The Creative Penn Podcast For Writers

Episode: Self-Publishing A Second Edition Of A Non-Fiction Book With Jin Stephens
Host: Joanna Penn
Guest: Jin Stephens
Release Date: November 4, 2024
Duration: Approximately 1 hour 5 minutes

1. Introduction to the Episode

Joanna Penn welcomes listeners to episode #779 of The Creative Penn Podcast, introducing the topic of self-publishing a second edition of a non-fiction book. She outlines the primary focus: Jin Stephens' experience transitioning from traditional publishing to self-publishing her second edition of Delay Don't Deny. The episode delves into when to consider a new edition, the benefits of self-publishing, and the impact of moving away from platforms like Facebook to build a private community.

2. Deciding to Publish a Second Edition [18:06]

Joanna opens the conversation by asking Jin why she chose to publish a second edition of Delay Don't Deny instead of writing a new book.

Jin Stephens:
"The original book from 2016 needed a refresh. I had learned so much more about the topic, and some advice was outdated. Plus, it continued to sell well, especially Delay Don't Deny, which some readers preferred over my other works." ([18:32])

Key Points:

• Evolution of Content: Advances in her understanding and new research necessitated updates.
• Reader Feedback: Continued popularity and reader preference for the original book influenced the decision.
• Self-Publishing Motivation: After a traditional publisher offered a minimal advance, Jin opted to self-publish to maintain control and quality.

3. Balancing Comprehensive Content vs. Storytelling [20:40]

Joanna inquires whether readers prefer the more comprehensive, research-heavy Fast Feast Repeat over the story-based Delay Don't Deny.

Jin Stephens:
"It depends on the person. Some readers resonate with detailed references and scientific explanations, while others prefer straightforward, relatable stories." ([20:54])

Key Points:

• Target Audience Diversity: Catering to both those seeking in-depth knowledge and those wanting personal stories.
• Empowerment Through Choice: Encouraging readers to choose the book that best fits their needs, whether it’s starting with a simpler guide or delving into comprehensive research.

4. Enhancing the Second Edition [23:31]

Joanna and Jin discuss the process of updating the second edition, focusing on what to retain and what to revise.

Jin Stephens:
"I focused on areas where readers had questions and confusions. For instance, I solidified the concept of the 'clean fast' based on community feedback and personal validation." ([23:31])

Key Points:

• Community Insights: Leveraging feedback from a large community to identify and address common questions.
• Terminology Updates: Incorporating new terms and refining existing concepts for clarity and effectiveness.
• Success Stories: Including recent and aligned success stories to reinforce the book’s guidance.

5. Challenges and Rewards of Self-Publishing Second Editions [37:32]

Joanna highlights the difficulties Jin faced in launching a second edition, such as losing existing reviews and starting anew on platforms like Amazon.

Jin Stephens:
"Launching the second edition meant starting from scratch with reviews, but my community stepped up to support and provide the necessary initial reviews to build credibility." ([37:07])

Key Points:

• Starting Fresh: Navigating the loss of accumulated reviews and search rankings.
• Community Support: Leveraging a dedicated community to generate initial reviews and boost visibility.
• Long-Term Benefits: Despite initial setbacks, the second edition gains traction through consistent community endorsement.

6. Audiobook Production: Challenges and Solutions [39:00]

Joanna asks Jin about her aversion to producing audiobooks and her strategies to manage this aspect.

Jin Stephens:
"I find audiobook production time-consuming and laborious. Initially, I did it myself, but now I prefer hiring professionals to ensure quality and reduce the workload." ([39:00])

Key Points:

• Time Investment: Audiobook production requires significant effort, making it less appealing.
• Professional Assistance: Hiring audio engineers and using services like Atticus streamline the process.
• Quality Assurance: Ensuring the audiobook matches the book’s quality through professional help.

7. Transitioning from Traditional to Self-Publishing [41:24]

The discussion shifts to Jin’s experiences with traditional publishing and her decision to return to self-publishing.

Jin Stephens:
"While I appreciate the support from traditional publishers, such as copy editing and cover design, the lack of control over certain elements like titles and Amazon listings pushed me back to self-publishing." ([43:26])

Key Points:

• Control Over Content: Preferring to make final decisions on titles, covers, and other creative aspects.
• Financial Considerations: Higher earnings potential through self-publishing despite the initial lower advance offers.
• Balanced Approach: Utilizing freelance professionals to maintain a high-quality product independently.

8. Building and Managing Online Communities [46:36]

Joanna explores Jin’s strategy for building a robust online community, particularly her move from Facebook to a private platform.

Jin Stephens:
"Leaving Facebook was crucial to protect my community from political toxicity and ensure focused support. Transitioning to a paid private community on Circle helped foster a more engaged and supportive environment." ([47:09])

Key Points:

• Platform Limitations: Facebook's algorithm changes and policy enforcement posed risks to her large fasting community.
• Private Community Benefits: Enhanced control, reduced exposure to negativity, and increased member commitment through paid access.
• Community Moderation: Implementing stringent rules to maintain a positive and productive environment.

9. Marketing Through an Author Ecosystem [56:49]

Jin discusses her natural “funnel” approach to marketing, integrating her podcast, books, and community without aggressive sales tactics.

Jin Stephens:
"My podcast leads listeners to my books, which in turn lead them to my community. It’s a natural ecosystem where each component supports the others organically." ([57:14])

Key Points:

• Integrated Marketing: Utilizing multiple platforms that complement each other to create a cohesive author ecosystem.
• Content Accessibility: Offering free resources like podcasts and accessible books to attract and retain an audience.
• Autonomous Growth: Allowing word-of-mouth and organic discovery to drive community and book sales without intrusive marketing.

10. Leveraging AI and Tools in Publishing [Amazon and AI Tools]

Joanna briefly mentions Amazon's discontinuation of Kindle Vella and discusses the rise of AI tools like ChatGPT and Perplexity AI for book discovery and writing.

Jin Stephens:
"Using AI tools can enhance the book discovery process by allowing more nuanced searches and personalized recommendations, which is beneficial for both authors and readers." ([AI Tools Segment])

Key Points:

• Platform Shifts: Navigating changes in publishing platforms and leveraging alternative avenues for serial storytelling.
• AI Integration: Incorporating AI tools to improve book marketing strategies, enhance writing processes, and facilitate better reader engagement.

11. Final Thoughts and Advice for Authors

Jin offers her insights on self-publishing, community building, and maintaining authenticity in authorial work.

Jin Stephens:
"Be confident in who you are and what you offer. You don’t need to please everyone, just your target audience. Focus on quality and genuine connections rather than quick sales." ([62:10])

Key Points:

• Authenticity: Staying true to one’s voice and mission is paramount for long-term success.
• Selective Engagement: Building a community that resonates with your work promotes sustained support and positive word-of-mouth.
• Continuous Improvement: Regularly updating and refining work ensures it remains relevant and valuable to readers.

12. Conclusion

Joanna wraps up the episode by summarizing the key takeaways: the importance of knowing when to update content, the benefits of self-publishing for greater control and better financial returns, the value of building a dedicated community, and leveraging natural marketing ecosystems without invasive sales techniques. She encourages listeners to explore Jin’s books and podcast for further insights into effective intermittent fasting and self-publishing strategies.

Notable Quotes:

• Jin Stephens on Self-Publishing Control [43:26]:
  "I wanted to maintain control over every aspect of my book, from the title to the Amazon listing. Self-publishing allows me to ensure my work is presented exactly as I envision it."

• Jin Stephens on Community Value [47:09]:
  "Moving to a private community has not only protected my members from negativity but also enriched our interactions, making support more meaningful and personalized."

• Jin Stephens on Marketing Ecosystem [57:14]:
  "My podcast leads people to my books, which lead them to my community. It’s a natural ecosystem where each component supports the others organically."

• Jin Stephens on Authenticity [62:10]:
  "Be confident in who you are and what you offer. You don’t need to please everyone, just your target audience."

Key Takeaways:

• Evaluate the Need for a Second Edition: Regularly assess whether your existing work requires updates based on new insights and reader feedback.
• Embrace Self-Publishing for Control and Profitability: Self-publishing offers greater autonomy over content and potentially higher earnings compared to traditional publishing.
• Build and Nurture a Dedicated Community: Transitioning to a private, paid community can enhance member engagement and provide a safer space for support.
• Utilize Integrated Marketing Strategies: Develop a natural ecosystem where your podcast, books, and community mutually reinforce each other without aggressive sales tactics.
• Leverage AI Tools for Enhanced Publishing Processes: Incorporate AI technologies to streamline book discovery, writing, and marketing efforts.
• Maintain Authenticity and Focus: Stay true to your voice and mission, focusing on genuine connections with your audience rather than attempting to please everyone.

Additional Resources:

• Jin Stephens’ Website: jenstevens.com – Access to her books, podcast, and community.
• Intermittent Fasting Stories Podcast: Explore Jin’s podcast for personal stories and expert insights on intermittent fasting.
• Books Mentioned:
  • Delay Don't Deny
  • Fast Feast Repeat
  • Clean Fast

For more detailed insights and actionable advice, listen to the full episode of The Creative Penn Podcast with Jin Stephens.