invest as much as you can afford now.
- “You’re not locking…It’s not a lockbox for your contributions. You can go ahead and take them at your will.” (29:41)
b. In-Plan Roth Conversion: Timing and Tax Tradeoffs
[31:17–33:21]
- Andrea (Connecticut): Should she do an in-plan Roth conversion now or wait until retirement (next year)?
- Key insight: Compare current tax rate to expected retirement tax rate.
- If tax bracket drops in retirement, wait to convert.
- “It’s about taxes today versus taxes in the future. Why pay 30% today when if you wait a year, you’ll be pulling money out at 15%?” (31:35)
- Best done in small increments to avoid bracket jumps.
- Key insight: Compare current tax rate to expected retirement tax rate.
c. Structuring Contributions After a Mid-Career Job Change
[33:21–37:42]
- Eric (Georgia): After job loss and new contractor role (no 401k match), is it better to contribute to 401k, Roth, or brokerage as he rebuilds his emergency fund?
- Wes’s hierarchy:
- Max Roth for both spouses for flexibility and tax benefits.
- Replenish emergency fund with funds in a brokerage account since it’s accessible and easy to use if needed.
- 401k only if able to contribute more, but focus on after-tax savings for accessibility.
- “All of this is almost all your money is IRA money. … The bigger priority is accessibility.”
- Clarifies “rule of 55” only applies if you leave your employer after 55, not before.
- Wes’s hierarchy:
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “You don’t just accidentally end up with a social group that carries you through the rest of your life. It takes some real effort… intentionality.”
(Wes Moss, 04:07) - “Despite social media, which is connected us at least digitally and more broadly… actual close connections, people that on any given day that’s really good or really bad, you can call, that’s a close connection.”
(Wes Moss, 06:29) - “If you have one to two close friends, you’re 22% less likely to be a happy retiree… If you have five or more, you’re 21% more likely.”
(Wes Moss, 07:41) - “I wouldn’t put the responsibility just yet on your son at age 18. I would have another family person that is the guardian and maybe the most responsible family friend as the trustee of the money.”
(Wes Moss, 13:19) - “Remember, high yield is a fancy word for junk bonds… The higher the duration, the more the price of the bond fund will move.”
(Wes Moss, 15:30) - “No reason to use the Roth… Use the brokerage or the HELOC and you’re home free to Arizona.”
(Wes Moss, 18:19) - “It’s about taxes today versus taxes in the future. Why pay 30% today when if you wait a year, you’ll be pulling money out at 15%?” (Wes Moss, 31:35)
Timestamps for Key Segments
- Intros, Year-end Reflections [00:32–03:28]
- Social Connections & Happiness in Retirement [03:46–11:34]
- Estate Planning: Guardianship and Trusts [11:34–14:41]
- How to Evaluate Bond Funds [14:41–16:51]
- Roth IRA for Short-Term Cash / Home Buying [16:51–20:49]
- Jobs & Economic Roundup [23:25–28:46]
- Young Adult: Roth vs. Down Payment Savings [28:46–31:17]
- In-plan Roth Conversions: Now or Later? [31:17–33:21]
- How to Prioritize Retirement Savings After Job Change [33:21–37:42]
- Wrap Up & Thanks [37:42–38:01]
Conclusion
This year-end Ask An Advisor edition is packed with insights—balancing hard financial tactics (trusts, bond metrics, conversion timing) with the often-overlooked “softer side” of retirement: intentional social connection. Wes Moss and Kristin Dee’s banter keeps things light, while their responses offer practical, nuanced strategies for people at all life stages. Their closing message: Financial independence and retirement happiness are both intentional acts—choose to work at both.
For more information or to submit a question, visit clark.com/askclark.