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- [00:05]
A
Welcome to the Cost of Doing business podcasts. Things on Instagram are pretty shiny, but here we're going to get to the reality behind the scenes on the hard journey of growing a business so we can all learn from each other. I'm your host, Weston Zimmerman, co founder of Synced Up. Been in the green industry my whole life. Let's get into it.
- [00:26]
B
Well, welcome back to another episode of the Class of Doing Business podcast. We are here at the Northeast Firescape Trade show in Connecticut. This is probably the year five first hint up at this show, but I don't know if I've ever run into you here though, have I?
- [00:39]
C
No, no. Yeah.
- [00:41]
B
Have you come to the show before?
- [00:42]
C
Yeah, yeah, I've been to a couple of them. It normally interlocks with or it's confrontational with the schedule of the Con Expo. So every couple years, every three years, it's always that same week in March. So it's always been a. It's always been tough to get to both.
- [00:59]
B
Conex Balls wins.
- [01:00]
C
It's like walking through a shoebox here when you, you know, a week ago we were there and it's like, you know, 14 miles a day.
- [01:06]
B
I forgot about that.
- [01:07]
C
Yeah. So it's a great show, though. It's a lot more intentional here, for sure. Smaller.
- [01:11]
B
Yeah.
- [01:12]
C
But it's. Yeah, it's definitely. It's a big, big difference, for sure.
- [01:16]
B
Well, give everybody listening just an introduction to you, your business, like, and often the way I like to frame the question is like, you know, how many people do you have? What does your business look like? What kind of jobs do you like to do?
- [01:28]
C
Yeah, yeah. So James Doyle, you know, innovative lawn and landscape in Torrington, Connecticut. So we. Connecticut's like two hours from one side to the other. It's pretty small. But we're based in Litchfield county, centered like the northwest corner of Connecticut. Primarily. We're doing, I would say, 60% landscape construction, excavation, smaller site work projects, 40% maintenance. So commercial maintenance, HOA, townhouse community.
- [01:56]
B
And it's full property service, like snow.
- [01:58]
C
Yeah. So we're doing everything, landscape enhancements, you know, all your bed maintenance, things like that, mulch, plantings, upsells, stuff like that. So we're trying to increase that a little bit. We're shifting things a little bit currently right now, we're restructuring everything. We just hired a senior account manager to kind of help nurture those relationships as the business has grown. I've tried to wear the hats for a lot of it the last few years.
- [02:19]
B
That is one thing I know about you is you wear a lot of
- [02:21]
C
hats or you have in the past. Yeah. Historically speaking, I'm losing hair because of it.
- [02:28]
B
But yeah, I remember talking to you probably three years ago. You were just telling me like about your daily life. Like the next time we could talk, it's just like 16 hours a day, back to back, you know?
- [02:39]
C
Yeah. So that's kind of where we're at now. We're restructuring this year, moving into 2026. Divided up mowing crews and enhancement crews to make it a little bit more streamlined with some leadership and some oversight from somebody other than me, so that there's somebody else to answer to. Not only for the crews, but for the clients too, from a customer service standpoint. So we're really trying to grow. Just kind of watching the economy and watching where things are going and looking back at like where we started, we're trying to build that up a little bit because I do see a lot of value in the maintenance side of things and the cash flow perspective. It's. I like to look at it as kind of like recession proof, so to speak. There's still going to be that maintenance work that comes in and kind of our ideal customer for that is always going to need to do it. You know, HOA fees are getting paid for that.
- [03:25]
B
Sure.
- [03:26]
C
We may need to trim up a budget or something like that a little bit to meet something, but it's never gonna go away. The grass still needs to be cut and the snow still needs to get plowed. Not everybody's always gonna put in a 500 square foot patio. So we still wanna offer that. But some type of.
- [03:38]
B
Little bit of building.
- [03:38]
C
Backup building.
- [03:39]
B
Yeah. Which is a key point, is that you have to know what you want. Correct. And then build for it. The whole thing of like, I'll get what comes to me and try to build for everything. I mean, you can do it, but split focus is expensive and there's gonna be a trade off if you don't make the machine lean.
- [03:58]
C
Yeah, exactly. And lean is a key word. That's what we're looking at. We've had a lot of rapid growth over the last couple years. Just kind of by. I would say by luck and hard work. And hard work. As Alex Hormozi says it, it's like hard work got me to 3 million, but it's also like. It's also why I'm still here, the hard work. You have to work smart now at this point, you have to work through people. And that's one of the Biggest things I struggle with is delegation and wanting to touc. You talk about the bottleneck all the time and it's hard. It is. Every entrepreneur that starts something from nothing, it's hard to let go of. Yeah, it is.
- [04:29]
B
And just because I talk about it doesn't mean I've figured it out. You know, it's what we were just saying before we started recording. People are hard and they're also incredibly rewarding. And it's like, it's the only way though. Like, you can hustle your way to a multimillion dollar business, carry it on your back, but there is a ceiling.
- [04:51]
C
Oh, yeah.
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B
100%.
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C
100%.
- [04:53]
B
And the quality of life is not great.
- [04:56]
C
No, I mean, when you're trying to do that plus a family, it's hard. And that's what like, we've realized, you know. You know, three young kids under three, you know, our twins are, you know, year and a half old and Riley, he's three. It's like trying to also, like, be there and be supportive. It's a hard balance.
- [05:11]
B
It is, for sure. Speaking of your twins, did we send you any baby swag?
- [05:17]
C
No, I don't think so.
- [05:18]
B
Ah, okay. Mental note.
- [05:20]
C
Yeah, we got the snow jobs. They sent us some shout outs to the snow jobs. Yeah, done pushing onesies.
- [05:27]
B
That's hilarious.
- [05:28]
C
Done pushing. That's awesome. On the back. Yeah.
- [05:33]
B
But we'll have to get you some synced up baby swag.
- [05:35]
C
For sure. For sure.
- [05:37]
B
But yeah, it's. I feel the tension. Like. I know what you mean. Like, it's. My oldest is now 10 and you know, five, six years into the synced up thing. And like, I've managed to, thanks to people, been able to travel. They cut my travel, like pretty much in half in terms of like nights away from home.
- [05:55]
C
Yeah.
- [05:55]
B
And I would say, you know, for my wife and I, we feel like, okay, this is maintainable, like we can do this. What I'm doing now is like 40, 50 nights a year. But yeah, there was a season there where it was 90 to 100 nights a year.
- [06:08]
C
Yeah, it's a lot. It's a lot of time away. It is miss a lot.
- [06:11]
B
Yeah. And you can't go back. And I think all of us have our own experience about like, I guess what the trade off is and what season of life you're in and all of that. But I think the thing that's on my mind the most is just like anything can happen. Like things could. I could achieve all my goals or like, whatever, but like, I Can never go back for the kids.
- [06:28]
C
Yeah, there's that one reel that floats around. You hear it all the time to like, different pictures and videos. And it's like you only have kids for four years and once it's gone, it's gone. You know, your kids are only little for four years. And it hit me pretty hard in the last like six months because Riley, you know, he just turned three and it's like he'll be four in September. So, like, I've always like, tried. He, like, very intentional. Like, I can see like the difference in the attitude and the morale. And it's like he recognizes a lot of things now. Like, if I like raise my voice, like just a little bit, like slightest. He thinks I'm like mad at him. And like, you know, he or, you know, he sees me change. And like, the reaction is crazy because like last year, no understanding of any of that. So you can tell the different evolvement and season of life. It's wild how fast it goes.
- [07:13]
B
I still remember the first time it just hit me like, oh, Chase, my oldest, like, oh, he's not a toddler. It's a different person. They're developing, they're processing, they're thinking.
- [07:24]
C
Yep. Yeah, it's crazy. Definitely fun.
- [07:28]
B
So going back to your business, what would you say is your. With the maintenance side, what would you say is your bread and butter on the install side? Like, what kind of project is. Like, that's what we're the best at.
- [07:38]
C
Yeah, I mean, I think there's a couple different things. And like, so we've kind of, we've explored a lot. And from the outside looking in, you know, third party outside perspective, it's. You know, there's probably some people that are like, hey, like, what does this guy actually really do? Right? Cause we've just tried to focus on, I would say four to five to six different things to really. We like a lot of things. Right. We're trying to figure out what we're the best at, what we're the most efficient at. And tilt rotators are part of the reason to blame. Like, it's made us so efficient at like a multitude of different things. So it's really hard to figure out what we're like the best at or what we're really good at because we do like, enjoy, you know, we enjoy doing a lot of drainage work. A lot of difficult drainage projects that, you know, maybe from kind of like an operational standpoint, it's hard to do and maneuver on a site, Things like that. We do a Lot of hydro seeding, you know, and we're not really into the design build as much. I wouldn't say it's not. I wouldn't say it's cookie cutter hardscape stuff, but like the more simple kind of in and out in a week or two week project, like going in and doing like a massive backyard design build. Like, we're not set up for it.
- [08:46]
B
Yeah.
- [08:47]
C
And it's not something that there's a lot of liability with it. I wouldn't say that. There's not passion in it for us to do it. We just, we haven't really broken into that. We're in a tough market. You know, I have a lot of respect for like, guys that have been around in the industry, in our market for a long time, like Baylor brothers. You know, these guys are. They've been in it. I just, we just had dinner with Josh tonight. They're. They just, they have a name and like that whole design, backyard build. There's some really, really great guys, Scoville's landscape contractors. There's so many other guys in the market that have been around for years that have that bigger. And it's just, I kind of like stay in my lane. Like, we'll do a lot of in and out sidewalk jobs, you know, bread and butter for Paverworks, probably like 3 to 800 square feet, you know, in paverwork that we're doing in and out, you know, good cash flow. We're going in with a rotator on a mini. You know, the efficiency is there. Like, we're in and out. We're able to be competitively priced but still make good money. And we're pushing a lot of like, bigger block wall stuff. Architectural style or not architecture. Engineer and architect drawn, like verde block walls. They're a manufacturer out of Utah that they've got a manufacturing plant here through, you know, just a local concrete that's bought their molds. They have support. They have designed, you know, all of the support systems behind it. And we're trying to push that. It's very well received. We're doing a couple lakefront projects right now.
- [10:08]
B
Nice.
- [10:09]
C
And it's just an easy in and out process to do from start to finish. And we're able to mechanize a lot of it. We're taking a lot of the labor out of it. You know, you're setting your first base course and it's just. It's like building Legos with machines that are set up with rotators. And it's like you're Having fun doing it. At the end of the day, the labor force, it's hard. Not a lot of people want to. Even with pave tool and all these different tools, like, you still have to do the human part of it, and it's a hard part to find nowadays, like that missing piece of the puzzle. So I don't know for. I would say in like a long winded answer. It's, you know, some of those in and out, easier jobs, like, we're just. We like to be. We don't like to be in the same spot for a long period of time. And that's a big driver of why we kind of pick those jobs. We like to be constantly on the move too. You know, we get bored and complacent in the same place for a while.
- [10:54]
B
I'd say it fits your personality.
- [10:55]
C
Yeah. You know, just keep moving, you know, so just keep moving.
- [11:00]
B
That's awesome. Yeah, no, it's. And knowing what you want, knowing your lane is half the battle, you know, Then from there, it's building for it.
- [11:09]
C
100%. Yep. For sure.
- [11:12]
B
What would you say has been the most difficult challenge you overcome in your business?
- [11:17]
C
Difficult challenge. I wish we could have scripted this off. The whim is tough. I mean, the most difficult challenge, realistically, I mean, every small business, we all talk about, like, people and cash flow. Yeah. Honestly, I would say just separating. Separating, like the time, like an understanding the timeframe of, like, when the time is right to stay steady and stay stagnant. We've just been on such an aggressive growth path that we've gotten here, like, really quickly. And I constantly am just driving for more and more and more, like that never satisfied mentality. Like, the goal is just. I reach it and I'm like, bought that truck. Awesome. I like it. I get the feeling, like, climbing the mountain and getting there. Like, once I get to the peak, I'm like, all right, cool. Let's go to the next mountain. So, like, I enjoy the climb, if that makes sense. Yeah. So, like, we get, you know, I guess the biggest challenge has been, like, when is. When is enough enough? Yeah. But I also.
- [12:27]
B
What are you optimizing for growth or is it something else?
- [12:30]
C
Yeah. Yeah. And so it becomes difficult because I constantly think. I am constantly worried that what we have now is not enough for the people that are working here. Like, I don't. I constantly worry that it's not big enough for their dreams, if that makes sense. Like, I was just talking to a kid about it the other day, and he asked me, he's like, well, what is your 3 year, 5 year, 10 year goal? And I said, to be honest with you, if it's 15 people, where 13 to 15 people where we're currently at and we're unbelievably profitable, great. Or if it's 25 to 30 to 50 people and we're growing and we're profitable and we have people to solve those problems at that size, business great too. I want a business to where my kids can work in it and see value in it and say, hey, we have this, we wanna be a part of this. Look at how big this is, look at how great it is. We feel like we can have a career here. But on the flip side of that, I don't want them to feel like they wanna resent the business because it's something that they saw me so invested in and spent time away from important things. I would say the biggest challenge is knowing when enough is enough or knowing when we're at the right spot, what is the right spot. And it's hard because with a never satisfied mentality, like I just don't know when that time is. So that's been a challenge over the last couple years and a really hard thing to navigate right now. I would say the next two years we're just kind of like, we just want to maximize where we're at, efficiency wise. And then if the growth happens organically because of systems and processes, so be it.
- [14:03]
B
Well, yeah, exactly. If you focus on the efficiency and being productive and being profitable, like the
- [14:09]
C
growth will happen by itself and the efficiencies are there. I have a production problem. When I have things laid out, our guys do them so fast that I don't have the call before he digs and the dig safe's done for the next jobs. Because it's either that or it's, we're not sure. Like it's the opposite. Right? Like we're shooting through what, two weeks and then it's three weeks, it's an extra week. And I'm like, hey, what happened? You know, the last five jobs we did, it was we got them done.
- [14:39]
B
So it turns into a bit of a sales and marketing thing. Feeding the beast.
- [14:43]
C
Yep, exactly. Yeah, 100%.
- [14:45]
B
Are you still doing all sales or do you.
- [14:46]
C
Yeah.
- [14:47]
B
Okay, so what do you think is your next bottleneck? The next thing you have to hire for?
- [14:52]
C
So I currently, like I said earlier, we've hired. I just set that position up for senior sales and like relationship base and a little bit, yeah, a little bit of Management and nurturing those relationships and helping with the scheduling side of things on that, I think, like some type of project management on our side, the same position, but like on the construction side, somebody that's geared towards construction, design, build, like hardscape work, things like that, that can kind of help set these. You know, there's a lot of moving parts. And that's why I can't. I can't separate myself from it because it's. You really have to be like a fast problem solver. Things change. My wife rode with me down here, and I didn't get off the phone for the first 45 minutes of the truck drive. And it was like. It was nine different people. And I was like, I'm sorry. She's like, can I get into the schedule at some point before we make it to the destination? Do I have to call Crystal in the office to schedule it? Literally, her words, she's like, do I have to call her to schedule this? To be at some type of conversation in the truck? And it was just funny because. And a lot of it is me just calling, checking in on things like, hey, has anything changed drastically? Because I'm going to be out for the afternoon. Do you want me to set anything up, figure anything out? So something in that realm of position, you know, some type of project construction manager, but can also help with the sales. You know, I don't think that it's. I don't think they're two different positions. Some people argue that they are. I think somebody that could do sales and manage that. Like, if they're selling the job and they know that Mrs. Smith is buying the job, they should be able to help manage it a little bit. They don't have to see it through all the way. A project foreman should be able to take that and then take some of those responsibilities, but work together, I think. I don't know. That's kind of just. That's. That's something that we've tried to figure out. And it's probably the next.
- [16:34]
B
I would say that worked good for Tuscan Landscaping. The sales guy would sell the job, would have the relationship with the client. There would be an introduction with the homeowner, with the crew lead and the sales guy. But the sales guy kept checking in, not managing the site, but they were right there with the form.
- [16:50]
C
And if anything came up, there should be. You have to nurture that relationship, in my opinion. Right.
- [16:55]
B
And ultimately, if there's an issue, I mean, that salesperson's the owner of the relationship, correct?
- [16:59]
C
Correct. Yep.
- [17:01]
B
And some homeowners are maybe easier to deal with and others aren't, but yeah, when things come off the rails, who's responsible? And I agree with your thinking there.
- [17:12]
C
Yeah. And it's tough because it's another thing. You just gotta let go a little bit.
- [17:16]
B
Yeah, well, that's the hard part for
- [17:18]
C
a builder or for, yeah, builder, operator, whatever you want to call it. Yeah. I mean, and I, you know, on an exit interview of an employee, I had that feedback. I said that was like, I want what it is. Like, give me the feedback. And it was like, letting go, you know, letting go of things is tough for you. And I said, yeah, it's hard. Type A entrepreneur that's built something from nothing, it's hard to let go. And I respect that feedback and value it. And it's something I learned. I have to deliver on promises and let go of things. And it's hard. It's a flaw,
- [17:50]
B
it's a feature of the personality. You just have to know how to, you just have to figure out what it feels like to let it go,
- [17:57]
C
how to funnel it.
- [17:58]
B
It's a little bit like when it happens right. When it goes well, you're like, okay, that's how I can let go. Right. Yeah. And I think in the beginning when you're first trying to let those first couple things go, that's, I think the hardest part
- [18:13]
C
this big account hire has been, has been an eye opener of just like how easy things can be when you let go, you know, with the right person, you know, that is invested and wants to see things through. So I think it'll be easier on the next one. But this has been the major one that, you know, the office side of things. I'm great at delegating things that I don't know how to do or don't like to do exactly. But things that I'm good at and have been able to hire put out. It's hard to, it's hard to hold back and let go of things. Yeah.
- [18:38]
B
So, yeah, for sure. What would you say is the best advice you've ever gotten?
- [18:45]
C
Best advice. Oh, man, I wasn't prepared for this one. And this is, I know, it's the question every single podcast. Best advice. Do what you say and say what you do. Don't over promise and under deliver. You know, I've always tried to sell ourselves on being able to deliver right where we need to at the end result. And I think the biggest thing, a lot of people in business nowadays, from what I've seen, they just they promise the client the world. They promise the buyer if you're buying a product, the world. And then when you can't. When you can't deliver on those promises, like, it makes you look really bad at the end of the day. And, you know, so in my situation is like, I would say, like, don't tell somebody that you can do, you know, know your limitations. Don't tell somebody that you can build a house and do the foundation and put the roof on and do the gutters and the windows. And if you can't, you know, and if you. If that's. If your job is like a general contractor. Right. I'm just using an analogy. If you don't have the resources to do all of those things and you have to end up doing them yourselves and you can't do them yourself, you're just gonna set yourself up for failure. And I found myself in a couple of those situations where I just wanted to help so bad. It wasn't about a money grab. It was like, I just want to be the resource here to help so that this homeowner's problem is solved. They've brought me a problem. My job is to solve it and be the solution and not bring any more problems. And I realized real quick, you can't over leverage yourself with your abilities, because the minute you start under delivering on people, that goes just as fast as doing bad work. And I've realized when you do over deliver, if you do it too much, it becomes an expectation. That's why I've constantly told my guys, don't do it so much. Every single time where the minute that you don't give that guy a Christmas bonus or the minute that you don't blow the driveway off completely, you know, somebody thinks they're getting taken advantage of. So it's just knowing that fine line of when, like, enough's enough and, like, where it's not gonna come back to bite you.
- [20:57]
B
Yeah.
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C
So, yeah, that quote came from Matthew McConaughey said that. He said, you know, do what you say and say what you do. Don't overdo it.
- [21:06]
B
Yeah. It's in sales, it's easy to get hungry, you know, or even just want to help people. Like what you were saying with, like, getting over your skis a little bit on an element of the project maybe isn't your skill or whatever. You're not set up for it. And some of the best intentions can turn into the thing you never intended. Meaning, like, you had the good intentions, and then you end up getting into a Situation where your good intentions laid a trap for yourself.
- [21:37]
C
Yep. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 100%. So, yeah, don't get too greedy.
- [21:42]
B
Doesn't mean grab it.
- [21:43]
C
Doesn't.
- [21:43]
B
It's not. The message is not don't grab life by the horns. Grab it. Like, go for it. But. But know your lane.
- [21:49]
C
Yeah, absolutely. No, I agree with that. Yeah, I agree with that.
- [21:51]
B
And sometimes saying no, like, no, actually, I'm not the right guy for that. But maybe here, like, here's another guy, you know, or here's another method, or here's another thing I, you know, being helpful but not. But saying no to the thing that's over your. Outside of your lane.
- [22:04]
C
Yeah, I would agree, 100%. Yeah. Yep. For sure.
- [22:09]
B
What year did you start your business again?
- [22:11]
C
So we launched January of 2017.
- [22:14]
B
Okay.
- [22:14]
C
January 11th, 2017.
- [22:16]
B
So next year's 10 years.
- [22:17]
C
10 years. Yeah. We're hitting the milestone. 10 years. Yeah. This is gonna be a year that we clean up a lot of things, get ourselves really healthy on the back end. We've got a clerical organization, finance organization. That's kind of our thing this year. We're trying to trim some fat, be as lean as possible and clean up, you know, just clean up some loose ends just so we can be strong going into year 10.
- [22:39]
B
Do you have any examples that you. And if it's something in play and you don't want to talk about it, it's fine, but, like, do you have any examples of, like, what you're dealing with that you're feeling like, okay, I need to be leaner here or cut,
- [22:49]
C
you know, here, like, yeah, yeah. I mean, certain help. You know, we're looking at things like that just to where, like, duplicated rolls that we don't like. So.
- [23:00]
B
Cleaning up rolls.
- [23:01]
C
Yeah, cleaning up roles and really defining, like, agreements, things like that that, you know, a lot of people talk about but don't necessarily do, you know, things like that. I don't want to go too, too deep into that just because obviously things are in motion right now. We're currently changing things around a lot of, you know, we've leveraged a lot of debt over the last, you know, a lot of good working debt that's profitable. You know, P. Ls look good, balance sheets look good. But, you know, at the end of the day, I would love to clean things up on that side a little bit more and get a little bit more lean just so we don't have as much going out every year, every month, however you wanna look at it. So there's a couple things on, you know, just a couple of examples as far as that goes. But, yeah, I mean, just really trying to dial everything. You know, I think we. You know, I would confidently and respectfully say we don't 110% know our numbers. I would say we're 95. 95 to 90% there. Cause things fluctuate and change. Like I said earlier, sometimes, like, our production is off, like, way positively or way negatively.
- [24:04]
B
Like, what happened.
- [24:04]
C
Yeah, yeah. So, like, we just look at things and we're like, oh, all. James was too focused on trying to drive the truck that week to help speed things up because there was a fourth of July party, and then I lacked on getting materials ordered and supplied for that job. And then all of a sudden, now they're delayed so they don't have them in stock ready to go or something silly like that where I didn't do the call before you dig the DigSafe ticket. So now there's utilities in the way, and now we're risking digging, saying, oh, well, we submitted the ticket. It just didn't go through on your end. And the guy showing up to mark it out. I don't know how many times we've done that just because I have not. I failed the full accountability, failed to get the dig safe done. So I started pawning that off on crystal and saying, hey, if you don't see that it's done within three days of us starting that job. If the job starts moving up in the calendar, please jump on it, because just know that my brain is over here and over here and over here. So that kind of goes back clearly defining those roles and knowing that I could take some off her plate and put it over here. But in turn, I'm also gonna give her something that's easier for her to do that maybe somebody in the field shouldn't be doing. So things like that.
- [25:08]
B
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
- [25:09]
C
Just a lot more clarity because there's just. With that, there's been a lack of, you know, my word for the year for 2026 is accountability. And, like, for myself, like, haven't held myself accountable for a lot of things that positively, like not saying I've done things bad, but both positively and negatively, like, hey, I should own that mistake because I didn't give that guy the tools or the knowledge or the value to make that decision. And the same thing with our crews. Like, they need to be accountable for what happens on the job. If they make the call and it's wrong, they need to Figure out why they. I'd rather somebody make the call and learn from the wrong call and say, all right, well, next time I'm gonna do this. And they shouldn't feel that. They shouldn't feel that there's gonna be any sort of reprimand or backlash for making a decision. Exactly. If anybody feels like that, it's not on purpose, obviously, and they shouldn't feel like that, they should be able to confidently say, hey, I'm gonna make this call, and if it's a mistake, we're gonna figure out why. And they should take the constructive criticism and say, hey, yeah, next time I gotta make sure that we're in the green and we're not gonna make that mistake again and again. In this day and age, I feel like it's okay to say that constructive criticism is hard to take from people. For some odd reason. I don't know why constructive criticism for some people is hard to take. You almost feel like you're pushing them against the wall, and it's like. It's not like that. We're just trying to make everything flow more positively for you and your crew and your teammates. And, you know, if you're the new entry level laborer, we want your job to be easier. We don't want you to be doing something that the machine can do, you know, silly example, right? Like, we're just trying to. We don't want you to not work hard. You know, I've had guys where I'm like, hey, don't shovel them. Like, why are you telling me what to do? And I'm like, because the machine's gonna do all that. I need you to have energy to do this, you know, more labor, value task that the machine can't do. Just silly things like that. So I just. I don't know, you know, just cleaning those things up and making things align more in terms of positions and things like that. We got a lot of hungry guys that are, you know, some new guys that are very hungry and just positive. Great attitude. Like, want to learn. They may not be the smartest right out the bat, right out the gate, but they want to learn, and they have the initiative, which is the important and the drive.
- [27:23]
B
Yeah.
- [27:23]
C
Which is. Which is huge. So super happy and excited for that.
- [27:27]
B
Yeah. The thing that resonated with me with what you said is it's not making the call that's wrong. It's not even getting it wrong that's wrong. It's the failure to learn from it. That's the gap.
- [27:39]
C
So we have A new thing that I started, and I literally used it today when we were walking in, I said, hey, my guy called me with something that was incorrect on engineered plans on a retaining wall job. He said, we have to shift this five feet towards the lake, otherwise we're going to undermine this guy's deck. By the time we get to the third tier of the wall, like, there's some serious measurements that are off. So that's what we're going to proceed to do, and we still have to confirm it tomorrow. But I told him, I said, before you tell me the problem, I want you to come to me with three options of what the 13 1. The 131 rule, three options of what your thoughts would be, and then we're going to talk about it. And I didn't tell anybody that I was going to start this. But. But James has always historically made all of the decisions, even if I'm not on the job. And it becomes that, like, back to accountability. I want you to confidently make the call. Being in that senior position, I want whichever side of the crew it is, whether you're just mowing or I want you to make the call right at the end of the day, that's all I want. And then we can figure out from there. Yeah. If it was a good call or a bad call. Again, back to that thing. You shouldn't feel like you can't make it. Just learn from it if it's the wrong one, that's all. But the 131 rule is huge for this year.
- [28:54]
B
And, you know, I know you and I both know the hard part is it starts with the leader making it safe to make the call and making employees feel, I don't know, maybe just understood when they do make the call and it was wrong, but you understand why they made the call that way.
- [29:13]
C
Yeah.
- [29:13]
B
Okay, I get the point.
- [29:14]
C
When Colleen was here, she was listening to the phone call, and I hung up with him. You know, my foreman that I was talking to, and she's like, he sounded really confident. Sounded like he was in a. You know, it was a really good conversation. Like, he was. He was happy he was making that call. And, like, there was confidence in the phone call. It wasn't like, you know, like holding back almost, you know, something. Something to that effect. So that's good. Just trying to instill positivity and, like, you know, just make it happen, man. It's. You know, you got my full support either way.
- [29:40]
B
Go get him.
- [29:41]
C
So we want everybody to grow.
- [29:43]
B
So coming up on your 10th year, what would you do a bit differently if you went all the way back to your year one?
- [29:53]
C
I think I would hire with intent.
- [29:55]
B
Okay, so instead of just bodies, is that what you're saying? Instead of just bodies to get work done?
- [29:59]
C
Yeah, I would hire a little bit more with intent, treat people with a little bit more value. Meaning we have had just so much growth. I've just not paid attention to 5 o' clock on a Friday or 6 o' clock on a Saturday. Before I had kids, it was just like, you know, the hustle and the long hours. Like that's a part of the, that's a part of chapter. Like we'll call it two or three, right. Year two or three, Chapter two or three. That just the Sundays, laying patios with like my now lawn and landscape maintenance foreman who didn't know anything about patios. Just like putting in patios on Sundays, starting them on a Sunday. Not like, hey, we gotta get this done. We're gonna go two hours into Sunday, hey, can we show up and finish this tomorrow? Just no regard for what day of the week it was. I think, you know, we lost a couple people over the years that just due to the nature of how many hours we were putting in. And I think I would hire, like I said, I would put people in place with a little bit more intent and maybe more people and less overtime. Just to little bit better quality of life, a little bit better quality of balance. You know, I hear people talk about, you know, Warren Buffett didn't care about balance, but at the end of the day, team members on our landscape, they're not Warren Buffett, right? Yeah, yeah, that's for me to do. In the early stages of building a business, I can't expect these guys to work 100 hours a week. And you know, like I said, we had some great guys that held on and lasted a long time, but I think, I think I burnt them out pretty bad, you know, and that'd be kind of one of my regrets. I feel like I lost a couple good guys that probably would have stayed here and loved the work. But due to a little bit of failed leadership and just like expecting way too much, they just found things that were a little bit easier on their bodies and on their schedules. That's a big thing that I've reflected on pretty hard over the last couple years.
- [31:47]
B
Yeah, and I gotta commend you for, you've obviously thought a lot about this and your self awareness and your hunger for growth. And I don't mean growth in business. I just Mean, growth as a person is. I see it and you should be commended for that. And I hope your guys see it too. With that kind of attitude. As a leader, the sky's the limit in terms of what your people will do for you.
- [32:17]
C
Yeah. It's just a matter of. And again, back to accountability. It's like I have to look at do my actions align with my intentions? Because sometimes I always find myself. My intentions are to be that leader that you're talking about and be commendable. And sometimes I find myself veering off and just going a different direction. And I always pull myself back in and stay aligned. It's hard and I don't know what that carrot is that's dangling one way or another, but sometimes it's like, yeah, I have to this year, like just staying focused on doing the things that I have to do. I'm not jumping in a truck to move a load of stone. I'm doing a disvalue to you. I sold that 50k job this morning before I came here. Instead of going and hauling that load of three quarter number 57 stone that I got asked and I said I can't do it. My purpose is to get this job out this morning. And that was sent. Viewed at 8:46 initial deposit done before 9am like done. True story. So it's like that's where my value is. And making sure that the work for the production issue that we talked about is still rolling in. Yeah.
- [33:22]
B
And it's thinking about where do you need to be spending your time? And we are all human. Like if the synced up team listened to this, they'd be like, oh yeah, Weston, but what about this? And yeah, we all have our flat spots. We all have our flaws.
- [33:34]
C
Yeah.
- [33:36]
B
And it's, it's not that you're gonna necessarily eliminate the flat spots. It's just that, you know, back to your. Do your actions align with your intentions?
- [33:46]
C
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, it's been a fun. It's been a fun nine years and we're. I think the sky's the limit still with the right people in place and, you know, just really caring about the people. I'm. The monetary side of things isn't everything. And I realized that like you could pay people everything, but sometimes quality of life and a little bit more intentional things, rewards. And intentional rewards mean a lot too. So that's, that's my focus for this year.
- [34:15]
B
It's a noble goal. It's a noble focus. And I just want to say too, like, thanks A million for the trust and faith you put in, synced up, you know, for your business.
- [34:24]
C
Absolutely. Yeah. It's been fun.
- [34:26]
B
It's no small feat. And it's also a lot of work. It is. Building systems is hard.
- [34:30]
C
Yeah.
- [34:31]
B
It's actually easier to keep doing the thing yourself. Like what you were saying, like, doing it in a way that the machine can do it, the system can do it, is harder than just continue to do it yourself.
- [34:39]
C
100%.
- [34:40]
B
That's a little bit what implementing a product, like a business management product into your business is like.
- [34:44]
C
Change is hard. Whether you're hiring new people, you're learning from a new leader, or you have a new guy like this coming in to help take some of the role away, like those guys that are working underneath him or alongside him, it's hard change for them. Implementing a software is hard change. New account, it's hard change. Like, all these things are nobody. The human. Humans don't like change by nature. And I've realized that in the average human, where you take something and you put a guy like that in that position, it's gonna take that guy that used to have all this authority and this power. It's gonna take him four to six months to really understand that. Cause you're literally taking all that away from him. Like, he had all of that, you know, or my accountant did everything this way. It's gonna take me some time to understand the way these new folks are gonna do something. Yeah. So, you know, change is hard, but change is always not always bad either.
- [35:28]
B
I like Dave Ramsey's quote as well. Just choose your hard. And Dave Ramsey's like, being in debt is hard. Being out of debt is hard. Choose your hard. You don't get to escape hard. You just get to choose which one.
- [35:38]
C
Yep. 100%. Yeah, I like that. Never heard that. I never actually picked up on that. Like that for sure.
- [35:44]
B
I think he says it on his entrepreneurship podcast or something like that.
- [35:48]
C
Okay. Yeah, yeah.
- [35:49]
B
But, yeah, thanks a lot. Before we wrap up, like, where can people find you, connect with you? DM you? That kind of thing?
- [35:55]
C
Yeah, Instagram. Keep up daily on that stuff. You know, stories and reels and things like that. You know, just on the bandwagon. Innovative Lawn Landscape LLC, TikTok, Mr. Innovative, and then Facebook, Just Innovative Lawn and Landscape LLC. Yeah, so we're on all three of those. So try to stay as active as we can educationally showing things what we're doing, you know, storytelling.
- [36:16]
B
Your Instagram's good.
- [36:17]
C
Yeah, it shows us. Yeah, yeah. So We're. I don't see you liking any of it though.
- [36:24]
B
Now I gotta go check.
- [36:25]
C
Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, we appreciate the software. Like I said, we had a couple runs and doing the implement and finally having somebody on the back end to help us. And I appreciate you giving us another shot when I was probably a very frustrating customer to get onboarded and really working with us, jumping on a screen, getting the CEO to come out and jump on a screen and say, hey, our maintenance guys are having a problem with this and just the intentional change of hey, we're going to get our IT guys working on this and boom, it's fixed within a week. Again, completely unscripted. You fixed a couple things today. Literally during the show. I was like, hey, I was punching this thing out from a consultation yesterday and it gave me a hard time. And you're literally learning how to use a new Apple product and you're screen sharing it and circling it and you're sending it out and you're like, yeah man, we're gonna work on fixing it right away like that. It's just, it's servant leadership at its finest and it's very humbling and appreciative to see.
- [37:18]
B
Absolutely. Thanks, James.
- [37:19]
C
It means a lot. Absolutely appreciate it.
- [37:21]
B
Appreciate your support.
- [37:22]
C
Sounds good. Go get them for sure.
- [37:25]
B
Make the 10 year milestone and one
- [37:26]
C
to be remembered for sure.
- [37:29]
A
Hey, thanks for listening to the Cost of Doing Business show. If you need help with knowing your numbers or you're looking for a better automated system to run estimating and scheduling and job costing or more in your business, just hit me up. You can book a demo@syncedup.com or DM me on Instagram. Syncedup, which is spelled S Y N K E D U P. See you on the next one.