The Daily Beans | Texas v Illinois (Feat. Steve Vladeck; David Janovsky)
Date: September 4, 2025
Hosts: Allison Gill and Dana Goldberg
Guests: Steve Vladeck (Constitutional law professor), David Janovsky (Acting Director, The Constitution Project at POGO)
Episode Overview
This episode dives into several significant legal and political developments, including the ongoing fallout from the Epstein survivors’ press conference (and Trump's attempts to suppress it), the Fifth Circuit’s ruling on the Alien Enemies Act, Trump’s efforts to fire federal agency members, international tensions with India’s Prime Minister Modi, and schools resisting anti-transgender policies. The central focus is the looming conflict over the possible deployment of Texas National Guard troops to Illinois—a potential constitutional showdown discussed in-depth with expert guests Steve Vladeck and David Janovsky.
Throughout, the hosts add their signature blend of pointed analysis, activism, and heartfelt community support, capped by a dose of “good trouble” and uplifting good news.
Major Discussion Points & Insights
1. Epstein Survivors Press Conference and Trump’s Interference
- Survivors’ Courage: The hosts discuss the emotional impact of listening to Epstein survivors. One survivor particularly moved them, still struggling not to blame herself for the abuse (02:11).
- “I just wanted to, like, reach out and hug her because she felt like she was trying to convince herself that what happened to her wasn’t her fault, you know?” —Allison Gill (02:19)
- Trump's Suppression Tactics: Trump responded to the conference by organizing a disruptive military flyover and calling Congress to threaten lawmakers pushing for Epstein files’ release.
- Survivors’ Initiative: Despite attempts to drown them out, survivors vowed to confidentially compile their own "client list" of abusers to give to Congress.
- “We know the names. Many of us were abused by them. Now, together as survivors, we will confidentially compile the names we all know…” —Epstein survivor (Clip, 06:54)
- Host Response: The hosts express admiration for the survivors’ bravery, while highlighting the intimidation and financial risks survivors face in naming high-profile abusers.
Memorable Moment:
“He scheduled a military flyover to happen right in the middle of their press conference… and we can hear that moment in this clip.” —Allison Gill (03:26)
2. Legal Setbacks for Trump: Courts Push Back
- Alien Enemies Act: The ultra-conservative Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals rules Trump's use of the Alien Enemies Act (to detain migrants and deport them to El Salvador) is unlawful, clarifying it’s a wartime statute.
- Allison wonders if Trump is seeking war to justify future use.
- Discussed in-depth later with guest Steve Vladeck.
- Trump's Attempt to Purge Agencies: The DC Circuit refused to block the reinstatement of FTC Commissioner Rebecca Slaughter, citing long-standing precedent (Humphrey’s Executor v. United States) that presidents can’t fire board members at will (09:40).
- “The government has no likelihood of success on appeal given controlling and directly on point Supreme Court precedent.” (09:40)
- Firing at the Federal Reserve: Senators, even those advocating for the Fed’s independence, largely sidestep criticizing Trump’s push to oust Fed Governor Lisa Cook or stop his hostile nominees.
- “You make the fucking laws.” —Allison Gill (11:12)
3. Foreign Affairs: Trump & Modi Feud Over Peace Prize Claims
- Trump claimed credit for solving India-Pakistan conflict and expected a Nobel Peace Prize from Pakistan, to Modi’s annoyance.
- “Trump will not be nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize.” —Dana Goldberg, mock-narration (12:57)
- Modi tells Trump the U.S. had no involvement in the ceasefire, but Trump remains unmoved, leading to a diplomatic rift.
4. Transgender Rights: Denver Schools Resist Federal Orders
- Denver Public Schools refuse Trump administration demands to ban transgender students from bathrooms, despite threats to federal funding.
- Superintendent Dr. Alex Marrero’s statement:
- “We will not waver. We will not back down. Because equity is not optional. It's who we are. Fuck, yes.” (15:11)
- Superintendent Dr. Alex Marrero’s statement:
- The hosts celebrate Denver’s courage compared to more elite institutions who folded under pressure.
5. Call to Action: Releasing the Epstein Files
- Host urges listeners to call their representatives to sign the discharge petition to release the Epstein files.
- “Dana, only four Republicans in the House have signed it.” (18:13)
- Noting even some GOP stalwarts like Marjorie Taylor Greene and Lauren Boebert expressed support.
6. Deep Dive: Texas National Guard and Constitutional Crisis
[Steve Vladeck Interview: 21:29–51:58]
Context & Stakes
- Illinois Governor Pritzker alleges Texas Gov. Abbott plans to deploy the Texas National Guard to Illinois—a move Abbott denies.
- Constitutional questions abound: Can one state send National Guard units into another state without consent? What legal authorities apply—federalized (Title 10) or state (Title 32) troops?
Key Legal Analysis
- Federalized (Title 10): National Guard becomes indistinguishable from federal troops, subject to the Posse Comitatus Act, restricting law enforcement activity.
- State (Title 32): Guard remains under state control but can serve federal purposes—fuzzier legal boundaries. Potential loophole for Trump?
- Statutory & Constitutional Hurdles:
- EMAC (Emergency Management Assistance Compact) and Article IV of the Constitution suggest both states must consent.
- “A world in which the law would somehow allow for the governor of Texas to send his National Guard into Illinois over Illinois’s objection… is basically turning the founding principle of the Constitution on its head.” —Steve Vladeck (38:41)
- Litigation Possibility:
- Illinois could sue Texas directly at the Supreme Court (original jurisdiction) or federal officials in district court.
- Recent precedent (e.g., New York v. New Jersey 2022) suggests fast-track action may be possible.
- Political Motivation:
- Consensus: This is another test of legal boundaries—the search for the “gray areas” that haven’t been litigated.
Notable Quote:
“This is looking for loopholes. This is the velociraptors in Jurassic Park testing the fences.” —Steve Vladeck (34:41)
7. National Guard in D.C.: Civilian vs. Military Blurred
[David Janovsky Interview: 52:08–68:18]
- Guard Presence in D.C.: Massive deployments from multiple states justified on “crime emergencies,” even though non-law enforcement tasks (e.g., landscaping) seem suspiciously wasteful.
- Chilling Effect:
- The show of force is about intimidation, not public safety. Masked federal agents and unmarked cars further erode transparency.
- “One of the reasons why we don’t like to see the military getting mixed up in civilian law enforcement is we expect… a certain baseline level of accountability for civilian law enforcement.” —David Janovsky (57:01)
- Unique D.C. Legal Framework:
- Unlike states, D.C. lacks control over its National Guard; its mayor cannot prevent federal deployments.
- Mayor Bowser’s Executive Order:
- Intended to coordinate with federal law enforcement, not to surrender or extend federal presence indefinitely.
- Broader Danger:
- Hosts and guest warn against normalization of “troops in the streets” imagery—chipping away public comfort with extraordinary abuses of power.
- “We don’t have to accept it as a new normal.” —David Janovsky (66:26)
8. Community, Activism, and Good Trouble
- The hosts repeatedly stress direct advocacy (calling representatives, organizing, showing support for survivors).
- Uplifting stories close the show: community banners, protest music series in Boston, and local acts of resistance illustrate “Good Trouble” in action.
- Protest Music Tip: Listeners are encouraged to check out “Which Side Boston” and artist MILCK for inspiration.
Notable Quotes & Timestamps
- Epstein Survivors’ List:
- “We know the names. Many of us were abused by them. Now, together as survivors, we will confidentially compile the names we all know…” —Epstein survivor (06:54)
- On Legal Loopholes:
- “This is looking for loopholes. This is the velociraptors in Jurassic Park testing the fences…” —Steve Vladeck (34:41)
- Constitutional Crisis:
- “A world in which the law would somehow allow for the governor of Texas to send his National Guard into Illinois over Illinois’s objection… is basically turning the founding principle of the Constitution on its head.” —Steve Vladeck (38:41)
- On Militarization of Law Enforcement:
- “We have a long and proud history in the United States of separating military and civilian law enforcement affairs in all but the most egregious circumstances.” —David Janovsky (55:34)
- Call to Action:
- “It would really make my heart sing if everyone called their House representatives and told them to sign the discharge petition to release the Epstein files.” —Allison Gill (18:01)
Important Segments & Timestamps
| Segment | Timestamp | |---------|---------------------| | Show Theme & Summary | 00:00–01:08 | | Epstein Survivors Press Conf. | 01:21–07:38 | | Trump’s Legal Setbacks | 09:40–13:30 | | Denver Schools & Trans Rights | 14:11–16:51 | | Good Trouble Call: Epstein Files | 17:57–19:11 | | Steve Vladeck Interview (Texas v. Illinois) | 21:29–51:58 | | David Janovsky Interview (DC Guard Deployment) | 52:08–68:18 | | Good News / Listener Stories | 68:25–82:24 |
Tone & Style
The episode maintains a sharp, progressive tone—mixing legal expertise, caustic humor, and heartfelt camaraderie. Hosts blend empathy for survivors, outrage at injustice, and practical civic encouragement—always with a signature dose of irreverence (“news with swearing”). The interviews are detailed but accessible, aimed at empowering the audience to understand—and take part in—defending democracy.
Final Thoughts
This episode is a master class in how grassroots media can demystify complex legal struggles, amplify survivor voices, and connect national issues to local civic action. It’s informative, inspiring, and deeply community-centered: a must-listen for anyone concerned about democracy, justice, and the power of raising your voice (and making some “good trouble”) in dangerous times.