The Creative Penn Podcast for Writers

Host: Joanna Penn
Guest/Co-Author: Mark Leslie Lefebvre
Episode: The Relaxed Author Writing Tips
Date: December 15, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode blends timely publishing industry news—including audiobook trends, AI, and platform strategies—with a substantial reading from Joanna Penn’s and Mark Leslie Lefebvre’s book The Relaxed Author: Take the Pressure Off Your Art and Enjoy the Creative Journey. The focus is on encouraging writers to cultivate a relaxed and sustainable creative life, find joy in writing, pace themselves realistically, and embrace processes that align with their personal strengths and lifestyles.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Publishing and Audiobook Trends (00:00–21:29)

• Spotify Audiobook Trends (03:30):

  • Spicy romance and "romantasy" genres are leading.
  • Music memoirs are increasingly popular, matching Spotify's musical roots.
  • Dystopian stories and content exploring social unrest, climate, and AI are on the rise.
  • Men are increasingly listening to romantasy genres (now 15% of steamier subgenres’ audience).
  • Joanna reflects:
    “Perhaps we just assume we know what our audience is and perhaps we don’t.” (07:15)

• The Evolution of Audiobooks (08:40):

  • Shift from abridged cassette tapes to mass-market digital full-length works.
  • The merge/blurring of podcasts, audiobooks, and other audio content.

• Audible and TikTok BookTok Partnership (10:22):

  • Audible integrates BookTok trends for better discoverability.
  • Younger audiences (16–25) are inspired to try new books.

• Platform Ownership and Substack (14:10):

  • Non-fiction authors can benefit from Substack, but complete reliance is risky.
  • Thomas Umstadt Jr., via the Novel Marketing podcast, cautions: “You are still sharecropping on their land, so to speak.”
    Joanna adds,
    “If it is free, you are the product... things move into pay to play eventually. Things do not stay free forever.” (16:32)

• AI in Publishing and Voice First Content (18:35):

  • OpenAI & Disney: AI-generated content with licensed characters (Sora app).
  • India's blanket AI copyright license framework signals global change—making it easier for AI companies to train on copyrighted works.
  • Voice-first content is transforming reading in emerging markets, lowering production costs, and driving inclusion.
  • Publishers must stop thinking of voice as an add-on and should think “audio-first,” Joanna paraphrases Mark Williams.

2. Excerpt from The Relaxed Author: Relaxed Writing (35:54–74:23)

Why The Relaxed Author Approach? (35:54)

• Both Joanna and Mark acknowledge their personal tendencies toward being driven or even anxious, yet emphasize the importance of relaxation in creative longevity.
• Joanna:
  “I am not a relaxed or laid-back person in the broader sense... but I am a relaxed author.” (36:54)

1.1 Write What You Love (39:25)

• Pandemic as a reminder of life’s brevity; write books you are passionate about.
• Joanna:
  “Writing is a career for many of us, but it’s a passion first and you don’t want to feel like you’ve wasted your time on words you don’t care about.” (41:10)
• Mark highlights the dangers of chasing trends at the expense of passion:
  “We get into writing with passion…and then sometimes we lose sight of the passion that drew us to writing in the first place.” (42:07)

1.2 Write at Your Own Pace (45:45)

• Dangers of “comparisonitis”—comparing your output or process to others breeds stress.
• Mark:
  “At times, indie authors would wear that stress, that anxiety…as a badge of honor. It’s fine to be proud...but when you push too far, you can ultimately do yourself more harm than good.” (37:16)
• Experience and circumstances will change your writing pace; allow variability for life changes.
• Joanna:
  “The key to pacing in a book is variability, and that’s true of life too. Write at the pace that works for you, and don’t be afraid to change it as you need to over time.” (53:10)

1.3 Write in a Series If You Want (55:30)

• Series writing can be relaxing and financially effective.
• Familiar characters/worlds make writing easier and allow you to build a core audience.
• Joanna:
  “Writing a book in a series makes it easier to fulfill both creative and financial goals.” (56:53)
• Mark draws evocative analogies:
  “It’s like returning to hang out with old friends…there’s nothing more wonderful than that sort of homecoming.” (57:02)

1.4 Schedule Time to Fill the Creative Well; Rest and Relaxation (64:21)

• Creativity is not just about output; rest and diverse experiences are essential.
• Joanna:
  “You can’t create from an empty mind, you have to actively seek out ways to spark ideas.”
  “Consume and produce. That’s the balance you need in order to keep the creative well filled.” (66:45)
• Mark advocates “magic moments” and the serendipity of relaxation and non-writing inspiration.

1.5 Improve Your Writing Process—But Only if it Fits You (70:45)

• Trying to adopt unsuitable productivity advice can increase stress.
• Joanna:
  “Productivity tips…can really help you tweak your personal process, but only if they work for you.” (70:55)
• Mark:
  “If it doesn’t work but you force yourself to keep doing it because a famous writer or a six-figure author said this is the way to do it…you create pressure.” (72:10)
• Embrace what works for you; continuous personal learning is healthy, but self-improvement should not become self-imposed pain.

3. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Relaxed Author Mindset:
  "If the writing life is a marathon, not a sprint, then pacing, not rushing, may be the key." – Mark (36:30)
• On Platform Risks:
  “If it is free, you are the product... things move into pay to play eventually.” – Joanna (16:32)
• On Writing to Your Own Rhythm:
  “Write at the pace that works for you, and don’t be afraid to change it as you need to over time.” – Joanna (53:10)
• On Series Writing:
  “It’s like returning to hang out with old friends. You know their backstory, you know their history, so you can easily fall into a new conversation.” – Mark (57:02)

4. Key Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | Speaker | | --------- | --------------------------------- | -------------- | | 00:00 | Podcast introduction, audiobook trends, Spotify & Audible news | Joanna | | 14:10 | Platform risks & owning your audience | Joanna | | 18:35 | AI in publishing, Disney/OpenAI, India’s copyright move, voice-first content | Joanna/Mark Williams | | 35:54 | The Relaxed Author reading begins, why relaxation matters | Joanna, Mark | | 39:25 | 1.1 Write what you love | Joanna, Mark | | 45:45 | 1.2 Write at your own pace | Mark, Joanna | | 55:30 | 1.3 Write in a series (if you want) | Joanna, Mark | | 64:21 | 1.4 Filling the creative well, rest | Mark, Joanna | | 70:45 | 1.5 Process improvement (only if it suits you) | Joanna, Mark |

5. Takeaways for Writers

• Write what you love and stay connected to your original passion.
• Set your own pace for writing; don’t compare your productivity to others.
• Embrace series if you enjoy them—world-building compounds creative ease.
• Rest and intentional "well-filling" are essential for sustained creation.
• Experiment with processes and tools, but only keep those that fit you.
• Protect your independence by not becoming overly reliant on any one platform.
• Be open to new trends (e.g., voice-driven content), but evolve at your own speed.

Concluding Thoughts

This episode is a timely reminder to step back from the hamster wheel, reassess your motivations and methods, and prioritize joy and authenticity in the writing life. The “relaxed author” philosophy doesn’t mean complacency—it means strategic, joyful sustainability.

For more inspiration, check out Joanna and Mark’s book The Relaxed Author in all major formats and follow Joanna’s ongoing insights on The Creative Penn.

For comments, show notes, and resources:
thecreativepenn.com/podcast
Book: creativepenbooks.com
Patreon: patreon.com/thecreativepenn