← The CPG Guys
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- [00:02]
A
Hello and welcome to the CPG Guys podcast. Set at the intersection of commerce and tech.
- [00:09]
B
Your hosts Sree Rajagopelan and Peter V
- [00:12]
A
S Vaughn explore how brands and retailers engage consumers in a digitally driven world. And now, here are the CPG Guys.
- [00:22]
B
Hello and welcome to the CPG Guys podcast. I'm your host, humble co host, pvsb, who also moonlights as head of industry and client engagement at Flywheel, the commerce acceleration division of Omnicom. My co host, you know him as Paparaj, as named by the fans of his two pop star daughters, Rhea and Laraj. He is the Chief Revenue Officer at Think Blue Consulting, the former Chief Customer Officer at General Mills, and more importantly, he's my BFF and Ride or Die. He is the man known as Sri Lanka. Sri and I were recently down at Cagney, the Consumer Analyst Group in New York conference in Orlando, Florida. We were listening quite a number of presentations. We managed to record this episode with a couple of guests in a second. I'll get back to that. In the meantime, I'll remind our audience. Please do follow us on your favorite podcast platform, Apple, Spotify, YouTube, whatever. And if you're on particularly Apple and Spotify while you're there, please leave us a rating. It helps make our podcast more findable. Industry contemporaries of yours looking to be educated and entertained. So two of the people we spoke with while we were down there came from Kimberly Clark, one of the presenting companies. First we had Craig Slavcheff, who is the Chief R and D Officer at Kimberly Clark. And joining him was Patricia Corsi, who is the Chief Growth Officer. Cherie had the conversation. I had to head out of town a little early to get back for my daughter's birthday. But the conversation was tremendous. I hope you you enjoy it. So without any further ado, let me turn it over to SRI and his conversation with Craig and Patricia.
- [02:07]
C
All right, let's welcome Patricia Corsi, Chief Growth Officer and Craig Slashev. Is that right?
- [02:13]
D
That's right.
- [02:14]
C
Perfecto. Chief R and D Officer Kimberly Clark. Welcome to the CPG Guys, both of you. How you guys doing? What a fabulous presentation at Cagny.
- [02:22]
D
Oh, thank you. It was a lot of fun, A lot of fun.
- [02:24]
C
Welcome.
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E
Thank you for having us. And indeed we had a great fun this morning.
- [02:31]
C
It clearly showed on stage and I gotta tell you, my love for Mike just grew. I was mentioning it earlier to Craig, 100 basis points because the best leaders, you know what they do, they let the experts do the talking. And he bought his leadership team and let y' all talk about the consumer, R and D development, innovation, things of that nature. And it showed, your passion showed in the conversation. And that's important at Cagney because these analysts rarely get to see that they just want to dig into the numbers, whereas practitioners like us want to hear the story. So you also came off a massive couple weeks. Amazing. Q4 Super F25, fiscal 25 earnings, historic, if I may say so. Shareholder vote on the kenview acquisition. Congrats. Momentum is real, guys. So big. Welcome indeed. So I'm going to jump right in and you know, here's a unique observation. Let's start with the relationship between both of your roles, you know, R and D brand. We often hear about the friction between R and D and brand. And you know, I was a sales leader myself for General Mills and we had a lot of that friction. I don't think either of us parties were convinced what's the right way to get stuff done. We thought our way was the only way or the better way, et cetera. But I see R and D, what's technically feasible, possible, releasable in the marketplace. Marketing, which is really all about what the consumer thinks they want and delivering against that promise for what they want. And your powering care strategy, you talk about the need to out, innovate out, market out, activate together. The key word here being together. Practically speaking, how you rewired your teams. Actually, you both are leaders. But talk to us about the teams, how you actually rewired your teams to work lockstep, hold hands with each other and then have we evolved where you get to sit in creative briefing? Sir, I'll start with you.
- [04:25]
E
Oh, that's going to be fun.
- [04:26]
D
Yeah. So it's interesting, the current or the electricity that goes through the wiring quite literally is the consumer insight. And that's what connects all the efforts within my organization and Patricia's organization. It's what connects everybody. It's what drives the focus and the effort and the attention of the organization. It's what allows us to say through my lens of building product and designing claims and manufacturing processes, it's all towards the service of this consumer insight, solving it in a way that that is better than competition. And so I'm hoping Patricia feels the same way.
- [05:07]
C
Is it fair to then say, Craig, you are constantly in the world of consumer insights?
- [05:13]
D
Oh, yeah.
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C
And you talk to us about your teams as well. What's the marching orders for them?
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D
Marching orders is if you can't articulate a pithy, clear consumer insight or problem to solve on your Project. Then go back to the drawing board.
- [05:27]
C
That makes you a rare breed, man. Let's hear your version now. So I want to ask you the exact same question. The partnership.
- [05:34]
E
So let me start with the partnership. I think Craig and I had the gift because we started together. So we have one month apart from starting and we share working in the same company for many years before we share.
- [05:49]
C
Where did you all join from?
- [05:52]
E
So the company that we work together is not the one that we are joining from. So we work both in Unilever and it was. So we have some values and the way we see people and consumers and product and brand building, we have it. It's in our muscle memory. This is at least how I see it. So let's see what Craig, how he respond to that. So it helped that we started together. So I think this is one. The second one. It helps that we have one mission. So it's almost like this ops team that we say, okay, what's the intervention? And there is no ego in the system. I think the problem when things go south a little bit, I can empathize a lot with what you're saying about, you know, sales has something. I remember once, long, long time ago, on my craft food day where a sales director came, he punched my desk and he said, why everything there is to sell, nobody wants to buy. And what everybody wants to buy, there is nothing to say. And I was thinking, since when I'm the factory machines to understand that. But immediately, because. And I think this. And I'm mentioning that because I think this is another thing that unites Craig and I even when we have this agreement, is this passion to win, is this absolutely commitment with making things right for our consumers. So when you're talking about the partnership, when we have things that we think differently. Absolutely. But we respect so much each other that we pause in a moment and we say, okay, let me. And many times we do this. Okay, help me to understand where this is coming from. And I think this strengthens the relationship.
- [07:36]
C
That's awesome. You know, when you put the consumer at the center of everything, you can never go wrong. Because I think the industry needs to accept more that the MVP for detail and for CPGs. The consumer is not our role.
- [07:47]
E
That's it. So you are not going to see two divas here.
- [07:52]
C
But also you guys were divas on stage though. But sometimes you guys knew you had command of what you were speaking.
- [07:59]
E
Thank you. I much appreciate that. But I think there is something that sometimes people cannot confuse the humbleness and this determination to lack of passion. So we are like. It's like the storm coming to happen. This is how the first question and the second question on the wiring, you were asking about the team. I think probably this is the hardest work because we are doing change management. Right?
- [08:24]
C
So you're acquiring and bringing in a new set of brands in new categories.
- [08:28]
E
And you, you heard Mike talking about performing while transforming. Right? So it's really important that we don't lose sight of that. So one of the things that, for example, Craig and I and we are doing together with Tamara, our head of supply chain, is that we are now getting together, the three of us, to say how we are going to make sure that we facilitate the life of our teams. How can we help bring clarity? Because in the absence of clarity, this is when the wiring doesn't work. So hopefully I've answered clear objectives is
- [08:59]
C
how I take that. Clear objectives, joint clear objectives.
- [09:02]
E
But also trust there's something. Sometimes there is one thing that is. Is his priority and it's a priority for the business. But it's. I, I have, I have a point of view, but you know, you. You got it, Craig. Keep us informed. So it's good for us to know, but there is not like, oh, let me just build my two cents. Let my build that. I think this happens when there is lack of trust.
- [09:25]
D
It's what leadership demonstrates and displays and role models. So, like, if, first of all, as you know, in cpg, the magic happens in marketing, R and D supply chain, if that Nexus is not working smoothly, none of it works. And so as our teams see us connected, see us working off of the same narrative, see us working off the same list of priorities and objectives. That's what fluidizes the team to get things done. I'm making this sound much easier than it is in practice. It's really hard. It's really hard.
- [10:01]
C
No, but it starts at the top. I wish you both the best, especially as you bring Kenview in. You'll have new people, new personalities, new categories to learn. It'll come with its own set of learning moments. But Patricia, us sales guys, did nobody tell you, when the quarter is great, we do everything. We are the same people. When the quarter's bad, the advertising sucks. And you never gave a good innovation portfolio. That's why we thump our hands down.
- [10:26]
E
Yeah, but I was in sales as well. This helps. So I, I always go back and say empathize, empathize, because it's coming from a place of passion to win when it's coming from a good place, I think then the way you take it is that's okay. So let's discuss how we can do this.
- [10:40]
C
I mean, every, everyone has pressure on their back, right? Like the sales guys have to answer to retail at the end of the day and they're protecting distribution at the end of the day because that is the elixir for everything. So, Craig, I want to drill down into something your CEO Mike mentioned regarding the stretched consumer. There's a tendency in CPG that, you know, you hold onto the best innovation as premium and you push it up the price ladder right on top. Right. And so many presentations, you know, 20 before y' all presented, we saw that premiumization. You're talking about a different approach by cascading premium tech down to value tiers, specifically with Huggies, Snug and drive in the U.S. you also presented other examples today. How do you engineer that kind of a premium assortment in the product, premium performance rather into a value tier product without breaking the margin structure. Like it almost seems like you're now Merlin the Magician with an R and D magic wand.
- [11:36]
D
Well, thanks for that. It's actually just good old fashioned material engineering and manufacturing engineering. So as we, as we look at these premium features, that is the algorithm, it's, it's to, it's to launch in a premium setting and then quickly redesign it to drive costs. And one of the examples I gave today was this. And it's a great story of partnership with marketing. It's called the cloud waistband and it's this kind of cushiony soft waistband that envelops baby's midriff and moves with how they move. And it's very gentle. When we launched it, it was in premium tier in China. And then we quickly worked on the engineering of it, both on manufacturing and also materials to bring the cost down 75% and 75% less in capital and able to run on more machines across the fleet. So now suddenly we have this fantastic premium feature that's accessible at a lower tier. Fantastic. Now what does Patricia do with this? She brings it off in an insight in Brazil as a Tier 3 diaper on a consumer benefit that consumers I think would recognize as real, but maybe didn't realize there was a solution for Enter the product and then we launch. And how many BIPs did we get in market share?
- [12:57]
E
290.
- [12:58]
D
290.
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E
Testing my memory.
- [13:00]
C
So when you speak about it on stage today, I remember that number.
- [13:03]
E
But.
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C
But I want to ask you about the. So clearly deep engineering background is helping out here. I'm going to come back and ask you about is how you're using AI in that process. Before that, you have the same task as well, you know, it's a product that delivers premium performance, but you have to sell it as a value tier. How do you write that story from a communication perspective to the consumer? Imvp.
- [13:27]
E
Yeah. Look, I think the first thing is we have strength in the company on rgm. Let's start with that. Because the peg price architecture is something that we. We cannot discount from that, especially in these times. Exactly. So we need to make sure that we have the right format, the right peg size in the right channel at the right price point. So. Because if everything. If people cannot buy what they cannot find, people cannot buy what they cannot pay for. Right?
- [13:53]
C
Absolutely.
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E
So I think this is one thing. So the second thing is we need to make sure that when we are doing things, and we were saying things, that when consumer experience that product, they are not just matching that, but they have even a better experience than they thought they would have. Because the value.
- [14:11]
C
So you're trying to over deliver.
- [14:13]
E
Yeah, because the value perception, if you think the value perception is how much I pay, how much I think it's worth. Right.
- [14:20]
C
Yeah. I mean. So let me ask you about that very definition of value perception. Right. In a prior world, retail had educated all of us that the only thing that matters is price. That's why we do promos and things of that nature. Over Covid and post Covid, we learned that value for a brand is its equity returning to what the. The actual performance of what it delivers. Do you agree?
- [14:42]
E
Well, look, I. First, I think price is not a strategy. I understand.
- [14:47]
C
I couldn't agree more with you.
- [14:49]
E
I think I understand that, obviously. And we see here at Cagney every. Everyone likes a freebie. Everyone likes a freebie.
- [14:56]
C
Oh, did you guys. Were you guys here day before yesterday? Mondelez. This happens every single year. Have you ever seen the Mondelez message that happens at the table? So thinking to myself, the crowd around the table for the freebie, like you said, right. There's probably, I don't know, in one bag you can fit about $50 of chocolate, maybe at Cogs. But I always reflect on what a mad dash happens right after for that $50 of chocolate for stuff you can buy in the market for maybe 100 bucks.
- [15:25]
D
Yeah, it was a mosh pit.
- [15:26]
C
It was a mosh pit.
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D
I didn't get one. I didn't get it back.
- [15:29]
C
I enjoy taking video. But. But that said. That said, though, there's something about Getting a freebie. There's no doubt about it. This is the last crowd you'd expect wants a freebie at this gathering.
- [15:41]
E
But the thing is, going back to understanding people in the deepest level is when you get a freebie, it's not about the freebie you got, because everyone in here can pay for a deodorant, can pay for a diaper or a fem. Is the fact that you feel like you got a gift special. You feel special. When you do a deal, you feel smarter. So if we understand what drives consumer emotions, then that's why I'm saying it's not marketing, blah, blah, blah. It's really what drives it. And what drives value is when you buy. Let me just give you a simple example. I'm a mom. I bought diapers. And then I said, oh, this was such a great deal. And the other one says, well, maybe I didn't got this deal, but my son is sleeping through the night, and I'm feeling so good because it makes me feel like a good mom and et cetera. So you just put something that is intangible in terms of value, having a baby. You know, I don't know if you had kids, but having a baby that sleep through the night. There is, you know, and there is the value of the child development, but there's the value of you feeling like great parents because your child is. Is really doing what they should do. So it's up to us to do it. And I think the other thing that we have also to modernize ourselves. You're talking a little bit about AI but you know, social media, social content, et cetera, is. We are in a different era where unboxing is a thing. So we sell products inside that people cannot touch. And Craig, every time, he has on his backpack different diapers because he will give it to us and feel it.
- [17:25]
C
That's so cool, man.
- [17:26]
E
Right? It's really cool. And when you feel it, you said, I always put it on my face. Because I said, oh, my God, this is so soft. But consumers that are buying it.
- [17:34]
C
But it's important, though, like, for the R and D captain to do that, have that perception of softness, because that's what your consumers want. Yeah, they are the mvp.
- [17:42]
E
And then you go, for example, we were.
- [17:44]
C
No wonder you guys were up on stage and the others didn't show up for their companies. I got to see this backpack. Now this is special.
- [17:51]
E
You. You go to. He just did it. Now everyone that will come to us to talk, he came with the two and he said, which one do you think is the one that. Which one do you think I was doing?
- [18:03]
D
I was doing blind compared comparisons to academy investors.
- [18:07]
E
It was really good. Nobody got it. But all of this to say that is it's our job to put the value where the value should be, but also to understand that consumers can imagine so much. So if you're asking them to upfront pay X for that pack of something without him touching it, you need to make sure that you are owning that trust and you're delivering against it. So this is our dream.
- [18:33]
C
I could not agree more with you
- [18:34]
E
than Shame on us.
- [18:35]
C
I do have two kids. I just mentioned my younger one is part of the world's largest global girls bank. Cat's Eye. She just performed. She just performed at the Grammys.
- [18:43]
E
I was not sure if I understood it. Well, your daughter.
- [18:46]
C
Yeah, my daughter's Lara. Yeah, my daughter's Lara.
- [18:48]
E
Wow.
- [18:49]
C
And I remember, you know, 20 years ago when she was born, that night sleep was such a big deal. And as you mentioned to many, it's we ask that question, am I a good dad? Am I a good mom? But some of the greatest joys in life was actually with her diaper on, Kimberly Clark diaper lying down on my shoulder, patting her on the back and putting her to sleep. So I'll never forget those moments.
- [19:13]
D
That's awesome.
- [19:14]
C
And now watching our kids, you know, succeed in the big theater, big life is a big deal. So greater joy than anything else I do. But congratulations.
- [19:22]
E
You have to tell us another time how it is to have your daughter as a celebrity.
- [19:26]
C
We'll get to that. So but the next one I have, this is actually again for the both of you and the biggest criticism that the industry has, even Wall street analysts have of legacy CPGs. Prior to this conversation, I kind of said to both of you, top tier presentation. I don't like to use the word legacy. It's just not a great word. But what at least most in the industry say is that they're slow. But you're talking about fast scaling in the presentation. Talk about winning innovations across markets at a global scale. The China conversation you had on stage was nothing short of, like, incredibly fabulous. Can you give us an example of a product and I'll ask both of you to give one each that worked in one market that you said, oh, my gosh, I gotta scale this, I gotta bring it to other markets. And then you did that at a pretty decent speed that you were able to deploy it. And then that customization, how do you take that product if it fits in one market like China and say, okay, this will also work in the US like how do you make sure that that brand, that that product, sku, whatever it is, succeeds? You can bring it to another market.
- [20:32]
E
Sure you do, baby. I do Fancare.
- [20:34]
C
Okay, let's do that.
- [20:35]
D
Yeah. So the cloud way span which we just talked about is a great example where we were able to scale that into 57 markets.
- [20:45]
C
57 in three years. Not 1, 2, 10, 20, 30, 40, 57.
- [20:49]
D
And it's. And we have plans to continue just in three years. And just in three years. Right. And part of that is because a the technology, as I said before, we engineered it with a second generation that made it more accessible both through the supply chain but also through the cost structure. The cool thing about it is the story and this is where your question about how do you optimize it for market. The story of the waistband marks, the red marks for Brazil was kind of unique to Brazil. And you could theorize there's a reason for that with a hot climate, et cetera, et cetera, but it was a way where the partnership between R and D and marketing is such that they together figure out what is the fit for the market and the technology. And they're obsessed, as Patricia said before, we're obsessed with finding that. And so that was a great example where same technology, second generation, much more accessible on cost and manufacturing and unique market specific story. So then part of our wiring in our company is to share those stories and those moves globally. So people start to build off the ideas and that's basically that's what I'm most excited about.
- [22:03]
C
You know, at the top of this conversation you started with grounded in consumer insights. When you are grounded in consumer insights in different markets, you are going to figure it out.
- [22:12]
D
Absolutely.
- [22:13]
C
And then femcare.
- [22:14]
E
Femcare. Gravity.
- [22:16]
C
Gravity.
- [22:17]
E
So Gravity is in China, is in Brazil. We are launching now in the U.S.
- [22:22]
C
congratulations and good luck by the way.
- [22:24]
E
Thank you. And the communication you seen. Yep, it's going to all those countries. Needless to tell you that it's really tough to get the same casting to fit Australia, Brazil, China, U.S. but it's possible. I think the, the, the one thing is this resourcefulness that we are. Because you're talking about legacy and sometimes I've never worked in a company that was younger than a hundred years old. So in 30, neither have I 33 years of, of career other than the
- [22:59]
C
CPG guys, which is six and a half.
- [23:01]
E
It's getting there. It's getting there. Um, but so I think the legacies. How do you take for granted what you have built? Because brands are incredibly strong and resilient. The equity, it's incredible. Sometimes there are brands that they have not been taken care of. There was a change on strategy in the company. They, they are placed on the cash cow, the famous cash cow box. And then somebody comes and said, let's rescue it. And it comes and it comes back.
- [23:33]
C
So we saw plenty of those stories here at Cagney.
- [23:36]
E
That's it. So. So I think the, the legacy part, even though it's. It's a bad word, I think there is something on companies that have endured the test of time, and I think we own it to these brands to bring them back. And, and you know when.
- [23:54]
C
I love that you actually owe it to the brands. If you're the, if you're the brand captain. That is so true. You own the brand equity. You owe it to the brand to build.
- [24:04]
E
This is how I feel when there's no doubt. You know, everyone has, I would say, challenging days, like tough days, tiring days, where you feel like you've been in one, you've been in meetings all day, you don't, you don't know exactly what was the outcome because you said, oh, my God, just meetings. And when I think about that, that, you know, we own it to those brands to leave them better than we got them. I got energized to say, I said, okay, no, no, that, that was a good day. You know, I, I have the privilege to.
- [24:35]
C
It's a special feeling.
- [24:37]
E
And, and especially in categories like Craig and I, we have an immense passion for adult care because we do believe that people that have incontinence, if they are not served with products, they stop living. It changes everything and them. So we believe, as you know, the inventors of the category, the leaders in the U.S. we believe that it's on us to do something different. Responsibility, and we have a vested interest. We are getting more. Yeah.
- [25:09]
C
I won't claim to be a spring chicken.
- [25:11]
D
Yeah. So actually. So the gravity core, which is the science behind this femcare pad, this is not staged. I didn't know just to prove you out that I too carry stuff.
- [25:29]
E
See, Right.
- [25:30]
C
So this man, true R D captain.
- [25:33]
D
So, so this, this is the gravity core. Look at how engineered that is. This is what's on the inside of a feminine care pad. It's what literally you. Acts as a vortex to pull fluid away from the body. That's why the gravity core is a superior technology.
- [25:47]
C
I'm Gonna guess and you can correct me, correct that. The reason it's engineered this way is it pulls it to the middle.
- [25:52]
D
To the middle and to the out into the bottom.
- [25:54]
C
To the edges?
- [25:55]
D
No, to the bottom. Away from the body.
- [25:57]
C
Away from the body.
- [25:58]
E
So I think touch the skin so you don't make sense.
- [26:01]
C
There's no rash and things of that nature.
- [26:02]
D
I'm just back in my.
- [26:04]
C
No, but Craig, I gotta tell you,
- [26:06]
E
I haven't seen this.
- [26:07]
C
I gotta tell you to see an R and D captain carry it around literally in your daily journal, that's pretty impressive man.
- [26:17]
D
We're passionate about production.
- [26:19]
C
That much we can tell after seeing the presentation. So I'm going to stick to this category for a second here. Patricia, you're obviously dealing with categories like personal care and hygiene that historically came with a lot of stigma, awkwardness. People don't want to talk about it, they're embarrassed, things of that nature. Obviously we live in a different world where none of that should matter but unfortunately a lot of that story still hasn't left. But as a marketer you've been credited with using emotional storytelling to actually get rid of that stigma, let's say to crush that stigma. How do you balance the functional science that we just talked, Craig just talked about that he builds with the brand love that you need to build. Can you talk about the creative strategy behind your recent, let's say the recent launches you've had and how that translates to actual market share gains?
- [27:07]
E
Yeah, look, when you work on stigmatized categories it's, it's tough because even the consumer research, they don't openly say, oh, I sneeze and I peed myself. This is not something that people feel comfortable to talk.
- [27:24]
C
It's awkward.
- [27:24]
E
It's different to say, oh I just bought a new car or I chocolate, a candy bar. I love, I love that this water bottle, it's very different. So even for us to understand and extract the Winnie real consumer insights, we need to be thoughtful. And when we start thinking about that, we need to make sure that we are also then not going to be cliche because we live in this. The boundaries are difficult to measure when you can talk about menstruation and periods and we were the first ones with Kotex to put red on pads. Everyone was putting blue, we put red. But what does it do if you don't have everything else that does it right that the product that you guarantee that they're going. Women also need great nights of sleep like everyone else.
- [28:23]
C
You bet your bottom dollar.
- [28:25]
E
Of course Exactly. And then, so what we were looking at this is saying, okay, so when we are looking at insights, one of the key insights that we got, we got, I would tell you three pieces of data that broke my heart at the same time, that energizes me for action. First one, apparently there is a market, betting market in the US that bets against female basketball players that are playing on their period.
- [28:50]
C
I have heard of that. Yes.
- [28:51]
E
This, this for me was shocking, shocking piece of data.
- [28:54]
C
The second, it's silly and unacceptable, but
- [28:56]
E
it happens, it happens a lot. Especially in a period where female sports have never had so much visibility.
- [29:04]
D
Yep.
- [29:05]
E
The second piece of, of evidence that we got was women, when they are in their periods, they do not practice sports and lots of them stop altogether. And the third piece is sport is a critical factor to build leadership. And therefore, this is one of the things that will keep women later on in life to feel comfortable to take leadership roles. When you put this three things together, when you say we have the right to do something with Kotex on this area, we want to get girls back to sport. And so you're talking about how this inspire creativity. That's why we came to.
- [29:46]
C
No, I totally get it.
- [29:47]
E
Patricia. That's why she was, she's looking at the swimming pool. And we were. Louise, shout out to Luis Sanchez, Luis Sanchez, our chief creative officer. We were having this big debate about the swimming pool. I said, oh, my God, this is such a cliche and all of it, but it's part of the life. There's lots of girls that will never hit the swimming pool. And then, for example, when you look in Australia, the sales of tampons are much higher because they're pushing to sports very early. And, and swimming is a big sport. So, so there is something that you can do as a society to influence that. And, and this is what energizes me about what we are doing with Kotex, because at the end of the day, what we want to say to girls is go back to sport. We have the products, we got your back. We have the products that gets you. But also this will help you to build confidence and leadership skills that will be very, very helpful in the future.
- [30:48]
C
You know, the way I interpreted that, emotionally you are empowering her when she's very young to develop that leadership skill on a field, in the pool, you know, whatever sport she chooses, so that when she's older, she can be the boss that she was born to be. That's how I interpret.
- [31:05]
E
That's it.
- [31:06]
C
Patricia, Media landscape. We're now completely fragmented. As you all have acknowledged, attention spans are near zero at this point. I won't say zero, but near zero. How is Kimberly Clark breaking through the noise right now in this interesting media fragmented landscape where sometimes a retailer also owns media and is selling it pretty aggressively? Is it about being more provocative with the creative? Is it about being more precise with targeting? Like, how do you live and execute in that world of fragmented media?
- [31:39]
E
Sure. So I think the first thing is we know the data tells us that the impact of anything you put on air, 50% is the smartness on how you buy the media, how you target audiences, et cetera. And 50% is creative. So you can make it this first part very.
- [31:59]
C
I want you to say that again for our audience. Right. So being successful is 50% targeting.
- [32:05]
E
So 50% is everything that you do from buying efficiencies, targeting, you know, audiences, everything that you execute the media. Exactly how you execute and buy. Right?
- [32:19]
A
Yep.
- [32:20]
E
There is a limit of what you can do with that.
- [32:22]
B
Yep.
- [32:23]
E
The other 50% is creativity the story. It's. It's the story that you want to tell. And it, the interesting part is I was when it was it June with the folks from Google at can Lyon and they. Because there is always this conversation and I want to make sure that I'm also doing a service to the countries in Kimberly Clark that we are serving. Serving. There's always this discussion. We need everything in five seconds, right. And I said, how do we build brands in five seconds? This is a new one to me, but I said, okay, let me arm myself with data and either I update myself or I help to democratize information. So Google showed me this very interesting piece of data that shows that the biggest effectiveness and consumption of content comes from in long formats, long over one minute and a half. And short formats, the long formats, over one minute and a half. Build brand makes your brand. You know, the resilience that, the grit that we want these brands to continue to have. No matter what happens, this is what it builds. But then creativity is even more important. The 50% is not enough. It has to be something that is not just, you know, impactful. Something that I said, oh, now it has to be something that speaks to me and that keeps me engaged. And then I want to do an action on it. The five seconds, the short, the five, ten, six seconds, they drive you to know an innovation. For example, they drive you to the point of sales. They drive you to, you know, one of the retailers online, whatever it is. So what I have presented today is the long formats. And of course here for here as well, we show the big one. But for every single innovation we have on Kotex, we have short formats.
- [34:06]
C
So you platform it out like from 6 to 15. Instagram, you've got the 6, 6 being the ideal, ideal one for today's attention
- [34:14]
E
span, for the innovation. Yes.
- [34:16]
C
YouTube, yes.
- [34:17]
E
So we have YouTube, we have TikTok, we have Instagram. And this will depend on the country. For Southeast Asia, TikTok all the way works well. For Brazil, Instagram better. So if you go to Middle East, Snap is still a platform that you need to consider because it has a lot of.
- [34:34]
C
So you're working, you're working at all.
- [34:36]
E
So we are looking at where the consumer is and how do we connect with them. And then because we put this on the briefing since the beginning is not something that, oh, let's adapt from the two minute manifest and then cut back.
- [34:50]
C
You're actually baking a version for TikTok as an example.
- [34:54]
E
The versions for TikTok were not cut down from, from the film that you have seen.
- [34:58]
C
Understood. So I want to tap your brain on the creative aspect.
- [35:03]
A
Right.
- [35:04]
C
Do y' all get to see the creative before it's launched in the marketplace? Give some input. Because that deep AI tool you spoke of with 65 plus 65 odd years of engineering science, that's a big deal.
- [35:17]
D
Yeah. So the answer is we're part of the journey. And I think gravity is a good example because gravity, not just as a product name, but as a mechanism of how the product works that was keyed in on an insight to consumer where like quite literally the goal for her is to get it away from my skin. Not just to control a mess and not have a leak. Of course that's table stakes, but get it away from my skin. So this notion of the special core that acts as a, as a, as a vortex to pull it away from her body, just like gravity does, starts to become not just a product name, not just a context, not just a technology, but a concept that can then be driven with activation.
- [36:01]
C
And so do you then get that input on the functional outcomes, the engineering of why things work a certain way into the storytelling.
- [36:09]
E
So on a separate part. So when we are doing, for example, and this is one stream of work that we are working together is how do you visualize claims? Because this, you know, this is one point, you were talking legacy before, right. So legacy before is those claims that are very hard to get approved by legal, regulatory and all of this. And when the consumer sees they really do not mind that much because this is not the language that they speak.
- [36:37]
C
They don't care.
- [36:38]
E
Right.
- [36:39]
C
They want outcomes, they want functional outcomes.
- [36:41]
E
So when, when he's talking about this vortex of things, the visual came in the concept, right. And then from the concept it starts appearing in some of the content that comes on short formats. So we, and, and this is the part where at the beginning we said we divide and conquer.
- [37:00]
C
Got it?
- [37:00]
E
Because otherwise, especially when you're building communication for what something is going to be in 20 countries, it is very difficult to do this by committee.
- [37:12]
C
I couldn't agree more because we already have committees in that scenario because we
- [37:15]
E
already have the countries that have really important input and we have to trust each other that through the process of concept inside, we got everything in there. And if there is more work that we want to do from a claims perspective, this will come in different content and different forms.
- [37:32]
C
Then as the leader, the captain, how do you keep the teams motivated, engaged to want to come together? Is, is it, do you have to, do you, do, do you conversationally engage them a lot? Are they tools you're building for that purpose?
- [37:47]
D
Well, we're, we're, we're, we're, we haven't closed yet.
- [37:50]
C
That's true. I forgot. My bad, my bad. So, yeah, that's only, that's only once the, all the regulatory process is done.
- [37:57]
B
Right, Correct.
- [37:58]
C
So yeah, that makes sense. But let me ask you the same question. How does calendar year 2026 looks for
- [38:02]
E
you so very focused what you have seen today, Most of the things that Craig and I share are not in the market for 12 months even so we know that great launches, they have to have a second year that is strong and that we continue that we don't get tired internally before even the consumer gets it.
- [38:29]
C
Yeah. What's a CPG rule? Most innovation, only 5% of innovation survives after three years.
- [38:34]
E
That's it. So we need to make sure it's a first, first step focus on delivering the promises and commitments we have made this year. And we are starting, I think in a strong way, like you said, with the earnings and with approvals. In regards to can view, as Craig said, it's too early for us to say anything. Personally, I'm very excited about the brands. I'm a brand lover, so whenever I see brands I get excited about it, especially because I've started my career as a trainee there. So some of those brands were very close to my heart by then. And I'm coming from Consumer Health, which
- [39:14]
C
is Neutrogena, Coming as part of the portfolio.
- [39:17]
E
Neutrogena is part of the portfolio.
- [39:19]
C
That's my favorite brand. I worked for JJ when it was JJ and Neutrogena was my favorite brand. I got to work on actually launching neutrogena.com as well in the process and engagement of the consumer and the data that you get in the process was significant. So hopefully all of that stuff is still there as it is.
- [39:36]
E
Yeah. So as Craig says, we haven't closed this is to be confirmed yet. But from an excitement, I think Craig and I, we shared excitement on. Let's see the great opportunity that this brings us. And with the teams the message is super clear. Focus on the deliverables that we have. We need to make sure that we guarantee and we deliver against the commitments that we have done this year. And there is a lot of work in play. Right.
- [40:02]
C
I mean you certainly have the momentum going behind you with the recent results, announced earnings, results announcements. So good luck on that horizon and we won't refer to Ken View now. Let's wait for the regulatory process and then we'll get back and hopefully get you both back and have a chat. Because you're inheriting, you'll be inheriting such a great portfolio in addition to what already makes you great. So Craig, let's talk about your favorite innovation. So in the last year, what would you put right up top and say, man, this was my favorite. The passion with which I saw you talking about the pad, that was special. But what's your number one?
- [40:35]
D
So my number one is actually launched in Korea. It is one of our, it's what we call a technology platform which means a technology that can scale across multiple categories, even BCC childcare, femcare, adult care. And the technology is essentially a body manufacturing technology. Yes.
- [41:01]
C
Gotcha.
- [41:01]
D
Yeah, it's a material slash material gotcha. Yeah. But it's a body responsive three dimensional substrate that reacts to insults. And so quite literally as it flexes, it will create holes and divots to absorb fluid. Gotcha. And so it's launched in Korea right now. It's got an intellectual property covering its patents, covering it. It's in 100 SKUs in Korea doing well.
- [41:28]
C
So what brand does it go by?
- [41:30]
D
It's under the Huggies brand.
- [41:31]
C
It is under the Huggies brand.
- [41:32]
D
And, and the, the other cool thing about it is we talk about speed. Typical long term technology platforms are just that they're long term, like three to five years. This thing was conceived and launched in 18 months. Wow, that is fast. Yeah, super fast.
- [41:49]
C
In 18 months.
- [41:50]
D
Yeah.
- [41:50]
C
That's a record. But let me ask you about one consumer trend that keeps you up at night. Excuse me one second. We'll do that again. Talk to us about one consumer trend that keeps you up at night.
- [42:02]
D
One consumer trend that keeps me up at night.
- [42:05]
C
The one that worries me is attention. Spanish.
- [42:08]
D
Yeah.
- [42:09]
C
Seems almost void at this point.
- [42:12]
D
Yeah. There is a lot of attention deficit disorder in the consumer sector right now. I think the one that I look as an opportunity and it keeps me up at night because it's an opportunity is the science of sleep. It's interesting. The science of sleep as a way to democratize the consumer's ability to manage their own health outcomes in a way that's very different than traditional medicine is going to be as big as the microbiome science space.
- [42:46]
C
No doubt, Craig. There's a lot of studies out that TikTok and Instagram are flooded with sleep being one of the most important need states and how that single poor sleep can ruin.
- [42:57]
D
Exactly. And conveniently, if you look at our portfolio of products and categories, most of them, all of them are used at night.
- [43:06]
C
Femcare baby care. Yep.
- [43:07]
D
Adult care. So there's a natural overlay there.
- [43:09]
C
Adult care.
- [43:10]
D
That's why I said it's an opportunity.
- [43:11]
C
That's awesome. What about you? One favorite launch and you can't take his. You have to take this.
- [43:17]
E
I'm not going to take his because, you know, this is the complementarity. You see, he drills down the science.
- [43:23]
C
Which is awesome, by the way.
- [43:24]
E
Exactly. That's why it's the compliment. I'm going to go on something very basic. Kleenex. Snap and Go first. I love Kleenex.
- [43:33]
C
Oh, yeah. Snap and Go. We can't argue about that one.
- [43:35]
E
It's a brand that is special, you know, and everyone, everyone that I know carry this, these little things with, you know, Kleenex on their bags. And now you have something that looks really nice, looks nice to take out.
- [43:51]
C
My. When they get it, they're like, wow, functional needs state solved.
- [43:55]
E
I think this is the beauty of it. Sometimes, you know, the. What you can deliver as a better consumer experience is the occasion that you're bringing it is the packaging. Sometimes it's the technology, sometimes it's the manufacturing. So, yeah, I wanted to go with something that is different. So you can see that there is.
- [44:16]
C
Absolutely. And then I'll ask you the same question as well, what consumer trend are you looking at? And say, okay, I got to figure that one out pretty fast.
- [44:26]
E
I have to say that the consumer trend that is worrying me at the moment and doesn't have any specific implication on the business, but is being a mom of a 17 year old. I'm seeing a generation that is having really a lot of impact with social media from an anxiety point of view, from how they build resil. When I, when I read the data points on suicide levels on, on young adults, these things really scares me. And some of the things that some of the products that we work, because when we are talking about incontinence, this for women, lots of them will happen when they're in menopause. There are lots of women that feel that they're going crazy. So mental health, girls with, you know, periods, also mental health. So when I look at that, to better understand what is happening with them, to better help them and serve them is something that I feel excited about. But I worry because I want to be able to help the next generation.
- [45:40]
C
But you do have a unique platform. As a marketing captain of what I would call legendary brands, you did talk about storytelling to empower women. Maybe that story just continues.
- [45:53]
E
That's it.
- [45:54]
C
In maybe a deeper way. Because there's enough data now to show that the average us, the average us human being, if there was such a word, is spending five hours or more on their phone every single day and
- [46:07]
E
where our emotions are going. And for example, I was talking about Kleenex and our clinics platform. It's called Every Tissue has a Story. And to influence and impact people, to really, really showcase their emotions because they're getting numb with this five hours of telephone. They're getting numb to anything. So I do believe our products have a place to do something with beautiful storytelling and with things that can make a positive impact.
- [46:37]
C
Indeed. Let's wrap it up with the last question for both of you.
- [46:40]
D
Sure.
- [46:41]
C
And it's a simple one, but a fun one, but also one I think the industry needs to hear. And that is imagine, Craig, now you're sitting across the chief merchant, retail one of whichever retailer really doesn't matter. What's the one thing you'd want them to know about your 2026 plans? Is it you've got legendary innovation coming or what you've already put in the marketplace is legendary enough that it needs to be in distribution in a better way? I don't want to script this for you. I'd love to hear your viewpoint.
- [47:09]
D
I would say that we're innovating on all levers in 2026 and that they should cross platforms. Cross platforms. And that they should get behind us. And which they are.
- [47:20]
C
And in your eyes, when you say get behind us, what does that mean?
- [47:24]
D
That means distribution. That means activation, excitement. I mean, that's excitement being the key. Yeah. And I think people, the way I think about my role and in partnership with Patricia is we generate excitement. That's our job with innovation. And innovation should be exciting and the retailer should just be so stoked to get it and excited to highlight it. And so that's what I would want, is their joint excitement with what we have in our F26 pipeline. How excited we are about it.
- [47:54]
C
That is. That's a special place to be at. And then let's ask you the same, because you get out often to retail.
- [48:00]
E
Not that much anymore as I used to when I was in the local teams. But eventually, yes, every once in a while.
- [48:09]
C
Well, let's tell Mr. Kurt that he needs to get you out more because he is a friend of ours.
- [48:14]
E
He takes me to some.
- [48:15]
C
But now let's ask you the same question. You're sitting across a chief merchant. What would you want them to know about your 2026 plans?
- [48:22]
E
Simple. What we are delivering is a total transformation of our business. And it's not a one time. If you look at our blueprints for growth, we have opportunities to grow in more usage, more users and more occasions. And the merchants, they want to hear how we are growing the category. And this is how we are growing the category. It's not just the market share gain. The market share is also a game and it's important to us. But we are growing. We are helping to grow the category. Right. So when you look at diapers, there are, in many countries, women will change diapers seven times a day. In some countries, two times a day. This is an expansion of the category.
- [49:03]
C
Listen, the category manager at retail will love you if you came with the story of expanding the category as opposed to why you're better. There's no doubt about it. So I'll wrap up with that. Patricia, Craig. It's rare to see this level of alignment between the science and the story. Congrats on the great presentation at Cagny, your recent Q4 announcement, your F25 results, and all the exciting things after the regulatory process with the kenview acquisition comes through. Good luck to both of you.
- [49:30]
E
Thank you.
- [49:31]
C
Thank you for joining us on this meeting, guys.
- [49:32]
E
Thank you for having us.
- [49:33]
C
Thank you for having us. Thank you. All right.
- [49:40]
B
What a great conversation that SRI had with Patricia and Craig. Hopefully you found as entertaining as we did. I will remind you, if you are following us on your favorite podcast platform, Apple, Spotify, YouTube. While you're there, please give us a rating. It helps make our podcast more fine into the 42,000 plus. People who follow us on LinkedIn trust us to fill their days with content, education, entertainment. We're greatly appreciative. That's all we have for you today. Looking forward to speaking with you on the next episode of the CPG Guys Podcast. Goodbye.
- [50:29]
A
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