The Commentary Magazine Podcast: "How Did We Get Here?" - Detailed Summary
Release Date: April 4, 2025
Hosts and Contributors:
- John Podhoretz: Host and Editor of Commentary Magazine
- Abe Greenwald: Executive Editor
- Seth Mandel: Senior Editor
- Eli Lake: Contributing Editor, Host of the Breaking History podcast, and Contributor at The Free Press
1. Introduction to the Episode
John Podhoretz opens the episode by highlighting a significant treat for listeners: the reading of Abe Greenwald's latest newsletter, titled "Shock Treatment." This newsletter outlines ten seismic shocks that have rocked the United States since the turn of the century.
2. Abe Greenwald's Newsletter: "Shock Treatment"
Key Points: Abe Greenwald enumerates ten major events shaping America's landscape:
- September 11 Attacks (2001)
- Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan
- 2008 Financial Crisis
- Donald Trump's First Election Victory
- COVID-19 Pandemic
- George Floyd's "Woke" Revolution
- January 6th Capitol Attack
- Joe Biden's Cognitive Impairment in Office
- Rise of Pro-Terrorist Mobs in the U.S.
- Donald Trump's Second Election Victory
Greenwald posits that each subsequent shock has become less astonishing due to cumulative disorientation, leading to societal numbness and a diminished capacity for genuine awe.
Notable Quote:
"Americans have become so oriented to disorientation that nothing stirs genuine astonishment, let alone awe, in us." ([01:43])
Greenwald warns that if Donald Trump continues his policies, particularly undoing global free trade, it could constitute an 11th seismic shock, further entrenching America's acceptance of perpetual upheaval.
3. Discussion on U.S. Shocks and Societal Numbness
Seth Mandel's Insights: Mandel draws parallels between current societal disruptions and the waning attention spans shaped over the past decades. He suggests that the incessant barrage of shocks has rendered the public increasingly inured to such events.
Notable Quote:
"Our attention spans throughout this period have been shaped in a different way. It's unlikely that people's attention spans can ever go back to what they were." ([07:04])
Mandel critiques the notion of a "new normal," arguing that what was perceived as normal post-Cold War was merely an interlude between more tumultuous periods.
4. Trump’s Tariffs and Executive Power
John Podhoretz's Analysis: Podhoretz delves into Donald Trump's unilateral tariff policies, questioning their constitutionality and potential to reset the global economic order. He underscores the risk of the Supreme Court ruling these actions unconstitutional, emphasizing the irreversible shift in U.S. trade policies.
Notable Quote:
"We've crossed the Rubicon. The United States has announced its intention to upend the post-war economic order." ([07:04])
Seth Mandel's Perspective: Mandel reflects on the long-term ramifications of Trump's economic decisions, particularly how diminished public attention spans contribute to a society more susceptible to policy disruptions.
5. Public Opinion on Trade Policies
Poll Insights: John references a Gallup poll indicating a significant shift in American public opinion favoring free trade as beneficial for economic growth:
- 81% believe free trade is good for economic growth.
- 14% view it as detrimental.
Notable Quote:
"As of 2025, 81% of the American people believe that free trade is good for economic growth." ([19:29])
Seth Mandel's Analysis: Mandel connects these statistics to historical trends, noting that party leaders often sway public opinion on trade. He observes that Trump's approach seemingly contradicts the prevailing public sentiment favoring free trade, suggesting internal Republican dissent against Trump's protectionist measures.
Notable Quote:
"If you can pull people along very easily by party leaders, the thing that used to happen was each party would run somebody for president as a challenger." ([19:29])
6. Biden's Presidency and Public Trust
Discussion on Presidential Capacity: The conversation shifts to Joe Biden's perceived cognitive decline and its impact on public trust. Podhoretz highlights recent legal challenges Trump faces over immigration policies, suggesting that administrative overreach may falter in courts due to procedural and constitutional missteps.
Notable Quote:
"The administration may want to have their way on immigration, but if they can't make it stand up legally, they're going to be hit hard." ([19:29])
Abe Greenwald's Commentary: Greenwald draws attention to the erosion of trust in American institutions, emphasizing how continuous upheaval fosters widespread skepticism.
Notable Quote:
"There’s a trust crisis in America because the ground has been shifting under our feet for a quarter century." ([05:21])
7. Free Trade vs. Protectionism
Economic Theories Discussed: Podhoretz critiques the abandonment of classical free-market principles, referencing David Ricardo's theory of comparative advantage. He laments the shift away from economic rationality towards protectionist measures driven by political motives.
Notable Quote:
"We don't believe in free trade anymore; we're throwing it out the window." ([36:55])
Seth Mandel's Input: Mandel connects Trump's tariff policies to historical protectionist tendencies, arguing that such moves undermine long-standing economic doctrines that have historically benefited the U.S.
8. China's Role and U.S. Policy
Eli Lake's Analysis: Lake examines the deteriorating U.S.-China relations, attributing it to Trump's policies that fail to address the comprehensive threat posed by China's economic and military strategies. He warns that weakening alliances may embolden adversarial nations, leading to increased nuclear proliferation.
Notable Quote:
"Liberation Day could provoke China, Japan, and South Korea to retaliate against America." ([36:55])
Seth Mandel's Perspective: Mandel reflects on James Mann's "The China Fantasy," discussing the miscalculations in integrating China into the global economy without ensuring political liberalization, leading to the rise of an authoritarian-led global order.
Notable Quote:
"We believed that bringing China into the global economy would liberalize it, but instead, China has integrated the rest of us into a Chinese-led order." ([36:55])
9. Idol Worship and Political Leadership
Discussion on Leadership Dynamics: Podhoretz introduces the concept of idol worship within the Republican Party, suggesting that unwavering loyalty to Trump resembles idolatrous behavior. He juxtaposes this with Jewish teachings that condemn idolatry, emphasizing the tension between religious principles and political fanaticism.
Notable Quote:
"Trump has created a condition inside the Republican Party in which he is the static figure and fealty to him and who he is and what he believes is what matters." ([60:05])
Eli Lake's Commentary: Lake criticizes influencer figures like Laura Loomer, describing their actions as mentally unstable and detrimental to institutional integrity.
Notable Quote:
"Laura Loomer is a 9/11 truther and she's like a lunatic." ([63:44])
10. Biden vs. Trump: Divergent Views on American Exceptionalism
Contrasting Presidencies: Podhoretz contrasts Barack Obama's and Donald Trump's views on American exceptionalism. While Obama criticized American policies as detrimental globally, Trump adopts a mirror image by demeaning America's alliances and policies, fostering a narrative that both leaders view the nation as flawed, albeit for different reasons.
Notable Quote:
"Obama thinks America's bad because our system is flawed, whereas Trump thinks America's bad because he dislikes what elites are enforcing." ([46:14])
11. Cultural and Ethical Decline
Evolution of Societal Values: The hosts discuss the shift away from traditional values and ethics, attributing it to a desire for a "magical world" devoid of religious and moral constraints. They argue that this trend leads to a society obsessed with artificial enhancements and perpetual youth.
Notable Quote:
"They want to become gods themselves. They want to reverse engineer, but they want to live forever." ([60:03])
12. Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Closing Remarks: John Podhoretz wraps up the discussion by reiterating the transformative and often chaotic nature of recent U.S. history, emphasizing the loss of institutional trust and the rise of populist, protectionist sentiments. He underscores the importance of understanding historical contexts to navigate the present turmoil.
Final Quote:
"We are a democratic republic. You work for the people." ([27:10])
Podhoretz encourages listeners to subscribe to Abe Greenwald's newsletter for ongoing insights into America's evolving political and economic landscape.
Notable Exclusions: The segment from [21:45] to [23:21] contains advertisement content promoting Quince's travel essentials. As per instructions, this non-content section has been omitted from the summary.
Conclusion: This episode of The Commentary Magazine Podcast delves deep into the multifaceted crises facing the United States, from economic upheavals and shifting trade policies to the erosion of public trust and the rise of idol worship within political factions. Through incisive discussions and thought-provoking insights, the hosts unpack how historical shocks have cumulatively shaped the current state of American society and governance.